The generic Hearts thread

[lapsedhibee]

The whole Black getting a cap at Easter Road was just to wind up Hibs fans. Just shows u how sad Craig Levein is when he is Scotland manager doing something like that

Was a wonder he didn't send him on with 51 on his back.

[Victor]

When looking back Hearts fans will want to blame Potter or the other clubs for their relegation.

This is the league table as we were losing the semifinal to Celtic.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200519/e8fc3018081ace51d0d92dc9262bdf56.jpg

We appointed JR and AB prevaricated. Anything approaching a decent managerial appointment would have seen Hearts, particularly with the money they were prepared to spend, move away from relegation. AB got that wrong and now it’s everyone else’s fault.

Think not.


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That is the situation in a nutshell. Another poor Managerial choice by St. Anne “I can do no wrong’ Budge. Why are they blaming the SPFL for her incompetence?


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[ano hibby]

Not an AST but got the Hamilton away tic in my wallet still. Will email the club

Keep the ticket mate. It’ll be a collectors item 👍

[660]

Was a wonder he didn't send him on with 51 on his back.

His treatment of Fletcher was disgraceful and I think partly due to his hibs connections

[Tug Wilson]

When looking back Hearts fans will want to blame Potter or the other clubs for their relegation.

This is the league table as we were losing the semifinal to Celtic.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200519/e8fc3018081ace51d0d92dc9262bdf56.jpg

We appointed JR and AB prevaricated. Anything approaching a decent managerial appointment would have seen Hearts, particularly with the money they were prepared to spend, move away from relegation. AB got that wrong and now it’s everyone else’s fault.

Think not.


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We have gained more points since then than any club outside the Uglies.

There is a clump of clubs have won 28 to 26 points. Us, Motherwell, Aberdeen, Livingston and St Johnstone.

St Mirren and Hamilton (who are up for a relegation scrap every season) have earned 21 and 18 respectively.

The 3 teams below that are Kilmarnock and Ross County with 16 and Hearts on 15.

Killie are 10 points ahead of Hearts so probably safe.

So Hearts best chance of getting off the bottom would have been to catch Ross County, who are apparently in free fall according to JKB!

That will be the Ross County that were 5 points ahead of them after 11 games and are now 6 points in front.

24 points to play for though. Aye right!

[hibee316]

Interesting that the table is not much different to as it stands now. We were 10 points behind Motherwell then and are now 9 points behind 19 games later.

If we hadn't had such a terrible start to the season we would be third ;)

[Keith_M]

If we hadn't had such a terrible start to the season we would be third ;)


If we hadn't kept losing to the worst team in the league, we would have been fifth; even with Hecky's otherwise disastrous spell in charge.

[Viva_Palmeiras]

Always willing to spend someone else’s money


https://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/hearts-fans-ready-pledge-serious-money-legal-battle-2856805

[Kaiser1962]

In the midst of all this does anybody know which rules, if any, have been broken?

Without this any potential legal case seems pointless

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/georgefoulkes/status/1262728390949421061?s=21


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[Ozyhibby]

In the midst of all this does anybody know which rules, if any, have been broken?

Without this any potential legal case seems pointless

None. That’s why I think they should take this all the way.


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[Kaiser1962]

None. That’s why I think they should take this all the way.


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In which case I wholeheartedly agree.

[Fuzzywuzzy]

Is this not a case for the judge among them if they signed up to the rules and regulations like all the other clubs and then being told to dry their eyes

[007]

Always willing to spend someone else’s money


https://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/hearts-fans-ready-pledge-serious-money-legal-battle-2856805

As the SPFL fees will be paid by all the clubs, I'd donate to that if someone was to start a crowd funding page. I'd even help get the link onto other teams' forums, if someone could be bothered to set it up.

[Ozyhibby]

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/hearts-owner-ann-budges-league-reconstruction-plan-be-ready-within-days-2858323


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[Ozyhibby]

As the SPFL fees will be paid by all the clubs, I'd donate to that if someone was to start a crowd funding page. I'd even help get the link onto other teams' forums, if someone could be bothered to set it up.

No need. Hearts won’t go legal. They are bluffing.


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[04Sauzee]

Always willing to spend someone else’s money


https://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/hearts-fans-ready-pledge-serious-money-legal-battle-2856805

Embarrassing

[04Sauzee]

https://twitter.com/georgefoulkes/status/1262728390949421061?s=21


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Embarrassing

[Onion]

Foulkes and Yam fans talking up legal action is simply to exert a little pressure on the others to vote for reconstruction. Hearts are now in a catch 22. The vote to relegate them has been taken. If they sue the other clubs - at BEST they may get a reprieve but that will come at the cost of pissing off the majority of other clubs in the Prem and most of the Champ sides as the only way they could remain in the Prem is by expanding the league. They will become the most hated club in the country.

They must be in SERIOUS financial bother to push this as far as they have. IMO, if they lose this, they will go bust.

[delbert]

In the midst of all this does anybody know which rules, if any, have been broken?

Without this any potential legal case seems pointless

That’s the whole point here, they have simply invoked their own rules which have been in place since the inception of the SPFL and which up to now have had no adverse comments from Hearts, who will have had input into the wording when they were written. I love the fact that serious money is about to be spent on this, it’s not about how much cash you have, it’s about whether you actually have a case or not !!

[Hibs4185]

They really are classless set of *ankers. Foulkes, deans etc.

All a set of old fools who used to form the establishment in Edinburgh. When these decrepit old fannies pass away, hopefully that’s the last of their ‘influential’ figures that saved them the last time.

Hope hearts stay in the championship for a very long time and get what they full deserve!

[bingo70]

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/hearts-owner-ann-budges-league-reconstruction-plan-be-ready-within-days-2858323


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Why is it not ready already? She’s had weeks.

[DaveF]

https://twitter.com/georgefoulkes/status/1262728390949421061?s=21


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Yep, that'll save Hearts. What a pathetic old fud he is.

[Billy Whizz]

https://twitter.com/georgefoulkes/status/1262728390949421061?s=21


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He’s a hoot

[Bostonhibby]

https://twitter.com/georgefoulkes/status/1262728390949421061?s=21


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkPresumably he's being paid for this trailblazing advice as he does like his expenses does this pee er of the realm.

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[MacGruber]

No need. Hearts won’t go legal. They are bluffing.


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They might sight their 'George Burley' defence which is defined as:-
If you have played 10 games of a season under George Burley you know how the rest of the season will pan out. If you have played 31 games with no George Burley nobody can claim how the season will end.

[hibeerealist]

No need. Hearts won’t go legal. They are bluffing.


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I agree Ozy they are just trying to talk up their belief that they were scammed out the league, NO legal action Budgie not that silly although it seems a number of her fans are!!

[G B Young]

https://twitter.com/georgefoulkes/status/1262728390949421061?s=21


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Jeez, hard to separate him and Leslie Deans when it comes to inflated egos and a belief that anyone actually takes them seriously.

Hearts claim the price of taking legal action is one worth paying when set against what being relegated is going to cost them. If that's the case I hope they DO go down the legal route, squandering their fans' 'serious' money and STILL ending up losing millions by playing in a lower league.

Out of interest, on what 'legal' basis to they hope to mount their case?

[007]

No need. Hearts won’t go legal. They are bluffing.


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I think they are too but it would send a message back saying come and have a go. Not worth wasting the time on right enough.

[Peevemor]

A "fans' group" is going to put in "serious money"? That already had me scared but when they mention bringing Stranraer supporters into it - crikey!!!

Then they wheel out that pointless old foulke-up... honestly, who gives a toss?

Stay classy jambos...

[Waxy]

They’re really looking very bad now. They dont even seem embarrassed at all. Shocking behaviour.

[Waxy]

Hearts are a championship club now. ICT and Dundee would have the legal right for entry to the prem if it expanded now.

[Greenworld]

They’re really looking very bad now. They dont even seem embarrassed at all. Shocking behaviour.The thing is have uefa not a aready given there blessing to the SPFL

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[greenginger]

Foulkes and Yam fans talking up legal action is simply to exert a little pressure on the others to vote for reconstruction. Hearts are now in a catch 22. The vote to relegate them has been taken. If they sue the other clubs - at BEST they may get a reprieve but that will come at the cost of pissing off the majority of other clubs in the Prem and most of the Champ sides as the only way they could remain in the Prem is by expanding the league. They will become the most hated club in the country.

They must be in SERIOUS financial bother to push this as far as they have. IMO, if they lose this, they will go bust.


This is wisdom piece from Budge should get circulated around Divs 1 and 2.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36999758

[Aldo]

Presumably he's being paid for this trailblazing advice as he does like his expenses does this pee er of the realm.

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Looks like auld pishy breeks needs to do his homework. UEFA gave the SPFL approval to finish the league?


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[Waxy]

The thing is have uefa not a aready given there blessing to the SPFL

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They did and they already stated it must be completed on sporting merit which it was.

[Billy Whizz]

They did and they already stated it must be completed on sporting merit which it was.

Hearts don’t do Sporting merit

[007]

Can't wait to see mad Vlad's video from the bridge of his submarine.

[Waxy]

Hearts don’t do Sporting merit

Your right it doesnt look like they do.
They finished bottom of the league.

[Victor]

https://twitter.com/georgefoulkes/status/1262728390949421061?s=21


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Beyond embarrassing. Is the old fool not aware that the UK government has more important things to worry about than saving some irrelevant football team from their self-inflicted fate?


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[hibbyfraelibby]

Jeez, hard to separate him and Leslie Deans when it comes to inflated egos and a belief that anyone actually takes them seriously.

Hearts claim the price of taking legal action is one worth paying when set against what being relegated is going to cost them. If that's the case I hope they DO go down the legal route, squandering their fans' 'serious' money and STILL ending up losing millions by playing in a lower league.

Out of interest, on what 'legal' basis to they hope to mount their case?

If it is sbout losing money playing in a lower league then to quantify that they must play in that league for a full season, open their books to court scrutiny to show their outgoings and income and demonstrate the reasonable losses.

In money terms they are talking about the difference between 12th place Prem money vs 1st place Championship money plus the parachute payment. On that basis they probably owe the league money😉

[hibbyfraelibby]

A "fans' group" is going to put in "serious money"? That already had me scared but when they mention bringing Stranraer supporters into it - crikey!!!

Then they wheel out that pointless old foulke-up... honestly, who gives a toss?

Stay classy jambos...

Does serious money buy you more legal clout than funny money?

[green day]

If it is sbout losing money playing in a lower league then to quantify that they must play in that league for a full season, open their books to court scrutiny to show their outgoings and income and demonstrate the reasonable losses.

In money terms they are talking about the difference between 12th place Prem money vs 1st place Championship money plus the parachute payment. On that basis theh probably owe the league money😉

The current difference between these is approx £800k.

No idea what the parachute payment is.

[JeMeSouviens]

Beyond embarrassing. Is the old fool not aware that the UK government has more important things to worry about than saving some irrelevant football team from their self-inflicted fate?


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Quite incredible. They do say booze consumption is getting dangerous in lockdown, right enough.

[greenginger]

Beyond embarrassing. Is the old fool not aware that the UK government has more important things to worry about than saving some irrelevant football team from their self-inflicted fate?


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Does he think the UK government will have forgotten that HOMFC stiffed the UK treasury for about £1.5 million not so long ago.

[weecounty hibby]

I couldn't help myself and had to reply to auld pish yer pants. Asked him to ask for an investigation into money laundering when Vlad was in charge, told him to remember he personally vouched for him. Every single one if them is totally deluded and totally off their nuts

[Caversham Green]

If it is sbout losing money playing in a lower league then to quantify that they must play in that league for a full season, open their books to court scrutiny to show their outgoings and income and demonstrate the reasonable losses.

In money terms they are talking about the difference between 12th place Prem money vs 1st place Championship money plus the parachute payment. On that basis they probably owe the league money😉

:agree: So far relegation hasn't cost them a single penny so they currently have no legal claim to compensation. If they play out the season as you suggest they'd have to show that they took reasonable steps to mitigate their losses - that would mean appointing a cheaper manager or moving a current employee into the manager role (and the ideal person is already there of course) and any new players would have to be cheaper than the ones they replace. The court should also consider the possibility that they would have been relegated anyway if the season had been completed - that looks more likely than not given their footballing performance over the last year and more.

The £3m being bandied about is a figment of Budge's imagination and has no basis in the facts currently available.

