Ukraine

[Mon Dieu4]

All kicking off in Russia and STV have Rocky 4 on, if I can change and you can change then maybe the whole world can change

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/kaitlancollins/status/1672385098891632640?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A


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[TrumpIsAPeado]

If there's ultimately a standoff between Putin and Prigozhin, my money is on the latter.

[AgentDaleCooper]

What is it that Prigozhin is actually after? If it's a private army, can he not just pull his troops out - or is he pretty much going for a military coup? Absolutely mental stuff. Can't see it ending well.

[Callum_62]

What is it that Prigozhin is actually after? If it's a private army, can he not just pull his troops out - or is he pretty much going for a military coup? Absolutely mental stuff. Can't see it ending well.Revenge it seems

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[Haymaker]

All kicking off in Russia and STV have Rocky 4 on, if I can change and you can change then maybe the whole world can changePerfect timing that!

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[Haymaker]

What is it that Prigozhin is actually after? If it's a private army, can he not just pull his troops out - or is he pretty much going for a military coup? Absolutely mental stuff. Can't see it ending well.Maybe giving billions to someone to have their own private army, then destroying your own army, then trying to kill the private army who now want to kill you and probably have a fair chunk of the regular army (that's left) on their side.... isn't a great idea?

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[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/intelarrow/status/1672467659684716544?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A


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[Ozyhibby]

https://paulmasonnews.medium.com/the-kayfabe-coup-is-under-way-353f5dc4d9c0


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[Jones28]

It’s happening.

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/vidtranslator/status/1672464280086802432?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Fascinating video with a translation. With all this going on, the front in Ukraine must be about ready to collapse.[emoji1696]
Looks like Wagner has full control of Rostov and it airport. It a big rail hub as well so they have control of logistics for supplying Ukraine.

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[Stairway 2 7]

https://paulmasonnews.medium.com/the-kayfabe-coup-is-under-way-353f5dc4d9c0


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Jesus that's crazy

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1672478515285852167?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A


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[Stairway 2 7]

Thread getting updated by a good journalist based in Kyiv, its all just as mental today

Russian Air force source confirming wagner shot down Russian helicopters.

JimmySecUK
·
Putin addressing Russia now, calling Prigozhin a traitor and vowing his rebellion will be defeated. “This is a stab in the back of our country and our people

The major significance of Putin's intervention - on Shoigu and the Russian Ministry of Defence's side - is that the one, slim chance of Prigozhin standing down relatively peacefully is now gone.

He's got little other option but to fight to the end now

[Stairway 2 7]

Putin's address was pretty full on. Prigozhin must be stopped in any way and he could be the traitor that losses them the war.

Prigozhin has hit back saying they would have lost the south anyway and the Russian losses are 10 times what they report

[Ozyhibby]

Reportedly heading for Moscow now. Will be there by tonight. Go big or go home I suppose.
25k troops isn’t enough so he must think he will win over large sections of the security forces. Very possible.


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[Stairway 2 7]

Wagners telegram has reported they have moved north from Rostov and taken military bases I Voronezh, 300 miles south of Moscow. Lots of reports of almost no resistance, unverified videos of big numbers of soldiers surrendering to Wagner

[Stairway 2 7]

Reportedly heading for Moscow now. Will be there by tonight. Go big or go home I suppose.
25k troops isn’t enough so he must think he will win over large sections of the security forces. Very possible.


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25k motivated and paid soldiers against an army that doesn't really want to fight Russians or die in Ukraine, its going to be a crazy few days

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1672508593969549312?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Wow. Putin’s statement from this morning. That is not a strong statement. It’s clear he is not certain what support he still has. This could be over quickly.


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[Ozyhibby]

Prigozhin is almost certainly just as bad as Putin but I suspect he will pull back from Ukraine so he can consolidate control in Russia and get to the serious business of running a gangster state and making money.


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[Stairway 2 7]

Wagners telegram channels not messing about it has said there will need to be presidential change

wartranslated
❗️AP Wagner: "The trigger of the Civil War was pulled by Pypa [Putin]. Instead of sending one or two degenerates into retirement, he gave the order to neutralize the most combat-ready unit in Russia. The life of one or two traitors was placed above 25,000 heroes. Who is evil in this conflict is already obvious. The victory will be for PMC "Wagner

[Hibrandenburg]

Prigozhin is almost certainly just as bad as Putin but I suspect he will pull back from Ukraine so he can consolidate control in Russia and get to the serious business of running a gangster state and making money.


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Who knows how this is going to turn out but I'm not sure that what's coming is better than before. Think SS coup against Hitler.

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/k_sonin/status/1672506391527866368?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Where are the other politicians?


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[Ozyhibby]

Who knows how this is going to turn out but I'm not sure that what's coming is better than before. Think SS coup against Hitler.

I agree. I’m only thinking of Ukraine and I don’t see how they can keep troops there and deal with this if it goes much past today.
The Russian people also might have a say? They are mostly lap dogs for Putin but who knows how things pan out if it’s someone else or if there is chaos in Moscow?


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[Hibrandenburg]

If things get desperate for Putin then depending on how much loyalty he commands, we might see nuclear weapons being used in a civil war for the first time.

[archie]

My initial thought was is this some elaborate feint to draw the Ukranians into something. But tge act of Putin having to address the nation suggests not. Because Putin had to do this it will sow doubt in Russian minds.

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/francis_scarr/status/1672508557156052992?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

It’s now being called a civil war.


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[Stairway 2 7]

I think chances are it gets squashed, but it will hasten Ukrainian victory. If it succeeds Prigozhin has been laying groundwork for a deal with Ukraine for months.

His speech yesterday saying the invasion was nothing to do with nato and purely about expansion and plunder, that Ukraine would do a deal in minutes if Russia got out of Ukraine ect ect. I think Ukraine could definitely do a deal with Prigozhin that could never be done with Putin

[Smartie]

https://twitter.com/frankieboyle/status/1672521239028482049?cxt=HHwWgoC2uZPN_rUuAAAA

[Stairway 2 7]

My initial thought was is this some elaborate feint to draw the Ukranians into something. But tge act of Putin having to address the nation suggests not. Because Putin had to do this it will sow doubt in Russian minds.

It's no feint there's videos of one of the downed helicopters and wagner setting up road blocks and air defenses in Rostov.

Rybar a pro Russian telegram with links to Russian military has just said Russian airforce are striking wagner on the motorway north of Rostov

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/igorsushko/status/1672497411460046848?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A


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[Stairway 2 7]

It's no feint there's videos of one of the downed helicopters and wagner setting up road blocks and air defenses in Rostov.

Rybar a pro Russian telegram with links to Russian military has just said Russian airforce are striking wagner on the motorway north of Rostov

Wagner confirming the airstrikes

AP Wagner:
In the Voronezh region, one of the convoys of the PMC "Wagner" was attacked. Aviation works, bombs is used. The civil war has officially begun.

[Ozyhibby]

Rumours Kadyrov and his Chechen troops are heading back to Grozny.


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[Stairway 2 7]

Prigozhin says they downed another helicopter


@wartranslated
Prigozhin in an audio message at 9:30AM BST, stating a helicopter attacked a Wagner unit on Moscow highway and was destroyed.

"On the Moscow highway, one of the asasult units got under fire of helicopters. In the units of PMC Wagner, everybody is intact. The helicopter was destroyed, it’s burning in a tree line.

I am once again warning everyone: we will consider a threat and destroy everything around. They will not be able to destroy us. We have goals, we are all ready to die. All 25,000. And then another 25,000. Becase we are dying for the Motherland, we’re dying for the Russian people who must be liberated from those people who are striking the civilian population, who were just attacked with a helicopter in Rostov. One pilot, belonging to the FSB, refused to take off and carry out strikes."

[Ozyhibby]

Lukashenko and family apparently fled to Turkey already. There will likely be an uprising in Belarus very soon.


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[Just Alf]

Lukashenko and family apparently fled to Turkey already. There will likely be an uprising in Belarus very soon.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalkhttps://twitter.com/officejjsmart/status/1672420961138757639?t=IUc9sBBqiLe4pzQ_OG892A&s=19

[Smartie]

Lukashenko and family apparently fled to Turkey already. There will likely be an uprising in Belarus very soon.


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https://twitter.com/Tendar/status/1672523999425994752?cxt=HHwWgIDRgert_7UuAAAA

Not alone by the looks of things.

[Del Boy]

Going to be an interesting and dramatic couple of days anyway

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/randymot4/status/1672499024962756609?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A


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[Gatecrasher]

This could be history in the making, hopefully Ukraine can take full advantage.

[Just Alf]

https://t.me/United24media/10808

Dunno if this will work ..


"The president was deeply mistaken about the betrayal of the Motherland. No one is going to come on demand," Prigozhin said

The leader of the "Wagner" PMC stated that they do not want the country to live in corruption.

"When we were told that we were at war with Ukraine, we fought, but it turned out that everything was being stolen. Now they are beating the peaceful because they are not fighting. We are patriots, and those who are against us are people who gathered around *******s," he said.

