Ukraine

[Hibrandenburg]

It is the same thing. When your nation has a real chance of being conquered as UK and Germany was you do whatever you can to stop the funds of your aggressor. UK bombed Dutch bridges and dams and oil refineries in France, they would definitely cut off Nord Stream.

With the large military package announced I guess Germany thinks similar?

It's not nearly the same, Holland and France were under German occupation.

[Moulin Yarns]

It's not nearly the same, Holland and France were under German occupation.

Dinnae be daft 😉

[Stairway 2 7]

It's not nearly the same, Holland and France were under German occupation.

It's the same in that if you want to stop being invaded you do whatever is needed to stop the income, it seems the German government agrees as they pretty much said as much and have continued supporting Ukraine.

It was an utter disgrace that Merkels government agreed to Nordstream 2 being built post crimea so I'm glad that was damaged in the explosion too. It was successful in getting European to cut its dependency on Russian gas, hammered Russia's income and turbocharged Europe's green energy build, so a massive win for Europe

[Ozyhibby]

https://x.com/maria_drutska/status/1824150501035999730?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Seems to be trouble in Belgorod tonight.[emoji1696]


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[Stairway 2 7]

https://x.com/maria_drutska/status/1824150501035999730?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Seems to be trouble in Belgorod tonight.[emoji1696]


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They had taken a town over the border this morning I'm not sure if it will be connected. Two fronts in Russia certainly wasn't expected. Interesting article on the advances. Russia just did expect them to be allowed to cross with nato equipment, the areas were just protected by mostly young conscripts who have given up en masses

https://newlinesmag.com/spotlight/how-ukraine-caught-putins-forces-off-guard-in-kursk-and-why/

[Hibrandenburg]

It's the same in that if you want to stop being invaded you do whatever is needed to stop the income, it seems the German government agrees as they pretty much said as much and have continued supporting Ukraine.

It was an utter disgrace that Merkels government agreed to Nordstream 2 being built post crimea so I'm glad that was damaged in the explosion too. It was successful in getting European to cut its dependency on Russian gas, hammered Russia's income and turbocharged Europe's green energy build, so a massive win for Europe

The same would have been sinking American shipping pre Pearl Harbour, but the UK didn't, despite the Americans trading oil with Germany.

[Ozyhibby]

They had taken a town over the border this morning I'm not sure if it will be connected. Two fronts in Russia certainly wasn't expected. Interesting article on the advances. Russia just did expect them to be allowed to cross with nato equipment, the areas were just protected by mostly young conscripts who have given up en masses

https://newlinesmag.com/spotlight/how-ukraine-caught-putins-forces-off-guard-in-kursk-and-why/

The amount of Russian soldier just surrendering in Kursk has caught the Ukrainians by surprise and they are having trouble processing them all. A pleasant surprise I’m sure.
The amount of troops Putin is now going to have to assign to the whole border with Ukraine is now massive and they are going to have to be of a quality that just doesn’t put their hands in the air.
I don’t think Russia has the troops for the job.


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[Ozyhibby]

The same would have been sinking American shipping pre Pearl Harbour, but the UK didn't, despite the Americans trading oil with Germany.

There are people on ships. Nord stream was a pipeline no longer in use paid for by Russia in international waters.


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[Hibs4185]

The amount of Russian soldier just surrendering in Kursk has caught the Ukrainians by surprise and they are having trouble processing them all. A pleasant surprise I’m sure.
The amount of troops Putin is now going to have to assign to the whole border with Ukraine is now massive and they are going to have to be of a quality that just doesn’t put their hands in the air.
I don’t think Russia has the troops for the job.


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The TV shows in Russia are openly discussing having to give up their border areas. Must be bad if they are saying that and I almost feel Putin’s power must be fading too if they are saying it. Normally they’d brush it away with threats and treat it like it’s not happening

[Hibrandenburg]

There are people on ships. Nord stream was a pipeline no longer in use paid for by Russia in international waters.


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Which is pretty much my point, that blowing up a pipeline in international waters is not the same as attacking infrastructure in enemy occupied territory.

[Stairway 2 7]

Which is pretty much my point, that blowing up a pipeline in international waters is not the same as attacking infrastructure in enemy occupied territory.

It wasn't just infrastructure tens of thousands of French were killed by allied bombing of French cities. I'm sure the French see it as a tragic ends to the means. This isn't on that level it is a pipe that could be used to fund their genocide, I don't think many would deny Ukraine the right to hit it, if they did

[Hibrandenburg]

It wasn't just infrastructure tens of thousands of French were killed by allied bombing of French cities. I'm sure the French see it as a tragic ends to the means. This isn't on that level it is a pipe that could be used to fund their genocide, I don't think many would deny Ukraine the right to hit it, if they did

I think it was fair game, I just don't think it's the same as the comparison you made where loss of friendly life was considered to be acceptable collateral damage.

[Ozyhibby]

It wasn't just infrastructure tens of thousands of French were killed by allied bombing of French cities. I'm sure the French see it as a tragic ends to the means. This isn't on that level it is a pipe that could be used to fund their genocide, I don't think many would deny Ukraine the right to hit it, if they did

Pretty sure there were more French civilian deaths on D-Day than allied or German deaths?


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[Bristolhibby]

Pretty sure there were more French civilian deaths on D-Day than allied or German deaths?


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The French hit the beaches too on D-Day. They green lit the whole operation. (As much as they had a green light). Point I’m making is they were involved.

J

[RyeSloan]

The amount of Russian soldier just surrendering in Kursk has caught the Ukrainians by surprise and they are having trouble processing them all. A pleasant surprise I’m sure.
The amount of troops Putin is now going to have to assign to the whole border with Ukraine is now massive and they are going to have to be of a quality that just doesn’t put their hands in the air.
I don’t think Russia has the troops for the job.


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This move has certainly caught everyone by surprise.

Seems like the Russians have over extended in Ukraine without even considering the thought that the Ukrainians might start to come the other way.

Says a lot about the Russian military that Ukraine has done what it has done without air superiority. Clearly the Russians are lacking even basic intelligence on the ground to bring their airforce to bear.

I assume the Ukraine thought process here is to force Russia to relocate a significant amount of their invasion force to shore up their own border. The Ukrainian forces then hit hard back in their home land on the now depleted invasion force and melt away in Russia avoiding a direct fight with the now relocated Russians.

Could be an absolute master stroke.

[Ozyhibby]

This move has certainly caught everyone by surprise.

Seems like the Russians have over extended in Ukraine without even considering the thought that the Ukrainians might start to come the other way.

Says a lot about the Russian military that Ukraine has done what it has done without air superiority. Clearly the Russians are lacking even basic intelligence on the ground to bring their airforce to bear.

I assume the Ukraine thought process here is to force Russia to relocate a significant amount of their invasion force to shore up their own border. The Ukrainian forces then hit hard back in their home land on the now depleted invasion force and melt away in Russia avoiding a direct fight with the now relocated Russians.

Could be an absolute master stroke.

That’s everyone’s hope. Russia has a lot of undefended border with Ukraine. To defend it properly will require more troops than it has. Hopefully they take away from Zaporizhzhia and Ukraine can make another push for Tokmak and Melitipol.


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[Lendo]

This move has certainly caught everyone by surprise.

Seems like the Russians have over extended in Ukraine without even considering the thought that the Ukrainians might start to come the other way.

Says a lot about the Russian military that Ukraine has done what it has done without air superiority. Clearly the Russians are lacking even basic intelligence on the ground to bring their airforce to bear.

I assume the Ukraine thought process here is to force Russia to relocate a significant amount of their invasion force to shore up their own border. The Ukrainian forces then hit hard back in their home land on the now depleted invasion force and melt away in Russia avoiding a direct fight with the now relocated Russians.

Could be an absolute master stroke.

My first thought when this all happened was that they had waited on the first F16’s being delivered and that they have given them the air superiority needed to stop any counter attack.

[Hibs4185]

Now destroyed two bridges in Kursk trapping 700 Russians and potentially doubling the seized land. Also the river over which the bridges crossed gives them a natural defence barrier.

Fingers crossed they’ve been practising their bridge demolition tactics for the Kerch Bridge. That would be a real sickener for Putin if he’s getting routed in Kursk and looses his precious bridge.

[Ozyhibby]

Now destroyed two bridges in Kursk trapping 700 Russians and potentially doubling the seized land. Also the river over which the bridges crossed gives them a natural defence barrier.

Fingers crossed they’ve been practising their bridge demolition tactics for the Kerch Bridge. That would be a real sickener for Putin if he’s getting routed in Kursk and looses his precious bridge.

I’m pretty sure they could have hit that bridge just now if they wanted to. I read somewhere that the Ukrainians were happy for it to tie up some pretty precious air defence systems and they were trying to take them out first.


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[BS44]

Meanwhile the Russians have their eyes on capturing another Ukrainian city.

BBC report

The latest advances bring the Russians closer to the city of Pokrovsk, a vital logistics hub that sits on a main road for supplies to Ukrainian troops along the eastern front.

Pokrovsk lies north-west of the Russian-held Donetsk region, which has been under Ukrainian fire since Friday morning, leaving several civilians injured.

A message from the head of the city’s military administration, Sergiy Dobryak, on Thursday, urged people to evacuate as Russia was “rapidly approaching the outskirts".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c628gk68p3po

[Ozyhibby]

Meanwhile the Russians have their eyes on capturing another Ukrainian city.

BBC report

The latest advances bring the Russians closer to the city of Pokrovsk, a vital logistics hub that sits on a main road for supplies to Ukrainian troops along the eastern front.

Pokrovsk lies north-west of the Russian-held Donetsk region, which has been under Ukrainian fire since Friday morning, leaving several civilians injured.

A message from the head of the city’s military administration, Sergiy Dobryak, on Thursday, urged people to evacuate as Russia was “rapidly approaching the outskirts".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c628gk68p3po

It’s not a sign that Russia is winning.


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[BS44]

It’s not a sign that Russia is winning.


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Obviously not, though they are taking territory in the east.

[Stairway 2 7]

Obviously not, though they are taking territory in the east.

Ukraine just took in 1 week more land than Russia has gained in the last 12 months, although both amounts are very minimal on a nationwide level

I read that if Russia advance at the same pace as this year it'll take them 1100 years to fully take Ukraine and 200 million dead soldiers..

[Jones28]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cg58mj7mzrdo

Russia desperately scraping the barrel with their frontline recruits.

A Ukranian drone is too good for this individual.

[Bristolhibby]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cg58mj7mzrdo

Russia desperately scraping the barrel with their frontline recruits.

A Ukranian drone is too good for this individual.

Statistics say he will soon be dead. And not a moment too soon. Let’s hope he gets killed well away from any Ukrainian villages or civilians. A HIMARS strike or the likes. Then hopefully the family of the old dear can get some closure and not fear for their lives with a non existent justice system in RuSSia.

J

[BS44]

BBC News - Russia pushes on key Ukraine city while Kyiv's Kursk incursion slows
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c984g10e22lo



Not looking good in the east of Ukraine

[Bridge hibs]

Looks like things could get tasty as Putin threats Nato if they deploy long range missles

[Stairway 2 7]

Looks like things could get tasty as Putin threats Nato if they deploy long range missles

He said the same about weapons going to Ukraine, then if tanks went to Ukraine, then if planes went to Ukraine, German
weapons killing Russians, UK weapons the same, no HIMARS, then if Ukraine was allowed to hit inside Russia, now it's this. It's about on average every two months a red line is crossed. His paid tankies will amplify it to try and stop it but it won't work and nothing will happen after it either.

