Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Could be.

Actually, I always maintained that David Murray HAD to have known about the Ticketus deal as well. If he didn't, then he didn't do his due diligence very well.

Jeez, I feel I've just regressed into 2011.....:rolleyes:

Talking of regressing, did you ever find out how the jambo admins got their fee CWG? ;-)

[CropleyWasGod]

Talking of regressing, did you ever find out how the jambo admins got their fee CWG? ;-)
In poppies, I believe.

[ballengeich]

An update from the liquidators :-

http://www.bdo.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0009/879165/Rangers-Creditors-Circ-13-November-2014.pdf

It looks like they've got a payment from Collyer Bristow which will add substantially to eventual payouts to the creditors. They also seem to think the BTC will stay largely in Rangers' favour after further appeals.

[greenginger]

Clause 5 in the report states that costs of the EBT appeal have so far been met by a Third Party , but going on to the next stage the third party wants Rangers ( in Liquidation ) to contribute.

Any ideas who the third party is ? maybe someone with an even bigger EBT bill. :greengrin

[Keith_M]

Clause 5 in the report states that costs of the EBT appeal have so far been met by a Third Party , but going on to the next stage the third party wants Rangers ( in Liquidation ) to contribute.

Any ideas who the third party is ? maybe someone with an even bigger EBT bill. :greengrin


DM perhaps?


(not Danger Mouse, though you never know)

[CropleyWasGod]

This stuck out for me:-

The Joint Liquidators have requested, from the former Joint Administrators, detailed
explanations regarding certain aspects of the strategy implemented by them during the
Administration. There remains on-going correspondence in this regard.


I like it. :greengrin

[CropleyWasGod]

An update from the liquidators :-

http://www.bdo.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0009/879165/Rangers-Creditors-Circ-13-November-2014.pdf

It looks like they've got a payment from Collyer Bristow which will add substantially to eventual payouts to the creditors. They also seem to think the BTC will stay largely in Rangers' favour after further appeals.

£24m. That's quite a result.

Is there any connection between CB's willingness to settle in full, and Gary Withey's arrest?

:cb

[s.a.m]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-30084830

Four men in court over alleged fraud after Rangers sale in 2011(Clockwise from top left) Gary Withey, David Grier, Paul Clark and David Whitehouse (Clockwise from top left) Gary Withey, David Grier, Paul Clark and David Whitehouse
Continue reading the main story
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Craig Whyte arrest warrant issued

Four men have appeared in court charged with fraudulent activity following a probe into the sale of Rangers in 2011.

David Grier, Paul Clark and David Whitehouse worked for Duff and Phelps, who were Rangers' administrators.

Gary Withey worked for law firm Collier Bristow, which represented Craig Whyte before he bought Rangers from Sir David Murray for £1 in 2011.

All four made no plea or declaration at Glasgow Sheriff Court and were granted bail ahead of a future hearing.

Mr Grier, Mr Clark and Mr Whitehouse were also charged with attempting to pervert the course of justice.

[jacomo]

Where is Craig Whyte? On the run from the law?

I am imagining him and Charles Green organising a hurried bonfire of various papers before fleeing Green's castle in haste, en route to Monaco in the gardener's battered 2CV (the Bentley attracts too much attention), arguing the entire way about who's fault it is that they've been rumbled.

[CropleyWasGod]

Where is Craig Whyte? On the run from the law?

I am imagining him and Charles Green organising a hurried bonfire of various papers before fleeing Green's castle in haste, en route to Monaco in the gardener's battered 2CV (the Bentley attracts too much attention), arguing the entire way about who's fault it is that they've been rumbled.

Nah.

They're using Chucky's horses. They have scarves over their mouths, tricorn hats and a bag that says "le Swag".

:kbacker::kbacker:

[Keith_M]

An update from the liquidators :-

http://www.bdo.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0009/879165/Rangers-Creditors-Circ-13-November-2014.pdf

It looks like they've got a payment from Collyer Bristow which will add substantially to eventual payouts to the creditors. They also seem to think the BTC will stay largely in Rangers' favour after further appeals.


February to September 2014 and BDO have taken just over 500k in fees (after taking off the 'outlay' mentioned in the report)


Nice work if you can get it.

[greenginger]

February to September 2014 and BDO have taken just over 500k in fees (after taking off the 'outlay' mentioned in the report)


Nice work if you can get it.


Makes up for the discount job they did for the Yams.

[greenginger]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-30084838

And a further twist, BDO who were appointed by HMRC to investigate and liquidate Old Co Rangers, are going to use some of the proceeds they have won for the creditors to fund a defence of Old Co against EBT claims appeals by HMRC.

Bizarre ! :confused:

[AndyM_1875]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-30084838

And a further twist, BDO who were appointed by HMRC to investigate and liquidate Old Co Rangers, are going to use some of the proceeds they have won for the creditors to fund a defence of Old Co against EBT claims appeals by HMRC.

Bizarre ! :confused:

Totally. It's a cast of characters and no mistake. Crooks, fraudsters and shysters.

If as suspected the EBT case will come down largely on the side of Oldco Rangers, (having already been judged in their favour twice) what HMRC will be left with the legal bill. What an absolute mess.
Surely someone at HMRC will surely be held accountable for this shambles? Or do they just walk away from the mess scot free as well?

[CropleyWasGod]

Totally. It's a cast of characters and no mistake. Crooks, fraudsters and shysters.

If as suspected the EBT case will come down largely on the side of Oldco Rangers, (having already been judged in their favour twice) what HMRC will be left with the legal bill. What an absolute mess.
Surely someone at HMRC will surely be held accountable for this shambles? Or do they just walk away from the mess scot free as well?

Why would HMRC be held accountable?

They are pursuing the EBT case for a number of reasons. The most important is to establish a precedent to enable them to pursue others; that is secondary to the question of whether they will recover any money from RFC(IL).

To do otherwise would be wrong, IMO.

[AndyM_1875]

Why would HMRC be held accountable?

They are pursuing the EBT case for a number of reasons. The most important is to establish a precedent to enable them to pursue others; that is secondary to the question of whether they will recover any money from RFC(IL).

To do otherwise would be wrong, IMO.

As an Unsecured Creditor will they get anything?

I understand about the precedent but that's been lost twice already in the Tribunals and legal opinion appears to suggest strongly that it won't be won in respect of RFC Oldco.
In short, throwing more good money after bad.

Having had my own issues with HMRC I know what a useless, incompetent shower of an organization they are.

[CropleyWasGod]

As an Unsecured Creditor will they get anything?

I understand about the precedent but that's been lost twice already in the Tribunals and legal opinion appears to suggest strongly that it won't be won in respect of RFC Oldco.
In short, throwing more good money after bad.

Having had my own issues with HMRC I know what a useless, incompetent shower of an organization they are.

BDO's legal opinion says that. HMRC's obviously says different.

HMRC will get a return from the liquidation, no matter what.

[ancient hibee]

Nah.

They're using Chucky's horses. They have scarves over their mouths, tricorn hats and a bag that says "le Swag".

:kbacker::kbacker:

Surely it's the mystery masked man-The Lone(or loan)(A)Ranger.

[saltandsauce]

I see they have started making redundancies

[AndyM_1875]

I see they have started making redundancies

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30109897
Administrative staff?

The more obvious targets of players earning 7k a week who aren't actually playing (e.g. Shiels, Miller) seems to be getting missed.
Two players at that level out the door and they could save 3/4 of a million a year

[dangermouse]

DM perhaps?


(not Danger Mouse, though you never know)

I'm giving them nothing :greengrin

[CropleyWasGod]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30109897
Administrative staff?

The more obvious targets of players earning 7k a week who aren't actually playing (e.g. Shiels, Miller) seems to be getting missed.
Two players at that level out the door and they could save 3/4 of a million a year
The problem with the players is that, as they are on fixed-term contracts, those contracts will probably be payable in full. Thus not really a saving. In fact, it's worse as the money would be payable now rather than over the life of the contract.

[AndyM_1875]

The problem with the players is that, as they are on fixed-term contracts, those contracts will probably be payable in full. Thus not really a saving. In fact, it's worse as the money would be payable now rather than over the life of the contract.

Sorry, my bad. Meant to say tell them to find new clubs in January. Get the prep work done now with their Agents and they can sign for their new clubs as soon as Transfer Window opens.

That of course assumes anyone wants them which is another discussion altogether.

[ballengeich]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30109897
Administrative staff?

The more obvious targets of players earning 7k a week who aren't actually playing (e.g. Shiels, Miller) seems to be getting missed.
Two players at that level out the door and they could save 3/4 of a million a year

In addition to the point made by CWG, when a company makes people redundant there's a time period has to elapse before they can recruit new employees to do the same work. I don't know how long the time is, but making footballers redundant now might mean they couldn't bring in new signings next summer.

Transfers and loan deals in the January window will be a better way to save on the playing budget, even if Sevco have to keep paying part of the leavers' wages, as few of them will get the same anywhere else.

[Keith_M]

Sorry, my bad. Meant to say tell them to find new clubs in January. Get the prep work done now with their Agents and they can sign for their new clubs as soon as Transfer Window opens.

That of course assumes anyone wants them which is another discussion altogether.

That would be the sensible thing to do but would they get offered nearly as much elsewhere? I think it's unlikely they would and even less likely they would be willing to move for less money.




I'm giving them nothing http://www.hibs.net/images/smilies/greengrin2.gif


Pleased to hear it

http://www.hibs.net/images/smilies/winky.gif

[jacomo]

Sorry, my bad. Meant to say tell them to find new clubs in January. Get the prep work done now with their Agents and they can sign for their new clubs as soon as Transfer Window opens.

That of course assumes anyone wants them which is another discussion altogether.

If you are Dean Shiels are you really going to move on?. He'll never earn money like it elsewhere.

[PatHead]

If you are Dean Shiels are you really going to move on?. He'll never earn money like it elsewhere.

Surely a loan deal with someone paying a percentage is better than paying it all yourself. The benefit to Shields is that he could be putting himself in the window rather than rotting in U20s or bounce games

[jonty]

The problem with the players is that, as they are on fixed-term contracts, those contracts will probably be payable in full. Thus not really a saving. In fact, it's worse as the money would be payable now rather than over the life of the contract.