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/mylovanov/status/1672538253814054912?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Good analysis of Putin’s speech this morning which showed major weakness.


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[18Craig75]

Prigozhin is almost certainly just as bad as Putin but I suspect he will pull back from Ukraine so he can consolidate control in Russia and get to the serious business of running a gangster state and making money.


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I wouldn’t be surprised if he tries to generate favor with the west by pulling out of Ukraine. I really hope so. However, he is a war criminal in his own right and will surely realise that any attempt to legitimise himself on the international stage is doomed to failure?

[Ozyhibby]

I wouldn’t be surprised if he tries to generate favor with the west by pulling out of Ukraine. I really hope so. However, he is a war criminal in his own right and will surely realise that any attempt to legitimise himself on the international stage is doomed to failure?

His main concern will be legitimising himself in Russia first. Once you bring chaos to a situation, unexpected things can happen.


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[Ozyhibby]

If Putin ends up getting the Ceaușescu treatment live on TV then I won’t be disappointed.


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[Ozyhibby]

Putin has apparently left Moscow.[emoji102]


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[Just Alf]

https://twitter.com/bayraktar_1love/status/1672538169093369857?t=ZFG2jJWzZiEc5wren9558A&s=19


Edit (for context.)...
BBC News Russian sources also say Wagner mercenaries have seized military facilities in Voronezh, which is halfway between Rostov and Moscow

[Kato]

If Putin is ousted it'll be a sad day for the organisations he has financed over the years, the Tory Party and GBNews will be bereft.

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[Lendo]

If Putin ends up getting the Ceaușescu treatment live on TV then I won’t be disappointed.


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Would prefer to see a Mussolini or Gaddafi style end for him.

[makaveli1875]

If Putin is ousted it'll be a sad day for the organisations he has financed over the years, the Tory Party and GBNews will be bereft.

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I think the real worry is who replaces him , the alternative could be even worse than mad vlad

[Kato]

I think the real worry is who replaces him , the alternative could be even worse than mad vladTrue but I think it would see the end of Putin's "project" of financing right wing groups outwith Russia.

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[Glory Lurker]

The best outcome would be for Prigozhin to lose this, after a huge face off with the Russian army. Putin to limp on, his power mortally wounded.

[Stairway 2 7]

I think the real worry is who replaces him , the alternative could be even worse than mad vlad

I don't think one person is in charge now or would take over if Prigozhin is successful. Russia is a mafia state ran by oligarchs, Prigozhin won't be running anything including this insurrection on his own.

[Smartie]

The best outcome would be for Prigozhin to lose this, after a huge face off with the Russian army. Putin to limp on, his power mortally wounded.

Not unlikely tbf.

[Stairway 2 7]

The best outcome would be for Prigozhin to lose this, after a huge face off with the Russian army. Putin to limp on, his power mortally wounded.

I don't know. Putin will never leave annexed areas without force. Prigozhin saying the war is pointless and only happened to to Russian greed and it has unnecessarily cost Russian lives. I think he's been laying road for talks including reportedly being willing Russian army positions in a deal with Kyiv last month

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/05/14/prigozhin-wagner-ukraine-leaked-documents/

[Ozyhibby]

The best outcome would be for Prigozhin to lose this, after a huge face off with the Russian army. Putin to limp on, his power mortally wounded.

The best outcome would be for the Russian people to grow a pair and take control of their country. Unlikely though. It’s a pretty docile population.


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[makaveli1875]

The best outcome would be for the Russian people to grow a pair and take control of their country. Unlikely though. It’s a pretty docile population.


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We can't even take control of our country from a bunch of posh former Eton schoolboys . What chance have the Russian people got against Putin and his mob of KGB goons

[TrumpIsAPeado]

We can't even take control of our country from a bunch of posh former Eton schoolboys . What chance have the Russian people got against Putin and his mob of KGB goons

:agree: An island that can't stand up to Jacob Rees-Mogg is in no position to criticise the lack of bravery of any other countries citizens.

[Stairway 2 7]

:agree: An island that can't stand up to Jacob Rees-Mogg is in no position to criticise the lack of bravery of any other countries citizens.

Difference is we'll vote JRM out of power next year. If we voted for independence we wouldn't even be in the same country.

Can see this thread becoming an argument of are we as free as a literal dictatorship where our posts saying our rulers are ****, would get us a jail sentence

[Stairway 2 7]

Wagner tanks rolling around in control of a city of 1 million is hard to take in

https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/1672562335573999617

[TrumpIsAPeado]

Difference is we'll vote JRM out of power next year. If we voted for independence we wouldn't even be in the same country.

Can see this thread becoming an argument of are we as free as a literal dictatorship where our posts saying our rulers are ****, would get us a jail sentence

That's 'Sir JRM'. You best hope it doesn't become 'Lord JRM', or he'll still be governing over us from an unelected position, despite being voted out.

[makaveli1875]

Wagner tanks rolling around in control of a city of 1 million is hard to take in

https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/1672562335573999617

It's hard to figure out what they are upto as well . Is this prigozhin fellow trying to oust Putin and crown himself the new Tzar ?

It's all a bit bizarre

[Stairway 2 7]

It's hard to figure out what they are upto as well . Is this prigozhin fellow trying to oust Putin and crown himself the new Tzar ?

It's all a bit bizarre

I've seen articles previously saying he wanted to be president, but also others saying he just wanted to lead the military so against Shoygu. If so he'll be upset Putin has fully backed Shoygu here.

It's all went too far now for it to just click to normal imo.

[AgentDaleCooper]

Difference is we'll vote JRM out of power next year. If we voted for independence we wouldn't even be in the same country.

Can see this thread becoming an argument of are we as free as a literal dictatorship where our posts saying our rulers are ****, would get us a jail sentence

best way to avoid that is for folk not to post Russo-phobic bollocks :aok:

[Just Alf]

Wagner tanks rolling around in control of a city of 1 million is hard to take in

https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/1672562335573999617Just wondering about this, it's a fair distance behind the lines, so were these loaded, transported then unloaded? I'd think that would need a.lot.of preplanning?
(Not sure tank's can drive that far/fast?)

[Stairway 2 7]

Just wondering about this, it's a fair distance behind the lines, so were these loaded, transported then unloaded? I'd think that would need a.lot.of preplanning?
(Not sure tank's can drive that far/fast?)

I've no idea but I've read some analysts say today that this would have taken a couple of months to put into place as its very organised and the amount of hardware set up

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/maks_nafo_fella/status/1672575672869371907?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A


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[Stairway 2 7]

A few sources saying they have passed yelets, 6 hour drive, not sure about military convoy speeds

Osinttechnical
·
Russian milblogger Rybar provided a short update a little while ago.

Per reports, Wagner forces reached Yelets, Lipetsk Oblast, roughly 350km from Moscow.

Rybar claims that the Wagner column includes anywhere from 150-400 pieces of equipment/vehicles

[Ozyhibby]

A few sources saying they have passed yelets, 6 hour drive, not sure about military convoy speeds

Osinttechnical
·
Russian milblogger Rybar provided a short update a little while ago.

Per reports, Wagner forces reached Yelets, Lipetsk Oblast, roughly 350km from Moscow.

Rybar claims that the Wagner column includes anywhere from 150-400 pieces of equipment/vehicles

A column of vehicles travelling up a motorway for hundreds of miles has to represent one of the easiest military targets going. Either the Russian air force is useless or Putin has lost control of it and can’t get them in the air.
Prigozhin could be in the Kremlin by morning.


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[Bridge hibs]

A column of vehicles travelling up a motorway for hundreds of miles has to represent one of the easiest military targets going. Either the Russian air force is useless or Putin has lost control of it and can’t get them in the air.
Prigozhin could be in the Kremlin by morning.


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkAnd surely they must know that or they are just plain stupid and offering themselves as canon fodder by driving up an open motorway, mind you the way Russia has ballesd up the invasion so far wouldnt surprise me. If Putin had any sense or control he would just send a couple of jets in that direction and job done

[Ozyhibby]

And surely they must know that or they are just plain stupid and offering themselves as canon fodder

I’m thinking they already have the military ready to switch to them and that’s why Putin has fled? This isn’t Warner’s first coup. Prep work will have been done.


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[Bridge hibs]

I’m thinking they already have the military ready to switch to them and that’s why Putin has fled? This isn’t Warner’s first coup. Prep work will have been done.


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkSorry bud edited my post as you replied, yeah that was my thinking too, if no jets up in the air then I think you are right

[AgentDaleCooper]

the best hope in this situation IMO is that a gap emerges which can be taken up by the Russian people. When they act, it's historically been pretty ****ing decisive. Anything else leads to nothing short of a living dystopia.

[Bridge hibs]

If Putin has fled, where could he go where he is safe, China ?

[AgentDaleCooper]

I’m thinking they already have the military ready to switch to them and that’s why Putin has fled? This isn’t Warner’s first coup. Prep work will have been done.


