Share Transfers Agreed/Cooling off period

[DaveF]

I didn't say that.

Had HMRC put the company under, there would have been redundancies at HMFC. Those non-playing staff who couldn't find other jobs would have to go on benefits.

Double-whammy for us. No tax income, and benefits expense.

Apologies - I was skimming across the posts and misread your comments.

[CropleyWasGod]

Apologies - I was skimming across the posts and misread your comments.

No problem.

I understand your anger, but think of it this way... HMFC now have a debt of £1.5m that they didn't have last week. That has to inform their budgeting for the next few years.

[StevieC]

Doesn't seem like HMRC tactics with tax avoiders. Reduce the amount and agree payment plan? Stinks of back room political interference.

I'm not so sure.
Given that Rangers (as opposed to The Rangers) have (allegedly) just "won" their tax case, it might be seen to be prudent to accept a reduced amount to save a lengthy and expensive trial/tribunal that could potentiall be "lost".

[Cracker]

No problem.

I understand your anger, but think of it this way... HMFC now have a debt of £1.5m that they didn't have last week. That has to inform their budgeting for the next few years.

Guess relegation will hurry things along:)

[CropleyWasGod]

Guess relegation will hurry things along:)

In many ways, that's the "fairest" way. They get sporting sanctions for sporting excesses. They also can't say "oh, it was the tax-man that screwed us".

[Hibs7]

So they have just paid HMRC £450,000 are due another £500,000 in May, received £300,000 from The Rangers and have raised £600,000 from the share issue ...... Hmmm
By my sums they are still £50,000 short and still have 2 months players salaries to cough up, no further income from the Scottish cup ( aw shame ) but an Easter rd semi which should net them about £250,000 - tax. They are living on a knife edge, oops forgot they have a £24m debt to service as well. I would say that it is not looking too healthy down Tinhutcastle way ......

[Hibby Kay-Yay]

So they have just paid HMRC £450,000 are due another £500,000 in May, received £300,000 from The Rangers and have raised £600,000 from the share issue ...... Hmmm
By my sums they are still £50,000 short and still have 2 months players salaries to cough up, no further income from the Scottish cup ( aw shame ) but an Easter rd semi which should net them about £250,000 - tax. They are living on a knife edge, oops forgot they have a £24m debt to service as well. I would say that it is not looking too healthy down Tinhutcastle way ......

They're due 500k from Rangers next year so that takes care of that one.

[GloryGlory]

No problem.

I understand your anger, but think of it this way... HMFC now have a debt of £1.5m that they didn't have last week. That has to inform their budgeting for the next few years.

They also still have the problem of financing the redevelopment of their death-trap, accident-waiting-to-happen main stand. Surely, even this Jambo council can't go on renewing safety certificates indefinitely.

I would imagine that they will try to renegotiate the contracts of the highest earners and offer them 30% or so of what they are currently on.

[MB62]

If they don't pick up 10 points before their main players get emptied in January I fancy them to go down this season.

and if the do pick up those points, there will no doubt be win bonuses due to be paid to their players.

Was in a taxi from Edinburgh airport on Friday when the driver was saying he is mates with something at Swinie (can't remember who now, did at the time and it was an ex player I think on the coaching staff now maybe, jet lag is still scrambling my brain) anyway, he was saying that Sutton is on £3,000 a week appearance money and that the yams just can't afford to play himand are desperate to offload him. I know he came on on Sunday so maybe that's another £3000 out of their coffers :greengrin
Don't know how true this is BTW, you know what taxi drivers are like :duck: :greengrin

[PatHead]

Not really. HMRC aren't daft. They would have got zip if they'd played that game.

This way, there is a chance that they will get some of that money.... and they also have the moral high ground of having been seen to help preserve jobs and future revenue for the Treasury.

Agree something is better than nothing at all but kind of flies in the face of Osborne's declared hard line on tax evaders though. Would also love to see the business plan they presented as well!

[clerriehibs]

No problem.

I understand your anger, but think of it this way... HMFC now have a debt of £1.5m that they didn't have last week. That has to inform their budgeting for the next few years.


You think? Budgeting doesn't really seem to have figured in anything the yams have done over recent years..

[Crazyhorse]

I'm not so sure.
Given that Rangers (as opposed to The Rangers) have (allegedly) just "won" their tax case, it might be seen to be prudent to accept a reduced amount to save a lengthy and expensive trial/tribunal that could potentiall be "lost".

Also sort of on this point. Given that there is still an investigation into dual contracts at oldcogers does this arrangement the yams have come to mean they are effectively owning up to deploying dual contracts for their employees? Is this £1.5m tax they should have paid on the Lith contracts? If so should we be expecting an SPL investigation?

[CropleyWasGod]

Also sort of on this point. Given that there is still an investigation into dual contracts at oldcogers does this arrangement the yams have come to mean they are effectively owning up to deploying dual contracts for their employees? Is this £1.5m tax they should have paid on the Lith contracts? If so should we be expecting an SPL investigation?

There has been no suggestion, other than on here, that the tax case has been about dual contracts.


Agree something is better than nothing at all but kind of flies in the face of Osborne's declared hard line on tax evaders though. Would also love to see the business plan they presented as well!

Thread hijack, I know, but don't get me started on Osborne. HMRC can only work with the tools they have been given by Government. It's the Government that make the tax laws in the first place, and the Government that have been cutting HMRC's resources for years.

[Lucius Apuleius]

Given they don't have to start paying it until May, could it be they do not ever expect or intend to pay it.

[inglisavhibs]

So they have just paid HMRC £450,000 are due another £500,000 in May, received £300,000 from The Rangers and have raised £600,000 from the share issue ...... Hmmm
By my sums they are still £50,000 short and still have 2 months players salaries to cough up, no further income from the Scottish cup ( aw shame ) but an Easter rd semi which should net them about £250,000 - tax. They are living on a knife edge, oops forgot they have a £24m debt to service as well. I would say that it is not looking too healthy down Tinhutcastle way ......

They will get nowhere near £250000 from the semi. They end up with around one third of gate receipts and will be very lucky to get £100k.
This was a tax bill Hearts were very confident of not having to pay and although they will be happy with the three year deal it is still a big hole in their fragile finances. The equivalent of 5 players on £2k per week.

[CropleyWasGod]

Given they don't have to start paying it until May, could it be they do not ever expect or intend to pay it.

Nah, for me it ties in with my theory that they have been playing "French cricket" for months.... ie buying time in the hope that they can either find a mug (sorry, buyer) or else milk as much cash as they can until they really do have to circle the wagons.

[Pete]

Fire-sale in January or letting lots of players go at the end of the season, while relying on youth to plug the gaps. If their kids are anything like Patterson or McHattie they will toil and will be a poor side. In fact, they are already a poor side.

I'll take that.

[clerriehibs]

I'm a bit disappointed nothing has been made public about the alleged damage to the south stand. Let the rest of Scotland see them for what they are, and remove any sympathy for them that's out there.

[Seveno]

Paying £500,000 in may will not be a problem for them. They'll be able to pay it out of their Scottish Cup run. Oh, wait a minute ................................:fenlon

[CropleyWasGod]

I'm a bit disappointed nothing has been made public about the alleged damage to the south stand. Let the rest of Scotland see them for what they are, and remove any sympathy for them that's out there.

It's not the Hibs way, rightly or wrongly.

However, if we did that, the next time some of our own bampots did the same at Tynie, then Hearts would be entitled to do the same.

[lapsedhibee]

Would you prefer that the taxpayer got nothing, and that staff went on the dole? Because that would have been the case had HMRC not adopted the approach they have.


This is a strange argument. Should you not send a violent criminal to jail because (a) it costs taxpayers money and (2) it would be less work for medical staff at A&E?

And wotaboot the "pour encourager les autres" principle?

As has been pointed out above, the approach Hector appears to have taken in this case is to act as a bank. HOMFC have spent money they should have given to Hector, and are being allowed to pay it back at a very leisurely pace with interest but NO PENALTIES. Sucks.

[PatHead]

They will get nowhere near £250000 from the semi. They end up with around one third of gate receipts and will be very lucky to get £100k.
This was a tax bill Hearts were very confident of not having to pay and although they will be happy with the three year deal it is still a big hole in their fragile finances. The equivalent of 5 players on £2k per week.

Do they not combine both semi gates and final gate. Then split the profit.

[Crazyhorse]

There has been no suggestion, other than on here, that the tax case has been about dual contracts.


I thought the yams had disputed whether they should pay this tax bill. So if this is just unpaid tax then it must go back a signficant period of time. Certainly it meant they could pay players more than their rivals and gain an advantage for that period of time.

[Seveno]

I'm a bit disappointed nothing has been made public about the alleged damage to the south stand. Let the rest of Scotland see them for what they are, and remove any sympathy for them that's out there.

How much damage was there ?

[clerriehibs]

How much damage was there ?

It's on one of the other threads so best discussed there. I was thinking for this thread more along the lines of they've got the begging bowls out to help them survive but trash ER, which they'll have to pay for ... these costs have to be made public! Far more interesting than Gary O's latest escapade!

[CropleyWasGod]

I thought the yams had disputed whether they should pay this tax bill. So if this is just unpaid tax then it must go back a signficant period of time. Certainly it meant they could pay players more than their rivals and gain an advantage for that period of time.

They disputed it, for sure, and it does go back a number of years (as evidenced in the accounts). However, like I say, nobody outside of those involved in the case KNOWS what it is about; all we can do is speculate.

And, of course, for the next few years they have to pay their players less than their rivals. :greengrin


This is a strange argument. Should you not send a violent criminal to jail because (a) it costs taxpayers money and (2) it would be less work for medical staff at A&E?

And wotaboot the "pour encourager les autres" principle?

As has been pointed out above, the approach Hector appears to have taken in this case is to act as a bank. HOMFC have spent money they should have given to Hector, and are being allowed to pay it back at a very leisurely pace with interest but NO PENALTIES. Sucks.

HMRC have a dual responsibility, and are often torn between the two. On one hand they have to maximise the income to the Treasury, and on the other they have to be seen to uphold the law.

The two don't always sit well together. However, in recent years, I have definitely seen a trend towards the first... and that's understandable in the current climate. Whether it's "right", of course, is an argument that could go on for a long time.

One further point, though. We only have Hearts' word for it that there were no penalties. Given the nature of that website, I wouldn't take that as gospel. Of course, HMRC won't tell us, but for all we know it could be the case that the tax bill is £1m and the penalties 500k.

[Hibercelona]

How much damage was there ?

Hopefully 8526 ticket sales worth of damage. Or preferably more.


They disputed it, for sure, and it does go back a number of years (as evidenced in the accounts). However, like I say, nobody outside of those involved in the case KNOWS what it is about; all we can do is speculate.

And, of course, for the next few years they have to pay their players less than their rivals. :greengrin

Assuming they actually survive, I reckon it will be for far longer than a few years.

[lapsedhibee]

One further point, though. We only have Hearts' word for it that there were no penalties. Given the nature of that website, I wouldn't take that as gospel. Of course, HMRC won't tell us, but for all we know it could be the case that the tax bill is £1m and the penalties 500k.

True. The sooner some Hectorworker leaks the facts the better. :agree: :wink:

[ScottB]

This is probably better than liquidation in a way, on several levels:

1. HMRC will get some money, better for the country than it all heading for a submarine in the Baltic Sea. Sure they are celebrating, but from now on surely a missed payment for any of their tax liabilities will have them headed for the blender?

2. They are going to be weak. They think they are weak just now, wait till their core of pricey players are gone.

3. They are still idiots, it wouldn't surprise me at all if they shift most of their pricey players then bring Skackel back on deadline day. I for one would love this; we could hammer a team comprised of him and a bunch of kids.

4. Paying that first instalment in May will take a huge chunk out of next seasons ST money, so they'll be an even worse mess next season than they are currently.

5. Excluding this amount, Romanov's lackey reckoned the fans needed to cough up 2 million to survive the season, they now need 500k more (though I think they use next seasons ST money, expect them to go on sale stupidly early), so the fans haven't even raised a third of the total they need to survive.

[lapsedhibee]

1. HMRC will get some money, better for the country than it all heading for a submarine in the Baltic Sea. Sure they are celebrating, but from now on surely a missed payment for any of their tax liabilities will have them headed for the blender?

But why would it? Now that Hector has indicated that he is willing to bend to the argument that the prospect of some money is always better than none, there can shirley never be a point when it is better to liquidise than to allow to continue intermittently defaulting. It's not as if Hector is going to reach a point when he simply won't stand for HOMFC taking the pish, because that's what they've already been doing for long enough.

[inglisavhibs]

Do they not combine both semi gates and final gate. Then split the profit.

They may well split the semi gates but the final stands alone. Let's hope they don't get there.

[CropleyWasGod]

But why would it? Now that Hector has indicated that he is willing to bend to the argument that the prospect of some money is always better than none, there can shirley never be a point when it is better to liquidise than to allow to continue intermittently defaulting. It's not as if Hector is going to reach a point when he simply won't stand for HOMFC taking the pish, because that's what they've already been doing for long enough.

I suspect that there will be another winding-up application soon.

October's PAYE is, apparently, late. November's is due soon, albeit at reduced amounts. December's, if it includes the deferred wages being paid up, will be due in January and it will be a big one. There will be a VAT bill due in early January too.

[lapsedhibee]

I suspect that there will be another winding-up application soon.