[hibbyfraelibby]

The current difference between these is approx £800k.

No idea what the parachute payment is.

The actual difference is £467k.from there you have to deduct the parachute year1 payment of £300k. That means the loss of income from the league is only £167k.

It could be argued that by finishing bottom Hearts will be financially better rewarded than Hamilton Accies who are in 11th, not being relegated, nor receiving the £500k parachure payment without the income from the play off final.

Hearts need to trade warily if they are going down the legal route as they may find the counter arguements will prove they have been adequately compensated and that expenditure under their control was neither reasonable nor transparently funded. The court would be invited to reveal Mr Ben E. Factor's identity as otherwise the income stream would not be admissible.

Just postulating like😉

[Joe6-2]

Your right it doesnt look like they do.
They finished bottom of the league.

Wasn’t that on merit?

[Waxy]

Wasn’t that on merit?

Yes it was. Sporting merit puts them bottom.
But they’re not liking it because they dont do sporting merit.

[Joe6-2]

Yes it was. Sporting merit puts them bottom.
But they’re not liking it because they dont do sporting merit.

😂

[Victor]

I couldn't help myself and had to reply to auld pish yer pants. Asked him to ask for an investigation into money laundering when Vlad was in charge, told him to remember he personally vouched for him. Every single one if them is totally deluded and totally off their nuts

I would not hold your breath waiting for a reply. Deluded old fart.


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[Not In The Know]

This is wisdom piece from Budge should get circulated around Divs 1 and 2.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36999758

hahahaha!

[Waxy]

This is wisdom piece from Budge should get circulated around Divs 1 and 2.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36999758

So Budge thinks we should only have 21 teams in Scotland?
Thats what she said there.

Here’s the blueprint for Scottish football.
I’m Ann Budge and i know best.
I want a 13 team Scottish super league with a eight team diddy league under that.
There shouldnt be any more teams under that so the rest must fold and go find regular jobs such as postman or chip fryer.

[jacomo]

This is wisdom piece from Budge should get circulated around Divs 1 and 2.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36999758


Ah, this was Budge in her prime, happily dispensing wisdom and humble bragging about her multi tasking abilities.

I mean, she still does those things, but the audience doesn’t seem so receptive these days.

[dchibs]

Hearts don’t do Sporting merit

Thats why they have been expelled.

[Irish_Steve]

Obviously our most recent statement has made it on Brokeback - good to see the are still obsessed with us on the anniversary of the day we died - bizarre!!

Buzzbomb1958:

Don't tell me the meltdown has begun the Hubs are asking the vermin not to ask for refunds on tickets promising to make it up to them, I hope that's the beginning of these rats starting to hurt tick tock

[high bee]

Obviously our most recent statement has made it on Brokeback - good to see the are still obsessed with us on the anniversary of the day we died - bizarre!!

Buzzbomb1958:

Don't tell me the meltdown has begun the Hubs are asking the vermin not to ask for refunds on tickets promising to make it up to them, I hope that's the beginning of these rats starting to hurt tick tock

Says the guys who’s team relies on monthly DDS over and above ticket sales. I’m going to assume he wants his team to issue automatic refunds then.

[malcolm]

The actual difference is £467k.from there you have to deduct the parachute year1 payment of £300k. That means the loss of income from the league is only £167k.

It could be argued that by finishing bottom Hearts will be financially better rewarded than Hamilton Accies who are in 11th, not being relegated, nor receiving the £500k parachure payment without the income from the play off final.

Hearts need to trade warily if they are going down the legal route as they may find the counter arguements will prove they have been adequately compensated and that expenditure under their control was neither reasonable nor transparently funded. The court would be invited to reveal Mr Ben E. Factor's identity as otherwise the income stream would not be admissible.

Just postulating like😉

Before anyone, with or without stained breeks, can even consider a loss the problem for them and any putative legal action, is that such loss needs to be caused by a legal wrong.

At best they’d maybe look at negligence in a duty of care where that has been carried out below the standard of care that any reasonable person would apply. Thing is I’m not seeing that anything, about ending the season, deciding on relegation or not opting for reconstruction, could be considered as unreasonably decided. Also the duty of care part, of clubs to each other, is in my humble unqualified opinion a bit of a stretch :wink:

[hibby rae]

This is wisdom piece from Budge should get circulated around Divs 1 and 2.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36999758

Aside from highlighting her double standards, this article is a nauseating fawning display from Tom English. He's defo rubbed one out thinking about her.

[Springbank]

Yep, still obsessed with us. Post 11813 on one of the threads about them

As opposed to 11813 threads over the road :)

[G B Young]

This is wisdom piece from Budge should get circulated around Divs 1 and 2.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36999758

Misplaced arrogance (or perhaps just embarrassing naivety) there for sure. You can tell she thinks she has this whole football thing under her wing with her condescending comments. Just another job done for top businesswoman Budge.

'Who needs sleep anyway?'

Probably safe to say she's not getting much these days.

[04Sauzee]

buzzbomb1958

Posted 4 hours ago
Don't tell me the meltdown has begun the Hubs are asking the vermin not to ask for refunds on tickets promising to make it up to them, I hope that's the beginning of these rats starting to hurt tick tock

Quote

[Tambo]

Now pushing the blame on berwick.

[Waxy]

Before anyone, with or without stained breeks, can even consider a loss the problem for them and any putative legal action, is that such loss needs to be caused by a legal wrong.

At best they’d maybe look at negligence in a duty of care where that has been carried out below the standard of care that any reasonable person would apply. Thing is I’m not seeing that anything, about ending the season, deciding on relegation or not opting for reconstruction, could be considered as unreasonably decided. Also the duty of care part, of clubs to each other, is in my humble unqualified opinion a bit of a stretch :wink:
The duty of care wouldnt allow all premier clubs to take a big drop in money to keep hearts up.That could be devastating to a club like Hamilton.A pretty small increase on hearts parachute payment is the most they can hope for.They may not even be entitled to that.

[Peevemor]

The duty of care wouldnt allow all premier clubs to take a big drop in money to keep hearts up.That could be devastating to a club like Hamilton.A pretty small increase on hearts parachute payment is the most they can hope for.They may not even be entitled to that.

I wouldn't even give them that for 2 reasons. Firstly it's almost like an admission of guilt, as if they've been hard done by, when in fact the season has ended in accordance with already established rules. Secondly, they shouldn't be given a greater advantage over their fellow championship clubs.

[blackpoolhibs]

Hearts and their £3m lawsuits are funny, they are like the couple who turn up at dragons den with an idea they can teach pigeons to fly, and want £3m for 1 percent of their company.

[Gloucester Hibs]

I wouldn't even give them that for 2 reasons. Firstly it's almost like an admission of guilt, as if they've been hard done by, when in fact the season has ended in accordance with already established rules. Secondly, they shouldn't be given a greater advantage over their fellow championship clubs.

I’d give them it on condition they now STFU about perceived injustices and all the other rubbish they’ve been coming out with. Basically not another word is said on the matter. Failure to do so and they get charged with bringing the game into disrepute.

[Joe6-2]

I wouldn't even give them that for 2 reasons. Firstly it's almost like an admission of guilt, as if they've been hard done by, when in fact the season has ended in accordance with already established rules. Secondly, they shouldn't be given a greater advantage over their fellow championship clubs.

I’m sure the teams who lost out on playoffs would be interested if that lot get any compensation

[Waxy]

I wouldn't even give them that for 2 reasons. Firstly it's almost like an admission of guilt, as if they've been hard done by, when in fact the season has ended in accordance with already established rules. Secondly, they shouldn't be given a greater advantage over their fellow championship clubs.

Its a good point. Where’s the care be to championship clubs there.hearts are no special case.

[Onion]

I’m sure the teams who lost out on playoffs would be interested if that lot get any compensation

Exactly. Hearts are not a special case. The fact they think they are just reveals their arrogance and sense of self-importance. ALL the clubs who were disadvantaged by Covid-19 have a case for compensation - including Hibs. In an ideal world, there would have been a pot of cash to soften the blow but there isn't. Clubs are just trying to survive. Hearts desperate threat of legal action is as embarrassing as it is futile - a deflection tactic of Sevconian proportions. Budge, Levein, Stendel, their rotten players and staff will have to face up to their own responsibilities soon.

[calumhibee1]

Exactly. Hearts are not a special case. The fact they think they are just reveals their arrogance and sense of self-importance. ALL the clubs who were disadvantaged by Covid-19 have a case for compensation - including Hibs. In an ideal world, there would have been a pot of cash to soften the blow but there isn't. Clubs are just trying to survive. Hearts desperate threat of legal action is as embarrassing as it is futile - a deflection tactic of Sevconian proportions. Budge, Levein, Stendel, their rotten players and staff will have to face up to their own responsibilities soon.

:agree:

If hearts are given a penny then we should be squared up for the money we ‘lost’ by dropping a place.

Funnily enough, we’re not that pathetic. Infact, if it’ll shut them up, they can have the money we lost.

[calumhibee1]

If they think any of they players are anywhere near good enough for the Championship then they’re in for a hell of a fright.

[AltheHibby]

Now pushing the blame on berwick.

In what way?

[Tambo]

In what way?

Saying they have messed up the whole of Scottish football.

[lucky]

I hope the SPLF finally put this restructuring to bed. Then we can all move on and they can start their legal case. When they lose then they will be liable for the SPLF costs. I’d be amazed if the premiership clubs agreed to given them more compensation that they are entitled too. They’ve been relegated and now don’t even have a vote as a premiership club that’s why she’s going down the route of 16 clubs. This is not going to end well for her or their club. At least being in the championship she’ll have another excuse not to hand over the shares.

[AltheHibby]

Saying they have messed up the whole of Scottish football.

Is it Brechin rather than Berwick? I see them having a go at Brechin.

I see they also have a top 5 reasons to hate us thread. Honestly, I despair that people like that have access to public forums.

[Ozyhibby]

I wouldn't even give them that for 2 reasons. Firstly it's almost like an admission of guilt, as if they've been hard done by, when in fact the season has ended in accordance with already established rules. Secondly, they shouldn't be given a greater advantage over their fellow championship clubs.

Add to that, why should Hamilton with a tiny turnover give money to Hearts with a much larger turnover?


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[Ozyhibby]

I’d give them it on condition they now STFU about perceived injustices and all the other rubbish they’ve been coming out with. Basically not another word is said on the matter. Failure to do so and they get charged with bringing the game into disrepute.

Bringing the game into disrepute charge no longer exists in Scottish football.


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[Gloucester Hibs]

Bringing the game into disrepute charge no longer exists in Scottish football.


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Figured as much. Certain clubs appear to say and do as they please with impunity.

[Bostonhibby]

Is it Brechin rather than Berwick? I see them having a go at Brechin.

I see they also have a top 5 reasons to hate us thread. Honestly, I despair that people like that have access to public forums.It's actually North Berwick, think they're just working their way round the country blaming everything in their wake, Dunbar are equally to blame.

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[James Stephen]

:agree:

If hearts are given a penny then we should be squared up for the money we ‘lost’ by dropping a place.

Funnily enough, we’re not that pathetic. Infact, if it’ll shut them up, they can have the money we lost.

The thing is, could Hibs not have conceivably caught Morherwell and Aberdeen? Could they not have caught the huns?

The fact is every club can take a super optimistic view of where they might had finished given an amazing end to the season.

But the league cant be finished like that, and so the closest they can come is to use past performance as the best indicators of future performance, i.e. av points per game.

Its not perfect, and most clubs can claim a level of injustice, but it is the most accurate way to still award league places based on sporting merit.

Ive said right from the start its the fairest way, despite it costing Hibs.

[Onion]

I hope the SPLF finally put this restructuring to bed. Then we can all move on and they can start their legal case. When they lose then they will be liable for the SPLF costs. I’d be amazed if the premiership clubs agreed to given them more compensation that they are entitled too. They’ve been relegated and now don’t even have a vote as a premiership club that’s why she’s going down the route of 16 clubs. This is not going to end well for her or their club. At least being in the championship she’ll have another excuse not to hand over the shares.

Ok, Ann we've restructured the SPFL. Happy now ? :greengrin

[calumhibee1]

The thing is, could Hibs not have conceivably caught Morherwell and Aberdeen? Could they not have caught the huns?

The fact is every club can take a super optimistic view of where they might had finished given an amazing end to the season.

