Summer 2022-23 transfer thread

[Gordy M]

If that was the case why did they mention the appearance clause at all? And not just that Hibs triggered a clause which meant they could sign him.


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Ive no idea, maybe to be transparent about the actual clause? Triggered an option to buy? How is that you have to buy him? Thats what im not understanding.

[G15 Hibs]

I’ve got to say if I was Rocky I’d be less than enamoured with that statement of me signing a 3 year deal.

"He has obvious strengths and it'll be interesting to see how quickly he can adapt to a new playing style."

"Interesting". Not exactly a ringing endorsement from the manager. Certainly a suggestion that's he's been lumbered with a player who doesn't fit into how he wants the team to play.

[bingo70]

I was hoping we would be looking to bring in better in defence tbh.

With McGinn extending and now Rocky signing permanently there doesn't seem a huge scope for too much more movement there. If we sell Porteous any replacement is only likely to be a downgrade.

I never saw what some saw in Rocky when he 1st arrived and as time went on he didn't do much to change my opinion. I suppose he is raw so there may be scope for improvement but he was a guy who spent much of the latter part of his spell here last season warming the bench. If we are to improve next season I can't see that changing much.

Our defence was good last season.

It was going forward and midfield we had our issues.

[hibbyfraelibby]

Well you don’t announce he’s away and then 3 days later say we’ve signed him unless someone really ****ed up.

Being pedantic maybe but after re-reading the news item the club didn't actually announce his departure they " expressed their gratitute" to the three loan players but made no direct reference to their not returning.

[Brightside]

Why? His loan ended, he was away but we had triggered an option to buy if we wanted. They spoke to LJ and decided to trigger that option? That seems to me what happened?

In that case we wouldn’t have mentioned him in the good bye press release. Same if we suddenly announce James Scott.

[Pretty Boy]

Keepers:
Marshall, Macey (For Now), Dabrowski

Centre Backs:
Hanlon, Porteous, Bushiri, McGregor, Delfierre

Full Backs/Wing Backs (L):
Doig, Stevenson, Mitchell

Full Backs/Wing Backs (R):
Cadden, Clarke, McGinn

Centre-Mids:
Newell, Doyle-Hayes, Magennis, Campbell, Henderson, Kenneh, Tait

Wide Players:
Mackay, Hauge (Mitchell & Cadden could be included here)

Forwards:
Nisbet, Doidge, Melkerson, Bojang

That is frightening.

We are 5 or 6 short and of that number at least 2 or 3 need to be immediate starters.

[Brightside]

Being pedantic maybe but after re-reading the news item the club didn't actually announce his departure they " expressed their gratitute" to the three loan players but made no direct reference to their not returning.

It was in the good bye press release. Everyone mentioned was leaving the club. There is no spin to cover up what looks like a clear mistake.

[bingo70]

That is frightening.

We are 5 or 6 short and of that number at least 2 or 3 need to be immediate starters.

Why is it frightening?

Season doesn’t start for ages.

[sorrow sorrow]

I'm more concerned about the Rocky signing than the Gambian laddie.

100% this

[Wilson]

"He has obvious strengths and it'll be interesting to see how quickly he can adapt to a new playing style."

"Interesting". Not exactly a ringing endorsement from the manager. Certainly a suggestion that's he's been lumbered with a player who doesn't fit into how he wants the team to play.

Or lumbered into making a statement about a player he hasn't yet had the chance to work with?

Too much reading between the lines in your post.

[The Captain....]

That is frightening.

We are 5 or 6 short and of that number at least 2 or 3 need to be immediate starters.Agreed, lots and lots of work to do. I have real concerns the current team aren't up to bringing in the right players.

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[hibbyfraelibby]

"He has obvious strengths and it'll be interesting to see how quickly he can adapt to a new playing style."

"Interesting". Not exactly a ringing endorsement from the manager. Certainly a suggestion that's he's been lumbered with a player who doesn't fit into how he wants the team to play.

I would imagine LJ will be "interested" to see how everyone adapts to the new playing style...

[GreenGray]

Ive no idea, maybe to be transparent about the actual clause? Triggered an option to buy? How is that you have to buy him? Thats what im not understanding.

I think it’s quite common in loan deals now where if a player plays a certain number of games the club must sign him. I think it’s clear that’s happened here given we announced he was leaving last week.


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[Brown Hibs]

As an aside that must be one of the least enthusiastic signing announcements ever.

if you could convert a sigh into written format it would be right at home in those 4 paragrpahs.

Cheer up eh.

[SlickShoes]

Sounds like you’re making you’re own dot net fact by saying that is the most likely situation?


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Based on the history of how football contracts work, it's more likely than us being legally forced to buy him and give him a 3 year deal.

[chippy]

Think they had always done the deal for Rocky but held back announcing until after the early bird deadline and the previous 3 signings

[Gordy M]

In that case we wouldn’t have mentioned him in the good bye press release. Same if we suddenly announce James Scott.

Why? He left after his loan deal? We would have then triggered the OPTION, i guess we would still have to speak to his agent the player Norwich etc to tie everything up, and for LJ to sanction it. That takes time id imagine.

[SlickShoes]

Keepers:
Marshall, Macey (For Now), Dabrowski

Centre Backs:
Hanlon, Porteous, Bushiri, McGregor, Delfierre

Full Backs/Wing Backs (L):
Doig, Stevenson, Mitchell

Full Backs/Wing Backs (R):
Cadden, Clarke, McGinn

Centre-Mids:
Newell, Doyle-Hayes, Magennis, Campbell, Henderson, Kenneh, Tait

Wide Players:
Mackay, Hauge (Mitchell & Cadden could be included here)

Forwards:
Nisbet, Doidge, Melkerson, Bojang

Delferierre isn't a centre back

[GreenGray]

Based on the history of how football contracts work, it's more likely than us being legally forced to buy him and give him a 3 year deal.

These sort of appearance clauses aren’t rare?


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[MrRobot]

They clearly didn’t know. And LJ isn’t going to change his mind in 3 days. It’s not like he saw him play in those 3 days? It’s a screw up. No other way to explain it.

TBF, the article actually isn’t very clear about the loan players. It says they wish to thank them for their contribution. The rest of the article is about thanking contracted players for their services over the last couple seasons.

i’m not overly impressed with us signing him permanently but i think we are looking too much into wording by hibs to find fault. i find it highly unlikely we would basically admit to a mistake in our confirmation statement.

[TelaStella]

He was never even Maloney’s player to begin with which was concerning in itself. This just opens up so much more to be concerned about. The signing of a 3 year contract for a player of his quality and secondly the nature of the deal going through in the first place in regards to this apparent clause.

Even Gordon Jnr’s quote about ‘ a lot of room for improvement’ says enough to me, it’s everything not to put in a statement around a new signing. We’re not a coaching school.

Wtf must Johnson be thinking of this?


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[SHODAN]

It's the 9th of June. Calm the **** down.

[Gordy M]

I think it’s quite common in loan deals now where if a player plays a certain number of games the club must sign him. I think it’s clear that’s happened here given we announced he was leaving last week.


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Il be honest, ive never heard of a club being FORCED to biy a player after a loan deal?

[tonyrougier123]

Anyone excited for new season yet?
I’m surprised by the Bushiri deal tbh,thought he started well enough but we should’ve been looking elsewhere.
As for the Gambian boy let’s see,but I’m definitely a little worried right now.
What’s with all the loan deals as well,scared to commit to signing players hibs?
It gets worse honestly.

[G15 Hibs]

Or lumbered into making a statement about a player he hasn't yet had the chance to work with?

Too much reading between the lines in your post.

Maybe. I've got a feeling there are a lot of lines to be read between in this press release though.

[Pretty Boy]

Our defence was good last season.

It was going forward and midfield we had our issues.

It was good over the piece but it had minimal strength in depth.

We shipped 3 to Livingston with a back 3 of Porteous, McGinn and Stevenson, 3 to Hearts with Rocky, Hanlon and Doig, 3 to Aberdeen with Cadden, Rocky, Portoeus and Doig, 3 to Dundee Utd with Cadde, Hanlon, Wood and Doig and 3 to Dundee with McGinn, Rocky, Porteous and Doig.

We pisssed about last year not getting in depth and ended up with Nathan Wood. Signing Rocky doesn't address that lack of strength in depth this year either. We need another, 2 more if Porteous goes.

[heid the baw]

Half a season trying to play some half-baked ponderous, slow build up "possession" football under Maloney. He seemed to pick up a fair few early bookings and his form was not always great. Having said that he had a very decent game up against Regan Charles Cook at ER.
I am interested to see what a full pre season under a new manager playing a different style might bring out of him. He's a young player with potential!

[flash]

Il be honest, ive never heard of a club being FORCED to biy a player after a loan deal?

That's because it doesn't happen.

[LaMotta]

I wouldn't have signed him but he's not as bad as some are suggesting.
Definitely be improvement in him given his age and lack of experience.

:agree: Whilst he wasn't great, he didn't do too much wrong either (red card at dens apart). Struggling to understand some of the OTT criticism.

But a 3 year deal does seem a bit radge.

[Hibernian Verse]

9th of June.

[Stevie Reid]

Have to say that on the surface I’m disappointed with Bushiri signing. That’s a decent portion of our transfer budget used up on a player who was really unimpressive during his loan spell.

Perhaps clutching at straws, but if LJ is planning on playing a high line, maybe he feels his pace will be important?

Liked the signing of the young Gambian lad, but this does feel disappointing. Have to agree that the wording of the announcement is curious as well.

[neil7908]

I don't see what the issue is with the new striker. If we don't get any more additions up top then yeah, I'll be worried. But we have a chance to see how a promising young player does over a year, risk free.

If he's amazing then we have a deal agreed to sign him. If he's rubbish, he goes back to his parent club having only cost us a year of (presumably moderate) wages.

[hibbyfraelibby]

It was in the good bye press release. Everyone mentioned was leaving the club. There is no spin to cover up what looks like a clear mistake.

Loans had come to an end but that does not mean they were all leaving. They were still other club's players but negocuations with them and their parent clubs was not discounted. It could actually be seen as a cute piece of dealing implying less interest to get a better price?

[Ronniekirk]

We previously released a statement thanking the loan players for thier service and the only player we were quoted as considering keeping was Jasper
When New manager came in it was clear he was t wanted iether
To now out the blue sign Rocky is bizarre to say the least Something doesn’t add up
Marshal apart none of our signings are going to shift more season tickets or improve us in the short term Potential is fine but it it’s not guaranteed

[GreenGray]

That's because it doesn't happen.

So why have hibs basically just said it’s happened in their statement?

Why else would they mention appearances?


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[ahibby]

How do we go from Marshall to Rocky? I'd be worried if we sell Porteous and Rocky is his replacement.

Lost count how many times he missed timed a Jump for the ball but at least he kicked the ball into the water.

Will support Hibs and Rock as usual next season but this one don't get me excited.

