Share Transfers Agreed/Cooling off period

[Mikey]

Vlad's playing an absolute blinder, assuming his plan is to let Thursday pass without any intervention from him.

[CB_NO3]

The way this is going looks as if Vlad will put them into voluntry administration. It will all but relegate them, give them a chance to get rid of players. UBIG can accept the CVA offer as they are the main creditor, come back debt free and sell the club for say 10-15 million pound with the stadium included. Will give Vlad a chance to get some money back. By doing this, they will still get the full fee for Wallace that they rejected.

[Mikey]

Good to see Vlad's still playing hardball with them, looks like either Vlad will bail them out or their goosed.

Unless the auction goes spectacularly well tonight. :greengrin

You can only empty little Freddy's piggy bank once ye know :wink:

[Dave-O]

Billionaire consortium with untold wealth meet vlad with a view to taking over hawrts, meeting lasted all of 10sec.

Vlad: ok gents take a seat, what can a dae for ye!

BCWUTW: we want to save oor club.

Vlad: nae probs, how much you paying me for it.

BCWUTW: Eh!

Vlad: shekels! how much you got.

BCWUTW: we wis wondering if you could just gie us it for nowt like, the team and the groond.

Vlad: away ya bunch o' f****** halfwits

BCWUTW: nae need to be hasty Vlad, we'll gie you 3 cupcakes and there's some hot soup nae pish, it wis done in a microwave.

Vlad: :giruy:


:greengrin:greengrin:greengrin

[Viva_Palmeiras]

Has it been listed anywhere who is in the Hearts consortium?

Business men? Ex players? Rich fans?

The Queen, The Vatican, The Gettys, The Rothschilds, *and* Colonel Sanders before he went tits up. Oh, I hated the Colonel with is wee *beady* eyes, and that smug look on his face. "Oh, you're gonna buy my chicken! Ohhhhh!"

[brog]

In the first place, agreements were made for payments by instalment; that is normal, and interest would have been taken into account when setting that.

RFC missed those instalments, therefore HMRC had to make a decision. Having been in discussions with RFC, they probably knew how bad things were. They also probably thought, as we all did at the time, that Craig Whyte had first dibs on Ibrox etc. They therefore "knew" that, the minute they took RFC to Court, that would be the end of things and that they would get diddley squat.

And that is what happened, although they probably will end up getting a bit more than they expected. Indeed, by not pushing them sooner, they squeezed a little more VAT out of them.

It's always a difficult call for HMRC to make. I have often had the "you can't get blood out of a stone" conversation with them. They have to walk the line between commercial reality and legality, and that's not easy.

Thanks, in line with what I thought & I assumed Yams would have done something similar, ie partial payments, instalments etc

[cabbageandribs1875]

Has it been listed anywhere who is in the Hearts consortium?

Business men? Ex players? Rich fans?



Bill Gates

Donald Trump

Sultan Haji Hassanal Bolkiah of Brunei

jammy gits so they are :bitchy:





:fibber:

[jodjam]

Stv news was good. Outside the asbestos dome was a lad with 2 collecting bins. Problem was he was swinging them about. The things were totally empty

[Stevie Reid]

Chris Hoy a "die hard Jambo" according to Gordon Chree. Sure he is.

Also the spokesperson for the government agency looking to implement fan ownership in Scotland said that "Hearts fans hold all the aces" with regards to gaining control from Romanov, as "it's their club". Eh? Probably the most inaccurate statement I have ever heard.

[Twa Cairpets]

At the risk of being very naive, if you take the value of a demolished, cleared and cleansed site at Tynecastle at being around, say £6-8 million, if any offer is less than that then Vlad/UBIG are better off sitting tight and taking the land value when the whole things goes vertically betitted?

[Franck Stanton]

Just watched the STV News coverage of the current fiasco at the pbs. Reporter says one of the items up for auction tonight is a cycling outfit from Chris Hoy - a die-hard jambo he says. Now I recall his tv interview and when pressed to name the football team he followed said " I don't really like or follow football, however , if backed into a corner would have to say Hearts" - Hardly "a Diehard" like claimed. Wish they would just report the issues truthfully. Also went on to say that Romanov has knocked back the offer to buy the club from the consortium of Edin buisness men, says it is nowhere near high enough.

[Seveno]

Vlad has just announced that he is in the process of selling Hearts to Abu Qatada as he believes it will provide the guarantee of a long term future for the club.

[YehButNoBut]

From BBC site http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20315889

Hearts say they have rejected a "note of interest" in the club from the Foundation of Hearts consortium led by businessman Alex Mackie.

But director Sergejus Fedotovas says they will continue to talk to Supporters Direct about a fan-led takeover of the Edinburgh club.

Hearts said in a statement that Mackie's bid "demonstrates a staggering misjudgement of the value of the club".

They say it showed "a worrying lack of understanding of the situation".

Earlier, the group, calling themselves the Foundation of Hearts, told BBC Scotland they had made a formal bid after having a "constructive dialogue" with a view to buying Vladimir Romanov's share in the Scottish Premier League club.

And, in conjunction with Supporters Direct, they hoped to provide a vehicle for fans' ownership and planned to speak to the Hearts board on Wednesday to discuss their bid.

Foundation of Hearts chairman Alex Mackie said that it had been discussing plans for the last two years.

Mackie is unsure how much it would cost to buy out Romanov but believes it would be significantly less than the £50m price tag that the Lithuanian put on the club last year.

Last month, Hearts invited fans to buy shares belonging to Romanov in a bid to support the long-term future of the club.

Financial problems at the club and a tax demand for almost £450,000 has put Hearts under threat and Hearts supporters have been urged to find £2m to help the Edinburgh club survive until the summer.

The club have reiterated their intention to offer supporters an opportunity to take control of the club and that they had entered into talks with Supporters Direct, the official government-backed organisation set up to promote fan ownership of football clubs.

"The proposal has no consideration of cash for the shares of the club, even if the debt is removed completely," they said in a statement.

"At best, it is opportunistic, an attempt to exploit what is a difficult financial situation at the club.

"No evidence was provided on how the club would be operated and resourced after any potential purchase."

Hearts say they remain open to genuine offers but would continue to with their share issue and other fundraising events.

"When we move the club on, it will be to the right people at the right time," said Fedotovos.

"With this in mind, we have held positive initial discussions with Supporters Direct and we have asked this organisation for further talks on how we might be able to structure an appropriate supporter-led buy-out of the club."

Mackie responded by stressing that fan ownership was the goal of his own group.

"We have been working for the past two years to try to convince the current owners that a transition to proper fan ownership was the way forward," he said. "This has involved a great deal of work behind the scenes and, at the weekend, we did make an offer to the club.

"However, we have to announce that this initial offer, which included the foundation paying the £450,000 bill to stop the winding-up order, has today been rejected by the current owners.

"We are now looking to continue our negotiations, which have always been constructive, with them.

"What we aim to deliver is a structure whereby fans have majority control, not the minority percentage which is currently being proposed by the current
owners, and are involved in the management and running of the club.

"The foundation was set up by a group of businesspeople, all Hearts fans and all working in their own time and at their own expense, and we have the backing of the key Hearts supporters' organisations for our plans."

Paul Goodwin, of Supporters Direct Scotland, confirmed that his organisation shared in the Foundation of Hearts' objectives.

[Stevie Reid]

Just watched the STV News coverage of the current fiasco at the pbs. Reporter says one of the items up for auction tonight is a cycling outfit from Chris Hoy - a die-hard jambo he says. Now I recall his tv interview and when pressed to name the football team he followed said " I don't really like or follow football, however , if backed into a corner would have to say Hearts" - Hardly "a Diehard" like claimed. Wish they would just report the issues truthfully. Also went on to say that Romanov has knocked back the offer to buy the club from the consortium of Edin buisness men, says it is nowhere near high enough.

Heard Hoy saying that too. Ridiculous spin from Chree.

[CropleyWasGod]

Thanks, in line with what I thought & I assumed Yams would have done something similar, ie partial payments, instalments etc

They have been doing that.


The way this is going looks as if Vlad will put them into voluntry administration. It will all but relegate them, give them a chance to get rid of players. UBIG can accept the CVA offer as they are the main creditor, come back debt free and sell the club for say 10-15 million pound with the stadium included. Will give Vlad a chance to get some money back. By doing this, they will still get the full fee for Wallace that they rejected.

UBIG wouldn't be involved in a CVA, as they are a secured creditor.

There will be no Administration, or if there is one it will last about half a day. If HMRC get their way, it will be straight to liquidation.

[cocopops1875]

This Auction they are having is all good and well but whats the chances of the 300 max people going being how will i put this BIG SERIOUS BIDDERS ? anyone who has run an auction knows that getting guys P*ssed up and into battle is a fine art, i reckon this will be crawling with folk hoping to get something Cheap, Well i hope so anyway :greengrin

[Saorsa]

This Auction they are having is all good and well but whats the chances of the 300 max people going being how will i put this BIG SERIOUS BIDDERS ? anyone who has run an auction knows that getting guys P*ssed up and into battle is a fine art, i reckon this will be crawling with folk hoping to get something Cheap, Well i hope so anyway :greengrinhardly surprising when maist of it belongs in a ****in' jumble sale, clum's top :hilarious

[TheEastTerrace]

Couple of tweets saying they've agreed staged payments with HMRC

[WindyMiller]

It appears the "consortium" were going to pay the Tax (wee bill), and Vlad was expected to just hand over the club.

[Hanny]

Couple of tweets saying they've agreed staged payments with HMRC

Greg Maxwell ‏@GregMax1
#Hearts agree payment plan deal with #HMRC over tax bill. It lifts the immediate threat of closure.

Chris McLaughlin ‏@BBCchrismclaug
#Hearts agree extention with HMRC to setle bill. #BBCSport

Chris McLaughlin ‏@BBCchrismclaug
#Hearts say HMRC deal possible due to some players agreeing to defer wage payments.

[seanshow]

This Auction they are having is all good and well but whats the chances of the 300 max people going being how will i put this BIG SERIOUS BIDDERS ? anyone who has run an auction knows that getting guys P*ssed up and into battle is a fine art, i reckon this will be crawling with folk hoping to get something Cheap, Well i hope so anyway :greengrin

On radio scotland just now, accountant guy representing the Peoples Judi-an front hearts consortium, says the have had the stadium valued..price £5 million :greengrin

[WindyMiller]

Couple of tweets saying they've agreed staged payments with HMRC

2 payments to be made by 2nd Dec.

[HibbyRod]

Do we know when the £1.75m Tax Tribunal starts?

[Gatecrasher]

I thought they couldn't defer wages without a reviewing their contracts?

[Golden Bear]

On radio scotland just now, accountant guy representing the Peoples Judi-an front hearts consortium, says the have had the stadium valued..price £5 million :greengrin

Do you mean ex player Donald Ford? I think he's an Accountant and Radio Scotland said in an earlier bulletin that he was part of the consortium.

[Stevie Reid]

Disappointing news. Is deferment of wages still punishable by the SPL?

[HibeeMG]

At the risk of being very naive, if you take the value of a demolished, cleared and cleansed site at Tynecastle at being around, say £6-8 million, if any offer is less than that then Vlad/UBIG are better off sitting tight and taking the land value when the whole things goes vertically betitted?

That bit just made me laugh very loudly for a while. :top marks

[Saorsa]

Disappointing news. Is deferment of wages still punishable by the SPL?Bloody should be otherwise the rule is pointless. they're still playing players they cannae afford tae pay, that's cheating, pure and simple.

[Pete]

2 payments to be made by 2nd Dec.

Gate money might just keep their head above eater but the sales-of-work will have to continue.

[Golden Bear]

Disappointing news. Is deferment of wages still punishable by the SPL?

Not sure, but if both parties involved (Employer & Employee) have agreed that this is their preferred course of action then I don't think that the SPL will really want to get involved.

[CropleyWasGod]

Do you mean ex player Donald Ford? I think he's an Accountant and Radio Scotland said in an earlier bulletin that he was part of the consortium.

He hasn't been an accountant for 20 years. He takes photies for a living now.

[Stevie Reid]

Bloody should be otherwise the rule is pointless. they're still playing players they cannae afford tae pay, that's cheating, pure and simple.

Exactly. The only good thing I can see is that 2 December could be the day they die :)

[Billy Whizz]

He hasn't been an accountant for 20 years. He takes photies for a living now.

Think he meant Alex Mackie is an accountant. He's live on Sportsound just now

[matty_f]

Greg Maxwell ‏@GregMax1
#Hearts agree payment plan deal with #HMRC over tax bill. It lifts the immediate threat of closure.

Chris McLaughlin ‏@BBCchrismclaug
#Hearts agree extention with HMRC to setle bill. #BBCSport

Chris McLaughlin ‏@BBCchrismclaug
#Hearts say HMRC deal possible due to some players agreeing to defer wage payments.

Booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!! Hector, yer a bad man!

[Horse]

Another hilarious example of how spineless and clueless the Jambos are! I bet even Mad Vlad is amazed at how easy it was to divide and conquer the maroon mutants. Simply ask the mugs to raid their bairns piggy banks and donate it to Vlads retirement fund, errr I mean invest in youth system, errr I mean pay the taxman knowing fine well that many of the brain-dead believers will immediately grab the claw hammers and smash the piggy banks without question whilst other Jambo factions who have a precious brain cell or two to rub between them slowly begin to suspect that the whole thing is a mighty con. Before you know it Gary Mackay is offering to sell off his impressive collection of retro Satellite dishes and begging the deluded fools to donate to his amazing Jambo saving campaign without really knowing how he is going to save the Jambos! Then we have these mysterious "Consortiums of wealthy local business men" who periodically appear with "offers" to buy the club from mad Vlad however these "offers" from "great business minds" amount to nothing more than them going to Vlad and saying "can you please get your bank to write of £25m and give us Tynecastle (still worth a few million even in today's climate) for free aswell please?" Vlad then says "No" and these consortiums slither off back to the whisky society or posh twats club patting themselves on the back for trying to save Hearts!

Any other group of fans (with the exception of the Zombie Huns possibly) would have rallied together years ago to stop this scenario from occurring in the first place and would happily accept their club living within their means and having a secure future. Such is the deluded nature of the pink savilles they have been so obsessed with their self proclaimed "big team" status and they have chosen to ignore 3 owners in a row massively overspending in search of the Big Team dream. They also chose to ignore the fact that they gave up any small amount of dignity and integrity that they ever had in the process. The biggest joke is that Hearts fans still talk about losing their club when anyone could see that they lost what was left of their shabby wee joke of a club years ago, replaced by an undignified, cheating, organisation that happily employed registered sex offenders when no-one else would.

Now eventually, as we all warned them the end is now near and there appears to be no way out for them. Many will presume that another Romanov will appear and rescue them from oblivion because they are a big team that won a few wars etc. however this time it appears that their luck is finally running out. And with pathetic, slavering idiots like the obscene George Foulkes, Gary Mackay etc. leading Save the Jambos campaigns they have no chance - these are the same eejits who led the deluded Jambos to Mr Romanov a few years ago and have no idea what they're doing.

The best option for Jambos now would be to unite and from a newco, share with Livi of somewhere similar, take their medicine and try to begin to build a new club from scratch - that will not happen because Jambos believe that they have a divine right to be a big team and would rather let their team die without a trace than admit that they are just a wee diddy team like the rest of us!

What great entertainment it is!

[Golden Bear]

He hasn't been an accountant for 20 years. He takes photies for a living now.

Aye right enough he must be a fair age by now and probably retired a while back.

[WindyMiller]

Think he meant Alex Mackie is an accountant. He's live on Sportsound just now


From wiki: In 1991, Ford left the accountancy profession and became a professional landscape photographer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photographer), a field he continues to work in to this da

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

As I predicted they have squirmed their way out of this for the time being but I can't help thinking someone somewhere will be giving them backhanders to pay the tax, wouldn't surprise me in the least as they are cheats end off

Disappointing news..

[YehButNoBut]

Exactly. The only good thing I can see is that 2 December could be the day they die :)

And we get to wave bye bye to them after turfing them oot the Scottish Cup same day, should be a historic day. :not worth

[Stevie Reid]

Not sure, but if both parties involved (Employer & Employee) have agreed that this is their preferred course of action then I don't think that the SPL will really want to get involved.

Just another way to cheat, if so.

[CropleyWasGod]

Aye right enough he must be a fair age by now and probably retired a while back.

He actually wasn't that old .... 47?...when he chucked it. He became disillusioned with the practice, and decided to do something completely different.

[ScottB]

I wouldn't be surprised if you'd get more on an open eBay auction for a Chris Hoy cycling suit than the Yams will get it flogging it to their own fans...


I don't think the payment plan will help them too much. They wont have £450k on Thursday and they won't have it next month. I'm surprised at this unless of course they've been able to prove, or at least show some chance that they will be able to pay this debt over the period agreed, plus all other taxes in that timeframe. Isn't part of HMRC taking action like this is to prevent the business from racking up more debt, not just failing to pay what they owe?

In any case, this tax bill, the tax case, wages and other bills / costs are far too much for them. The Sword of Damocles is inching ever closer...

[IWasThere2016]

He hasn't been an accountant for 20 years. He takes photies for a living now.

Aye - based just up the road fae me in Carnoostie. I last spoke to him a few years back and he was convinced the Yams woukd be relegated sometime soon...

[ronaldo7]

The auction might be a bit slow tonight given their stay of execution:greengrin

[Stevie Reid]

And we get to wave bye bye to them after turfing them oot the Scottish Cup same day, should be a historic day. :not worth

I was actually making reference to one of their supporters' "they died that day" quote! Here's to hopefully knocking them out but as I've said before, the fact that they're being allowed to defend a trophy they cheated to win when they're still cheating in the same way, is outrageous.

[The Harp]

Chris Hoy a "die hard Jambo" according to Gordon Chree. Sure he is.

Probably assumed that because he once wore a blazer, he must be a die-hard Hertz supporter. He may have donated something for their auction but he would surely have done the same for any charity case. Come to think of it, I could've given them my 7-0 programme and ticket stub to auction ... nah, that's priceless!:wink:

[truehibernian]

As I predicted they have squirmed their way out of this for the time being but I can't help thinking someone somewhere will be giving them backhanders to pay the tax, wouldn't surprise me in the least as they are cheats end off

Disappointing news..

I don't know - it might prompt decent journalists to ask about some other unpaid bills and debts Hearts haven't, and should have paid - some bills that other SPL clubs are having to pay and are thus not receiving the 'advantage' Hearts are currently enjoying (allegedly)

[HibeeMG]

I'd be surprised if anyone knows but I'll ask...

How much of an extension have they been given?

Also, SSN are reporting it as an extension rather than a payment plan. So along with the deferred wages on Friday they are just pushing their debts further down the road.

[Mikey]

I'd be surprised if anyone knows but I'll ask...

How much of an extension have they been given?

Also, SSN are reporting it as an extension rather than a payment plan. So along with the deferred wages on Friday they are just pushing their debts further down the road.

It's been split into 2 payments, the second one due on 3rd December.

[WindyMiller]

From the auction; Hearts home strip from 2007/08 signed by Andy Driver, Miko and Mikey Stewart (the top is faded).


:rotflmao::rotflmao:

[Mikey]

Disappointing news. Is deferment of wages still punishable by the SPL?

Strictly speaking it should be, but I suspect it won't be.

[Gatecrasher]

Strictly speaking it should be, but I suspect it won't be.
Does deferring wages mean a delay in payment? or not paying at all? Just to be clear.

[Peevemor]

He actually wasn't that old .... 47?...when he chucked it. He became disillusioned with the practice, and decided to do something completely different.

He a good bloke. I met him a few times when my mate worked for him in Linlithgow (Ford and Bannerman). The company became Alexander 1 Partners and is now the A9 Partnership (at least one partner, who was my best man first time round,, is a lifelong hibee).

[Stevie Reid]

Strictly speaking it should be, but I suspect it won't be.

Disgusting if that proves to be the case. They are blatantly cheating to gain a sporting advantage. And, as was pointed out by another poster at the weekend, they're not even picking cost effective line ups.

[Mikey]

Does deferring wages mean a delay in payment? or not paying at all? Just to be clear.

I would assume it's just a delay.

Hold on, I'll check with Mrs Stevenson :greengrin

[HibeeMG]

It's been split into 2 payments, the second one due on 3rd December.

The first installment due this week then?

The timing sounds as though they're using the cup game money as collateral.

[Steve20]

Very disappointed. Wormed their way out again.

[Gatecrasher]

I would assume it's just a delay.

Hold on, I'll check with Mrs Stevenson :greengrin
Cheers :greengrin

[Stevie Reid]

Does deferring wages mean a delay in payment? or not paying at all? Just to be clear.

Deferment means delayed wages.

[Mikey]

The first installment due this week then?

The timing sounds as though they're using the cup game money as collateral.

I suspect they're handing over all they can this week and the balance on the 3rd.

[Paisley Hibby]

I'd be surprised if anyone knows but I'll ask...

How much of an extension have they been given?

Also, SSN are reporting it as an extension rather than a payment plan. So along with the deferred wages on Friday they are just pushing their debts further down the road.

That's all they need - time to get a bit of cash flow from their up coming home games and the cup game with us. They will sell who they can in January and then cut things to the bone next summer. They will then be safe - at least in a financial sense. However, they will have to compete with the reosurces they really have so good chance of relegation :greengrin

[WindyMiller]

I suspect they're handing over all they can this week and the balance on the 3rd.


I'd imagine the futher payments will have to be paid as they fall due.

[matty_f]

Bear in mind they've used money from ticket sales for their next 3(?) games to pay for this, plus a wad of donations and share uptake (raising £200k)... If that ticket money has been used up now, their income is going to be hampered later on.

Could be a good Christmas!

[CropleyWasGod]

I'd imagine the futher payments will have to be paid as they fall due.

There is one due on the 22nd of this month.

[WindyMiller]

I'd imagine the futher payments will have to be paid as they fall due.


Which means that it's vitally important that they don't get through to the next round of the cup.

[SuperTortolano]

When do they get their day in court regarding the £1.7m due to the tax man?

[Peevemor]

I'd imagine the futher payments will have to be paid as they fall due.

Yup, they've has their last chance.

[Sergy Pie]

Smashing :thumbsup:


Another hilarious example of how spineless and clueless the Jambos are! I bet even Mad Vlad is amazed at how easy it was to divide and conquer the maroon mutants. Simply ask the mugs to raid their bairns piggy banks and donate it to Vlads retirement fund, errr I mean invest in youth system, errr I mean pay the taxman knowing fine well that many of the brain-dead believers will immediately grab the claw hammers and smash the piggy banks without question whilst other Jambo factions who have a precious brain cell or two to rub between them slowly begin to suspect that the whole thing is a mighty con. Before you know it Gary Mackay is offering to sell off his impressive collection of retro Satellite dishes and begging the deluded fools to donate to his amazing Jambo saving campaign without really knowing how he is going to save the Jambos! Then we have these mysterious "Consortiums of wealthy local business men" who periodically appear with "offers" to buy the club from mad Vlad however these "offers" from "great business minds" amount to nothing more than them going to Vlad and saying "can you please get your bank to write of £25m and give us Tynecastle (still worth a few million even in today's climate) for free aswell please?" Vlad then says "No" and these consortiums slither off back to the whisky society or posh twats club patting themselves on the back for trying to save Hearts!

Any other group of fans (with the exception of the Zombie Huns possibly) would have rallied together years ago to stop this scenario from occurring in the first place and would happily accept their club living within their means and having a secure future. Such is the deluded nature of the pink savilles they have been so obsessed with their self proclaimed "big team" status and they have chosen to ignore 3 owners in a row massively overspending in search of the Big Team dream. They also chose to ignore the fact that they gave up any small amount of dignity and integrity that they ever had in the process. The biggest joke is that Hearts fans still talk about losing their club when anyone could see that they lost what was left of their shabby wee joke of a club years ago, replaced by an undignified, cheating, organisation that happily employed registered sex offenders when no-one else would.

Now eventually, as we all warned them the end is now near and there appears to be no way out for them. Many will presume that another Romanov will appear and rescue them from oblivion because they are a big team that won a few wars etc. however this time it appears that their luck is finally running out. And with pathetic, slavering idiots like the obscene George Foulkes, Gary Mackay etc. leading Save the Jambos campaigns they have no chance - these are the same eejits who led the deluded Jambos to Mr Romanov a few years ago and have no idea what they're doing.

The best option for Jambos now would be to unite and from a newco, share with Livi of somewhere similar, take their medicine and try to begin to build a new club from scratch - that will not happen because Jambos believe that they have a divine right to be a big team and would rather let their team die without a trace than admit that they are just a wee diddy team like the rest of us!

What great entertainment it is!

[Part/Time Supporter]

When do they get their day in court regarding the £1.7m due to the tax man?

The guy who offered to buy the club (Mackie) said that the hearing will start this week. Don't expect anything from that anytime soon though. Rangers tax case was heard in January and still hasn't reported, although that is unusually slow due to its complexity and size.

[HibeeMG]

That's all they need - time to get a bit of cash flow from their up coming home games and the cup game with us. They will sell who they can in January and then cut things to the bone next summer. They will then be safe - at least in a financial sense. However, they will have to compete with the reosurces they really have so good chance of relegation :greengrin

But is it all they need though?

If it is then it's quite right that HMRC haven't forced a company to liquidate that could be saved.