But the league cant be finished like that, and so the closest they can come is to use past performance as the best indicators of future performance, i.e. av points per game.

Its not perfect, and most clubs can claim a level of injustice, but it is the most accurate way to still award league places based on sporting merit.

Ive said right from the start its the fairest way, despite it costing Hibs.

:agree:

It really is that simple.

[jacomo]

I see they also have a top 5 reasons to hate us thread. Honestly, I despair that people like that have access to public forums.


That’s really sad. What a desperate, small-minded bunch.

[Keith_M]

The thing is, could Hibs not have conceivably caught Morherwell and Aberdeen?

It was highly unlikely but, mathematically, we could still have finished third.



Could they not have caught the huns?


We were thirty points behind with 24 points to play for, so I'd say... probably not.

[Crazyhorse]

If we hadn't kept losing to the worst team in the league, we would have been fifth; even with Hecky's otherwise disastrous spell in charge.

It’s so galling. Without us the maroon plums would have been well and truly stranded at the bottom.

[Waxy]

The thing is, could Hibs not have conceivably caught Morherwell and Aberdeen? Could they not have caught the huns?

The fact is every club can take a super optimistic view of where they might had finished given an amazing end to the season.

But the league cant be finished like that, and so the closest they can come is to use past performance as the best indicators of future performance, i.e. av points per game.

Its not perfect, and most clubs can claim a level of injustice, but it is the most accurate way to still award league places based on sporting merit.

Ive said right from the start its the fairest way, despite it costing Hibs.
Exactly. If hearts can go to court for what might have been, then every team must be treated the same.
Hearts dont have a leg to stand on.

[ballengeich]

Could Hearts take Mrs Budge to court? Employing Levein and Stendel as managers must be some kind of offence under legislation covering directors' responsibilities.

[04Sauzee]

Kickback is a hoot

https://www.hmfckickback.co.uk/index.php?/topic/188844-has-it-begun-hibs-ticket-refunds/

[James Stephen]

It was highly unlikely but, mathematically, we could still have finished third.





We were thirty points behind with 24 points to play for, so I'd say... probably not.

Sorry, i meant Motherwell or Dons, im not THAT optimistic 😁

[Rocky]

Kickback is a hoot

https://www.hmfckickback.co.uk/index.php?/topic/188844-has-it-begun-hibs-ticket-refunds/

To be fair most of them are pointing out that Hibs approach is perfectly sensible. Plus one of them makes an interesting point about whether VAT should be payable on the "potential refund" amount given that it's effectively a donation. I won't claim to understand the tax implications but hypothetically if Hibs were to refund 10,000 supporters £60 each, then that would include £100,000 of VAT and £500,000 of income. If all of those refunds were then donated back to the club they would gain the full £600,000 and thus be £100,000 better off? Could this be implemented by offering all supporters a specific opt in to claiming a refund then donating it back?

[Carheenlea]

I see they also have a top 5 reasons to hate us thread. Honestly, I despair that people like that have access to public forums.

“ On the anniversary of the doing we gave them, what are the ultimate top 5 reasons you have for despising them?

Let me start with:

Their support.

Their bitterness, and inability to accept, that they are Edinburgh’s wee team.

Bleating on about a game that was played over 47 years ago. In which they gained two league points! Two.

Deeks.

Mickey Weir.

I choose ‘top 5’ because, if I hadn’t, I could have been here all night”


The OP claims he could have been there all night despite running out of ideas after 3 reasons :lolyam:

[Skol]

I accept that the current situation is far from ideal and its possible (not likely) that Hearts could have made their way off the bottom and into a play off place. I would much rather we had played the 38 games and they went down with no cause for complaint (although I am sure they would still complain).

The problems though are that there are very few options and no option works for all.

-Finishing the season whenever we can eats into the next one.
- Voiding the season puts the impact on Dundee United which flies in the face of their sporting integrity and no one should be impacted
- Reconstruction means that 12 clubs who will already be financially impacted are asked to give up a bit more to ensure Hearts and one other promoted club are recompensed. Then we have a situation where many more clubs are at risk of going down next year because we all did our bit to help hearts. Also see above re no one being worse off

There really is no good outcome here and hearts really should appreciate that. Rather than legal demands and threats and looking for reconstruction, they should be thinking about the bigger picture here.

Hearts essentially want everyone else to soften the blow for them, when their current position is all of their own making and arguably was avoidable.

I do feel for the SPFL who have to wrestle with all the above and I even see partly where Hearts are coming from. However, had they beaten St Mirren on that fateful night, I wonder what their position would have been.

[Keith_M]

Sorry, i meant Motherwell or Dons, im not THAT optimistic 😁


Fair enough

:greengrin

[Sammy7nil]

It was highly unlikely but, mathematically, we could still have finished third.





We were thirty points behind with 24 points to play for, so I'd say... probably not.

But there was still a chance :wink:

[Since90+2]

I accept that the current situation is far from ideal and its possible (not likely) that Hearts could have made their way off the bottom and into a play off place. I would much rather we had played the 38 games and they went down with no cause for complaint (although I am sure they would still complain).

The problems though are that there are very few options and no option works for all.

-Finishing the season whenever we can eats into the next one.
- Voiding the season puts the impact on Dundee United which flies in the face of their sporting integrity and no one should be impacted
- Reconstruction means that 12 clubs who will already be financially impacted are asked to give up a bit more to ensure Hearts and one other promoted club are recompensed. Then we have a situation where many more clubs are at risk of going down next year because we all did our bit to help hearts. Also see above re no one being worse off

There really is no good outcome here and hearts really should appreciate that. Rather than legal demands and threats and looking for reconstruction, they should be thinking about the bigger picture here.

Hearts essentially want everyone else to soften the blow for them, when their current position is all of their own making and arguably was avoidable.

I do feel for the SPFL who have to wrestle with all the above and I even see partly where Hearts are coming from. However, had they beaten St Mirren on that fateful night, I wonder what their position would have been.

If Hearts had beaten St Mirren and were 2nd bottom they'd be saying **** all about reconstruction and would have voted to end the league. Absolutely guaranteed and them and their fans know it too.

[The 90+2]

If Hearts had beaten St Mirren and were 2nd bottom they'd be saying **** all about reconstruction and would have voted to end the league. Absolutely guaranteed and them and their fans know it too.

Their fans don’t actually know it. They are that two faced and deluded they think they would have stood up to save erm a team they’ve hated for the past 30 years. Flumps.

[Alfred E Newman]

I accept that the current situation is far from ideal and its possible (not likely) that Hearts could have made their way off the bottom and into a play off place. I would much rather we had played the 38 games and they went down with no cause for complaint (although I am sure they would still complain).

The problems though are that there are very few options and no option works for all.

-Finishing the season whenever we can eats into the next one.
- Voiding the season puts the impact on Dundee United which flies in the face of their sporting integrity and no one should be impacted
- Reconstruction means that 12 clubs who will already be financially impacted are asked to give up a bit more to ensure Hearts and one other promoted club are recompensed. Then we have a situation where many more clubs are at risk of going down next year because we all did our bit to help hearts. Also see above re no one being worse off

There really is no good outcome here and hearts really should appreciate that. Rather than legal demands and threats and looking for reconstruction, they should be thinking about the bigger picture here.

Hearts essentially want everyone else to soften the blow for them, when their current position is all of their own making and arguably was avoidable.

I do feel for the SPFL who have to wrestle with all the above and I even see partly where Hearts are coming from. However, had they beaten St Mirren on that fateful night, I wonder what their position would have been.

They have handled this so badly even some of their own supporters are embarrassed. Tough as it may be they could have come out of this with a bit of credit for the good of the game, and I'm sure their supporters would have helped them take the hit financially.

[Greenworld]

They have handled this so badly even some of their own supporters are embarrassed. Tough as it may be they could have come out of this with a bit of credit for the good of the game, and I'm sure their supporters would have helped them take the hit financially.The desperation may well be just that it is not beyond the realms of possibility that financially they are a lot worse than people realise. It makes sense the reporter who spoke with a leading club who discussed admin must have been Hearts. You cannot hemorrhage the money they have in all aspects of the business and be ok . HEARTS ARE GOING BROKE

Sent from my SM-G975U1 using Tapatalk

[Aldo]

The desperation may well be just that it is not beyond the realms of possibility that financially they are a lot worse than people realise. It makes sense the reporter who spoke with a leading club who discussed admin must have been Hearts. You cannot hemorrhage the money they have in all aspects of the business and be ok . HEARTS ARE GOING BROKE

Sent from my SM-G975U1 using Tapatalk

I think her mentioning in the media that the club have/had a £3 million cash shortfall to get through COVID backs this up imho.

Their outgoings were reported as £1.5 million a month, or in that region. They’ve also received large multi million pound donations which has been pissed away!

They’ve not lived within their means and this backs up the theory and using COVID is a smokescreen.

No club in Scotland outwith the OF are big enough to cope with that sort of outgoing without a massive influx of cash..... it just doesn’t add up.

FWIW I really hope it’s them and they go pop fir a second time.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[jacomo]

If Hearts had beaten St Mirren and were 2nd bottom they'd be saying **** all about reconstruction and would have voted to end the league. Absolutely guaranteed and them and their fans know it too.


Everyone knows this to be true.

It’s why Budge’s repeated claims for the moral high ground really stick in the throat.

[Jones28]

Kickback is a hoot

https://www.hmfckickback.co.uk/index.php?/topic/188844-has-it-begun-hibs-ticket-refunds/

Oh man, the desperation for some news of financial hardship to come out is palpable.

Typing “tick tock”...it almost sounds like they’re pleading.

[Joe6-2]

Oh man, the desperation for some news of financial hardship to come out is palpable.

Typing “tick tock”...it almost sounds like they’re pleading.

The word ‘Fud’ was invented for them

[Jdawg]

The word ‘Fud’ was invented for them

10 out of 10!

[Alan62]

That's a fascinating thread. It's incredible that they're busy pointing out the SPFL rule book to say that Hibernian will have to pay deferred wages by January while simultaneously failing to remember that the SPFL rules also show that their 'demotion'/'expulsion' was also written into the rules for all to see.

[Barney McGrew]

Am I correct in thinking that now the league has been called then they won’t be able to activate the fabled ‘Clause 12’ if they needed to?

[Skol]

Clause 12 I believe is a ted herring as all it does is allow them to defer wages during any suspension. Not sure they could use it to avoid paying or end contracts. They also couldn’t use it for those they wanted rid of but not use it for their potentially saleable assets. Or should that say hickey.

[greenginger]

The word ‘Fud’ was invented for them


Not necessarily, unless they are doing nuts as well as chips. :greengrin


https://www.sainsburys.co.uk/gol-ui/product/asian/fudco-deluxe-assorted-nut-mix-500g

[brog]

I think her mentioning in the media that the club have/had a £3 million cash shortfall to get through COVID backs this up imho.

Their outgoings were reported as £1.5 million a month, or in that region. They’ve also received large multi million pound donations which has been pissed away!

They’ve not lived within their means and this backs up the theory and using COVID is a smokescreen.

No club in Scotland outwith the OF are big enough to cope with that sort of outgoing without a massive influx of cash..... it just doesn’t add up.

FWIW I really hope it’s them and they go pop fir a second time.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

A little less, about £1.24m to end June last year. Of course could be higher now with the cash that was splashed to avoid relegation. On that note I still struggle to get my head round Budge giving that (their high spend) as a reason not to relegate them!

[Aldo]

A little less, about £1.24m to end June last year. Of course could be higher now with the cash that was splashed to avoid relegation. On that note I still struggle to get my head round Budge giving that (their high spend) as a reason not to relegate them!

Think we had the chat about that before Brog. You have to remember though it’s what BIG teams do but as you’ve mentioned I cannot get my head round why this is a reason.

Don’t relegate us cos we’ve spent outwith our means.

I do however look forward to reconstruction falling flat and her statement regarding their way forward


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[RoYO!]

The tick tock stuff from them really is laughable! Desperation in its truest form.

I'm not sure the club has ever been in a better place both financially and infrastructure wise. Covid has then come along and one step after the next the club have made decisions that are in keeping with the class at the core of the club.

Not shouting from the rooftops- a calm and most importantly considered, considerate approach looking out for the club, employees, fans and broader society. It's an A+ from me.

So let them clutch at straws. Whilst we watch on, with a wry smile and a shake of the head.