Clearly The Rangers weren't very forward thinking when it came to giving them contracts if there were no clauses in which they could be released, particularly given their funding issues at the time.

In order words, you reap what you sow. You have to feel sorry for those being made redundant. Its crap at the best of times, let alone just before Christmas

[jonty]

A second arrest warrant issued for he who has 'off the radar' wealth. And I was told tonight that the IPO is being torn apart next, which could cause issues with the current setup as the training facilities and ground were something to do with it?

[CropleyWasGod]

A second arrest warrant issued for he who has 'off the radar' wealth. And I was told tonight that the IPO is being torn apart next, which could cause issues with the current setup as the training facilities and ground were something to do with it?

If that's the case, Chucky is next for the felt collar.

[ancient hibee]

If that's the case, Chucky is next for the felt collar.

Good use of the European Arrest Warrant.

[Badge]

A second arrest warrant issued for he who has 'off the radar' wealth. And I was told tonight that the IPO is being torn apart next, which could cause issues with the current setup as the training facilities and ground were something to do with it?

What is the IPO?

[jonty]

What is the IPO?

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/1e685aea-4768-11e2-a899-00144feab49a.html#axzz3JeAjpPML
http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/football/rangers-fans-5m-helps-club-pass-target-as-share-issue-closes.19714169

[Badge]

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/1e685aea-4768-11e2-a899-00144feab49a.html#axzz3JeAjpPML
http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/football/rangers-fans-5m-helps-club-pass-target-as-share-issue-closes.19714169

Cheers

[ancient hibee]

What on earth did these institutions ever think they were going to get from investing in Rangers.At least Ashley knew what he was doing.

[greenginger]

What on earth did these institutions ever think they were going to get from investing in Rangers.At least Ashley knew what he was doing.


It would'nt be the institutions themselves , but individual fund managers with Rangers leanings who would think it a good idea to take a punt on the shares and help there Club at the same time. A half million is nothing when its not your own money and can be excused as just a bad call when it all went bad.

[Cropley10]

If that's the case, Chucky is next for the felt collar.

Charles of Normandy has apparently signed his Chateau over to his wife...

What I can never get my head round is that D&P had an irrevocable agreement to sell the assets to Sevco 5088 buy they didn't, they sold it to Sevco Scotland.

[CropleyWasGod]

Charles of Normandy has apparently signed his Chateau over to his wife...

What I can never get my head round is that D&P had an irrevocable agreement to sell the assets to Sevco 5088 buy they didn't, they sold it to Sevco Scotland.
That's probably one of the issues that BDO have, which they referred to in their report this week.

[Keith_M]

Charles of Normandy has apparently signed his Chateau over to his wife...

What I can never get my head round is that D&P had an irrevocable agreement to sell the assets to Sevco 5088 buy they didn't, they sold it to Sevco Scotland.



Wasn't it the case that they did sell it to Sevco 5088 but all assets were then transferred to Sevco Scotland?


Or is this just yet another aspect of the whole shenanigans that has my head in a spin? :greengrin

[CropleyWasGod]

Wasn't it the case that they did sell it to Sevco 5088 but all assets were then transferred to Sevco Scotland?


Or is this just yet another aspect of the whole shenanigans that has my head in a spin? :greengrin

When I wrote my previous post, my head was spinning a bit too.

I'm pretty sure you're correct.

However, the only source I can find was this:-

“For the avoidance of doubt, Sevco 5088 Limited bought the assets of the Rangers Football Club and then transferred them to Sevco Scotland Limited so that all the assets would be in the Scottish registered company that is Rangers FC.”

.. from... ahem...a representative of Philip Green. :cb


That said, BDO will have a right to clarify the issue, as well as the price paid.

[Keith_M]

When I wrote my previous post, my head was spinning a bit too.

I'm pretty sure you're correct.

However, the only source I can find was this:-

“For the avoidance of doubt, Sevco 5088 Limited bought the assets of the Rangers Football Club and then transferred them to Sevco Scotland Limited so that all the assets would be in the Scottish registered company that is Rangers FC.”

.. from... ahem...a representative of Philip Green. :cb


That said, BDO will have a right to clarify the issue, as well as the price paid.


Thanks.

So it's possible but still not guaranteed. Much like many other 'facts' in this case.



I can't wait for the Chucky Green arrest warrant. I presume that will have just been motivated by 'the bigots' as well :wink:

[ancient hibee]

When I wrote my previous post, my head was spinning a bit too.

I'm pretty sure you're correct.

However, the only source I can find was this:-

“For the avoidance of doubt, Sevco 5088 Limited bought the assets of the Rangers Football Club and then transferred them to Sevco Scotland Limited so that all the assets would be in the Scottish registered company that is Rangers FC.”

.. from... ahem...a representative of Philip Green. :cb


That said, BDO will have a right to clarify the issue, as well as the price paid.

Could I suggest you change Philip to Charlie-I suspect Mr Green(monaco)has his minions searching the net for indiscretions.

[CropleyWasGod]

Could I suggest you change Philip to Charlie-I suspect Mr Green(monaco)has his minions searching the net for indiscretions.

Ha... telt you ma heid was spinning. :greengrin

[Keith_M]

Ha... telt you ma heid was spinning. :greengrin


"Philip Green (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_Green) sues hibs.net for slander"

"CropleyWasGod forced to sell Cropley Towers to pay court costs"

[CropleyWasGod]

"Philip Green (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_Green) sues hibs.net for slander"

"CropleyWasGod forced to sell Cropley Towers to pay court costs"
All foreseen.

The house is in an EBT.

I'll TUPE myself over to a new company and start again under the name CropleyWasASlightlyLessInfallibleDeity.

HMRC can have the kids.

[Hibby70]

All foreseen.

The house is in an EBT.

I'll TUPE myself over to a new company and start again under the name CropleyWasASlightlyLessInfallibleDeity.

HMRC can have the kids.
Can I buy security on your garden shed for a pound?

[CropleyWasGod]

Can I buy security on your garden shed for a pound?
If you promise to cut the grass and feed the two tramps that live there. ......Craig and Charles they're called.

[blackpoolhibs]

If you promise to cut the grass and feed the two tramps that live there. ......Craig and Charles they're called.

I thought the proclaimers had gone quiet recently.

[leither17]

I thought the proclaimers had gone quiet recently.

a proper LOL moment there

[Jack Hackett]

a proper LOL moment there
:yes:

Edit

No smileys on mobile is a pain...I'm old and forget things

[Deansy]

All I want to know is when will SDM's name come-up in all these rumours, gossip etc - he's the one that started the ball rolling with their 'Dodgy deals/money/taxes' etc ?

[Keith_M]

All I want to know is when will SDM's name come-up in all these rumours, gossip etc - he's the one that started the ball rolling with their 'Dodgy deals/money/taxes' etc ?


He knows where all the bodies are buried.

[Smartie]

All I want to know is when will SDM's name come-up in all these rumours, gossip etc - he's the one that started the ball rolling with their 'Dodgy deals/money/taxes' etc ?

I heard a wee whisper that he's biding his time, waiting in the wings to ride back in and take over.

Obviously when the price is right.....

[greenginger]

Its pretty obvious the Rangers are toiling for cash. Awaiting Ashley's next loan to allow them to pay the wages for the month.

You got to wonder what is not getting paid at the moment. In both the other Rangers and Yam admins. a huge list of creditors appeared when the insolvency people were called in.

I bet there already is a lot of pending payment /final demands on the intray.

I wish wee Black would blab about his bonuses not being paid. A 5 point penalty like Livvy would be nice.

[CropleyWasGod]

I heard a wee whisper that he's biding his time, waiting in the wings to ride back in and take over.

Obviously when the price is right.....
I'd be surprised. The rest of his empire is crumbling.

Then again, it's been some story. ...

[Cropley10]

I heard a wee whisper that he's biding his time, waiting in the wings to ride back in and take over.

Obviously when the price is right.....

He set up the sting, getting 'duped' and selling the wreck of the old Club to Whyte for £1...

However - there's a rumour that Craigie has lots of dirt on SDM too.

Loving it!

[CropleyWasGod]

He set up the sting, getting 'duped' and selling the wreck of the old Club to Whyte for £1...

However - there's a rumour that Craigie has lots of dirt on SDM too.

Loving it!
he pays millions for the club, sells it for £1, and then buys it again?

No wonder the empire is crumbling. ....

[portycabbage]

Its pretty obvious the Rangers are toiling for cash. Awaiting Ashley's next loan to allow them to pay the wages for the month.

You got to wonder what is not getting paid at the moment. In both the other Rangers and Yam admins. a huge list of creditors appeared when the insolvency people were called in.

I bet there already is a lot of pending payment /final demands on the intray.

I wish wee Black would blab about his bonuses not being paid. A 5 point penalty like Livvy would be nice.

Livi also have an SFA hearing about dual interests of club ownership (aside from the SPFL one that resulted in today's punishment)-

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2847706/Scottish-Championship-Livingstone-deducted-five-points-tax-breaches.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490

Although Ashley's got less than 10% shares, article 13 of the SFA Handbook seems to suggest that "any influence in management or administration" of a club counts as an "interest" in a club. Can't seem to get link to the PDF posted, but it seems broader than just shares and strict ownership of a club.

Was wondering if having a club dependent on loans, or having a guy in the boardroom, would count as an "influence in management or administration"? (The rule includes influence through an associate).

It mentions shareholdings of 3% or more, but also that "prior written consent of the board" can be given for dual interest cases. Was also wondering if this was the basis for the 10% agreement Ashley and the SFA were reported to have?

Also says in article 13 that the SFA have the power to find out who the shareholders of a club are, which seems to have be a matter for debate in the The Rangers case.

[Ronniekirk]

Livi also have an SFA hearing about dual interests of club ownership (aside from the SPFL one that resulted in today's punishment)-

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2847706/Scottish-Championship-Livingstone-deducted-five-points-tax-breaches.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490

Although Ashley's got less than 10% shares, article 13 of the SFA Handbook seems to suggest that "any influence in management or administration" of a club counts as an "interest" in a club. Can't seem to get link to the PDF posted, but it seems broader than just shares and strict ownership of a club.