I'm not sure though. They'll have another PAYE and VAT bill to pay next month I would presume. The players and staff will have to be paid at some point. That's not taking into account the £1.79m tax bill which might go against them.

I don't think they're going to be able to sell enough soup, family silver and face painting in the meantime to keep them going.

[3pm]

Well done to the boy singing 'we only won 5-1' while Luke Shanley was doing his update. The auld yins are the best....yawn.

[HibeeMG]

Well done to the boy singing 'we only won 5-1' while Luke Shanley was doing his update. The auld yins are the best....yawn.

I would imagine Shanners is pounding his face into the concrete as we speak! :yw:

[truehibernian]

What's clear is Vlad still pulls the strings and whilst not really getting involved, he's sitting back and watching the performance from on high. I'm convinced that there is something in place regards the stadium and I'm equally convinced they'll make January - where McGowan, Zaliukas, Webster and Others will be sold.

What I'd like to see is a bit more investigative journalism and have it explained why Hearts are getting away with other bills that other clubs are having to pay - level playing field and all that.

[Bighoose]

#Hearts say HMRC deal possible due to some players agreeing to defer wage payments. #BBCSport@BBCchrismclaug (http://twitter.com/BBCchrismclaug)

Am I being thick here? - if players are deferring their wages due on friday, then why do they also need an extension to paying HMRC the full amount on thursday?

Or should it be read as they need more time to sell some more fairy cakes as they completely skint?

[Saorsa]

What's clear is Vlad still pulls the strings and whilst not really getting involved, he's sitting back and watching the performance from on high. I'm convinced that there is something in place regards the stadium and I'm equally convinced they'll make January - where McGowan, Zaliukas, Webster and Others will be sold.

What I'd like to see is a bit more investigative journalism and have it explained why Hearts are getting away with other bills that other clubs are having to pay - level playing field and all that.Need tae get some new journalists then rather the clowns that currently work for the comics that pass for newspapers in this country.

[Billy Whizz]

I presume they are counting on shifting their 3,900 tickets for the Scottish cup = £97,500 inc vat, plus share of the gate
How lucky that this game came along for them. Hibs have saved them.
Wonder if Rod has agreed to pay them their share on 2nd December to help them, we're that type of club

[WindyMiller]

#Hearts say HMRC deal possible due to some players agreeing to defer wage payments. #BBCSport@BBCchrismclaug (http://twitter.com/BBCchrismclaug)

Am I being thick here? - if players are deferring their wages due on friday, then why do they also need an extension to paying HMRC the full amount on thursday?

Or should it be read as they need more time to sell some more fairy cakes as they completely skint?


The ham bone in the bloody soup takes a bit of boiling!

[mjhibby]

Another hilarious example of how spineless and clueless the Jambos are! I bet even Mad Vlad is amazed at how easy it was to divide and conquer the maroon mutants. Simply ask the mugs to raid their bairns piggy banks and donate it to Vlads retirement fund, errr I mean invest in youth system, errr I mean pay the taxman knowing fine well that many of the brain-dead believers will immediately grab the claw hammers and smash the piggy banks without question whilst other Jambo factions who have a precious brain cell or two to rub between them slowly begin to suspect that the whole thing is a mighty con. Before you know it Gary Mackay is offering to sell off his impressive collection of retro Satellite dishes and begging the deluded fools to donate to his amazing Jambo saving campaign without really knowing how he is going to save the Jambos! Then we have these mysterious "Consortiums of wealthy local business men" who periodically appear with "offers" to buy the club from mad Vlad however these "offers" from "great business minds" amount to nothing more than them going to Vlad and saying "can you please get your bank to write of £25m and give us Tynecastle (still worth a few million even in today's climate) for free aswell please?" Vlad then says "No" and these consortiums slither off back to the whisky society or posh twats club patting themselves on the back for trying to save Hearts!

Any other group of fans (with the exception of the Zombie Huns possibly) would have rallied together years ago to stop this scenario from occurring in the first place and would happily accept their club living within their means and having a secure future. Such is the deluded nature of the pink savilles they have been so obsessed with their self proclaimed "big team" status and they have chosen to ignore 3 owners in a row massively overspending in search of the Big Team dream. They also chose to ignore the fact that they gave up any small amount of dignity and integrity that they ever had in the process. The biggest joke is that Hearts fans still talk about losing their club when anyone could see that they lost what was left of their shabby wee joke of a club years ago, replaced by an undignified, cheating, organisation that happily employed registered sex offenders when no-one else would.

Now eventually, as we all warned them the end is now near and there appears to be no way out for them. Many will presume that another Romanov will appear and rescue them from oblivion because they are a big team that won a few wars etc. however this time it appears that their luck is finally running out. And with pathetic, slavering idiots like the obscene George Foulkes, Gary Mackay etc. leading Save the Jambos campaigns they have no chance - these are the same eejits who led the deluded Jambos to Mr Romanov a few years ago and have no idea what they're doing.

The best option for Jambos now would be to unite and from a newco, share with Livi of somewhere similar, take their medicine and try to begin to build a new club from scratch - that will not happen because Jambos believe that they have a divine right to be a big team and would rather let their team die without a trace than admit that they are just a wee diddy team like the rest of us!

What great entertainment it is!

That is the best summary of events at the pbs ive read anywhere.Most hertz fans wont admit but they do realise they are headed for administration at best although they still feel winning the trophies was more important.The big team nonsense just actually shows how insecure they all are and why they wont be missed if/when they drop down a league or two.yes we will miss the derbies but as a few guys have pointed out we seemed to have treated the derbies as just another game so them not being their wont make any difference. Btw i hope the taxman is as benevolent to the pars who after all have a debt a third of hertz.

[Cabbage East]

Does anyone know how much soup they've sold and how many crispy cakes have been baked?

[DC_Hibs]

What's clear is Vlad still pulls the strings and whilst not really getting involved, he's sitting back and watching the performance from on high. I'm convinced that there is something in place regards the stadium and I'm equally convinced they'll make January - where McGowan, Zaliukas, Webster and Others will be sold.

What I'd like to see is a bit more investigative journalism and have it explained why Hearts are getting away with other bills that other clubs are having to pay - level playing field and all that.

I'm baffled by all the references to them selling players in January. Roll up, Roll up, come check out the firesale at a bottom six SPL club.

Who is going to pay money for Webster? Hearts got him on a free by once again offering more wages than us but I dont recall many other teams being in for him.....that would pay a fee. His previous spell/s in England will likely ensure no offers from there. Macgowan will raise around 200k with him being out of contract in the summer. Zaliukas I believe is rated by some clubs but FFS, surely they would have cashed in on this dumpling if any offers had come in previously.

I hope they put on another cake and candy stall as they'd make more from the scouts on that than they would on players.

HoMFC - DEFERRING THE INEVITABLE

[shagpile]

I presume they are counting on shifting their 3,900 tickets for the Scottish cup = £97,500 inc vat, plus share of the gate
How lucky that this game came along for them. Hibs have saved them.
Wonder if Rod has agreed to pay them their share on 2nd December to help them, we're that type of club

They don't get to keep their ticket sales AND share the rest of the gate money. The gate money gets shared equally between Hibs & hearts.

[Makaveli]

#Hearts say HMRC deal possible due to some players agreeing to defer wage payments. #BBCSport@BBCchrismclaug (http://twitter.com/BBCchrismclaug)

Am I being thick here? - if players are deferring their wages due on friday, then why do they also need an extension to paying HMRC the full amount on thursday?

Or should it be read as they need more time to sell some more fairy cakes as they completely skint?

This is the crux of it: they don't have the money for either.

It's all well and good to show the taxman that revenue is coming, but that future revenue would normally cover future expenditures. Where is the money for December's wages going to come from, assuming the November ones are ever paid?

[VickMackie]

I presume they are counting on shifting their 3,900 tickets for the Scottish cup = £97,500 inc vat, plus share of the gate
How lucky that this game came along for them. Hibs have saved them.
Wonder if Rod has agreed to pay them their share on 2nd December to help them, we're that type of club

That would be brilliant. Then we bump them. Hahaha

[Billy Whizz]

They don't get to keep their ticket sales AND share the rest of the gate money. The gate money gets shared equally between Hibs & hearts.

What I meant was they dont have to wait for the cash for the tickets they sell, plus they'll get a share of the total gate income

[#FromTheCapital]

So we pump them on the 2nd and they go bust on the 3rd. That would be an epic couple of days

[Emerald]

IF some sort of deal with the SPL has been struck to allow them to defer players wages, I'll be raging. The whole point of these sanctions was to punish clubs who signed players on big wages that they couldn't afford i.e. cheating. If they allow this to happen the SPL should get a list of all the players who are not receiving there wages and ban them from playing until they have been paid. Otherwise they are getting away with cheating again and the rest of the teams who have to play against these players may suffer because of it.

Cheating barstewards:grr:

[garys]

With all the clowns they have across the dark side o toon, them trying to get money from here, there and everywhere and deferred payments etc, I hope they have a good juggler!! it's one big circus there right enough!! :-D

[The_Sauz]

They are just living on borrowed time! I think they will need to get rid off at least 4 high earners in January just to get to the end of the season :agree:

[EuanH78]

So we pump them on the 2nd and they go bust on the 3rd. That would be an epic couple of days

They will be able to make the payments in this scenario. The SC gate money will cover them there, looks like Hibs agreeing to get the tickets on sale just now has given them enough leverage to deal with the taxman. It looks hand to mouth for them. I cant see it being this £450k sinking them - maybe next time.

[jdships]

Well the dogs have been called off - for now at least
Now the problem is ' The world isn't going to stop to let them get off '
The club still has to be run , bills will still have to be paid , VAT will still be required to be paid , Nat Ins and Taxes will still have to be paid , wages paid , the debt has to be serviced etc etc .
It is going to take a massive refinancing to put HMFC on a normal working basis .
Looks awful like there will be major 'surgery' among the staff and their numbers come May 2013

:rolleyes:

[The_Sauz]

IF some sort of deal with the SPL has been struck to allow them to defer players wages, I'll be raging. The whole point of these sanctions was to punish clubs who signed players on big wages that they couldn't afford i.e. cheating. If they allow this to happen the SPL should get a list of all the players who are not receiving there wages and ban them from playing until they have been paid. Otherwise they are getting away with cheating again and the rest of the teams who have to play against these players may suffer because of it.

Cheating barstewards:grr:

Thats the sad thing......the SPL & the SFA are basicly encouraging cheating. They know about Rangers for years, the same goes for Hearts, but do nothing, yet they were quick to act on Livingston/Gretna/Dundee.

[truehibernian]

I'm baffled by all the references to them selling players in January. Roll up, Roll up, come check out the firesale at a bottom six SPL club.

Who is going to pay money for Webster? Hearts got him on a free by once again offering more wages than us but I dont recall many other teams being in for him.....that would pay a fee. His previous spell/s in England will likely ensure no offers from there. Macgowan will raise around 200k with him being out of contract in the summer. Zaliukas I believe is rated by some clubs but FFS, surely they would have cashed in on this dumpling if any offers had come in previously.

I hope they put on another cake and candy stall as they'd make more from the scouts on that than they would on players.

HoMFC - DEFERRING THE INEVITABLE

What I meant is they will try and recoup as much as they can for players that they themselves think will get most money - McGowan is off in January regardless I am hearing. Webster, with the CV he has, will find a club and attract a modest fee - Zaliukas likewise, a modest fee.

Hearts won't command a great deal in transfers but it will get six figures in and reduce the wage bill. I do however think they'll face 'Obua like' scenarios where certain players may decide to plant their feet and take a chance in seeing out contracts.

Hearts have got a couple of really decent young lads in their ranks and I hope Hibs are keeping an eye on that too - some of these lads might face the axe and there are two or three that I think have real promise.

[big gogs]

wonder if the first minister had a word with the taxman,he did hint last week

[shagpile]

What I meant was they dont have to wait for the cash for the tickets they sell, plus they'll get a share of the total gate income

For SC games the cash used to be dished out by the SFA because its their baby. Usually a few weeks later. maybe that has changed though.

[Billy Whizz]

For SC games the cash used to be dished out by the SFA because its their baby. Usually a few weeks later. maybe that has changed though.

Lets just let them know, that we saved them

[Hibby Kay-Yay]

How long are the big earners contracted for?

[The_Sauz]

Forget the cayman islands........Scottish football the new tax haven :agree:

[Col2]

The 5-1 and wee team text messages have started again.

They just won't learn will they?

And yet none of them ask why Vlad hasn't paid any of the bill or even bothered to turn up!

[The_Sauz]

How long are the big earners contracted for?
A few of them run to the end of this season!


The 5-1 and wee team text messages have started again.

They just won't learn will they?

And yet none of them ask why Vlad hasn't paid any of the bill or even bothered to turn up!