[Since452]

Dundee United for Hearts is a great swap. Similar sized traveling support with the promotion bounce. Will soften the blow for the so called tinpot diddy clubs as Hearts fans like to call them

[Joe6-2]

Not necessarily, unless they are doing nuts as well as chips. :greengrin


https://www.sainsburys.co.uk/gol-ui/product/asian/fudco-deluxe-assorted-nut-mix-500g

Well they are certainly nuts!

[Waxy]

A little less, about £1.24m to end June last year. Of course could be higher now with the cash that was splashed to avoid relegation. On that note I still struggle to get my head round Budge giving that (their high spend) as a reason not to relegate them!
Football success at any cost to anyone is their motto.


2 Sports Marketing Ltd £5,153
A1 Minibus & Coaches £100
ADT Fire£1,033
Ayr United FC£1,750
Arnold Clark Finance£6,764
Allan Dick£50
Alasdair Fraser£528
Ardue House Hotel£180
AllStar Business Solutions£100
Alexander Szaorari£9,100
AB Ukio Bankas£15,488,290
Baltic Clipper£497
Bank of Scotland (Merchant Services)£100
Bank of Scotland (Equipment Finance)£970
Beswicks Sports Ltd£3,000
BOC Gases£490
British Red Cross£76
BT£3,024
British Gas£580
BIG Hearts Community Trust£589
Bruce Rae Property Management£34,048
Business Line UAB£204,143
Cable & Wireless£2,198
James Calcer£1,411
Cameron Presentations£5,406
Campbell Medical Supplies£100
Janette Campbell£100
Cardiac Services£152
Charlie Irons Coaches£100
Chamic£100
Childcare Vouchers£100
B Ciocco£11,469
Citroen£5,232
Clearwater Technology£5,156
Clouds£6,870
Coerver Coaching Scotland£949
Concept Group£841
Copymade Ltd£100
Corona Energy Retail£29,729
The Insolvency Service£0
DJ Alexander£6,323
David Cameron£110
Miss Amal Daher£120
Dataserve UK£160
DC Lighting Services£652
DJB Fire & Safety Training£48
Outfield Harrison£1,816
Daisy Communications£1,474
Ensco 165 £509,464
Eamonn Collins£5,000
Edinburgh Chamber of Commerce£674
Elite Medicale£222
Ermington Associates£100
Egkijius Valiauga£863
Fife Imaging Associates£903
Fountain Court Apartments£100
Football Safety Officers£230
GF Capital Solutions£337
John Gibson£2,520
Glenham Property£100
Graeme Rankin Sports Mgmt.£12,000
Green Star Media£77
Greentech Sportsturf£1,056
G4S£12,057
GroupCall Ltd.£210
HM Revenue - VAT£0
HM Revenue£1,881,068
Hamilton & Brydie£144
Hectic Life£52
HBJ Gateley Wareing£100
Herriot Watt£145,655
Highlander Kilt Hire£430
Hitachi Capital£7
Holiday Inn Aberdeen£58
Homespring Ltd£499
Sven Housten£40
HoMFC Shareholder Association£5,030
Impact Signs£6,499
InterLax£234
Interface En£100
James Armstrong & Co£1,520
Johnston Carmichael£100
Jane Lofthouse Johnson£410
James Sandison£680
J Thomson Colour Printers£100
Kauno Futbolo£13,431
Key Sports Management£23,049
Korelita£52,610
KPMG Hungary£1,190
Lady Haigs Poppy Fund£185
Lietuvos Rytas£37
Livingston FC£282
Liverpool FC£46,625
Llyods TSB£17,165
Lex Autolease£1,159
Lochgreen Hotel£510
Lyco Direct Ltd.£1,822
Milson Capital Corp£1,223,989
Ian Maclennan£335
McCraes Battalion Trust£100
Dr Carrie McCrea£760
Tony McGill£19,625
Dr Scott McKie£700
McRae of Gorgie£560
Meridan Hospital£790
Dr Andrew Murray£250
Musselburgh Athletic FC£5,790
Michael Page International£100
NHS Lothian£75
NHS Fife £739
North Lanarkshire Council£100
Northgate Vechile Hire£100
Nuffield Health£4,645
OG Lawfirm£5,000
Orange£5,896
PHS Group£1,110
Pulsant Scotland£240
Paton Plant Ltd£3,290
Pendrich Height Services£6,552
Performing Right Society£13,995
Pitch International£4,746
PPL Sport & Leisure£1,325
PPL£4,133
Premier Sports£4,836
ProKit£100
ProAmica£34,899
Professor Ernest Schiders£2,410
Rapide Communication£176
Respublikos Investicija£62
Runos Vertimal£43
RWN Orthopaedics£100
Ryden Lettings£100
Rigby Taylor Ltd.£1,564
Robert Graeme Wilson£150
Spie Matthew£2,436
Spire Healthcare£3,118
Scottish Water£100
Steve Hutchison£3,430
Scottish Police Authority£18,585
Savills£20,602
Scottish Ambulance Services£2,454
Scomac Catering Equip.£100
Scottish Power (Stadium)£9,544
Scottish Power (Ticket Office)£5,467
Scottish Power (Admin Block)£1,254
Scottish Gas Business£347
Scrubbers Laundry£162
SDMS£411
Securevent Security£12,309
SFA£5,011
Shanks Waste Mgmt.£1,211
Scottish Hydro Electric£139
Jordan Shearer£90
Shred-it£457
Sky Business£100
Slaters£100
SNS Group£1,281
Spectator Seating£13,005
Speedy Power£100
Sportsmasters£1,648
Sporting ID£100
Sports Medicine Uraea AB£2,700
SRM Hearts£19,853
Scottish Power£100
St Andrews First Aid£364
Stenhousemuir FC£12,900
Stellar Football Ltd£5,750
Streamline Print Mgmt.£418
Superturas£26,636
Scottish Youth Football Assoc.£1,700
T.G Baker Sound£2,656
ThyssenKnapp Elevator£3,378
City of Edinburgh Council£90,715
City of Edinburgh Council (for flats)£2,631
The Edinburgh Clinic£557
Newspaper Licensing Agency£1,428
Talk Talk£5,548
The Rangers FC£1,410
Ticketmaster£33,112
TNT UK£8
TNT Post£56
Trichem£1,380
Technology Services Group£1,967
Turnstile Systems£810
UAB litcargus£1,166
UK Football Academy£228
Unum£2,300
UAB Ukio£8,151,497
Veecom Systems£3,525
Viola£290
Vodafone Connect£343
Wallace Brown/Langstane£956
Weatherseal£42
Western Saab£500
Dr David Whitaker£500
Scott Wilson£1,000
Yorkshire Clinic£2,562

[04Sauzee]

Football success at any cost to anyone is their motto.


2 Sports Marketing Ltd £5,153
A1 Minibus & Coaches £100
ADT Fire£1,033
Ayr United FC£1,750
Arnold Clark Finance£6,764
Allan Dick£50
Alasdair Fraser£528
Ardue House Hotel£180
AllStar Business Solutions£100
Alexander Szaorari£9,100
AB Ukio Bankas£15,488,290
Baltic Clipper£497
Bank of Scotland (Merchant Services)£100
Bank of Scotland (Equipment Finance)£970
Beswicks Sports Ltd£3,000
BOC Gases£490
British Red Cross£76
BT£3,024
British Gas£580
BIG Hearts Community Trust£589
Bruce Rae Property Management£34,048
Business Line UAB£204,143
Cable & Wireless£2,198
James Calcer£1,411
Cameron Presentations£5,406
Campbell Medical Supplies£100
Janette Campbell£100
Cardiac Services£152
Charlie Irons Coaches£100
Chamic£100
Childcare Vouchers£100
B Ciocco£11,469
Citroen£5,232
Clearwater Technology£5,156
Clouds£6,870
Coerver Coaching Scotland£949
Concept Group£841
Copymade Ltd£100
Corona Energy Retail£29,729
The Insolvency Service£0
DJ Alexander£6,323
David Cameron£110
Miss Amal Daher£120
Dataserve UK£160
DC Lighting Services£652
DJB Fire & Safety Training£48
Outfield Harrison£1,816
Daisy Communications£1,474
Ensco 165 £509,464
Eamonn Collins£5,000
Edinburgh Chamber of Commerce£674
Elite Medicale£222
Ermington Associates£100
Egkijius Valiauga£863
Fife Imaging Associates£903
Fountain Court Apartments£100
Football Safety Officers£230
GF Capital Solutions£337
John Gibson£2,520
Glenham Property£100
Graeme Rankin Sports Mgmt.£12,000
Green Star Media£77
Greentech Sportsturf£1,056
G4S£12,057
GroupCall Ltd.£210
HM Revenue - VAT£0
HM Revenue£1,881,068
Hamilton & Brydie£144
Hectic Life£52
HBJ Gateley Wareing£100
Herriot Watt£145,655
Highlander Kilt Hire£430
Hitachi Capital£7
Holiday Inn Aberdeen£58
Homespring Ltd£499
Sven Housten£40
HoMFC Shareholder Association£5,030
Impact Signs£6,499
InterLax£234
Interface En£100
James Armstrong & Co£1,520
Johnston Carmichael£100
Jane Lofthouse Johnson£410
James Sandison£680
J Thomson Colour Printers£100
Kauno Futbolo£13,431
Key Sports Management£23,049
Korelita£52,610
KPMG Hungary£1,190
Lady Haigs Poppy Fund£185
Lietuvos Rytas£37
Livingston FC£282
Liverpool FC£46,625
Llyods TSB£17,165
Lex Autolease£1,159
Lochgreen Hotel£510
Lyco Direct Ltd.£1,822
Milson Capital Corp£1,223,989
Ian Maclennan£335
McCraes Battalion Trust£100
Dr Carrie McCrea£760
Tony McGill£19,625
Dr Scott McKie£700
McRae of Gorgie£560
Meridan Hospital£790
Dr Andrew Murray£250
Musselburgh Athletic FC£5,790
Michael Page International£100
NHS Lothian£75
NHS Fife £739
North Lanarkshire Council£100
Northgate Vechile Hire£100
Nuffield Health£4,645
OG Lawfirm£5,000
Orange£5,896
PHS Group£1,110
Pulsant Scotland£240
Paton Plant Ltd£3,290
Pendrich Height Services£6,552
Performing Right Society£13,995
Pitch International£4,746
PPL Sport & Leisure£1,325
PPL£4,133
Premier Sports£4,836
ProKit£100
ProAmica£34,899
Professor Ernest Schiders£2,410
Rapide Communication£176
Respublikos Investicija£62
Runos Vertimal£43
RWN Orthopaedics£100
Ryden Lettings£100
Rigby Taylor Ltd.£1,564
Robert Graeme Wilson£150
Spie Matthew£2,436
Spire Healthcare£3,118
Scottish Water£100
Steve Hutchison£3,430
Scottish Police Authority£18,585
Savills£20,602
Scottish Ambulance Services£2,454
Scomac Catering Equip.£100
Scottish Power (Stadium)£9,544
Scottish Power (Ticket Office)£5,467
Scottish Power (Admin Block)£1,254
Scottish Gas Business£347
Scrubbers Laundry£162
SDMS£411
Securevent Security£12,309
SFA£5,011
Shanks Waste Mgmt.£1,211
Scottish Hydro Electric£139
Jordan Shearer£90
Shred-it£457
Sky Business£100
Slaters£100
SNS Group£1,281
Spectator Seating£13,005
Speedy Power£100
Sportsmasters£1,648
Sporting ID£100
Sports Medicine Uraea AB£2,700
SRM Hearts£19,853
Scottish Power£100
St Andrews First Aid£364
Stenhousemuir FC£12,900
Stellar Football Ltd£5,750
Streamline Print Mgmt.£418
Superturas£26,636
Scottish Youth Football Assoc.£1,700
T.G Baker Sound£2,656
ThyssenKnapp Elevator£3,378
City of Edinburgh Council£90,715
City of Edinburgh Council (for flats)£2,631
The Edinburgh Clinic£557
Newspaper Licensing Agency£1,428
Talk Talk£5,548
The Rangers FC£1,410
Ticketmaster£33,112
TNT UK£8
TNT Post£56
Trichem£1,380
Technology Services Group£1,967
Turnstile Systems£810
UAB litcargus£1,166
UK Football Academy£228
Unum£2,300
UAB Ukio£8,151,497
Veecom Systems£3,525
Viola£290
Vodafone Connect£343
Wallace Brown/Langstane£956
Weatherseal£42
Western Saab£500
Dr David Whitaker£500
Scott Wilson£1,000
Yorkshire Clinic£2,562
1.8m to HM Revenue, was that ever repaid?
George Foulkes wanting Boris to save his Hearts 😂

[Ozyhibby]

1.8m to HM Revenue, was that ever repaid?
George Foulkes wanting Boris to save his Hearts [emoji23]

Johnson won’t even show up for work as it is, I doubt he’ll have much interest in Hearts.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Wee Scottie Dug]

1.8m to HM Revenue, was that ever repaid?
George Foulkes wanting Boris to save his Hearts 😂

Not a penny ....... the CVA 'accepted' paid out 0p in the £ ........ :rolleyes:

[04Sauzee]

Not a penny ....... the CVA 'accepted' paid out 0p in the £ ........ :rolleyes:

Makes it more sickening they are looking for other clubs to help fund their fight and that old Benny couldn't have paid back their non football debts

[inglisavhibs]

I accept that the current situation is far from ideal and its possible (not likely) that Hearts could have made their way off the bottom and into a play off place. I would much rather we had played the 38 games and they went down with no cause for complaint (although I am sure they would still complain).