[Jim44]

He said the same about weapons going to Ukraine, then if tanks went to Ukraine, then if planes went to Ukraine, German
weapons killing Russians, UK weapons the same, no HIMARS, then if Ukraine was allowed to hit inside Russia, now it's this. It's about on average every two months a red line is crossed. His paid tankies will amplify it to try and stop it but it won't work and nothing will happen after it either.

I’m not convinced of this. If the madman and his lackies are forced into an ever decreasing corner he might do something drastic.

[Stairway 2 7]

I’m not convinced of this. If the madman and his lackies are forced into an ever decreasing corner he might do something drastic.

I read that he has said 24 different red lines to the media. The thought that missles hitting airbases a little further into Russia when American HIMARS are already hitting Russian airbases just over the border, would be the line is wild.

If Russia was about to fall then maybe but Ukraine doesn't want that and it's never going to happen. This is just like his other lines, I'm surprised it even gets reported as that what he wants. It's apparently getting approved this week, I'm still going to book my Christmas nights out I'm that confident there won't be a nuclear holocaust

[Ozyhibby]

I’m not convinced of this. If the madman and his lackies are forced into an ever decreasing corner he might do something drastic.

They are not a suicide cult. Otherwise why would they be stealing all that money? They are in this for personal enrichment. They are not ideologues. That’s why all their families live in the west.
Eventually the oligarchs are going to make a move v Putin because he is costing them all a lot of money now.


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[Jones28]

Looks like things could get tasty as Putin threats Nato if they deploy long range missles

Russia have lost over 600k casualties.

If they start something with NATO I give Russia two weeks until they’re kicked out of Ukraine. Crimea included.

[Stairway 2 7]

After it was announced Russia had paid 2800 influencers on the left and right to spout Kremlin misinfo, including fools like Tim Poole who Musk loves to retweet. The CIA has released documents showing the biggest known secret, that RT is full of Russian disinfo and spies. Bit embarrassing for George Galloway, Tommy Sheridan and Alex Salmond

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/09/13/politics/biden-administration-rt-russian-intelligence/index.html

[Jim44]

After it was announced Russia had paid 2800 influencers on the left and right to spout Kremlin misinfo, including fools like Tim Poole who Musk loves to retweet. The CIA has released documents showing the biggest known secret, that RT is full of Russian disinfo and spies. Bit embarrassing for George Galloway, Tommy Sheridan and Alex Salmond

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/09/13/politics/biden-administration-rt-russian-intelligence/index.html

In what way is it embarrassing for George Galloway, Tommy Sheridan and Alex Salmond?
Is it not the case that there might be something deeply sinister about their political motivation?

[Ozyhibby]

Russia have lost over 600k casualties.

If they start something with NATO I give Russia two weeks until they’re kicked out of Ukraine. Crimea included.

Yip. They are barely a fighting force now. Poland alone would make short work of Russia. Their only defence now is the Nuclear weapons.


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[Stairway 2 7]

In what way is it embarrassing for George Galloway, Tommy Sheridan and Alex Salmond?
Is it not the case that there might be something deeply sinister about their political motivation?

It's embarrassing to be caught taking money openly from the Russian government at least the tories hid it. Sheridan tweeted for a week denying the Bucha massacre until it was beyond doubt. Galloway defended Assads and Russias slaughter of the Syrians, he has a Palestine ticket now but was silent when Assad was gassing the Syrians. They have amplified just about every Putin line this invasion.

They might be deeply sinister but I think for Galloway it's money and spotlight, it's all coming out though

[cabbageandribs1875]

wonder who the ally is that has pulled out from donating a full patriot air defence system along with the Dutch :dunno: Patriot air defence aid for Ukraine falls through as ally withdraws (msn.com) (https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/patriot-air-defence-aid-for-ukraine-falls-through-as-ally-withdraws/ar-AA1qzZg0?ocid=msedgntp&pc=U531&cvid=d0f75529d4464927be7a36cd01313229&ei=16)

[Ozyhibby]

https://x.com/prune602/status/1836402102739841238?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Russian banks suspending lending.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://x.com/olganyc1211/status/1836640984861393012?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A
Gangsters jockeying for position.


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[Lendo]

Ukraine should be looking in to where the Russian Army buys its Walkie-Talkies

[judas]

Question. If there is a major incident at a Ukrainian Nuclear plant with Western intelligence identifying Russian involvement, what would the West do?

Such an event would divert Ukrainian resources and bring advantages to Russia on the battlefield.

The use of Nuclear weapons is deemed unacceptable by the west, India and China. What about a nuclear plant attack / sabotage where the effects are akin to an actual nuclear weapon?

[Ozyhibby]

Question. If there is a major incident at a Ukrainian Nuclear plant with Western intelligence identifying Russian involvement, what would the West do?

Such an event would divert Ukrainian resources and bring advantages to Russia on the battlefield.

The use of Nuclear weapons is deemed unacceptable by the west, India and China. What about a nuclear plant attack / sabotage where the effects are akin to an actual nuclear weapon?

It would be a disaster for Russia. The Chinese would turn on them and I suspect their troops in Ukraine would be routed in short order by western militaries. A nuclear disaster affects everyone. The world would unite against them.


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[Ozyhibby]

Ukraine striking pretty deep in Russia now with their drones. Massive ammo dumps hit over the last week.


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[judas]

Ukraine striking pretty deep in Russia now with their drones. Massive ammo dumps hit over the last week.


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I saw that. Biggest explosion I’ve seen since the dockside one in Beirut.

That l’s got to hurt Russia. At night from the distant camera shots it looked like a city on fire.

[Ozyhibby]

I saw that. Biggest explosion I’ve seen since the dockside one in Beirut.

That l’s got to hurt Russia. At night from the distant camera shots it looked like a city on fire.

Analysts seem to think the value of the missiles destroyed is close to $1bn.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://x.com/anders_aslund/status/1837752857748975794?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

When you are that short of infantry that you are willing to sacrifice highly skilled sailors then surely they are not far from a total collapse?


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[Bristolhibby]

https://x.com/anders_aslund/status/1837752857748975794?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

When you are that short of infantry that you are willing to sacrifice highly skilled sailors then surely they are not far from a total collapse?

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Seem to remember the Nazis doing this towards the end of WW2.

That said, the U.K. had a Naval Division serving in the trenches of WW1. A little known fact. However I think these guys were volunteers.

J

[Jones28]

Seem to remember the Nazis doing this towards the end of WW2.

That said, the U.K. had a Naval Division serving in the trenches of WW1. A little known fact. However I think these guys were volunteers.

J


This is all getting very end stage desperation now. So many similarities to the Germans in the 2nd world war.

[Ozyhibby]

https://x.com/noelreports/status/1838996213099528523?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Getting more and more desperate.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://x.com/prune602/status/1840968364920828355?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Russian economy is getting closer to collapse.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/9/30/russia-to-hike-defence-spending-by-a-quarter-in-2025


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[Stairway 2 7]

https://x.com/prune602/status/1840968364920828355?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Russian economy is getting closer to collapse.


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And we think our mortgage rises were crippling with a quarter of that inflation. Must be brutal times for the population

[Ozyhibby]

And we think our mortgage rises were crippling with a quarter of that inflation. Must be brutal times for the population

They also have a massive housing bubble about to burst. They might be looking at a banking collapse.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://www.newsweek.com/putin-ally-dead-moscow-gunshot-1962476

Putin ally dead.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2024/10/ukraine-war-negotiated-peace/680100/?utm_source=native-share&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=share
Great article on Ukrainian drone warfare.


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[Ozyhibby]

Tonight’s Channel 4 news report from the front lines in Ukraine is amazing reporting. Try catch on catch up if you can.


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[cabbageandribs1875]

The Netherlands have sent it's first batch of F-16's to Ukraine, they will send a total of 24

[Jim44]

BBC reporting that Putin and Iran are planning organised chaos in the streets of the UK.Based on info from MI5

[DaveF]

BBC reporting that Putin and Iran are planning organised chaos in the streets of the UK.Based on info from MI5

I think we are perfectly capable of creating our own mayhem with any outside help.

[Jones28]

BBC reporting that Putin and Iran are planning organised chaos in the streets of the UK.Based on info from MI5

Like what? Far right protests or something?

It’s laughable that Russia still see themselves as one of the big boys at the table.

I wonder how Putin feels about his special military operation 2 and a half years on?

[Jim44]

Like what? Far right protests or something?

It’s laughable that Russia still see themselves as one of the big boys at the table.

I wonder how Putin feels about his special military operation 2 and a half years on?

Link : https://search.app/oH7u7TH5288LT3Ve6

[tamig]

BBC reporting that Putin and Iran are planning organised chaos in the streets of the UK.Based on info from MI5

Its nothing new. They’ve been trying for years. But different methods being used now.

[Ozyhibby]

https://x.com/sumlenny/status/1844326672373346306?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Gangsters getting ready for the civil war.


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[DaveF]

https://x.com/sumlenny/status/1844326672373346306?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Gangsters getting ready for the civil war.


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Stern looks and beards a necessity.

[JimBHibees]

BBC reporting that Putin and Iran are planning organised chaos in the streets of the UK.Based on info from MI5

Did that not already happen during the summer.

[Ozyhibby]

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/uk-strikes-at-the-heart-of-russian-energy-revenues-funding-putins-war

This is good news and ridiculous it hasn’t happened before now. We need to make sure we enforce now as well. We are good at making laws in this country, poor at enforcement.


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[Lendo]

https://x.com/sumlenny/status/1844326672373346306?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Gangsters getting ready for the civil war.


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Fingers crossed. It’s the only real way the madness in Ukraine will stop.

[Paul1642]

Reports on X that North Korean troops are training in Russia, potentially with a view to enter the war. Wonder what Kim Jong Un would expect to gain from this?

Edit: also on the BBC https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3vkqwe9wwdo

[Ozyhibby]

Reports on X that North Korean troops are training in Russia, potentially with a view to enter the war. Wonder what Kim Jong Un would expect to gain from this?

Edit: also on the BBC https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3vkqwe9wwdo

https://x.com/stratcomcentre/status/1847317531477844036?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

North Korean troops invading Europe is not something that should be treated lightly.


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[Paul1642]

https://x.com/stratcomcentre/status/1847317531477844036?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

North Korean troops invading Europe is not something that should be treated lightly.


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Will probably be the push the US needed to allow Ukraine to use foreign weapons behind Russian borders.

Can you imagine in February 2022 if someone suggested that 2.5 years later Russia would be enlisting the help of NK troops to help break the stalemate.

[Lendo]

https://x.com/stratcomcentre/status/1847317531477844036?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

North Korean troops invading Europe is not something that should be treated lightly.


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This is ****ing nuts. Will this force Ukraine in to declaring war on North Korea? If Trump is elected in a few weeks time I genuinely don’t think any of us will be surviving the new four years.

[Ozyhibby]

https://x.com/nexta_tv/status/1847983298837905753?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A


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[AgentDaleCooper]

https://x.com/nexta_tv/status/1847983298837905753?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A


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it's like China without a plan. (not endorsing China's 'plan')

[Lendo]

28210

First time I have seen Typhoons with their transponders turned on over the Black Sea while protecting the Rivet Joint aircraft.

[Jim44]

News footage of Putin meeting world leaders at the BRICS conference, shaking hands and hugging each other, makes uneasy, repulsive viewing. Indication of the hold that the criminal dictator has over naive, indiscriminate, self centred barstewards. The 46 individuals, by their actions, are declaring alegiance to the war monger and should be considered enemies of the rest of the free world.