Your just jealous wee team Hobo :greengrin

[Hibby Kay-Yay]

A few of them run to the end of this season!

So potentially per contracts and nominal fees then given the yams and their Del Boy junk sale

[#FromTheCapital]

How long are the big earners contracted for?

I think the majority of their current first team squad is only contracted till the end of the season. So they will get no transfer fees for them and will be lucky to offload them in January because most teams will just wait until summer to get them for free.

[Just_Jimmy]

Surprise surprise. Itll never happen. They always squirm out of it.

[truehibernian]

So potentially per contracts and nominal fees then given the yams and their Del Boy junk sale

Hearts aren't exactly in the best bargaining position *** January - any club interested in their top players hold all the aces - most are out of contract soon, they are desperate for money, not many clubs in January are flush and unless there is a burning desire to get a player they'll hold off or get a pre-contract signed.

They'll survive though.

[hibees 7062]

wonder if the first minister had a word with the taxman,he did hint last week

Meanwhile, Edinburgh South MP Ian Murray is thought to have made headway in behind-the-scenes talks with Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs (HMRC), which is pursuing Hearts for the £450,000 unpaid tax bill, in a bid to give new momentum to discussions.
He said: “I have been speaking to the Treasury and senior officials at HMRC to try to get a constructive dialogue going between the club and tax authority.
“I’m confident now that those discussions are open and the club is in a better position today than it was last week.”
On Saturday, the News reported how club director Sergejus Fedotovas warned that Hearts fans would have to generate around £10,000 of revenue every day this season to survive its funding crisis :fenlon

[heidtheba]

Apologies if this has been posted before, but isn't this '3,2,Wonga' thing and its 'cash dash' just a bit cringeworthy given their current status?

http://www.heartsfc.co.uk/articles/20121112/3-2-wonga-is-here_2241384_2978590

:cb

[green glory]

Meanwhile, Edinburgh South MP Ian Murray is thought to have made headway in behind-the-scenes talks with Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs (HMRC), which is pursuing Hearts for the £450,000 unpaid tax bill, in a bid to give new momentum to discussions.
He said: “I have been speaking to the Treasury and senior officials at HMRC to try to get a constructive dialogue going between the club and tax authority.
“I’m confident now that those discussions are open and the club is in a better position today than it was last week.”
On Saturday, the News reported how club director Sergejus Fedotovas warned that Hearts fans would have to generate around £10,000 of revenue every day this season to survive its funding crisis :fenlon

Well well, so LABOUR are first interfere!

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

The 5-1 and wee team text messages have started again.

They just won't learn will they?

And yet none of them ask why Vlad hasn't paid any of the bill or even bothered to turn up!

Just never let them forget it was...

0 (nil) 7 (seven)

6 (six) 2 (two)

Never ever let them forget it...:agree:

[Hibercelona]

The 5-1 and wee team text messages have started again.

They just won't learn will they?

And yet none of them ask why Vlad hasn't paid any of the bill or even bothered to turn up!

He'll be busy flying around in his new Christmas present to be fair.

[Viva_Palmeiras]

Thats the sad thing......the SPL & the SFA are basicly encouraging cheating. They know about Rangers for years, the same goes for Hearts, but do nothing, yet they were quick to act on Livingston/Gretna/Dundee.

Is that the difference having a Campbell Ogilvie type person does for your club?

[Craig_in_Prague]

Surprise surprise. Itll never happen. They always squirm out of it.

Appears that way.

Oh well, back to football discussions and not long till we play them in 'their' cup.

[AndyM_1875]

Hearts aren't exactly in the best bargaining position *** January - any club interested in their top players hold all the aces - most are out of contract soon, they are desperate for money, not many clubs in January are flush and unless there is a burning desire to get a player they'll hold off or get a pre-contract signed.

They'll survive though.

They'll be totally uncompetitive and carrying a huge debt that they will have to start paying meaningful interest on in July 2013.

Hearts are in no position to demand transfers of any size for any of their high earners. They need shot of them as soon as the Transfer window opens.

[ScottB]

Meanwhile, Edinburgh South MP Ian Murray is thought to have made headway in behind-the-scenes talks with Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs (HMRC), which is pursuing Hearts for the £450,000 unpaid tax bill, in a bid to give new momentum to discussions.
He said: “I have been speaking to the Treasury and senior officials at HMRC to try to get a constructive dialogue going between the club and tax authority.
“I’m confident now that those discussions are open and the club is in a better position today than it was last week.”
On Saturday, the News reported how club director Sergejus Fedotovas warned that Hearts fans would have to generate around £10,000 of revenue every day this season to survive its funding crisis :fenlon

Aye I'm sure he did.

Watch the scramble for people to take credit for this, when really it is just the tax man doing his duty; trying to get the maximum amount of blood out the stone before they shut them down.

[clerriehibs]

It might not be worth worrying about, but the bookies see the bloodyturds as a better bet to win the scottish than we do. If the bookies are right, we're at SIGNIFICANT risk of going out to the cheating bloodyturds. Is it more important to Hibs to play this match than to challenge the bloodyturds' right to even PLAY in it, given they're insolvent?

http://www.oddschecker.com/football/scottish/scottish-fa-cup

[monktonharp]

Maybe someone should tell Ewan that in business, if you don't pay bills and monies due to contractors, sub contractors and the revenue, then other peoples livelihoods also suffer - sometimes causing extreme financial hardship and job loss. This kind of reaction (the 'football clubs are part of the community thus should be treated differently') is exactly what often prevents others from having sympathy or empathy towwards a cause - especially those with no interest in football. I'm told there are many many debts still to be paid and yet to be announced - maybe Ewan should do some digging and he'd find out to who :wink:

Did Ewan fight the good fight for Woolworths, Comet, MFI and JJB ? They have been in the community for years, they employ hundreds (or thousands), they each had 'history'.

People in this country are far too quick to point the finger of blame at those who really have had no responsibility for the problem they find themselves in - like a parent being told his son is a bully, only for the parent to blame the victime/school/police or anyone else that listens rather than deal with the matter in hand - his son being a bully.

Hearts fans loved the success but seemed to put to the side that it was always on the never never - they have had 7 years to confront, take on, challenge Romanov - or at the very least really scrutinise his ways - even Mr Murray could have reverted back to being a good old fashioned journalist, so lacking in the sports pages in Scotland these days, and taken it upon himself to investigate fully UBIG, Romanov and the way forward for Hearts.

Instead - they've waited for the inevitable to happen and now expect sympathy. I've reiterated a few times, I want Hearts to survive due to the fact I love the derby games, the banter and I've good mates that follow that side of town - but they get zero sympathy from me and karma is indeed a bitch as they say - you do indeed reap what you sew.:agree:best post I've read, on this subject. I have no feelings about them surviving though.made their bed............n' awe that.

[Hibercelona]

It might not be worth worrying about, but the bookies see the bloodyturds as a better bet to win the scottish than we do. If the bookies are right, we're at SIGNIFICANT risk of going out to the cheating bloodyturds. Is it more important to Hibs to play this match than to challenge the bloodyturds' right to even PLAY in it, given they're insolvent?

http://www.oddschecker.com/football/scottish/scottish-fa-cup

So they're favorites to beat us in the next derby then?

That's fine by me.

[Topographic Hibby]

Meanwhile, Edinburgh South MP Ian Murray is thought to have made headway in behind-the-scenes talks with Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs (HMRC), which is pursuing Hearts for the £450,000 unpaid tax bill, in a bid to give new momentum to discussions.
He said: “I have been speaking to the Treasury and senior officials at HMRC to try to get a constructive dialogue going between the club and tax authority.
“I’m confident now that those discussions are open and the club is in a better position today than it was last week.”


Some questions...

Bearing in mind your are a representative of the people Mr Murray, have you been even-handed in your attempts to maximise the public purse's position?
Have you received re-assurances from HMFC that all taxes, PAYE, NIC, VAT etc due to fund hospitals and schools etc are paid in full?
Who have you spoken with at HMFC?
What promises have they made to you?
If you have NOT spoken to HMFC, why not?
If you have not spoken with a Director level individual at HMFC, why are you taking it upon yourself to negotiate with the collector of taxes?

Answer on a postage stamp please....

[Winston Ingram]

wonder if the first minister had a word with the taxman,he did hint last week

He had a word with them about the Huns and got put in his place. Doubt he'd have tried again

[Bristolhibby]

Presumably they have right up to the court case unless they reach an agreement first. At that stage HMRC will withdraw the request. But I hope that the case is heard at 9.00am on the dot and they don't get a chance.

Can anyone check the court schedule for Thursday.

I believe somebody did it last time they had a winding up order.

J

[EuanH78]

Some questions...

Bearing in mind your are a representative of the people Mr Murray, have you been even-handed in your attempts to maximise the public purse's position?
Have you received re-assurances from HMFC that all taxes, PAYE, NIC, VAT etc due to fund hospitals and schools etc are paid in full?
Who have you spoken with at HMFC?
What promises have they made to you?
If you have NOT spoken to HMFC, why not?
If you have not spoken with a Director level individual at HMFC, why are you taking it upon yourself to negotiate with the collector of taxes?

Answer on a postage stamp please....

To be fair, if the Yams get liquidated, HMRC will probably get hee haw anyway. At least this way they are getting some money in, until the next time.

[Billy Whizz]

When we beat them on the 2nd he'll probably not pay out on the 3rd. Think he's just hanging on for this game.
It would be lovely if Vlad would show up for this one

[monktonharp]

hardly surprising when maist of it belongs in a ****in' jumble sale, clum's top :hilarious now now big yin, all it takes is 2 Callum Elliot fans,intent on getting his stuff. it's his full kit remember:wink:

[truehibernian]

To be fair, if the Yams get liquidated, HMRC will probably get hee haw anyway. At least this way they are getting some money in, until the next time.

Exactly - as my good mate just texted, it's not money that's going into Hearts but out of it - and into the public purse. Lets hope other public monies are paid too.

[The Green Goblin]

Maybe someone should tell Ewan that in business, if you don't pay bills and monies due to contractors, sub contractors and the revenue, then other peoples livelihoods also suffer - sometimes causing extreme financial hardship and job loss. This kind of reaction (the 'football clubs are part of the community thus should be treated differently') is exactly what often prevents others from having sympathy or empathy towwards a cause - especially those with no interest in football. I'm told there are many many debts still to be paid and yet to be announced - maybe Ewan should do some digging and he'd find out to who :wink:

Did Ewan fight the good fight for Woolworths, Comet, MFI and JJB ? They have been in the community for years, they employ hundreds (or thousands), they each had 'history'.

People in this country are far too quick to point the finger of blame at those who really have had no responsibility for the problem they find themselves in - like a parent being told his son is a bully, only for the parent to blame the victime/school/police or anyone else that listens rather than deal with the matter in hand - his son being a bully.

Hearts fans loved the success but seemed to put to the side that it was always on the never never - they have had 7 years to confront, take on, challenge Romanov - or at the very least really scrutinise his ways - even Mr Murray could have reverted back to being a good old fashioned journalist, so lacking in the sports pages in Scotland these days, and taken it upon himself to investigate fully UBIG, Romanov and the way forward for Hearts.

Instead - they've waited for the inevitable to happen and now expect sympathy. I've reiterated a few times, I want Hearts to survive due to the fact I love the derby games, the banter and I've good mates that follow that side of town - but they get zero sympathy from me and karma is indeed a bitch as they say - you do indeed reap what you sew.


Superb post!! :agree: Sums it up perfectly.

[brog]

I wouldn't get over excited about this. All this means is Yams will see 2012 out. The share issue is a one off that not even gullible Yams will fall for next time. Similarly with jumble sales, cake bakes etc. They've used up all this income plus sales of future tickets just to clear this debt. Now they have to start all over again just to meet normal running costs & still have the £2mm tax spectre hanging over them. Gate money from us & transfer dish from sevco will spin it out a bit longer but it's death by a thousand cuts. They will not be in SPL next season & I doubt for a number of years.

[kennyh]

IF some sort of deal with the SPL has been struck to allow them to defer players wages, I'll be raging. The whole point of these sanctions was to punish clubs who signed players on big wages that they couldn't afford i.e. cheating. If they allow this to happen the SPL should get a list of all the players who are not receiving there wages and ban them from playing until they have been paid. Otherwise they are getting away with cheating again and the rest of the teams who have to play against these players may suffer because of it.

Cheating barstewards:grr:

Totally agree. Any player or management team not paid this week should not be allowed to participate in any match till the club has proven they have been paid in full. This should be on the SPL rule book.

[Saorsa]

Totally agree. Any player or management team not paid this week should not be allowed to participate in any match till the club has proven they have been paid in full. This should be on the SPL rule book.Joke of an organisation run by blithering imbeciles without the baws tae do the right thing. That last pointless transfer embargo for failure tae pay wages on time should have been a points deduction, the failure tae pay taxes on time should have been another points deduction and still they get away with it, pathetic.