Does the fact that HOMFC know that Hector doesn't actually want them wound up not reduce the force of these applications somewhat? To something like a very tedious dance? :dunno:

[Billy Whizz]

I would have thought they would be doing deals to move players on from 1st January, as they can't afford to pay them on January, and will need to move them at the start, rather than the end of the window

[Mr White]

So would it be more or less fair to say that both deep throat and Disney swallow were correct with their most recent leaks?

[KeithTheHibby]

I cannot stand these tossers as much as the next person and ask me a few months ago would have said let them die as soon as possible....however after witnessing their off the field problems coupled with the issues they shall face over the next few years has forced me to change my mind.

Watching the game on Sunday we were utter gash in every sense. We can and have played better, our league form and position tells you this. We still beat them though and kept a clean sheet.
They on the other hand played as well as they could given the limited squad they have. No strikers, young lads all over the park and a team generally held together and built on their defence. Come January i would expect to see any player of worth to be sold and replaced by an inferior player or youngster thus weakening the team.
A team incidentally managed by a completely and utterly inept moron who is out of his depth. The best of it though? They cannot afford to sack him. Vlad has emptied managers for far less.
So what do we have left? Terrible manager, fire sale impending and a precarious league position with no signs of improvement.

Watching the next 6 months or 6 years unfold will be far more interesting and funny than watching them disappear entirely.

[StevieC]

4. Paying that first instalment in May will take a huge chunk out of next seasons ST money

Next seasons ST money (March/April?) will be long gone by the time May comes around, they'll need it all just to complete this season.

[PatHead]

Used to work in a bank years ago. The amount of businesses I saw that were struggling was incredible. Many of them were good guys that just hadn't adapted to change, many that had just grown too quickley and weren't able to keep it going and some had been bumped by someone who had done the dirty on them. Each month they would be robbing Peter to pay Paul as the business "would be back to normal" soon. For many businesses they held on far too long and just hurt themselves and their families all the more.

Eventually they couldn't carry on spinning all the plates and it would come crashing down.

Suspect Hearts are in this position as they add another wobbly plate to the show..............................tick,tock

(Personally I want it to happen sooner rather than later though.)

[greenginger]

Next seasons ST money (March/April?) will be long gone by the time May comes around, they'll need it all just to complete this season.


3 year season ticket deals anyone ? 5 year, any advances , lifetime including your children. Opportunities unlimited to con the gullable.

[CropleyWasGod]

Does the fact that HOMFC know that Hector doesn't actually want them wound up not reduce the force of these applications somewhat? To something like a very tedious dance? :dunno:

Not at all. It's a common credit-control tool that Government departments and businesses use.

Thus far, they have always worked in that Hearts have paid up.

[greenginger]

I suspect that there will be another winding-up application soon.

October's PAYE is, apparently, late. November's is due soon, albeit at reduced amounts. December's, if it includes the deferred wages being paid up, will be due in January. There will be a VAT bill due in early January too.

And I would imagine " giving fatigue " will be setting in very shortly down at the PBS !

[The Harp]

Are they now going to reimburse the kids who tore up their Christmas lists to keep them afloat?
This club really is below contempt. Don't imagine for one minute we've heard the last of their begging-bowl antics.

[calumhibee1]

So they can't afford the players they already have yet there going to have another 10k a week to pay out for the next 3 years? If they're serious about cutting back then this news should surely mean losing an extra 4 or 5 on top of what was originally planned. Aye jambos, that's great news.

[Sergey]

Time to act

04.12.2012

The sterling efforts of the Hearts supporters have seen the club reduce its projected deficit of £2million between now and the end of the season by almost 50 per cent, director Sergejus Fedotovas revealed today.

The Gorgie faithful's response to the 2012 Share Issue has helped Heart of Midlothian stave off a recent threat of liquidation. Fans have until Wednesday, December 19 to continue to purchase shares and Sergejus revealed that, despite the amount of work already done, the volume of business over the next two weeks remains critical to the club's financial stability as it heads into 2013.
Speaking to Hearts News, he said: "Words cannot express how grateful we are to those people who have already contributed to the share scheme. Their sacrifices in difficult times have been appreciated by everyone.
"But with just two weeks now remaining to buy shares, time is running out. The Share Issue is designed to create stability and it is important to achieve the targets we have set.
"We would urge those supporters, and particularly those in the corporate sector, to act now if they have not done so already. Much work lies ahead and the window of opportunity for supporters to play their part is closing quickly.
"Unless these targets are hit, going forward we forecast that there will be further battles ahead when it comes to timely payment of bills.
"In this scenario, we will be forced again to look at what we can do with our cost base as all revenue streams are sweating at the moment and there is no reasonable expectation that we can bring significantly more revenue to the club at this moment."
The club was pleased with the resolution to the tax tribunal, which was announced on the club website earlier today.
And Sergejus expressed his hope that this latest settlement with HMRC will encourage previously hesitant fans to participate in the Share Issue.
He said: "The resolution of this dispute gives us a positive nod to expect that those supporters who were wary of the immediate effect on the club of the tax case can now step forward in confidence.
"We are keeping our promise to keep this club alive and we have the results - the petition was agreed and paid, the tax case is resolved.
"It is good to know that we are not alone in our ambitions but we need more involvement as we are in far from good shape and the recent Scottish Cup result is the best evidence of this.
"Now, more than ever before, is the time for our fans everywhere to stand up and be counted."

There's plenty for them to be worried about after reading that!

[Caversham Green]

There's plenty for them to be worried about after reading that!

Yep. Five weeks in, two to go and they're less than halfway there. And it was always going to be front-heavy.

[MB62]

There's plenty for them to be worried about after reading that!

That statement sounds like a man who just narrowly dodged a bullit but has just spotted the guillotine coming dropping down inches from his head, and there's no nail in the wood to stop it. :greengrin

[Hibrandenburg]

**** it! This thread is getting copied, pasted and printed. Once the inevitable happens, it will give me a warm glow inside for years to come just browsing through this.

[lyonhibs]

There's plenty for them to be worried about after reading that!

How does that fellow keep a straight face when he puts in the token reference in every statement regarding how the Hearts fans need to continue "to be counted", which basically means "continue to brass up ya plums".

Johnny Jambo in the street has - granted very, very late in the day - brassed up plenty. What a bunch of comedy shysters the Hearts board are, but they've got the leadership they deserve I guess.

[poolman]

http://i46.tinypic.com/ir5d93.jpg

[YehButNoBut]

http://www.cartoonstock.com/lowres/hsc1968l.jpg

[brog]

This is a strange argument. Should you not send a violent criminal to jail because (a) it costs taxpayers money and (2) it would be less work for medical staff at A&E?

And wotaboot the "pour encourager les autres" principle?

As has been pointed out above, the approach Hector appears to have taken in this case is to act as a bank. HOMFC have spent money they should have given to Hector, and are being allowed to pay it back at a very leisurely pace with interest but NO PENALTIES. Sucks.

Sucks even more for me! After paying tax up front through PAYE for 44 years & correctly completing a tax return every year, I retired 2 years ago. For the last few months I've been discussing my final 2010/11 return with HMRC. To avoid full detail & to cut a long story short HMRC have hit me with a 15% penalty for what they term ( but I dispute ) careless behaviour on my part. Yams, evade, hide & don't pay tax for years & have no penalty!! I fully understand the rationale behind HMRC's behaviour but it doesn't make it any more palatable. If it wasn't a totally nauseating thought I'd change my name to Johnny Jambo & apply for the penalty to be waived!!

[CropleyWasGod]

[/B]Sucks even more for me! After paying tax up front through PAYE for 44 years & correctly completing a tax return every year, I retired 2 years ago. For the last few months I've been discussing my final 2010/11 return with HMRC. To avoid full detail & to cut a long story short HMRC have hit me with a 15% penalty for what they term ( but I dispute ) careless behaviour on my part. Yams, evade, hide & don't pay tax for years & have no penalty!! I fully understand the rationale behind HMRC's behaviour but it doesn't make it any more palatable. If it wasn't a totally nauseating thought I'd change my name to Johnny Jambo & apply for the penalty to be waived!!

I am not sure about the claim that there were no penalties. I'd prefer to hear that from another source before I'd believe it.

[Golden Bear]

The whole affair smacks of wheeling and dealing behind the scenes and influences being brought to bear but we'll never know for certain.

[brog]

I am not sure about the claim that there were no penalties. I'd prefer to hear that from another source before I'd believe it.

Well Yams stated originally that their possible liability was £1.7 million so if they're only paying £1.5mm in total then penalties seem unlikely. Of course Yams could have lied separately twice but it surely wouldn't be sensible for them to publicly announce no penalties if HMRC could refute that statement, would it?

[greenginger]

I am not sure about the claim that there were no penalties. I'd prefer to hear that from another source before I'd believe it.


According to the Hearts statement the £ 1.5 million is made up from £ 1.2 m. tax and nic. and £300,000 interest. It adds there are no penalties.

Something lost in translation may'be, your penalties are in the post. :greengrin

[PatHead]

What the statement really means

The sterling efforts of the Hearts supporters have seen the club reduce its projected deficit of £2million between now and the end of the season by almost 50 per cent, director Sergejus Fedotovas revealed today. Thanks so far but we are nowhere near it.

The Gorgie faithful's response to the 2012 Share Issue has helped Heart of Midlothian stave off a recent threat of liquidation. Yes it was that close. Fans have until Wednesday, December 19 to continue to purchase shares and Sergejus revealed that, despite the amount of work already done, the volume of business over the next two weeks remains critical to the club's financial stability as it heads into 2013. You supporters have a hell of a long way to go before we can escape by blaming you for not backing the club.
Speaking to Hearts News, he said: "Words cannot express how grateful we are to those people who have already contributed to the share scheme. Their sacrifices in difficult times have been appreciated by everyone. You don’t really need children’s Christmas presents.
"But with just two weeks now remaining to buy shares, time is running out. The Share Issue is designed to create stability and it is important to achieve the targets we have set. We are actually still desperate as Vlad doesn’t have any more money.
"We would urge those supporters, and particularly those in the corporate sector, to act now if they have not done so already. Much work lies ahead and the window of opportunity for supporters to play their part is closing quickly. Are there any businesses out there as the supporters are pretty much milked dry?
"Unless these targets are hit, going forward we forecast that there will be further battles ahead when it comes to timely payment of bills. No wages or bills paid again this month
"In this scenario, we will be forced again to look at what we can do with our cost base as all revenue streams are sweating at the moment and there is no reasonable expectation that we can bring significantly more revenue to the club at this moment." Redundancies are on the way and we will have to close the main stand as we can’t maintain it, cease our relationship with Heriot Watt and train in public parks.
The club was pleased with the resolution to the tax tribunal, which was announced on the club website earlier today.It could have been worse, they could have shut us down now.
And Sergejus expressed his hope that this latest settlement with HMRC will encourage previously hesitant fans to participate in the Share Issue.
He said: "The resolution of this dispute gives us a positive nod to expect that those supporters who were wary of the immediate effect on the club of the tax case can now step forward in confidence.
"We are keeping our promise to keep this club alive and we have the results - the petition was agreed and paid, the tax case is resolved. We don’t need to give them any money until May so if we can rip you off on a regular basis in the meantime everything is okay.
"It is good to know that we are not alone in our ambitions but we need more involvement as we are in far from good shape and the recent Scottish Cup result is the best evidence of this. We know we are *****.
"Now, more than ever before, is the time for our fans everywhere to stand up and be counted."

[CropleyWasGod]

Well Yams stated originally that their possible liability was £1.7 million so if they're only paying £1.5mm in total then penalties seem unlikely. Of course Yams could have lied separately twice but it surely wouldn't be sensible for them to publicly announce no penalties if HMRC could refute that statement, would it?

HMRC are unlikely to refute it, as it is their policy (indeed, their statutory duty) not to comment on taxpayer affairs.

Why I say it is that it's not that common for investigation settlements to be reached without any penalties, especially if they have been going for some years, as theirs has.

It is common, though, for assessments to be modified on the basis of discussions and negotiation before the FTTT starts ("the steps of the Court" route). It wouldn't surprise me if that is what has happened... the tax has been reduced, hence the interest, and a mutually agreeable penalty arrived at..... to avoid the risk, for both parties, of losing the case in full.

HMFC may have claimed that there were no penalties, to try and gain some kind of "victory" in front of their fans, knowing that HMRC probably won't refute that claim.

At the end of the day, it's a pedantic point. They have to pay £1.5m, end of story; the make-up is unimportant. However, my professional curiosity is aroused..... :greengrin


According to the Hearts statement the £ 1.5 million is made up from £ 1.2 m. tax and nic. and £300,000 interest. It adds there are no penalties.

Something lost in translation may'be, your penalties are in the post. :greengrin

Those numbers make sense, but they are easily massaged. (disclaimer.... not that I am suggesting that HMFC would ever do anything so Pravda-esque)

I would have believed it more if they had said £800k for tax (ie approximately half of the assessment), £200k interest and £500k penalties.

[Seveno]

Are they going to bring much in during the January sales ? They have few players worth much, there tends to be little transfer activity in January and other clubs will know that Hearts are desperate to sell.

Add to the mix that some of the players might have to accept a wage cut if they move, then are they likely to accept a move ?