I heard fans say they don't rate him. I might be alone then because I think there could be a player in there. There are one or two things to be sorted out with his game but I think the coaching staff will be on that. If Porto goes then I think we need another CB to keep Rocky on his toes while he develops to LJs new style.

The Gambian lad turns 21 a week on Sunday, but his contract won't start until 1st of July. Our team reports back on the 18th of June to start pre season. Will he be able to train with us from then or does insurance not permit for that, in case of injuries etc when he isn't contracted?

[Pretty Boy]

Why is it frightening?

Season doesn’t start for ages.

30 days. I'm assuming we are interested in the League Cup after all. I'd suggest hitting the ground running in that competition is of the utmost importance this year.

And it's frightening because it highlights the scale of the task we are facing in terms of recruitment. We are half a team short of being candidates for top 4.

[B.H.F.C]

It's the 9th of June. Calm the **** down.

We obviously have time to sign players.

But we also have a number of players on long term contracts (including the one signed today) who were crap for us last season. I’m more worried about what we do have than what we don’t have at the moment.

[04Sauzee]

Anyone excited for new season yet?
I’m surprised by the Bushiri deal tbh,thought he started well enough but we should’ve been looking elsewhere.
As for the Gambian boy let’s see,but I’m definitely a little worried right now.
What’s with all the loan deals as well,scared to commit to signing players hibs?
It gets worse honestly.

Been looking forward to the news season for a few weeks now.

Season tickets purchased, so yeah I am.

[Gordy M]

So why have hibs basically just said it’s happened in their statement?

Why else would they mention appearances?


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Because the appearances triggered an option for us to buy him? I

[Saint Hibee]

Just waiting for the James Scott announcement later today


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Now you've really given me the fear.

[Fergus52]

It was good over the piece but it had minimal strength in depth.

We shipped 3 to Livingston with a back 3 of Porteous, McGinn and Stevenson, 3 to Hearts with Rocky, Hanlon and Doig, 3 to Aberdeen with Cadden, Rocky, Portoeus and Doig, 3 to Dundee Utd with Cadde, Hanlon, Wood and Doig and 3 to Dundee with McGinn, Rocky, Porteous and Doig.

We pisssed about last year not getting in depth and ended up with Nathan Wood. Signing Rocky doesn't address that lack of strength in depth this year either. We need another, 2 more if Porteous goes.

We had the third best defense in the league on goals conceded, that's pretty good going considering we conceded three in all those games you mention.

[neil7908]

Rocky

WTF!

Skipped through all the posts but only just seen the chat is about Rocky. And yeah, not thrilled with that one.

Being positive I'd say he's raw and young enough to still come good. But his form last season did not scream someone you'd be desperate to see back.

[Big_Franck]

That's because it doesn't happen.

It does. Loan with obligation to buy is fairly common now.

[Wilson]

Anyone excited for new season yet?
I’m surprised by the Bushiri deal tbh,thought he started well enough but we should’ve been looking elsewhere.
As for the Gambian boy let’s see,but I’m definitely a little worried right now.
What’s with all the loan deals as well,scared to commit to signing players hibs?
It gets worse honestly.

I wouldn't worry about the loan signings. Apparently we're forced to sign the player at the end of the deal in any case.

[neil7908]

It does. Loan with obligation to buy is fairly common now.

Yup. Dejan Kulusevski to Spurs was a loan but obligation to buy if certain conditions were met. Confirmed here:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/football/2022/mar/22/spurs-deal-with-juventus-to-buy-dejan-kulusevski-revealed

[Paulie Walnuts]

We obviously have time to sign players.

But we also have a number of players on long term contracts (including the one signed today) who were crap for us last season. I’m more worried about what we do have than what we don’t have at the moment.

:agree:

We’ve got considerable numbers in the squad now with a considerable lack of quality. That’s a concern. We won’t just keep adding players until the quality is where it needs to be.

[bingo70]

30 days. I'm assuming we are interested in the League Cup after all. I'd suggest hitting the ground running in that competition is of the utmost importance this year.

And it's frightening because it highlights the scale of the task we are facing in terms of recruitment. We are half a team short of being candidates for top 4.

30 days is a long time in the transfer window.

We could literally sign 2 players this afternoon and things would be looking brighter again.

Sorry PB, you’re far too premature with your panic IMO.

[Willis1875]

Anyone excited for new season yet?
I’m surprised by the Bushiri deal tbh,thought he started well enough but we should’ve been looking elsewhere.
As for the Gambian boy let’s see,but I’m definitely a little worried right now.
What’s with all the loan deals as well,scared to commit to signing players hibs?
It gets worse honestly.
Don’t we only have Clarke and Bojang on loan?

[ahibby]

We had the third best defense in the league on goals conceded, that's pretty good going considering we conceded three in all those games you mention.

Take our last game against St J, we had four at the back and another two defenders in midfield (Stevenson and Clark), hardly surprising we kept a clean sheet, but still had enough to score 4 up front and Stevenson and Clark contributed to attack big time. Best of both worlds, plenty defenders on the park and plenty goals.

[Gordy M]

It does. Loan with obligation to buy is fairly common now.

Ive never seen or heard of it, what i have seen is clubs saying will sign a player next year but until then he is on loan, like Ewan Henderson. Ive never heard of of a player paying 20 games for example and then you have to buy that player? Maybe ive just missed it.

[SlickShoes]

Don’t we only have Clarke and Bojang on loan?

Yes, 2 is too many, but if another team does well this season with a lot of loans you can bet there will be a thread here asking why we didnt get more loans in.

[SHODAN]

Didn't we hold off playing Simon Brown for months because it would trigger a clause in his contract?

[Saint Hibee]

Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but I'm getting a bit worried about Ian Gordon's obsession with "adding value" as if the only relevant criteria in our signings is potential sell on fee. I get that we need/hope to make money off players, but that shouldn't be an end in itself.

[G15 Hibs]

We obviously have time to sign players.

But we also have a number of players on long term contracts (including the one signed today) who were crap for us last season. I’m more worried about what we do have than what we don’t have at the moment.

This is a key point. Come the new season we're going to have a lot of the squad who played their part in a pretty disappointing 2021/22 still at the club. Because of their contracts it'll be difficult to move them on. So what we should be looking for, and hopefully are, are guys who will come in and immediately be first team starters, to be, essentially, amongst the best players at the club, who will bring up the performances of those who were disappointing last season but maybe have something to offer if they have better players around them. So far, that's not the type of player we've been signing and financially there has to be a limit to the number of players we can have in the squad. The signs at the moment are that we're filling up the squad with a bunch of guys with potential but we need these key signings.

[ElginHibbie]

Yes, 2 is too many, but if another team does well this season with a lot of loans you can bet there will be a thread here asking why we didnt get more loans in.

Like Hearts who finished 3rd, with 4 prominent players being loans?

[Fergus52]

30 days. I'm assuming we are interested in the League Cup after all. I'd suggest hitting the ground running in that competition is of the utmost importance this year.

And it's frightening because it highlights the scale of the task we are facing in terms of recruitment. We are half a team short of being candidates for top 4.

I'd say that's a big stretch - sign a couple of quality wingers/attacking midfielders and a starting CB and we'll have a stronger squad than Motherwell or Dundee Utd.

We don't need to sign half a team to be competing for European places next year.

[Booked4Being-Ugly]

Looks like we have 26 players in the 1st team squad now.

I think we’ll sign another couple of players and that’s it, unless we put a few out on loan again, or sell anyone.

[Unseen work]

I’ve said quite a few times I don’t think Rocky was ever expected to play as many games as he did. No one would have expected Porteous to get suspended for as many games as he did, Hanlon to get injured and McGinn to get injured.

I think he’s very raw but has some attributes like pace and stregnth which Johnson might like.

Needs to improve on quite a few things but playing for us last season was his first consistent run in years.

The weirdest thing about the Rocky signing for me was that Maloney knew of him and thought he was good on the ball which I’ve not see at all. Maybe being centre of a back 2 will suit him more than right of a back 3.

I’d imagine this is why we rarely saw Jasper play at the end so the transfer wasn’t automatically triggered.

Anyway, the new signing this afternoon will cheer everyone up.

[Heisenberg]

Looks like we have 26 players in the 1st team squad now.

I think we’ll sign another couple of players and that’s it, unless we put a few out on loan again, or sell anyone.

A load need to leave. The squad is miles away from being good enough.

[Pretty Boy]

Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but I'm getting a bit worried about Ian Gordon's obsession with "adding value" as if the only relevant criteria in our signings is potential sell on fee. I get that we need/hope to make money off players, but that shouldn't be an end in itself.

In itself I have no issue with it.

11 players on the park all attracting suitors from elsewhere would mean we were having a hell of a season.

The problem is of the players we have signed in recent windows none of them look likely to reach a point where they are going to attract a 6 or 7 figure fee. The flagship signing from last summer was allowed/had to be allowed to walk away after a few weeks (for a myriad of reasons I know). Looking at our current squad with the exception of Doig and Porteous I don't see much sell on value at all (accepting the 2 signings from Leeds and Rainbow respectively are unknown quantities).

[04Sauzee]

I’ve said quite a few times I don’t think Rocky was ever expected to play as many games as he did. No one would have expected Porteous to get suspended for as many games as he did, Hanlon to get injured and McGinn to get injured.

I think he’s very raw but has some attributes like pace and stregnth which Johnson might like.

Needs to improve on quite a few things but playing for us last season was his first consistent run in years.

I’d imagine this is why we rarely saw Jasper play at the end so the transfer wasn’t automatically triggered.

Anyway, the new signing this afternoon will cheer everyone up.

I'm sure the afternoon signings was very tongue in cheek 😁

I'm also convinced Rocky was playing with some kind of injury last season, he was heavily strapped in a few games. Not sure he should have played but he did. I'm sure a fully fit Rocky with a decent pre-season behind him and LJ coaching him will be an asset.

[04Sauzee]

Looks like we have 26 players in the 1st team squad now.

I think we’ll sign another couple of players and that’s it, unless we put a few out on loan again, or sell anyone.

Are you including Hauge and Delferriere? I'm sure they were around the 1st team due to injuries, I always thought they were brought in for the development u23 squad?

[MrRobot]

We previously released a statement thanking the loan players for thier service and the only player we were quoted as considering keeping was Jasper
When New manager came in it was clear he was t wanted iether
To now out the blue sign Rocky is bizarre to say the least Something doesn’t add up
Marshal apart none of our signings are going to shift more season tickets or improve us in the short term Potential is fine but it it’s not guaranteed

I don’t believe that hibs at any point made any statements to be quoted on regarding the intention to keep loan players or not :dunno:

[hibbyfraelibby]

Anyway, the new signing this afternoon will cheer everyone up.

🤫🤫🤫🤫🤫🤫🤫 or Aberdeen will nip in and sign him

[number9dream]

I thought Rocky looked okay in his first couple of games after such a long time out with injuries, but he then got progressively worse.
Maybe with a pre-season and a 'keep it simple' message, he can improve, but he certainly wouldn't be a first pick with everyone fit and we need better than we've got.