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frightening stuff.

[AgentDaleCooper]

If Putin has fled, where could he go where he is safe, China ?

DPKR would probably welcome him with open arms.

[Just Alf]

I've no idea but I've read some analysts say today that this would have taken a couple of months to put into place as its very organised and the amount of hardware set upMakes sense :agree:

[Northernhibee]

If Putin is toppled, I wonder how much will come out about individuals, groups, and political parties in the pockets of the Russian government?

[AgentDaleCooper]

If Putin is toppled, I wonder how much will come out about individuals, groups, and political parties in the pockets of the Russian government?

if he's toppled by Wagner and they remain in control, nothing that comes out will be very reliable.

[Stairway 2 7]

Ukraine armed forces getting the popcorn out.

https://twitter.com/ChristopherJM/status/1672578245772947456

[Ozyhibby]

if he's toppled by Wagner and they remain in control, nothing that comes out will be very reliable.

Especially as it’s Wagner who runs a lot of that stuff.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1672590500254081024?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A


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[Stairway 2 7]

Girkin has posted what he thinks Prigozhin's plan will be, a storm to Moscow and hope logistics keep up

https://twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1672596167140450304

[Just Alf]

https://twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1672551944039145474?t=E2Gem9XLM0-Sqih5TyrG6A&s=19

[Stairway 2 7]

Kadarovs Chechens being sent to fight wagner. This will play into Prigozhin's hand in some areas of info wars

https://twitter.com/michaeldweiss/status/1672605067134861312

[cabbageandribs1875]

i hope Lukashenko is starting to sweat a bit

has he fled Belarus yet ? where's his nearest base for Asylum :) here's hoping

[degenerated]

i hope Lukashenko is starting to sweat a bit

has he fled Belarus yet ? where's his nearest base for Asylum :) here's hopingI'm sure I read that he'd fled this morning and was supposed to be holed up in Turkey.

[cabbageandribs1875]

I'm sure I read that he'd fled this morning and was supposed to be holed up in Turkey.


i was just going to say that he will be doing a bit of sweating then i found this whilst googling for a name check

of course no idea how accurate :) https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1784011/lukashenko-flees-belarus-russia-coup


An aircraft carrying Belarus' President Alexander Lukashenko, who is a close ally of Vladimir Putin (https://www.express.co.uk/latest/vladimir-putin), has reportedly been seen fleeing the country, as rumblings of a coup in Russia (https://www.express.co.uk/latest/russia) continue to gather pace. According to news outlet Visegrád 24, the 68-year-old dictator's plane was seen over Turkey just hours after mercenaries stormed a Russian city, and threatened Moscow.

[silverhibee]

I thought British citizens were told to leave Russia at the start of this war, COBRA meeting just finished and that seems to be what it’s about, getting UK citizens out of Russia.

[Glory Lurker]

I'm sure I read that he'd fled this morning and was supposed to be holed up in Turkey.

I think it was posted on here.

Like was to flight radar, or something like that, suggesting the presidential plane has gone to Turkiye. It said it had turned off its transponder over Russia. I know nothing about these things, but I wouldn't think that would be a good idea.

[degenerated]

I think it was posted on here.

Like was to flight radar, or something like that, suggesting the presidential plane has gone to Turkiye. It said it had turned off its transponder over Russia.I saw it on twitter this morning, never know how much truth there is in these things though.

[Glory Lurker]

I thought British citizens were told to leave Russia at the start of this war, COBRA meeting just finished and that seems to be what it’s about, getting UK citizens out of Russia.

Journalists?

[Just Alf]

I saw it on twitter this morning, never know how much truth there is in these things though.Likewise, saw on twitter also. the flight radar bit's been confirmed.... what's not clear is if Lukashenko was on it or just his family.

[cabbageandribs1875]

that would be a heck of a comedown for the big Gorilla, one day threatening everyone cause he was a big hard man with nukes now


to running away :greengrin hope it's true anyway and we see the Belurusians claiming back their country from Dictator Lukashenko




but i suspect the Wagners and Putin will kiss and make up

[AgentDaleCooper]

Just read on the BBC that Prigozhin wants Russia to use nukes in Ukraine - would be great if Putin's regime collapsed, but astonishingly, he might actually be the lesser evil here.

[degenerated]

that would be a heck of a comedown for the big Gorilla, one day threatening everyone cause he was a big hard man with nukes now


to running away :greengrin hope it's true anyway and we see the Belurusians claiming back their country from Dictator Lukashenko




but i suspect the Wagners and Putin will kiss and make upIt's difficult to know how this is going to play out. My hope is that the people of Moscow see this as the opportunity to take to the streets, seize control and implement a democracy. Too far fetched I suspect.

[Glory Lurker]

Just read on the BBC that Prigozhin wants Russia to use nukes in Ukraine - would be great if Putin's regime collapsed, but astonishingly, he might actually be the lesser evil here.

Aye. Putin is a despicable horror of a man but Prigozhin is worse. And he's not as bad as the Chechen boy. There is no happy ending with any of this bunch.

[Stairway 2 7]

Just read on the BBC that Prigozhin wants Russia to use nukes in Ukraine - would be great if Putin's regime collapsed, but astonishingly, he might actually be the lesser evil here.

It would take about 300 people to send a nuke, it won't happen as people like to live.

Prigozhin actually said they could nuke Belgrade to stop the insurgency, then said the day later he was clearly joking.

[Glory Lurker]

It's difficult to know how this is going to play out. My hope is that the people of Moscow see this as the opportunity to take to the streets, seize control and implement a democracy. Too far fetched I suspect.

I think the big problem is that they don't want that.

[Stairway 2 7]

Aye. Putin is a despicable horror of a man but Prigozhin is worse. And he's not as bad as the Chechen boy. There is no happy ending with any of this bunch.

There is if they blooter each other then that quickens Ukraine getting there land back. I just want the genocide to end. This mutiny is obviously been pushed by the oligarchs who want normal relations and finance with the west.

Prigozhin coming out and saying the war was stupid and only started due to Russian greed is a hammer to putins narrative and the people will have heard it

[degenerated]

I think the big problem is that they don't want that.Cometh the hour.........26915

[Just Alf]

Just read on the BBC that Prigozhin wants Russia to use nukes in Ukraine - would be great if Putin's regime collapsed, but astonishingly, he might actually be the lesser evil here.Was the original security agreement between NATO, Russia and Ukraine for Ukraine to give up its nuclear weapons not all about NATO or Russia (I know, I know!) To come to their defence if Ukraine was threatened by nuclear force?.

[Stairway 2 7]

Girkin saying the column has passed Barabanovo about 2 hours from Moscow. Only the oka river and road blocks stopping them now

[Just Alf]

https://twitter.com/detresfa_/status/1672640399553462272?t=q3npe2FTZAWokH3s8MzpNA&s=19

[Hibs4185]

I wonder if Prigozhin saw how easy it was for the Russian legion in Belgorod and the lack of response from Putin and that emboldened him.

Just seen diggers digging up the roads around Moscow to stop Wagner and bridges being swung and left open so they can’t across.

It’s astonishing what’s happened in the last few hours.

You have to wonder if Ukraine should rush all the remaining batallions to the front and try to take advantage of the chaos but that could be maybe be the plan….doubt the Russians are that clever though

[Stairway 2 7]

The Russian airforce chanel fighterbomber is reporting Russia has lost 7 planes hellies to Russia, what a day

https://twitter.com/JimmySecUK/status/1672646888141598720

3 - Mi-8MTPR electronic warfare helicopters
1 - Mi-8 transport helicopter
1 - Ka-52 helicopter gunship
1 - Mi-35 helicopter gunship
1 - IL-22 airborne command post

[Stairway 2 7]

Ukraine has made pretty big gains in the east and its being reported making crossing of the dnipro

@NOELreports
·
41m
Russian channels are reporting that Ukrainian units have crossed the Dnipro river and fights are ongoing near the destroyed Antonivskyi bridge.

"The enemy has already transferred 3 tanks with the help of a ferry

[Just Alf]

[emoji1038]Austria commented on the coup in the Russian Federation

Federal Chancellor of Austria Karl Neghammer, commenting on the events in Russia, emphasized the importance of preventing nuclear weapons from falling into foreign hands.

The Chancellor of Austria added that he is in contact with colleagues from the EU. In addition, according to him, Western special services are constantly analyzing the situation in Russia

[Stairway 2 7]

[emoji1038]Austria commented on the coup in the Russian Federation

Federal Chancellor of Austria Karl Neghammer, commenting on the events in Russia, emphasized the importance of preventing nuclear weapons from falling into foreign hands.

The Chancellor of Austria added that he is in contact with colleagues from the EU. In addition, according to him, Western special services are constantly analyzing the situation in Russia

Neghammer will do nothing regardless, just like he's done zero to help Ukraine the last year

[Just Alf]

https://twitter.com/randymot4/status/1672652780442460161?t=OMQQXJr_t53mALg3pMVwRg&s=19

[stoneyburn hibs]

Whatever Wagner do it won't topple him sadly.
His position will be seriously weakened though.
Can only hope that this will be an awakening of the Russian people.