[Hibby Kay-Yay]

Joke of an organisation run by blithering imbeciles without the baws tae do the right thing. That last pointless transfer embargo for failure tae pay wages on time should have been a points deduction, the failure tae pay taxes on time should have been another points deduction and still they get away with it, pathetic.

This

[monktonharp]

I would imagine Shanners is pounding his face into the concrete as we speak! :yw:well, if he didnae, his faither would if he's lurkin' in the background. dont f/ck wi' the Niddrie boys:greengrin


What's clear is Vlad still pulls the strings and whilst not really getting involved, he's sitting back and watching the performance from on high. I'm convinced that there is something in place regards the stadium and I'm equally convinced they'll make January - where McGowan, Zaliukas, Webster and Others will be sold.

What I'd like to see is a bit more investigative journalism and have it explained why Hearts are getting away with other bills that other clubs are having to pay - level playing field and all that.:agree:fully agree with you on this, as in a previous post. I get the feeling though that some up and coming Journo bbc type gadge will be compiling a reveal all tv invetigative prog. as we speak. saw it happening to der hun, and , der mini-hun is not untouchable for the sake of fair minded folk:wink:

[Steve20]

They will not be in SPL next season & I doubt for a number of years.

Yes they will. There will be another time we all get our hopes up but it'll come to nothing, like this week.

[green day]

Ian Murray MP is(or was) a hearts season ticket holder.

Ewan Murray is also a jambo.

Hardly surprising that they are being supportive, but not exactly how either dealt with the Sevco situation.

[truehibernian]

Ian Murray MP is(or was) a hearts season ticket holder.

Ewan Murray is also a jambo.

Hardly surprising that they are being supportive, but not exactly how either dealt with the Sevco situation.

And Ian Murray MP will get my vote if he gets Hearts to not only pay the HMRC but also the other companies and public bodies they owe money to - and I hope he has been in negotiations with them to ensure payments are in the pipeline there too.

[brog]

Yes they will. There will be another time we all get our hopes up but it'll come to nothing, like this week.

We'll see, have faith. I've never posted anything like this before but this time is different.

[monktonharp]

That is the best summary of events at the pbs ive read anywhere.Most hertz fans wont admit but they do realise they are headed for administration at best although they still feel winning the trophies was more important.The big team nonsense just actually shows how insecure they all are and why they wont be missed if/when they drop down a league or two.yes we will miss the derbies but as a few guys have pointed out we seemed to have treated the derbies as just another game so them not being their wont make any difference. Btw i hope the taxman is as benevolent to the pars who after all have a debt a third of hertz.they shall drop 3 divisions, if it's the same as der Hun.spl,1st,2nd 3rd remember.looks like the taxman has given them a stay of exucution, imho.more to follow, but they have been a shower o' lucky barstewards for a long number of years. our day will surely come. they are ,as the saying goes..............dead man walking

[jabis]

At the risk of being very naive, if you take the value of a demolished, cleared and cleansed site at Tynecastle at being around, say £6-8 million, if any offer is less than that then Vlad/UBIG are better off sitting tight and taking the land value when the whole things goes vertically betitted?

i prefer "mammaries skywards" :greengrin

[KeithTheHibby]

So they get an extension, big deal.

One thing that tells me is Vlad was never going to bail them out by paying himself as he clearly either has no cash or couldn't be ersed.

They are also deferring wages, basically robbing from Peter to pay Paul. The wages will still need paid at some point.

I also think this decision will slow down any momentum built up by the supporters when it comes to the fundraising.

Out of interest what exactly are the SFA or SPL doing about this? Clearly not paying tax and now not paying wages on time for 3rd month in a row shall lead to more sanctions?

[monktonharp]

wonder if the first minister had a word with the taxman,he did hint last weekcan you just check, and confirm that the member of parliment that had a private word with hector....is in fact of the labour persuation. not saying for a moment that he is a jambo barsteward, just to point oot that salmond was not directly involved in any under the *****er deals, if ye ken what ah mean:wink:

[hibees 7062]

well, if he didnae, his faither would if he's lurkin' in the background. dont f/ck wi' the Niddrie boys:greengrin

:faf: :top marks

[Peevemor]

How will the SPL view Hearts "deferring" players' wages to pay the tax bill. Even though they say that the players have agreed, in reality they didn't have much choice - "either take your wages late or we get closed down and you'll get no wages at all".

Surely this must count as another late payment.

[Topographic Hibby]

To be fair, if the Yams get liquidated, HMRC will probably get hee haw anyway. At least this way they are getting some money in, until the next time.Completely true. As someone else has said, I'm looking forward to seeing how he negotiates the other creditors (eg Newtongrange Star) that are due cash. Seem to remember that the local newsagent in the SevcoWest creditor list was due a few quid for newspapers etc supplied to Rangers. There are no doubt a number of HMFC creditors (including some small/medium sized businesses) that are asking questions like "when" and "if" and perhaps more correctly "will I supply them with anymore (insert appropriate good or service here)..?"

[monktonharp]

I dont quite know what will happen with their wages, to be honest . but, as far as I've noticed it's some players that have agreed to differ,not all? . however, the rules were changed and the players themselves no longer have to notify the spl about a late payment. the club itself must notify(in writing I think) the governing body (spl) about late payments within 2/3 days? . what action is taken thereafter, is up in the air as far as I can see. I do however,sense a total climbdown by the spl on this matter. shower o' gutless blazers, along with the sfa, when honest, hard pressed lesser clubs to a certain degree like livi, dundee etc were hammered. not obviously by the spl, but the footballing authoroties in general. there may be some young players amongst that gorgie mob, that feel obliged to deffer their wages for a week or two, and their Ma n' Da could say....naw son we'll let you stay here rent free for a month, but yer no allowed in the kitchen awrite:greengrin that's when Fraser Wishart comes in.

[Fat Penlon]

So they get an extension, big deal.

One thing that tells me is Vlad was never going to bail them out by paying himself as he clearly either has no cash or couldn't be ersed.

They are also deferring wages, basically robbing from Peter to pay Paul. The wages will still need paid at some point.

I also think this decision will slow down any momentum built up by the supporters when it comes to the fundraising.

Out of interest what exactly are the SFA or SPL doing about this? Clearly not paying tax and now not paying wages on time for 3rd month in a row shall lead to more sanctions?


This is obviously what’s happening. Can any of the financial experts on here shed any light on why HMRC would allow the extension when it’s obvious they are only getting in deeper by continuing to honor player contracts which they cannot afford. They are running up more tax liabilities which they cannot pay. They will make almost nothing in Jan player sales as they are all out of contract next summer therefore must rely on match days for income for the rest of the season which is nowhere near enough income. I cannot see how it’s possible for HMRC to allow this to go on any longer? Or am I missing something?

[s.a.m]

IF some sort of deal with the SPL has been struck to allow them to defer players wages, I'll be raging. The whole point of these sanctions was to punish clubs who signed players on big wages that they couldn't afford i.e. cheating. If they allow this to happen the SPL should get a list of all the players who are not receiving there wages and ban them from playing until they have been paid. Otherwise they are getting away with cheating again and the rest of the teams who have to play against these players may suffer because of it.

Cheating barstewards:grr:

This is a good point. I realise there probably isn't a rule in place to cover this (because clubs keep inventing new ways to employ players they can't afford to pay), but, ultimately, the proper sanction should be that you cannot play unpaid players.

[iwasthere1972]

Serious question. Does anybody know how much Hearts need to find by Friday for the wages?

[monktonharp]

Completely true. As someone else has said, I'm looking forward to seeing how he negotiates the other creditors (eg Newtongrange Star) that are due cash. Seem to remember that the local newsagent in the SevcoWest creditor list was due a few quid for newspapers etc supplied to Rangers. There are no doubt a number of HMFC creditors (including some small/medium sized businesses) that are asking questions like "when" and "if" and perhaps more correctly "will I supply them with anymore (insert appropriate good or service here)..?"toilet rolls for instance, ? Vlad, like the pope/queen delete as appropriate , need to go tae

[Kato]

Serious question. Does anybody know how much Hearts need to find by Friday for the wages?

Squillions.

[monktonharp]

the point raised by Emerald is a good one, and like s.a.m, I agree

[iwasthere1972]

Squillions.

Look it's a serious question so I need a serious answer. How many squillions? :greengrin

[HibeeMG]

Squillions.

This type of unconfirmed post is what starts internet rumours.

It's well known that they need to find Gazillions!

:greengrin

[Bostonhibby]

This type of unconfirmed post is what starts internet rumours.

It's well known that they need to find Gazillions!

:greengrin

I've not really been keeping up with what's going on over there but how is this a problem?

Doesn't Romanov own a bank, thus ensuring that whenever they need to print some banknotes, forgive debt or just ignore an inconvenient story generally he can just make all the bad news go away?

He probably has loads of Gazillion pound notes and I bet he will spend a few on the genuine historical treasures available at the Tynecastle auction right now.

The chance to own the A.Wallace Mercer combined toilet roll holder and cigar cutter or the Graham Rix Jacuzzi (excluding fixtures and fittings, buyer collects) only comes up once in a lifetime after all.

[Steve20]

They'll always find a way to worm their way out of trouble. Won't get my hopes up again.

[Wee Scottie Dug]

Serious question. Does anybody know how much Hearts need to find by Friday for the wages?

Must be around £420K ........ Being the well publicised £5M annual wage bill / 12 ....... Might need a few more bake sales and auctions to raise that !! :hibees

[ScottB]

Lets stop and consider just what they will have to do to survive the season.

First thing tomorrow, cut back on everything possible, staff begged to leave, ask players to make their own ways to away fixtures, bail out of any all expenses that aren't essential to putting a squad out for a game.

Stop picking players with pricey bonuses / appearance fees, unless they agree to waive them. Try and convince any / all players to donate their wages to the clubs emergency fund / go without in exchange for a free transfer in January.

Keep begging the fans for money, flogging anything and everything to them to meet the various tax bills. At least another £200k for the one due this week, and another few hundred grand for the others that will fall due before the end of the year.

If still going in January, sell anyone who can be sold / release anyone on any sort of serious wages if they will go.


Surely this is exactly what they will have to do? If they are still alive at the end of January it'll be a youth team earning peanuts getting hammered in front of a support bled dry by 3 months of begging letters and share issues...

[ScottB]

Must be around £420K ........ Being the well publicised £5M annual wage bill / 12 ....... Might need a few more bake sales and auctions to raise that !! :hibees

That presumably won't include the NI and PAYE they will owe with it either...

[iwasthere1972]

Must be around £420K ........ Being the well publicised £5M annual wage bill / 12 ....... Might need a few more bake sales and auctions to raise that !! :hibees

My thoughts as well. Somewhere between £400K-£500K.

Can't wait until Friday.

edit: Just heard that the players have agreed to defer this month's wage. Booger.

[Bostonhibby]

My thoughts as well. Somewhere between £400K-£500K.

Can't wait until Friday.

edit: Just heard that the players have agreed to defer this month's wage. Booger.

Take some comfort from the possibility that one of the deferee's may well be Ryan Stevenson.

[Wee Scottie Dug]

That presumably won't include the NI and PAYE they will owe with it either...

Guess not . . . . . . Assuming recent bill was a quarterly one then that's about £150K more needed . . . Just as well there's only 7 more wage months to get them through to the end of the season . . . :greengrin

[greenginger]

Serious question. Does anybody know how much Hearts need to find by Friday for the wages?

They had 57 non playing staff according to there last accounts , say they have cut that to 40 , add another 40 for coaching and junior players, makes about 80 employees on just above minimum wage say £ 325 /week ; that makes a monthly total of £ 104,000 due on Friday less of course the tax, make it £ 80,000 due on Friday.

[GreenCastle]

So they get an extension, big deal.

One thing that tells me is Vlad was never going to bail them out by paying himself as he clearly either has no cash or couldn't be ersed.

They are also deferring wages, basically robbing from Peter to pay Paul. The wages will still need paid at some point.

I also think this decision will slow down any momentum built up by the supporters when it comes to the fundraising.

Out of interest what exactly are the SFA or SPL doing about this? Clearly not paying tax and now not paying wages on time for 3rd month in a row shall lead to more sanctions?

:agree:

They still need to find a large amount of money to keep themselves operating and I imagine the plan is to make it till January so they can sell some players - the problem is they haven't got many decent players to sell and now everyone know's how poor they are so you can imagine the bids for players in January being very low.

The share issue is still a load of nonsense as long as Vlad is the majority shareholder - he is taking them for a serious ride and trying to get some of his lost money back.

The next few months and how the yams are going to be looking as a team in 2013 is going to be very interesting to see.