According to a mate down under, we're close to a deal for an Aussie, 21-year-old who is a right-back, which appears to be an area we have well covered at the moment. Another 'emerging talent'...

[Unseen work]

I'm sure the afternoon signings was very tongue in cheek 😁

I'm also convinced Rocky was playing with some kind of injury last season, he was heavily strapped in a few games. Not sure he should have played but he did. I'm sure a fully fit Rocky with a decent pre-season behind him and LJ coaching him will be an asset.

I’d agree re his injury. Having not playing in a year or two and then going into playing 2-3 times a week in a struggling team with the back three changing every other game was also going to be challenging too.

[Hibees1973]

Wow...extraordinary.

After Bushiri played a few games for us and was exposed due to his lack of discipline and ability I cannot recall anyone on here providing a positive spin on his performances. But now a few posters are. How come.

Banjo and Bushiri, WTF is going on.

Think I'll give hibs.net a body swerve for a few weeks as most of my posts recently have been negative about Hibs and probably a bit too honest. Sure some of you will be pleased about that.

[04Sauzee]

I thought Rocky looked okay in his first couple of games after such a long time out with injuries, but he then got progressively worse.
Maybe with a pre-season and a 'keep it simple' message, he can improve, but he certainly wouldn't be a first pick with everyone fit and we need better than we've got.

According to a mate down under, we're close to a deal for an Aussie, 21-year-old who is a right-back, which appears to be an area we have well covered at the moment. Another 'emerging talent'...

I don't suppose he could give you a name of the player or which team he's with 😁
Wonder if he plays first team football currently.

[Unseen work]

I thought Rocky looked okay in his first couple of games after such a long time out with injuries, but he then got progressively worse.
Maybe with a pre-season and a 'keep it simple' message, he can improve, but he certainly wouldn't be a first pick with everyone fit and we need better than we've got.

According to a mate down under, we're close to a deal for an Aussie, 21-year-old who is a right-back, which appears to be an area we have well covered at the moment. Another 'emerging talent'...

That would make zero sense.

Which makes me think it’s happening.

[Col2]

Looks like we have 26 players in the 1st team squad now.

I think we’ll sign another couple of players and that’s it, unless we put a few out on loan again, or sell anyone.

I read we are are targeting 6 new players. I think this was from LJ podcast thing but I might be wrong. That’s us at 4. So assuming Porto goes then it’s another CH and a striker? No attacking midfielder or winger. Hopefully we have a lot more movement to come as your right we are high in numbers, just not so much in quality. Macey must be a departure.

[WeeRussell]

Wow...extraordinary.

After Bushiri played a few games for us and was exposed due to his lack of discipline and ability I cannot recall anyone on here providing a positive spin on his performances. But now a few posters are. How come.

Banjo and Bushiri, WTF is going on.

Think I'll give hibs.net a body swerve for a few weeks as most of my posts recently have been negative about Hibs and probably a bit too honest. Sure some of you will be pleased about that.

Enjoy your few weeks off.

[Col2]

Wow...extraordinary.

After Bushiri played a few games for us and was exposed due to his lack of discipline and ability I cannot recall anyone on here providing a positive spin on his performances. But now a few posters are. How come.

Banjo and Bushiri, WTF is going on.

Think I'll give hibs.net a body swerve for a few weeks as most of my posts recently have been negative about Hibs and probably a bit too honest. Sure some of you will be pleased about that.

Nobody is pleased about being negative. It’s a fans forum. We are all 100% Hibs and want nothing but success for the club.

[Heisenberg]

McGinn not wanted by LJ.

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/8987956/paul-mcginn-hibs-exit-contract-lee-johnson/

[Not In The Know]

From the same posters every time

how anyone can turn signing this guy at this moment in time into a negative is mind boggling.

[Paulie Walnuts]

McGinn not wanted by LJ.

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/8987956/paul-mcginn-hibs-exit-contract-lee-johnson/

:faf:

If this is true then you have to laugh really.

What a ****ing mess.

[Col2]

McGinn not wanted by LJ.

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/8987956/paul-mcginn-hibs-exit-contract-lee-johnson/

Wow. Does anyone know if his extension was automatic or needed player/club to agree? Even if no choice by club surely McGinn would know if he was welcome or not?

[Wilson]

Wow...extraordinary.

After Bushiri played a few games for us and was exposed due to his lack of discipline and ability I cannot recall anyone on here providing a positive spin on his performances. But now a few posters are. How come.

Banjo and Bushiri, WTF is going on.

Think I'll give hibs.net a body swerve for a few weeks as most of my posts recently have been negative about Hibs and probably a bit too honest. Sure some of you will be pleased about that.

Nobody is putting a positive spin on his performances. There was little positive but he wasn't alone in that. The positive spin is on signing a 22 year old with a decent number of games under his belt and scope to improve. That is the difference.

Players with a good track record for us struggled during Maloney's time. They get a pass because they've got credit in the bank. I'd give Rocky that same chance under a new manager.

[ahibby]

Don’t we only have Clarke and Bojang on loan?

Signs are that Hibs are taking the requisite for players to have development value (whatever that means), all the way. All those signings and loanees are young inexperienced (relatively, but Marshall the exception). We know from decades of watching the game that breeds inconsistency, isn't conducive to much success in the league or cups and so I am hoping for some experience in future signings. Maybe just me but I'm beginning to feel we are going in a similar direction to Ajax, ten or twenty years ago, when they were not at their best, whenever that was. Such a contrast to the team that had Sauzee in it. If I remember correctly, the youngest player apart from cameos was usually Laursen at twenty four years of age. The likes of Latapy, Zitelli, Sauzee and Pateleinen (sorry for the spelling), would have been on big wages with no sell on value at all. Stark contrast in approach and perhaps in relative success, to be seen.

[Tyler Durden]

I was ready to post earlier that folk needed to calm down with the hysteria around Ian Gordon. Then we get this bombshell.

It's a shambles whatever way you look at it. If Rocky was genuinely wanted, then the statement is appalling and has opened the club up to accusations that we've had to sign him.

If we did make a mistake, where was the communication to make clear to David Gray that he wasn't allowed to play him to avoid this scenario? It was bizarre to me that he played Rocky in that Dundee game anyway but never mind....

He was awful last season. 3 year deal is bizarre. Looks like we're now counting on Hanlon and Porto staying fit and available and back to their best. Or we are intending to sell Doig and then buy a top class CB..... Not sure which is more likely

[Col2]

how anyone can turn signing this guy at this moment in time into a negative is mind boggling.

He was at best poor when on loan. Why do you think Rocky is a decent signing? I don’t disagree he might come good but on what evidence you think negativity is mind boggling?

[Unseen work]

I don't suppose he could give you a name of the player or which team he's with 😁
Wonder if he plays first team football currently.

My guess will be Lewis Miller.

Out of contract this summer, 21 and was playing in the same team as Cummings. Decent number of appearances for his age.

Makes me think Clarke is being recallled.

[ScottB]

:faf:

If this is true then you have to laugh really.

What a ****ing mess.

Don’t see how it’s a mess, if McGinn had triggered a contract extension that was part of his deal, so be it. Johnson is free to want to use him or not.

[badabing67]

Just waiting for the James Scott announcement later today



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That genuinely wouldn't upset me in the slightest if we get a good deal..

[delbert]

Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but I'm getting a bit worried about Ian Gordon's obsession with "adding value" as if the only relevant criteria in our signings is potential sell on fee. I get that we need/hope to make money off players, but that shouldn't be an end in itself.

Perhaps something he has brought in from his background in retail wine selling, which is where he learned his trade, luckily his Dad knew that experience would be vital for spotting talented football players

[bingo70]

I thought Rocky looked okay in his first couple of games after such a long time out with injuries, but he then got progressively worse.
Maybe with a pre-season and a 'keep it simple' message, he can improve, but he certainly wouldn't be a first pick with everyone fit and we need better than we've got.

According to a mate down under, we're close to a deal for an Aussie, 21-year-old who is a right-back, which appears to be an area we have well covered at the moment. Another 'emerging talent'...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lewis_Miller_(soccer)

I hope the poster doesn’t mind but it was mentioned on the PM
board in amongst a few other names we were interested in Lewis Miller. He’s just left Central Coast Mariners and appears to be really highly rated.

[Northernhibee]

McGinn not wanted by LJ.

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/8987956/paul-mcginn-hibs-exit-contract-lee-johnson/

We have no ****ing clue what we are doing.

[Vault Boy]

McGinn not wanted by LJ.

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/8987956/paul-mcginn-hibs-exit-contract-lee-johnson/

Bloody hell

[LaMotta]

It does. Loan with obligation to buy is fairly common now.


Yup. Dejan Kulusevski to Spurs was a loan but obligation to buy if certain conditions were met. Confirmed here:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/football/2022/mar/22/spurs-deal-with-juventus-to-buy-dejan-kulusevski-revealed

It does happen but it's pretty rare. And it's different from option to buy which is what Rocky's deal has been described as.

It would certainly be pretty mad if Hibs had left Scott Allan festering on the bench whilst we couldnt score because we were worried about paying him a bonus, but at the same time played Rocky so often that we were forced to buy him on a 3 year contract.

[GreenGray]

Tbf was Mcginn’s extension not decided a while back and he was the one who had the option to extend?


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[Unseen work]

Don’t see the issue with the McGinn scenario, was implemented in his contract by the previous manager and recruitment team and it was automatically triggered.

I can’t see it being an issue moving him on.

He’ll want games and doesn’t seem the type to just sit and pick up a wage.

I’m probably in the minority but I would have kept him as a squad player. Maybe adds credence to what a poster said 10 minutes ago about a young Aussie right back.

[Lago]

:top marks
The scapegoating of Ian Gordon is absolutely mental on here. Lee Johnson has previous for signing foreign players, he also mentioned the contacts he has around the world, and there's articles suggesting the boys name was given to LJ by someone he knows.

But on here Hibs.neters know more, and it's Ian Gordon signing and not LJ. Ffs, pack it in. Hes been a scapegoat since he got here and im yet to see absolutely any proof he's the man scouting all these players, and not just dealing with the negotiations/contracts.

Our signings were crap before he came along, anyone remember Feruz? Rheeras? Eckersly? Bigirimana? Hyndman? Sinclair? Darnell Johnson, Nelom, Agyepong, need I go on?

To me anyway, our recruitment is no better and no worse than its ever been, yet one glance on here and you'd think Ian Gordon is ruining Hibs.

Folk clearly didn't take to Ron when he came in and Ian Gordon being hired just gives those folk that are desperate to criticise him yet another stick to beat him with.

[Saint Hibee]

McGinn not wanted by LJ.

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/8987956/paul-mcginn-hibs-exit-contract-lee-johnson/

I thought we just gave him an extension?