The problems though are that there are very few options and no option works for all.

-Finishing the season whenever we can eats into the next one.
- Voiding the season puts the impact on Dundee United which flies in the face of their sporting integrity and no one should be impacted
- Reconstruction means that 12 clubs who will already be financially impacted are asked to give up a bit more to ensure Hearts and one other promoted club are recompensed. Then we have a situation where many more clubs are at risk of going down next year because we all did our bit to help hearts. Also see above re no one being worse off

There really is no good outcome here and hearts really should appreciate that. Rather than legal demands and threats and looking for reconstruction, they should be thinking about the bigger picture here.

Hearts essentially want everyone else to soften the blow for them, when their current position is all of their own making and arguably was avoidable.

I do feel for the SPFL who have to wrestle with all the above and I even see partly where Hearts are coming from. However, had they beaten St Mirren on that fateful night, I wonder what their position would have been.
The method used to finish our season was also used in Belgium and France. In Belgium the team relegated were only 2 points from the next team with I think 10 games to go. In France two teams were relegated and the second bottom team were 4 points adrift, the same as Hearts. If England can’t finish their games they will have a similar problem. As you say there wasn’t an easy solution and the SFL has had plenty accusations thrown at them unlike the French and Belgians. Yes it’s unlucky and not what you would want but time to get on with it. As many of their own fans are saying, maybe best to look at the running of their club for answers to their problems.

[Alan62]

Sweet bit of schadenfreude for one particular creditor that CORONA virus has had such a big part to play in their current woes.

Corona Energy Retail £29,729

[plhibs]

Sweet bit of schadenfreude for one particular creditor that CORONA virus has had such a big part to play in their current woes.

Corona Energy Retail £29,729

I had to laugh at that one, karma, a word they like to use.
Anyone know why thy owed Stenhousemuir FC 12 gs ?

[Sammy7nil]

What they appear to be missing is potentially every club that was not top or mathematical impossible to catch the team above them may have lost out financially. They all had the opportunity to improve their position.

Perhaps 38 of our clubs could take the SPFL to court?

[Kojock]

Their fans don’t actually know it. They are that two faced and deluded they think they would have stood up to save erm a team they’ve hated for the past 30 years. Flumps.

They blame St Mirren for 1986 instead of asking why their team blew it at Dens. FFS a draw would’ve sufficed but they couldn’t even do that. Its a Hear7s trait to blame everyone else for their failings. Budge is now doing exactly the same.

[Bostonhibby]

I had to laugh at that one, karma, a word they like to use.
Anyone know why thy owed Stenhousemuir FC 12 gs ?Stenhousemuir looking to have one of those "special" relationships?

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[Kojock]

Think we had the chat about that before Brog. You have to remember though it’s what BIG teams do but as you’ve mentioned I cannot get my head round why this is a reason.

Don’t relegate us cos we’ve spent outwith our means.

I do however look forward to reconstruction falling flat and her statement regarding their way forward


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The stupid old boot said it was unfair to relegate them as they had spent a lot of money to avoid it. WTF

[et_hibby]

Corona Energy Retail£29,729

Prophetic? ‘Karma?’


Football success at any cost to anyone is their motto.


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[Bostonhibby]

The stupid old boot said it was unfair to relegate them as they had spent a lot of money to avoid it. WTFI wouldn't go to a casino with her that's for sure, can you imagine the doormen trying to wedge her out the door whilst she explains that all that money she lost really needs to be paid out at the window.

Bonkers

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[Spike Mandela]

BBC Kheredine now tweeting

“Question: how many @spfl clubs will either be able to, or want to, play football behind closed doors if / when that gets the go-ahead? One chairman tells me any reconstruction may have to be based on which teams WANT to play without fans. Enough for 2 leagues of 14, for example?”

Anonymous Chairman, likely Budge or one of her cohorts. I think there’s going to be a smorgasbord of options put on the table and the arguing and deliberation will drag on and on.

[Billy Whizz]

BBC Kheredine now tweeting

“Question: how many @spfl clubs will either be able to, or want to, play football behind closed doors if / when that gets the go-ahead? One chairman tells me any reconstruction may have to be based on which teams WANT to play without fans. Enough for 2 leagues of 14, for example?”

Anonymous Chairman, likely Budge or one of her cohorts. I think there’s going to be a smorgasbord of options put on the table and the arguing and deliberation will drag on and on.

You’d have thought all of the 12 teams in the Premiership will be up to play behind closed doors. The TV money will determine that it goes on

[Ozyhibby]

You’d have thought all of the 12 teams in the Premiership will be up to play behind closed doors. The TV money will determine that it goes on

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p08dp7sk


It was talked about in today’s sportsound podcast.


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[Aldo]

The stupid old boot said it was unfair to relegate them as they had spent a lot of money to avoid it. WTF

She won’t even remember saying that I bet!


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[hibeerealist]

The Duncans are creaming themselves at legal action, they have costed what each club will need to pay them as their share of compensation they will demand through the courts!!

It is a done deal as far as many of them are concerned, they will smash the SPFL case in court - wee Leslie has really got them fired up.

Oh and there is only one club safe financially, you guessed it, Hertz. FOH will keep them at the top end financially no mention of the huge squad needing paid bloated wages (even after wage cuts).

I would suggest that contrary to what they believe, Hertz could be one of the first clubs to fall - they really need to get real.

[Real Emerald]

BBC Kheredine now tweeting

“Question: how many @spfl clubs will either be able to, or want to, play football behind closed doors if / when that gets the go-ahead? One chairman tells me any reconstruction may have to be based on which teams WANT to play without fans. Enough for 2 leagues of 14, for example?”

Anonymous Chairman, likely Budge or one of her cohorts. I think there’s going to be a smorgasbord of options put on the table and the arguing and deliberation will drag on and on.

Well after committing to a season ticket once again I’ll have to live with the thought no fans will be there and football may have to go on behind closed doors. What I can’t live with is Hearts worming their way out of this into a contrived league set up to cover over the gross mismanagement of their whole club. My season ticket is for a fair competitive league set up and would not be renewed to fund any shyster set up to dig them out of their hole. I’m sure Hibs and many other clubs will be well aware of what their supporters would think of this sham desperate disaster of a league set up.

[WoreTheGreen]

She won’t even remember saying that I bet!


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I spent a few quite on a second hand car but sadly I didn’t win any F1 races who do I take to court

[Aldo]

I spent a few quite on a second hand car but sadly I didn’t win any F1 races who do I take to court

By their reckoning it wasn’t your fault you bought the car and it wasn’t your fault you spent thousands and thousands to try and win but you just didn’t. Definitely not your fault though.

As for court purposes I’d take everyone else to court as it’s their fault not yours!


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[WoreTheGreen]

Tom Englisher said I’ve got a strong case 🤷*♂️

[Eyrie]

The stupid old boot said it was unfair to relegate them as they had spent a lot of money to avoid it. WTF

Think Newcastle used to run out to Mark Knopfler's "Local Hero".

Hearts will be able to use "Money for Nothing" as they're in dire straits.

[Irish_Steve]

Dont you just love it when the maroon balloons try to use big words

To explain Court Interdicts - they are granted on the Balance of Convivence . Freezing the funds would affect 41 other clubs / parties so I cant see a court granting any such interdict for the convenience of one club / party. The club will be well advised here - be constructive , look for non court solutions and when its thrown back in our face - lets go to court where will get a more favourable reception for trying not to go to court. Lets be patient for a while - time to don the tackety boots is coming.

Hibsarepants but not as pants as his spelling!

[high bee]

Dont you just love it when the maroon balloons try to use big words

To explain Court Interdicts - they are granted on the Balance of Convivence . Freezing the funds would affect 41 other clubs / parties so I cant see a court granting any such interdict for the convenience of one club / party. The club will be well advised here - be constructive , look for non court solutions and when its thrown back in our face - lets go to court where will get a more favourable reception for trying not to go to court. Lets be patient for a while - time to don the tackety boots is coming.

Hibsarepants but not as pants as his spelling!

The balance of Covfefe.

[Barney McGrew]

Oh and there is only one club safe financially, you guessed it, Hertz. FOH will keep them at the top end financially no mention of the huge squad needing paid bloated wages (even after wage cuts).

They often quote FOH as being their saviour in these times, but they only contribute around £100k a month. While that’s a pretty admirable figure, it’s not going to keep the wolves from the door when all it’s doing is covering Naismith and Boyce’s wages and a wee bit more.

Their wage bill last year was £8.2m!

[Irish_Steve]

The balance of Covfefe.

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

[MacGruber]

I had to laugh at that one, karma, a word they like to use.
Anyone know why thy owed Stenhousemuir FC 12 gs ?

Yes.

David Templeton.

They signed Templeton but refused to pay up. Stenny wanted to go to court but Hearts weren't interested because they knew they couldn't afford to go down that route.

Templeton subsequently signed for Rangers. Rangers in turn never paid up the full transfer value agreed because of the financial mess they got themselves in and Hearts were apoplectic about it.

A player they stole from a minnow, that they never paid up for and they moaned they never got the full million from Rangers. Funny the attitude at the time was screw you take us to court if you can.

& before you ask... yes, true story

[SouthMoroccoStu]

Tom Englisher said I’ve got a strong case 🤷*♂️

Would love to hear his justification for this view point

[mjhibby]

What they appear to be missing is potentially every club that was not top or mathematical impossible to catch the team above them may have lost out financially. They all had the opportunity to improve their position.

Perhaps 38 of our clubs could take the SPFL to court?

Indeed. The most galling thing is after the St Mirren game virtually every hertz fan thought they were down. The were six off the play off place and were very likely to go down. Their behaviour since has just summed them up. Spend others money then blame every body else when it goes breasts skywards. A joke of a club.I doubt they will avoid relegation but if they do I will be reminding them constantly that we saved them.

[Glory Lurker]

Indeed. The most galling thing is after the St Mirren game virtually every hertz fan thought they were down. The were six off the play off place and were very likely to go down.

Yep. Remember "Player of the Season" photo of the back of some jambo player with the name "Covid" and squad number "19" that did the rounds when football was suspended?

[hibeerealist]

They often quote FOH as being their saviour in these times, but they only contribute around £100k a month. While that’s a pretty admirable figure, it’s not going to keep the wolves from the door when all it’s doing is covering Naismith and Boyce’s wages and a wee bit more.

Their wage bill last year was £8.2m!

Yep you are bang on BM

[FilipinoHibs]

Stenhousemuir looking to have one of those "special" relationships?

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Run by an orangeman as well.

[brog]

Yes.

David Templeton.

They signed Templeton but refused to pay up. Stenny wanted to go to court but Hearts weren't interested because they knew they couldn't afford to go down that route.

Templeton subsequently signed for Rangers. Rangers in turn never paid up the full transfer value agreed because of the financial mess they got themselves in and Hearts were apoplectic about it.

A player they stole from a minnow, that they never paid up for and they moaned they never got the full million from Rangers. Funny the attitude at the time was screw you take us to court if you can.

& before you ask... yes, true story

I remember that. Of course they had previous with Arbroath & Andy Webster. A foul club.