[iwasthere1972]

They had 57 non playing staff according to there last accounts , say they have cut that to 40 , add another 40 for coaching and junior players, makes about 80 employees on just above minimum wage say £ 325 /week ; that makes a monthly total of £ 104,000 due on Friday less of course the tax, make it £ 80,000 due on Friday.

:hilarious They wish.

[The_Sauz]

They had 57 non playing staff according to there last accounts , say they have cut that to 40 , add another 40 for coaching and junior players, makes about 80 employees on just above minimum wage say £ 325 /week ; that makes a monthly total of £ 104,000 due on Friday less of course the tax, make it £ 80,000 due on Friday.

Are you sure that's correct:confused:

[greenginger]

Vlad knocking back chuckie Greens £ 500 K before there was any deal with HMRC suggests he would of happily allowed the club to be liquidated.

of course, they might not turn up with Thursday's Tax installment for HMRC.:greengrin

[iwasthere1972]

Vlad knocking back chuckie Greens £ 500 K before there was any deal with HMRC suggests he would of happily allowed the club to be liquidated.

of course, they might not turn up with Thursday's Tax installment for HMRC.:greengrin

Keep up man. That along with the wages has been deferred. Do you know how long it takes to make 100,000 fairy cakes? :greengrin

[The Green Goblin]

Well, I think the yams should be really angry, cos if the creditors are let down, its them that will suffer. After all, its all debt that they owe to themselves, therefore if they don't pay up, they could lose millions.

:greengrin

[Springbank]

Should we pay hearts the Scottish cup gate money on time? I don't know. Tell you what, let's ask Arbroath FC what they think.

[Bristolhibby]

Are we forgetting that is UBIG goes mammeries verticaly skywards, then HoMFC's not continuing is academic.

What was it somebody was saying 12% drop in share value in two days. That's bad.

J

[Saorsa]

Should we pay hearts the Scottish cup gate money on time? I don't know. Tell you what, let's ask Arbroath FC what they think.Personally I wouldnae have let them sell the tickets and would have held the dosh 'til the last possible minute

[Treadstone]

Euromillions won in France . Keep baking the cakes lads.

[truehibernian]

Personally I wouldnae have let them sell the tickets and would have held the dosh 'til the last possible minute

Nah, far better beating them and putting them out the cup DD - January is going to be the real time for Hearts to start worrying, trust me.

[Saorsa]

Nah, far better beating them and putting them out the cup DD - January is going to be the real time for Hearts to start worrying, trust me.Only if you never wanted them tae go bust yesterday :wink:

[truehibernian]

Only if you never wanted them tae go bust yesterday :wink:

There's more bills on the way I'm hearing ;-)

[Mikey]

Euromillions won in France . Keep baking the cakes lads.

Anyone seen Peevemor this morning? :greengrin

[Saorsa]

There's more bills on the way I'm hearing ;-)Yeah, lots, I still believe they will be gone soon, yesterday was only a stay of execution IMO, it's just a pity it happened that's all, again just my opinion.

[Kaiser1962]

IF some sort of deal with the SPL has been struck to allow them to defer players wages, I'll be raging. The whole point of these sanctions was to punish clubs who signed players on big wages that they couldn't afford i.e. cheating. If they allow this to happen the SPL should get a list of all the players who are not receiving there wages and ban them from playing until they have been paid. Otherwise they are getting away with cheating again and the rest of the teams who have to play against these players may suffer because of it.

Cheating barstewards:grr:

This is my view and I would extend it further by adding future potential for bullying and intimidation in there as well. If they get away with it this time then what happens if certain individuals, not only players, are perhaps not so keen on "deferring" and the Yams need 10 of them to do so? Are the office staff told if they dont defer, so that player A can be paid, their working life will be made even more hellish and, should they leave, the Yam hierarchy will tell the DWP they walked out nullifying any benefit claim.

HMFC have lodged contracts with the SFA and the SFA should ensure that payments are made in accordance with those contracts. Any decision shouuld be removed from the responsibility of individual staff and, if the SFA allow this to happen, they may be leaving themselves open to future litigation. The SFA have a duty to protect all staff at all clubs that come under their governance.


Yes they will. There will be another time we all get our hopes up but it'll come to nothing, like this week.

I am not so sure.

They are trying to sell a cigar box that was a gift prior to a european tie along with some faded tops that have been removed from their display cases. They are potless. The biggest worry for them is that it is barely mid November and they cant pay their VAT (they've spent it) and they cant pay their wages. All ST money (their main source of income) is gone. They are surviving now on a day by day basis.

FWIW anyone taking over the yam is going to need substantial capital going forward and unless they abdicate responsibility for the seasons sold by Vlad, I cant see how the Yams can make it to the end of the season. Not only that but any consortium is going to need serious money shortly to renovate the PBS which is showing signs of advanced deacy and neglect. IF they dont get to end of the season then I cant see the SFA hanging around to make a decision who replaces them, or they will end up with another Dundee scenario. If they go pop before the end of January I suspect its non league for them.

[Peevemor]

Anyone seen Peevemor this morning? :greengrin

J'arrive! :greengrin

[Mikey]

J'arrive! :greengrin

Ou est le piles of cash? :greengrin

[Peevemor]

Ou est le piles of cash? :greengrin

Dans mon cul! :na na:

[Mikey]

Dans mon cul! :na na:

Well keep it there and don't give 50 mill to any Jambos :wink:

[JeMeSouviens]

Things we know now we didn't know last week:

1. Vlad isn't going to bail them out.
2. They couldn't raise 450K to save their club (and diminishing returns says ... :wink: )
3. Vlad isn't going to write off all the debt.
4. The "consortium" consists of a few guys who want Vlad to give them the club including the ground, write off all the debt and agree to cover any liability from existing tax cases.

The annoying thing is we have to play them in the cup while they've still got a squad costing twice as much as ours and will have a siege mentality.

[EuanH78]

This is obviously what’s happening. Can any of the financial experts on here shed any light on why HMRC would allow the extension when it’s obvious they are only getting in deeper by continuing to honor player contracts which they cannot afford. They are running up more tax liabilities which they cannot pay. They will make almost nothing in Jan player sales as they are all out of contract next summer therefore must rely on match days for income for the rest of the season which is nowhere near enough income. I cannot see how it’s possible for HMRC to allow this to go on any longer? Or am I missing something?

I'm not a financial expert but I assume that as Hearts have been able to show that they will be able to pay this bill (at least) then HMRC will be happy to take the money without regard for what may happen in the near future. It's only when the payments aren't made they'll get pissy with them again.

As I understand (though I'm happy to be corrected) HMRC will get brussell sprout in the event of liquidation as it will all go to Romanov so taking the money today (figuratively) is better than not taking it all, but should they fail to pay in future I'm sure HMRC will issue another WUP and as it looks like they are paying yesterdays bills with tomorrows money it will come to a sticky end sometime soon enough

[Craig_in_Prague]

They are like a dying old limping dog.
They need put down.
Struggling on is just delaying the inevitable.

I am glad I do not pay into the UK tax system. For a company like Hearts and their regular late payments, including some late payments on installments agreed... to then get another extension, on a figure we all keep hearing "isn't that significant"...... is truely astonishing.

Pathetic the whole thing,
and what about our dear SFA/SPL leaders, they will just keep allowing them to keep playing these players that they can't afford... and extend the embargo as maximum penalty.

[greenginger]

HMRC are just acting like any respectable loan shark. Take anything and everything they can get off their " client " with a warning they will be back for the rest and they had better pay or it's a kneecapping ! :thumbsup:

[truehibernian]

I'm not a financial expert but I assume that as Hearts have been able to show that they will be able to pay this bill (at least) then HMRC will be happy to take the money without regard for what may happen in the near future. It's only when the payments aren't made they'll get pissy with them again.

As I understand (though I'm happy to be corrected) HMRC will get brussell sprout in the event of liquidation as it will all go to Romanov so taking the money today (figuratively) is better than not taking it all, but should they fail to pay in future I'm sure HMRC will issue another WUP and as it looks like they are paying yesterdays bills with tomorrows money it will come to a sticky end sometime soon enough

That's the way I see it - not only am I a football fan but a tax payer. Hearts are (apparently) paying what they are due in tax - so fair play. I just hope they pay all the other companies they owe money too as well.

If they then run their club into the ground paying ridiculous wages then its entirely up to them. But I think we are in for a very interesting new year as far as Hearts are concerned.

[Jim44]

Has the SPL or the PFA commented on the players' consenting to defer or reduce their wages this month? Presumably they can make this gesture 'for the good of their employers' but are they in breach of the rules and still liable for further sanctions?

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

Has the SPL or the PFA commented on the players' consenting to defer or reduce their wages this month? Presumably they can make this gesture 'for the good of their employers' but are they in breach of the rules and still liable for further sanctions?

As said on previous occasions Jim they seem to get away with anything they want, must be a big club thing but yes the silence from the SFA is deafening, I really hope they get them by the scruff of the neck and boot them out of the league ASAP, they deserve it for serial cheating.

[Keith_M]

Let's think about this logically. They've been given a stay of execution because they've managed to put together HALF of what they owe to the tax man in historic debt. They've done this by the equivelant of handing over all future income up to Christmas (ticket sales for all home matches gone) and begging to the fans to give generously. They have the share of income from one SC game against Hibs, minus the money for the 3,900 tickets they already have, which does not leave an awful lot

Result: No more income due for November/December. Players wages + PAYE + NI still to pay for November and December. HALF of the 450,000 still due to pay on 3rd Dec. All normal running costs of the club and stadium plus costs of hosting the home games for which they've already taken the money

To pay all that with very little due to come in over the next 7 weeks, they'll need yet another Share Issue plus the fans to yet again put their hands in their pockets for donations, auctions etc. Some how, I just can't see how they can possibly bring in anything approaching the outgoings.

[PatHead]

Things we know now we didn't know last week:

1. Vlad isn't going to bail them out.
2. They couldn't raise 450K to save their club (and diminishing returns says ... :wink: )
3. Vlad isn't going to write off all the debt.
4. The "consortium" consists of a few guys who want Vlad to give them the club including the ground, write off all the debt and agree to cover any liability from existing tax cases.

The annoying thing is we have to play them in the cup while they've still got a squad costing twice as much as ours and will have a siege mentality.

5. They have have not managed to sell out their next game after a week of begging so the majority of supporters can't be that bothered .
6. Vlad's empire is crumbling at a rate of knots with his Banks share price tanking
7. Vlad couldn't be bothered appearing to rally the troops
8 They had a faded Callum Elliot top on display!

Wonder if they had drawn someone like Stenhousemuir away in the cup if HMRC would have allowed them to stay open as one of the major sources of income would not be there.

Seriously though

[bathhibby]

Let's think about this logically. They've been given a stay of execution because they've managed to put together HALF of what they owe to the tax man in historic debt. They've done this by the equivelant of handing over all future income up to Christmas (ticket sales for all home matches gone) and begging to the fans to give generously. They have the share of income from one SC game against Hibs, minus the money for the 3,900 tickets they already have, which does not leave an awful lot

Now, let's think about this. No more income due for November/December. Players wages + PAYE + NI still to pay for November and December. HALF of the 450,000 still due to pay on 3rd Dec. All normal running costs of the club and stadium plus costs of hosting the home games for which they've already taken the money

To pay all that with very little due to come in over the next 7 weeks, they'll need yet another Share Issue plus the fans to yet again put their hands in their pockets for donations, auctions etc. Some how, I just can't see how they can possibly bring in anything approaching the outgoings.

Excellent point - its only a matter of time

[Hibercelona]

Let's think about this logically. They've been given a stay of execution because they've managed to put together HALF of what they owe to the tax man in historic debt. They've done this by the equivelant of handing over all future income up to Christmas (ticket sales for all home matches gone) and begging to the fans to give generously. They have the share of income from one SC game against Hibs, minus the money for the 3,900 tickets they already have, which does not leave an awful lot

Now, let's think about this. No more income due for November/December. Players wages + PAYE + NI still to pay for November and December. HALF of the 450,000 still due to pay on 3rd Dec. All normal running costs of the club and stadium plus costs of hosting the home games for which they've already taken the money

To pay all that with very little due to come in over the next 7 weeks, they'll need yet another Share Issue plus the fans to yet again put their hands in their pockets for donations, auctions etc. Some how, I just can't see how they can possibly bring in anything approaching the outgoings.

Exactly. It's ridiculous to allow this madness to continue.

How do the SFA honestly expect Hearts to get through the next several weeks? Unless of course they're giving them some hidden source of funding, which is why they're keeping so quiet about the issue.