Was wondering if having a club dependent on loans, or having a guy in the boardroom, would count as an "influence in management or administration"? (The rule includes influence through an associate).

It mentions shareholdings of 3% or more, but also that "prior written consent of the board" can be given for dual interest cases. Was also wondering if this was the basis for the 10% agreement Ashley and the SFA were reported to have?

Also says in article 13 that the SFA have the power to find out who the shareholders of a club are, which seems to have be a matter for debate in the The Rangers case.
I don't think there is the appetite at SFA to go digging and get there hands dirty again Seems to me that it's turn a blind eye and get them back up as soon as .
The whole saga now has been dragging on for so long that we have become immune to all there skullduggery So much for Transparency and sound financial governance . they are a Shambles of a Club and there must be more twists and turns to come .They seem prepared to do anything rather than sell a player This Transfer Window will be interesting to see what they do or don't do

[greenginger]

I don't think there is the appetite at SFA to go digging and get there hands dirty again Seems to me that it's turn a blind eye and get them back up as soon as .
The whole saga now has been dragging on for so long that we have become immune to all there skullduggery So much for Transparency and sound financial governance . they are a Shambles of a Club and there must be more twists and turns to come .They seem prepared to do anything rather than sell a player This Transfer Window will be interesting to see what they do or don't do


The Weegie press are bumming-up Lewis Mcleod for the English Premership this morning. :confused:

[JimBHibees]

The Weegie press are bumming-up Lewis Mcleod for the English Premership this morning. :confused:

Be fair the journos have to earn their Christmas lunch somehow. :greengrin

[greenginger]

Talking about the English premiership, that Yam lad that went to Swansea , has he ever been heard of again ?

[lapsedhibee]

The Weegie press are bumming-up Lewis Mcleod for the English Premership this morning. :confused:

Maybe join Fleck at Coventry - think they're in the Premiership.

[JimBHibees]

Talking about the English premiership, that Yam lad that went to Swansea , has he ever been heard of again ?

In the under 21 squad

[greenginger]

In the under 21 squad


Was there any add-ons to the sale ?

If so is it due to the creditors or Mrs Budge ?

[CropleyWasGod]

Was there any add-ons to the sale ?

If so is it due to the creditors or Mrs Budge ?

I think that it will be the current club. It's the flip-side of the "football creditors" scenario, IMO.

[JimBHibees]

Was there any add-ons to the sale ?

If so is it due to the creditors or Mrs Budge ?

No idea on both counts, but would assume certainly would be add ons for a young player.

[jacomo]

Livi also have an SFA hearing about dual interests of club ownership (aside from the SPFL one that resulted in today's punishment)-

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2847706/Scottish-Championship-Livingstone-deducted-five-points-tax-breaches.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490

Although Ashley's got less than 10% shares, article 13 of the SFA Handbook seems to suggest that "any influence in management or administration" of a club counts as an "interest" in a club. Can't seem to get link to the PDF posted, but it seems broader than just shares and strict ownership of a club.

Was wondering if having a club dependent on loans, or having a guy in the boardroom, would count as an "influence in management or administration"? (The rule includes influence through an associate).

It mentions shareholdings of 3% or more, but also that "prior written consent of the board" can be given for dual interest cases. Was also wondering if this was the basis for the 10% agreement Ashley and the SFA were reported to have?

Also says in article 13 that the SFA have the power to find out who the shareholders of a club are, which seems to have be a matter for debate in the The Rangers case.

There's no question that Ashley has influence at Rangers. He forced the CEO out and his people are now effectively running the club. The only question is whether the SFA are going to do anything about it. At the moment they look like Neville Chamberlain: 'I have in my hand a piece of paper'.

[greenginger]

I think that it will be the current club. It's the flip-side of the "football creditors" scenario, IMO.


I'm no expert , but would an add-on not be part of a contract entered into pre-admin. and therefor due to pre-admin. creditors.

Whatever the correct way, I'm sure Jackson will deem the money due to the current residents of the Gorgie asylum.

Robin.p ... any thoughts ?

[CropleyWasGod]

I'm no expert , but would an add-on not be part of a contract entered into pre-admin. and therefor due to pre-admin. creditors.

Whatever the correct way, I'm sure Jackson will deem the money due to the current residents of the Gorgie asylum.

Robin.p ... any thoughts ?

In the normal way of business and insolvency, yep I'd agree.

However, the football-debt process isn't part of that normal process either. That's why I think it's the other side of that coin.

Were I a creditor, I'd be wanting the money in the pot. But, since none of the unsecured creditors are getting anything, it's academic.

[AndyM_1875]

There's no question that Ashley has influence at Rangers. He forced the CEO out and his people are now effectively running the club. The only question is whether the SFA are going to do anything about it. At the moment they look like Neville Chamberlain: 'I have in my hand a piece of paper'.

Not sure they really can do anything about it.

His shareholding is <10% at the moment therefore not on their radar and even if he takes it over that figure it's only a 'gentleman's agreement' re dual ownership of clubs. Mike Ashley is many things in his business life, a gentleman is not one of them however.

[greenginger]

Report on Craig Whyte's 15 year directorship disqualification.


http://www.mondaq.com/article.asp?articleid=355584&email_access=on

Love the reference to his Tixway company.

" the accountancy information was so inadequate , the liquidator was unable to discover what type of business, if any, the company operated ".

[grunt]

Love the reference to his Tixway company.

" the accountancy information was so inadequate , the liquidator was unable to discover what type of business, if any, the company operated ".

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/craig-whyte-profile-the-scots-billionaire-1076110

:devil:

[jacomo]

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/craig-whyte-profile-the-scots-billionaire-1076110

:devil:

Rangers fans are forever grateful that SDM stood by his promise to only sell the club to the 'right people.'

Where is Craig Whyte? Presumably there is still an arrest warrant out for him? I imagined he was on the run with Chuckie Green but maybe he's hiding behind a false wall at his castle, being very quiet?

[Kaiser1962]

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/craig-whyte-profile-the-scots-billionaire-1076110

:devil:

Thanks for that.

Always cheers me up.

[greenginger]

http://www.scotsman.com/news/scotland/top-stories/craig-whyte-s-former-castle-grant-home-is-sold-1-3543017

The castle's gone. Whyte will be in some off-shore haven with no extradition. Pitcairn Island ! :greengrin

Its not like he has'nt seen this coming.

[jacomo]

http://www.scotsman.com/news/scotland/top-stories/craig-whyte-s-former-castle-grant-home-is-sold-1-3543017

The castle's gone. Whyte will be in some off-shore haven with no extradition. Pitcairn Island ! :greengrin

Its not like he has'nt seen this coming.

Off the radar, you mean? :wink:

£1m seems like a bargain for a place like that, although grand Scottish houses don't seem to sell so well these days. Also sounds like he vandalised the place when clearing out.

[grunt]

http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/mobile/rangers/regans-concern-at-rangers-finances-190032n.25969185

This article seems to imply that Ashley has exceeded the terms of his agreement with the SFA.
Let's see if the SFA do anything about it.

[portycabbage]

http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/mobile/rangers/regans-concern-at-rangers-finances-190032n.25969185

This article seems to imply that Ashley has exceeded the terms of his agreement with the SFA.
Let's see if the SFA do anything about it.

The SFA rule (article 13) states that influence through an "associate" (pretty broadly defined) counts in terms of dual interests, even though Ashley may not have exceeded the share limit agreed. LLambias is on the board and is an associate and friend of Ashley, but as you and others mention, whether they implement their own rules is another matter. There's provision for them not applying the rules in the actual rule!

[Ronniekirk]

The SFA rule (article 13) states that influence through an "associate" (pretty broadly defined) counts in terms of dual interests, even though Ashley may not have exceeded the share limit agreed. LLambias is on the board and is an associate and friend of Ashley, but as you and others mention, whether they implement their own rules is another matter. There's provision for them not applying the rules in the actual rule!

Your last sentence is the key one ,it just shouldn't be there imo but it is and probably with this very scenario in mind Maybe being too cynical but am still not convinced The SFA have the appetite to take this issue on

[portycabbage]

Your last sentence is the key one ,it just shouldn't be there imo but it is and probably with this very scenario in mind Maybe being too cynical but am still not convinced The SFA have the appetite to take this issue on

There's an SFA hearing just now about Livi and dual interests (end of article), might be interesting to see how it compares with the SFA/Ashley situation-

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2847706/Scottish-Championship-Livingstone-deducted-five-points-tax-breaches.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490

[s.a.m]

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/fugitive-craig-whyte-arrested-major-4703408

[jodjam]

The Mexicans have got craigy boy

[robinp]

I'm no expert , but would an add-on not be part of a contract entered into pre-admin. and therefor due to pre-admin. creditors.

Whatever the correct way, I'm sure Jackson will deem the money due to the current residents of the Gorgie asylum.

Robin.p ... any thoughts ?

I would certainly say yes, it should be paid to the insolvency, but as Crops has said with the football creditor rules it might not - I wouldn't dare hang my hat on either!

[Keith_M]

So, Craigy Boy arrested and SDM and Walter Smith called to give evidence. (http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/walter-smith-david-murray-lead-4703261)


This could get interesting


:greengrin

[Moulin Yarns]

So, Craigy Boy arrested and SDM and Walter Smith called to give evidence. (http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/walter-smith-david-murray-lead-4703261)


This could get interesting


:greengrin

Wisnae me!!

A big boy did it and ran away!!:wink:

[jacomo]

I didn't realise Craigie Boy had two warrants out for his arrest - one relating to possible fraudulent activity around the take over, and the other for repeated failings to attend court in his battle with Ticketus.

[grunt]

I didn't realise Craigie Boy had two warrants out for his arrest - one relating to possible fraudulent activity around the take over, and the other for repeated failings to attend court in his battle with Ticketus.... and the SFA are also trying to get their unpaid fines (for bringing the game into disrepute, was it? Surely not!)