[greenginger]

Just got me thinking, the outstanding Tax Bill means definitely no European Football for the Yams for the next 3 years. :thumbsup:

Mind you, football of any kind 3 years on might be seen as a bonus for the

[ScottB]

Are they going to bring much in during the January sales ? They have few players worth much, there tends to be little transfer activity in January and other clubs will know that Hearts are desperate to sell.

Add to the mix that some of the players might have to accept a wage cut if they move, then are they likely to accept a move ?

I can't imagine they'll sell anybody.

Wouldnt be surprised if players are allowed to go for free as part of the wage deferral deal, their big earners are all nearly out of contract, coupled with everyone knowing the state they are in and the chances of anyone wanting to buy a Webster or a Barr suggests that players will simple be released.

Maybe a token bid for somebody like McGowan, but assuming their financial reality causes some sane actions over by, all their big earners should go next month.


No doubt they'll sign Skackel on deadline day all the same mind you!

[Spike Mandela]

Just got me thinking, the outstanding Tax Bill means definitely no European Football for the Yams for the next 3 years. :thumbsup:



Why:confused:

[Devilstorment]

That statement sounds like a man who just narrowly dodged a bullit but has just spotted the guillotine coming dropping down inches from his head, and there's no nail in the wood to stop it. :greengrin


Thats some metaphor!! and you dont get statements like that everyday!

[greenginger]

Why:confused:

No European license if a club has outstanding tax debts. Part of football fair play regulations, I think.

[Sergey]

An excellent post that I've unashamedly copied from over the road.


A Yam Smells The Coffee

It is all very well Serge praising us for what has been a remarkable response, but more than platitudes are required. Prior to the winding up order bombshell, we were previously led to believe that the reason for David Templeton,s departure was an attitude problem. Ryan McGowan would have followed had he not elected to put his international career but they erroneously suggested they were happy the deal fell through. I looked through the share offer document at the Ross County game, and it clearly stated the reasons for, and the proceeds of the offer were youth development and day to day working capital as and when required.There is no way monies raised will be allocated to youth development and effectively we have, and will continue to bail out the business.We all know there is a big hole in the balance sheet but for sometime now the custodians have been less than forthcoming.Now more than ever we deserve nothing less than full transparency. Financial indiscipline and bad management normally spell the end for most organisations and it is about time the owners take cognisance of the peculiar circumstances that see minority shareholders/ ordinary punters effectively discharging the club liabilities.It is now beyond even a tacit acknowledgement of insolvency and the proposed share issue ridiculously over values the club.Are or will future begging bowl receipts be utilised for debt servicing purposes which fall into the working capital requirement category.


It is time to come clean in relation to the valuation price which in their current plight can hardly be more than 5 - 6 million pounds. Forget the nonsense of accrued debt which has no bearing on current valuation. I have my own small business and if I decided to chuck generated income out the window I could hardly use that as a mitigating factor in its subsequent failure, and then somehow justify seeking quasi compensation from my customer base. The brand intangible value argument from Serge is becoming monotonous as they are now unable to manage brand development and with Scottish Football in disarray the perception value is at an all time low.

[At The Edge]

An excellent post that I've unashamedly copied from over the road.

Has he been called a Hobo yet and plenty of 5-1 quotes been thrown about?

:greengrin

[Hibernia Na Eir]

more than anything, they are completely and utterly skint now. not a penny to their name.

let's see how they cope now :)

[#FromTheCapital]

No European license if a club has outstanding tax debts. Part of football fair play regulations, I think.

About as effective as their transfer ban until the window opens then because they won't be getting anywhere near Europe anytime soon :-D

[Geo_1875]

I notice he admits they're in deep **** but still manages to get a dig in that the rest of Scottish Football is in disarray.

Naw we're no ya fanny.

[CallumLaidlaw]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20602141

[Kato]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20602141

jettison personnel

I want to see Vlad use the torpedo tubes.

[CropleyWasGod]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20602141

Spot the inconsistency in this statement:-

The club's share issue will hand over 10% of owner Vladimir Romanov's controlling interest, with the scheme due to run until 19 December.

"We are still in progress with our share issue and that is designed to create stability," added Fedotovas in a bid to drum up further support.

"It is very important for us to achieve the target of selling the shares to our supporters.


"Unless that is achieved, again we will be in the position where it is difficult to meet certain payments from time to time." ."

[greenflyer]

"Eventually they couldn't carry on spinning all the plates and it would come crashing down.

Suspect Hearts are in this position as they add another wobbly plate to the show..............................tick,tock"



It's the Wonga way.:rolleyes:

[PapillonVert]

Just coming back to the deal they've made with HMRC, I wonder if HMRC would make the deal conditional upon HFC agreeing to meet its on-going PAYE, NI, VAT payments on time in future otherwise HMRC could move for immediate payment of the outstanding sums?

Does anyone have any inside info. on whether the Big Team has been obliged to agree any conditions attached to the deal?
Or does anyone with experience of dealing with HMRC know if this is a standard approach to agreeing these deals?

Otherwise, you could imagine them continuing to flout their obligations by failing to pay their tax bill when it falls due and force HMRC to file yet another Winding-up Petition to try and get the money. Easier IMO to make the deal conditional on meeting their future obligations rather than continue with the same merry-go-round of non-payment, petitions and then payments made just before the case comes up to Court.

[GloryGlory]

Just coming back to the deal they've made with HMRC, I wonder if HMRC would make the deal conditional upon HFC agreeing to meet its on-going PAYE, NI, VAT payments on time in future otherwise HMRC could move for immediate payment of the outstanding sums?

Does anyone have any inside info. on whether the Big Team has been obliged to agree any conditions attached to the deal?
Or does anyone with experience of dealing with HMRC know if this is a standard approach to agreeing these deals?

Otherwise, you could imagine them continuing to flout their obligations by failing to pay their tax bill when it falls due and force HMRC to file yet another Winding-up Petition to try and get the money. Easier IMO to make the deal conditional on meeting their future obligations rather than continue with the same merry-go-round of non-payment, petitions and then payments made just before the case comes up to Court.

I would imagine that a failure to meet agreed payments will attract a penalty notice from HMRC, which can be 100% of the tax due. HMRC can also increase the rate of interest charged on overdue tax, IIRC. So, a potential double whammy.

[greenginger]

The financial shambles at the PBS must down to living in a Walter Mitty World.

In the last close season did nobody do a financial forecast of income and expenditure and realise the money would run out before the season was half way through. Instead of releasing or moving on every player possible they actually added 4 to their total in August.

That they are alive today is down to some large slices of luck rather than any thought out plan.

If Rangers had got their CVA their would have been no £ 1 million from the Huns just 5 pence in the pound and the SFA would have no leverage to make Rangers make up the difference to football creditors. The money for the Templeton transfer which probably saved them on Monday came from a deal struck minutes before the close of the transfer window and could just as easy have been missed.

The Yams have definitely dodged a few bullets but their luck must run out very soon as they still don,t have any notion of a financial plan.

[JeMeSouviens]

The financial shambles at the PBS must down to living in a Walter Mitty World.

In the last close season did nobody do a financial forecast of income and expenditure and realise the money would run out before the season was half way through. Instead of releasing or moving on every player possible they actually added 4 to their total in August.

That they are alive today is down to some large slices of luck rather than any thought out plan.

If Rangers had got their CVA their would have been no £ 1 million from the Huns just 5 pence in the pound and the SFA would have no leverage to make Rangers make up the difference to football creditors. The money for the Templeton transfer which probably saved them on Monday came from a deal struck minutes before the close of the transfer window and could just as easy have been missed.

The Yams have definitely dodged a few bullets but their luck must run out very soon as they still don,t have any notion of a financial plan.

:agree:

Drawing Liverpool in Europe and us in the cup is another 2 windfalls they can't have budgeted for. You would imagine the following is just bluster for the brain dead but even Yams must be starting to think Fedotovas is taking the piss:


"Results this season show that the team needs attention and we need to strengthen that aspect of our business.

"But if we are short, if we don't reach the magic number, it will be enormously difficult to find additional revenue to bring new players to the club and we will need to address our cost base."

[mjhibby]

They really are the most deluded bunch of muppets that ever supported a football club.They seem to believe anything they are told on their website even if two days later that has seen to be utter balderdash.There has never been a figure put on actual shares bought so the hertz fans have no idea how much they have raised.The so called full house against celtic was 2,000 short of that and actually was the same attendance as last year so none of the mythical £80.000 was made.They will now face dons and will probably have 2,000 more fans than last season so again way short of what they have said.They are actually saying on sickbag that the £500,000 they are having to pay the taxman over the next 3 seasons is a good result even though their board said they would robustly defend their position.The money they are due for wallace will cover the first one but the next two seasons sees them facing another £500,000 bill and with a euro run highly unlikely they are going to struggle big time.
The biggest flaw in fedotovas waffling is the fact they are most likely to miss out on the top six and with a drop of income from the spl of maybe half a million plus lower gates after the split and the loss of reulting tv money could mean that all the money the hertz fans have put in could be swallowed up by the loss from them not making the top six. Im sure they will struggle on but unless a sugar daddy comes along or they go into administration the future looks bleak for them.What a shambles and a joke of a club they really are.

[PatHead]

A good Ramsdens Cup run would help them next year.

[JimBHibees]

Just coming back to the deal they've made with HMRC, I wonder if HMRC would make the deal conditional upon HFC agreeing to meet its on-going PAYE, NI, VAT payments on time in future otherwise HMRC could move for immediate payment of the outstanding sums?

Does anyone have any inside info. on whether the Big Team has been obliged to agree any conditions attached to the deal?
Or does anyone with experience of dealing with HMRC know if this is a standard approach to agreeing these deals?

Otherwise, you could imagine them continuing to flout their obligations by failing to pay their tax bill when it falls due and force HMRC to file yet another Winding-up Petition to try and get the money. Easier IMO to make the deal conditional on meeting their future obligations rather than continue with the same merry-go-round of non-payment, petitions and then payments made just before the case comes up to Court.

I would be amazed if that wasnt the case.

[YehButNoBut]

Serge is rattling the collection tin again

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/top-football-stories/hearts-admit-staff-face-the-axe-if-2m-shortfall-isn-t-met-1-2675686

Hearts admit staff face the axe if £2m shortfall isn’t met

HEARTS director Sergejus 
Fedotovas today warned that the club may have to cut staff in order to keep the club in business.

Fedotovas admitted that there is a real possibility of job losses in January if the Tynecastle side cannot cover the predicted shortfall of £2 million for the season. The club announced yesterday that an agreement has been reached with Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs over their outstanding £1.75m tax case that will allow Hearts to pay a reduced amount of £1.5m – £1.2m in tax and National Insurance, plus £300,000 in interest – back over three years.

The two parties reached a compromise agreement over unpaid tax relating to players loaned from the Lithuanian club FBK 
Kaunas between 2005 and 2010.

The instalments will be monthly, starting in May of next year. In addition to that matter 
being resolved, Hearts earlier in the week also settled a previously outstanding £450,000 VAT and PAYE bill and Fedotovas has insisted that there are now no more tax-related issues to deal with.

Hearts are believed to have raised almost £1m so far through their share issue and other avenues and Fedotovas is hopeful that they will reach the desired £2m mark.

He stressed, however, that the club still needs supporters to back the club financially if they are to avoid losing a number of staff – both on and off the pitch – come the turn of the year.

The share issue scheme runs only until December 19, and, asked about the threat of job losses if they fall short, he said: “This is a possibility. If that’s what’s required to keep the club in business, we will be forced to do that. We are somewhere halfway through addressing the funding gap.”
Hearts are ninth in the Scottish Premier League and were knocked out of the William Hill Scottish Cup on Sunday by Hibs. However, they are in the semi-finals of the Scottish Communities League Cup.

“The share issue is designed to create stability and it is important to achieve the targets we have set,” Fedotovas added on the club’s official website.

“Unless these targets are hit, we forecast there will be further battles ahead when it comes to timely payment of bills.

“There is no reasonable expectation that we can bring significantly more revenue to the club at this moment.”

[PapillonVert]

I would be amazed if that wasnt the case.

So would I, Jim, but it never ceases to amaze me the number of times govt. departments FAIL to protect the taxpayer and public interest and end up entering into deals and contracts which even a totally incompetent contracts manager in the private sector wouldn't dream of signing up for!

NHS computer system? Defence? PFI? West coast railway line?


Serge is rattling the collection tin again

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/top-football-stories/hearts-admit-staff-face-the-axe-if-2m-shortfall-isn-t-met-1-2675686

“Unless these targets are hit, we forecast there will be further battles ahead when it comes to timely payment of bills.

“There is no reasonable expectation that we can bring significantly more revenue to the club at this moment.”

Getting the excuses in now for when the next unpaid debt case is called in Court! It'll be all the fault of the fans.

How can anyone enter into a contract with this lot with any degree of confidence?

[Keith_M]

.............. I wonder if HMRC would make the deal conditional upon HFC agreeing to meet its on-going PAYE, NI, VAT payments on time in future otherwise HMRC could move for immediate payment of the outstanding sums?..................


Why should Hibs have to pay their debts?


:confused:


























:wink:

[lapsedhibee]

So would I, Jim, but it never ceases to amaze me the number of times govt. departments FAIL to protect the taxpayer and public interest and end up entering into deals and contracts which even a totally incompetent contracts manager in the private sector wouldn't dream of signing up for!

NHS computer system? Defence? PFI? West coast railway line?