It honestly wouldn't surprise me at this point. :rolleyes:

[Jim44]

There has been clear political intervention to allow the Jambos to wriggle off the hook. Salmond has made reference to the Scottish Government's involvement and there are reports about MP Ian Murray having talks with David Gauke, the Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury and senior officials at HMRC. Foulkes has also loudly publicised this political conivance:

@GeorgeFoulkes: Thanks to Ian Murray MP for speaking with Treasury Ministers and HMRC to get a deal to enable the Hearts debt to be paid in stages

Do UEFA and FIFA not have rules about politics and football? I wonder if they will turn a blind eye on this occasion?

[truehibernian]

There has been clear political intervention to allow the Jambos to wriggle off the hook. Salmond has made reference to the Scottish Government's involvement and there are reports about MP Ian Murray having talks with David Gauke, the Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury and senior officials at HMRC. Foulkes has also loudly publicised this political conivance:

@GeorgeFoulkes: Thanks to Ian Murray MP for speaking with Treasury Ministers and HMRC to get a deal to enable the Hearts debt to be paid in stages

Do UEFA and FIFA not have rules about politics and football? I wonder if they will turn a blind eye on this occasion?

Putting aside the rivalry though Jim, is it not in the interests of the Scottish tax payer that Hearts pay their tax ? I'm happy that all the money they are raising is going directly into the public purse for the greater good - it's not going into Hearts FC.

I'll reiterate, I hope the politicians and journalists are equally zealous in making sure Heart of Midlothian pay all their other outstanding bills to companies and other public bodies - they are after all owned by a very rich man we're constantly reminded - so face up to your financial responsibilities and pay your dues and pay them on time.

I'm of the understanding they are behind in a great many payments to people - so get them paid - if not they have already gained unfair sporting advantage and that needs highlighted.

[alexedwards]

:agree:

They still need to find a large amount of money to keep themselves operating and I imagine the plan is to make it till January so they can sell some players - the problem is they haven't got many decent players to sell and now everyone know's how poor they are so you can imagine the bids for players in January being very low.

The share issue is still a load of nonsense as long as Vlad is the majority shareholder - he is taking them for a serious ride and trying to get some of his lost money back.

The next few months and how the yams are going to be looking as a team in 2013 is going to be very interesting to see.

It's not so much selling their big players as getting them off the wage bill - if they manage to move the big salary players and lower wage bill/tax they should be home and dry. Peanuts will suffice in relation to transfer fees as they will be free from paying salaries. All they need do is survive to Jan as much as that irks everybody.

[ScottB]

There has been clear political intervention to allow the Jambos to wriggle off the hook. Salmond has made reference to the Scottish Government's involvement and there are reports about MP Ian Murray having talks with David Gauke, the Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury and senior officials at HMRC. Foulkes has also loudly publicised this political conivance:

@GeorgeFoulkes: Thanks to Ian Murray MP for speaking with Treasury Ministers and HMRC to get a deal to enable the Hearts debt to be paid in stages

Do UEFA and FIFA not have rules about politics and football? I wonder if they will turn a blind eye on this occasion?

In all seriousness, what has happened is by far the best deal for the tax payer. Hearts haven't 'gotten away' with anything, they've been given what seems like an extra 2 weeks to cough up.

At the least the taxman now has at least £200k out of them, money that he / we would never have gotten had the club been liquidated, it'd have went straight to Vlad's back pocket.

It's HMRC's duty to protect the interests of the taxpayer, Hearts clearly have at least some money there, so they've done the right thing and grabbed it. That's the difference with the Rangers situation, there was no hope of getting any serious percentage of what was owed. I doubt any politicians did anything really, some no mark Labour chump claiming credit for it aside, if Hearts hadn't raised this cash they'd be staring into the abyss, and if they fail to meet the instalment due at the start of December that's where they will end up.

[Scònaldò]

Do UEFA and FIFA not have rules about politics and football? I wonder if they will turn a blind eye on this occasion?

They do, there was this blog written during the whole rangers saga.

http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/political-interference-scottish-football/1134

[truehibernian]

It's not so much selling their big players as getting them off the wage bill - if they manage to move the
big salary players and lower wage bill/tax they should be home and dry. Peanuts will suffice in relation
to transfer fees as they will be free from paying salaries. All they need do is survive to Jan as much as
that irks everybody.

You are making a huge assumption that the players on big salaries will move - they may sit tight, take the money, and wait til summer. We will see just how loyal certain players are during the window. Look at David Obua for example - they were champing to get him off the wage bill but he dug his heels in.

[Keith_M]

It's not so much selling their big players as getting them off the wage bill - if they manage to move the
big salary players and lower wage bill/tax they should be home and dry. Peanuts will suffice in relation
to transfer fees as they will be free from paying salaries. All they need do is survive to Jan as much as
that irks everybody.


Doesn't irk me at all.

Contrary to popular opinion, it's exactly what I want. Hearts scrimp and save till January, lose any remaining high earners, finish at or near the bottom of the league (pumped out of the SC by Hibs, and beaten by us twice in league games). Start next season with bargain basement players, saddled with debt and no hope in hell of ever paying for a new Main stand.

What's not to like? :dunno:

[Part/Time Supporter]

Doesn't irk me at all.

Contrary to popular opinion, it's exactly what I want. Hearts scrimp and save till January, lose any remaining high earners, finish at or near the bottom of the league (pumped out of the SC by Hibs, and beaten by us twice in league games). Start next season with bargain basement players, saddled with debt and no hope in hell of ever paying for a new Main stand.

What's not to like? :dunno:

:agree:

Best of both worlds, Hearts alive but crippled. Hibs still get the additional income from derbies (compared to Falkirk, Partick or whoever) but gain the satisfaction of winning them more often.

[green glory]

Doesn't irk me at all.

Contrary to popular opinion, it's exactly what I want. Hearts scrimp and save till January, lose any remaining high earners, finish at or near the bottom of the league (pumped out of the SC by Hibs, and beaten by us twice in league games). Start next season with bargain basement players, saddled with debt and no hope in hell of ever paying for a new Main stand.

What's not to like? :dunno:

Sounds good to me. A golden age of derbies beckons methinks. Looking forward to the ****bo end regularly emptying by the 60th minute as we pump goal after goal past them.

Just a punchbag for Hibs in the future. Licking my lips thinking about it.

[Moulin Yarns]

Anyone seen Peevemor this morning? :greengrin

I hear he's bringing 24 workmates to Scotland. Coincidence????

[hibsmad]

Sounds good to me. A golden age of derbies beckons methinks. Looking forward to the ****bo end regularly emptying by the 60th minute as we pump goal after goal past them.

Just a punchbag for Hibs in the future. Licking my lips thinking about it.

I like the way you put that!:thumbsup:

Also, in my opinion it's no more than they or we deserve.

[Hibercelona]

Sounds good to me. A golden age of derbies beckons methinks. Looking forward to the ****bo end regularly emptying by the 60th minute as we pump goal after goal past them.

Just a punchbag for Hibs in the future. Licking my lips thinking about it.

It will take far more than financial superiority over them to get the better of them.

If we honestly believe that derbies are just going to be a walk in the park from now on, then we're sadly mistaken.

[YehButNoBut]

From STV site, the interesting part is - A spokesman for the league said: “The wage deferral at Hearts is a contract amendment and therefore does not commit a remuneration default.” - which means no sanctions will be applied this month. :rolleyes:

http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/hearts/200531-majority-of-hearts-first-team-players-agree-to-defer-their-november-wages/

The majority of Hearts first team stars agreed to defer their November wages to help out the club.

Hearts announced on Tuesday night that wages for the month had been agreed to be deferred as the Edinburgh side battles to pay a tax bill of £450,000.

The club has confirmed that the majority of the top team players at Tynecastle have agreed to this deferral, including the senior players.

However it is not clear when the pay will now arrive, or what the details of the deal struck with the players are.

A spokesman for Hearts said: “The majority of the first team, including senior players, agreed to the wage deferral.
“Details of the deferrals remain confidential.”

The voluntary wait to receive their November money does not invoke the same sanctions from the Scottish Premier League as a late wage payment.

Hearts are under a registration embargo until December after paying their staff late twice this season, but the new deferral announced this week will not constitute a “remuneration default” in the eyes of the SPL.

A spokesman for the league said: “The wage deferral at Hearts is a contract amendment and therefore does not commit a remuneration default.”

[Stevie Reid]

From STV site, the interesting part is - A spokesman for the league said: “The wage deferral at Hearts is a contract amendment and therefore does not commit a remuneration default.” - which means no sanctions will be applied this month. :rolleyes:

http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/hearts/200531-majority-of-hearts-first-team-players-agree-to-defer-their-november-wages/

The majority of Hearts first team stars agreed to defer their November wages to help out the club.

Hearts announced on Tuesday night that wages for the month had been agreed to be deferred as the Edinburgh side battles to pay a tax bill of £450,000.

The club has confirmed that the majority of the top team players at Tynecastle have agreed to this deferral, including the senior players.

However it is not clear when the pay will now arrive, or what the details of the deal struck with the players are.

A spokesman for Hearts said: “The majority of the first team, including senior players, agreed to the wage deferral.
“Details of the deferrals remain confidential.”

The voluntary wait to receive their November money does not invoke the same sanctions from the Scottish Premier League as a late wage payment.

Hearts are under a registration embargo until December after paying their staff late twice this season, but the new deferral announced this week will not constitute a “remuneration default” in the eyes of the SPL.

A spokesman for the league said: “The wage deferral at Hearts is a contract amendment and therefore does not commit a remuneration default.”

Just yet more cheating, pure and simple.

[Just_Jimmy]

So lets get this straight?

They are not going to pay players. Again but theyll be allowed to play them.

They will sell said players in january making, albeit a limited amount, from players they havent paid in months.

Thats like me selling my brothers car because i drive it sometimes and keeping the cash!

The whole thing is corrupt as **** and the authorities of our game just let it go.

[CropleyWasGod]

So lets get this straight?

They are not going to pay players. Again but theyll be allowed to play them.

They will sell said players in january making, albeit a limited amount, from players they havent paid in months.

Thats like me selling my brothers car because i drive it sometimes and keeping the cash!

The whole thing is corrupt as **** and the authorities of our game just let it go.

People forget that they still have to pay the players.

This is all just delaying the inevitable.

[Hibercelona]

So lets get this straight?

They are not going to pay players. Again but theyll be allowed to play them.

They will sell said players in january making, albeit a limited amount, from players they havent paid in months.

Thats like me selling my brothers car because i drive it sometimes and keeping the cash!

The whole thing is corrupt as **** and the authorities of our game just let it go.

:agree:

If the situation was reversed an we were in their position, would we get away with it?

Would we ****!

[s.a.m]

This 'contract amendment' business just opens a new loophole for clubs to avoid paying their players on time.

[#FromTheCapital]

Seen a preview of front page of Evening News tonight, some daft slag worth 40m has joined the consortium apparently.

[Steve20]

Simply, they shouldn't be allowed to play any players they can't afford to pay.

[Hibernia Na Eir]

They are like a dying old limping dog.
They need put down.
Struggling on is just delaying the inevitable.

I am glad I do not pay into the UK tax system. For a company like Hearts and their regular late payments, including some late payments on installments agreed... to then get another extension, on a figure we all keep hearing "isn't that significant"...... is truely astonishing.

Pathetic the whole thing,
and what about our dear SFA/SPL leaders, they will just keep allowing them to keep playing these players that they can't afford... and extend the embargo as maximum penalty.

ah,but Craig, you'd be harming a whole "community" if you put them down. Don't you know they're the "very fabric" of the Dalry/Gorgie?!!
Starting to think this Establishment outfit are becoming untouchable.....they've even got the Scottish Government on their side.
poor, smaller firms aren't afforded such repayment plans by the Taxman. why is this then?

[Emerald]

This 'contract amendment' business just opens a new loophole for clubs to avoid paying their players on time.

Agree, the players have no choice. No pay this month and tell everyone it has been agreed or loose your job at Christmas. The bottom line is Hearts can't afford these players but will use them anyway to cheat against every team they come up against. I hope St Mirren put in an official complaint if any of these players take the field against them. The sanctions have been loopholed, cheating wins again.

[Stevie Reid]

Seen a preview of front page of Evening News tonight, some daft slag worth 40m has joined the consortium apparently.

Securing the support of the wealthy former Scottish & Newcastle IT manager is a coup for the consortium. She is not understood to be investing any capital in the bid at this stage, but will lend great business acumen and contacts.

[lapsedhibee]

Securing the support of the wealthy former Scottish & Newcastle IT manager is a coup for the consortium. She is not understood to be investing any capital in the bid at this stage, but will lend great business acumen and contacts.

:faf:

[Hibernia Na Eir]

Agree, the players have no choice. No pay this month and tell everyone it has been agreed or loose your job at Christmas. The bottom line is Hearts can't afford these players but will use them anyway to cheat against every team they come up against. I hope St Mirren put in an official complaint if any of these players take the field against them. The sanctions have been loopholed, cheating wins again.

totally and utterly spot on.