[Moulin Yarns]

The Mexicans have got craigy boy

I hear the Celtc fans are planning Mexican waves for tonight. :wink:

[hibs0666]

UEFA determine that Huns and Newcastle will not be able to play in Europe together next season (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/newcastle-united/11257795/Newcastle-and-Rangers-will-not-be-able-to-play-in-Europe-together-next-season-because-of-Mike-Ashley.html) :thumbsup:

[erin go bragh]

UEFA determine that Huns and Newcastle will not be able to play in Europe together next season (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/newcastle-united/11257795/Newcastle-and-Rangers-will-not-be-able-to-play-in-Europe-together-next-season-because-of-Mike-Ashley.html) :thumbsup:
Might effect Newcastle but the Huns only avenue into Europe would be winning the SC . More chance of us winning it imo .

Ggtth

[JimBHibees]

UEFA determine that Huns and Newcastle will not be able to play in Europe together next season (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/newcastle-united/11257795/Newcastle-and-Rangers-will-not-be-able-to-play-in-Europe-together-next-season-because-of-Mike-Ashley.html) :thumbsup:

Once again UEFA leads the way while our own authorities stare at their shoes too petrified to act.

[CropleyWasGod]

If both teams qualify for the same competition, the one with the higher Uefa co-efficient ranking would be allowed to enter at the expense of the other. As things stand, Newcastle are ranked 65 and Rangers are down at 101.

In the short term, it is Rangers who will suffer as they have the lower ranking. In the long term, Rangers have a far greater chance of playing in the Champions League than Newcastle, which would mean the Magpies would not be allowed to compete in the Europa League, even if they won a domestic cup competition or finished fifth or sixth in the Premier League.

[Boyle89]

For a man that seemingly doesn't have any money Craig gets about eh.

[Haymaker]

For a man that seemingly doesn't have any money Craig gets about eh.

His wealth is Off the radar?! :confused:


:greengrin

[Keith_M]

UEFA determine that Huns and Newcastle will not be able to play in Europe together next season (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/newcastle-united/11257795/Newcastle-and-Rangers-will-not-be-able-to-play-in-Europe-together-next-season-because-of-Mike-Ashley.html) :thumbsup:


Might effect Newcastle but the Huns only avenue into Europe would be winning the SC . More chance of us winning it imo .

Ggtth


It's not going to affect them too much next season but it sends out a strong signal to the SFA that Ashley, in the eyes of UEFA, has broken the rules on dual-ownership.

I look forward with interest to the SFA's comments on this.

[Weststandwanab]

If both teams qualify for the same competition, the one with the higher Uefa co-efficient ranking would be allowed to enter at the expense of the other. As things stand, Newcastle are ranked 65 and Rangers are down at 101.

In the short term, it is Rangers who will suffer as they have the lower ranking. In the long term, Rangers have a far greater chance of playing in the Champions League than Newcastle, which would mean the Magpies would not be allowed to compete in the Europa League, even if they won a domestic cup competition or finished fifth or sixth in the Premier League.

This has the stench of Admin 2 all over i t!


For a man that seemingly doesn't have any money Craig gets about eh.

Just like Carl Lewis the amateur athlete - That house is not mine it is owned by one of my Trust Funds.


It's not going to affect them too much next season but it sends out a strong signal to the SFA that Ashley, in the eyes of UEFA, has broken the rules on dual-ownership.

I look forward with interest to the SFA's comments on this.

As the song goes Silence is golden but .....

[JimBHibees]

It's not going to affect them too much next season but it sends out a strong signal to the SFA that Ashley, in the eyes of UEFA, has broken the rules on dual-ownership.

I look forward with interest to the SFA's comments on this.

Agree entirely didnt take UEFA long to come to a decision.

[grunt]

Breaking: Former Rangers owner Craig Whyte held by police on arrival at Heathrow from Mexico.

[Keith_M]

Breaking: Former Rangers owner Craig Whyte held by police on arrival at Heathrow from Mexico.


Mexicans Jails not to his taste, then.

[CropleyWasGod]

Mexicans Jails not to his taste, then.

According to the Record, the Mexicans "swooped on his bolthole".

If that's their habit, I wouldn't like it either.....

[Keith_M]

According to the Record, the Mexicans "swooped on his bolthole".

If that's their habit, I wouldn't like it either.....


:tee hee:

[Smartie]

According to the Record, the Mexicans "swooped on his bolthole".

If that's their habit, I wouldn't like it either.....

Given where he's likely to end up I could see Craigie-boy's bolthole being swooped on on a regular basis over the next few years.

[HoboHarry]

If Craigie boy even thinks he might end up in jail it won't take long for him to start yapping..... Might be some nervous individuals out there lol. Oooooohhhhhh this is going to be fun.....

[AndyM_1875]

Given where he's likely to end up I could see Craigie-boy's bolthole being swooped on on a regular basis over the next few years.

He should be grateful the Police don't say to save Taxpayer money we're just going to drop you off outside the Loudon Tavern.
There's a welcoming committee waiting...:greengrin

[jacomo]

If Craigie boy even thinks he might end up in jail it won't take long for him to start yapping..... Might be some nervous individuals out there lol. Oooooohhhhhh this is going to be fun.....

I reckon he's yapping already. He'd dob in his granny if it was to his advantage.

[silverhibee]

Will appear at Glasgow Sheriff Court tomorrow.

[HoboHarry]

I reckon he's yapping already. He'd dob in his granny if it was to his advantage.
Oh my word I hope so. This will be so much fun to watch..... Hope Campbell Ogilvie ends up in the sh**e as well.....

[emerald green]

Oh my word I hope so. This will be so much fun to watch..... Hope Campbell Ogilvie ends up in the sh**e as well.....

I wonder what Sir David's thoughts are on these latest developments?

[greenginger]

The Rangers 2014 accounts

http://www.londonstockexchange.com/exchange/news/market-news/market-news-detail/12165769.html

I will leave it to the professionals ! :greengrin

[Billy Whizz]

The Rangers 2014 accounts

http://www.londonstockexchange.com/exchange/news/market-news/market-news-detail/12165769.html

I will leave it to the professionals ! :greengrin

Losses are down to just over £8million😄

[Hermit Crab]

Losses are down to just over £8million


Does this mean admin mk2 is on the cards?

[Billy Whizz]

Does this mean admin mk2 is on the cards?

As greengineer says, I'll let the experts answer most of this, but there is a definite cash short fall on the horizon

[CropleyWasGod]

Does this mean admin mk2 is on the cards?
It's possible.

One of the definitions of insolvency is when a business can't pay its bills as they fall due. We don't have any proof that RFC are in that position, but the evidence points that way.

[emerald green]

It's possible.

One of the definitions of insolvency is when a business can't pay its bills as they fall due. We don't have any proof that RFC are in that position, but the evidence points that way.

Fingers crossed then for a nice wee 15 points deduction. Can only hope. Or would that be too good to be true?

[CropleyWasGod]

Fingers crossed then for a nice wee 15 points deduction. Can only hope. Or would that be too good to be true?
It would be 25.

[Hibs Class]

If both teams qualify for the same competition, the one with the higher Uefa co-efficient ranking would be allowed to enter at the expense of the other. As things stand, Newcastle are ranked 65 and Rangers are down at 101.

In the short term, it is Rangers who will suffer as they have the lower ranking. In the long term, Rangers have a far greater chance of playing in the Champions League than Newcastle, which would mean the Magpies would not be allowed to compete in the Europa League, even if they won a domestic cup competition or finished fifth or sixth in the Premier League.

I'm surprised the rangers even have a European ranking, never having played in Europe. I'm sure there was also comment made that if they qualified via a cup competition they wouldn't be allowed in because of their inability to provide three years' accounts, so it seems a bit of a mixed message from uefa.

[Oscar T Grouch]

Not sure if the people who've invested to keep them going this season already would let them go into admin again. But Rangers water's are that murky it's just mud now, so we will have to wait and see. It continues to give me endless entertainment though 😊

[CropleyWasGod]

I'm surprised the rangers even have a European ranking, never having played in Europe. I'm sure there was also comment made that if they qualified via a cup competition they wouldn't be allowed in because of their inability to provide three years' accounts, so it seems a bit of a mixed message from uefa.
They'll have 3 years accounts at the end of this season :)

[Billy Whizz]

It would be 25.

Would put them in a play off position, to possibly go down

[emerald green]

It would be 25.

Even better. :aok:

[Ozyhibby]

Would put them in a play off position, to possibly go down

Not to mention, they would also have to make all their players redundant.

[CropleyWasGod]

Not to mention, they would also have to make all their players redundant.
They wouldn't.

Didn't have to last time, and neither did Hearts. The decision would be the administrator's.

[greenginger]

They'll have 3 years accounts at the end of this season :)

Is it not 3 years of unqualified accounts, this lot are qualified I think.

[CropleyWasGod]

Is it not 3 years of unqualified accounts, this lot are qualified I think.



I don't know about them needing to be unqualified...I'll dust off my dog-eared copy of the rules. :cb

EDIT...The latest SFA licence requirements say that the audit report should not contain an adverse opinion or disclaimer. Neither should it contain a qualified opinion in respect of Going Concern.

That last sentence might apply here. I haven't seen the Audit Report. What does it say?

[Andy74]

This lot are heavily qualified :)

I don't know about them needing to be unqualified...I'll dust off my dog-eared copy of the rules. :cb

EDIT...The latest SFA licence requirements say that the audit report should not contain an adverse opinion or disclaimer. Neither should it contain a qualified opinion in respect of Going Concern.

That last sentence might apply here. I haven't seen the Audit Report. What does it say?

The club's independent auditor, Deloitte, added: "The group requires additional funding to continue to meet its liabilities as they fall due.
"The group has made key assumptions in relation to its ability to secure further funding in addition to the timing and value of season ticket income, increases in matchday income and sponsorship, the timing and value of dividends and further cost reductions.
"These conditions around the need to secure further funding, along with the details provided in note 1 of the financial statements, indicate the existence of a material uncertainty which may cast significant doubt over the group's ability to continue as a going concern and therefore that the group may be unable to realise its assets and discharge its liabilities in the normal course of business."