Hector has just made it clear, by entering into a three-year instalment plan with the yams, that he doesn't want HOMFC to cease to be. Why then would he insist on introducing conditions which if not met would bring about the immediate demise of HOMFC?

[PapillonVert]

Hector has just made it clear, by entering into a three-year instalment plan with the yams, that he doesn't want HOMFC to cease to be. Why then would he insist on introducing conditions which if not met would bring about the immediate demise of HOMFC?

Because, like most creditors who enter into agreements with debtors, there's only so much you can take or be expected to take before you reach the conclusion that you're flogging the metaphorical dead horse and it's better to cut your losses and put the said moribund creature out of its misery and pack it off to the knacker's yard.

In other words, nothing will ultimately be achieved by HMRC agreeing to keep HFC going if HFC only continues to run up debts by not paying the taxes it is due.

[CropleyWasGod]

Because, like most creditors who enter into agreements with debtors, there's only so much you can take or be expected to take before you reach the conclusion that you're flogging the metaphorical dead horse and it's better to cut your losses and put the said moribund creature out of its misery and pack it off to the knacker's yard.

In other words, nothing will ultimately be achieved by HMRC agreeing to keep HFC going if HFC only continues to run up debts by not paying the taxes it is due.

However, HMRC's recent tactics have resulted in HMFC paying their PAYE and VAT. In that respect, they have been a success.

[lapsedhibee]

Because, like most creditors who enter into agreements with debtors, there's only so much you can take or be expected to take before you reach the conclusion that you're flogging the metaphorical dead horse and it's better to cut your losses and put the said moribund creature out of its misery and pack it off to the knacker's yard.

In other words, nothing will ultimately be achieved by HMRC agreeing to keep HFC going if HFC only continues to run up debts by not paying the taxes it is due.

Yes but HOMFC do have money coming in, and the prospect of £500k for Wallace - even if it's not enough to pay taxes on time, or in full, the longer HOMFC lasts the more tax is likely to be collected. So it wouldn't make sense - on the basis that half a loaf is better than no tax - for HMRC to pull the plug anytime soon just because HOMFC didn't pay a particular PAYE or NIC or VAT bill on time.

[PapillonVert]

However, HMRC's recent tactics have resulted in HMFC paying their PAYE and VAT. In that respect, they have been a success.

Fine, let's hope they continue to do so.

[Mikey]

“The share issue is designed to create stability and it is important to achieve the targets we have set,” Fedotovas added on the club’s official website.

“Unless these targets are hit, we forecast there will be further battles ahead when it comes to timely payment of bills.



That's not even remotely close to what was said about the share issue when it was launched a few weeks ago. Where's the financial backing for youth development now ya plum?

We might as well ask the question as Hearts fans and the press won't :rolleyes:

[EH6 Hibby]

Yes but HOMFC do have money coming in, and the prospect of £500k for Wallace - even if it's not enough to pay taxes on time, or in full, the longer HOMFC lasts the more tax is likely to be collected. So it wouldn't make sense - on the basis that half a loaf is better than no tax - for HMRC to pull the plug anytime soon just because HOMFC didn't pay a particular PAYE or NIC or VAT bill on time.

Or the more money they will continue to take in without paying the Vat or the PAYE and NIC on wages paid out.

[CropleyWasGod]

Fine, let's hope they continue to do so.

It's not that common for HMRC to take legal action for debts that are as "recent" as Hearts'. In that light, they really are keeping them on a tight leash, and Hearts will know that. If they slip behind again, they know what will happen.

Bear in mind, too, that Hearts will also be liable for interest and penalties on the late amounts.


That's not even remotely close to what was said about the share issue when it was launched a few weeks ago. Where's the financial backing for youth development now ya plum?

We might as well ask the question as Hearts fans and the press won't :rolleyes:

The BBC are still telling us it's Vlad's shares they're buying. :rolleyes:

[Jim44]

The BBC are still telling us it's Vlad's shares they're buying. :rolleyes:

But then the BBC is as 'petty and ill-informed' as it's Saturday afternoon discussion programme. -:)

[CropleyWasGod]

But then the BBC is as 'petty and ill-informed' as it's Saturday afternoon discussion programme. -:)

The BBC tell me Graham Norton is funny. :rolleyes:

[jdships]

We must not forget that like any business a football club has day to day/week to week/month to month running costs to meet and very much depends on 'cash flow' to meet those commitments .
Overdrafts/debts /mortgages have to serviced .
If you look at the fixture list and with no Scottish Cup revenue the next big payday is the semi final at ER
The H's are almost in the situation of the guy who has two credit cards and uses one to pay off the other and is therefore building up interest debt .
I spoke with shopkeeper this morning who has to find £430 a month rent to be able to put the key in the door which they can just manage.
However they are being pursued for being TWO MONTHS adrift in Tax and NHC .
Shows the difference in HMRC dealings with a small business which is an easy touch and a large company .!!

I suppose as far as the Hearts are concerned it's also a case of ' You can't take the P..S out of S...E ' !! :greengrin:wink:

[CropleyWasGod]

I spoke with shopkeeper this morning who has to find £430 a month rent to be able to put the key in the door which they can just manage.
However they are being pursued for being TWO MONTHS adrift in Tax and NHC .
Shows the difference in HMRC dealings with a small business which is an easy touch and a large company .!!

I suppose as far as the Hearts are concerned it's also a case of ' You can't take the P..S out of S...E ' !! :greengrin:wink:

Hearts were being threatened with winding up for a debt that was only that old.

[JimBHibees]

So would I, Jim, but it never ceases to amaze me the number of times govt. departments FAIL to protect the taxpayer and public interest and end up entering into deals and contracts which even a totally incompetent contracts manager in the private sector wouldn't dream of signing up for!

NHS computer system? Defence? PFI? West coast railway line?

Completely agree you can add in Parliament and Trams also though no doubt private sector deals which fail tend to be not heard of again.

[jdships]

Hearts were being threatened with winding up for a debt that was only that old.

Must be reading the wrong newspaers and listening to the wrong TV/Radio news :greengrin


FROM STV WEBSITE 7th November 2012
Heart of Midlothian FC faces a winding up order from HM Revenue and Customs over an unpaid £450,000 tax bill.

The tax authority presented a petition to the Court of Session in Edinburgh to place the SPL club owned by Vladimir Romanov into liquidation earlier this month.

It is understood that the Tynecastle club is facing the action from HMRC over unpaid PAYE and National Insurance dating back several months,

[CropleyWasGod]

Must be reading the wrong newspaers and listening to the wrong TV/Radio news :greengrin


FROM STV WEBSITE 7th November 2012
Heart of Midlothian FC faces a winding up order from HM Revenue and Customs over an unpaid £450,000 tax bill.

The tax authority presented a petition to the Court of Session in Edinburgh to place the SPL club owned by Vladimir Romanov into liquidation earlier this month.

It is understood that the Tynecastle club is facing the action from HMRC over unpaid PAYE and National Insurance dating back several months,

TBH, STV are the last place I would get my info from on this kind of stuff. :greengrin

As far as I could make out, it was for the three months up to and including the September wages that they were due. However, part of that was based on something Fedotovas said.... and that's probably the second-last place I would get my info from!

However, it does seem to me that Hearts are now on a very short leash. I have seen it before with PAYE debts.... HMRC will be watching them very closely.

[Hibbyradge]

One of their first winding up orders was for only £12400.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2008/mar/07/newsstory.hearts

You might find the last line in that article enjoyable too! :greengrin

[Leithenhibby]

One of their first winding up orders was for only £12400.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2008/mar/07/newsstory.hearts

You might find the last line in that article enjoyable too! :greengrin

Very ... :greengrin

[Saorsa]

One of their first winding up orders was for only £12400.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2008/mar/07/newsstory.hearts

You might find the last line in that article enjoyable too! :greengrin:hilarious didnae ken they'd started, did it look worse than that before? it's a long time since I've been there.

[WindyMiller]

One of their first winding up orders was for only £12400.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2008/mar/07/newsstory.hearts

You might find the last line in that article enjoyable too! :greengrin


Ewan Murray, journalist, :rolleyes:

[Springbank]

If vlad shifts HMfc onto their fans groups then yesterday was a master stroke (for vlad) and an albatross round the necks of anyone looking to buy HMfc.

If he shifts his way out the door in April then all of the 1.5m lands on someone else's desk. Devious.

Wasting my breath here but have you heard any jambos grumbling about this? Me neither.

[PatHead]

Notice they still have 1200 tickets left in the Hearts end for Aberdeen match and expect a crowd of around 14,000-14500 according to itsallrightwearesavedafteradealwiththetaxmanback.

Pathetic attempt at saving your club. They all should be ashamed.

[NewHibby]

They still do not get it....the fact they were cheating, and living beyond there means doesn't seem to compute with these mutants.
i remember a family in our street in the 70s, they had gone to live in Canada for a few years then came back, we thought they were millionaires they had colour tv all new carpets furniture, sparkling ford cortina. Then the bills came due and six months later the sherif officer is evicting them and repossessing everything.
Debt does not go away if you have assets, and what is their only asset....the PBS

[NotoriousLor]

Ripping into us about our loan players last season and this and now they are all creaming their tweeds about some auld lith striker they are going to get on loan from Kaunus

[Oscar T Grouch]

Ripping into us about our loan players last season and this and now they are all creaming their tweeds about some auld lith striker they are going to get on loan from Kaunus

Is Kaunas no in the amateur leagues in lithuania nowadays? He must be ***** great :greengrin

[clerriehibs]

I'll be disappointed if "hearts do not exist anymore" slips below 50% ... :-\

[Speedway]

I notice Heart of 'TICK TOCK' Midlothian haven't gone out of business yet.

[silverhibee]

I take it the yams still pay there bills to Forth One.

F***ing sick of every time i get in to my car and listen to Forth One, the yams advertising that is on that station everyday about tickets for sale and gifts from the shop for Xmas.

Get it sorted Grant. :greengrin

[Winston Ingram]

They still do not get it....the fact they were cheating, and living beyond there means doesn't seem to compute with these mutants.
i remember a family in our street in the 70s, they had gone to live in Canada for a few years then came back, we thought they were millionaires they had colour tv all new carpets furniture, sparkling ford cortina. Then the bills came due and six months later the sherif officer is evicting them and repossessing everything.
Debt does not go away if you have assets, and what is their only asset....the PBS

It's not. That was transferred to UBIG a couple of years back in one of the debt for equity shams that Vlad came up with:agree:

[CropleyWasGod]

It's not. That was transferred to UBIG a couple of years back in one of the debt for equity shams that Vlad came up with:agree:

Done to death on here, and the conclusion is "unlikely". :greengrin However, if you have c and v, please tell.... our esteemed press have yet to even ask the question...:rolleyes:

[#FromTheCapital]

The 'hobos' rattling the tin again for some loose change....

http://www.heartsfc.co.uk/articles/20121207/make-it-a-million_2241384_3002299

[Bleeds green]

@BarryAnderson_8: #Hearts fans raise £750,000 via share issue. Fabulous effort. Club eager to reach £1.79m target or there will be "consequences", they say.

[Saorsa]

@BarryAnderson_8: #Hearts fans raise £750,000 via share issue. Fabulous effort. Club eager to reach £1.79m target or there will be "consequences", they say.so that less than half and only 12 days tae go for the rest :hmmm: and it's bound tae be slowing down, the piggy banks will be empty now.

[Bleeds green]

Supposedly almost at a standstill now! Yet they think its 'jobs a good un'

[CropleyWasGod]

@BarryAnderson_8: #Hearts fans raise £750,000 via share issue. Fabulous effort. Club eager to reach £1.79m target or there will be "consequences", they say.

I actually think it is a fabulous effort in such a short period.

However, I also think it is misguided and misdirected.

[BarneyK]

so that less than half and only 12 days tae go for the rest :hmmm: and it's bound tae be slowing down, the piggy banks will be empty now.

:agree: I can't imagine they will make their target, not by a long shot. Fair play to them so far, mind.

[jacomo]

I actually think it is a fabulous effort in such a short period.

However, I also think it is misguided and misdirected.

Yup, that's £750k that could have gone to Foundation of Hearts to fund a buy out and a new start for Hearts.

Instead they've emptied this into Vlad's pocket, to pay the bills that are outstanding due to his own mismanagement.

[SHODAN]

So Hearts are interested in buying a player whose wage will come directly from the pockets of Hearts supporters (when his wages are actually paid) and the SFA are fine with it? What the actual ****? Will they ever get punished for anything? :grr:

[#FromTheCapital]

So Hearts are interested in buying a player whose wage will come directly from the pockets of Hearts supporters (when his wages are actually paid) and the SFA are fine with it? What the actual ****? Will they ever get punished for anything? :grr:

They are such a soft touch, hearts are really taking the piss and nobody seems to care

[poolman]

The 'hobos' rattling the tin again for some loose change....

http://www.heartsfc.co.uk/articles/20121207/make-it-a-million_2241384_3002299


Yea, a tidy sum of cash for their "Academy" and to spend on maintaining the asbestos shack :rolleyes:

Well it's true, wee fat Robbo asked them to be up front or he would not get involved in the share issue

[bingo70]

So Hearts are interested in buying a player whose wage will come directly from the pockets of Hearts supporters (when his wages are actually paid) and the SFA are fine with it? What the actual ****? Will they ever get punished for anything? :grr:

1.It's up to the SPL not the sfa.