[Craig_in_Prague]

Anyone else read the kickback thread of Top 5 reasons to hate Hibs?
Someone mentioned the colour of our strip (and wee white sleeves). 🤣
....ok dokey.... blood coloured turd is a marvellous colour,...plums.

[Irish_Steve]

Anyone else read the kickback thread of Top 5 reasons to hate Hibs?
Someone mentioned the colour of our strip (and wee white sleeves). 🤣
....ok dokey.... blood coloured turd is a marvellous colour,...plums.

I wonder what Irish fans (North and South of the border)who support Hearts think of that comment

[Ozyhibby]

https://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/hearts-join-championship-call-discuss-hampden-hub-option-2859982
Starting to accept their fate.


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[Sammy7nil]

https://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/hearts-join-championship-call-discuss-hampden-hub-option-2859982
Starting to accept their fate.


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Shame, I feel so sad for those loyal gorgie boys, they are a big team they don't deserve this :na na:

[The Harp Awakes]

https://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/hearts-join-championship-call-discuss-hampden-hub-option-2859982
Starting to accept their fate.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think the jumbos endgame is to get compensation, either through legal action, or via the spfl directly through the threat of legal action.

League reconstruction this season looks remote and a court is never going to overturn the democratic decision of a members organisation to call the league as is.

Their only hope is if an SPL club goes bust before we start playing football again. Even then it's not automatic that the jumbos will be saved as they are already in the Championship. Other Championship clubs, e.g., their chums ICT, ironically, would have as reasonable a claim as Hertz to be elevated to the SPL.

[plhibs]

Yes.

David Templeton.

They signed Templeton but refused to pay up. Stenny wanted to go to court but Hearts weren't interested because they knew they couldn't afford to go down that route.

Templeton subsequently signed for Rangers. Rangers in turn never paid up the full transfer value agreed because of the financial mess they got themselves in and Hearts were apoplectic about it.

A player they stole from a minnow, that they never paid up for and they moaned they never got the full million from Rangers. Funny the attitude at the time was screw you take us to court if you can.

& before you ask... yes, true story

Yes I remember something like that now. That lot just think they can do anything they want again and screw the outcome, we have the FOH donations we'll be ok.

[Ozyhibby]

I think the jumbos endgame is to get compensation, either through legal action, or via the spfl directly through the threat of legal action.

League reconstruction this season looks remote and a court is never going to overturn the democratic decision of a members organisation to call the league as is.

Their only hope is if an SPL club goes bust before we start playing football again. Even then it's not automatic that the jumbos will be saved as they are already in the Championship. Other Championship clubs, e.g., their chums ICT, ironically, would have as reasonable a claim as Hertz to be elevated to the SPL.

The endgame is exactly that. Compensation. It’s a shakedown. Doubt it will work though their hand is not strong.


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[Thief]

Wee post from over the road.
Is it that last beer I had or is this guy playing with my mind on a far deeper level than I deserve?

“Even though the reconstruction saga rumbles on it's clear many clubs are simply paying the talks lip service

Perhaps due to words coming down from above by you know who has now begun to realise just what the consequences might be if all avenues are not exhausted.
I think the word is out not to rule them out until they are presented and discussed in the next few days but you don't have to be a rocket scientist to see what way the wind is blowing
Perception is everything sometimes.

Our only decision will be to take legal action or not and if we do take action do we accept an offer of compensation should it be forthcoming or simply act to void the expulsion ?”

Perception is everything sometimes - a cracking line, I’ll give him that [emoji106]


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[Hibeesmad]

18th May 2020- Hearts relegated. Never forget it.

[Phil MaGlass]

https://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/hearts-join-championship-call-discuss-hampden-hub-option-2859982
Starting to accept their fate.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

We are the Hubs
We are the Hubs
We are
We are
We are the Hubs.
:flag:

[weecounty hibby]

Wee post from over the road.
Is it that last beer I had or is this guy playing with my mind on a far deeper level than I deserve?

“Even though the reconstruction saga rumbles on it's clear many clubs are simply paying the talks lip service

Perhaps due to words coming down from above by you know who has now begun to realise just what the consequences might be if all avenues are not exhausted.
I think the word is out not to rule them out until they are presented and discussed in the next few days but you don't have to be a rocket scientist to see what way the wind is blowing
Perception is everything sometimes.

Our only decision will be to take legal action or not and if we do take action do we accept an offer of compensation should it be forthcoming or simply act to void the expulsion ?”

Perception is everything sometimes - a cracking line, I’ll give him that [emoji106]


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To perceive we must first perceive that we do perceive!!

[Danderhall Hibs]

I asked one of them where the compensation figure they think they’ll get came from - he was flapping about trying to add stuff like the revenue from the cup matches not being played. They’ve just plucked it out of the air.

As for the “tick tock” stuff - we used to do that (in the build up to them actually bumped loads of folk for money) and clearly got to them so they’re hoping we might be in the same boat one day. #neverletthemforget

[The Spaceman]

I assume HOMFC are going to factor in their significantly enchanted FOH contributions and ST revenue as a result of being relegated/siege mentality they have created?

[Geo_1875]

Wee post from over the road.
Is it that last beer I had or is this guy playing with my mind on a far deeper level than I deserve?

“Even though the reconstruction saga rumbles on it's clear many clubs are simply paying the talks lip service

Perhaps due to words coming down from above by you know who has now begun to realise just what the consequences might be if all avenues are not exhausted.
I think the word is out not to rule them out until they are presented and discussed in the next few days but you don't have to be a rocket scientist to see what way the wind is blowing
Perception is everything sometimes.

Our only decision will be to take legal action or not and if we do take action do we accept an offer of compensation should it be forthcoming or simply act to void the expulsion ?”

Perception is everything sometimes - a cracking line, I’ll give him that [emoji106]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That reads like Pink Floyd lyrics from 1967.

[jacomo]

Hearts have been relegated. They are now a Championship club.

If reconstruction does happen this summer it could be the shortest relegation ever. But why would the 12 let them back in?

Budge has been throwing her weight around, accusing her fellow chairmen of being sanctimonious and unfair, threatening legal action, but has not delivered any plan for a different way forward.

Is this a person you’d want to work with while trying to get Scottish football through this crisis?

[calumhibee1]

Yes.

David Templeton.

They signed Templeton but refused to pay up. Stenny wanted to go to court but Hearts weren't interested because they knew they couldn't afford to go down that route.

Templeton subsequently signed for Rangers. Rangers in turn never paid up the full transfer value agreed because of the financial mess they got themselves in and Hearts were apoplectic about it.

A player they stole from a minnow, that they never paid up for and they moaned they never got the full million from Rangers. Funny the attitude at the time was screw you take us to court if you can.

& before you ask... yes, true story

:agree:

They are utterly shameless. An absolute embarrassment that Scottish football would be better without.

[greenpaper55]

Hearts have been relegated. They are now a Championship club.

If reconstruction does happen this summer it could be the shortest relegation ever. But why would the 12 let them back in?

Budge has been throwing her weight around, accusing her fellow chairmen of being sanctimonious and unfair, threatening legal action, but has not delivered any plan for a different way forward.

Is this a person you’d want to work with while trying to get Scottish football through this crisis?

You got me thinking , Hearts are now a championship club and i think they all agree to that so If re construction does happen then surely every other championship club is entitled to challenge for a place in the top league. The only way this can be done is on sporting merit ie who is top at the end of the season ?

[Juice-Terry]

What they appear to be missing is potentially every club that was not top or mathematical impossible to catch the team above them may have lost out financially. They all had the opportunity to improve their position.

Perhaps 38 of our clubs could take the SPFL to court?

That's an excellent point. Cheers.

[CentreLine]

You got me thinking , Hearts are now a championship club and i think they all agree to that so If re construction does happen then surely every other championship club is entitled to challenge for a place in the top league. The only way this can be done is on sporting merit ie who is top at the end of the season ?

Yep. And why should it be hearts that are promoted in the event of reconstruction being successful? They are in the Championship on merit but what gives them the right to assume a position above Inverness, Dundee, or any other club for that matter and automatically be restored to the Premiership? The season has ended so every club is on exactly the same points total of zero. Should they therefore decide it on alphabetical order?

[Billy Whizz]

:agree:

They are utterly shameless. An absolute embarrassment that Scottish football would be better without.

They are, but Budge would have to had to pay it back

[hibbyfraelibby]

Yep. And why should it be hearts that are promoted in the event of reconstruction being successful? They are in the Championship on merit but what gives them the right to assume a position above Inverness, Dundee, or any other club for that matter and automatically be restored to the Premiership? The season has ended so every club is on exactly the same points total of zero. Should they therefore decide it on alphabetical order?

Alloa will agree with that one...

[Jim44]

Yep. And why should it be hearts that are promoted in the event of reconstruction being successful? They are in the Championship on merit but what gives them the right to assume a position above Inverness, Dundee, or any other club for that matter and automatically be restored to the Premiership? The season has ended so every club is on exactly the same points total of zero. Should they therefore decide it on alphabetical order?

That’s fine by me. As long is the criterion is not the club that’s going to waste the most money.

[Jim44]

Wee post from over the road.
Is it that last beer I had or is this guy playing with my mind on a far deeper level than I deserve?

“Even though the reconstruction saga rumbles on it's clear many clubs are simply paying the talks lip service

Perhaps due to words coming down from above by you know who has now begun to realise just what the consequences might be if all avenues are not exhausted.
I think the word is out not to rule them out until they are presented and discussed in the next few days but you don't have to be a rocket scientist to see what way the wind is blowing
Perception is everything sometimes.

Our only decision will be to take legal action or not and if we do take action do we accept an offer of compensation should it be forthcoming or simply act to void the expulsion ?”

Perception is everything sometimes - a cracking line, I’ll give him that [emoji106]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


You don’t have to be a weatherman to know it’s gonna rain. ........ Is that you, Bob? :whistle:

[hibeerealist]

You don’t have to be a weatherman to know it’s gonna rain. ........ Is that you, Bob? :whistle:


Another one I read was "It is INEVITABLE now that reconstruction will go ahead but part of me wants it to fail so as we can bring the whole organisation and its clubs down".

He/she would get more satisfaction blah blah, absolute roasters!

[coldingham hibs]

Another one I read was "It is INEVITABLE now that reconstruction will go ahead but part of me wants it to fail so as we can bring the whole organisation and its clubs down".

He/she would get more satisfaction blah blah, absolute roasters!

Hearts fans seem to have escalated their club into being the master rulers of Scottish Football, every club is now at their mercy. Anne Budge has clearly played a blinder, deliberately finish bottom so she can run the the SPFL. It’s quite astonishing that nobody seen this plan coming.

[Aldo]

Just got sent this. Hope it works


https://twitter.com/Oldfirmfacts1/status/1263442066895515655?s=09


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Waxy]

Hearts fans seem to have escalated their club into being the master rulers of Scottish Football, every club is now at their mercy. Anne Budge has clearly played a blinder, deliberately finish bottom so she can run the the SPFL. It’s quite astonishing that nobody seen this plan coming.

So this was hearts plan for world domination?
Finish bottom, get relegated and just go into complete denial about.
Tell everyone if they dont break the rules and let us back up. We’ll destroy football itself?

[Tom Hart RIP]

Yes.

David Templeton.

They signed Templeton but refused to pay up. Stenny wanted to go to court but Hearts weren't interested because they knew they couldn't afford to go down that route.

Templeton subsequently signed for Rangers. Rangers in turn never paid up the full transfer value agreed because of the financial mess they got themselves in and Hearts were apoplectic about it.

A player they stole from a minnow, that they never paid up for and they moaned they never got the full million from Rangers. Funny the attitude at the time was screw you take us to court if you can.

& before you ask... yes, true story

I seem to remember they bought Willie Petigrew and Derek Addison from Dundee United and either didn't pay or had to be taken to court before Mercer coughed up? Anyone can confirm?

[hibbyfraelibby]

Just has wee wee peak under the Keekboak blanket. The mood music coming out of the Duncan Dome is becoming increasingly Bunker Syndromesque with endless manic expressions of their invincibility in the face of unsurmountable odds and general approbation

Its like 1945 with the Führerin Budge deep in the bowels of the ravaged Chancellory that is the shattered glass curtained mega stadion shifting her imaginary Bulgarian battalions about in a final push to win the war at a stroke as the forces of retribution are on the Piazza hammering at the door.