[CropleyWasGod]

The club's independent auditor, Deloitte, added: "The group requires additional funding to continue to meet its liabilities as they fall due.
"The group has made key assumptions in relation to its ability to secure further funding in addition to the timing and value of season ticket income, increases in matchday income and sponsorship, the timing and value of dividends and further cost reductions.
"These conditions around the need to secure further funding, along with the details provided in note 1 of the financial statements, indicate the existence of a material uncertainty which may cast significant doubt over the group's ability to continue as a going concern and therefore that the group may be unable to realise its assets and discharge its liabilities in the normal course of business."

Ta.

That's a Going Concern qualification then. :greengrin

I know it's the least of their problems, but European football is a no-no for them next season.

More importantly, I think the SFA Licence is at risk as well, if I'm reading the Rules properly.

[Hermit Crab]

Thanks for the replies folks.

[ballengeich]

I'm surprised the rangers even have a European ranking, never having played in Europe.

The ranking is for the old club. UEFA keep clubs on their lists for five years even when they're liquidated. If the new lot do get into Europe during that period it will be interesting to see whether UEFA sets up two rankings or merges them.

[ballengeich]

Ta.

More importantly, I think the SFA Licence is at risk as well, if I'm reading the Rules properly.

Mmmm - perhaps.

[Andy74]

Ta.

That's a Going Concern qualification then. :greengrin

I know it's the least of their problems, but European football is a no-no for them next season.

More importantly, I think the SFA Licence is at risk as well, if I'm reading the Rules properly.

The key assumptions also include being promoted and the associated uplift in everything.

[CropleyWasGod]

Mmmm - perhaps.

Have a look ... they're a buggar to read... and see if you come to the same conclusion.

http://www.scottishfa.co.uk/resources/documents/ClubLicensing/2015/2015%20Club%20Licensing%20Manual%20-%20Parts%201%20&%202.pdf

[Bronson]

Not sure if this has already been mentioned but the BBC have just posted this http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30234751

Pleasing.

[ballengeich]

Have a look ... they're a buggar to read... and see if you come to the same conclusion.

http://www.scottishfa.co.uk/resources/documents/ClubLicensing/2015/2015%20Club%20Licensing%20Manual%20-%20Parts%201%20&%202.pdf

There are a lot of SFA regulations that allow normal rules to be overridden whenever the heidbummers want.

Section 8.11 seems to allow the licensing commission discretion to set particular conditions to allow a licence to be issued when an adverse audit is submitted. I suspect that if there's an adequate further share issue that something would be cobbled together to allow the license. Without the share issue how do they keep going anyway?

[CropleyWasGod]

There are a lot of SFA regulations that allow normal rules to be overridden whenever the heidbummers want.

Section 8.11 seems to allow the licensing commission discretion to set particular conditions to allow a licence to be issued when an adverse audit is submitted. I suspect that if there's an adequate further share issue that something would be cobbled together to allow the license. Without the share issue how do they keep going anyway?
On reflection, those are the rules for 2015.

By the time RFC apply for the licence, at the end of this season, the picture will be clearer. If the share issue is successful, then I would understand the SFA granting the license.

[Jack]

They'll have 3 years accounts at the end of this season :)

Do the 3 years accounts not show something like a £30m, £16m and an £8m loss? (figures off the top of my head :-)

While the SFA will applaud such prudence from the new company I'd suspect EUFA will be less than impressed!

[Keith_M]

All of today's Papers are reporting they need 8 million in funding over the next 12 months.

Is this an extra 8 million, meaning over and above what they expect from Season Ticket sales, etc?

[Keith_M]

Do the 3 years accounts not show something like a £30m, £16m and an £8m loss? (figures off the top of my head :-)

While the SFA will applaud such prudence from the new company I'd suspect EUFA will be less than impressed!


They only have two years accounts so far, with losses of £14.4M and £8.3M (Source Daily Record (http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-crisis-again-david-somers-4710124))

[CropleyWasGod]

All of today's Papers are reporting they need 8 million in funding over the next 12 months.

Is this an extra 8 million, meaning over and above what they expect from Season Ticket sales, etc?

Deloittes will have access to their records up to date, as well as forecasts.

I haven't seen the reports, or read Deloitte's report in detail. However, my guess is that the £8m will be in addition to the income already expected from ST sales and the likes. They have been operating at a huge deficit and it's likely that this will continue.

[jacomo]

Not sure if this has already been mentioned but the BBC have just posted this http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30234751

Pleasing.

Operating loss of £8.3m on turnover of £25.2m? Rank incompetence. I hope they get hammered. My worry is that Mike Ashley won't let it happen.

[Andy74]

Deloittes will have access to their records up to date, as well as forecasts.

I haven't seen the reports, or read Deloitte's report in detail. However, my guess is that the £8m will be in addition to the income already expected from ST sales and the likes. They have been operating at a huge deficit and it's likely that this will continue.

That's right. They could always lower player costs but that doesn't appear to fit with their view of themselves.

Staggering that a club who has been enjoying significanty the secong biggest income in Scotland has also managed to burn through an extra £50m or so, whilst only having to compete in the lower leagues!

[Keith_M]

Deloittes will have access to their records up to date, as well as forecasts.

I haven't seen the reports, or read Deloitte's report in detail. However, my guess is that the £8m will be in addition to the income already expected from ST sales and the likes. They have been operating at a huge deficit and it's likely that this will continue.


Cheers, good news then.


Actually, given the Turnover of the Club, it's probably the only reasonable conclusion.

[green&left]

Operating loss of £8.3m on turnover of £25.2m? Rank incompetence. I hope they get hammered. My worry is that Mike Ashley won't let it happen.

Not when he's selling Rangers their strips MORE than the retail value we won't :greengrin
(Grant Russel STV's twitter this morning)

[Keith_M]

Not when he's selling Rangers their strips MORE than the retail value we won't :greengrin
(Grant Russel STV's twitter this morning)


I'm not sure I understand what you mean.

Got a link to the story?

[hibs0666]

I'm not sure I understand what you mean.

Got a link to the story?

Mean that, if the retail price they could charge was, say, £45, Ashley had them (over a barrel) paying more than that to supply the stock.

Just the type of hero that the huns need to save them. :not worth

[Viva_Palmeiras]

Story doing the rounds here in Glasgow is that th DR has printed his flight arrival details...

Cant find anything online but do recall they have previous giving Hugh Dallas details out - car make model license plate were revealed and where he lived - after THAT OF match he officiated when he was coined... A neighbour then panned his windows - presumably knew where he lived anyway.

[Seveno]

I fail to see why Ashley is keeping them afloat when it clearly needs a massive injection of capital just to keep them afloat never mind competing in the SPFL if they get promoted. Despite what their deluded fans might think, they are not a global brand and there is a limit to how many shirts they can sell. It just does not make sense from the retail perspective.

As far as I know, Ashley does not have a criminal record or been suspected of anything criminal. He therefore fails the minimum requirement to be on the Rangers board. :cb

[AndyM_1875]

I fail to see why Ashley is keeping them afloat when it clearly needs a massive injection of capital just to keep them afloat never mind competing in the SPFL if they get promoted. Despite what their deluded fans might think, they are not a global brand and there is a limit to how many shirts they can sell. It just does not make sense from the retail perspective.

As far as I know, Ashley does not have a criminal record or been suspected of anything criminal. He therefore fails the minimum requirement to be on the Rangers board. :cb

Ashley is keeping them afloat because it makes business sense and long term business sense to him. They're not a global brand (no Scottish side is and neither are Newcastle) but they are a big brand.
Despite all the sneering and froth that's been thrown at them Rangers still sell a shed load of replica jerseys, probably more than any other Scottish club and they put out three kits a season. Mike Ashley owns the retail rights for that. It was him who organized the Puma deal for them, three cheap template kits rushed out for quick payback.
That's a lot of £ he's already made out of them. According to the accounts Rangers Retail (Ashley) made £7.6m. The football club actually got less than a quarter of that back.

If Rangers are playing in the SPL and then get into the CL (something Newcastle, being honest, have no chance of) then that's even more revenue to him. Rangers going into Administration again would be disastrous for Ashley. He'd lose what is and will continue to be a lucrative business deal.
Keeping Rangers going will be chicken feed to him.

[Keith_M]

Mean that, if the retail price they could charge was, say, £45, Ashley had them (over a barrel) paying more than that to supply the stock.

Just the type of hero that the huns need to save them. :not worth

Wow! So they actually lose money for every top they sell?

[Keith_M]

I fail to see why Ashley is keeping them afloat when it clearly needs a massive injection of capital just to keep them afloat never mind competing in the SPFL if they get promoted. Despite what their deluded fans might think, they are not a global brand and there is a limit to how many shirts they can sell. It just does not make sense from the retail perspective.




There was an article in the Papers a few years back that stated both Celtic and Rangers were selling in the region of 200,000 replica strips per year.

Even if there's been a large reduction since then, I'd imagine it's still a number the other Clubs could only dream off.

[Thecat23]

Ashley is keeping them afloat because it makes business sense and long term business sense to him. They're not a global brand (no Scottish side is and neither are Newcastle) but they are a big brand.
Despite all the sneering and froth that's been thrown at them Rangers still sell a shed load of replica jerseys, probably more than any other Scottish club and they put out three kits a season. Mike Ashley owns the retail rights for that. It was him who organized the Puma deal for them, three cheap template kits rushed out for quick payback.
That's a lot of £ he's already made out of them. According to the accounts Rangers Retail (Ashley) made £7.6m. The football club actually got less than a quarter of that back.

If Rangers are playing in the SPL and then get into the CL (something Newcastle, being honest, have no chance of) then that's even more revenue to him. Rangers going into Administration again would be disastrous for Ashley. He'd lose what is and will continue to be a lucrative business deal.
Keeping Rangers going will be chicken feed to him.

There is only one CL place up for grabs in Scotland, Celtic are miles and I mean miles ahead of them when it comes to wages and how much they can spend. The Rangers will not be in the CL for at least 10 years so no idea why Ashley would invest myself.

Personally myself I think they will go bust within the next 2 years!