[degenerated]

Whatever Wagner do it won't topple him sadly.
His position will be seriously weakened though.
Can only hope that this will be an awakening of the Russian people.Looks like prigozhin is standing down. Reported on TV that he has stopped movement of troops and is de-escalating after agreement with lukashenko

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-66006142

[Glory Lurker]

Wha...?

[AgentDaleCooper]

This is hard to wrap one's head around

[Stairway 2 7]

Prigozhin has said he's stood down. Says its dependent on the promise he's been given that Shoygu and Gerasimov will stand down.

Surely Putin can't sit back and have them pardoned, it's too big an embarrassment the helicopters alone. I think Prigozhin will be falling out a window soon.

[degenerated]

Prigozhin has said he's stood down. Says its dependent on the promise he's been given that Shoygu and Gerasimov will stand down.

Surely Putin can't sit back and have them pardoned, it's too big an embarrassment the helicopters alone. I think Prigozhin will be falling out a window soon.Surely he would know his fate, is he maybe buying time?

[Lendo]

Looks like prigozhin is standing down. Reported on TV that he has stopped movement of troops and is de-escalating after agreement with lukashenko

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-66006142

Boo!!!

[Stairway 2 7]

Surely he would know his fate, is he maybe buying time?

I can't get my head round it all. Prigozhin has just said no deal is sorted yet. He could have knew he'd have the problem the Turkish soldiers trying to get Erdoğan had. They got into the cities didn't know what to do then just fizzled out

Girkin the leader of the 2014 invasion doesn't believe it either

“I don't believe in any ‘arrangements’. I hope to be wrong. The only option is that Prigozhin has been told that he is going to be personally killed, in a dark place, right now.”

- Igor Strelkov (Girkin

[Stairway 2 7]

A lot of it doesn't make sense. She could a relatively small group March across Russia unopposed, why didn't the airforce strike the column. Why do they say right that's it after Putin had previously said he needs wiped out. Sure more will come out in time.

[TrumpIsAPeado]

Prigozhin has said he's stood down. Says its dependent on the promise he's been given that Shoygu and Gerasimov will stand down.

Surely Putin can't sit back and have them pardoned, it's too big an embarrassment the helicopters alone. I think Prigozhin will be falling out a window soon.

I'd be checking every coffee cup from now on, that's for sure.

[Stairway 2 7]

I've just read a book on Blackrock it's bizarre. A private army more advanced than most nations, who committed war crimes in Iraq. These private armies are so wrong

@JimmySecUK
·
Imagine if the CEO of Blackwater publicly declared his intention to march on Washington D.C., shot down multiple USAF aircraft and killed an unknown number of American soldiers, and then was given legal immunity and allowed to maintain his huge private army by the President

[Glory Lurker]

I'd be checking every coffee cup from now on, that's for sure.

Dead by Friday.

[Stairway 2 7]

https://twitter.com/maxseddon/status/1672671654449762304


Russian TV showing images of wagner being cheered and hugged, all very weird

[degenerated]

Dead by Friday.Suppose that will depend on how much Putin enjoys his taste of Wagner's fees for fighting in Africa etc.

[Bridge hibs]

So what happens now, do they about turn and start hitting Ukraine again and with rage face Putin threatening the West again ?

[Stairway 2 7]

So what happens now, do they about turn and start hitting Ukraine again and with rage face Putin threatening the West again ?

They didn't stop going for Ukraine, well defending the Ukrainian advance. Ukraine said there wasn't much troop movement in Ukraine. That's why Prigozhin could travel the country, 95% of Russian troops are in Ukraine

[Smartie]

So what happens now, do they about turn and start hitting Ukraine again and with rage face Putin threatening the West again ?

The Wagner troops (plus those that were convinced to join them) must be all over the place mentally.

One minute you’re putting your life on the line for one thing, the next you’re heading off in a different direction, then you’re asked to halt / beat a retreat.

It wouldn’t surprise me if the next twist was Prigozhin losing control of his own army.

He must have been threatened with something fairly horrendous to get this far then about turn, surely?

[DaveF]

One theory being put forward is that it's just been some sort of ploy between Putin and Prigozhin to flush out any traitors within the Kremlin inner circle.

Might explain the lack of air attack on the convoy but then does not tie in with the aircraft downed earlier in the day by Wagner.

[Stairway 2 7]

One theory being put forward is that it's just been some sort of ploy between Putin and Prigozhin to flush out any traitors within the Kremlin inner circle.

Might explain the lack of air attack on the convoy but then does not tie in with the aircraft downed earlier in the day by Wagner.

It defo seems weird but the two things that can't be explained away are as you said, 7 aircraft being destroyed. 2 with footage of dead pilots. Second is Prigozhin slamming every excuse about the war, saying it had nothing to do with nato everything to do with expansion, Ukraine hasn't been bombing civilians in Donbas, Ukraine are about to win in the South ect. Surely Putin will be furious about this

[Glory Lurker]

So this is how Bobby felt when he came out the shower.

[Hibrandenburg]

Either Putin has something that scares the **** out of the Wagner leadership or Wagner are just taking a breather. Either way, what's being said doesn't add up with what's happening on the ground. Expect more twists.

[Lancs Harp]

It doesnt add up. I know there's a lot of boll*x going out there but a mercenary outfit with 10000 men marching into Moscow? Seriously? Has to be more to it than that unless Prigozhin is more deluded than Putin.

[cabbageandribs1875]

how can some old Trumpets hate their own country so much (1) i'd rather be a russian than democrat - Twitter Search / Twitter (https://twitter.com/search?q=i%27d%20rather%20be%20a%20russian%20than% 20democrat&src=typeahead_click)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FzZfTbcXgAMArdo?format=jpg&name=medium

[Glory Lurker]

how can some old Trumpets hate their own country so much (1) i'd rather be a russian than democrat - Twitter Search / Twitter (https://twitter.com/search?q=i%27d%20rather%20be%20a%20russian%20than% 20democrat&src=typeahead_click)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FzZfTbcXgAMArdo?format=jpg&name=medium

STs in the Club Deck.

[AgentDaleCooper]

how can some old Trumpets hate their own country so much (1) i'd rather be a russian than democrat - Twitter Search / Twitter (https://twitter.com/search?q=i%27d%20rather%20be%20a%20russian%20than% 20democrat&src=typeahead_click)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FzZfTbcXgAMArdo?format=jpg&name=medium
More to do with how much they hate minorities IMO

[cabbageandribs1875]

STs in the Club Deck.

:hilarious


More to do with how much they hate minorities IMO


fair comment :agree:




Kwestion Next, as i suspected nothing came of this Wagner marching on Moscow bizarreness, but i'm not getting why Prigozhin has been sent to Belarus ? what are the experts saying about this

what's happened to his group etc etc

[Hibernian Verse]

BBC

Criminal case into Prigozhin ongoing despite assurances - Russian media
The head of the Wagner mercenary group is still being investigated by Russian authorities despite the Kremlin promising to drop all charges against him, according to Russia's three main news agencies and another newspaper.

Russia's domestic spy agency, the FSB, still has a case open against Yevgeny Prigozhin, according to unnamed sources speaking to the news outlets.

Under a deal mediated by Belarusian leader Alexander Lukahsenko to defuse the crisis late on Saturday, the Kremlin said a criminal case against Prigozhin would be dropped and his fighters would face no legal action.

But the Kommersant website, quoting an unidentified source, said the decision to initiate a criminal case had not yet been cancelled, and the investigation into the rebellion was ongoing. It went on to quote the source saying not enough time had passed to close the case.

To be clear, this information is coming from Russian news outlets, and we haven't yet been able to independently verify it.

It remains unclear exactly what this means for the deal, and we haven't heard from Prigozhin or Russia's leader Vladimir Putin yet.

[WeAreHibs]

Thought I'd share the thoughts of an ex-CIA spy.

https://youtu.be/OvXguRJb_ro

[degenerated]

Thought I'd share the thoughts of an ex-CIA spy.

https://youtu.be/OvXguRJb_roI've seen that dude before on some crackpot alien TV programmes on discovery plus :greengrin

That's not to say he's wrong though as there are reports of Wagner building camps about 200 km from Ukraine border in Belarus.

[Stairway 2 7]

I've seen that dude before on some crackpot alien TV programmes on discovery plus :greengrin

That's not to say he's wrong though as there are reports of Wagner building camps about 200 km from Ukraine border in Belarus.

Russias full army, vdk special forces failed to take Kyiv. That was then they had 100k soldiers on the border, full air supremacy, 2000 more tanks, 4 times the rockets. Ukraine had basically no Western hardware, no real air defense, no HIMARS.

Remember the huge miles long convoy of Russian vehicles going to Kyiv and then sitting there as the distance was too long for the logistics. That would get blootered by HIMARS and all the aircraft wouldn't last a second with the patriots in Kyiv.