One final paper on reconstruction here, a rambling statement there and the unleashing of the latest conflict winning Vengence Legal Action. The virus of financial armagedon ravaging rivals as the maroon pound is withrawn and focused on the assured destruction of some Englander city called Doncaster.

Meanwhile Herman Pishy Breeks and Heinrich Deans are hanging on to every word of Tom Goebels for a glimmer of light in the darkness and news of Herr Daniel's decisive counter attack...

[Mr Grieves]

Just got sent this. Hope it works


https://twitter.com/Oldfirmfacts1/status/1263442066895515655?s=09


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

:hilarious

[hibsbollah]

Ligue 1 has its own Hearts style tantrum going on.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/may/21/this-is-unjust-amiens-president-relegation-ligue-1 (https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/may/21/this-is-unjust-amiens-president-relegation-ligue-1)

[Victor]

Just has wee wee peak under the Keekboak blanket. The mood music coming out of the Duncan Dome is becoming increasingly Bunker Syndromesque with endless manic expressions of their invincibility in the face of unsurmountable odds and general approbation

Its like 1945 with the Führerin Budge deep in the bowels of the ravaged Chancellory that is the shattered glass curtained mega stadion shifting her imaginary Bulgarian battalions about in a final push to win the war at a stroke as the forces of retribution are on the Piazza hammering at the door.

One final paper on reconstruction here, a rambling statement there and the unleashing of the latest conflict winning Vengence Legal Action. The virus of financial armagedon ravaging rivals as the maroon pound is withrawn and focused on the assured destruction of some Englander city called Doncaster.

Meanwhile Herman Pishy Breeks and Heinrich Deans are hanging on to every word of Tom Goebels for a glimmer of light in the darkness and news of Herr Daniel's decisive counter attack...

[emoji23][emoji23]


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[Ozyhibby]

Ligue 1 has its own Hearts style tantrum going on.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/may/21/this-is-unjust-amiens-president-relegation-ligue-1 (https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/may/21/this-is-unjust-amiens-president-relegation-ligue-1)

It will be the same everywhere when it happens but there is no other way.


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[Dashing Bob S]

It will be the same everywhere when it happens but there is no other way.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes, sadly. We just have to accept it.

[greenpaper55]

Jambos seem to think it will cost 42 league clubs K100 each if they win their case, seems like they are paying it themselves !

[chasitup]

Jambos seem to think it will cost 42 league clubs K100 each if they win their case, seems like they are paying it themselves !
Given that they’re one of the 42 does that mean they fork out £100k too?

[Waxy]

We can make a creditors list for them.

[greenpaper55]

They will owe it to themselves !

[04Sauzee]

Saughton Jambo Saughton Jambo

Posted 41 minutes ago
1 hour ago, Deevers said:
Funnily enough was speaking to a Perth mate today who reckons that certain club chairmen has been contacted and told in no uncertain terms what the cost of defending a civil action would mean to their club and an estimate of what losing the said action would be for them. Told that the sums quoted were eye watering.

Probably coincides with what I’ve been told but as jimmy cricket says....there’s more....a lot more. If I can get this confirmed tonight then I will post what I’ve been told. In the interim though I’ve been asked to hold off.

Quote

[Kato]

Saughton Jambo Saughton Jambo

Posted 41 minutes ago
1 hour ago, Deevers said:
Funnily enough was speaking to a Perth mate today who reckons that certain club chairmen has been contacted and told in no uncertain terms what the cost of defending a civil action would mean to their club and an estimate of what losing the said action would be for them. Told that the sums quoted were eye watering.

Probably coincides with what I’ve been told but as jimmy cricket says....there’s more....a lot more. If I can get this confirmed tonight then I will post what I’ve been told. In the interim though I’ve been asked to hold off.

QuoteWhat a wallpaper.

Sent from my SM-A405FN using Tapatalk

[Keith_M]

Ligue 1 has its own Hearts style tantrum going on.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/may/21/this-is-unjust-amiens-president-relegation-ligue-1 (https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/may/21/this-is-unjust-amiens-president-relegation-ligue-1)


"the small northern city straddling the River Somme"


That'll get the Hearts going, tales of battles on the Somme.

[green.oracle]

Saughton Jambo Saughton Jambo

Posted 41 minutes ago
1 hour ago, Deevers said:
Funnily enough was speaking to a Perth mate today who reckons that certain club chairmen has been contacted and told in no uncertain terms what the cost of defending a civil action would mean to their club and an estimate of what losing the said action would be for them. Told that the sums quoted were eye watering.

Probably coincides with what I’ve been told but as jimmy cricket says....there’s more....a lot more. If I can get this confirmed tonight then I will post what I’ve been told. In the interim though I’ve been asked to hold off.

Quote

Is this the same saughton jumbo that was starting the legal fund a few weeks ago by putting his signed and framed vanecek strip up for auction?

:confused::confused:

[Ozyhibby]

Saughton Jambo Saughton Jambo

Posted 41 minutes ago
1 hour ago, Deevers said:
Funnily enough was speaking to a Perth mate today who reckons that certain club chairmen has been contacted and told in no uncertain terms what the cost of defending a civil action would mean to their club and an estimate of what losing the said action would be for them. Told that the sums quoted were eye watering.

Probably coincides with what I’ve been told but as jimmy cricket says....there’s more....a lot more. If I can get this confirmed tonight then I will post what I’ve been told. In the interim though I’ve been asked to hold off.

Quote

Then surely the costs of taking a civil action would be eye watering as well? Or do lawyers only charge defendants?


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[Waxy]

Saughton Jambo Saughton Jambo

Posted 41 minutes ago
1 hour ago, Deevers said:
Funnily enough was speaking to a Perth mate today who reckons that certain club chairmen has been contacted and told in no uncertain terms what the cost of defending a civil action would mean to their club and an estimate of what losing the said action would be for them. Told that the sums quoted were eye watering.

Probably coincides with what I’ve been told but as jimmy cricket says....there’s more....a lot more. If I can get this confirmed tonight then I will post what I’ve been told. In the interim though I’ve been asked to hold off.

Quote
Hearts could be in serious trouble if thats true.

[RyeSloan]

Saughton Jambo Saughton Jambo

Posted 41 minutes ago
1 hour ago, Deevers said:
Funnily enough was speaking to a Perth mate today who reckons that certain club chairmen has been contacted and told in no uncertain terms what the cost of defending a civil action would mean to their club and an estimate of what losing the said action would be for them. Told that the sums quoted were eye watering.

Probably coincides with what I’ve been told but as jimmy cricket says....there’s more....a lot more. If I can get this confirmed tonight then I will post what I’ve been told. In the interim though I’ve been asked to hold off.

Quote

Cost of defending civil action for SPFL is cost / 42

Cost of pursuing civil action for Hearts is cost / 1

It’s not the other clubs chairs whose eyes are watering.

[JeMeSouviens]

Then surely the costs of taking a civil action would be eye watering as well? Or do lawyers only charge defendants?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It's an open and shut case because they spent loads of money ... or something. :confused:

:faf:

[G B Young]

“I don’t think for a second anyone would have been talking about reconstructing the leagues had it been ourselves or Hamilton sitting at the bottom of the table when football was stopped"
St Mirren CEO Tony Fitzpatrick

[Waxy]

Go to desperate and take it way beyond.

[truehibernian]

Saughton Jambo Saughton Jambo

Posted 41 minutes ago
1 hour ago, Deevers said:
Funnily enough was speaking to a Perth mate today who reckons that certain club chairmen has been contacted and told in no uncertain terms what the cost of defending a civil action would mean to their club and an estimate of what losing the said action would be for them. Told that the sums quoted were eye watering.

Probably coincides with what I’ve been told but as jimmy cricket says....there’s more....a lot more. If I can get this confirmed tonight then I will post what I’ve been told. In the interim though I’ve been asked to hold off.

Quote

I suppose he is technically correct - the fact that clubs will be paying nothing for any legal action (other than Hearts) is eye watering as the clubs defending the action (that will never happen :wink:) will be crying with laughter if/once they see the action :greengrin:aok:

[DickEDastardly]

Just has wee wee peak under the Keekboak blanket. The mood music coming out of the Duncan Dome is becoming increasingly Bunker Syndromesque with endless manic expressions of their invincibility in the face of unsurmountable odds and general approbation

Its like 1945 with the Führerin Budge deep in the bowels of the ravaged Chancellory that is the shattered glass curtained mega stadion shifting her imaginary Bulgarian battalions about in a final push to win the war at a stroke as the forces of retribution are on the Piazza hammering at the door.

One final paper on reconstruction here, a rambling statement there and the unleashing of the latest conflict winning Vengence Legal Action. The virus of financial armagedon ravaging rivals as the maroon pound is withrawn and focused on the assured destruction of some Englander city called Doncaster.

Meanwhile Herman Pishy Breeks and Heinrich Deans are hanging on to every word of Tom Goebels for a glimmer of light in the darkness and news of Herr Daniel's decisive counter attack...

Quality post[emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[007]

Saughton Jambo Saughton Jambo

Posted 41 minutes ago
1 hour ago, Deevers said:
Funnily enough was speaking to a Perth mate today who reckons that certain club chairmen has been contacted and told in no uncertain terms what the cost of defending a civil action would mean to their club and an estimate of what losing the said action would be for them. Told that the sums quoted were eye watering.

Probably coincides with what I’ve been told but as jimmy cricket says....there’s more....a lot more. If I can get this confirmed tonight then I will post what I’ve been told. In the interim though I’ve been asked to hold off.

Quote

It is 1 to 2% of next years prize pot. Clubs won't eve notice it. 1% of club 42's prize money is £450.

[Stanton Spence]

I’m not sure I would be putting much credence into anything a convicted murderer says about Hearts prospect of success in the courts.It gets better and some of the replies to saughton jambos post are off the scale
Lf hearts says don't post it cos it will hinder the clubs action [emoji23] save it and don't put it out there it's for the good of the club and its better stuff like that stays behind closed doors.....
Delusion on a major scale

Sent from my G3121 using Tapatalk

[Jakhog1]

They are a bunch of slavering fools, their go fund me page to raise £100,000 to help there cause in fighting this in court was sitting at £1075 five days ago, in that time they have been relegated so you would think that they would have seen a big increase in this, nope still sitting at the same amount, they know deep down in there broken wee hearts that it has no chance

[JimBHibees]

Jambos seem to think it will cost 42 league clubs K100 each if they win their case, seems like they are paying it themselves !

How much will it cost Hearts when they don't?

More I think about it don't think they will go anywhere near court given how leak a case they actually have. They will bottle it then put out a rambling statement about for the good of Scottish football.

[The Spaceman]

If you want a laugh, have a read of their "five reasons you hate Hibs" thread they've just started:

https://www.hmfckickback.co.uk/index.php?/topic/188845-top-5-reasons-to-hate-hibs/page/3/

They hate us and are truly scraping the bottom of the barrel with their comments. Feeble-minded fools. Enjoy the Championship you complete and utter losers.

[660]

If you want a laugh, have a read of their "five reasons you hate Hibs" thread they've just started:

https://www.hmfckickback.co.uk/index.php?/topic/188845-top-5-reasons-to-hate-hibs/page/3/

They hate us and are truly scraping the bottom of the barrel with their comments. Feeble-minded fools. Enjoy the Championship you complete and utter losers.

Racist hibs fans? What is this based on?

[The Falcon]

Saughton Jambo Saughton Jambo

Posted 41 minutes ago
1 hour ago, Deevers said:
Funnily enough was speaking to a Perth mate today who reckons that certain club chairmen has been contacted and told in no uncertain terms what the cost of defending a civil action would mean to their club and an estimate of what losing the said action would be for them. Told that the sums quoted were eye watering.

Probably coincides with what I’ve been told but as jimmy cricket says....there’s more....a lot more. If I can get this confirmed tonight then I will post what I’ve been told. In the interim though I’ve been asked to hold off.

Quote

Has anybody asked these dafties what rules have been broken? The ones they signed up to?

[The 90+2]

If you want a laugh, have a read of their "five reasons you hate Hibs" thread they've just started:

https://www.hmfckickback.co.uk/index.php?/topic/188845-top-5-reasons-to-hate-hibs/page/3/

They hate us and are truly scraping the bottom of the barrel with their comments. Feeble-minded fools. Enjoy the Championship you complete and utter losers.
They seem to hate everything and everyone, truly turned full fat huns now.