2.they can't sign anyone just now as they're in the middle of a transfer ban so they've done what you are going raj about them not doing.

[Spike Mandela]

1.It's up to the SPL not the sfa.

2.they can't sign anyone just now as they're in the middle of a transfer ban so they've done what you are going raj about them not doing.

He has a point though. The SPL rules are so tough that all Hearts had to do was change the word 'unpaid' to 'deferred' and hey presto no further punishment whilst the crime they were guilty of previously has remained the same.

The SPL have no real desire to enforce any financial fair play rules and I strongly suspect that Doncaster and co advised Hearts on the course of action to take to avoid them having to be sanctioned further rather than telling them get their financial house in order.

[#FromTheCapital]

He has a point though. The SPL rules are so tough that all Hearts had to do was change the word 'unpaid' to 'deferred' and hey presto no further punishment whilst the crime they were guilty of previously has remained the same.

The SPL have no real desire to enforce any financial fair play rules and I strongly suspect that Doncaster and co advised Hearts on the course of action to take to avoid them having to be sanctioned further rather than telling them get their financial house in order.


:agree:
Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.

The only fair thing to do would be tell them that they cant play any players that aren't getting paid and of course the transfer ban could include a period of time when the transfer window is actually open

[steviehibsleith]

Its all yam media bringing in a striker.
They are over a million short of a figure stated to survive till the end of the season. There team are unable to score goals and playing a 18yo up front who by all accounts is a midfielder. The plumber has just spat the dummy on a live interview stating thier main striker JS can no longer score goals " how many did he score last season" . They cant sell tickets for this weekends game against ABerdeen when they know they need sellouts to survive because they know team is unable to find the net. In football not scoring goals doesnt sell tickets.
Pretty sure they are still under a transfer emargo until they can pay wages, just cos they deferred wages means SPL will not impose more punishments. They led fans on thinking they were going to sign Shatzell they r doing the same here.

[Alan62]

He has a point though. The SPL rules are so tough that all Hearts had to do was change the word 'unpaid' to 'deferred' and hey presto no further punishment whilst the crime they were guilty of previously has remained the same.

The SPL have no real desire to enforce any financial fair play rules and I strongly suspect that Doncaster and co advised Hearts on the course of action to take to avoid them having to be sanctioned further rather than telling them get their financial house in order.

Surely the difference between 'deferred' and 'unpaid' is the will of the players. Deferring the wages implies the agreement of the players so, effectively, it's an adjustment to their contracts. That deferment could still become 'unpaid' if they fail to stump up on the agreed date. If that happened then sanctions would follow.

It's clear that Hearts have serious cashflow problems. These are likely to continue. The share flotation is unlikely to be fully subscribed. The £750K subscribed by the dafties this time round has now been taken out of the equation for a fan-based takeover of the club. The scale of their fundraising (while laudable to some degree) suggests that they cannot raise anything like the sums required to run a top-level football club.

The support base is decent though. A debt-free club with a fit-for-purpose stadium and its own training facilities could fare well in the SPL with average crowds in the 12-15000 range. That has been Rod Petrie's ambition for Hibs for many years and we're well on track to achieve that in the relatively near future. Our neighbours are not. However you look at their predicament, the only thing they can hope for is a magic bullet.

[lapsedhibee]

However you look at their predicament, the only thing they can hope for is a magic bullet.

Didn't they already have one of those, from Genk?

[Leithenhibby]

You got to laugh. :greengrin

"There will be consequences if we fail to hit that target and I would ask anyone who hasn't participated in the scheme yet, to do so.

[Mikey]

"There will be consequences if we fail to hit that target and I would ask anyone who hasn't participated in the scheme yet, to do so.

I haven't participated yet.

Go on, ask me :greengrin

[Spike Mandela]

Surely the difference between 'deferred' and 'unpaid' is the will of the players. Deferring the wages implies the agreement of the players so, effectively, it's an adjustment to their contracts. That deferment could still become 'unpaid' if they fail to stump up on the agreed date. If that happened then sanctions would follow.



I am fully aware of how they have used this loophole and fully expect there has been a gun held to the Hearts players' heads and with all the media spin on their plight(kids selling their Chrissie pressies blah blah blah) which player was actually going to refuse.

Nevertheless, i fully expect pay to be paid this once to allow them to sign players in January( the real reason for getting a deferral agreement) then they will go back to just non payment of wages and the SPL can get really tough and give them an extended transfer embargo until the next window opens up.

[lord bunberry]

I actually think it is a fabulous effort in such a short period.

However, I also think it is misguided and misdirected.

And soon to be misappropriated

[Saorsa]

And soon to be misappropriatedis that the same as trousered by Vlad? :greengrin

[Hibby70]

I haven't participated yet.

Go on, ask me :greengrin

Dear Mr Mikey

Please participate.

Pretty please.

Vlad.

[Leithenhibby]

You can see why the mad one will no longer support the "big team" (using that term loosely) any longer. His bank is starting to wobble somewhat.........

The fact of the matter is he can't, as he doesn't have a pot to pi$$ in.. :aok:

http://www.nasdaqomxbaltic.com/market/?instrument=LT0000102352&list=2&currency=LTL&pg=details&tab=historical&lang=et&downloadcsv=0&date=&start_d=30&start_m=11&start_y=2012&end_d=7&end_m=12&end_y=2012&period=month

[steviehibsleith]

You can see why the mad one will no longer support the "big team" (using that term loosely) any longer. His bank is starting to wobble somewhat.........

The fact of the matter is he can't, as he doesn't have a pot to pi$$ in.. :aok:

http://www.nasdaqomxbaltic.com/market/?instrument=LT0000102352&list=2&currency=LTL&pg=details&tab=historical&lang=et&downloadcsv=0&date=&start_d=30&start_m=11&start_y=2012&end_d=7&end_m=12&end_y=2012&period=month

ok dont speak Lithuanian and im not a Wbanker Can see the -26.5% and the downwould spiral but perhaps you can put figures on this. Cheers

[greenginger]

ok dont speak Lithuanian and im not a Wbanker Can see the -26.5% and the downwould spiral but perhaps you can put figures on this. Cheers

Click the Union Jack on top right and all will become as clear as mud. :greengrin

[steviehibsleith]

Click the Union Jack on top right and all will become as clear as mud. :greengrin

Labai ačiū :aok:

[Leithenhibby]

Click the Union Jack on top right and all will become as clear as mud. :greengrin

:wink:


ok dont speak Lithuanian and im not a Wbanker Can see the -26.5% and the downwould spiral but perhaps you can put figures on this. Cheers


I'm no banker either but any business that has lost a share value of %62.84 over 3 years ain't doing too well. :wink:

[hibees 7062]

I haven't participated yet.

Go on, ask me :greengrin

How no ? :greengrin

[#FromTheCapital]

You can see why the mad one will no longer support the "big team" (using that term loosely) any longer. His bank is starting to wobble somewhat.........

The fact of the matter is he can't, as he doesn't have a pot to pi$$ in.. :aok:

http://www.nasdaqomxbaltic.com/market/?instrument=LT0000102352&list=2&currency=LTL&pg=details&tab=historical&lang=et&downloadcsv=0&date=&start_d=30&start_m=11&start_y=2012&end_d=7&end_m=12&end_y=2012&period=month

To be fair it hasn't really got any worse since the initial crash last month

[Leithenhibby]

To be fair it hasn't really got any worse since the initial crash last month


28.03% in two months is not good in any banking business .......... :na na:

Another 2.59% in the last week, it all helps :greengrin

[#FromTheCapital]

28.03% in two months is not good in any banking business .......... :na na:

Another 2.59% in the last week, it all helps :greengrin

Heres hoping it plummets even further :greengrin

[greenginger]

Still not had a response from our Council to my Freedom of Information request concerning non payment by HOMFC of Business rates and Rent for the PBS.

I phoned this afternoon and after a bit of dicking around I got to speak to the case officer who told me she had gatherred the information I requested, BUT ----

It had not been cleared by the legal team yet and I should call again on Monday. I told her the information was required to ensure HOMFC were complying with Scottish Football's financial fair play rules and she said that it could be taken into consideration when deciding to release the info.

That confirms to me that there is non payment information, which should be no surprise to anyone. If you are not paying the wages and taxman, you sure as hell ain't paying the rates its just a question of how much !

[Leithenhibby]

Heres hoping it plummets even further :greengrin


:agree:

And I would bet the the share issue at the PBS is going to other projects :wink:

[fatbloke]

UKIOBANKAS SHARE PRICE 7/12/2010

1.2050 LTL = 0.2816 GBP

UKIOBANKAS SHARE PRICE TODAY

0.3900 LTL = 0.0911 GBP
See the pattern:greengrin

[DC_Hibs]

Still not had a response from our Council to my Freedom of Information request concerning non payment by HOMFC of Business rates and Rent for the PBS.

I phoned this afternoon and after a bit of dicking around I got to speak to the case officer who told me she had gatherred the information I requested, BUT ----

It had not been cleared by the legal team yet and I should call again on Monday. I told her the information was required to ensure HOMFC were complying with Scottish Football's financial fair play rules and she said that it could be taken into consideration when deciding to release the info.

That confirms to me that there is non payment information, which should be no surprise to anyone. If you are not paying the wages and taxman, you sure as hell ain't paying the rates its just a question of how much !

You should go to the media re the Council's reluctance to provide and try and put some pressure on that way. Obviously the Evening News/Scotsman would do fek all but maybe 1 of 100 from the west might take their focus off the ugly sisters for an hour.

[Mikey]

Still not had a response from our Council to my Freedom of Information request concerning non payment by HOMFC of Business rates and Rent for the PBS.

I phoned this afternoon and after a bit of dicking around I got to speak to the case officer who told me she had gatherred the information I requested, BUT ----

It had not been cleared by the legal team yet and I should call again on Monday. I told her the information was required to ensure HOMFC were complying with Scottish Football's financial fair play rules and she said that it could be taken into consideration when deciding to release the info.

That confirms to me that there is non payment information, which should be no surprise to anyone. If you are not paying the wages and taxman, you sure as hell ain't paying the rates its just a question of how much !

Good work. Keep at it :aok:

[johnbc70]

Still not had a response from our Council to my Freedom of Information request concerning non payment by HOMFC of Business rates and Rent for the PBS.

I phoned this afternoon and after a bit of dicking around I got to speak to the case officer who told me she had gatherred the information I requested, BUT ----

It had not been cleared by the legal team yet and I should call again on Monday. I told her the information was required to ensure HOMFC were complying with Scottish Football's financial fair play rules and she said that it could be taken into consideration when deciding to release the info.

That confirms to me that there is non payment information, which should be no surprise to anyone. If you are not paying the wages and taxman, you sure as hell ain't paying the rates its just a question of how much !
Well done and keep at it, clearly something to hide.

[1two]

Still not had a response from our Council to my Freedom of Information request concerning non payment by HOMFC of Business rates and Rent for the PBS.

I phoned this afternoon and after a bit of dicking around I got to speak to the case officer who told me she had gatherred the information I requested, BUT ----

It had not been cleared by the legal team yet and I should call again on Monday. I told her the information was required to ensure HOMFC were complying with Scottish Football's financial fair play rules and she said that it could be taken into consideration when deciding to release the info.

That confirms to me that there is non payment information, which should be no surprise to anyone. If you are not paying the wages and taxman, you sure as hell ain't paying the rates its just a question of how much !

Good work! Keep at it

[Leithenhibby]

Still not had a response from our Council to my Freedom of Information request concerning non payment by HOMFC of Business rates and Rent for the PBS.

I phoned this afternoon and after a bit of dicking around I got to speak to the case officer who told me she had gatherred the information I requested, BUT ----

It had not been cleared by the legal team yet and I should call again on Monday. I told her the information was required to ensure HOMFC were complying with Scottish Football's financial fair play rules and she said that it could be taken into consideration when deciding to release the info.

That confirms to me that there is non payment information, which should be no surprise to anyone. If you are not paying the wages and taxman, you sure as hell ain't paying the rates its just a question of how much !


I dof my cap Mr, keep up the good work :wink:

[fat freddy]

Still not had a response from our Council to my Freedom of Information request concerning non payment by HOMFC of Business rates and Rent for the PBS.

I phoned this afternoon and after a bit of dicking around I got to speak to the case officer who told me she had gatherred the information I requested, BUT ----

It had not been cleared by the legal team yet and I should call again on Monday. I told her the information was required to ensure HOMFC were complying with Scottish Football's financial fair play rules and she said that it could be taken into consideration when deciding to release the info.

That confirms to me that there is non payment information, which should be no surprise to anyone. If you are not paying the wages and taxman, you sure as hell ain't paying the rates its just a question of how much !


In the best traditions of Bob Woodward and Carl Bernstein you are truly a seeker of truth and justice and your investigative work on this delicate matter will be celebrated by future generations...keep up the good work.

[blindsummit]

In the best traditions of Bob Woodward and Carl Bernstein you are truly a seeker of truth and justice and your investigative work on this delicate matter will be celebrated by future generations...keep up the good work.

So, in this case, who is playing the "Deep Throat" role? :greengrin

[Bostonhibby]

Still not had a response from our Council to my Freedom of Information request concerning non payment by HOMFC of Business rates and Rent for the PBS.