[Sergio sledge]

We had the third best defense in the league on goals conceded, that's pretty good going considering we conceded three in all those games you mention.

And considering we struggled to put the same defence out 2 weeks in a row for most of the season, certainly under Maloney, due to injuries and suspensions.

I'm still not a massive fan of Rocky though and I think we could have signed better.

[Hibs90]

Tin hat on but I think Rocky is okay and we’ve certainly had worse in defence. I’m fine with him staying as a back up-rotation option and maybe in time he will improve over the season and cement himself as a starter. If McGregor is going to retire and Porteous leaves as expected then I’m fine with Rocky being the 3rd choice CB.

[SaulGoodman]

Whoever’s agreeing to these contracts with automatic extension clauses and automatic signing clauses needs kicked in the baws.

[Tyler Durden]

Don’t see the issue with the McGinn scenario, was implemented in his contract by the previous manager and recruitment team and it was automatically triggered.

I can’t see it being an issue moving him on.

He’ll want games and doesn’t seem the type to just sit and pick up a wage.

I’m probably in the minority but I would have kept him as a squad player. Maybe adds credence to what a posted said 10 minutes ago about a young Aussie right back.

:agree:

There could easily be more to follow too. Likes of Campbell, Mackay and Tait could be out on loan.

I don't think there's any danger that we're only looking to make 2 or 3 more signings.

[McGruber]

We said we would be signing 5 or 6 - that's 4 already and numbers wise hardly much wiggle room in the squad. Can't believe we have re-signed Rocky. He isn't good enough IMO - doesn't win enough headers, doesn't dominate, for strength being an attribute he isn't aggresive. Seems poor positionally and prone to errors. He's young, a decent size and can improve but we were really needing 2 CBs in to improve us.

Still need a proven experienced striker - 2 if Doidge can't get back to full fitness.

2 CMs vital and a winger - experienced and ready to go straight in.

We either aren't going to get that or we will be running with a huge squad! (unless we can ship some players out)

Interesting times ahead

[ElginHibbie]

Don’t see the issue with the McGinn scenario, was implemented in his contract by the previous manager and recruitment team and it was automatically triggered.

I can’t see it being an issue moving him on.

He’ll want games and doesn’t seem the type to just sit and pick up a wage.

I’m probably in the minority but I would have kept him as a squad player. Maybe adds credence to what a posted said 10 minutes ago about a young Aussie right back.

Reading the article though sounds like LJ would have him as a squad player, but not a starter and McGinn might want that?

But yeah, think people jumping to negative reactions to this particular story a bit too quickly

[04Sauzee]

Don’t see the issue with the McGinn scenario, was implemented in his contract by the previous manager and recruitment team and it was automatically triggered.

I can’t see it being an issue moving him on.

He’ll want games and doesn’t seem the type to just sit and pick up a wage.

I’m probably in the minority but I would have kept him as a squad player. Maybe adds credence to what a posted said 10 minutes ago about a young Aussie right back.

It's hardly the Wow moment being banded by some.
I think although I could be wrong but he had the option to extend his contract so he did so. LJ if the reports in the Sun which we choose to believe sometimes and choose not to believe at other times, has spoken to him and said he can't guarantee him game time and it may be better for him to find another club then fair enough.

[Pretty Boy]

Tbf was Mcginn’s extension not decided a while back and he was the one who had the option to extend?


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These appearances clauses are commonplace. No issue with that being in his contract.

Would probably have been better for all parties if Hibs and McGinn had agreed not to activate the clause though, theoretically it's automatic but it can be overridden. That would need agreement from all sides though and that may have not been forthcoming.

[hibsforeurope]

Wow. Does anyone know if his extension was automatic or needed player/club to agree? Even if no choice by club surely McGinn would know if he was welcome or not?

The report says it was an automatic extension, not sure what the trigger was.

i can see Mcginn and Rocky both leaving on loan to allow LJ to bring in his own players.

[Unseen work]

https://youtu.be/laab1kJb42I

He actually plays very similar to Clarke, even now they move and take a man on.

[badabing67]

Keepers:
Marshall, Macey (For Now), Dabrowski

Centre Backs:
Hanlon, Porteous, Bushiri, McGregor, Delfierre

Full Backs/Wing Backs (L):
Doig, Stevenson, Mitchell

Full Backs/Wing Backs (R):
Cadden, Clarke, McGinn

Centre-Mids:
Newell, Doyle-Hayes, Magennis, Campbell, Henderson, Kenneh, Tait

Wide Players:
Mackay, Hauge (Mitchell & Cadden could be included here)

Forwards:
Nisbet, Doidge, Melkerson, Bojang

I don't think McGregor is an option anymore and where is Doig? FWIW I think Doig and Cadden would do a good job in the middle for us

[Since452]

I'm sure the afternoon signings was very tongue in cheek 😁

I'm also convinced Rocky was playing with some kind of injury last season, he was heavily strapped in a few games. Not sure he should have played but he did. I'm sure a fully fit Rocky with a decent pre-season behind him and LJ coaching him will be an asset.

He absolutley was. Agree with your post. My thought on it too. If LJ thinks there is potential there and can go and improve him then i'm willing to let him prove it. Like i said earlier, clean slate for me.

[Tyler Durden]

Whoever’s agreeing to these contracts with automatic extension clauses and automatic signing clauses needs kicked in the baws.

The Rocky situation is bizarre but otherwise I don't see the issue.

If Jasper had turned out to be a star, we knew we had agreed a fee to keep him. Avoiding the situation we had with the likes of Griffiths over the years where a loan player excels and then prices himself out of our reach.

With McGinn it made sense. Solid squad player and probably not on the biggest wage relatively speaking. He's protected himself by taking the option but he'll likely get the same money somewhere else so he'll move on.

[tonyrougier123]

Frightening the direction we are heading.
As one poster said recruitment are trying to run before they can walk talking about resale value of players before they have kicked a ball in anger at Easter road.

The signings over the last year alone are horrific.

What a mess!

[Lago]

Rocky signs permanently for 3 years.

Didn’t see that coming. Not sure I rate him much and would’ve preferred getting someone else in the door.

Are we allowed to moan about this or be concerned that he’s been considered good enough?
That will go down like a turd in a punch bowl with some on here 😂

[Since452]

https://youtu.be/laab1kJb42I

He actually plays very similar to Clarke, even now they move and take a man on.

Who is this? Someone else we're linked to? Sorry may have missed it amongst all the welcome and good luck messages to Rocky and Bojang.

[flash]

I realise I will be in the minority here but McGinn would be nowhere near my team so not worried that the new manager feels that way too.
Far too many mistakes and lapses in concentration for a player of his experience.
Nowhere near the worst we have had but comfortable with him moving on.

[OstKurve Hibs]

Hopefully he gets better with experience and some better coaching but I have my doubts,

[hibsforeurope]

Frightening the direction we are heading.
As one poster said recruitment are trying to run before they can walk talking about resale value of players before they have kicked a ball in anger at Easter road.

The signings over the last year alone are horrific.

What a mess!

We're stumbling from one disaster to another, if it's not the quality of signings it's the contracts/clauses given out.

I get that other clubs have transfer committees, but they have people on them who know what they are doing. Particularly the last few days has proven that BK isn't good at drawing up contracts. The committee needs some help before it's too late and we've frittered away the Boyle money.

[J-C]

Rocky started off ok but soon fell apart like most of the team under Maloney, he's still raw and LJ sees something in him.I don't think we were obligated to take him, we triggered the option, a huge difference.

[Unseen work]

Who is this? Someone else we're linked to? Sorry may have missed it amongst all the welcome and good luck messages to Rocky and Bojang.

Sorry I meant to put than in an edited post instead of a new one.

A poster mentioned we’re after a 21 year old Australian right back and I found this lad who seems the most likely.

[bingo70]

I realise I will be in the minority here but McGinn would be nowhere near my team so not worried that the new manager feels that way too.
Far too many mistakes and lapses in concentration for a player of his experience.
Nowhere near the worst we have had but comfortable with him moving on.

Agreed. I understood why I thought the club wanted to keep him, I didn’t have any real issues with that as we have bigger priorities elsewhere but if the club now feel we can get better, I can quite believe that. Good luck to the guy.

At a time when there’s a free for all on the club from its own supporters I’d rather it never happened a week after he signed the new contract but in the greater scheme of things, I don’t care really.

[Lago]

That's how I read it too.

If that's the case, it's utterly ridiculous that we've now had to offer a 3 year deal to him based on a clause in the loan deal.

Someone needs their arse kicked!
How do you and others, know there was a clause in his loan deal?

[hibsforeurope]

How do you and others, know there was a clause in his loan deal?

From the offical press release:

The 22-year-old centre-half has penned a three-year deal with the Club after an option in his original loan agreement was triggered through a certain number of appearances. The terms of the agreement will remain undisclosed.

[MikeyS]

Tin hat on but I think Rocky is okay and we’ve certainly had worse in defence. I’m fine with him staying as a back up-rotation option and maybe in time he will improve over the season and cement himself as a starter. If McGregor is going to retire and Porteous leaves as expected then I’m fine with Rocky being the 3rd choice CB.

We have definitely had worse but unfortunately for Rocky those guys were Michael Nelson, David Stephens & Dave Beaumont!

[Greenworld]

Rocky started off ok but soon fell apart like most of the team under Maloney, he's still raw and LJ sees something in him.I don't think we were obligated to take him, we triggered the option, a huge difference.That's exactly it "option" not obligation. Rocky is a big unit that can play many positions . Personally I'm glad we've signed him I think he will turn good.

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[HoboHarry]

I'll need to finish work early today to give me time to catch up on the expected new 40 pages of bitching and whining.

[Greenio]

If the club had made a mess of the loan signing by putting in an obligation to buy him regardless of performances, would they really put it in their signing statement? :dunno:

This

[Hibs3-2]

Steven Fletcher at ER today.

[04Sauzee]

Steven Fletcher at ER today.

How do you know ? Heard or seen?

[tonyrougier123]

I'll need to finish work early today to give me time to catch up on the expected new 40 pages of bitching and whining.

I’d ask for overtime if I was you.

I’ll sum it up for you.

Bad contracts.
Loan deals.
YouTube technical recruitment wizard.
Resigned and leaving within one week.
New African signing could be worth $100,000,000

[Unseen work]

Steven Fletcher at ER today.

Is there any middle ground to our signings?

35+ or 22 and under 😅

[SHODAN]

Steven Fletcher at ER today.

Is he tho

[SaulGoodman]

Steven Fletcher at ER today.

Anyone know if he’s any good? Any YouTube clips or anything?

A bit concerned that we seem to be going for an unknown 35 year old tbh

[Northernhibee]

Anyone know if he’s any good? Any YouTube clips or anything?

A bit concerned that we seem to be going for an unknown 35 year old tbh

If it’s not a six month loan signing from FC Blancmange I’m not interested

[SHODAN]

13 years since Fletcher left. Where has the time gone

[Unseen work]

Is Fletcher not really injury prone now?