[Hibrandenburg]

News footage of Putin meeting world leaders at the BRICS conference, shaking hands and hugging each other, makes uneasy, repulsive viewing. Indication of the hold that the criminal dictator has over naive, indiscriminate, self centred barstewards. The 46 individuals, by their actions, are declaring alegiance to the war monger and should be considered enemies of the rest of the free world.

The world is starting to polarise again, we've been here before regularly over the centuries, I'm just surprised that it's taken a few generations longer than it usually does.

[WeAreHibs]

South Korea threatens to send arms, personnel to Ukraine

https://www.voanews.com/amp/south-korea-threatens-to-send-arms-personnel-to-ukraine/7832347.html

[cabbageandribs1875]

Ukraine saying the first of the North Korean soldiers will arrive tomorrow near the frontlines in the Kursk Region

[Jones28]

South Korea threatens to send arms, personnel to Ukraine

https://www.voanews.com/amp/south-korea-threatens-to-send-arms-personnel-to-ukraine/7832347.html

Interesting. If it ended the war I'd be all for South Korea jumping in.

[RyeSloan]

Ukraine saying the first of the North Korean soldiers will arrive tomorrow near the frontlines in the Kursk Region

Just more meat for the grinder sadly.

Can’t imagine they will be excited about the prospect of fighting a war that has nothing to do with them.

[Lendo]

Just more meat for the grinder sadly.

Can’t imagine they will be excited about the prospect of fighting a war that has nothing to do with them.

You would imagine the North Korean troops have no idea where they are being sent or for what reason.

[Northernhibee]

You would imagine the North Korean troops have no idea where they are being sent or for what reason.

I wonder if you’ll see defectors within them as soon as they get the chance to escape from North Korea.

[Bristolhibby]

I wonder if you’ll see defectors within them as soon as they get the chance to escape from North Korea.

Good point. First thing I’d do is buy a mobile phone and many sims.

Get in Google maps and figure out where the foop you are. Then take it from there.

Will be a massive coup getting a North Korean defector.

That said, they may be in the rear echelon roles (traffic, logistics, guarding installations and bases, protecting arms dumps, freeing up Russians to enter the meat grinder.

J

[Ozyhibby]

Good point. First thing I’d do is buy a mobile phone and many sims.

Get in Google maps and figure out where the foop you are. Then take it from there.

Will be a massive coup getting a North Korean defector.

That said, they may be in the rear echelon roles (traffic, logistics, guarding installations and bases, protecting arms dumps, freeing up Russians to enter the meat grinder.

J

Suspect they will be in Kursk so that they can say they are not attacking Ukraine.


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[Hibs4185]

I wonder if you’ll see defectors within them as soon as they get the chance to escape from North Korea.

I thought this also but these guys will probably have family at home who would then be in danger if they defected.

Can’t imagine being the wife or child of a defector in North Korea has a long life span

[Bristolhibby]

I thought this also but these guys will probably have family at home who would then be in danger if they defected.

Can’t imagine being the wife or child of a defector in North Korea has a long life span

There must be a lot of youngsters though. People seem to up age most fighting soldiers. Many of them will be 17 - 21 with little or no ties back home.

J

[Ozyhibby]

There must be a lot of youngsters though. People seem to up age most fighting soldiers. Many of them will be 17 - 21 with little or no ties back home.

J

No idea about the North Koreans but the average age of Russian and Ukrainian soldiers in this war must be the highest in history.
Think it’s about 44 years old.


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[ddoc]

No idea about the North Koreans but the average age of Russian and Ukrainian soldiers in this war must be the highest in history.
Think it’s about 44 years old.


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Probably because the younger ones are all dead.

[Ozyhibby]

Probably because the younger ones are all dead.

It’s because both countries are afraid to conscript younger people.


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[ddoc]

It’s because both countries are afraid to conscript younger people.


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I was being a bit tongue in cheek, but don't think it is an appropriate thread for a smiley face.
I have absolutely no idea of the demographics of the dead and seriously injured on both sides, but there is sure to be a lot in their 20's and 30's.

[Smartie]

I thought this also but these guys will probably have family at home who would then be in danger if they defected.

Can’t imagine being the wife or child of a defector in North Korea has a long life span

Might they have hand picked ones to go who have family back home, therefore making defection less desirable?

Pretty sure I heard that Russian spies overseas were selected on this basis - ones who knew the KGB had very close eyes on their families back in Russia so as to reduce any temptations.

[Bristolhibby]

Might they have hand picked ones to go who have family back home, therefore making defection less desirable?

Pretty sure I heard that Russian spies overseas were selected on this basis - ones who knew the KGB had very close eyes on their families back in Russia so as to reduce any temptations.

Makes sense. In an awful way.

J

[cabbageandribs1875]

Russian Missile hits a residential building in Dnipro killing three

[Ozyhibby]

https://x.com/threshedthought/status/1851216035627585856?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A

Good thread on our failure to deal with Russia.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://x.com/tendar/status/1854185661240086860?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A


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[K-Zazu]

What happens now that Trump is back as president? Be good if there was no more War.

[Jones28]

What happens now that Trump is back as president? Be good if there was no more War.

It’s up to no one other than Ukraine. If they want to give up territory to Russia to end to the war, fine, if they want to fight on and reclaim what has been stolen from them we should back them to the hilt.

No one wants war but it should be on their say-so.

We must give them everything they need, and take off limitations on what can be used and where. North Korean troops might be clueless but there’s about a million of them that Putin would happily throw in to his project war.

[Ozyhibby]

What happens now that Trump is back as president? Be good if there was no more War.

That’s what everyone is trying to figure out. If I had to bet I’d say Ukraine is going to be giving up some territory in exchange for EU membership and European troops stationed in what’s left of Ukraine.
And everyone should listen to me because I know stuff.[emoji6][emoji23]


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[Ozyhibby]

It’s up to no one other than Ukraine. If they want to give up territory to Russia to end to the war, fine, if they want to fight on and reclaim what has been stolen from them we should back them to the hilt.

No one wants war but it should be on their say-so.

We must give them everything they need, and take off limitations on what can be used and where. North Korean troops might be clueless but there’s about a million of them that Putin would happily throw in to his project war.

I don’t see how Ukraine can fight on without US support. Europe have been useless when it comes to defence for a long time now. And even worse when it comes to sanctions enforcement. European countries just won’t pay up.


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[Stairway 2 7]

It’s up to no one other than Ukraine. If they want to give up territory to Russia to end to the war, fine, if they want to fight on and reclaim what has been stolen from them we should back them to the hilt.

No one wants war but it should be on their say-so.

We must give them everything they need, and take off limitations on what can be used and where. North Korean troops might be clueless but there’s about a million of them that Putin would happily throw in to his project war.

Spot on. Europe should have spent 2 years having a joined up increased military, alas. Ukraine has been fighting for 10 years and won't stop with or without the US. Ukraine supposedly pleasantly surprised about how good talks with Trumps team have been this month. Trump did send Javelins to Ukraine when they had no anti tanks they also sanctioned Russia and wanted Nord stream 2 stopped as it would help Putin. Probably just a bunch of self serving grifters like all right wing politicians

[Paul1642]

It’s not the ideal option but i feel like peace with current territory is what’s going to happen now Trump is in power and it probably for the best, even though I certainly wouldn’t feel that was if I was a Ukrainian. Unfortunately Ukraine just isn’t regaining territory in any meaningful way anymore and without direct military intervention from allies thats likely not to change now.

The money being committed to the war from UK, US and others is simply harder and harder to justify when everything is ****ed at home. If an endgame was in sight it would be easier.

My personal opinion is that I would love to see Ukrainian regain all its territory including the Crimea and Putin overthrown but I just don’t see either now.

[Stairway 2 7]

Papers saying Trump want US and UK troops to create a buffer zone, would mean Ukraine conceding land, nor sure they would, they have been fighting on their own for 10 years

Mike Rodgers is also getting secretary of defence apparently

"Since the beginning, the President has been overly worried that giving Ukraine what it needs to win would be too escalatory…This conflict must end. And the President must be willing to do what it takes to end it.I fear Putin will use victory in Ukraine as a springboard to invade Eastern Europe. We can’t let that happen ”

- Mike Rogers

[Ozyhibby]

Papers saying Trump want US and UK troops to create a buffer zone, would mean Ukraine conceding land, nor sure they would, they have been fighting on their own for 10 years

Mike Rodgers is also getting secretary of defence apparently

"Since the beginning, the President has been overly worried that giving Ukraine what it needs to win would be too escalatory…This conflict must end. And the President must be willing to do what it takes to end it.I fear Putin will use victory in Ukraine as a springboard to invade Eastern Europe. We can’t let that happen ”

- Mike Rogers

I would be very surprised if Trump committed any US troops. I think any deal will involve European troops.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://x.com/teoyaomiquu/status/1856201376780693842?s=46&t=3pb_w_qndxJXScFNwz8V4A
Trumps new national security advisor.


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[tamig]

Papers saying Trump want US and UK troops to create a buffer zone, would mean Ukraine conceding land, nor sure they would, they have been fighting on their own for 10 years

Mike Rodgers is also getting secretary of defence apparently

"Since the beginning, the President has been overly worried that giving Ukraine what it needs to win would be too escalatory…This conflict must end. And the President must be willing to do what it takes to end it.I fear Putin will use victory in Ukraine as a springboard to invade Eastern Europe. We can’t let that happen ”

- Mike Rogers

What does “victory in Ukraine” mean exactly for Putin though?

[Bishop Hibee]

What does “victory in Ukraine” mean exactly for Putin though?

If he gets a lease on Crimea and control of a buffer zone he’d be persuaded to call that a victory. Particularly if sanctions are lifted.

[Ozyhibby]

If he gets a lease on Crimea and control of a buffer zone he’d be persuaded to call that a victory. Particularly if sanctions are lifted.

I actually don’t think that is enough for him. I think he still wants all of Ukraine. He will take a break in fighting to re-arm though.


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[tamig]

If he gets a lease on Crimea and control of a buffer zone he’d be persuaded to call that a victory. Particularly if sanctions are lifted.

If that was the sum of it, I couldn’t see how that could possibly act as a springboard to invade other Eastern European states - as S27 quoted above.

[Hibrandenburg]

Papers saying Trump want US and UK troops to create a buffer zone, would mean Ukraine conceding land, nor sure they would, they have been fighting on their own for 10 years

Mike Rodgers is also getting secretary of defence apparently

"Since the beginning, the President has been overly worried that giving Ukraine what it needs to win would be too escalatory…This conflict must end. And the President must be willing to do what it takes to end it.I fear Putin will use victory in Ukraine as a springboard to invade Eastern Europe. We can’t let that happen ”

- Mike Rogers

US and UK troops directly on Russia's border, there's no way he could see that as anything other than a humiliating defeat bearing in mind one of his excuses for starting the war was the encroachment of NATO troops towards Russia.

[StevieC]

What does “victory in Ukraine” mean exactly for Putin though?

IMO getting the land link between Russia and Crimea is a victory. That was always his aim back in 2022 (and 2014 to an extent) and taking control of Kyiv would have been a bonus. Being allowed to keep the land link, and ultimately getting sanctions lifted as part of a peace deal, is 100% a victory for Putin. It also allows him to restock his military over the next few years before he pushes from Kherson to Odessa and then Moldova.

Removing the land link in any proposed peace deal would be viewed as defeat and unacceptable to Russia.

[Ozyhibby]

IMO getting the land link between Russia and Crimea is a victory. That was always his aim back in 2022 (and 2014 to an extent) and taking control of Kyiv would have been a bonus. Being allowed to keep the land link, and ultimately getting sanctions lifted as part of a peace deal, is 100% a victory for Putin. It also allows him to restock his military over the next few years before he pushes from Kherson to Odessa and then Moldova.