I phoned this afternoon and after a bit of dicking around I got to speak to the case officer who told me she had gatherred the information I requested, BUT ----

It had not been cleared by the legal team yet and I should call again on Monday. I told her the information was required to ensure HOMFC were complying with Scottish Football's financial fair play rules and she said that it could be taken into consideration when deciding to release the info.

That confirms to me that there is non payment information, which should be no surprise to anyone. If you are not paying the wages and taxman, you sure as hell ain't paying the rates its just a question of how much !

:thumbsup: Hang in there, has tae fit wi wee slippery Salmon's view of the new Scotland that we keep the public engaged and informed, if they somehow think its none of your business there's always a judicial review - we could get a fund going.

[greenginger]

Thanks for those kind words, but I've been thinking ( dangerous I know )

If it turns out there are big numbers in the sum HOMFC are due the Council are we better demanding the Council make them pay it or, should we look for the Council to cut us a similar deal by giving us a rates holiday.

Bit of a quandary ! :confused:

[Saorsa]

Thanks for those kind words, but I've been thinking ( dangerous I know )

If it turns out there are big numbers in the sum HOMFC are due the Council are we better demanding the Council make them pay it or, should we look for the Council to cut us a similar deal by giving us a rates holiday.

Bit of a quandary ! :confused:make them pay :agree:

[Bostonhibby]

Thanks for those kind words, but I've been thinking ( dangerous I know )

If it turns out there are big numbers in the sum HOMFC are due the Council are we better demanding the Council make them pay it or, should we look for the Council to cut us a similar deal by giving us a rates holiday.

Bit of a quandary ! :confused:

:no way: Problem is that everyone else who makes sure they do pay their way would them want the same deal - make the Yam pay like every one else. Its not as if they haven't collected the money.

[Craig_in_Prague]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20649266?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=sportsound

[Saorsa]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20649266?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=sportsound


"There will be consequences if we fail to hit that target."'mon the consequences :pray: :greengrin :thumbsup:

[Part/Time Supporter]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20649266?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=sportsound

Or "how to spin the same news in a completely different way"

EEN: magnificent effort by the Hearts fans, well on their way to reaching the funds required

BBC: well short of target and only 12 days left

:rolleyes:

[Hibercelona]

Or "how to spin the same news in a completely different way"

EEN: magnificent effort by the Hearts fans, well on their way to reaching the funds required

BBC: well short of target and only 12 days left

:rolleyes:

Vlads really pushing the desperado's for every penny they have. :greengrin

Long may it continue. (Until the club dies of course)

[MoscowHibs]

Still not had a response from our Council to my Freedom of Information request concerning non payment by HOMFC of Business rates and Rent for the PBS.

I phoned this afternoon and after a bit of dicking around I got to speak to the case officer who told me she had gatherred the information I requested, BUT ----

It had not been cleared by the legal team yet and I should call again on Monday. I told her the information was required to ensure HOMFC were complying with Scottish Football's financial fair play rules and she said that it could be taken into consideration when deciding to release the info.

That confirms to me that there is non payment information, which should be no surprise to anyone. If you are not paying the wages and taxman, you sure as hell ain't paying the rates its just a question of how much !

It may well be the cooncil are not saying as it could be going to court, hence the legal team bit.

[jgl07]

It may well be the cooncil are not saying as it could be going to court, hence the legal team bit.

More likely they are trying to avoid others knowing that are letting the Yams off.

[Bostonhibby]

'mon the consequences :pray: :greengrin :thumbsup:

We want Consequences, we want consequences...............there's a song in there somewhere...........

[poolman]

Since when did the Yams play 4-3-3 :faf:

WTF, Tattie -heid scouring the UK for a striker :faf:


http://www.scotsman.com/edinburgh-evening-news/football/top-stories/hearts-boss-scours-uk-in-bid-to-find-suitable-striker-as-spearhead-for-club-s-4-3-3-formation-1-2680737

[Spike Mandela]

Since when did the Yams play 4-3-3 :faf:

WTF, Tattie -heid scouring the UK for a striker :faf:


http://www.scotsman.com/edinburgh-evening-news/football/top-stories/hearts-boss-scours-uk-in-bid-to-find-suitable-striker-as-spearhead-for-club-s-4-3-3-formation-1-2680737

****ing scandalous that they are looking to sign players while not paying their current players.

Now their £2m share target is reduced to £1m, they're making it up as they go along.......
Also more fantasyland stuff from Foundation of Hearts.

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/spl/hearts-ask-for-250-000-more-from-fans-1-2681676

[Bostonhibby]

Since when did the Yams play 4-3-3 :faf:

WTF, Tattie -heid scouring the UK for a striker :faf:


http://www.scotsman.com/edinburgh-evening-news/football/top-stories/hearts-boss-scours-uk-in-bid-to-find-suitable-striker-as-spearhead-for-club-s-4-3-3-formation-1-2680737

Sould have no problem attracting a top striker assuming the transfer embargo is lifted - all he has to do is offer twice the salary of every other club in the league then not pay it, simple really. All top players will jump at the chance not to get paid. And it must be a great place to go on loan, not knowing if they are going to be there next week.

If I were Fester I would pick myself up front then I could get not paid for 2 jobs.

[Moulin Yarns]

Still not had a response from our Council to my Freedom of Information request concerning non payment by HOMFC of Business rates and Rent for the PBS.

I phoned this afternoon and after a bit of dicking around I got to speak to the case officer who told me she had gatherred the information I requested, BUT ----

It had not been cleared by the legal team yet and I should call again on Monday. I told her the information was required to ensure HOMFC were complying with Scottish Football's financial fair play rules and she said that it could be taken into consideration when deciding to release the info.

That confirms to me that there is non payment information, which should be no surprise to anyone. If you are not paying the wages and taxman, you sure as hell ain't paying the rates its just a question of how much !


You should go to the media re the Council's reluctance to provide and try and put some pressure on that way. Obviously the Evening News/Scotsman would do fek all but maybe 1 of 100 from the west might take their focus off the ugly sisters for an hour.


It may well be the cooncil are not saying as it could be going to court, hence the legal team bit.

I work for a Cooncil, and FOI is a pain.

It takes a fair few man hours to gather the information, which then has to be checked by Legal to ensure there is no Data Protection issues. This is all standard practice. There are occassions when the cost of gathering the information is so high that it can be stopped on the grounds of costs, but the fact the case officer has said the info is at the legal stage means it has been gathered.

The only reason for not releasing the info would be for Data Protection and I can't imagine there will be any personal details in this, so just be patient, and phone at 09:05 on Monday. :wink:

[wookie70]

Hope the FOI request comes through but I suspect Data Protection will scupper it. If the request is about an indiivual Business then that may be enough for the Legal Team to say no.

[busdriver]

We want Consequences, we want consequences...............there's a song in there somewhere...........

One consequences,
There's more than one consequences...

[grunt]

Hope the FOI request comes through but I suspect Data Protection will scupper it. If the request is about an indiivual Business then that may be enough for the Legal Team to say no.
Data Protection Act is about the protection of personal data not corporate data.

[Twa Cairpets]

I am fully aware of how they have used this loophole and fully expect there has been a gun held to the Hearts players' heads and with all the media spin on their plight(kids selling their Chrissie pressies blah blah blah) which player was actually going to refuse.

Nevertheless, i fully expect pay to be paid this once to allow them to sign players in January( the real reason for getting a deferral agreement) then they will go back to just non payment of wages and the SPL can get really tough and give them an extended transfer embargo until the next window opens up.

Surely that's too Machiavellian even for Vlad?
Pay players in order to sign more players in order to not pay them once signed?
I ken Vlad is bonkers, but this is a mental theory.

[Spike Mandela]

Surely that's too Machiavellian even for Vlad?
Pay players in order to sign more players in order to not pay them once signed?
I ken Vlad is bonkers, but this is a mental theory.

But exactly what they did last year.:confused:

With the proviso that of course we dont know the exact pay day agreed by the deferral. If it is late enough in Say, January I am sure he could even give that a miss once new players are on board.

[CropleyWasGod]

But exactly what they did last year.:confused:

The problem with your theory, although entirely possible in Vlad'sVorld, is that they have an ever-decreasing pot of money. From that pot, they need to find December's wages AND the deferred wages from November. On top of that (effectively two month's wages), they then have to find the related PAYE in January, which of course will be almost twice the normal.

[Biggie]

What's the betting they will hold off and sign skatchel?...****s

[Hibernia Na Eir]

I work for a Cooncil, and FOI is a pain.

It takes a fair few man hours to gather the information, which then has to be checked by Legal to ensure there is no Data Protection issues. This is all standard practice. There are occassions when the cost of gathering the information is so high that it can be stopped on the grounds of costs, but the fact the case officer has said the info is at the legal stage means it has been gathered.

The only reason for not releasing the info would be for Data Protection and I can't imagine there will be any personal details in this, so just be patient, and phone at 09:05 on Monday. :wink:

re FOI requests, they're required by law to provide the information you seek. the only details they can't release are bank account detials, personal data etc.
but the kind of info your after is definitely viewable. get onto them!


What's the betting they will hold off and sign skatchel?...****s

nah, the big nosed, bar lady will stay with the Hun Haters.

[YehButNoBut]

The charity tin's being rattled once more, with Serge pleading for another £250k from the fans and now saying that £1 million is a more realistic target than their £1.79 million original target. Must be obvious now that they will get nowhere near the amount they need, so what will be the consequences??

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/spl/hearts-ask-for-250-000-more-from-fans-1-2681676

Hearts ask for £250,000 more from fans

HEARTS have again warned supporters that the club faces “consequences” if they fail to hit their £1.79 million share issue scheme by the 19 December deadline. With only £750,000 generated so far, director Sergejus Fedotovas has admitted that £1 million is now a more realistic figure.

Fedotovas said: “It is a great effort to bring in £750,000 and the fans should be proud of the achievement. But, as I have stated on a number of occasions, we are still well short of reaching the target which was set at the launch of the share issue. There will be consequences if we fail to hit that target and I would ask anyone who hasn’t participated in the scheme yet, to do so. We have to look at reaching £1m now. I think [this target] is one that is realistic and achievable.”

Meanwhile, the Foundation of Hearts will today step up its efforts to piece together a viable takeover bid for Hearts when it calls on fans to pledge money for the future running of the club.

The fan-led consortium, which claims to remain in “positive dialogue” with the Hearts hierarchy, has produced 20,000 leaflets to be distributed before this afternoon’s match with Aberdeen at Tynecastle as it seeks the financial backing needed to progress its plans. Already, around 3,000 supporters have promised cash, with the Foundation asking for regular monthly contributions from members should its buy-out succeed.

It has stressed that it is not asking for money at this point, rather a commitment, in a range of £10 to £100 per month, to help fund the club in future. The cash would “provide working capital for the running of the club” and, before any request for contributions are sought, full financial information will be provided to those who make pledges.

[Seveno]

Sould have no problem attracting a top striker assuming the transfer embargo is lifted - all he has to do is offer twice the salary of every other club in the league then not pay it, simple really. All top players will jump at the chance not to get paid. And it must be a great place to go on loan, not knowing if they are going to be there next week.

If I were Fester I would pick myself up front then I could get not paid for 2 jobs.

Signing players on loan has a different meaning from normal at the pink palace. It means that the player will have to apply for a ​payday loan.

[brog]

He has a point though. The SPL rules are so tough that all Hearts had to do was change the word 'unpaid' to 'deferred' and hey presto no further punishment whilst the crime they were guilty of previously has remained the same.

The SPL have no real desire to enforce any financial fair play rules and I strongly suspect that Doncaster and co advised Hearts on the course of action to take to avoid them having to be sanctioned further rather than telling them get their financial house in order.



I believe you're spot on. Yams were charged under rule A6.21, only introduced in July therefore per SPL Yams previous indiscretions could not be taken into a/c. Nowhere in that rule or the accompanying sub sections 2 & 3 does it mention contract amendments, deferrals or players' agreement. Incidentally since July, further sections, up to A6.33 have been added re clubs defaulting on PAYE/VAT to HMRC. It could be strongly argued Yams have broke those rules also & continue to be in breach by their current delay in payment. I intend to write to SPL asking if they are in breach of their own regulations. Perhaps someone smarter than me could download those rules & regs. Here's the link.
http://www.scotprem.com/content/mediaassets/doc/RULES%20EFFECTIVE%203%20DECEMBER%202012.pdf

[greenginger]

I believe you're spot on. Yams were charged under rule A6.21, only introduced in July therefore per SPL Yams previous indiscretions could not be taken into a/c. Nowhere in that rule or the accompanying sub sections 2 & 3 does it mention contract amendments, deferrals or players' agreement. Incidentally since July, further sections, up to A6.33 have been added re clubs defaulting on PAYE/VAT to HMRC. It could be strongly argued Yams have broke those rules also & continue to be in breach by their current delay in payment. I intend to write to SPL asking if they are in breach of their own regulations. Perhaps someone smarter than me could download those rules & regs. Here's the link.
http://www.scotprem.com/content/mediaassets/doc/RULES%20EFFECTIVE%203%20DECEMBER%202012.pdf

Here is my attempt at deciphering SPL speak .

Page 17 A6.24 Paye and Nic must be paid within 28 days of date due or SPL must be informed within 2 days.