Just waiting on the comments about how he’d be a perfect fit 😅

[EVENTUALLY]

I'm starting to worry about what we're going to see from Lee Johnson. He has stated that he'll be interested to see how Rocky adapts to a new style which seems likely to be a less measured passing build up from defence through to attack especially if Paul McGinn who is steady, a decent passer and challenges on the deck and in the air very effectively is now no longer required.
The other thing that bothered me in his recent video interview with the podcast guys was his preference not to dominate games but would prefer to have a 55/45 possession advantage so to quickly move into transition going forwards and backwards !

[tonyrougier123]

Anyone know if he’s any good? Any YouTube clips or anything?

A bit concerned that we seem to be going for an unknown 35 year old tbh

You should be on insta nevermind YouTube trying to see if omeonga has Livingston in his rear view mirror heading in the direction of edinburgh.

[Unseen work]

Anyone know if James Scott had a certain amount of goals he had to score before the loan became a permanent?

Would make the St Johnstone game make more sense 🤣

[MrRobot]

I'm starting to worry about what we're going to see from Lee Johnson. He has stated that he'll be interested to see how Rocky adapts to a new style which seems likely to be a less measured passing build up from defence through to attack especially if Paul McGinn who is steady, a decent passer and challenges on the deck and in the air very effectively is now no longer required.
The other thing that bothered me in his recent video interview with the podcast guys was his preference not to dominate games but would prefer to have a 55/45 possession advantage so to quickly move into transition going forwards and backwards !

why does it bother you?

[Lago]

From the offical press release:

The 22-year-old centre-half has penned a three-year deal with the Club after an option in his original loan agreement was triggered through a certain number of appearances. The terms of the agreement will remain undisclosed.
Thanks, missed that, although as sme have pointed out there is a difference between option and obligation.

[Greenworld]

These appearances clauses are commonplace. No issue with that being in his contract.

Would probably have been better for all parties if Hibs and McGinn had agreed not to activate the clause though, theoretically it's automatic but it can be overridden. That would need agreement from all sides though and that may have not been forthcoming.Maybe hibs are happy to do so an accept say 50k / 75k instead of moving for nothing . I know it's a small amount but might be the case.

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[Heisenberg]

Is there any middle ground to our signings?

35+ or 22 and under 😅

Certainly not made any headway in filling the middle bracket of the squad LJ spoke about the other week.

[GreenGray]

I'm starting to worry about what we're going to see from Lee Johnson. He has stated that he'll be interested to see how Rocky adapts to a new style which seems likely to be a less measured passing build up from defence through to attack especially if Paul McGinn who is steady, a decent passer and challenges on the deck and in the air very effectively is now no longer required.
The other thing that bothered me in his recent video interview with the podcast guys was his preference not to dominate games but would prefer to have a 55/45 possession advantage so to quickly move into transition going forwards and backwards !

I thought he said he’s not bothered about dominating possession and looks to get the ball from defence to attack quickly?


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[WhileTheChief..]

Frightening the direction we are heading.
As one poster said recruitment are trying to run before they can walk talking about resale value of players before they have kicked a ball in anger at Easter road.

The signings over the last year alone are horrific.

What a mess!

You need to be careful using the word ‘horrific’ for anything Hibs related.

It’s only the events in Ukraine that applies to. Or something.

[neil7908]

It does happen but it's pretty rare. And it's different from option to buy which is what Rocky's deal has been described as.

It would certainly be pretty mad if Hibs had left Scott Allan festering on the bench whilst we couldnt score because we were worried about paying him a bonus, but at the same time played Rocky so often that we were forced to buy him on a 3 year contract.

That's exactly how the statement from Hibs reads:

"The 22-year-old centre-half has penned a three-year deal with the Club after an option in his original loan agreement was triggered through a certain number of appearances"

Now, LJ might also want him, but given his form last season, that would be quite a surprise imo.

[EVENTUALLY]

why does it bother you?

I want to dominate possession and keep the ball, thereby increasing the likelyhood of Hibs scoring and preventing the opposition from advancing on Marshall's net.

[Jones28]

I for one I'm glad we've signed Rocky. He started off well, and while raw I don't think we should be writing off anyone based on the last few months.

[GreenGray]

I want to dominate possession and keep the ball, thereby increasing the likelyhood of Hibs scoring and preventing the opposition from advancing on Marshall's net.

Dominating possession has no guarantee of that, did you watch a Shaun Maloney team?


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[ahibby]

That's exactly how the statement from Hibs reads:

"The 22-year-old centre-half has penned a three-year deal with the Club after an option in his original loan agreement was triggered through a certain number of appearances"

Now, LJ might also want him, but given his form last season, that would be quite a surprise imo.

but doesn't the word option, indicate that a choice could still be made either way, by the club?

[CallumHibs07]

That's exactly it "option" not obligation. Rocky is a big unit that can play many positions . Personally I'm glad we've signed him I think he will turn good.

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It doesn't say who the option was for, sounds like it was the player (similar to McGinn) and not Hibs, given it was related to the number of appearances. And the statement says "an option was triggered" rather than "we have triggered the option". Anyone trying to dress this up as anything other than a **** up is deluded.

[BoomtownHibees]

I want to dominate possession and keep the ball, thereby increasing the likelyhood of Hibs scoring and preventing the opposition from advancing on Marshall's net.

The point being is dominating the ball isn’t always the best option. If we are playing a team who are happy to sit in then having loads of the ball isn’t the most effective. He’s basically saying he’s happy to give up some of that possession if it means it gives us a better chance of breaking the team down.

Which makes sense imo

[Brooster]

I can hardly believe this. He is horrendous.

[Rumble de Thump]

It doesn't say who the option was for, sounds like it was the player (similar to McGinn) and not Hibs, given it was related to the number of appearances. And the statement says "an option was triggered" rather than "we have triggered the option". Anyone trying to dress this up as anything other than a **** up is deluded.

What else have you imagined?

[EVENTUALLY]

Dominating possession has no guarantee of that, did you watch a Shaun Maloney team?


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I never said anything about guarantees. The likelyhood is that by dominating possession a side will more often than not come out on top.

[Stuart93]

I for one I'm glad we've signed Rocky. He started off well, and while raw I don't think we should be writing off anyone based on the last few months.

Nonsense. We can definitely write players off that clearly aren’t good enough.

[Unseen work]

I want to dominate possession and keep the ball, thereby increasing the likelyhood of Hibs scoring and preventing the opposition from advancing on Marshall's net.

I think he’s said a couple of times now that he does still want to have more possession than the opposition but not something like 70%.

He’ll have triggers where we allow the opposition to have the ball at the back and knock it about before we pounce and try win it back high up the pitch.

No one can attack with the intensity that he wants to for 90 minutes so the spell without the ball allows them to have a bit of a breather before getting it back.

[CapitalGreen]

I want to dominate possession and keep the ball, thereby increasing the likelyhood of Hibs scoring and preventing the opposition from advancing on Marshall's net.

To dominate possession you usually have to take less risks, avoiding taking risks wont necessarily translate into goals unless you have a dominant skill advantage over your opponent. What typically happens is the opposition will get everyone behind the ball and allow you to pass side to side in midfield creating very little as we watched under Maloney.

[flash]

Nonsense. We can definitely write players off that clearly aren’t good enough.

It's not nonsense. He disagrees with you.

[CallumHibs07]

What else have you imagined?

What bit do you disagree with?

[neil7908]

but doesn't the word option, indicate that a choice could still be made either way, by the club?

Not my reading of it, I'm not sure why there would be anything in loan agreement about appearances if it was just an option that we could back out of. It would have no value to us, the player or his parent club in that case.

I don't have inside info so could be wrong of course, but to me the language is pretty clear. Rocky is only 22 so don't want to write anyone off but we need first team players that can come in and make a real difference. Right now he's certainly not falling into that category.

[Ozyhibby]

https://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/20198200.paul-mcginn-set-for-shock-hibs-exit-just-one-week-sealing-new-deal/

McGinn no longer part of Johnson’s plan. One week after signing a new deal.
We are venturing into Romanov at hearts territory with the madness going on. But with less money getting spent.


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[Lester B]

It doesn't say who the option was for, sounds like it was the player (similar to McGinn) and not Hibs, given it was related to the number of appearances. And the statement says "an option was triggered" rather than "we have triggered the option". Anyone trying to dress this up as anything other than a **** up is deluded.

Deluded? Oh please.

It's an option not an obligation as many have stated. Do you genuinely believe that any loan deal meant that we had to buy him AND offer a three year deal.

There is a possibility which I'm sure many will discount as it doesn't fit with a lot of the wailing on here. LJ was aware of Rocky already and rates him. He chose to activate the option contained in the loan deal as he believes he can get something out of the player.

Rocky started well and then came unstuck. You could say the same of a number of players under Maloney.

Oh and one more thing not related to this post but in general. Why are people suddenly regarding what's published in The Sun as remotely accurate let alone spot on???

[Smartie]

As an aside that must be one of the least enthusiastic signing announcements ever.

if you could convert a sigh into written format it would be right at home in those 4 paragrpahs.

I actually think it’s quite disrespectful to the chap, irrespective of any opinion on his ability.

Rocky was hung out to dry at Tynecastle, clearly injured and should have been substituted. That’s influenced a lot of people’s opinions.

Rocky has a lot of raw materials that are good in a defender. If we’ve got a coaching team who can improve players this signing might surprise a few people imo.

[GreenPJ]

Wow. Does anyone know if his extension was automatic or needed player/club to agree? Even if no choice by club surely McGinn would know if he was welcome or not?

It suggests it was automatic which in my view would need Player to confirm they are happy to accept automatic renewal. Why would you not want to accept if you don't have anything else lined up. Its unfortunate that the automatic clause was in there but its not uncommon I suspect. I personally think McGinn can still be an effective squad player for us but if LJ has his sights on someone else as first team pick then I am fine with that although assuming Clarke is still going to be with us does beg the question who plays where in a first 11 - am not sure Clarke is left or right sided midfield.

[Franck Stanton]

Well you don’t announce he’s away and then 3 days later say we’ve signed him unless someone really ****ed up.

My god, Hibs only had him on loan until the end of the season. We didn't "release" him at all. On termination of the loan period he, like all players at any club, returned to his parent club.

[Unseen work]

Deluded? Oh please.

It's an option not an obligation as many have stated. Do you genuinely believe that any loan deal meant that we had to buy him AND offer a three year deal.

There is a possibility which I'm sure many will discount as it doesn't fit with a lot of the wailing on here. LJ was aware of Rocky already and rates him. He chose to activate the option contained in the loan deal as he believes he can get something out of the player.

Rocky started well and then came unstuck. You could say the same of a number of players under Maloney.

Oh and one more thing not related to this post but in general. Why are people suddenly regarding what's published in The Sun as remotely accurate let alone spot on???