Removing the land link in any proposed peace deal would be viewed as defeat and unacceptable to Russia.

Depends on if Ukraine is re-arming at the same time and European troops are stationed there.
There are a million different ways this could wash out. I still think that Russia can be defeated but it will need European powers to get serious about their own defence. And there needs to be more sanctions and much better enforcement. On that issue the Americans are miles ahead. Europe is turning a lot of blind eyes.


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[Smartie]

Apologies if this has been mentioned here before... I've been off the HG for a while before recently re-emerging as a private member.

For the past good few months I've been following this thread here - https://fmttmboro.com/index.php?threads/the-end.36813/page-354

The guy "borolad259" appears to be an admin on the forum. I'm not entirely sure of the back story but I think he may be ex-military and has business links to a guy who is a Swedish general.

Anyway, every so often borolad259 will post some "musings" that are sent to him from his Swedish general friend. They'll sometimes be military info about what is going on in the war, they'll sometimes be stuff that is of geo-political interest.

I'm aware that all of this may be the creation of an online fantasist who keeps an eye on twitter...

But some very interesting stuff definitely emerges through this channel, often a long time before it reaches the mainstream media. A lot of it it interesting and comes true, some of it ends up being wide of the mark (a reported attempt on Xi's life a few months being one such example of something that was false).

There haven't been as many updates lately as the "Swedish general friend" appears to have been tanking about trying to drum up support for an EU army as he appears to have found himself an important job - and the Trump situation has led to increased urgency around Europe.

The latest update makes for interesting reading though, and you normally get stuff like this with reasonable regularity.

Just thought it would be interesting to share, as I've certainly found this interesting to follow over the past year or so. Please consume with caution as I'm aware how accurate a source " 'Boro fans' forum" should be considered to be, but it will be interesting to follow over the next few weeks, months and years as the various scenarios play out and see how accurate any of it turns out to be.

[Ozyhibby]

Apologies if this has been mentioned here before... I've been off the HG for a while before recently re-emerging as a private member.

For the past good few months I've been following this thread here - https://fmttmboro.com/index.php?threads/the-end.36813/page-354

The guy "borolad259" appears to be an admin on the forum. I'm not entirely sure of the back story but I think he may be ex-military and has business links to a guy who is a Swedish general.

Anyway, every so often borolad259 will post some "musings" that are sent to him from his Swedish general friend. They'll sometimes be military info about what is going on in the war, they'll sometimes be stuff that is of geo-political interest.

I'm aware that all of this may be the creation of an online fantasist who keeps an eye on twitter...

But some very interesting stuff definitely emerges through this channel, often a long time before it reaches the mainstream media. A lot of it it interesting and comes true, some of it ends up being wide of the mark (a reported attempt on Xi's life a few months being one such example of something that was false).

There haven't been as many updates lately as the "Swedish general friend" appears to have been tanking about trying to drum up support for an EU army as he appears to have found himself an important job - and the Trump situation has led to increased urgency around Europe.

The latest update makes for interesting reading though, and you normally get stuff like this with reasonable regularity.

Just thought it would be interesting to share, as I've certainly found this interesting to follow over the past year or so. Please consume with caution as I'm aware how accurate a source " 'Boro fans' forum" should be considered to be, but it will be interesting to follow over the next few weeks, months and years as the various scenarios play out and see how accurate any of it turns out to be.

Thanks for that. Who knows if true but always nice to read other opinions.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20241113/7aed3e07ca094a50100856d421cd60ce.png
The war must be getting expensive.


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[Hibrandenburg]

Russia to introduce a Ministry for Sex because of declining birth rates and higher mortality rates.


https://www.newsweek.com/russia-casualties-death-rate-birth-rate-ukraine-1984557

[Ozyhibby]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/nov/16/a-night-with-urkaine-drone-squad-targeting-russian-forces-donetsk?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

Interesting article on Ukrainian drone operators.


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[jacomo]

Depends on if Ukraine is re-arming at the same time and European troops are stationed there.
There are a million different ways this could wash out. I still think that Russia can be defeated but it will need European powers to get serious about their own defence. And there needs to be more sanctions and much better enforcement. On that issue the Americans are miles ahead. Europe is turning a lot of blind eyes.


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I think Russia has already lost this war. The problem is that Ukraine hasn’t won yet.

Putin’s war aim - to have a complicit Ukrainian state, doing his bidding just like Belarus - has been shown to be a dangerous delusion. At best, Trump will help him secure Crimea plus four war-torn Ukrainian provinces, with a hostile force across the border and the constant threat of sabotage and destruction. Rebuilding Mariupol alone will bankrupt Russia.

Enlisting the help of North Korea to fight his battles is a desperate move. There is a reason Putin hadn’t visited North Korea in over 20 years, despite it being a neighbour: North Korea is broke and unpredictable, and Russia preferred to pretend it didn’t really exist.

Only a fool would predict the date of Putin’s fall, but his old pal Pregozhin showed just how brittle Russia really is.

[BS44]

Biden allows Ukraine to attack Russia with US long range missles

[jamie_1875]

Biden allows Ukraine to attack Russia with US long range missles

I don't have the answers but this feels dangerous. This is pretty much a US v Russia war by proxy now or perhaps it's been like that for a while but this feels like a further escalation.

[Stairway 2 7]

Biden allows Ukraine to attack Russia with US long range missles

About 2 years too late but still great news. La Figaro saying UK and France have just agreed to do the same. Scholz has refused again, see his appeasement phone call on Friday worked as Russia sent its most missles in months last night. Thankfully most were shot down, f16 were meant to have done a great job, they were also 2 years late

[Stairway 2 7]

I don't have the answers but this feels dangerous. This is pretty much a US v Russia war by proxy now or perhaps it's been like that for a while but this feels like a further escalation.

A war by proxy doesn't look like giving a country your outdated 1970s equipment so it can defend itself. There will be strict limits to what can be hit like missle launch sites. I think it's offensive to Ukrainians to say it's US or NATO v Russia. If it was they would get hundreds of f35 fighter jets and this would be ended. US gave Israel f35s and they just waltzed into Iran and took out all the Russian supplied air defenses with ease.

Their has been about 30 Putin red lines I'd confidently put my house on this being no different to the rest

[jamie_1875]

A war by proxy doesn't look like giving a country your outdated 1970s equipment so it can defend itself. There will be strict limits to what can be hit like missle launch sites. I think it's offensive to Ukrainians to say it's US or NATO v Russia. If it was they would get hundreds of f35 fighter jets and this would be ended. US gave Israel f35s and they just waltzed into Iran and took out all the Russian supplied air defenses with ease.

Their has been about 30 Putin red lines I'd confidently put my house on this being no different to the rest

A fair point about it being offensive to Ukraine saying it's a Russia v US war, badly made point by me. I just don't see how this ends and it feels it's escalation after escalation. Hey maybe Donald Trump will sort it out.....

[Stairway 2 7]

A fair point about it being offensive to Ukraine saying it's a Russia v US war, badly made point by me. I just don't see how this ends and it feels it's escalation after escalation. Hey maybe Donald Trump will sort it out.....

God knows and who knows what Putin will do as he's not rational. Trump will want Ukraine carved up and I'm pessimistic that that's what will happen.

[jamie_1875]

God knows and who knows what Putin will do as he's not rational. Trump will want Ukraine carved up and I'm pessimistic that that's what will happen.

I probably never helped myself reading this over the summer

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Nuclear-War-Scenario-compulsive-non-fiction/dp/1911709593?dplnkId=1611ff6e-fff8-4e63-9dba-da1cc8f87829

[Ozyhibby]

I probably never helped myself reading this over the summer

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Nuclear-War-Scenario-compulsive-non-fiction/dp/1911709593?dplnkId=1611ff6e-fff8-4e63-9dba-da1cc8f87829

Obviously terrifying but that’s is never an excuse for surrendering to the Russians. We have been too fearful for too long with this guy. If he gets Ukraine then he won’t stop, just as Hitler had no plan to stop with Sudetenland. Appeasement is as wrong now as it was then.


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[K-Zazu]

Trump will stop all the wars once he gets into the White House.

[Smartie]

I don't have the answers but this feels dangerous. This is pretty much a US v Russia war by proxy now or perhaps it's been like that for a while but this feels like a further escalation.

I understand (and in some way share) your concerns, but the Russians have been committing atrocity after atrocity.

When you’re merrily firing missiles into schools and hospitals, murdering innocent children, I don’t think you can have too many complaints when aspects of the international community seek to turn that back on you.

I’m a former pacifist who has changed my ways in the face of what the Russians have been up to. As has been mentioned above - this is a couple of years too late.

The consequences of inaction are greater than those of action.

I won’t pretend I didn’t wince when I heard though. Interesting times.

[Col2]

Obviously terrifying but that’s is never an excuse for surrendering to the Russians. We have been too fearful for too long with this guy. If he gets Ukraine then he won’t stop, just as Hitler had no plan to stop with Sudetenland. Appeasement is as wrong now as it was then.


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But you don’t really know if that is true. The comparison to Hilter keeps getting referenced but there is no indication that will be the case. This was meant to be a military special operation lasting weeks and have been very painful for Putin lasting years.

What can’t accept is and outgoing president (not fit for office) is pressing the major escalation button weeks before handing over power. AND Starmer won’t even have the guts or duty to go to parliament to get approval before going ahead thus acting like the lapdog this country is.

[K-Zazu]

Obviously terrifying but that’s is never an excuse for surrendering to the Russians. We have been too fearful for too long with this guy. If he gets Ukraine then he won’t stop, just as Hitler had no plan to stop with Sudetenland. Appeasement is as wrong now as it was then.


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What country’s will he invade after Ukraine? And why would he do it?

[lapsedhibee]

What country’s will he invade after Ukraine? And why would he do it?

Estonia and Latvia, because he thinks they're part of the USSR.

[Ozyhibby]

But you don’t really know if that is true. The comparison to Hilter keeps getting referenced but there is no indication that will be the case. This was meant to be a military special operation lasting weeks and have been very painful for Putin lasting years.

What can’t accept is and outgoing president (not fit for office) is pressing the major escalation button weeks before handing over power. AND Starmer won’t even have the guts or duty to go to parliament to get approval before going ahead thus acting like the lapdog this country is.

It’s not an escalation of the other side are already using long range weapons.


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[Ozyhibby]

What country’s will he invade after Ukraine? And why would he do it?

I’m sure that was said after Georgia.


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[StevieC]

What country’s will he invade after Ukraine? And why would he do it?

Georgia, Azerbaijan, Moldova, Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia.

Reasons? Expanding the Russian Federation, but with the same excuse of persecution of Russian citizens. Transnistra, Kaliningrad, South Ossetia, Crimea, to name but a few reasons.

[StevieC]

I think Russia has already lost this war

Their primary aim was a land link to Crimea. If there is an end to the war and they are allowed to retain this then Putin has succeeded, and I guess “won” the war.

Taking control of Ukraine by taking control of Kyiv was always a secondary aim. Supply lines from Belarus to Kyiv were always stretched, and my updates from friends at the start of the escalation showed that this was always going to be a struggle. We also saw the abandonment of this, and redeployment of troops to the south, when Ukrainian troops started to regain ground and recaptured Kharkiv and Kherson.

[Hibrandenburg]

Obviously terrifying but that’s is never an excuse for surrendering to the Russians. We have been too fearful for too long with this guy. If he gets Ukraine then he won’t stop, just as Hitler had no plan to stop with Sudetenland. Appeasement is as wrong now as it was then.