[Just Alf]

There is only one CL place up for grabs in Scotland, Celtic are miles and I mean miles ahead of them when it comes to wages and how much they can spend. The Rangers will not be in the CL for at least 10 years so no idea why Ashley would invest myself.

Personally myself I think they will go bust within the next 2 years!


:pray:

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

They wouldn't.

Didn't have to last time, and neither did Hearts. The decision would be the administrator's.

Its starting again Crops, its starting!

[HoboHarry]

They will have to find Craigie boy a cell in amongst Celtic supporters for his own safety lol

[jacomo]

There is only one CL place up for grabs in Scotland, Celtic are miles and I mean miles ahead of them when it comes to wages and how much they can spend. The Rangers will not be in the CL for at least 10 years so no idea why Ashley would invest myself.

Personally myself I think they will go bust within the next 2 years!

Ashley is protecting his contracts. Even at 100k shirt sales a season that is a serious revenue stream.

[Thecat23]

That is defo a big return, but even shirt sales won't cover what he will need to put in if he wants them to be going for CL.

He's pretty much chucking money away, there must be something else behind his motives for taking an interest in The Rangers.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Billy Whizz]

Has Craigie boy appeared in court yet today?

[jacomo]

That is defo a big return, but even shirt sales won't cover what he will need to put in if he wants them to be going for CL.

He's pretty much chucking money away, there must be something else behind his motives for taking an interest in The Rangers.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You can guarantee that Ashley will not be throwing his money away. I don't know what he's up to, but he's not a sugar daddy. He does have the capacity to save The Rangers from their ineptitude, though.

[Thecat23]

Yeah there is defo something in this for him. But no idea what yet.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[AndyM_1875]

That is defo a big return, but even shirt sales won't cover what he will need to put in if he wants them to be going for CL.

He's pretty much chucking money away, there must be something else behind his motives for taking an interest in The Rangers.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What he's spent on Rangers is peanuts compared with what he spent on Newcastle and the rumours are that he'd like to sell the Magpies whom he has already given £129m in Interest Free loans. He doesn't even have to buy shares in Rangers as he can do what Co-Operative bank did with Celtic (for their £33m soft loan) and secure that against Club assets and Rangers have quite a few pieces of land.

Ashley will sell Newcastle (likely 2016 (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/sep/12/mike-ashley-newcastle-selling)) but a buyer will have to come up with £250m to take the club out of his hands.

[jonty]

Has Craigie boy appeared in court yet today?

Laura Brannan @_LauraBrannan
Craig Whyte has been granted bail after a 45 minute hearing at Glasgow Sheriff Court.

[Billy Whizz]

Laura Brannan @_LauraBrannan
Craig Whyte has been granted bail after a 45 minute hearing at Glasgow Sheriff Court.

Thanks
Has he been charged with anything?

[ballengeich]

Ashley's making money out of the sale of replica kit. So far as I can see, all he's done to date is lend money, secured against the car park and Edmiston House, to allow the business to continue trading while his consultants work out whether the cost of sustaining The Rangers for a further period is justifed by future income from the commercial deals.

He might want to prop them up if he sees adequate future profit. However, even if he does, whatever his plan is, it has to bring some benefit to other shareholders. Despite what's been written in various places, his 9% shareholding doesn't give him absolute power over the club. If the likes of Laxey and the off-shore funds fronted by the Easedales don't like what he's proposing it needn't go ahead, even if the alternative is to shut the club down.

[greenginger]

Ashley's making money out of the sale of replica kit. So far as I can see, all he's done to date is lend money, secured against the car park and Edmiston House, to allow the business to continue trading while his consultants work out whether the cost of sustaining The Rangers for a further period is justifed by future income from the commercial deals.

He might want to prop them up if he sees adequate future profit. However, even if he does, whatever his plan is, it has to bring some benefit to other shareholders. Despite what's been written in various places, his 9% shareholding doesn't give him absolute power over the club. If the likes of Laxey and the off-shore funds fronted by the Easedales don't like what he's proposing it needn't go ahead, even if the alternative is to shut the club down.

I thought Sports Direct own the copyright to Rangers badge so even if the football club goes pop, Third Rangers will still have to deal with Sports Direct.

Going into admin. again may cause a temporary collapse in kit sales and the loss of any chance on promotion , but if it gets rid of wage thieve players , wifi and catering contracts, it might be worthwhile.

In Ashley's eyes anyway. :greengrin

[Keith_M]

In the event of an Administration, those owed money have a very large say in whether any CVA will be accepted.

Ashley's Loans could prove to be very useful as a bargaining chip if that does happen.

[ballengeich]

Going into admin. again may cause a temporary collapse in kit sales and the loss of any chance on promotion , but if it gets rid of wage thieve players , wifi and catering contracts, it might be worthwhile.

In Ashley's eyes anyway. :greengrin

I think that promotion this season is vital to the club's future. Get it and some of the lapsed ST holders will return, other income will pick up and the club might be close to breaking even. Another Championship season will lead to further crowd reductions and more massive losses.

[greenginger]

In the event of an Administration, those owed money have a very large say in whether any CVA will be accepted.

Ashley's Loans could prove to be very useful as a bargaining chip if that does happen.

Ashley could simply take possession of the properties his loans are secured on ( car park and Edminston House ), ditch the onerous contracts and players, and continue to supply the kit etc. and lease the properties back to the club to cover the loss on his loan.

Only downside is the 25 point penalty. A 15 point penalty and they could still get a play-off place.

Over to you SPFL.

[Billy Whizz]

Hope the link works


http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-30242028

[hibs0666]

Hope the link works


http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-30242028

Craigie is my new hero.

[Springbank]

Hope the link works


http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-30242028

He looks like robbie jobbie neilson there

[Springbank]

With a hint of rik mayall

[silverhibee]

Hope the link works


http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-30242028


Obviously big turn out at court by The Rangers fans, Whyte escorted out of court by police, SSN couldn't use any sound as he left court due to the abusive language being shouted at him, apart from looking like a tramp the fear on his face as he looked at the huns leaving court was priceless.

[Leithenhibby]

Hope the link works


http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-30242028


Craigie is my new hero.


Obviously big turn out at court by The Rangers fans, Whyte escorted out of court by police, SSN couldn't use any sound as he left court due to the abusive language being shouted at him, apart from looking like a tramp the fear on his face as he looked at the huns leaving court was priceless.

This has fairly made ma day :greengrin

[silverhibee]

This has fairly made ma day :greengrin

Even worse is he has another warrant out for his arrest by the High court in London, he could be spending a long weekend in some nick down South before he appears in court on Monday. :greengrin

[grunt]

http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-30242028


Craigie is my new hero.
He seems to have lost weight. Hope he's ok.

[Billy Whizz]

He seems to have lost weight. Hope he's ok.

I agree, and looks to have aged by about 10 years or so

[Haymaker]

How much jail time will he be looking at?

[gorgie greens]

I agree, and looks to have aged by about 10 years or so

looks like Ian Beale when they found him homeless living in cardboard city

[HoboHarry]

How much jail time will he be looking at?
I don't know but every day is going to be in the protection wing for his own safety lol. He will need two Celtic supporting bodyguards....

[emerald green]

looks like Ian Beale when they found him homeless living in cardboard city

:agree:


I don't know but every day is going to be in the protection wing for his own safety lol. He will need two Celtic supporting bodyguards....

:agree: I thought when I saw his photo in the papers he had maybe been trying to change his appearance.

[Keith_M]

:agree: I thought when I saw his photo in the papers he had maybe been trying to change his appearance.


Same here, trying to avoid being recognized.

Thing is, he has the same bulging eyes, so no mistaking him in a line-up


:wink:

[Stan the Man]

Hope the link works


http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-30242028

This may have been discussed before, but I can't understand how David Murray could have been 'duped' in the process.

Would someone in Ticketus not picked up the phone to him, to let him know that a Craig Whyte had been enquiring about securing a loan against something that wasn't his (3 years season ticket monies)?

I am struggling to believe either:

- Ticketus issued money to Whyte based purely on his word he now owned Rangers

or

- Murray sold to Whyte without checking his bank account to see he had the money required

Either way it feels to me Murray must have known more than he is letting on.

[CropleyWasGod]

This may have been discussed before, but I can't understand how David Murray could have been 'duped' in the process.

Would someone in Ticketus not picked up the phone to him, to let him know that a Craig Whyte had been enquiring about securing a loan against something that wasn't his (3 years season ticket monies)?

I am struggling to believe either:

- Ticketus issued money to Whyte based purely on his word he now owned Rangers

or

- Murray sold to Whyte without checking his bank account to see he had the money required

Either way it feels to me Murray must have known more than he is letting on.
I have said for a long time that SDM had to have known.

If he didn't, he is guilty of not doing his own due diligence. As, perhaps, are Ticketus. Not a crime, but in some ways I say "hell mend em"

If they did do such diligence, and still got duped. ...I'm dying to see how they did it :-). I always love fraud trials for that reason.

[greenginger]

Yeah, but is pretending to have money a crime ?

If so, Buy.Hibs better watch themselves. :greengrin

[overdrive]

This may have been discussed before, but I can't understand how David Murray could have been 'duped' in the process.

Would someone in Ticketus not picked up the phone to him, to let him know that a Craig Whyte had been enquiring about securing a loan against something that wasn't his (3 years season ticket monies)?

I am struggling to believe either:

- Ticketus issued money to Whyte based purely on his word he now owned Rangers

or

- Murray sold to Whyte without checking his bank account to see he had the money required

Either way it feels to me Murray must have known more than he is letting on.


I thought he did have the money in his account - from Ticketus. Did the solicitor not claim he was duped by Whyte when the brown stuff first hit the fan as the money was in the account? If that was the case, the solicitor obviously didn't do a great job on the money laundering checks.

I agree Murray either didn't do a great deal of due diligence or was complicit in it all. After all, he was desperate to offload the club.

[Jim44]

They can't help themselves at the Beeb. The anchorman ( don't know his name) was really chuffed with his humerus comment ...... "The 1902 cup winners go through." Call me touchy, but it gets a bit boring.