Most actual generals and military scholars say Russia attacking over the border is laughable. Loads of right wing nutters and conspiracy/anti vax types think there's a good chance

[archie]

Interesting (and sobering ) assessment https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/26/world/europe/ukraine-counteroffensive.html?unlocked_article_code=pyfbMz FDknz9CogRKldeZUhjQPWHEgfzgDvTLNaLpJOOyM0RLCYqYkGE vvovCV536JuQsEAZATfKCp54E9jFm4CWaiX76Vw6rKNOCMO6j3 TJjBmymkrxPaMqfBet6J_Bx1KuBvB0NBCFHYnxma0kKXurn-KGsI4tsRY2LoNbAt__QgdWMt2ooTqwJ0dwNe12oEuSf9yYTRpp FO3H83xNoNb_7hYTyhRTwMTRhiwFmKDMAna3EJh_hsDMK4WxFC E9uTWZeLJdnmrKZzQZL7y8xYh4AW9DLTAsqvrmYOun7ZfSn5Tv hzRo6MqjJp7cVizGbmVUoFdhdz2VYvn77ZDKjW9Vzdc62yzF&smid=url-share

[degenerated]

Russias full army, vdk special forces failed to take Kyiv. That was then they had 100k soldiers on the border, full air supremacy, 2000 more tanks, 4 times the rockets. Ukraine had basically no Western hardware, no real air defense, no HIMARS.

Remember the huge miles long convoy of Russian vehicles going to Kyiv and then sitting there as the distance was too long for the logistics. That would get blootered by HIMARS and all the aircraft wouldn't last a second with the patriots in Kyiv.

Most actual generals and military scholars say Russia attacking over the border is laughable. Loads of right wing nutters and conspiracy/anti vax types think there's a good chanceI do, but it doesn't mean they're not too stupid to try and open up a front as a distraction. Would save Putin a lot of polonium tea bags.

[Stairway 2 7]

I do, but it doesn't mean they're not too stupid to try and open up a front as a distraction. Would save Putin a lot of polonium tea bags.

Prigozhin a right wing evil **** bag and I'll not cry when he falls out a window, but I don't think he's too daft. He said striking Kyiv was stupid as was going head on to Bakhmut and losing so many. But then again he still complied so who knows. I reckon they know it would be a instant wipe out though so won't try it.

More likely to absorb wagner like they planned or keep some open to go back to rape, murder and pillage in Africa

[Stairway 2 7]

Lots of reports and images of Ukraine crossing the dnipr. I think its overblown, they aren't going to get there major force over without a bridge. Osint accounts say only a third of Ukraines counter offensive forces have been used but most are behind the lines further east than Kherson. Doubt we'll see much for another month, Ukraine seems to be focusing on logistics and using storm shadows

https://twitter.com/ChuckPfarrer/status/1673389363357425669

[Ozyhibby]

Lots of reports and images of Ukraine crossing the dnipr. I think its overblown, they aren't going to get there major force over without a bridge. Osint accounts say only a third of Ukraines counter offensive forces have been used but most are behind the lines further east than Kherson. Doubt we'll see much for another month, Ukraine seems to be focusing on logistics and using storm shadows

https://twitter.com/ChuckPfarrer/status/1673389363357425669

Too swampy there anyway and I doubt there is a need to do a river crossing. Probably this is about targeting Russian artillery and wearing them down. When the big push comes it will either be towards melitipol or marioupol.


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[Ozyhibby]

Interesting (and sobering ) assessment https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/26/world/europe/ukraine-counteroffensive.html?unlocked_article_code=pyfbMz FDknz9CogRKldeZUhjQPWHEgfzgDvTLNaLpJOOyM0RLCYqYkGE vvovCV536JuQsEAZATfKCp54E9jFm4CWaiX76Vw6rKNOCMO6j3 TJjBmymkrxPaMqfBet6J_Bx1KuBvB0NBCFHYnxma0kKXurn-KGsI4tsRY2LoNbAt__QgdWMt2ooTqwJ0dwNe12oEuSf9yYTRpp FO3H83xNoNb_7hYTyhRTwMTRhiwFmKDMAna3EJh_hsDMK4WxFC E9uTWZeLJdnmrKZzQZL7y8xYh4AW9DLTAsqvrmYOun7ZfSn5Tv hzRo6MqjJp7cVizGbmVUoFdhdz2VYvn77ZDKjW9Vzdc62yzF&smid=url-share

Not really. NY times has been calling this war wrong since the beginning.


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[superfurryhibby]

Interesting (and sobering ) assessment https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/26/world/europe/ukraine-counteroffensive.html?unlocked_article_code=pyfbMz FDknz9CogRKldeZUhjQPWHEgfzgDvTLNaLpJOOyM0RLCYqYkGE vvovCV536JuQsEAZATfKCp54E9jFm4CWaiX76Vw6rKNOCMO6j3 TJjBmymkrxPaMqfBet6J_Bx1KuBvB0NBCFHYnxma0kKXurn-KGsI4tsRY2LoNbAt__QgdWMt2ooTqwJ0dwNe12oEuSf9yYTRpp FO3H83xNoNb_7hYTyhRTwMTRhiwFmKDMAna3EJh_hsDMK4WxFC E9uTWZeLJdnmrKZzQZL7y8xYh4AW9DLTAsqvrmYOun7ZfSn5Tv hzRo6MqjJp7cVizGbmVUoFdhdz2VYvn77ZDKjW9Vzdc62yzF&smid=url-share

Thanks for posting, that was an interesting read.

I wonder how close to a stalemate things are just now? There must be a balance between trying to force a breakthrough and ensuring that men and equipment aren't squandered needlessly. I suppose the Ukrainian forces need to also remain mindful that there is a risk of counter-offensive.

[Stairway 2 7]

Thanks for posting, that was an interesting read.

I wonder how close to a stalemate things are just now? There must be a balance between trying to force a breakthrough and ensuring that men and equipment aren't squandered needlessly. I suppose the Ukrainian forces need to also remain mindful that there is a risk of counter-offensive.

Ukraine have just taken yesterday 120 sq miles that has been Russian held since 2014, they wont be stopping. Even Prigozhin said they will soon retake Bakhmut and are destined to break through to the sea in the south.

Osint teams looking at the satellite say about a third of the offensive force are at play so far. I think anyone that has called it right the last year and there are only a handful are saying the main attempts haven't started.

[Ozyhibby]

Thanks for posting, that was an interesting read.

I wonder how close to a stalemate things are just now? There must be a balance between trying to force a breakthrough and ensuring that men and equipment aren't squandered needlessly. I suppose the Ukrainian forces need to also remain mindful that there is a risk of counter-offensive.

We are not in a stalemate.


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[Jones28]

A reminder of how indiscriminately the Russians are shelling/blowing up Ukrainians.

Graphic video ⚠️

https://twitter.com/ostapyarysh/status/1673782245440495617?s=46&t=LWpyA25jn7_ojIH7KWfnGg

[cabbageandribs1875]

three teenage girls are among the 11 killed in that restaurant, inc 14 year old twin sisters and a 17 year old

Ukranian writer is still critical "fighting for her life" they are still searching the restaurant

[Renfrew_Hibby]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xEDOKC_Xl3s&pp=ygUEMTQyMA%3D%3D

A short video from the '1420' guys filmed in the Chuvashia Republic, east of Moscow and near Kazan.

The video portrays a community that is depressed and hopeless but utterly deluded at the same time. Away from the glitz of Moscow and St.petes Russia really is a ****hole

[Ozyhibby]

https://www.foreignaffairs.com/ukraine/theres-no-such-thing-great-power

Great article on why Russia was over estimated. And not behind a pay wall for now.


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[cabbageandribs1875]

28 year old Russian Bank Executive dies after she fell out a window Russian bank executive, 28, dies in mystery plunge from window of her Moscow apartment (msn.com) (https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/russian-bank-executive-28-dies-in-mystery-plunge-from-window-of-her-moscow-apartment/ar-AA1ddcVA?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=438e65a36cd043578031a7ddd92534c4&ei=46)

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/zero_4/status/1676235793516437510?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

UK govt still turning a blind eye to companies trading in Russia.


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[Jack]

https://twitter.com/zero_4/status/1676235793516437510?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

UK govt still turning a blind eye to companies trading in Russia.


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It's not surprising. Was it Shell or BP were exposed at the weekend for still dealing with Russian oil?

And I'm not sure if I read it here (maybe Private Eye) some Russian bigwig still somehow in the UK held a pro Russian party/diner attended by some tory Lords and others. It must be really difficult for them to get by without Russian blood money although a few of them are having a good try at rinsing the Chinese.

[Hibrandenburg]

https://twitter.com/zero_4/status/1676235793516437510?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

UK govt still turning a blind eye to companies trading in Russia.


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Lots of other countries at it too.

[Jones28]

Lots of supposition on Twitter that Russia are preparing a false flag even at a nuclear power plant.