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Surely that's not you judging Putin present from history? :greengrin

[Stairway 2 7]

But you don’t really know if that is true. The comparison to Hilter keeps getting referenced but there is no indication that will be the case. This was meant to be a military special operation lasting weeks and have been very painful for Putin lasting years.

What can’t accept is and outgoing president (not fit for office) is pressing the major escalation button weeks before handing over power. AND Starmer won’t even have the guts or duty to go to parliament to get approval before going ahead thus acting like the lapdog this country is.

UK agreed for the use of storm shadow before the US, they also sent tanks before the US and mlrs's. Is that not the opposite of a lap dog.

It's Putin propaganda to say this is escalation. Russia has been firing Iranian and N Korean missles into Ukraine without a care. It's now using NK troops inside Ukraine. If that was NATO troops fighting for Ukraine tankies heads would explode. Ukraine has destroyed more red lines than Maradona destroyed white ones

[Ozyhibby]

Surely that's not you judging Putin present from history? :greengrin

Judging Putin in the present and learning the lesson from history of appeasement.[emoji6]


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[Hibs4185]

I don't have the answers but this feels dangerous. This is pretty much a US v Russia war by proxy now or perhaps it's been like that for a while but this feels like a further escalation.

The poor Ukrainians after seeing hundreds of missiles this week, north Korean troops and many other atrocities, must be *hitting themselves thinking “oh no not another escalation”.

[Ozyhibby]

The poor Ukrainians after seeing hundreds of missiles this week, north Korean troops and many other atrocities, must be *hitting themselves thinking “oh no not another escalation”.

We had all this nonsense when it was tanks, then HIMARS, F16’s etc.
The laws of war allow Ukraine to strike back using weapons wherever they can find them. We should never have limited supply in the first place.


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[AgentDaleCooper]

Obviously terrifying but that’s is never an excuse for surrendering to the Russians. We have been too fearful for too long with this guy. If he gets Ukraine then he won’t stop, just as Hitler had no plan to stop with Sudetenland. Appeasement is as wrong now as it was then.


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I still think we did a huge amount to create Putin (not least interfering with Russian elections during the 90s to prevent them democratically returning to communism)...but I am increasingly inclined to agree that he needs to be stopped. The best case scenario for 'peace' with Putin still in power is because the rest of Europe has turned fascist and he doesn't even need to invade, he can just take.

[DaveF]

See that a russian ballet dancer (who was anti war) fell out of a window.

[Ozyhibby]

See that a russian ballet dancer (who was anti war) fell out of a window.

A clear sign of weakness of Putin that he is afraid of a ballet dancer.


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[Ozyhibby]

Russia turning on the printing presses to bail out their banks.
With inflation at 13.4% and interest rates at 21% the Russian business environment must be challenging.

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/11/18/economy/russia-inflation-new-heights-intl-analysis

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[Ozyhibby]

https://bylinetimes.com/2024/11/19/europe-must-forget-trump-and-form-a-coalition-of-the-willing-to-defend-ukraine/

I agree with this 100%.


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[Smartie]

https://bylinetimes.com/2024/11/19/europe-must-forget-trump-and-form-a-coalition-of-the-willing-to-defend-ukraine/

I agree with this 100%.


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Me too.

FWIW - I believe it is very much happening.

[Ozyhibby]

Me too.

FWIW - I believe it is very much happening.

It’s going to have to. Russians now cutting undersea cables of European countries. We have to defend ourselves.


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[Jim44]

Putin lowers the threshold for using his nuclear arsenal after Biden’s arms decision for Ukraine.

This latest news should be giving all concerned food for thought as to the direction this conflict is leading to. I’ve always feared that the use of nuclear weapons is inevitable. I’ve always been ‘assured’ that this could/would never happen for a variety of reasons: Putin isn’t crazy or suicidal personally or for his nation or he doesn’t have supreme power to make the final decision as his ‘cabinet’ and advisors could/would step in and prevent it. I’m not so sure. Putin can’t and won’t give any ground and I suspect that Trump will intervene and find a resolution favouring Putin at the expense of Ukraine.

[Ozyhibby]

Putin lowers the threshold for using his nuclear arsenal after Biden’s arms decision for Ukraine.

This latest news should be giving all concerned food for thought as to the direction this conflict is leading to. I’ve always feared that the use of nuclear weapons is inevitable. I’ve always been ‘assured’ that this could/would never happen for a variety of reasons: Putin isn’t crazy or suicidal personally or for his nation or he doesn’t have supreme power to make the final decision as his ‘cabinet’ and advisors could/would step in and prevent it. I’m not so sure. Putin can’t and won’t give any ground and I suspect that Trump will intervene and find a resolution favouring Putin at the expense of Ukraine.

That is not in Trump’s gift. He can withdraw aid but others may decide to continue the fight. Poland has no intention of letting Ukraine fall.
We can’t just give Russia what it wants out of fear. If we do that then it won’t be long before Putin controls all of Europe and the UK.


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[Smartie]

Putin lowers the threshold for using his nuclear arsenal after Biden’s arms decision for Ukraine.

This latest news should be giving all concerned food for thought as to the direction this conflict is leading to. I’ve always feared that the use of nuclear weapons is inevitable. I’ve always been ‘assured’ that this could/would never happen for a variety of reasons: Putin isn’t crazy or suicidal personally or for his nation or he doesn’t have supreme power to make the final decision as his ‘cabinet’ and advisors could/would step in and prevent it. I’m not so sure. Putin can’t and won’t give any ground and I suspect that Trump will intervene and find a resolution favouring Putin at the expense of Ukraine.

Putin is toast if he reaches for a nuclear weapon. It doesn’t matter what doctrines say or what thresholds exist (at least for now - it might all change when Trump gets in).

His Ukraine war is war of conquest. If the world stands by when a nuclear power bullies their non-nuclear neighbours because they’re cowed by threats of nuclear weapons then the human race and civilisation are in big trouble.

His bluff needs called and countries who invade others shouldn’t get to choose where all the red lines are.

Today’s doctrine amendment changes nothing.

[Stairway 2 7]

Putin lowers the threshold for using his nuclear arsenal after Biden’s arms decision for Ukraine.

This latest news should be giving all concerned food for thought as to the direction this conflict is leading to. I’ve always feared that the use of nuclear weapons is inevitable. I’ve always been ‘assured’ that this could/would never happen for a variety of reasons: Putin isn’t crazy or suicidal personally or for his nation or he doesn’t have supreme power to make the final decision as his ‘cabinet’ and advisors could/would step in and prevent it. I’m not so sure. Putin can’t and won’t give any ground and I suspect that Trump will intervene and find a resolution favouring Putin at the expense of Ukraine.

I'm old enough to remember when Putin said sending fighter jets was a nuclear red line, also NATO weapons hitting Russia, Ukraine taking Russian land, NATO sending tanks. He's the drunk old guy sitting in the boozer saying he would leather the young team if he wanted.

When there is real end of world problems like climate change I'm not sure why the papers give his ramblings space, well it seeks so I do know but it's also what he wants

[Ozyhibby]

I'm old enough to remember when Putin said sending fighter jets was a nuclear red line, also NATO weapons hitting Russia, Ukraine taking Russian land, NATO sending tanks. He's the drunk old guy sitting in the boozer saying he would leather the young team if he wanted.

When there is real end of world problems like climate change I'm not sure why the papers give his ramblings space, well it seeks so I do know but it's also what he wants

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20241119/8276def2eb743d84238602df40bd338f.png


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[Ozyhibby]

It’s going to have to. Russians now cutting undersea cables of European countries. We have to defend ourselves.


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Chinese ship now been detained by Danes over cable cutting incident. Things getting interesting.


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[JimBHibees]

See that a russian ballet dancer (who was anti war) fell out of a window.

Seems to happen quite a lot to Russians must be very unlucky

[Smartie]

Chinese ship now been detained by Danes over cable cutting incident. Things getting interesting.


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Very interesting.

And a bit unexpected?

[cabbageandribs1875]

thank goodness Starmer wants to be XI Jinpings buddy

cables around GB should be safe










for now

[Bristolhibby]

From the Telegraph today.

Apart from the farmer push at the end and the “lefty lawyer” jibe I agree.

Now is the time for Ukraine to get as much leverage as it can. Trump will sue for peace so Ukraine need to be on the front foot for the next three months.

It is day 1000 today of President Putin’s “3 day” Special Military Operation. Ukraine has about six weeks to get to a place of advantage before Trump’s arrival in the White House, but Sir Keir Starmer is still refusing to push on fully with Storm Shadow.
Sadly, this is classic political posturing, with officials only wanting to make decisions at the last possible moment. This just so happens to be the worst type of decision for military operations. President Biden has already unleashed the US ATACMS weapon system, no doubt emboldened by his lame duck status, allowing for at least some decisive action on behalf of the Western alliance.
Whoever holds Kursk at Christmas will be in the ascendancy for the anticipated Trump ceasefire talks in early 2025. I hope our leader realises, and quickly, that his own personal political needs must come after enabling Ukraine to survive this Russian onslaught, and to get into a position of advantage by next year.
There are 50,000 Russian and North Korean troops forming up in their assembly areas for the much-delayed counterattack into Kursk, who are sitting ducks for Storm Shadow and ATACMS missiles which can most certainly turn the tide in this conflict and for once in Kyiv’s favour.
But it needs to be done now, today, not in a few weeks’ time. Great military leadership is about seizing fleeting opportunities, and this is one which Starmer may be about to butcher. The likely reason behind his relative inaction may be because he is cowed by the fear of Putin’s nuclear threats.
Still, we must keep in mind that the Russian leader’s warnings have always been bluff and bluster in this regard. Now he says that if a non-nuclear nation attacks Russia supported by a nuclear nation, he will escalate to nuclear attack. But this has always been Russian nuclear doctrine, certainly since the last major review in 2014 and restated by Putin at a press conference in October 2022.
Ukraine attacked Russia in British challenger tanks months ago, and his doctrine would have allowed him to strike back with nuclear weapons then. Quite frankly, if he did not do it with this level of provocation, I cannot see a scenario where he would, short of Starmer dropping a Trident missile on the Kremlin.
Perhaps Sir Keir Starmer’s “civil rights” legal conscience is getting the better of him, wanting to avoid battlefield casualties, but if Russia prevails in Ukraine, we may eventually have to fight the Russians in Europe with our tiny Army and our handful of tanks. Most informed estimates by reliable experts suggest the current British Army would last about 6 weeks if we have to go toe-to-toe with Russian armour, and for one who has spent the last 36 years on the battlefields of the planet, this is to be avoided at all costs.
The PM should perhaps stop bashing the farmers and the taxpayers and focus on bashing the Russians instead, or at least enable Ukraine to do so before it is too late.

J

[Ozyhibby]

thank goodness Starmer wants to be XI Jinpings buddy

cables around GB should be safe










for now

Although it’s a Chinese ship it sailed from Russia with a Russian captain.
Irish navy had to chase a Russian ship surveying cables around UK the other day.


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[tamig]

Putin lowers the threshold for using his nuclear arsenal after Biden’s arms decision for Ukraine.