[Keith_M]

They can't help themselves at the Beeb. The anchorman ( don't know his name) was really chuffed with his humerus comment ...... "The 1902 cup winners go through." Call me touchy, but it gets a bit boring.


Two points:

What's that got to do with Rangers Financial Troubles

and


THIS is a Humerus..............

:wink:

http://i944.photobucket.com/albums/ad290/gingerglamalgan/humerus-1.jpg

[Jim44]

Two points:

What's that got to do with Rangers Financial Troubles

and


THIS is a Humerus..............

:wink:

http://i944.photobucket.com/albums/ad290/gingerglamalgan/humerus-1.jpg

Oops, wrong thread and oh, very humerous.:greengrin

[portycabbage]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30284514

..."That means for every £10 spent by Rangers fans on merchandise, the club receives only around 75p. The accounts also reveal that Rangers Retail has an obligation to purchase stock at a higher price than it is able to be sold at.

In the second half of the year covered by the accounts, it appears that the portion of profit due to the club is £2,000.

For comparative purposes, the much maligned JJB agreement, our previous retail deal, made the club a minimum of £4.8m a year over the term of the deal, over eight times the amount we are making from Sports Direct."

[Haymaker]

75p for every £10! Ha!

[portycabbage]

Rangers manager Ally McCoist braced for Ibrox fire-sale

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/rangers/11269147/Rangers-manager-Ally-McCoist-braced-for-fire-sale.html

Also liked this bit-

"Tunisia defender Bilel Mohsni told French reporters that McCoist had prevented him moving to clubs in England and France and McCoist conceded that he could ill afford to dilute his pool of talent."

[Hibernia&Alba]

Rangers manager Ally McCoist braced for Ibrox fire-sale

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/rangers/11269147/Rangers-manager-Ally-McCoist-braced-for-fire-sale.html

Also liked this bit-

"Tunisia defender Bilel Mohsni told French reporters that McCoist had prevented him moving to clubs in England and France and McCoist conceded that he could ill afford to dilute his pool of talent."

Pleasing.

[CropleyWasGod]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30284514

..."That means for every £10 spent by Rangers fans on merchandise, the club receives only around 75p. The accounts also reveal that Rangers Retail has an obligation to purchase stock at a higher price than it is able to be sold at.

In the second half of the year covered by the accounts, it appears that the portion of profit due to the club is £2,000.

For comparative purposes, the much maligned JJB agreement, our previous retail deal, made the club a minimum of £4.8m a year over the term of the deal, over eight times the amount we are making from Sports Direct."
By boycotting the merchandise, they are depriving the club of income at a time when it is really needed. it will make administration more likely.

Crack on, chaps.

[Jim44]

Rangers manager Ally McCoist braced for Ibrox fire-sale

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/rangers/11269147/Rangers-manager-Ally-McCoist-braced-for-fire-sale.html

Also liked this bit-

"Tunisia defender Bilel Mohsni told French reporters that McCoist had prevented him moving to clubs in England and France and McCoist conceded that he could ill afford to dilute his pool of talent."

Doesn't McCoist waffle on with meaningless statements at times?

"I am in contact with [former Newcastle chief executive and new non-executive director] Derek Llambias and the chairman. If I have anything to ask, or they need to see me, we contact over phone, email or I see them in person.”

........ You don't say, Ally. You could also mention using fax, media conference, Skype, Facebook, sign language and carrier pigeon to convince the fans that your the man with a finger on the pulse of the decreasingly beating heart of a once proud club. ;-)

[jonty]

By boycotting the merchandise, they are depriving the club of income at a time when it is really needed. it will make administration more likely.

Crack on, chaps.

2k? :greengrin
the straw that breaks the camels back? I'm beginning to warm to Mike Ashley :greengrin

[jacomo]

By boycotting the merchandise, they are depriving the club of income at a time when it is really needed. it will make administration more likely.

Crack on, chaps.

I think the point they are making is that Rangers make very little income from retail.

Still, they might force Ashley out if they annoy him enough. Don't worry Teddy Bears, Dave King or Brian Kennedy will come to the rescue. :faf:

[bingo70]

I think the point they are making is that Rangers make very little income from retail.

Still, they might force Ashley out if they annoy him enough. Don't worry Teddy Bears, Dave King or Brian Kennedy will come to the rescue. :faf:

Is the shop not franchised out though?

I thought we were the same and didn't make much off our shop.

[Billy Whizz]

By boycotting the merchandise, they are depriving the club of income at a time when it is really needed. it will make administration more likely.

Crack on, chaps.

The Gers fans group on sportsound last night said, if you have £10 to spend, buy tickets on Rangers pools, rather than retail, as more money goes to the club

[AndyM_1875]

2k? :greengrin
the straw that breaks the camels back? I'm beginning to warm to Mike Ashley :greengrin

A cynic might suggest that all Ashley is doing is handing Rangers back their own money in the form of a loan whist he takes great security over their assets via this **cough* loan...

[Bostonhibby]

Rangers manager Ally McCoist braced for Ibrox fire-sale

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/rangers/11269147/Rangers-manager-Ally-McCoist-braced-for-fire-sale.html

Also liked this bit-

"Tunisia defender Bilel Mohsni told French reporters that McCoist had prevented him moving to clubs in England and France and McCoist conceded that he could ill afford to dilute his pool of talent."

I hadn't even realised Hyde United were looking for any more rank defenders.

[CropleyWasGod]

The Gers fans group on sportsound last night said, if you have £10 to spend, buy tickets on Rangers pools, rather than retail, as more money goes to the club

That's fair enough, and fair play to them if that's the way it goes.

[ano hibby]

Rangers announced last week that the club had made an operating loss of £8.3  million (believed to be a world record for a third-tier club) and chairman David Somers admitted that a similar amount of investment was required in order to keep them afloat.

Record breakers :)

[ano hibby]

“I’d love it if this was our last Petrofac Cup campaign and I mean that in the nicest possible way,” he said. “It maybe makes the game at Alloa that bit more special. “Winning it in our final year would be the ideal scenario. That would be the dream ticket."

Dream ticket...Petrofac Training Trophy :)

[CropleyWasGod]

“I’d love it if this was our last Petrofac Cup campaign and I mean that in the nicest possible way,” he said. “It maybe makes the game at Alloa that bit more special. “Winning it in our final year would be the ideal scenario. That would be the dream ticket."

Dream ticket...Petrofac Training Trophy :)

Words to bite one's bum, perhaps. :cb

[ano hibby]

Words to bite one's bum, perhaps. :cb

Good spot :)

[jacomo]

“I’d love it if this was our last Petrofac Cup campaign and I mean that in the nicest possible way,” he said. “It maybe makes the game at Alloa that bit more special. “Winning it in our final year would be the ideal scenario. That would be the dream ticket."

Dream ticket...Petrofac Training Trophy :)

This would be McCoist's first cup as a manager. No wonder he thinks it's special.

Edit: He also says in that article 'I respect everything going on at the club right now.' Surprised he didn't start gushing about Mike Ashley's many qualities, great dress sense and handsome looks.

What a greasy wee individual.

[StevieC]

Still, they might force Ashley out if they annoy him enough.

No chance.

Just ask us long suffering Newcastle fans. :grr:

"Get out of our club .." has been chanted at almost every match for the last 3 years!!

[jacomo]

No chance.

Just ask us long suffering Newcastle fans. :grr:

"Get out of our club .." has been chanted at almost every match for the last 3 years!!

Well, he did put Newcastle up for sale - but no one offered the asking price.

[Andy74]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30284514

..."That means for every £10 spent by Rangers fans on merchandise, the club receives only around 75p. The accounts also reveal that Rangers Retail has an obligation to purchase stock at a higher price than it is able to be sold at.

In the second half of the year covered by the accounts, it appears that the portion of profit due to the club is £2,000.

For comparative purposes, the much maligned JJB agreement, our previous retail deal, made the club a minimum of £4.8m a year over the term of the deal, over eight times the amount we are making from Sports Direct."

Eight times? £4.8m is a wee bit further away than that.

[Iain G]

This would be McCoist's first cup as a manager. No wonder he thinks it's special.

Edit: He also says in that article 'I respect everything going on at the club right now.' Surprised he didn't start gushing about Mike Ashley's many qualities, great dress sense and handsome looks.

What a greasy wee individual.

You expect anything less from toadying wee Ally? Typical Rangers man doffing his cap to his betters...

[Keith_M]

Oops, wrong thread and oh, very humerous.:greengrin


That would be 'humorous'



:wink:

[Spike Mandela]

Alloa Chairman has a nice wee pop about tonight:greengrin

mike mulraney (@mikemulraney1)
03/12/2014 16:55
With most of our team out for tonight,9 We might need a wee bit of luck. Newly promoted teams always present a challenge! #alloafc #rangers

[Bostonhibby]

Alloa Chairman has a nice wee pop about tonight:greengrin

mike mulraney (@mikemulraney1)
03/12/2014 16:55
With most of our team out for tonight,9 We might need a wee bit of luck. Newly promoted teams always present a challenge! #alloafc #rangers

Newboys just failing there against the established Alloa boys, brave fight by the sound of it though, maybe the petrofac was a tournament too far.

Sally was well up for it as well, the knives will be out, is he the right sort of manager for a new club, being an long standing establishment figure himself? :faf:

[Keith_M]

Alloa Chairman has a nice wee pop about tonight:greengrin

mike mulraney (@mikemulraney1)
03/12/2014 16:55
With most of our team out for tonight,9 We might need a wee bit of luck. Newly promoted teams always present a challenge! #alloafc #rangers


It appears that wee bit of luck was on their side after all, in the (rotund) shape of Super Ally


:greengrin



Good luck to Alloa in the final.

[Malthibby]

On BBC Alba iPlayer. Miller's face at the end is just priceless..............

[portycabbage]

Eight times? £4.8m is a wee bit further away than that.

I think it's the 600k-ish figure elsewhere in the article (ie what the deal is supposed to give them) that's being referred to, rather than the 100k they've received so far, or the 2k the accounts show they're due for the second half of the year. Whichever way you slice it it's not exactly a great deal for them!