[Ozyhibby]

Lots of supposition on Twitter that Russia are preparing a false flag even at a nuclear power plant.

It’s very possible. Not much we can do but carry on and hope.


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[AgentDaleCooper]

Lots of supposition on Twitter that Russia are preparing a false flag even at a nuclear power plant.

one of the few things that would make the slightest bit of sense out of the events of last week would be that Putin was looking for a way of moving Wagner to Belarus to do something awful, but with an element of surprise by utterly confusing everyone...but then again, he's weakened his position considerably in Russia, so it's probably not that :confused:

[Ozyhibby]

one of the few things that would make the slightest bit of sense out of the events of last week would be that Putin was looking for a way of moving Wagner to Belarus to do something awful, but with an element of surprise by utterly confusing everyone...but then again, he's weakened his position considerably in Russia, so it's probably not that :confused:

I doubt there is that level of planning going on now. I think it’s all about survival and he no longer knows who to trust. The regime will be gone very soon I think. Just have to hope without a major incident at Zaporizhzhia.


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[AgentDaleCooper]

I doubt there is that level of planning going on now. I think it’s all about survival and he no longer knows who to trust. The regime will be gone very soon I think. Just have to hope without a major incident at Zaporizhzhia.


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hope so. One of my pals from Poland is very, very unhappy about Wagner being stationed across the Border in Belarus - it would be like if they were sitting tight in Carlisle right now for us.

[Ozyhibby]

hope so. One of my pals from Poland is very, very unhappy about Wagner being stationed across the Border in Belarus - it would be like if they were sitting tight in Carlisle right now for us.

I think the poles would make very short work of them to be honest.


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[Hibrandenburg]

I think the poles would make very short work of them to be honest.


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Not just the Poles, the whole of NATO would swat them like flies.

[Ozyhibby]

https://nucleardiner.wordpress.com/2023/07/04/the-danger-at-zaporizhzhia-nuclear-power-plant/

For anyone worried about the nuclear power plant.


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[Stairway 2 7]

https://nucleardiner.wordpress.com/2023/07/04/the-danger-at-zaporizhzhia-nuclear-power-plant/

For anyone worried about the nuclear power plant.


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The Washington Post and the New York Times have both been generally wrong about everything in the war. Both Ill-informed tabloids with delusions of grandeur

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/tbowmannpr/status/1676709006063091712?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Ukraine getting cluster munitions.[emoji106]


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[Stairway 2 7]

https://twitter.com/tbowmannpr/status/1676709006063091712?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Ukraine getting cluster munitions.[emoji106]


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Both sides have used them since the start of the war. Ukraine have only had a few from Turkey but Russia did have a large supply initially. If only US would send long range weapons and ok fighter jets coming and the end would speed up massively

[Lendo]

https://twitter.com/tbowmannpr/status/1676709006063091712?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Ukraine getting cluster munitions.[emoji106]


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I thought these were banned. Maybe it’s the cluster bombs we used to use in the first Gulf War

[Smartie]

I thought these were banned. Maybe it’s the cluster bombs we used to use in the first Gulf War

Human rights groups still don't love them very much.

[Ozyhibby]

Human rights groups still don't love them very much.

They’ll kill less civilians than the Russians do though, so it’s a good thing.


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[Stairway 2 7]

They aren't illegal us the US and both sides of this war use them, they are opposed by rights groups who want them and land mines banned. Russia uses Thermobarics that are a gray area too. Both sides use depleted uranium rounds as do most nations, which are opposed.

The quickest way to stop all these horrible weapons would be to give Ukraine all the precision weapons they can get, especially long distance. The west isn't doing that at great speed though

[Stairway 2 7]

https://archive.ph/4WkBO

Xi Jinping warned Vladimir Putin against nuclear attack in Ukraine
Chinese officials privately take credit for convincing Russian leader to back down from veiled atomic threats

[Stairway 2 7]

Poor Russian oligarch says his life is being ruined by sanctions, shame

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-07-04/oligarch-fridman-bemoans-a-life-destroyed-by-eu-sanctions

[BS44]

Tin, wood or glass?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-66121584

[Kato]

Poor Russian oligarch says his life is being ruined by sanctions, shame

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-07-04/oligarch-fridman-bemoans-a-life-destroyed-by-eu-sanctionsAnybody coming away from Russia a billionaire has thieved that money from the Russian people with Putin's blessing.

Maybe his friends in govt will speak for him if he feels hard done by.

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[Stairway 2 7]

Anybody coming away from Russia a billionaire has thieved that money from the Russian people with Putin's blessing.

Maybe his friends in govt will speak for him if he feels hard done by.

Sent from my SM-A528B using Tapatalk

Yep horrendous what spivs like Putin and Abramovich were allowed to do to the publics assets after the fall of the union, happened in Ukraine too.

[Stairway 2 7]

Quite a statement from Erdoğan in his joint press conference with Zelensky in Turkey. Along with weapons package Turkey has really shown its cards to the doubters this war. Closing the bosphorus and voting Finland in also large statements mind

"Ukraine has the right to become a member of NATO,"

[Lendo]

Quite a statement from Erdoğan in his joint press conference with Zelensky in Turkey. Along with weapons package Turkey has really shown its cards to the doubters this war. Closing the bosphorus and voting Finland in also large statements mind

"Ukraine has the right to become a member of NATO,"

I really don’t know what to make of Erdogan. A cruel and nasty authoritarian but equally appears to be a stateman that can get **** done, like the grain deal.

I suspect it’s a case of just doing or saying whatever he needs to in the moment that best suits his own agenda.

[Stairway 2 7]

I really don’t know what to make of Erdogan. A cruel and nasty authoritarian but equally appears to be a stateman that can get **** done, like the grain deal.

I suspect it’s a case of just doing or saying whatever he needs to in the moment that best suits his own agenda.

He like all leaders do what's best for him and that's pro nato. He's been clear in his support from sending cluster bombs to approval of Finland.

He's also an authoritarian **** bag that murders the kurds with no conscience

[Lendo]

He like all leaders do what's best for him and that's pro nato. He's been clear in his support from sending cluster bombs to approval of Finland.

He's also an authoritarian **** bag that murders the kurds with no conscience

Read that Putin is doing a state visit to Turkey next month. Surely with Turkey being a NATO member they would be obliged to detain him for the international arrest warrant that was issued?

[Stairway 2 7]

Read that Putin is doing a state visit to Turkey next month. Surely with Turkey being a NATO member they would be obliged to detain him for the international arrest warrant that was issued?

It's not a NATO warrant. They would get exemption anyway I'm sure as their supposed role as mediator

[Hibrandenburg]

Read that Putin is doing a state visit to Turkey next month. Surely with Turkey being a NATO member they would be obliged to detain him for the international arrest warrant that was issued?

There's no way Putin will set foot outside his area of influence, he's reluctant to set foot outside the Kremlin never mind going abroad.

[Stairway 2 7]

While Putin sits in his bunker, Zelensky has just visited snake Island to pay his respects

Russian warship go **** yourself

https://twitter.com/PhillipsPOBrien/status/1677576325287096322

[Stairway 2 7]

Interesting article on Turkeys dealings with both parties

https://news.yahoo.com/turkey-supports-ukraine-without-alienating-russia-100046689.html

[Rumble de Thump]

I really don’t know what to make of Erdogan. A cruel and nasty authoritarian but equally appears to be a stateman that can get **** done, like the grain deal.

I suspect it’s a case of just doing or saying whatever he needs to in the moment that best suits his own agenda.

The grain deal was just the enabling of the theft of hundreds of thousands of tonnes of Ukrainian grain. Probably more than a million tonnes by now.

[Stairway 2 7]

Wow. The azovstal defenders were sent to neutral turkey in an agreement they would stay there until after the war. Turkey has just sent them back to Ukraine. Huge and surprising, you would think Russia won't be happy

https://twitter.com/PhillipsPOBrien/status/1677693639022067712

[Stairway 2 7]

Wow. The azovstal defenders were sent to neutral turkey in an agreement they would stay there until after the war. Turkey has just sent them back to Ukraine. Huge and surprising, you would think Russia won't be happy

https://twitter.com/PhillipsPOBrien/status/1677693639022067712

"The return of the leaders of the Azov from Turkey to Ukraine is nothing more than a direct violation of the terms of the existing agreements. And in this case, both the Ukrainian and Turkish sides violated the conditions," Peskov said

[Lendo]

Wow. The azovstal defenders were sent to neutral turkey in an agreement they would stay there until after the war. Turkey has just sent them back to Ukraine. Huge and surprising, you would think Russia won't be happy

https://twitter.com/PhillipsPOBrien/status/1677693639022067712

Surely Turkey couldn’t forcibly hold these men anyway.

[Stairway 2 7]

Surely Turkey couldn’t forcibly hold these men anyway.

That's what I thought when they went there, why is this happening, why didn't Russia send them east. I think it was part of the surrender, both sides agreed Turkey would hold them in a good state.