Tbf if imagine any loan that has an option to buy in it means the contract for the player is already agreed.

Kensell said for Rocky and Jasper we can make it permanent at any time, we wouldn’t be able to do it if that wasn’t already in place.

It also wouldn’t make sense to have an arrangement with the parent club if the player has no interest in joining with the contract we offer.

[Fergus52]

To dominate possession you usually have to take less risks, avoiding taking risks wont necessarily translate into goals unless you have a dominant skill advantage over your opponent. What typically happens is the opposition will get everyone behind the ball and allow you to pass side to side in midfield creating very little as we watched under Maloney.

:agree:

We dominated possession in loads of games that were absolutely dire to watch under Maloney, Ross and even under Stubbs.

When Johnson spoke about wanting his side to take more risks and get the ball in the final third quickly I was happy.

[Unseen work]

Wonder how much we actually paid Norwich for Rocky…maybe best if that doesn’t come out….

[Haymaker]

:hyper

[EVENTUALLY]

To dominate possession you usually have to take less risks, avoiding taking risks wont necessarily translate into goals unless you have a dominant skill advantage over your opponent. What typically happens is the opposition will get everyone behind the ball and allow you to pass side to side in midfield creating very little as we watched under Maloney.


I think he’s said a couple of times now that he does still want to have more possession than the opposition but not something like 70%.

He’ll have triggers where we allow the opposition to have the ball at the back and knock it about before we pounce and try win it back high up the pitch.

No one can attack with the intensity that he wants to for 90 minutes so the spell without the ball allows them to have a bit of a breather before getting it back.

Fair enough guys but I'd rather watch a Hibs side with a high percentage possession of the ball moving forward progressively. I know there are 2 teams on the park but I'm not interested in opposition sides pressing Hibs and waiting for them to loose the ball before we take up the challenge. Starting on the front foot and staying there is how I want to see Hibs play.

[CallumHibs07]

Deluded? Oh please.

It's an option not an obligation as many have stated. Do you genuinely believe that any loan deal meant that we had to buy him AND offer a three year deal.

There is a possibility which I'm sure many will discount as it doesn't fit with a lot of the wailing on here. LJ was aware of Rocky already and rates him. He chose to activate the option contained in the loan deal as he believes he can get something out of the player.

Rocky started well and then came unstuck. You could say the same of a number of players under Maloney.

Oh and one more thing not related to this post but in general. Why are people suddenly regarding what's published in The Sun as remotely accurate let alone spot on???

Except you're missing the fact clearly the option is with Rocky, and not us as a club. Why would the club have the option if its based on Rocky playing more than x number of games? That would only make sense if he didn't reach a certain number of games. Why does the statement say "an option was triggered" if it was triggered by us? Strange wording. We also thanked him for his time and said he's going back to Norwich only last week, not to mention the statement is hardly complimentary. So aye, deluded. :aok:

[J-C]

https://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/20198200.paul-mcginn-set-for-shock-hibs-exit-just-one-week-sealing-new-deal/

McGinn no longer part of Johnson’s plan. One week after signing a new deal.
We are venturing into Romanov at hearts territory with the madness going on. But with less money getting spent.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The McGinn extension was triggered by the number of appearances, so we were obliged to extend his deal as it was in his contract, unfortunately now the new manager doesn't want him.

[Franck Stanton]

Surely it must have been a decision rather than an obligation given the length of contract? The agreement would have been with Norwich so if we were duty bound to sign him based on his appearances but didn’t want to do so, we could have offered him a 1 year deal, no?

The fact he’s been rewarded with a 3 year contract would tell me that we’ve decided he’s a player worth going for as opposed to someone that’s been forced on us by a clause

At last, a sensible post.Well said.

[GreenGray]

https://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/20198200.paul-mcginn-set-for-shock-hibs-exit-just-one-week-sealing-new-deal/

McGinn no longer part of Johnson’s plan. One week after signing a new deal.
We are venturing into Romanov at hearts territory with the madness going on. But with less money getting spent.


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Nonsense, Mcginns extension was agreed ages ago and was a clause in his contract, no where near Romanov levels…yet.


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[hibsforeurope]

Thanks, missed that, although as sme have pointed out there is a difference between option and obligation.

It depends who had the 'option'. was it Rocky, Norwich or Hibs. Mcginn had the option, he re-signed and the club have told him he can leave. Hibs even mentioning Rocky on the players leaving the club statement, regardless of wording, suggests Hibs never had a say in the 'option'. if they intended to sign him permanently why not just leave him off that list and do a separate announcement at the time.

[J-C]

Except you're missing the fact clearly the option is with Rocky, and not us as a club. Why would the club have the option if its based on Rocky playing more than x number of games? That would only make sense if he didn't reach a certain number of games. We also thanked him for his time and said he's going back to Norwich only last week, not to mention the statement is hardly complimentary. So aye, deluded. :aok:

He went back to Norwich as his loan ended and he was then still a Norwich player. The option is not for Rocky to decide but for Hibs. If you actually think we're allowing players to make decisions to join instead of the manager, then I'd suggest your nuts.

[Since452]

Unfortunate for McGinn but that's always the risk you have when a new manager comes in. Wish him all the best if he moves on.

[CapitalGreen]

Fair enough guys but I'd rather watch a Hibs side with a high percentage possession of the ball moving forward progressively. I know there are 2 teams on the park but I'm not interested in opposition sides pressing Hibs and waiting for them to loose the ball before we take up the challenge. Starting on the front foot and staying there is how I want to see Hibs play.

There is more ways to play football than the seemingly binary options you have presented.

[J-C]

It depends who had the 'option'. was it Rocky, Norwich or Hibs. Mcginn had the option, he re-signed and the club have told him he can leave. Hibs even mentioning Rocky on the players leaving the club statement, regardless of wording, suggests Hibs never had a say in the 'option'. if they intended to sign him permanently why not just leave him off that list and do a separate announcement at the time.

Again he was a loan signing who went back to his parent club while we decided if we wanted to take up the option.

[WeeRussell]

There is more ways to play football than the seemingly binary options you have presented.

Bit over the top. He’s only stating he prefers his team to have more of the ball. It’s not that mental.

[Since452]

Again he was a loan signing who went back to his parent club while we decided if we wanted to take up the option.

Exactly.

[Unseen work]

Bojang announced 9pm during a Scotland game
Rocky announced 10am

Gearing up for an exciting announcement this afternoon to get fans back onside

[nickwhibs]

I for one I'm glad we've signed Rocky. He started off well, and while raw I don't think we should be writing off anyone based on the last few months.

Me too. He’s got the attributes to become a good player. He started well but had some poor performances (as did many of his teammates). He’s still young and will improve with more games, confidence and a better system.

[hibsforeurope]

Again he was a loan signing who went back to his parent club while we decided if we wanted to take up the option.

or norwich didn't want him back and told hibs they had to take up the option, much like the McGinn deal. The number of games, fee and contract were agreed with Rocky and Norwich in the Loan agreement.

[Lago]

He went back to Norwich as his loan ended and he was then still a Norwich player. The option is not for Rocky to decide but for Hibs. If you actually think we're allowing players to make decisions to join instead of the manager, then I'd suggest your nuts.
Spot on, the amount of hysteria on here, based only on speculation, is mind boggling.

[CallumHibs07]

He went back to Norwich as his loan ended and he was then still a Norwich player. The option is not for Rocky to decide but for Hibs. If you actually think we're allowing players to make decisions to join instead of the manager, then I'd suggest your nuts.

The option is for the manager to play him or not. If he's met a certain number of appearances it seems to me the player has the option to extend or not. Just like what's happened with McGinn.

[EVENTUALLY]

There is more ways to play football than the seemingly binary options you have presented.


Bit over the top. He’s only stating he prefers his team to have more of the ball. It’s not that mental.

Correct Wee R. :wink:

[J-C]

or norwich didn't want him back and told hibs they had to take up the option, much like the McGinn deal. The number of games, fee and contract were agreed with Rocky and Norwich in the Loan agreement.
Bit early to be pished is it not?

[Lester B]

Except you're missing the fact clearly the option is with Rocky, and not us as a club. Why would the club have the option if its based on Rocky playing more than x number of games? That would only make sense if he didn't reach a certain number of games. Why does the statement say "an option was triggered" if it was triggered by us? Strange wording. We also thanked him for his time and said he's going back to Norwich only last week, not to mention the statement is hardly complimentary. So aye, deluded. :aok:

Ok.

How much do you know about employment contracts specifically fixed term contracts?

All employment contracts are based upon offer and acceptance of offer. All contracts even for professional football players are weighted in favour of the employer. That is the nature of employment. I don't see what the point you think you're making about the option being with Rocky rather than the club. Any option would have to be agreed by both clubs and the individual. You seem to believe that there is a contractual clause in the loan agreement that allows the player to demand that Employer A sells him to Employer B and offers a three year contract. Hibs have had loan deals, I think Murphy was one, when the loan deal expires and a fixed term contract follows on from this. I think Henderson was another. This is not what we are talking about in relation to Rocky.

Also the idea that McGinn automatically gets an extension at the end of his contract puzzles me. There would be an option to extend but again this would be under mutually agreed terms with no compulsion or obligation.

[Lago]

or norwich didn't want him back and told hibs they had to take up the option, much like the McGinn deal. The number of games, fee and contract were agreed with Rocky and Norwich in the Loan agreement.
Some stretch to come to that conclusion.

[hibbyfraelibby]

Whoever’s agreeing to these contracts with automatic extension clauses and automatic signing clauses needs kicked in the baws.

I would think neither of those individuals are still with the club...and perhaps contributory factors in their departures

[LeithMike]

Surely it must have been a decision rather than an obligation given the length of contract? The agreement would have been with Norwich so if we were duty bound to sign him based on his appearances but didn’t want to do so, we could have offered him a 1 year deal, no?

The fact he’s been rewarded with a 3 year contract would tell me that we’ve decided he’s a player worth going for as opposed to someone that’s been forced on us by a clause

I suspect not. If this was just a matter of an option and Hibs got him at a specific price if he played a number of games then what is the benefit to Norwich? Hibs could have dictated the price depending on the number of games he played.

It looks like this was a loan with a view to a permanent deal with the contract agreed with the player and an option on Hibs' part which would be triggered automatically if he played a certain number of games. No other view makes sense from a contractual point of view and suggests wishful thinking that our owners know what they are doing.

It also makes sense with the statement on the website. We had an option which became a mandatory "option" on a certain number of games being played.

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[SteveHFC]

https://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/article/rocky-bushiri-joins-hibs-permanently

Rocky signed permanently


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Dreadful

[hibsforeurope]

Bit early to be pished is it not?

if the club initiated the deal why write this statement:
The 22-year-old centre-half has penned a three-year deal with the Club after an option in his original loan agreement was triggered through a certain number of appearances. The terms of the agreement will remain undisclosed.