[franks]

Saw last nights game and was delighted, almost switched over at 0-2 but stayed with it. What I can't understand is the TV news tonight calling it a shock. Can't see how anyone would think it a shock. Some people seem to think of the old rangers when talking about them, things have changed and Alloa beating them is no surprise at all anymore.

[Leithenhibby]

On BBC Alba iPlayer. Miller's face at the end is just priceless..............

:greengrin Made my night...............

[worcesterhibby]

On BBC Alba iPlayer. Miller's face at the end is just priceless..............

Aye and McCulloch booting the ball out of the ground and down the road in frustration at the final whistle.. :greengrin:greengrin I hope they made him go and fetch it !

[Keith_M]

It looks like the knives are out (http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-boss-ally-mccoist-facing-4751192) in the Boardroom for Super Ally


The Easdales want rid but the Media have only just sussed that TRFC can't afford to sack him.


They should have been reading this Forum for the last two and a bit years, we've said it often enough :wink:

[grunt]

It looks like the knives are out (http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-boss-ally-mccoist-facing-4751192) in the Boardroom for Super Ally
:wink:Nice shirt you're wearing there! :greengrin

[Keith_M]

Nice shirt you're wearing there! :greengrin


That happens to be a Scotland Rugby Top.

:greengrin

The WeeMees (http://www.weeworld.com/) didn't have any Football Tops when I made the picture.

[lapsedhibee]

It looks like the knives are out (http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-boss-ally-mccoist-facing-4751192) in the Boardroom for Super Ally

Can't understand this. The No vote in the Should Sally Do Walking Away? poll stands at only 41%. Hibbies got the boy Sebo to the top of a previous hun poll - shirley we can do better on this one?

[jacomo]

On BBC Alba iPlayer. Miller's face at the end is just priceless..............

He should have come home to the Hibees. Nae sympathy!

[jacomo]

Can't understand this. The No vote in the Should Sally Be Sacked poll stands at only 41%. Hibbies got the boy Sebo to the top of a previous hun poll - shirley we can do better on this one?

We all need to rally round at times like these. Looks like the Daily Ranger is still in favour of McCoist though, so bitterness and recrimination whatever happens.

Thank God Swally doesn't do walking away.

[Hibernia&Alba]

We all need to rally round at times like these. Looks like the Daily Ranger is still in favour of McCoist though, so bitterness and recrimination whatever happens.

Thank God Swally doesn't do walking away.

He can't walk far at all these days. Have you seen the size of him?

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Did anyone else see Super Ally on the STV News? I'm starting to feel sorry for him if he believes the words that came out his mouth in that interview to be the truth. The only reason he is still in his job is cos he shafted his beloved Gers for such a ridiculous contract.

[Crazyhorse]

Did anyone else see Super Ally on the STV News? I'm starting to feel sorry for him if he believes the words that came out his mouth in that interview to be the truth. The only reason he is still in his job is cos he shafted his beloved Gers for such a ridiculous contract.

I wouldn't say that but he is clearly delusional.

[Bronson]

£1.4million to sack him according to The Sun, he's going nowhere:greengrin

[Hibernia&Alba]

£1.4million to sack him according to The Sun, he's going nowhere:greengrin

It's absolutely crazy for a liquidated and demoted club to be putting a manager on such a contract. They didn't learn a thing, and it's no surprise they're looking at administration again.

[Bronson]

It's absolutely crazy for a liquidated and demoted club to be putting a manager on such a contract. They didn't learn a thing, and it's no surprise they're looking at administration again.

Madness indeed, I don't think I've seen a club run so badly in my life.

Last year they made a loss of £8.3million - a world record annual loss for a 3rd tier football club.

Another nice wee stat, through their dodgy dealings with Ashley (I think), the club now makes a laughable 75p for every £10 spent on merchandise. Seriously, let that sink in.

[Iain G]

Charlie Miller blindly defending his old mate "Coisty"

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30349206

"I'm still at the point where I can't believe people are even speaking about sacking Coisty. I'm actually really, really upset about that."

Awwwww....

[eastcoasthibby]

McCoist needs to stay ...so he can continue to make an erse of things through at the home of self indulgence and arrogance ..... they are getting what they deserve .... they have forked out money they don't have for that bunch of shyst ..... but sorry I forgot !! they are all quality players earning what they are worth !!!!!! yeh right hahahahaha.
Miller, Boyd, will be on more a week than the entire Alloa staff are a week !!

The Astley deal tells you how desperate they are to literally "sell the jerseys" the way they have tells you they are in bad bad way financially.....

Sevco actually need to stay in this league another year to learn the reality of what they are now .....living within their means and maybe then they will turn things around ... I am cannot stand what they are, but Scottish football needs the money they can generate.

GGTTH

[Keith_M]

It's absolutely crazy for a liquidated and demoted club to be putting a manager on such a contract. They didn't learn a thing, and it's no surprise they're looking at administration again.


They didn't actually choose to put him on that kind of money, that was David Murray's legacy. He was given the Contract under Murray's leadership and the new owners of the Purchased Assets (Green, et al) had to honour it under TUPE rules.

When Green first arrived, he was determined to get rid of Super Swally but would have had to pay him off for the same crazy amount that it takes to get rid of him now.

[CropleyWasGod]

They didn't actually choose to put him on that kind of money, that was David Murray's legacy. He was given the Contract under Murray's leadership and the new owners of the Purchased Assets (Green, et al) had to honour it under TUPE rules.

When Green first arrived, he was determined to get rid of Super Swally but would have had to pay him off for the same crazy amount that it takes to get rid of him now.
That's correct, they had no option.

Didn't he take a pay cut, though?

[Keith_M]

That's correct, they had no option.

Didn't he take a pay cut, though?


Allegedly :wink:


However, under his contract, they would have to pay him off according to the original salary level (700k+ basic, I think)

[MrSmith]

One question keeps popping into my head; for a club that is supposed to be proving it can live within its means but clearly it can't and given the SPFL put news rules into place to ensure this, why haven't the powers that be acted?

Its quite clear and has been for a year at least, The Rangers are in real trouble financially and its not going to get better.

[CropleyWasGod]

One question keeps popping into my head; for a club that is supposed to be proving it can live within its means but clearly it can't and given the SPFL put news rules into place to ensure this, why haven't the powers that be acted?

Its quite clear and has been for a year at least, The Rangers are in real trouble financially and its not going to get better.
To be fair, up until now, they have lived within their means. They had £x, and still have some of it left.

It's only the latest accounts that might transgress the SFA rules, in that it might affect their application for a licence. However, by the time that application is due, their financial position should be resolved, one way or the other :)

[happiehibbie]

http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/what-the-dickens-is-going-on-at-ibrox/

this is a good read

[jacomo]

http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/what-the-dickens-is-going-on-at-ibrox/

this is a good read

I'd take him more seriously if he didn't write like an embittered blow hard.

[CropleyWasGod]

http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/what-the-dickens-is-going-on-at-ibrox/

this is a good read

Does he know about paragraphs? :rolleyes:

It's all good from the point of view of us gloating, but it annoys the hell out of me (the business me, not the Hibby me) that such a review wasn't conducted at the very start of RFC MkII.

However, Llambias' comment that the whole thing needs to be closed down and restarted is quite encouraging.

[Smartie]

Does he know about paragraphs? :rolleyes:

It's all good from the point of view of us gloating, but it annoys the hell out of me (the business me, not the Hibby me) that such a review wasn't conducted at the very start of RFC MkII.

However, Llambias' comment that the whole thing needs to be closed down and restarted is quite encouraging.

Me too.

But I don't know if "the people" would have tolerated it at the time. There was still the feeling that they were a big club and that they had to blow fortunes on transfers - it's what they're all about.

They've had a few years trawling around the lower leagues with reality sinking in and I think that this time they might realise that there would be no third chance, and that the very existence of their club actually does mean a lot more to them than their delusions of grandeur.

[grunt]

Does he know about paragraphs? :rolleyes:

This really annoys me - he calls himself a journalist, author and blogger, yet he seems incapable of writing in a style which is half way readable. I guess he's a journalist in the same way that Sun reporters are journalists.

[lapsedhibee]

Does he know about paragraphs?

Would that not be unnecessarily highfalutin, given that the target audience struggle to spell their own team's name? :dunno:

[Callum_62]

See there wee just awared 204,000GBP for the development of Charlie Telfer - to be paid by Dundee UTD

[CropleyWasGod]

See there wee just awared 204,000GBP for the development of Charlie Telfer - to be paid by Dundee UTD
Yep.

Agree with the principle, but the price is very steep IMO.

[jonty]

See there wee just awared 204,000GBP for the development of Charlie Telfer - to be paid by Dundee UTD

I don't get the argument that they've used. Surely it was the companies that ran the club signed him up for a contract, paid his wages and developed him. He simply played one game in league one.
If there was any development monies due it should go into the creditors pot, not the current company running the club?
ie Season ticket income doesn't go to the club, it goes to the company? so why would income in this case?

CWG :cb

[Pedantic_Hibee]

See there wee just awared 204,000GBP for the development of Charlie Telfer - to be paid by Dundee UTD

How much did The Rangers want for him?

[CropleyWasGod]

I don't get the argument that they've used. Surely it was the companies that ran the club signed him up for a contract, paid his wages and developed him. He simply played one game in league one.
If there was any development monies due it should go into the creditors pot, not the current company running the club?
ie Season ticket income doesn't go to the club, it goes to the company? so why would income in this case?

CWG :cb
For me, it centres round the fact that NewHun took on (most of) the staff of OldHun, with all the rights and responsibilities that go with that. They are liable to pay the contracts, pensions, redundancies of the employees. .....the balance to that is that they should be entitled to the benefits of those employees as well.

Haven't seen the full report yet so don't know if the tribunal used that reason. Was it simply a case of "poor things need the money...just give it to them"? [emoji6]

[Bishop Hibee]

How much did The Rangers want for him?

£200,000. What Newco want, Newco get. The SFA will never allow Newco to suffer after what happened to Oldco. Watch them bend over backwards to allow Ashley's de-facto ownership.