Late payments subject to a " time to pay agreement " with HMRC are not considered late if the payments are up to date in terms of the agreement.
So, the 1.5 million tax case money is not relevant, at least until May.
The £ 450,000 for late payments Sept, August was relevant but has now been paid.Was the SPL informed and do they ignore these indiscretions because payment has now been made ?
October's Paye and Nic due 22nd November would become relevant if not already paid, or paid before 22nd December.

The Yams could be allowed to sign players come January if the SPL wants to take a soft line with them and nobody is screaming about not being paid.

[jonty]

To be fair it hasn't really got any worse since the initial crash last month

http://www.nasdaqomxbaltic.com/market/?instrument=LT0000102352&list=2&currency=LTL&pg=details&tab=historical&downloadcsv=0&date=&start_d=8&start_m=12&start_y=2012&end_d=7&end_m=12&end_y=2012&lang=en&period=6months

au contraire mon capitan! It looks ******g awful :greengrin

[Newry Hibs]

Caught a bit of the Killie match and I'm sure the commentator, whilst again banging on about Celtc in Europe, said that all SPL teams will get £250k because of their progress.

[ScottB]

The charity tin's being rattled once more, with Serge pleading for another £250k from the fans and now saying that £1 million is a more realistic target than their £1.79 million original target. Must be obvious now that they will get nowhere near the amount they need, so what will be the consequences??

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/spl/hearts-ask-for-250-000-more-from-fans-1-2681676

Hearts ask for £250,000 more from fans

HEARTS have again warned supporters that the club faces “consequences” if they fail to hit their £1.79 million share issue scheme by the 19 December deadline. With only £750,000 generated so far, director Sergejus Fedotovas has admitted that £1 million is now a more realistic figure.

Fedotovas said: “It is a great effort to bring in £750,000 and the fans should be proud of the achievement. But, as I have stated on a number of occasions, we are still well short of reaching the target which was set at the launch of the share issue. There will be consequences if we fail to hit that target and I would ask anyone who hasn’t participated in the scheme yet, to do so. We have to look at reaching £1m now. I think [this target] is one that is realistic and achievable.”

Meanwhile, the Foundation of Hearts will today step up its efforts to piece together a viable takeover bid for Hearts when it calls on fans to pledge money for the future running of the club.

The fan-led consortium, which claims to remain in “positive dialogue” with the Hearts hierarchy, has produced 20,000 leaflets to be distributed before this afternoon’s match with Aberdeen at Tynecastle as it seeks the financial backing needed to progress its plans. Already, around 3,000 supporters have promised cash, with the Foundation asking for regular monthly contributions from members should its buy-out succeed.

It has stressed that it is not asking for money at this point, rather a commitment, in a range of £10 to £100 per month, to help fund the club in future. The cash would “provide working capital for the running of the club” and, before any request for contributions are sought, full financial information will be provided to those who make pledges.

Fantastic, Hearts want the supporters to pay to run the club, and the Foundation want fans to pay for them to buy the club... You couldn't make it up!

Also, why 20,000 leaflets for a stadium that can barely take 16,000? Nonsense.

[Springbank]

The classic yam approach.

Why take action when one may instead write a strongly worded pamphlet or open letter on the subject

[fatbloke]

Fantastic, Hearts want the supporters to pay to run the club, and the Foundation want fans to pay for them to buy the club... You couldn't make it up!

Also, why 20,000 leaflets for a stadium that can barely take 16,000? Nonsense.

Fans are the only ones who really really care - simples.

[ScottB]

Fans are the only ones who really really care - simples.

While true in this case it's fans who are being ripped off, while it was rather funny I'm starting to find it all a bit distasteful really, mainly the media that has fully bought into the whole 'poor valiant Hearts struggling to survive' nonsense.

[#FromTheCapital]

http://www.nasdaqomxbaltic.com/market/?instrument=LT0000102352&list=2&currency=LTL&pg=details&tab=historical&downloadcsv=0&date=&start_d=8&start_m=12&start_y=2012&end_d=7&end_m=12&end_y=2012&lang=en&period=6months

au contraire mon capitan! It looks ******g awful :greengrin

I agree that it looks awful (or as I like to call it.. Funny) but this was posted last month after the initial free fall and since then there has been no other developments

[brog]

Here is my attempt at deciphering SPL speak .

Page 17 A6.24 Paye and Nic must be paid within 28 days of date due or SPL must be informed within 2 days.

Late payments subject to a " time to pay agreement " with HMRC are not considered late if the payments are up to date in terms of the agreement.
So, the 1.5 million tax case money is not relevant, at least until May.
The £ 450,000 for late payments Sept, August was relevant but has now been paid.Was the SPL informed and do they ignore these indiscretions because payment has now been made ?
October's Paye and Nic due 22nd November would become relevant if not already paid, or paid before 22nd December.

The Yams could be allowed to sign players come January if the SPL wants to take a soft line with them and nobody is screaming about not being paid.

Yep, pretty much fits with my interpretation also in that as you say there's a case that they've already defaulted. As I previously posted I believe SPL are terrified that another big club will go down the toilet & they'll bend over backwards to get Hawrts at least through this season.

[jonty]

I agree that it looks awful (or as I like to call it.. Funny) but this was posted last month after the initial free fall and since then there has been no other developments
It was posted two days ago on the 7th :confused:

I must admit, i prefer your definition of awful.
Either way - its only been headed on way :greengrin

Makes RBS shares look good by comparison :agree:

[#FromTheCapital]

It was posted two days ago on the 7th :confused:

I must admit, i prefer your definition of awful.
Either way - its only been headed on way :greengrin

Makes RBS shares look good by comparison :agree:

Sorry mate should of said it was posted by someone last month around the time it started going downhill for UB. I'm sure it was on this thread if you can be bothered searching for it.

[jonty]

Sorry mate should of said it was posted by someone last month around the time it started going downhill for UB. I'm sure it was on this thread if you can be bothered searching for it.

I'd seen it before - I think Sergey posted a link on the PM board on that thread :wink:

Wasnt at all surprised to see the share price is still following the same trend though:greengrin

I still have more faith in the british banks than that lot. They really, really are in the sticky brown stuff and just don't have a clue :thumbsup:

[jacomo]

Fantastic, Hearts want the supporters to pay to run the club, and the Foundation want fans to pay for them to buy the club... You couldn't make it up!

Also, why 20,000 leaflets for a stadium that can barely take 16,000? Nonsense.

The Foundation of Hearts have been scuppered by the fundraising drive that the club itself has done. If HMFC hit the revised target that's £1m less available for a fans-led buy out.

[CropleyWasGod]

The Foundation of Hearts have been scuppered by the fundraising drive that the club itself has done. If HMFC hit the revised target that's £1m less available for a fans-led buy out.

.... but £1m less debt that they'll have to pay off when they buy the club. :greengrin

[Peevemor]

http://www.scotsman.com/edinburgh-evening-news/latest-news/vladimir-romanov-says-hmrc-has-vendetta-against-hearts-1-2683400

Vlad speaks


Do you think that a missed payment for one month of tax is sufficient reason to put the club into administration or liquidation? There is an obvious answer. We have our income and we were able to demonstrate to HMRC that we have sufficient income to cover that liability. So the threats were really a draconic measure

:wtf:

[Saorsa]

http://www.scotsman.com/edinburgh-evening-news/latest-news/vladimir-romanov-says-hmrc-has-vendetta-against-hearts-1-2683400

Vlad speaks


:wtf::hilarious You've got tae laugh, we have the income? :hilarious They could pay the tax because they didnae pay the wages. Who or what is getting bumped tae pay the next tax bill?

[Part/Time Supporter]

http://www.scotsman.com/edinburgh-evening-news/latest-news/vladimir-romanov-says-hmrc-has-vendetta-against-hearts-1-2683400

Vlad speaks


:wtf:

It would be draconic but for the fact that they have been repeatedly late payers. HMRC have had to use court petitions (presumably at some public cost) to force them to pay up.

It's a bit like the little boy who cried wolf. Hearts have been taking advantage of the patience of their creditors, paying up at the last possible moment. How were HMRC supposed to know that this time they were genuinely toiling for cash, as opposed to just Vlad mucking them around?

[Viva_Palmeiras]

Loft ;) in translation ?

... "We know the people who have invested so far are simple fans."


From http://m.scotsman.com/sport/football/spl/hearts-fans-takeover-bid-criticised-by-vladimir-romanov-1-2683157

[JollyGreenGiant]

Loft ;) in translation ?

... "We know the people who have invested so far are simple fans."


From http://m.scotsman.com/sport/football/spl/hearts-fans-takeover-bid-criticised-by-vladimir-romanov-1-2683157

He certainly knows the yams well, judging by this comment...

[JoeTortolanoFanClub]

Lost ;) in translation ?

... "We know the people who have invested so far are simple fans."


From http://m.scotsman.com/sport/football/spl/hearts-fans-takeover-bid-criticised-by-vladimir-romanov-1-2683157

It is a common mistranslation from Russian. простой can mean both simple and ordinary.

[lapsedhibee]

It is a common mistranslation from Russian. простой can mean both simple and ordinary.

:tsk tsk: Having twelve toes is anything but ordinary, so he must have meant simple.

[degenerated]

"Romanov also went on to discuss he struggle with the media, football authorities and HMRC, which he suggested had unfairly treated him"

All that's missing from that is a comma and the following words - but we'd lost will to live by that point so made our excuses and left.

[Ozyhibby]

Friday is pay day again at the PBS. Will last months 'deferred' wages have to be paid before then?
If all wages are not up to date by Monday, will the SPL act this time?
Next week has the potential for much amusement.

[CropleyWasGod]

Friday is pay day again at the PBS. Will last months 'deferred' wages have to be paid before then?
If all wages are not up to date by Monday, will the SPL act this time?
Next week has the potential for much amusement.

That will depend on the terms of the amended contracts :wink:

[Saorsa]

That will depend on the terms of the amended contracts :wink:Maybe all their women folk work just like McGlynn's missus and they dinnae need their wages.

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

Whatever the outcome of this months wage fiasco is I'm sure they will get away with what ever they want to...they always do..

[Jim44]

The embargo will be lifted 'unless they have problems paying this month's wages on time.' It doesn't say, however, whether another deferral would be given another blind eye. I suspect another deferral will be accepted by the SPL and the SPFA and they will be signing players in the January window. I don't think Salmond has yet announced to the Scottish Parliament what he has decided. :-)

[#FromTheCapital]

The embargo will be lifted 'unless they have problems paying this month's wages on time.' It doesn't say, however, whether another deferral would be given another blind eye. I suspect another deferral will be accepted by the SPL and the SPFA and they will be signing players in the January window. I don't think Salmond has yet announced to the Scottish Parliament what he has decided. :-)

****ing scandalous, completely ignoring the fact that the players are still due last months wages. They are taking the piss

[bingo70]

The embargo will be lifted 'unless they have problems paying this month's wages on time.' It doesn't say, however, whether another deferral would be given another blind eye. I suspect another deferral will be accepted by the SPL and the SPFA and they will be signing players in the January window. I don't think Salmond has yet announced to the Scottish Parliament what he has decided. :-)

It might be accepted by the SPL but I doubt it'd be accepted by the players, especially when they're talking about signing new players.

[Mikey]

Friday is pay day again at the PBS. Will last months 'deferred' wages have to be paid before then?
If all wages are not up to date by Monday, will the SPL act this time?
Next week has the potential for much amusement.

I've heard from more than one person that the players are looking to be paid up in full on the 16th and not just get December's pay. Dream on boys :greengrin

The 16th is a Sunday so presumably pay day is actually Friday 14th.

In other news, Mrs Stevenson is apparently doing her dinger about it :thumbsup:

There may not be a new tattoo in Ryan's stocking this year!

[DaveF]

Still not had a response from our Council to my Freedom of Information request concerning non payment by HOMFC of Business rates and Rent for the PBS.

Any more news on this?

[greenginger]

Any more news on this?

I called the Council F O I office yesterday and got told they had not quite got all the info. yet but it would be sent out in the next couple of days.

Don't worry I'm on their case. :greengrin. Hibs.net will be the first to Know !

[Leithenhibby]

I called the Council F O I office yesterday and got told they had not quite got all the info. yet but it would be sent out in the next couple of days.

Don't worry I'm on their case. :greengrin. Hibs.net will be the first to Know !

:top marks ..... haha :wink:

[DaveF]

I called the Council F O I office yesterday and got told they had not quite got all the info. yet but it would be sent out in the next couple of days.

Don't worry I'm on their case. :greengrin. Hibs.net will be the first to Know !

Good stuff. Slightly disappointing that they say they are sending it out, which could well mean everything is up to date. Look forward to seeing what the situation is though.

[YehButNoBut]

It seems that Serge is confident that Hearts will have the wages paid in time this month so that they can sign players in January. Although no mention if this will include both November & December salaries.


http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/top-football-stories/hearts-director-says-players-will-be-paid-on-time-1-2685331

Hearts director says players will be paid on time

HEARTS director Sergejus Fedotovas is confident that the club will pay players’ wages on time this month. Provided salaries are processed by the due date of December 16, Hearts will have their transfer embargo lifted and be free to sign players during January’s transfer window.

Players and coaches are due to receive their pay this weekend after agreeing to defer last month’s salaries. Those have been paid up to date so far and Hearts predict no problems processing this month’s payments on time after more than £1million poured into Gorgie in the last month. “I am confident we will pay the wages on time. We are working towards that and I don’t foresee any problems,” 
Fedotovas told the Evening News.