[snedzuk]

Given that they’re one of the 42 does that mean they fork out £100k too?

It'll cost a lot more than that if they lose

[calumhibee1]

“I don’t think for a second anyone would have been talking about reconstructing the leagues had it been ourselves or Hamilton sitting at the bottom of the table when football was stopped"
St Mirren CEO Tony Fitzpatrick

Safe to say St Mirren won’t be voting for reconstruction then.

Do the right thing, Leeann.

[jacomo]

“I don’t think for a second anyone would have been talking about reconstructing the leagues had it been ourselves or Hamilton sitting at the bottom of the table when football was stopped"
St Mirren CEO Tony Fitzpatrick


Boom.

The great thing about Budge is that she is never quite sure what she is saying. She has all but admitted that Hearts should be treated as a special case, and it is obvious to all that she wouldn’t give a second thought to reconstruction if Hearts hadn’t finished in last place.

[Paisley Hibby]

Saughton Jambo Saughton Jambo

Posted 41 minutes ago
1 hour ago, Deevers said:
Funnily enough was speaking to a Perth mate today who reckons that certain club chairmen has been contacted and told in no uncertain terms what the cost of defending a civil action would mean to their club and an estimate of what losing the said action would be for them. Told that the sums quoted were eye watering.

Probably coincides with what I’ve been told but as jimmy cricket says....there’s more....a lot more. If I can get this confirmed tonight then I will post what I’ve been told. In the interim though I’ve been asked to hold off.

Quote

That's hilarious. What his "mate from Perth" "reckons" "probably" coincides with what he's been told. Aye, that clearly means the rest of us are all doomed right enough 🤣. Jeez, you really couldn't make that **** up.

[Bostonhibby]

Sporting integrity.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200521/486d8c9ecbd567b106544227390fbf0d.jpg

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[SouthMoroccoStu]

Racist hibs fans? What is this based on?

Racist

How dare they

Some of my best friends are white

[Geo_1875]

They are a bunch of slavering fools, their go fund me page to raise £100,000 to help there cause in fighting this in court was sitting at £1075 five days ago, in that time they have been relegated so you would think that they would have seen a big increase in this, nope still sitting at the same amount, they know deep down in there broken wee hearts that it has no chance

Is that the one Leslie Deans promised a 5 figure sum to get started?

[Jakhog1]

Is that the one Leslie Deans promised a 5 figure sum to get started?


Not sure if it's the Leslie Deans one, still pretty pathetic otherwise

https://www.gofundme.com/f/only-hearts

[Bostonhibby]

Not sure if it's the Leslie Deans one, still pretty pathetic otherwise

https://www.gofundme.com/f/only-heartsI think they were initially saving up for a wendy house but now there's maybe a bit left over for a trampoline and a bit artificial grass?

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[blackpoolhibs]

Well if he's spoken to someone in Perth, it looks like we are ****ed.

[jacomo]

Racist

How dare they

Some of my best friends are white


I assume this is a reference to the skacel song, which gives them a sense of moral superiority.

[O'Rourke3]

Is that the one Leslie Deans promised a 5 figure sum to get started?4 not 5. £19.02 was the favourite £20.16 more appropriate.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

[Jones28]

Is that the one Leslie Deans promised a 5 figure sum to get started?

To be fair..


It was 4 figures.

😂

[MrSmith]

Their logic is superb :aok:

Because they are the SPFL, on one hand they will be paying for the case to be heard and raise the action whilst on the other, they will be paying to defend it against themselves! Staggeringly brilliant business acumen :D

[Billy Whizz]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52758938

They took part in a video conference with other championships clubs yesterday

[Fanforlife]

They definitely dont do irony over darkside,fair few of them on thread for fighting spfl now saying if any club cant pay wages etc they should be tossed out of League. Either this or it's vlad induced group memory loss.I lost count of the amount of times Hertz players went without wages.

[Ozyhibby]

Not sure if it's the Leslie Deans one, still pretty pathetic otherwise

https://www.gofundme.com/f/only-hearts

What happens to the cash if it doesn’t go ahead? Does the boy who started it get to keep it?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Waxy]

We’d be doing everyone a favour and saving hearts from themselves if we don’t even bring this to a vote and finish it tomorrow.

Wake up jambos.

[jacomo]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52758938

They took part in a video conference with other championships clubs yesterday


They must be one of the Biggest and most Famous clubs in that division Tbf.

[blackpoolhibs]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52758938

They took part in a video conference with other championships clubs yesterday

Please please please postpone the lower league games until they allow fans back in. :pray:

[Jakhog1]

What happens to the cash if it doesn’t go ahead? Does the boy who started it get to keep it?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It's Hearts we are talking about here, do they not have previous of fleecing each other, you would think that they would hand any money over to club, With the money they have raised so far will pay Naismith's wage for a day

[The 90+2]

Please please please postpone the lower league games until they allow fans back in. :pray:

If it happens then they could be done. Especially when they can’t release all their players using a random clause they get threatened with.

[H18 SFR]

Watching One Born Every Minute here. Screaming like a bunch of yams going down.

[Jdawg]

Remember the boy that organised the bus and then just kept the money 😂😂

[greenginger]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52758193


looks like the English lower leagues could be finishing on points per game played with promotion and relegation based on positions established by that method.

Much the same as our system. I wonder if clubs are lining up legal battalions to fight this injustice.

[bingo70]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52758193


looks like the English lower leagues could be finishing on points per game played with promotion and relegation based on positions established by that method.

Much the same as our system. I wonder if clubs are lining up legal battalions to fight this injustice.

The English seem to be a bit behind us having the same arguments as we did weeks ago.

Heard a few pundits say how unfair it is to relegate teams but I’ve not heard one give a realistic alternative option, when they are pushed they just come back reiterating that it doesn’t seem fair to them.

There isn’t any fairer alternative solution, it’s as simple as that.

[Andy74]

The English seem to be a bit behind us having the same arguments as we did weeks ago.

Heard a few pundits say how unfair it is to relegate teams but I’ve not heard one give a realistic alternative option, when they are pushed they just come back reiterating that it doesn’t seem fair to them.

There isn’t any fairer alternative solution, it’s as simple as that.

Correct. We are all going to suffer from this.

Relegated clubs always suffer. That’s due to them being pish.

Covid-19 isn’t a get out from that. Relegated clubs will suffer proportionally to the rest of us. A decent tip would have been to not habitually to have been the worst team in the league.

[RyeSloan]

The English seem to be a bit behind us having the same arguments as we did weeks ago.

Heard a few pundits say how unfair it is to relegate teams but I’ve not heard one give a realistic alternative option, when they are pushed they just come back reiterating that it doesn’t seem fair to them.

There isn’t any fairer alternative solution, it’s as simple as that.

A bit like the foundation of Hearts plum I heard on the radio on Monday.

Asked what he thought of it all it was a case of mumble mumble unfair mumble then something about how unfair it was because ‘they were in the ascendancy’

Asked about why reconstruction it was more of the same mumbling interjected with some undefined supposition on that it would benefit everyone before falling back onto the fact it would stop the unfairness to Hearts.

I’ve yet to hear a logical reason for reconstruction nor have I seen any evidence of why it would be to the benefit of the whole of Scottish football....they have said it often enough but never, not once, actually explained how they have got to that conclusion.

[KeithTheHibby]

Not sure if it's the Leslie Deans one, still pretty pathetic otherwise

https://www.gofundme.com/f/only-hearts

Going well I see. Still just over a grand and no donations for 5 days.

[Sammy7nil]

Remember the boy that organised the bus and then just kept the money 😂😂

:greengrin :aok:

[jacomo]

A bit like the foundation of Hearts plum I heard on the radio on Monday.

Asked what he thought of it all it was a case of mumble mumble unfair mumble then something about how unfair it was because ‘they were in the ascendancy’

Asked about why reconstruction it was more of the same mumbling interjected with some undefined supposition on that it would benefit everyone before falling back onto the fact it would stop the unfairness to Hearts.

I’ve yet to hear a logical reason for reconstruction nor have I seen any evidence of why it would be to the benefit of the whole of Scottish football....they have said it often enough but never, not once, actually explained how they have got to that conclusion.


They don’t have a single reason for reconstruction, except that they don’t want to be relegated.

[lord bunberry]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52758938

They took part in a video conference with other championships clubs yesterday
He makes a very good point. Outside the premiership it would be unworkable for teams to start next season without fans. Thankfully we’re in the premiership so we’ll be fine to resume next season, I really feel for clubs in the second tier like hearts who might have to just shut down for a year until this all blows over. I consider myself a football fan, but safety must come first.

[HFC93]

Saughton Jambo Saughton Jambo

Posted 41 minutes ago
1 hour ago, Deevers said:
Funnily enough was speaking to a Perth mate today who reckons that certain club chairmen has been contacted and told in no uncertain terms what the cost of defending a civil action would mean to their club and an estimate of what losing the said action would be for them. Told that the sums quoted were eye watering.

Probably coincides with what I’ve been told but as jimmy cricket says....there’s more....a lot more. If I can get this confirmed tonight then I will post what I’ve been told. In the interim though I’ve been asked to hold off.

Quote

Is Saughton Jambo actually Wee Airdrie Jambo under a different name?

[NYHibby]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52758938

They took part in a video conference with other championships clubs yesterday

Hopefully their lawyers have explained affirmation to them. Choosing to act as if they have been relegated to the championship doesn't help their legal position.

[Michael]

Absolute scenes when Hearts go bust. All captured in glorious 4K for their doc.

[SANH 1875]

Absolute scenes when Hearts go bust. All captured in glorious 4K for their doc.

Surely you mean glorious 400k

[Greenworld]

Saughton Jambo Saughton Jambo

Posted 41 minutes ago
1 hour ago, Deevers said:
Funnily enough was speaking to a Perth mate today who reckons that certain club chairmen has been contacted and told in no uncertain terms what the cost of defending a civil action would mean to their club and an estimate of what losing the said action would be for them. Told that the sums quoted were eye watering.

Probably coincides with what I’ve been told but as jimmy cricket says....there’s more....a lot more. If I can get this confirmed tonight then I will post what I’ve been told. In the interim though I’ve been asked to hold off.

QuoteLoL Saughton Jambo is at it. He has them on a string .
Same guy posted the LD letter all made up a couple of them are on to him but most are takin in by him . He is either a dillusianist or a uncover hibee agent

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[theonlywayisup]

I've not really been paying much attention to the talk of legal action. If they start it, is it to stop them being relegated or is it to gain compensation for being, in their opinion, wrongly relegated.

[Bristolhibby]

They don’t have a single reason for reconstruction, except that they don’t want to be relegated.

Seems legit. Should have thought of that one when we lost the playoff.

What mugs we were accepting we were just ***** and got relegated because we were not good enough not to be in the bottom two or win a playoff.

J

[Kojock]

They don’t have a single reason for reconstruction, except that they don’t want to be relegated.

Other than they spent a lot of money to avoid relegation 😂

[Caversham Green]

A bit like the foundation of Hearts plum I heard on the radio on Monday.

Asked what he thought of it all it was a case of mumble mumble unfair mumble then something about how unfair it was because ‘they were in the ascendancy’

Asked about why reconstruction it was more of the same mumbling interjected with some undefined supposition on that it would benefit everyone before falling back onto the fact it would stop the unfairness to Hearts.

I’ve yet to hear a logical reason for reconstruction nor have I seen any evidence of why it would be to the benefit of the whole of Scottish football....they have said it often enough but never, not once, actually explained how they have got to that conclusion.

They're exactly the same with the supposed £3m cost of relegation. It's only £3m because Budge came up with that figure but hasn't once substantiated it.

They might well lose £3m worth of turnover, but they could cut more than that from their wages bill and still have by far the biggest budget in the division - they've already saved their manager's wages for next year. They also can and will cut their other outgoings so relegation could actually produce a better bottom line than last year's. If they lose a net £3m that's down to their own gross mismanagement and nothing to do with relegation.


So far the decision to call the season hasn't cost them a penny so they have no competent claim for compensation at this stage even if there was any legal wrongdoing.

[Waxy]

They could cut 3M from their wage bill and still have a better team than they had last season so honking they were.

[Glory Lurker]

Is the reconstruction plan due to be tabled today?