This latest news should be giving all concerned food for thought as to the direction this conflict is leading to. I’ve always feared that the use of nuclear weapons is inevitable. I’ve always been ‘assured’ that this could/would never happen for a variety of reasons: Putin isn’t crazy or suicidal personally or for his nation or he doesn’t have supreme power to make the final decision as his ‘cabinet’ and advisors could/would step in and prevent it. I’m not so sure. Putin can’t and won’t give any ground and I suspect that Trump will intervene and find a resolution favouring Putin at the expense of Ukraine.
The bit in bold is more than a little misleading. The timing is coincidental. They’ve been reviewing their “nuclear doctrine” for a while. Russia apply made up rules that others need to adhere to but they feel free to ignore. Another piece of Putin flannel. Red lines don’t seem to mean anything where this war is concerned.

[superfurryhibby]

If Russia prevails in Ukraine, we may eventually have to fight the Russians in Europe with our tiny Army and our handful of tanks. Most informed estimates by reliable experts suggest the current British Army would last about 6 weeks if we have to go toe-to-toe with Russian armour, and for one who has spent the last 36 years on the battlefields of the planet, this is to be avoided at all costs.



Why would the British army last six weeks v Russia and the Ukrainians remain fighting after nearly three years?

Ps: I appreciate BH is quoting from the Telegraph

[Ozyhibby]

Why would the British army last six weeks v Russia and the Ukrainians remain fighting after nearly three years?

It’s not true. All Russia has that would concern is it nuclear. Their armour would not get anywhere near our armour as our air force would wipe it out.
But that’s as it is now, not once it’s absorbed Ukraine, Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania and Poland.
It’s best not to find out and deal with it now.


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[superfurryhibby]

It’s not true. All Russia has that would concern is it nuclear. Their armour would not get anywhere near our armour as our air force would wipe it out.
But that’s as it is now, not once it’s absorbed Ukraine, Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania and Poland.
It’s best not to find out and deal with it now.


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If Russia are on their knees financially and so stretched militarily in Ukraine, how could they ever succeed in defeating those other nations, given that they can't even gain the upper hand in Ukraine anyway?

[Moulin Yarns]

If Russia are on their knees financially and so stretched militarily in Ukraine, how could they ever succeed in defeating those other nations, given that they can't even gain the upper hand in Ukraine anyway?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn0dpdx420lo


Bbc verify saying Russian gains in 2024 more than 2023. Russia are gaining the upper hand.

[Ozyhibby]

If Russia are on their knees financially and so stretched militarily in Ukraine, how could they ever succeed in defeating those other nations, given that they can't even gain the upper hand in Ukraine anyway?

If we abandon Ukraine then they will take Ukraine. That gives them an extra 30 odd million people/tax payers and all of Ukraines resources. Trump lifts the sanctions and the money starts to flow again from gas and Oil. Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania are much smaller and wouldn’t be much of a problem from there.
Poland might be a bit trickier and might require a pause first but eventually it would fall. Maybe Moldova and then onto Romania first?
Once you have all that it becomes very difficult to stop them at all.
When we handed over Sudetenland to the Nazi’s in 1938 it came with the massive Skoda armaments factories which strengthened them hugely.

Appeasement doesn’t have a great track record and I don’t think we should be doing it here.


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[superfurryhibby]

If we abandon Ukraine then they will take Ukraine. That gives them an extra 30 odd million people/tax payers and all of Ukraines resources. Trump lifts the sanctions and the money starts to flow again from gas and Oil. Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania are much smaller and wouldn’t be much of a problem from there.
Poland might be a bit trickier and might require a pause first but eventually it would fall. Maybe Moldova and then onto Romania first?
Once you have all that it becomes very difficult to stop them at all.
When we handed over Sudetenland to the Nazi’s in 1938 it came with the massive Skoda armaments factories which strengthened them hugely.

Appeasement doesn’t have a great track record and I don’t think we should be doing it here.


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Those scenarios are predicated on military aid ceasing for Ukraine, that would be absolute madness.

Not so sure it's as simple as you suggest though. Trying to maintain Russian order in the face of internal resistance in Ukraine alone would be a huge challenge, even if they were able to defeat the Ukrainian army. Europe would not stand by and allow Russia to defeat the likes of Poland, Estonia etc, neither would Nato?

Comparisons with appeasement in the 1930's. The Nazis were a very different proposition from Putin's Russia militarily. However, there is a very obvious need to continue to support Ukraine.

[Ozyhibby]

Those scenarios are predicated on military aid ceasing for Ukraine, that would be absolute madness.

Not so sure it's as simple as you suggest though. Trying to maintain Russian order in the face of internal resistance in Ukraine alone would be a huge challenge, even if they were able to defeat the Ukrainian army. Europe would not stand by and allow Russia to defeat the likes of Poland, Estonia etc, neither would Nato?

Comparisons with appeasement in the 1930's. The Nazis were a very different proposition from Putin's Russia militarily. However, there is a very obvious need to continue to support Ukraine.

It’s a scenario that has close to zero chance of happening but not zero. I just don’t think we should be backing down at all to any dictator.


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[Smartie]

Those scenarios are predicated on military aid ceasing for Ukraine, that would be absolute madness.

Not so sure it's as simple as you suggest though. Trying to maintain Russian order in the face of internal resistance in Ukraine alone would be a huge challenge, even if they were able to defeat the Ukrainian army. Europe would not stand by and allow Russia to defeat the likes of Poland, Estonia etc, neither would Nato?

Comparisons with appeasement in the 1930's. The Nazis were a very different proposition from Putin's Russia militarily. However, there is a very obvious need to continue to support Ukraine.

I disagree that the Nazis were a different proposition to Putin’s Russia.

They are a huge danger who would be emboldened by any success they enjoy in Ukraine.

Complacency in the West is almost as big a danger as the genocidal dictator.

[superfurryhibby]

I disagree that the Nazis were a different proposition to Putin’s Russia.

They are a huge danger who would be emboldened by any success they enjoy in Ukraine.

Complacency in the West is almost as big a danger as the genocidal dictator.

Militarily, there is no comparison. That was my point.

Nazi Germany was a potent threat, It's armies seemed unstoppable, with a military-industrial economic structure, a well resourced army, airforce and navy. It's servicemen were not conscripts, prisoners released to serve and North Koreans shipped in.

Russia has a demoralised military, it's poorly resourced and it's economy is shattered? There is also tremendous potential for discontent amongst it's population.

No one could disagree that Putin is a dangerous man or that Russia unchecked might continue to wreak havoc, but they are nowhere near as a capable a threat as the Nazis were before the onset of WW2.

Let's not forget that Nazi Germany also had military allies in the Italians and had pacts with Japan and Russia.

[Smartie]

Militarily, there is no comparison. That was my point.

Nazi Germany was a potent threat, It's armies seemed unstoppable, with a military-industrial economic structure, a well resourced army, airforce and navy. It's servicemen were not conscripts, prisoners released to serve and North Koreans shipped in.

Russia has a demoralised military, it's poorly resourced and it's economy is shattered? There is also tremendous potential for discontent amongst it's population.

No one could disagree that Putin is a dangerous man or that Russia unchecked might continue to wreak havoc, but they are nowhere near as a capable a threat as the Nazis were before the onset of WW2.

Let's not forget that Nazi Germany also had military allies in the Italians and had pacts with Japan and Russia.

I wouldn’t want to argue in favour of Russian competence after what we’ve seen in this calamitous war, but their size, nuclear weapons and disregard for human life means that they will always be a formidable threat.

Re Nazi Germany and their pacts - the only reason the Russians haven’t had their ***** handed to them worse than they have has been the relationships they enjoy with Iran, North Korea and possibly China.

As a bloc, that is fairly formidable, especially if / when Trump pulls American opposition to them out.

[Ozyhibby]

Militarily, there is no comparison. That was my point.

Nazi Germany was a potent threat, It's armies seemed unstoppable, with a military-industrial economic structure, a well resourced army, airforce and navy. It's servicemen were not conscripts, prisoners released to serve and North Koreans shipped in.

Russia has a demoralised military, it's poorly resourced and it's economy is shattered? There is also tremendous potential for discontent amongst it's population.

No one could disagree that Putin is a dangerous man or that Russia unchecked might continue to wreak havoc, but they are nowhere near as a capable a threat as the Nazis were before the onset of WW2.

Let's not forget that Nazi Germany also had military allies in the Italians and had pacts with Japan and Russia.

How big a threat were the German military 6 years before when Hitler took power in 1933?


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[superfurryhibby]

How big a threat were the German military 6 years before when Hitler took power in 1933?


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I think the point is that Putin's Russia will never reach the level of military or economic
potency of Nazi Germany.

[Smartie]

I think the point is that Putin's Russia will never reach the level of military or economic
potency of Nazi Germany.

“Never” is a long time.

They’ll definitely be toiling for a while after this war though. Or at least they should be.

[superfurryhibby]

I wouldn’t want to argue in favour of Russian competence after what we’ve seen in this calamitous war, but their size, nuclear weapons and disregard for human life means that they will always be a formidable threat.

Re Nazi Germany and their pacts - the only reason the Russians haven’t had their ***** handed to them worse than they have has been the relationships they enjoy with Iran, North Korea and possibly China.

As a bloc, that is fairly formidable, especially if / when Trump pulls American opposition to them out.

Do Iran or North Korea really add hugely to Russian influence ? As for China, I would question the strength of their political or military ties with Russia.

Size and nuclear weapons have not really advantaged the Russians in this conflict? What we have seen is an incompetent, poor led, poorly equipped military failure against a small army and well drilled militia. This thread is full of reports of Russian military failure over many years.

They are not a well honed, cutting edged war machine.

I'm finding it a bit strange how Russia goes from a country on the verge of imploding socially, militarily and economically to a potent threat to European security depending on which narrative suits the argument being proposed (not by you, I should add).

As an outsider through most of the discussion on here it seems clear that:

Russia's conventional forces are poorly led, poorly equipped and struggling to maintain the commitment in the field that this war requires of them.

Russia's economy is in dire trouble.

I am not suggesting that the west cease backing Ukraine, far from it.

[Ozyhibby]

Do Iran or North Korea really add hugely to Russian influence ? As for China, I would question the strength of their political or military ties with Russia.

Size and nuclear weapons have not really advantaged the Russians in this conflict? What we have seen is an incompetent, poor led, poorly equipped military failure against a small army and well drilled militia. This thread is full of reports of Russian military failure over many years.

They are not a well honed, cutting edged war machine.

I'm finding it a bit strange how Russia goes from a country on the verge of imploding socially, militarily and economically to a potent threat to European security depending on which narrative suits the argument being proposed (not by you, I should add).

As an outsider through most of the discussion on here it seems clear that:

Russia's conventional forces are poorly led, poorly equipped and struggling to maintain the commitment in the field that this war requires of them.

Russia's economy is in dire trouble.

I am not suggesting that the west cease backing Ukraine, far from it.

Nuclear weapons have definitely helped them. If they did not have them it would be over by now. The armies of Western Europe would have over run them within months. Only Nuclear weapons have prevented that.


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[Ozyhibby]

Nuclear weapons have definitely helped them. If they did not have them it would be over by now. The armies of Western Europe would have over run them within months. Only Nuclear weapons have prevented that.


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I think both things can be true. Russia is on the brink of collapsing economically and its army is hopeless but given its intent and its natural resources it should not be taken lightly.


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[Bristolhibby]

Nuclear weapons have definitely helped them. If they did not have them it would be over by now. The armies of Western Europe would have over run them within months. Only Nuclear weapons have prevented that.


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Ukraine must rue the day they handed over their Nuclear weapons subject to Western and Russian guarantees protecting their integrity.

If Ukraine was Nuclear armed we wouldn’t be having this conversation.

The West Completely threw the Ukrainians under the bus. As a minimum we should be arming them and transferring lock stock all the seized Russian assets. Something crazy like £30 billion.