Turkey has obviously changed that decision, Russian press are not amused so far

[Hibrandenburg]

Wow. The azovstal defenders were sent to neutral turkey in an agreement they would stay there until after the war. Turkey has just sent them back to Ukraine. Huge and surprising, you would think Russia won't be happy

https://twitter.com/PhillipsPOBrien/status/1677693639022067712

Doesn't bode well for any future POW exchanges.

[Lendo]

How can Turkey be considered “neutral” when it’s a NATO member?! I’m so confused.

[Ozyhibby]

https://www.newsweek.com/2023/07/21/exclusive-cias-blind-spot-about-ukraine-war-1810355.html

Interesting article on the role of the CIA in Ukraine.


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[Ozyhibby]

How can Turkey be considered “neutral” when it’s a NATO member?! I’m so confused.

It’s not really neutral as much as it’s concerned for it’s own interests.


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[JeMeSouviens]

How can Turkey be considered “neutral” when it’s a NATO member?! I’m so confused.

Well I think technically there's no formal alliance between NATO and Ukraine, so all NATO countries are theoretically neutral in a conflict between Russia and Ukraine. Obviously not in practice, but it's why NATO countries were initially hesitant to do anything that could be seen as them being in open conflict with Russia.

[Stairway 2 7]

Announced Turkey will be building a Bayraktar drone factory jointly with Ukraine, in the west of the country. It might cause issues if Putin tries to blow it up as it will be owned by Erdoğans son in law..

Turkey also saying today they will approve Swedens nato place, if the EU restart talks on Turkey joining the EU

[Ozyhibby]

Announced Turkey will be building a Bayraktar drone factory jointly with Ukraine, in the west of the country. It might cause issues if Putin tries to blow it up as it will be owned by Erdoğans son in law..

Turkey also saying today they will approve Swedens nato place, if the EU restart talks on Turkey joining the EU

I would think the war will be over before it’s up and running.
The EU thing is weird. There is a pathway to the EU for Turkey already but they are not doing the things that you need to do. If anything, on democracy and press freedom, they are moving away from what needs to be done.


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[Rumble de Thump]

I would think the war will be over before it’s up and running.
The EU thing is weird. There is a pathway to the EU for Turkey already but they are not doing the things that you need to do. If anything, on democracy and press freedom, they are moving away from what needs to be done.


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Turkey would need to stop illegally occupying north Cyprus for a start.

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/natalkakyiv/status/1678416359238017025?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A


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[Ozyhibby]

Announced Turkey will be building a Bayraktar drone factory jointly with Ukraine, in the west of the country. It might cause issues if Putin tries to blow it up as it will be owned by Erdoğans son in law..

Turkey also saying today they will approve Swedens nato place, if the EU restart talks on Turkey joining the EU

https://twitter.com/skynewsbreak/status/1678487179410960397?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Job done for the swedes.[emoji106]


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[Ozyhibby]

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/currencies/russia-economy-putin-sanctions-markets-currency-labor-recession-emigration-2023-7

Russian economy about to collapse?


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[Glory Lurker]

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/currencies/russia-economy-putin-sanctions-markets-currency-labor-recession-emigration-2023-7

Russian economy about to collapse?


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About the same time Sevco go burst?

[Ozyhibby]

About the same time Sevco go burst?

Well that would be nice.


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[Jack]

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/currencies/russia-economy-putin-sanctions-markets-currency-labor-recession-emigration-2023-7

Russian economy about to collapse?


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I've read about the economy collapsing, almost since day 1.

Just the other week there we heard about a oil company still doing business, other companies with Russian subsidiaries still doing billions in business ... and I've still not heard that Rishi Sunaks in-laws have pulled out their multi billion pound business.

It seems its only a few dozen oligarchs are feeling a bit of a pinch while the recipe for Micky Ds and KFCs are delivered far and wide.

Forgive me if I don't get excited!

[Stairway 2 7]

A country like Russias economy is going to just fail completely, but the damage is unbelievably high. India and China are taking all the oil and gas they can get, unfortunately for Russia The discount on urals means they are barely making profit.

It's already estimated the countries economy has been damaged greater than after the fall of the soviet Union.

The damage will be for decades rather than instant. It's estimated 200,000 young people with degrees fled the country, the damage from that you don't see on paper. Add maybe 75,000 dead young men and multiple times that disabled.

I'm sure once this is over companies will start to trade again but the damage is done. European nations were forced to diversify their access to fuel and that is there forever now. Russias future has been decimated and for what

[Ozyhibby]

Turkey would need to stop illegally occupying north Cyprus for a start.

Plus about a million other things that Turkey would need to change before entering the EU. It’s not happening anytime soon and def not under Erdogan.


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[cabbageandribs1875]

i realise he's trying to put pressure on but i think using words like "absurd" doesn't help his cause imo Nato summit: Zelensky says Nato 'absurd' for membership delay - BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-66140072)



Were Ukraine to join now, Nato countries would technically have to declare war on Russia.

Kyiv has conceded it can't join during the conflict, but wants to join as soon as possible afterwards.


the conflict will go on for a long time yet and i'm sure Nato know what they're doing

[Ozyhibby]

i realise he's trying to put pressure on but i think using words like "absurd" doesn't help his cause imo Nato summit: Zelensky says Nato 'absurd' for membership delay - BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-66140072)



Were Ukraine to join now, Nato countries would technically have to declare war on Russia.

Kyiv has conceded it can't join during the conflict, but wants to join as soon as possible afterwards.


the conflict will go on for a long time yet and i'm sure Nato know what they're doing

I personally don’t think there is a year left in this conflict. Just my opinion.


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[Stairway 2 7]

The institute for the study of war has estimated Ukraine has recaptured in 5 weeks, the same amount of land that Russia captured in 6 months of its offensive.

https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2023/07/11/7410745/

[Stairway 2 7]

On the same day Russia confirm general Tsoskov was killed in a storm shadow strike, France announce they will join the UK in sending a significant amount of long range missles. Germany and the US next hopefully although both reluctant.

https://twitter.com/yarotrof/status/1678781000762163203

[Ozyhibby]

On the same day Russia confirm general Tsoskov was killed in a storm shadow strike, France announce they will join the UK in sending a significant amount of long range missles. Germany and the US next hopefully although both reluctant.

https://twitter.com/yarotrof/status/1678781000762163203

Ukraine also assassinated a Russian submarine captain in Krasnodar.
https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/1678508144857686018?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

He was out jogging but was easy to find as he posted his runs online.

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[cabbageandribs1875]

I personally don’t think there is a year left in this conflict. Just my opinion.


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Nato have refused to give him a timeline


Nato summit: Allies refuse to give Ukraine timeframe on joining - BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-66167616)

But Mr Zelensky tweeted that the lack of an agreed timeframe meant his country's eventual membership could become a bargaining chip.


"A window of opportunity is being left to bargain Ukraine's membership in Nato in negotiations with Russia. Uncertainty is weakness," he said.


His comments follow disagreement between Nato members on Ukrainian membership.



i'd leave the decision making to the experienced Nato dudes, and so should he

[Stairway 2 7]

Nato have refused to give him a timeline


Nato summit: Allies refuse to give Ukraine timeframe on joining - BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-66167616)

But Mr Zelensky tweeted that the lack of an agreed timeframe meant his country's eventual membership could become a bargaining chip.


"A window of opportunity is being left to bargain Ukraine's membership in Nato in negotiations with Russia. Uncertainty is weakness," he said.


His comments follow disagreement between Nato members on Ukrainian membership.



i'd leave the decision making to the experienced Nato dudes, and so should he


Your country isn't getting flattened. There's no reason they can't say, Ukraine won't join whilst still fighting in its borders but once that ends or agreement is in place there will be a clear time line.

Apparently it's the US and Germany wanting to hold off and the rest are wanting a clear time line. Particular anger from Eastern European and Baltic nations and no path given, which is understandable as they share borders with Russia and Belarus

[Onceinawhile]

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/currencies/russia-economy-putin-sanctions-markets-currency-labor-recession-emigration-2023-7

Russian economy about to collapse?


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Got to the phrase "the ruble has is crashing" and decided it probably wasn't 100% correct.

[Ozyhibby]

Got to the phrase "the ruble has is crashing" and decided it probably wasn't 100% correct.

Is the ruble not crashing?


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[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1679258082302459904?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A


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[Stairway 2 7]

Grim read about Ukrainian public imprisoned by Russia. If Ukraine had brokered a peace deal last summer like some were calling for, this would be the fate of some in Kherson.

https://apnews.com/article/ukraine-russia-prisons-civilians-torture-detainees-88b4abf2efbf383272eed9378be13c72?taid=64af8aa88cb4 af0001874873&utm_campaign=TrueAnthem&utm_medium=AP&utm_source=Twitter

[AgentDaleCooper]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-66211121

Wagner troops in Belarus - surely they're going to go for Kyiv. Grim if they are.

[Ozyhibby]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-66211121

Wagner troops in Belarus - surely they're going to go for Kyiv. Grim if they are.