Hearts are operating under a transfer embargo imposed by the Scottish Premier League until 
December 23. The sanction was imposed as punishment for paying 
players late in October, and the SPL today pledged to lift the embargo if this month’s salaries arrive as scheduled. “Assuming there are no further breaches of the rules, then the transfer embargo will be automatically removed on December 23 and the club will be free to sign players thereafter,” said an SPL spokesperson.

Hearts fans have generated over £700,000 of income for the club through a share issue, which runs until December 19. A £300,000 instalment arrived from Rangers at the end of last month as part of David Templeton’s transfer deal. Those monies are being used to help make up a shortfall in income estimated at around £2 million.

Plans are already in place to recruit new players in January, with the Lithuanian international striker Arturas Rimkevicius expected to train with the Hearts first team at Riccarton today. He scored 41 goals in 38 games in all competitions this year and is seen as a possible solution to the club’s goalscoring problems.

[Peevemor]

It seems that Serge is confident that Hearts will have the wages paid in time this month so that they can sign players in January. Although no mention if this will include both November & December salaries.


http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/top-football-stories/hearts-director-says-players-will-be-paid-on-time-1-2685331

Hearts director says players will be paid on time
HEARTS director Sergejus Fedotovas is confident that the club will pay players’ wages on time this month. Provided salaries are processed by the due date of December 16, Hearts will have their transfer embargo lifted and be free to sign players during January’s transfer window.

Players and coaches are due to receive their pay this weekend after agreeing to defer last month’s salaries. Those have been paid up to date so far and Hearts predict no problems processing this month’s payments on time after more than £1million poured into Gorgie in the last month. “I am confident we will pay the wages on time. We are working towards that and I don’t foresee any problems,” 
Fedotovas told the Evening News.

Hearts are operating under a transfer embargo imposed by the Scottish Premier League until 
December 23. The sanction was imposed as punishment for paying 
players late in October, and the SPL today pledged to lift the embargo if this month’s salaries arrive as scheduled. “Assuming there are no further breaches of the rules, then the transfer embargo will be automatically removed on December 23 and the club will be free to sign players thereafter,” said an SPL spokesperson.
Hearts fans have generated over £700,000 of income for the club through a share issue, which runs until December 19. A £300,000 instalment arrived from Rangers at the end of last month as part of David Templeton’s transfer deal. Those monies are being used to help make up a shortfall in income estimated at around £2 million.

Plans are already in place to recruit new players in January, with the Lithuanian international striker Arturas Rimkevicius expected to train with the Hearts first team at Riccarton today. He scored 41 goals in 38 games in all competitions this year and is seen as a possible solution to the club’s goalscoring problems.

"Those have been paid up to date so far". I'm not sure what that means - it reads like the deferred wages are being paid in instalments.

[SHODAN]

Pretty good going for them - so long as they pay the players they currently have at the club they can play all the players they sign for free until the end of the season!

Because make no mistake, that is exactly what they'll do. ****ing pathetic.

[JimBHibees]

"Those have been paid up to date so far". I'm not sure what that means - it reads like the deferred wages are being paid in instalments.

Reads like they will be paying the players a month later than they should have e.g November in December, December in January.

[PatHead]

According to a learned friend, Romanov cannot go back to the mugs with another share issue for 12 months from the closure of this one. Anyone confirm or deny this?

If so that will really screw up their cash flow as they will have to rely on face painting and cakes for the players wages.

[Suburban Hibby]

According to a learned friend, Romanov cannot go back to the mugs with another share issue for 12 months from the closure of this one. Anyone confirm or deny this?

If so that will really screw up their cash flow as they will have to rely on face painting and cakes for the players wages.

Sure that was confirmed when they announced the deal with HMRC

[Jack Hackett]

According to a learned friend, Romanov cannot go back to the mugs with another share issue for 12 months from the closure of this one. Anyone confirm or deny this?

If so that will really screw up their cash flow as they will have to rely on face painting and cakes for the players wages.

No worries on that score. They'll just start pre selling next seasons books in February (Cash only please, no Cheques or Credit Cards), with a 'Save your club, or else' premium added to the price. :greengrin

.....I'm actually surprised they haven't offered their 'simple' fans a photo opportunity with the cup, as they did with the schools. Signed by the participating players...Oh, wait a minute...that would be short a few sigs by now....even fewer next month :greengrin

[Jim44]

The Lithuanian has started training with the Jambos with a view to signing when the embargo is lifted. Feditovas says he is confident the players will be paid on time. "we are working on it.". Given that the money has effectively to be up front by the weekend they are sailing close to wind if he can't say categorically ' the money is there and WILL be paid on time.

[Golden Bear]

The Lithuanian has started training with the Jambos with a view to signing when the embargo is lifted. Feditovas says he is confident the players will be paid on time. "we are working on it.". Given that the money has effectively to be up front by the weekend they are sailing close to wind if he can't say categorically ' the money is there and WILL be paid on time.

Unfortunately it won't make any difference Jim as they'll squirm there way out of it yet again.

[The Green Goblin]

I wonder if its the fans money which will be settling the players' wages?

Absolutely jaw-droppingly unbelievable that there is even any suggestion of them signing new players in January.

[cabbageandribs1875]

imagine fans having to pay extra for players salaries :greengrin do the players not feel embarrassed relying on joe public to directly pay their wages :confused:

[TrinityHibs]

I'm pretty sure I voted drop Hertz down to a lower league in the poll. How do I change it to not exist anymore because I've had enough of them?

[KeithTheHibby]

The facts?

They needed 2m to make it through to the end of the seaon?

They have raised 700k through shares, extra gate receipts, cake sales etc.?

Fedidooda warned that unless they made the magical 2m then players would be sold in January to make up the shortfall?


I really don't understand how they are even in a position to even consider signing players when it is clear they need to sell to make it through to the end of the season?

[CropleyWasGod]

The facts?

They needed 2m to make it through to the end of the seaon?

They have raised 700k through shares, extra gate receipts, cake sales etc.?

Fedidooda warned that unless they made the magical 2m then players would be sold in January to make up the shortfall?


I really don't understand how they are even in a position to even consider signing players when it is clear they need to sell to make it through to the end of the season?

It isn't about selling, though. It's about reducing the wage bill. Getting rid of lots of high earners, if they'll go, and partly replacing them with cheap imports makes a certain amount of sense.

[Peevemor]

The facts?

They needed 2m to make it through to the end of the seaon?

They have raised 700k through shares, extra gate receipts, cake sales etc.?

Fedidooda warned that unless they made the magical 2m then players would be sold in January to make up the shortfall?


I really don't understand how they are even in a position to even consider signing players when it is clear they need to sell to make it through to the end of the season?

Plus they have a £500k back tax instalment to pay in May.

[Onion]

imagine fans having to pay extra for players salaries :greengrin do the players not feel embarrassed relying on joe public to directly pay their wages :confused:

Twice :greengrin They're already paying for their wages through STs and gate money, now they are having to bake cakes and buy shares to do it all over again :greengrin

[SHODAN]

So what happens if they refuse to sell anyone, then beg for more money?

[matty_f]

I don't think the Templeton money can be considered in their fundraising as they had planned for that already. The £2m they needed to raise was over and above that afaik.

It's looking more and more like their fans have been taken for a ride with this whole thing.

[Spike Mandela]

So what happens if they refuse to sell anyone, then beg for more money?

They will continue to beg and they will do this in tandem with not paying players until next years season ticket money is due to come in. They will have League Cup revenues to factor in as well.

[Saorsa]

I don't think the Templeton money can be considered in their fundraising as they had planned for that already. The £2m they needed to raise was over and above that afaik.

It's looking more and more like their fans have been taken for a ride with this whole thing.you would certainly hope so :greengrin

[Bighoose]

http://www.scotsman.com/scotland-on-sunday/webchats

Theres been a webchat hosted by Moira Gordon on the go since 12.00 and there's only been about 5 punters on.

And all seem to appreciate they are donald ducked. One bloke has bought/gifted £2k for "shares".

[Leithenhibby]

I think it's fair to say that we can expect more nonsense from Tynecastle as the 19th approaches :agree:

As long as there is a chance to screw the fans for more cash then that will be the way they go :rolleyes:

[Bostonhibby]

Twice :greengrin They're already paying for their wages through STs and gate money, now they are having to bake cakes and buy shares to do it all over again :greengrin

Shocking, if they had anything about them the Yammish would cut out the middle men here and give the cakes directly to the players. Have they no organisation or leadership? Doing it this way means nothing can be creamed off the top by the Liths :greengrin

Mind you who knows what they use as cake topping down Gorgie way.

[Part/Time Supporter]

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/364165/Jambos-squad-in-wages-fury


HEARTS players will warn the Tynecastle hierarchy they won’t be so accommodating in taking future wage deferrals if the club go out and add to their wage bill in January.

[VickMackie]

Their fans biggest problem is the fact the 2 million hasn't been broken down.

Does it contain future planned income e.g. Templeton cash.
Has it been reforecast following the Scottish Cup draw against us?
Was it based on them finishing in a certain position in the league e.g. top 6? Remember there is about 80k per place up for grabs and larger attendance against Celtic (at least).
Is the 2 million based on keeping all players on existing contracts til the end of the season?
etc etc etc

I suspect they'll be offering this guy 1k a week (25-30 grand til the end of the season) or so and if he can score the goals that put them 1 or 2 positions up the league it will be a great investment for them. The player will be up for it to get a more lucrative move. That would be my interpretation anyway.

[James70]

http://www.heartsfc.co.uk/articles/20121212/shares-hit-800000-mark-_2241384_3007686

Shame on the 396,800 fans who haven't applied for the share offer! :greengrin

[Saorsa]

http://www.heartsfc.co.uk/articles/20121212/shares-hit-800000-mark-_2241384_3007686

Shame on the 396,800 fans who haven't applied for the share offer! :greengrin:hilarious

[VickMackie]

http://www.heartsfc.co.uk/articles/20121212/shares-hit-800000-mark-_2241384_3007686

Shame on the 396,800 fans who haven't applied for the share offer! :greengrin

Average of 250 quid each which is pretty decent to be honest.

However, if 400,000 of them averaged out at 250 they'd have raised 100,000,000. That would be the 50 million for Romanov and 50 million towards the super dome. Then all they'd need to do is raise anoter 2 million via bake sales to add to the 50 for the stadium to complete it (it was 52 million wasn't it?!).

:faf:

[#FromTheCapital]

http://www.heartsfc.co.uk/articles/20121212/shares-hit-800000-mark-_2241384_3007686

Shame on the 396,800 fans who haven't applied for the share offer! :greengrin

:greengrin

I love it how they keep referring to the 100,000 people who lined the streets in May, asking for them to donate. I'd be willing to bet that at least 70% of they people couldn't care less about hearts and were simply dragged along for the day out.

[DarrenSQH]

http://www.heartsfc.co.uk/articles/20121212/shares-hit-800000-mark-_2241384_3007686

Shame on the 396,800 fans who haven't applied for the share offer! :greengrin

Hearts share scheme only has about 3 times the people that have signed up for the east terracing plaques. Crazy when you think this is to save the "big team"

[Jim44]

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/364165/Jambos-squad-in-wages-fury

..................... Yam players growing b@lls at last. :greengrin

[HibbyRod]

So the Jambos have 8,500 season tickets according to Fedetovas. (We have 8,000+)

How can that be when their fans keep banging on about how much more ST holders they have than us? :confused:

Are they really a big team? :dunno:

[Saorsa]

So the Jambos have 8,500 season tickets according to Fedetovas. (We have 8,000+)

How can that be when their fans keep banging on about how much more ST holders they have than us? :confused:

Are they really a big team? :dunno:a big, massive, gigantic, enormous team :agree:

[Part/Time Supporter]

So the Jambos have 8,500 season tickets according to Fedetovas. (We have 8,000+)

How can that be when their fans keep banging on about how much more ST holders they have than us? :confused:

Are they really a big team? :dunno:

Quite a big chunk of their support didn't renew ST (despite winning the cup) because of the shambles they made of their pricing offer. That's part of the reason why they have such a big cash flow issue. It also explains why Fedotovas is concerned about the gap between the derby and their following home game. The money they've raised will probably cover the current bills, but then there will be four weeks without much cash coming in.

[JimBHibees]

http://www.heartsfc.co.uk/articles/20121212/shares-hit-800000-mark-_2241384_3007686

Shame on the 396,800 fans who haven't applied for the share offer! :greengrin

Wow so they are going to list the names of the fans that have donated, really classy not. :rolleyes:

[Jim44]

Insisting the club would not go under, Romanov said: “I don’t think that I would allow that to happen. Do you think that a missed payment for one month of tax is sufficient reason to put the club into liquidation?
“We were able to demonstrate to HMRC that we have sufficient income to cover that liability, so the threats were really a draconic measure.”


A quote from a post on KB, which has the deluded ones creaming themselves over Romanov yet again. By Mad Vlad's reckoning, HOMFC's misdemeanors are simply "a missed payment for one month of tax."

[Suburban Hibby]

They are absolutely shameless- holding a gun to the heads of their fans.

Oooo ma sides!!!!!!!

[Saorsa]

Wow so they are going to list the names of the fans that have donated, really classy not. :rolleyes::greengrin


"I was conned by Mad Vlad Nov/Dec 2012"

A. Roaster
A. Fud
A. Windae-Licker
etc,
etc,