J

[Smartie]

Do Iran or North Korea really add hugely to Russian influence ? As for China, I would question the strength of their political or military ties with Russia.

Size and nuclear weapons have not really advantaged the Russians in this conflict? What we have seen is an incompetent, poor led, poorly equipped military failure against a small army and well drilled militia. This thread is full of reports of Russian military failure over many years.

They are not a well honed, cutting edged war machine.

I'm finding it a bit strange how Russia goes from a country on the verge of imploding socially, militarily and economically to a potent threat to European security depending on which narrative suits the argument being proposed (not by you, I should add).

As an outsider through most of the discussion on here it seems clear that:

Russia's conventional forces are poorly led, poorly equipped and struggling to maintain the commitment in the field that this war requires of them.

Russia's economy is in dire trouble.

I am not suggesting that the west cease backing Ukraine, far from it.

Iranian drones have certainly helped them. North Korean men are currently helping them - if they were to call upon potentially 50,000 then that might make a fairly significant difference.

I’ve not really got much to add to Ozy’s posts above. Russia’s sheer size, numbers and resources make them a potentially fierce enemy, even if they end up seriously weakened following this conflict. They will nearly always have a potential to regenerate and go again. Any end point to this conflict must be carefully considered from the point of view of leaving a future weakness to be exploited.

[Smartie]

Ukraine must rue the day they handed over their Nuclear weapons subject to Western and Russian guarantees protecting their integrity.

If Ukraine was Nuclear armed we wouldn’t be having this conversation.

The West Completely threw the Ukrainians under the bus. As a minimum we should be arming them and transferring lock stock all the seized Russian assets. Something crazy like £30 billion.

J

This is depressingly true.

[Ozyhibby]

Ukraine must rue the day they handed over their Nuclear weapons subject to Western and Russian guarantees protecting their integrity.

If Ukraine was Nuclear armed we wouldn’t be having this conversation.

The West Completely threw the Ukrainians under the bus. As a minimum we should be arming them and transferring lock stock all the seized Russian assets. Something crazy like £30 billion.

J

£300bn.


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[Ozyhibby]

Ukraine must rue the day they handed over their Nuclear weapons subject to Western and Russian guarantees protecting their integrity.

If Ukraine was Nuclear armed we wouldn’t be having this conversation.

The West Completely threw the Ukrainians under the bus. As a minimum we should be arming them and transferring lock stock all the seized Russian assets. Something crazy like £30 billion.

J

I think apart from South Africa, every country that has ever given up nuclear weapons has subsequently been invaded? The lesson surely must be to never give them up?


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[superfurryhibby]

Iranian drones have certainly helped them. North Korean men are currently helping them - if they were to call upon potentially 50,000 then that might make a fairly significant difference.

I’ve not really got much to add to Ozy’s posts above. Russia’s sheer size, numbers and resources make them a potentially fierce enemy, even if they end up seriously weakened following this conflict. They will nearly always have a potential to regenerate and go again. Any end point to this conflict must be carefully considered from the point of view of leaving a future weakness to be exploited.

Yes, I tend to agree with myself on this.

I have pointed out on here repeatedly that rumours of Russia's demise in the conflict have been greatly exaggerated, based on the same rationale and had that dismissed. Here we are several years later and the Russians are still going at it. It has cost them enormously, but they remain committed

For me the most likely outcome is a peace settlement which will allow the Russians to keep the territories they occupy.

[Smartie]

Yes, I tend to agree with myself on this.

I have pointed out on here repeatedly that rumours of Russia's demise in the conflict have been greatly exaggerated, based on the same rationale and had that dismissed. Here we are several years later and the Russians are still going at it. It has cost them enormously, but they remain committed

For me the most likely outcome is a peace settlement which will allow the Russians to keep the territories they occupy.

I agree with you - that is the most likely outcome.

It’s a good one for Russia and an awful one for the UK, Ukraine, Europe, freedom and democracy.

[Ozyhibby]

I agree with you - that is the most likely outcome.

It’s a good one for Russia and an awful one for the UK, Ukraine, Europe, freedom and democracy.

I don’t see how Ukraine agrees to that? Or the rest of Europe? I think the Poles would rather join the fight than allow that?


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[Paul1642]

“Never” is a long time.

They’ll definitely be toiling for a while after this war though. Or at least they should be.

Putin has been in power for over 15 years and has had absolute power for a good chunk of that time.

He had plenty time to build the Russian armed forces and prepare for the invasion of Ukraine which he no doubt planned to do for some time. He even got to start a proxy war in the east of the country years before the invasion supported by his own army under false flags without much consequence.

Despite this his invasion fell flat and 3 years on hasn’t made much progress.

They couldn’t do it this time there’s nothing to suggest they will ever be able to again. Russias greatest military asset has always been manpower and the days of an huge infantry being a war winner and drawing to an end.

All they have is Nukes. Without them NATO would have wiped the floor with them in a matter of weeks 3 years ago.

[AgentDaleCooper]

is there any reason why all reasonable Russian assets haven't been seized?

[Ozyhibby]

is there any reason why all reasonable Russian assets haven't been seized?

Protection under law of private property is fundamental to how our system works. That won’t be given up easily.
Also the Europeans need to protect the euro. Confiscating other states holdings of euros may deter other from holding it.
It complicated but I expect it will happen at the end of the war in return for compensation for Ukraine.


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[judas]

Yes, I tend to agree with myself on this.

I have pointed out on here repeatedly that rumours of Russia's demise in the conflict have been greatly exaggerated, based on the same rationale and had that dismissed. Here we are several years later and the Russians are still going at it. It has cost them enormously, but they remain committed

For me the most likely outcome is a peace settlement which will allow the Russians to keep the territories they occupy.

That’s been my view too. My concerns have been politely dismissed several times on here.

[Bristolhibby]

£300bn.


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Even more crazy.

Mad thing is, they can buy our shells and war material off us. Win win all round and good for our economy.

J

[Bristolhibby]

Yes, I tend to agree with myself on this.

I have pointed out on here repeatedly that rumours of Russia's demise in the conflict have been greatly exaggerated, based on the same rationale and had that dismissed. Here we are several years later and the Russians are still going at it. It has cost them enormously, but they remain committed

For me the most likely outcome is a peace settlement which will allow the Russians to keep the territories they occupy.

I’d like to see Ukraine hold onto their Kursk gains and use that to get their territory around Mariupol, Melitopol and Zaporichia.

J

[Ozyhibby]

That’s been my view too. My concerns have been politely dismissed several times on here.

Everyone is concerned. The Russians are still going but the costs to them have been very high. So far the regime survives and I guess it will look ok right up to the minute it doesn’t. The Russian economy is experiencing huge inflation just now. Interest rates are about 20%. Mortgage rates with their biggest bank are now at 28.1%. The govt has no way of stopping the inflation because it’s being caused by the massive increase in military spending. The interest rates have had no effect. It will keep rising because wages keep rising as firms with contracts for the war compete for Labour.
The govt is now moving into deficit every year which isn’t normally a problem except Russia can’t borrow money because the ruble is collapsing and sanctions prevent foreigners from lending to them.
They are now starting to print money to pay for it. Hyper inflation usually follows.
How long can they keep going? Difficult to say but when it eventually collapses then it will be obvious why. It’s not like we haven’t seen all these stages before.
Ukraine has to be able to hold them off on the battle field though in the mean time.


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[Ozyhibby]

Ruble now at 103 to the dollar. Russia has used a lot of its reserves keeping it below 100. It now appears to have given up. More inflation on the way.

Another red line crossed by Ukraine and little response from Putin.


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[Bridge hibs]

Ruble now at 103 to the dollar. Russia has used a lot of its reserves keeping it below 100. It now appears to have given up. More inflation on the way.

Another red line crossed by Ukraine and little response from Putin.


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkGMTV this morning Putin has hit Donetsk with an ICBM and he also says the UK is now a valid target due to allowing long range missiles to hit Russia.

**** needs stopped

[Ozyhibby]

GMTV this morning Putin has hit Donetsk with an ICBM and he also says the UK is now a valid target due to allowing long range missiles to hit Russia.

**** needs stopped

He hits Ukraine with missiles everyday?[emoji2369]


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[Hibrandenburg]

GMTV this morning Putin has hit Donetsk with an ICBM and he also says the UK is now a valid target due to allowing long range missiles to hit Russia.

**** needs stopped

If he hits a NATO country then he's toast.

[Bridge hibs]

If he hits a NATO country then he's toast.

Yeah but I want to see him toast before Im toast 🫣

[lapsedhibee]

Yeah but I want to see him toast before Im toast 🫣
:cheers:

[Ozyhibby]

Yeah but I want to see him toast before Im toast 🫣

Stepping up but more importantly, properly enforcing the sanctions is the best way for that to happen.


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[StevieC]

GMTV this morning Putin has hit Donetsk with an ICBM

It hit Dnipro.
South side of the city, not too far away from the Meteor Stadium where we played our game against them.

[Lendo]

It hit Dnipro.
South side of the city, not too far away from the Meteor Stadium where we played our game against them.

https://www.reddit.com/r/HighStrangeness/s/4O32I1e0dt

The video footage of the ICBM strike is nuts.

[Keith_M]

Yeah but I want to see him toast before Im toast 🫣


Putin's secret service takes out his enemies on a regular basis and are now threatening the West on various fronts.

If such rogue activity is alright in his eyes, then maybe the West should give him a taste of his own medicine.

[Ozyhibby]

Ruble now at 103 to the dollar. Russia has used a lot of its reserves keeping it below 100. It now appears to have given up. More inflation on the way.

Another red line crossed by Ukraine and little response from Putin.


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They tried to stabilise it on Monday but it hasn’t worked. Hit 105 today.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://youtu.be/0rpZihqjd7s?si=yKvnKSRtvgXYy71F

This is worth a watch.


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[superfurryhibby]

https://youtu.be/0rpZihqjd7s?si=yKvnKSRtvgXYy71F

This is worth a watch.


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Why don't you say what it is about, then we might consider it?

[grunt]

Why don't you say what it is about, then we might consider it?Putin scrambles to fill equipment shortages as deep strikes on Russia begin

[superfurryhibby]

Putin scrambles to fill equipment shortages as deep strikes on Russia begin

Cheers :aok:

[Ozyhibby]

Why don't you say what it is about, then we might consider it?

There is literally a description that comes with the video?[emoji2369]


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[Smartie]

The equipment an economic situations for Russia are desperate.

If only someone could get through to Trump that the sort of deal he’s going to want to force here is anything like the sort of deal he should be making.

“MAGA” is going to be a disaster for America and the wider world.

[Moulin Yarns]

There is literally a description that comes with the video?[emoji2369]


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That would have been helpful

[Ozyhibby]

Ruble cracking 107.75 now. This could turn into a big story if this doesn’t stabilise soon.

https://wsnext.com/2bb854b-ruble-devaluation-export-cancellations/

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[Andy Bee]

I keep reading that the UK and France are considering putting troops on the ground if Trump stops financing Ukraine, is this true or scaremongering?

[Ozyhibby]

I keep reading that the UK and France are considering putting troops on the ground if Trump stops financing Ukraine, is this true or scaremongering?

I doubt it’s true and I don’t think it’s needed just yet. Europe will need to dramatically lift the finance it provides and find the weaponry. On that front, the ever transactional Trump would likely sell it to Europe.


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[Smartie]

Ruble cracking 107.75 now. This could turn into a big story if this doesn’t stabilise soon.

https://wsnext.com/2bb854b-ruble-devaluation-export-cancellations/

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This should have been the tipping point in this war…

Might yet prove to be.