Why not write something like this?
We are delighted to announce the signing of 20-year-old Momodou Bojang on loan from Rainbow FC, subject to international clearance and work permit approval.

i would put money on Rocky being loaned out or told he can leave before too long.

[007]

Especially since he is 175cm tall. Maybe the Fibonacci Sequence can make sense of that .....

:greengrin

What team does Fibonacci Sequence play for? 🤔

[hibsforeurope]

Some stretch to come to that conclusion.

Which part is the stretch?

[J-C]

The option is for the manager to play him or not. If he's met a certain number of appearances it seems to me the player has the option to extend or not. Just like what's happened with McGinn.
Not on a loan deal, he wasn't our player.
Norwich say to us, you can have him if he plays x amount of games at £x amount if you and him are happy, we decide aye ok we'll take him then.
Players do not decide who signs them, that's up to the club.

[Aldo]

Bojang announced 9pm during a Scotland game
Rocky announced 10am

Gearing up for an exciting announcement this afternoon to get fans back onside

You really think we’ll announce another signing today?? [emoji15]


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[Rumble de Thump]

A mandatory option :greengrin This place is bonkers.

[Unseen work]

I think it’s worth remembering that this was a Maloney signing.

Maloney knew him, wanted him and played him instantly. Probably more than expected through injuries and suspensions.

But the club out everything in place for Maloney to get his man at the end of it and backed him.

Maloney never worked out and now we have Rocky.

We want the managers to have more of a say in players so we have to accept things like this may happen.

[SteveHFC]

Just waiting for the James Scott announcement later today



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Can i return my season ticket if that happens?

[hibbyfraelibby]

https://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/20198200.paul-mcginn-set-for-shock-hibs-exit-just-one-week-sealing-new-deal/

McGinn no longer part of Johnson’s plan. One week after signing a new deal.
We are venturing into Romanov at hearts territory with the madness going on. But with less money getting spent.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

McGinn didn't sign a new deal, this deal is his originsl one being exercised

[ahibby]

I suspect not. If this was just a matter of an option and Hibs got him at a specific price if he played a number of games then what is the benefit to Norwich? Hibs could have dictated the price depending on the number of games he played.

It looks like this was a loan with a view to a permanent deal with the contract agreed with the player and an option on Hibs' part which would be triggered automatically if he played a certain number of games. No other view makes sense from a contractual point of view and suggests wishful thinking that our owners know what they are doing.

It also makes sense with the statement on the website. We had an option which became a mandatory "option" on a certain number of games being played.

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Surely if it's mandatory then it's not an option. You can't decide to complete mandatory training the decision is made for you. With optional training you can decide. Mandatory option sounds like an oxymoron to me.

[J-C]

Ok.

How much do you know about employment contracts specifically fixed term contracts?

All employment contracts are based upon offer and acceptance of offer. All contracts even for professional football players are weighted in favour of the employer. That is the nature of employment. I don't see what the point you think you're making about the option being with Rocky rather than the club. Any option would have to be agreed by both clubs and the individual. You seem to believe that there is a contractual clause in the loan agreement that allows the player to demand that Employer A sells him to Employer B and offers a three year contract. Hibs have had loan deals, I think Murphy was one, when the loan deal expires and a fixed term contract follows on from this. I think Henderson was another. This is not what we are talking about in relation to Rocky.

Also the idea that McGinn automatically gets an extension at the end of his contract puzzles me. There would be an option to extend but again this would be under mutually agreed terms with no compulsion or obligation.

McGinn extra year was triggered by the amount of games, already written into his contract, nothing Hibs could do, they had to agree to it.

[Brown Hibs]

It is clear that we triggered the option to buy and were obliged to buy. The statements from Johnson and Gordon are hardly a ringing endorsement. The same with the Mueller statement when they talked about a significant amount being freed up - largely confirming he was on silly money for a club our size. They could have done Rocky a favour and made out they were not obliged but actually believe in the signing.

[CallumHibs07]

Ok.

How much do you know about employment contracts specifically fixed term contracts?

All employment contracts are based upon offer and acceptance of offer. All contracts even for professional football players are weighted in favour of the employer. That is the nature of employment. I don't see what the point you think you're making about the option being with Rocky rather than the club. Any option would have to be agreed by both clubs and the individual. You seem to believe that there is a contractual clause in the loan agreement that allows the player to demand that Employer A sells him to Employer B and offers a three year contract. Hibs have had loan deals, I think Murphy was one, when the loan deal expires and a fixed term contract follows on from this. I think Henderson was another. This is not what we are talking about in relation to Rocky.

Also the idea that McGinn automatically gets an extension at the end of his contract puzzles me. There would be an option to extend but again this would be under mutually agreed terms with no compulsion or obligation.

Do you know that for a fact? Regardless, the power was with us in terms of how many games to play him in. Once he plays x number of games it seems more likely the option is with the player, which is backed up by the statement, which doesn't say we triggered the option. The previous statement last week also makes no mention of the clause regarding number of games played.

It was widely reported McGinn's contract was extended due to playing a certain number of games last season. If it was mutually agreed he was given an extension last week and now LJ wants shot of him that's an even bigger **** up I'm sure you'll agree??

[007]

It doesn't say who the option was for, sounds like it was the player (similar to McGinn) and not Hibs, given it was related to the number of appearances. And the statement says "an option was triggered" rather than "we have triggered the option". Anyone trying to dress this up as anything other than a **** up is deluded.

The article says McGinn's was an extension that was triggered, not an option. That's not me dressing it up, it's you either not understanding the difference or not reading the article and/or statement properly.

[TelaStella]

I think it’s worth remembering that this was a Maloney signing.

Maloney knew him, wanted him and played him instantly. Probably more than expected through injuries and suspensions.

But the club out everything in place for Maloney to get his man at the end of it and backed him.

Maloney never worked out and now we have Rocky.

We want the managers to have more of a say in players so we have to accept things like this may happen.

From what I’ve been told he wasn’t Maloney’s signing.


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[w pilton hibby]

From what I’ve been told he wasn’t Maloney’s signing.


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and?

[Rumble de Thump]

It is clear that we triggered the option to buy and were obliged to buy. The statements from Johnson and Gordon are hardly a ringing endorsement. The same with the Mueller statement when they talked about a significant amount being freed up - largely confirming he was on silly money for a club our size. They could have done Rocky a favour and made out they were not obliged but actually believe in the signing.

Did you see the word obliged in any statement from Hibs? Or do you genuinely think option and obligation are the same thing?

[Edinburgh Green]

I suspect not. If this was just a matter of an option and Hibs got him at a specific price if he played a number of games then what is the benefit to Norwich? Hibs could have dictated the price depending on the number of games he played.

It looks like this was a loan with a view to a permanent deal with the contract agreed with the player and an option on Hibs' part which would be triggered automatically if he played a certain number of games. No other view makes sense from a contractual point of view and suggests wishful thinking that our owners know what they are doing.

It also makes sense with the statement on the website. We had an option which became a mandatory "option" on a certain number of games being played.

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Yeah that's how I see the situation. Also to answer the poster you quoted of why we didn't therefore only a 1 year deal. I'd imagine that the fee involved would of made it an even more foolish decision. If for instance the fee was a couple hundred thousand then we would be better signing the 3 year deal with the hope that he does improve on his ability to where he becomes an asset.

[hibsforeurope]

The article says McGinn's was an extension that was triggered, not an option. That's not me dressing it up, it's you either not understanding the difference or not reading the article and/or statement properly.

The story from Patrick in the EEN says it's an option for Mcginn:

McGinn’s contract is up in the summer but he has an option to extend for a further year,

www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hibs/hibs-news-paul-mcginn-provides-update-on-contract-talks-with-his-deal-set-to-expire-3664717[/URL]vides-update-on-contract-talks-with-his-deal-set-to-expire-

[hibsforeurope]

Did you see the word obliged in any statement from Hibs? Or do you genuinely think option and obligation are the same thing?

Not obliged but triggered by the number of appearances suggests the same.

[CallumHibs07]

The article says McGinn's was an extension that was triggered, not an option. That's not me dressing it up, it's you either not understanding the difference or not reading the article and/or statement properly.

Looks like you haven't read properly :aok:

[Saint Hibee]

From what I’ve been told he wasn’t Maloney’s signing.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Was he not meant to be a Ben Kensall signing?

[Stuart93]

Wonder what time we’ll announce James Scott

[LeithMike]

Surely if it's mandatory then it's not an option. You can't decide to complete mandatory training the decision is made for you. With optional training you can decide. Mandatory option sounds like an oxymoron to me.I think you're reading too much into the word option. "Options" can also involve an element of compulsion depending on what you agree to.

I hard to think that this was anything other than a loan with an option on the part of Hibs to make permanent which could be exercised either at the option of Hibs or if certain other criteria were fulfilled i.e. RB playing so many games.

Presumably Hibs were content to agree to that at the time but appear to have forgotten what was in the contract when managing his gametime and speaking of his release the other day.

Either way, that's not a great management.

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[04Sauzee]

Former Hearts loanee Ben Woodburn has been released by Liverpool

It's understood that at least one Scottish Premiership club holds an interest in signing the Welsh international

https://t.co/6w75EVIae8 https://t.co/9p2QST4g9A

[NAE NOOKIE]

If it’s not a six month loan signing from FC Blancmange I’m not interested

I'm having a pretty bad few days, but this made me laugh my arse off ...... thanks mate :top marks

[Unseen work]

Wonder what time we’ll announce James Scott

Heard he had an option if he scored 4 or more goals for us..

[Unseen work]

Former Hearts loanee Ben Woodburn has been released by Liverpool

It's understood that at least one Scottish Premiership club holds an interest in signing the Welsh international

https://t.co/6w75EVIae8 https://t.co/9p2QST4g9A

It’s a current Hibs signing all over isn’t it

[Real Emerald]

Former Hearts loanee Ben Woodburn has been released by Liverpool

It's understood that at least one Scottish Premiership club holds an interest in signing the Welsh international

https://t.co/6w75EVIae8 https://t.co/9p2QST4g9A

Well I hope it’s not us. The Hearts fans didn’t want him back.

[Unseen work]

Aberdeen rumoured to be signing Alen Halilovic.

[Gordy M]

I think you're reading too much into the word option. "Options" can also involve an element of compulsion depending on what you agree to.

I hard to think that this was anything other than a loan with an option on the part of Hibs to make permanent which could be exercised either at the option of Hibs or if certain other criteria were fulfilled i.e. RB playing so many games.

Presumably Hibs were content to agree to that at the time but appear to have forgotten what was in the contract when managing his gametime and speaking of his release the other day.

Either way, that's not a great management.

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So why let him "leave" along with the other loans. If it was compulsory? That def doesnt make sense?

[The Captain....]

Wonder what time we’ll announce James ScottDouble coup with Rowan Vine also returning. Nothing would surprise me.