[Stevie Reid]

People forget that they still have to pay the players.

This is all just delaying the inevitable.

Not forgetting that at all CWG, but another month with the wages late may well have led to a points deduction and morale around the club dropping even lower. A technicality appears to have allowed them to avoid that, and it's frustrating - the longer they can put out a strong team, the better for them.

Whichever way you slice it, they're still not paying their players on time, and shouldn't be allowed to play those in question. It's still cheating, it's just that this kind of cheating is approved by the SPL.

[DaveF]

Agree, the players have no choice. No pay this month and tell everyone it has been agreed or loose your job at Christmas. The bottom line is Hearts can't afford these players but will use them anyway to cheat against every team they come up against. I hope St Mirren put in an official complaint if any of these players take the field against them. The sanctions have been loopholed, cheating wins again.

Completely agree. The rest of the SPL clubs should be making strong complaints about this. Every one of them are being stiffed by the cheats again and again.

[PatHead]

Securing the support of the wealthy former Scottish & Newcastle IT manager is a coup for the consortium. She is not understood to be investing any capital in the bid at this stage, but will lend great business acumen and contacts.

On listening to the radio yesterday evening I got the impression that the consortium were not putting money up either. They wanted Vlad to write off the debt and they would pay the tax bill. The money they were using would be a loan which they hoped to recoup at a later date once the mugs, er fans, had added to the pot.

[#FromTheCapital]

On listening to the radio yesterday evening I got the impression that the consortium were not putting money up either. They wanted Vlad to write off the debt and they would pay the tax bill. The money they were using would be a loan which they hoped to recoup at a later date once the mugs, er fans, had added to the pot.


I wonder how much vlad wants for hearts?

[matty_f]

On listening to the radio yesterday evening I got the impression that the consortium were not putting money up either. They wanted Vlad to write off the debt and they would pay the tax bill. The money they were using would be a loan which they hoped to recoup at a later date once the mugs, er fans, had added to the pot.

I think the consortium were miles off what Vlad will accept for the club, and I think he'd rather see it go to the wall than hand it over for a pittance.

The statement that the Yams put out yesterday made it clear that they expect the debt to be cleared in the purchase, or at least taken on, and that UBIG want money for the shares that they traded for equity.

There's no danger anyone's picking up a bargain here.

Anyone seriously wanting to invest in a football team would spend their money a lot more wisely by trying to buy Edinburgh's best football team instead.

[Golden Bear]

Has the SPL or the PFA commented on the players' consenting to defer or reduce their wages this month? Presumably they can make this gesture 'for the good of their employers' but are they in breach of the rules and still liable for further sanctions?



A point which any journalist worth their salt would be jumping on but the only sure thing is that we'll hear absolutely zero.

[Jim44]

You are making a huge assumption that the players on big salaries will move - they may sit tight, take the money, and wait til summer. We will see just how loyal certain players are during the window. Look at David Obua for example - they were champing to get him off the wage bill but he dug his heels in.

Oh the irony .......... These high-earners are going to hang around after January for wages which, by their own agreement, they are unlikely to receive?

[CropleyWasGod]

A point which any journalist worth their salt would be jumping on but the only sure thing is that we'll hear absolutely zero.

It's been asked :greengrin

The response was that it was a "contract amendment" and therefore doesn't count as non-payment.

[Mikey]

Seen a preview of front page of Evening News tonight, some daft slag worth 40m has joined the consortium apparently.

£40m aint enough!!

[StevieC]

Just a punchbag for Hibs in the future.

It's not going to be easy getting a derby game in when they are in the lower divisions. :rolleyes:

[Sprouleflyer]

£40m aint enough!!

Being worth £40M and having £40M are two entirely different things.

[hibIBZ]

am i right in saying that several of their big earners are out of contract in the summer? with hearts being desperate for cash i dont see them being able to demand much in transfer fees in january

[#FromTheCapital]

Hearts highest earners won't be in a rush to leave in January, no other club is going to pay them a fraction of what they earn at the moment because of one simple reason - they're *****!
Unless its been explained to them that they're going to have to leave which is surely a breach of contract. Either way January should be interesting and I don't think it will be the lifeline that they desperately need.

[CropleyWasGod]

am i right in saying that several of their big earners are out of contract in the summer? with hearts being desperate for cash i dont see them being able to demand much in transfer fees in january

It's not so much about the transfer fees, ir's more about getting the wage bill down.

[KeithTheHibby]

Securing the support of the wealthy former Scottish & Newcastle IT manager is a coup for the consortium. She is not understood to be investing any capital in the bid at this stage, but will lend great business acumen and contacts.


Superb, they need cash but this high flier is only on board in an advisory capacity!

I know hee haw about business but one look at that shower tells me they need money, not advice!

[Golden Bear]

It's been asked :greengrin

The response was that it was a "contract amendment" and therefore doesn't count as non-payment.

That's the way to go!

Keep on "amending contracts" and deferring payments and nothing can ever be classified as a non-payment.

Genius.

:wink:

[CropleyWasGod]

That's the way to go!

Keep on "amending contracts" and deferring payments and nothing can ever be classified as a non-payment.

Genius.

:wink:

It can't go on, though. The SPFA will be involved, I'm sure, if it's suggested again in December.

[Jim44]

It's been asked :greengrin

The response was that it was a "contract amendment" and therefore doesn't count as non-payment.

This heartwarming loyalty is misguided and wrong.
It's the equivalent of an incestuously raped victim refusing to press charges against her attacker because she has family attachments to him. The authorities would not take the same point of view of the matter and would take appropriate action. The fact that the players have stupidly agreed to go along with the charade does not hide the fact that their employer has acted illegally and immorally. ' Contract ammendment', my @rse.

[clerriehibs]

It can't go on, though. The SPFA will be involved, I'm sure, if it's suggested again in December.

It mskes the spl rule worthless ... Wr will only ever have contract amendments rather than late wages in future.

We shouldn't play the cup game. It's as explicit a cheat as you can get.

[jgl07]

How about a competition to see how many pages on this thread before Hearts are liquidated?

It was page 383 of the Rangers in Administration thread for this to be confirmed!

[Ross4356]

I was driving through the Cowgate last night (so my signal was bad) when the guy fronting the Hearts consortium was on the BBC Scotland, did I hear right that the land for the PBS is worth only 5m? Signal was poor

[Spike Mandela]

That's the way to go!

Keep on "amending contracts" and deferring payments and nothing can ever be classified as a non-payment.

Genius.

:wink:

Whilst the SPL may be toothless enough to not not use any new sanction on Hearts surely they will at leat extend the transfer embargo for a couple of months or more for further delay in wages payment, deferred or not.

Surely they wouldn't leave themselves open to removing embargo in December and watching Hearts brazenly signing players in January (even though they can't afford to).............or could they?

[Part/Time Supporter]

It mskes the spl rule worthless ... Wr will only ever have contract amendments rather than late wages in future.

We shouldn't play the cup game. It's as explicit a cheat as you can get.

You can only have a contract amendment if both parties agree.

[southsider]

If the yams pay their vat & ni/paye quatrerly they may be in more trouble has been thought. HMRC give companies 30 days then start issuing fines etc then as a last resort a WUP. Therefore (and i dont know the due dates), it could be that the late payments are for May/June/July. This would mean that the NEXT quarter August/sept/october would be due 30th November......or in 16 days and all the present and future capital has been used. Just a thought.

[Jim44]

It mskes the spl rule worthless ... Wr will only ever have contract amendments rather than late wages in future.

We shouldn't play the cup game. It's as explicit a cheat as you can get.

The SPL has seriously dug itself into a hole on with this.

[Bostonhibby]

Securing the support of the wealthy former Scottish & Newcastle IT manager is a coup for the consortium. She is not understood to be investing any capital in the bid at this stage, but will lend great business acumen and contacts.

Thats that pesky lightbulb sorted for good now then. Wonder if she is any good at plumbing or asbestos disposal.

[Future17]

I was driving through the Cowgate last night (so my signal was bad) when the guy fronting the Hearts consortium was on the BBC Scotland, did I hear right that the land for the PBS is worth only 5m? Signal was poor

Nah, you misheard. He was actually quoting the cost of five pieces of millionaire shortbread at the bake sale.

[JimBHibees]

Doesn't irk me at all.

Contrary to popular opinion, it's exactly what I want. Hearts scrimp and save till January, lose any remaining high earners, finish at or near the bottom of the league (pumped out of the SC by Hibs, and beaten by us twice in league games). Start next season with bargain basement players, saddled with debt and no hope in hell of ever paying for a new Main stand.

What's not to like? :dunno:

Completely agree wish the cup tie was in January now instead of 3 weeks as they will have a stronger squad at that stage

[Newry Hibs]

Completely agree wish the cup tie was in January now instead of 3 weeks as they will have a stronger squad at that stage

So .... what if by some fluke we don't win first time around? A draw - will they be around for any replay? A defeat, will they exist for the next round - I presume their opponents would get a bye, rather than us reinstated?

[PatHead]

Completely agree wish the cup tie was in January now instead of 3 weeks as they will have a stronger squad at that stage

I really wish Hibs supporters (not having a go at you, but in general) would stop bricking it about Hearts having their best players available for the match. There are very few, if any, of their best players that would get anywhere near our first team. Their manager is a fud and tactically inept.

Both teams are in a similar situation to going into the cup final except the roles are reversed. Hibs are in the strong position (much stronger than they were at the time), Hearts are the team on a bad run fighting relegation. We will win and need to start believing that. It could actually be as big a humiliation as we got in the Cup final. Lets just enjoy them squirming and concentrate on ourselves.

[JimBHibees]

So .... what if by some fluke we don't win first time around? A draw - will they be around for any replay? A defeat, will they exist for the next round - I presume their opponents would get a bye, rather than us reinstated?

I would rather that we went through rather than some other team if they default. The way it is going is that they are likely to have a stronger squad in 3 weeks rather than in January where they may need to offload some of their better players giving us a better chance.

[cocopops1875]

Nah, you misheard. He was actually quoting the cost of five pieces of millionaire shortbread at the bake sale.

And Clum's faded shirt

[JimBHibees]

I really wish Hibs supporters (not having a go at you, but in general) would stop bricking it about Hearts having their best players available for the match. There are very few, if any, of their best players that would get anywhere near our first team. Their manager is a fud and tactically inept.

Both teams are in a similar situation to going into the cup final except the roles are reversed. Hibs are in the strong position (much stronger than they were at the time), Hearts are the team on a bad run fighting relegation. We will win and need to start believing that. It could actually be as big a humiliation as we got in the Cup final. Lets just enjoy them squirming and concentrate on ourselves.

Not bricking it in the slightest however want Hibs to have the best chance possible to win. As it stands there will be next to nothing in the game as poor as their league form has been they are more than capable or playing well in a particular one off game. A stronger squad to chose from means they have a better chance than they probably should have due to their financial mess.

[Hibby Kay-Yay]

Completely agree. The rest of the SPL clubs should be making strong complaints about this. Every one of them are being stiffed by the cheats again and again.

A team that is currently 10th in the league. It's unlikely they will leave as they can sign pre-contracts. If Hearts want rid they need to terminate contracts which I doubt they can afford, unless players are willing to accept faded shirts and cigar boxes?

What I think will happen is more deferred payments in December with an end game in the new year.

[HibeeMG]

I really wish Hibs supporters (not having a go at you, but in general) would stop bricking it about Hearts having their best players available for the match. There are very few, if any, of their best players that would get anywhere near our first team. Their manager is a fud and tactically inept.

Both teams are in a similar situation to going into the cup final except the roles are reversed. Hibs are in the strong position (much stronger than they were at the time), Hearts are the team on a bad run fighting relegation. We will win and need to start believing that. It could actually be as big a humiliation as we got in the Cup final. Lets just enjoy them squirming and concentrate on ourselves.

:agree:

I know form doesn't count for much in derbies but having watched their game at Inverness and then ours against Dundee Utd, we were light years ahead.

If they bring that same midfield then we'll absolutely pump them.

[Gatecrasher]

Reading some comments on the scotsman articles the jambos think they are in the clear, I which is good because they will be back to square 1 in a couple of weeks.

Anyone know when the wages are deferred to?

[Spike Mandela]

I was driving through the Cowgate last night (so my signal was bad) when the guy fronting the Hearts consortium was on the BBC Scotland, did I hear right that the land for the PBS is worth only 5m? Signal was poor

It's the accountancy tactic of Duff and Phelps and Charles Green. When you are buying it it's only worth £5m but once you've bought it it's worth £140 m.

The Hearts consortium puts forward a plausible sounding individual who states, without any embarrassment, that Vlad HAS to sell Hearts to them but he must retain the £20m+ debt and no doubt hand over the stadium.

What's Lithuanian for "Aye awright then!"