They are not that stupid. There is zero chance of another ground attack on Kiev.


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[AgentDaleCooper]

They are not that stupid. There is zero chance of another ground attack on Kiev.


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Maybe, but I find it hard to believe that the only reason they are there is because they are following their leader...looks like some sort of strategic thing to me.

[Ozyhibby]

Maybe, but I find it hard to believe that the only reason they are there is because they are following their leader...looks like some sort of strategic thing to me.

Everything is possible. Applying logic to some of their decisions can lead me astray sometimes. I just can’t see how anyone thinks that opening another front helps Russia. I really think Putin has lost all control now and unpredictable things are about to happen. If it’s heading to Kiev then they will be slaughtered.


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[AgentDaleCooper]

Everything is possible. Applying logic to some of their decisions can lead me astray sometimes. I just can’t see how anyone thinks that opening another front helps Russia. I really think Putin has lost all control now and unpredictable things are about to happen. If it’s heading to Kiev then they will be slaughtered.


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One paper was saying that they might be planning on releasing some of the criminals within Wagner over the border into Poland, simply to cause havoc - it would suit the prisoners, as the conditions would be much better inside Polish cells than in Russian ones.

[Stairway 2 7]

When Russia went for Kyiv Russia had surprise, an army that hadn't been ruined, full air supremacy to fly in Ukraine, guided missles, special forces that were blootered outside Kyiv.

Ukraine didn't have western weapons particularly drones, HIMARS and patriots that will destroy any plane near Kyiv. Ukraine also now has fortifications all along the border they didn't have and all bridges mined

Russia would be vaporised coming from the North.

If anything it's a show so that Ukraine has to keep some soldiers up north

[Smartie]

Kyiv will surely be about the hardest European capital to “take” these days.

[Stairway 2 7]

Kyiv will surely be about the hardest European capital to “take” these days.

If you take nato forces out the equation as in all would defend Poland ect, then I'd think so, definitely the best air defense

[Smartie]

A section of the Kerch bridge taken down overnight?

Putin has convened the security council.

[Ozyhibby]

A section of the Kerch bridge taken down overnight?

Putin has convened the security council.

https://twitter.com/igorsushko/status/1680828416613060608?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A
Road section will be out of action for the rest of the year now.[emoji106]

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[Stairway 2 7]

On the 9th anniversary of Russian blowing up flight mh17 killing 298 people

[BS44]

When Russia went for Kyiv Russia had surprise, an army that hadn't been ruined, full air supremacy to fly in Ukraine, guided missles, special forces that were blootered outside Kyiv.

Ukraine didn't have western weapons particularly drones, HIMARS and patriots that will destroy any plane near Kyiv. Ukraine also now has fortifications all along the border they didn't have and all bridges mined

Russia would be vaporised coming from the North.

If anything it's a show so that Ukraine has to keep some soldiers up north

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/putin-targets-nato-s-weakest-links-with-invasion-threat-from-wagner-fighters/ar-AA1dWIRM?cvid=41b01d9ee1604135820af29a32497707&ocid=winp2fptaskbarhover&ei=5

"A top pro-Putin parliamentarian and reservist general says Wagner is set to be used to take an area known as The Suwalki Corridor - a 60-mile strip of land straddling the border between Poland and Lithuania."

[Ozyhibby]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/putin-targets-nato-s-weakest-links-with-invasion-threat-from-wagner-fighters/ar-AA1dWIRM?cvid=41b01d9ee1604135820af29a32497707&ocid=winp2fptaskbarhover&ei=5

"A top pro-Putin parliamentarian and reservist general says Wagner is set to be used to take an area known as The Suwalki Corridor - a 60-mile strip of land straddling the border between Poland and Lithuania."

I doubt Poland would even bother to trigger article 5 in dealing with this. It would be all over in a morning.


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[Lendo]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/putin-targets-nato-s-weakest-links-with-invasion-threat-from-wagner-fighters/ar-AA1dWIRM?cvid=41b01d9ee1604135820af29a32497707&ocid=winp2fptaskbarhover&ei=5

"A top pro-Putin parliamentarian and reservist general says Wagner is set to be used to take an area known as The Suwalki Corridor - a 60-mile strip of land straddling the border between Poland and Lithuania."

Would be absolutely suicidal.

If it was Wagner doing the dirty work then it could give Russia some deniability, similar to when Wagner forces attacked a US base in Syria. The US wiped out a few hundred Russians in a four hours battle and there was no escalation as Russia technically had no involvement and confirmed to the US no Russian forces were in the area. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Khasham

[cabbageandribs1875]

https://www.thenews.com.pk/latest/1091477-oleg-khorzhan-putins-puppet-leader-found-dead-at-home-in-suspected-murder

Putin's puppet leader found dead at home in suspected murder
Khorzhan served as the Communist Party's leader in Transnistria, a nation that was being protected by 1,500 Russian army "peacekeepers," and, following a four-year prison sentence for assaulting a public servant, the pro-Russian politician entered politics again with Moscow's support.
He was freed eight months ago, and people refer to him as a "Moscow proxy."

Russia has been charged by Moldova with using the breakaway state of Transnistria to destabilise the nation. According to some experts, Putin's plans to establish a new empire include an invasion of Moldova, which was formerly part of the Soviet Union.

[Glory Lurker]

The ANC is a gang.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-66238766

[Stairway 2 7]

Putin blinks first. Putin will not attend BRICS in South Africa due to mutual consent..

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-07-19/south-africa-says-putin-will-not-attend-brics-summit-in-person-lk9lracd

[Ozyhibby]

Putin blinks first. Putin will not attend BRICS in South Africa due to mutual consent..

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-07-19/south-africa-says-putin-will-not-attend-brics-summit-in-person-lk9lracd

Always thought he would. When it comes to protecting himself he always blinks first.


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[Lendo]

Always thought he would. When it comes to protecting himself he always blinks first.


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https://news.sky.com/story/amp/vladimir-putin-plans-rare-overseas-trip-to-visit-nato-member-turkey-12917197

Really don’t understand this planned trip either. Surely exactly the same situation. How can any NATO nation contemplate hosting him? Especially after todays attack on the the grain port.

[Stairway 2 7]

https://news.sky.com/story/amp/vladimir-putin-plans-rare-overseas-trip-to-visit-nato-member-turkey-12917197

Really don’t understand this planned trip either. Surely exactly the same situation. How can any NATO nation contemplate hosting him? Especially after todays attack on the the grain port.

They get it approved by NATO as supposed peacemakers to discuss grain deal and prisoner swaps apparently

[Glory Lurker]

Cheerio to any chance of EU membership.

[Jones28]

Cheerio to any chance of EU membership.

?

[Bristolhibby]

Cheerio to any chance of EU membership.

For Russia?

[Glory Lurker]

I was meaning Turkey, in reaction to that article about the prisoner swap.

[Bristolhibby]

I was meaning Turkey, in reaction to that article about the prisoner swap.

Ahhh.

Turkeys never getting into the EU anyway. It was just a scare story during the Brexit election to scare racists.

J

[Jack]

Ahhh.

Turkeys never getting into the EU anyway. It was just a scare story during the Brexit election to scare racists.

J

Maybe for the tory or Brexit thread but I see the torys are trying to do some Brexit benefit deal with Turkey. Wouldn't surprise me if part of that deal included something about Turkish people coming here. Its seems many of these deals do. The irony given what you said!

[Bristolhibby]

Maybe for the tory or Brexit thread but I see the torys are trying to do some Brexit benefit deal with Turkey. Wouldn't surprise me if part of that deal included something about Turkish people coming here. Its seems many of these deals do. The irony given what you said!

The irony isn’t lost on me. Vote Brexit to keep brown people out. Ends up more deals to allow more brown people in.

You can’t make it up.

J

[cabbageandribs1875]

Russian defence minister visiting North Korea yesterday Kim Jong-un welcomes Putin's war chief as Russia prepares to beg for weapons (msn.com) (https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/kim-jong-un-welcomes-putin-s-war-chief-as-russia-prepares-to-beg-for-weapons/ar-AA1end8v?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=14ff99b8afaf4402b07be7a0e8b6beab&ei=25) i'm sure the world will be a safer place if they're helping despot jong-un with his nuclear programme

[StevieC]

Dnipro hit by two missiles today.

I know this are well, it’s quite central with busy restaurants nearby.

https://twitter.com/defenceu/status/1685008746425020418?s=46&t=rLSOnf0Y0oJGKGO8p2iMQw

[Ozyhibby]

https://newlinesmag.com/argument/russians-see-ukrainian-progress-where-others-dont/

Decent summary of the counter offensive.


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[Glory Lurker]

I'm surprised their borders with Belarus are still open at all.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-66347370

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/threshedthought/status/1685644057739935744?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A


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[Bridge hibs]

Did I hear correctly on GMTV news this morning that Ukraine has fired drones into Moscow and saying they are taking the war to Russia ?

I can understand defending your own country as they have been but sending drones into Russia is surely a very dangerous move and an escalation