That Swedish general chappie that I linked to a while back had calculated that this November was going to be of great significance - the American election along with the trajectory of various Russian losses - equipment, soldiers and economic woes biting hard.

[Ozyhibby]

This should have been the tipping point in this war…

Might yet prove to be.

That Swedish general chappie that I linked to a while back had calculated that this November was going to be of great significance - the American election along with the trajectory of various Russian losses - equipment, soldiers and economic woes biting hard.

Putin has banned companies from declaring bankruptcy this week. Can’t see what that achieves? Like telling a man falling out a window to stop falling?[emoji2369]


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[Bristolhibby]

I doubt it’s true and I don’t think it’s needed just yet. Europe will need to dramatically lift the finance it provides and find the weaponry. On that front, the ever transactional Trump would likely sell it to Europe.


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I said it earlier, give them the £300 billion in seized Russian assets. That will buy a lot of shells and drones.

J

[judas]

Putin has banned companies from declaring bankruptcy this week. Can’t see what that achieves? Like telling a man falling out a window to stop falling?[emoji2369]


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Good analogy.

[AgentDaleCooper]

I doubt it’s true and I don’t think it’s needed just yet. Europe will need to dramatically lift the finance it provides and find the weaponry. On that front, the ever transactional Trump would likely sell it to Europe.


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it would be such an escalation that we really cannot afford to let it get to that stage. it wouldn't necessarily be a quick war to be involved in, and the stakes would be completely insane, with nukes looming very large in the wings. no thanks.

[Stairway 2 7]

it would be such an escalation that we really cannot afford to let it get to that stage. it wouldn't necessarily be a quick war to be involved in, and the stakes would be completely insane, with nukes looming very large in the wings. no thanks.

Against NATO Russia would last a few months. Israel just used a half dozen f35 fighter jets to walz round Iran and take out the best available Russian air defenses available with ease. NATO has 600 f35s and 700 eurofighters.

It obviously won't ever come to that. Plus what France said was post a ceasefire they could have French and UK troops either training Ukrainian troops or helping a DMZ.

I see yesterday Putin's number 2 Dmitry Medvedev was saying western missles hitting Russia wasn't a red line but NATO transferring nukes to Ukraine would be, running out of red lines. I'm stunned that so many people fell for the escalation/red line chat this week for the 50th time

[Ozyhibby]

Ruble at 108 now. It falls much further and there will be food shortages in Russia.


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[AgentDaleCooper]

Against NATO Russia would last a few months. Israel just used a half dozen f35 fighter jets to walz round Iran and take out the best available Russian air defenses available with ease. NATO has 600 f35s and 700 eurofighters.

It obviously won't ever come to that. Plus what France said was post a ceasefire they could have French and UK troops either training Ukrainian troops or helping a DMZ.

I see yesterday Putin's number 2 Dmitry Medvedev was saying western missles hitting Russia wasn't a red line but NATO transferring nukes to Ukraine would be, running out of red lines. I'm stunned that so many people fell for the escalation/red line chat this week for the 50th time

fair enough, that's good to know

[Stairway 2 7]

fair enough, that's good to know

I'm not worried about a war between NATO and Russia I'm more worried that there will be a ceasefire soon, a carve up of Ukraine, a token few months pause and then the gas starts being traded again between EU and Russia. Putin being welcomed to g12 meetings again in the name of peace

[Smartie]

This continuously sliding rouble is significant.

112.75 roubles to the dollar now.

It's hard for the Russian population to do much about the dictatorship but when the population get too poor, hungry and then have nothing to lose, that spells big trouble for Putin.

[Ozyhibby]

Syrian civil war seems to have kicked off again with rebels entering the city of Aleppo last night. Bad for the Assad regime and Putin.

https://apnews.com/article/syria-attack-clashes-aleppo-9c07da6f83036f34d4b18a479de9d085

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[Hibs4185]

Syrian civil war seems to have kicked off again with rebels entering the city of Aleppo last night. Bad for the Assad regime and Putin.

https://apnews.com/article/syria-attack-clashes-aleppo-9c07da6f83036f34d4b18a479de9d085

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Putin likes to spread instability in order to take the heat off him, Iran, hezbollah, Syria etc.

Nice to see Ukraine giving him a few headaches elsewhere and possibly drawing resources.

[Ozyhibby]

Putin likes to spread instability in order to take the heat off him, Iran, hezbollah, Syria etc.

Nice to see Ukraine giving him a few headaches elsewhere and possibly drawing resources.

This will likely be the Turks and Israelis with a bit of secret help from the west. They have swept right into centre of Aleppo already and regime forces have collapsed.
It’s a long way to Damascus though. Assad flew to Moscow last night apparently. No doubt begging for help.


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[Hibs4185]

This will likely be the Turks and Israelis with a bit of secret help from the west. They have swept right into centre of Aleppo already and regime forces have collapsed.
It’s a long way to Damascus though. Assad flew to Moscow last night apparently. No doubt begging for help.


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I seen something saying Ukraine have been training drone operators and also the opposition are wearing yellow or blue armbands. Maybe doesn’t mean anything but I can see why it’s in Ukraine’s interest and straight from the Putin playbook

[Ozyhibby]

I seen something saying Ukraine have been training drone operators and also the opposition are wearing yellow or blue armbands. Maybe doesn’t mean anything but I can see why it’s in Ukraine’s interest and straight from the Putin playbook

Absolutely. Wouldn’t surprise me. This is now a World War in my opinion. We just haven’t joined it.
Yet.

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[Ozyhibby]

https://bsky.app/profile/mariekalevala.bsky.social/post/3lc47ehgoos2w

Looks like Aleppo has fallen very quickly.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://bsky.app/profile/igorsushko.bsky.social/post/3lc5eubhdas2x

Police raided Moscow nightclubs last night and took the men away for conscription. Women released.


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[Paul1642]

https://bsky.app/profile/igorsushko.bsky.social/post/3lc5eubhdas2x

Police raided Moscow nightclubs last night and took the men away for conscription. Women released.


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That’ll be some hangover.

[Ozyhibby]

https://bsky.app/profile/rioinbrasil.bsky.social/post/3lc6q3tvz5k2w

Lots of rumours of a military coup in Damascus tonight.


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[Moulin Yarns]

https://bsky.app/profile/rioinbrasil.bsky.social/post/3lc6q3tvz5k2w

Lots of rumours of a military coup in Damascus tonight.


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https://www.turkiyetoday.com/region/what-do-we-know-about-rumors-of-a-military-coup-in-syria-86821/

Latest update from Turkey (6pm)

[Ozyhibby]

https://bsky.app/profile/timkmak.bsky.social/post/3lcdclhmqxc2i

Russian troops leaving Damascus. Assad looking very isolated.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://bsky.app/profile/militarynewsua.bsky.social/post/3lcfpft5vls2k
US air force getting involved.


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[DaveF]

https://bsky.app/profile/militarynewsua.bsky.social/post/3lcfpft5vls2k
US air force getting involved.


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What's democratic about this so called SDF? They are probably just slightly less desirable than Assad and co.

[Ozyhibby]

What's democratic about this so called SDF? They are probably just slightly less desirable than Assad and co.

Usually if democratic is in the name then it’s not.[emoji23]


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[Ozyhibby]

What's democratic about this so called SDF? They are probably just slightly less desirable than Assad and co.

There no evidence anywhere that any of these groups come close to the monstrousness of Assad? [emoji2369]


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[cabbageandribs1875]

South Korean president declares emergency martial law "to protect the country from North Korea's communist forces" and to eliminate anti-state elements.

no idea what this is all about

[Hibernian Verse]

Not sure if related, but South Korea just declared martial law...could this be a by-the-way-side response to what's happening in Syria from Russia? (i.e. setting North Korea up to attack the south, diverting western focus?)

From BBC

Ruling party and opposition both vow to block declaration - report
published at 14:17
14:17
The Yonhap News Agency is reporting that the leader of South Korean opposition Democratic Party, Lee Jae-myung, has said the declaration of martial law is unconstitutional.

Yonhap is also reporting that Han Dong-hoon, the head of the ruling People Power Party - of which President Yoon Suk Yeol is a member - has also vowed to block the declaration, describing it as "wrong".

[AgentDaleCooper]

From BBC

Ruling party and opposition both vow to block declaration - report
published at 14:17
14:17
The Yonhap News Agency is reporting that the leader of South Korean opposition Democratic Party, Lee Jae-myung, has said the declaration of martial law is unconstitutional.

Yonhap is also reporting that Han Dong-hoon, the head of the ruling People Power Party - of which President Yoon Suk Yeol is a member - has also vowed to block the declaration, describing it as "wrong".

Yeah, just saw that - really weird, hopefully nowt.

[Ozyhibby]

Yeah, just saw that - really weird, hopefully nowt.

Martial law lifted. Seems like a hissy fit from a corrupt right wing president facing impeachment and possible criminal charges.
Thank goodness. Need democratic countries to be strong for next 4 years.


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[AgentDaleCooper]

Martial law lifted. Seems like a hissy fit from a corrupt right wing president facing impeachment and possible criminal charges.
Thank goodness. Need democratic countries to be strong for next 4 years.


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uncanny...i wish the folk flocking to the right could see what they are walking into... :no way:

[Ozyhibby]

uncanny...i wish the folk flocking to the right could see what they are walking into... :no way:

Wish the centre left would get its act together and offer an alternative.


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[AgentDaleCooper]

Wish the centre left would get its act together and offer an alternative.


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that too

[Ozyhibby]

Russia have had to evacuate their naval base at Tartus. It was one of their few warm water ports.

https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2024/12/first-sign-russian-navy-evacuating-naval-vessels-from-tartus-syria/

They are obviously not confident Assad can hold on.


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[Bristolhibby]

Problem is the rebels (at least these particular rebels) are off shoots of Daeash, not particularly palatable. It’s not like the “good guys” are taking over.

Expect more destabilisation. One positive is that Iranian e
Weapons won’t be able to get to Hezbolla through Syria.

And the Russians can Foxtrot Oscar.

J

[Ozyhibby]

Problem is the rebels (at least these particular rebels) are off shoots of Daeash, not particularly palatable. It’s not like the “good guys” are taking over.

Expect more destabilisation. One positive is that Iranian e
Weapons won’t be able to get to Hezbolla through Syria.

And the Russians can Foxtrot Oscar.

J

Def not any good guys. However these bad guys will be easier to deal with once Putin is dealt with.


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[Stairway 2 7]

Problem is the rebels (at least these particular rebels) are off shoots of Daeash, not particularly palatable. It’s not like the “good guys” are taking over.

Expect more destabilisation. One positive is that Iranian e
Weapons won’t be able to get to Hezbolla through Syria.

And the Russians can Foxtrot Oscar.

J
All the parties are completely grimm but I'd doubt any other group would kill the 500,000 people Assad and Putin killed, that takes a huge airforce.

USA backed Kurds probably the best but they have no chance with Turkey slaughtering them from all angles

[Ozyhibby]

https://bsky.app/profile/viisegrad24.bsky.social/post/3lcktkjqaxk2a

Hama has fallen to the rebels. That makes the Russian air base and port very vulnerable now and they will likely withdraw totally from both.
Homs is next big city before Damascus.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://bsky.app/profile/ramijarrah.bsky.social/post/3lckthy4ay22n

Mass release of prisoners.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://bsky.app/profile/faredalmahlool.bsky.social/post/3lcn7hbn6m223

Russians evacuating Syria. Hopefully more countries follow.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://bsky.app/profile/theworldindex.bsky.social/post/3lcnrnt6e722f

Assad has fled apparently. Not sure where.


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