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[Lester B]

Do you know that for a fact? Regardless, the power was with us in terms of how many games to play him in. Once he plays x number of games it seems more likely the option is with the player, which is backed up by the statement, which doesn't say we triggered the option. The previous statement last week also makes no mention of the clause regarding number of games played.

It was widely reported McGinn's contract was extended due to playing a certain number of games last season. If it was mutually agreed he was given an extension last week and now LJ wants shot of him that's an even bigger **** up I'm sure you'll agree??

Do I know this for a fact? There are of course potential exceptions in terms of English Premiership players. Exceptions rather than rules. It certainly does not apply to a Team at Hibs level

I think your obsession about the wording does you no favours about triggering an option. It's an option to enter into an agreement. There can be no compulsion.

Widely reported? The Club Statement on the year long extension says "the Club has decided to take up the option to extend Paul McGinn’s contract for an extra year.". It wasn't widely reported at the time as far as I can make out that it was dependant on appearances. If you have contemporaneous sources I can't find them. That has now appeared in Press stories today and even then the Herald, which has presumably picked up the story from the Sun is cagey in its wording: "This is said to have automatically triggered a contract extension for the season ahead. "

You're sure I'll agree? That's nice.

[Tyler Durden]

Yeah that's how I see the situation. Also to answer the poster you quoted of why we didn't therefore only a 1 year deal. I'd imagine that the fee involved would of made it an even more foolish decision. If for instance the fee was a couple hundred thousand then we would be better signing the 3 year deal with the hope that he does improve on his ability to where he becomes an asset.

I think that's an excellent point that has been missed thus far.

I couldn't get my head around the 3 year deal but if we've (surely) had to shell out a minimum of £2-300k on him, then we really do need to protect that investment and hope for the best. And yes I'm totally speculating on the fee but that would surely be the minimum given what Norwich had invested in him to date.

[ahibby]

I think you're reading too much into the word option. "Options" can also involve an element of compulsion depending on what you agree to.

I hard to think that this was anything other than a loan with an option on the part of Hibs to make permanent which could be exercised either at the option of Hibs or if certain other criteria were fulfilled i.e. RB playing so many games.

Presumably Hibs were content to agree to that at the time but appear to have forgotten what was in the contract when managing his gametime and speaking of his release the other day.

Either way, that's not a great management.

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It's not the word option, I have a problem with, it's coupling it with mandatory that is the issue. It was never mandatory that we sign Rocky, we had the option not too even though a certain number of appearances were made. Gut instinct is that Porto has an offer and is interested in moving on and so we have gone back and triggered the option. We shall see.

[truehibernian]

Delighted with Rocky signing permanently. He has all the attributes to go right to the top. Fast, strong, good on the ball. Centre halves take a while to become established and hopefully we can bring him on.

Are your eyes glued on ? Bushiri is a simply awful centre half, up there with the Sean O’Hanlon’s of this world. Dreadful signing - Lee Johnson will need to delve into Yogi’s ‘magic dust’ drawer at HTC and hope there’s a huge handful of it.

[Brown Hibs]

Did you see the word obliged in any statement from Hibs? Or do you genuinely think option and obligation are the same thing?

You probably think the Theory of Evolution is actually a theory and not fact.

[Scouse Hibee]

Too many people mixing up option and obligation on this thread.

[WeeRussell]

Too many people mixing up option and obligation on this thread.

In your option.

[Sir David Gray]

Just catching up with all of this as I've been working - I feel like a broken record with all of this but I am genuinely concerned about the direction of the club right now.

By the sounds of the wording in the Bushiri announcement, we were forced to take him as opposed to actually wanting him. He really wasn't impressive last season so to have him signed up on a 3 year deal is surprising to say the least.

We now have a squad of 28 players and I think we need to sign a minimum of 5 or 6 first team picks if we're going to have a chance of competing where we want to be next season.

I sincerely hope I am wrong but as things stand I have very little faith in the current structure or leadership of the club.

[CallumHibs07]

Do I know this for a fact? There are of course potential exceptions in terms of English Premiership players. Exceptions rather than rules. It certainly does not apply to a Team at Hibs level

I think your obsession about the wording does you no favours about triggering an option. It's an option to enter into an agreement. There can be no compulsion.

Widely reported? The Club Statement on the year long extension says "the Club has decided to take up the option to extend Paul McGinn’s contract for an extra year.". It wasn't widely reported at the time as far as I can make out that it was dependant on appearances. If you have contemporaneous sources I can't find them. That has now appeared in Press stories today and even then the Herald, which has presumably picked up the story from the Sun is cagey in its wording: "This is said to have automatically triggered a contract extension for the season ahead. "

You're sure I'll agree? That's nice.

So if the club triggered an extension and now LJ doesn't want him a week later, what's your thoughts on that? Are you going to put a positive spin on that as well?

[007]

Looks like you haven't read properly :aok:

Or that we have read different articles. The Herarld has reported it as an automatic extension that was triggered (so EEN have reported it differently)

https://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/20198200.paul-mcginn-set-for-shock-hibs-exit-just-one-week-sealing-new-deal/

Doesn't change the fact that you got it wrong when you said "Except you're missing the fact clearly the option is with Rocky, and not us as a club."

https://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/player/rocky-bushiri

"In January 2022, Rocky Bushiri joined Hibernian FC on loan from Norwich City, but the club does have an option to buy the young centre-back in the summer!"

:aok:

[HoboHarry]

I'm having a pretty bad few days, but this made me laugh my arse off ...... thanks mate :top marks

He keeps me running round and round, well that's all right with me.....

[Lester B]

So if the club triggered an extension and now LJ doesn't want him a week later, what's your thoughts on that? Are you going to put a positive spin on that as well?

Positive spin? I don't think I'm spinning anything. Just talking about the nature of contracts from my experience.

Do you believe everything you read in the Sun? That currently is the only primary source for this info

[mcfly]

The club is a shambles at the moment.

What a poor way to treat players. New contract given. Next week bye bye

No wonder season tickets sales are v low.

[Real Emerald]

The club is a shambles at the moment.

What a poor way to treat players. New contract given. Next week bye bye

No wonder season tickets sales are v low.

It seems to be getting worse instead of improving.

[.Sean.]

Steven Fletcher at ER today.
Yes please

[ahibby]

It seems to be getting worse instead of improving.

Unsettling for fans and we can only guess at how unsettling for players it is.

[04Sauzee]

The club is a shambles at the moment.

What a poor way to treat players. New contract given. Next week bye bye

No wonder season tickets sales are v low.
How many have we sold so far?

[Stuart93]

How many have we sold so far?

I reckon if sales had been good the club would’ve been updating us like they have in the past

[TelaStella]

and?

And what?


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[The Harp]

I'll be sorry to see McGinn go, as I rate the guy. Can't believe we have Rocky Bushiri on a 3 year deal either. I know which one I'd rather keep - and it ain't Bushiri.

[WeeRussell]

I reckon if sales had been good the club would’ve been updating us like they have in the past

I reckon a large number of fans would have found a way to make the good sales news seem like bad news.

[bingo70]

Just catching up with all of this as I've been working - I feel like a broken record with all of this but I am genuinely concerned about the direction of the club right now.

By the sounds of the wording in the Bushiri announcement, we were forced to take him as opposed to actually wanting him. He really wasn't impressive last season so to have him signed up on a 3 year deal is surprising to say the least.

We now have a squad of 28 players and I think we need to sign a minimum of 5 or 6 first team picks if we're going to have a chance of competing where we want to be next season.

I sincerely hope I am wrong but as things stand I have very little faith in the current structure or leadership of the club.

Is the squad of 28 not including B team players though including Hauge and that Belgian guy we signed in January?

[GreenGray]

Or that we have read different articles. The Herarld has reported it as an automatic extension that was triggered (so EEN have reported it differently)

https://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/20198200.paul-mcginn-set-for-shock-hibs-exit-just-one-week-sealing-new-deal/

Doesn't change the fact that you got it wrong when you said "Except you're missing the fact clearly the option is with Rocky, and not us as a club."

https://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/player/rocky-bushiri

"In January 2022, Rocky Bushiri joined Hibernian FC on loan from Norwich City, but the club does have an option to buy the young centre-back in the summer!"

:aok:

There could have been an option for the player as well as one for the club?


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[Aldo]

I reckon if sales had been good the club would’ve been updating us like they have in the past

Hospitality seems to be selling very well.

I reckon we’ll sell about 10k this year!


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[w pilton hibby]

And what?


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and whose choice is he?

[ahibby]

or norwich didn't want him back and told hibs they had to take up the option, much like the McGinn deal. The number of games, fee and contract were agreed with Rocky and Norwich in the Loan agreement.

but that was never informed to anyone by Hibs at the time, they only advised us that they had the option to buy in the summer, not that there was anything in the loan cotract that they would be forced to. I will take it as it is reported, i.e. Hibs had the option and chose to sign him. Just don't see any logic in the alternative from a Hibs perspective. Does anyone actually have it in writing that Hibs were forced to sign him? From LJs statement, he seems quite up for it highlighting the players strengths and such.

[Sir David Gray]

Is the squad of 28 not including B team players though including Hauge and that Belgian guy we signed in January?

Yes it is;

Marshall
Macey
Dabrowski
Mitchell

McGinn
Porteous
Doig
Hanlon
Bushiri
Clarke
Cadden
Stevenson
Delferriere
Mitchell
McGregor

Newell
Doyle Hayes
Campbell
Tait
Hauge
Magennis
Henderson
Kenneh
Mackay

Nisbet
Doidge
Melkersen
Bojang

I'd say there's a lot of work required to that current list over the next month or so.

[G15 Hibs]

The club is a shambles at the moment.

What a poor way to treat players. New contract given. Next week bye bye

No wonder season tickets sales are v low.

I don't think that's what happened though. I don't think they sat down and said "here you go, Paul, your new contract all ready to sign". What seems to have happened is that his current contact (his original one from what he signed in 2019? Not sure if he signed an extension since then) would have been until the end of 2021/22 but with a further year if he played a certain number of games. He played that number of games and took up his option to extend. Which he had every right to do. So it's not a new contract as such, but the same one he was on.

What seems to have happened now is that the new manager has said he wouldn't necessarily be a first team player and someone's told the Sun that McGinn might be available/on the lookout for another club. It's unfortunate timing, but the kind of thing that can easily happen when a club changes manager.

For what it's worth, I'd be quite happy for McGinn to stay and be a squad player, but if he left and it freed up a bit cash for wages for the kind of quality signing we need then I'd be more happy.

[04Sauzee]

I reckon if sales had been good the club would’ve been updating us like they have in the past

Boy on the Bounce is confident we have sold 9800+

Just wondering if someone is hearing differently. To have sold 10k after the season we just had isn't all bad. Still time to go as well

That's if the 9.8k-10k is correct.

[Fuzzywuzzy]

With regards to bushiri, like the rest of the team, he came in to a style of play that none of them could really meet the expectations of. Let's see what happens when he's playing the new system.