Gray is out of his depth’

[blackpoolhibs]

Cons

I'm loathed to want him out, but his tactics are awful, his team seections are out a tombola, and his substitutions are sheite and most of them dont make sense?

Pros

His team got off the bottom tonight.

[TimeForHeroes32]

1 win in first round fixtures bar the Aberdeen game that was moved, sitting 1 point above 12th plus add in getting beat of Kelty Hearts in the cup is a sackable offence. If it wasn’t Gray in charge they would be chased out the door tonight if that wasn’t already done

When will the board learn you can’t hire untried managers and expect miracles with the squad they have made, this is the 3rd experiment they’ve went down since sacking Ross and bringing in their own man. Even Johnson was a massive mistake. Gray isn’t the only name that should be getting major questions asked of though as Kensell is another who needs sacked now and let BK hire whoever they want in that position

Gray has Sunday, we don’t win then the board need hold up their hands and admit they were wrong and should had listened to the BK on who should had been hired and try save our season before we spend our 150th year in the championship

[K-Zazu]

New manager please

[we are hibs]

There's nothing to suggest there is any improvement imminent. We are a poor poor team

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[JohnM1875]

There's nothing to suggest there is any improvement imminent. We are a poor poor team

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I think we're actually getting worse.

[Paul1642]

There's nothing to suggest there is any improvement imminent. We are a poor poor team

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The opposite. That was worse than anything since the St Mirren second half.

We might have had a spell of possession for 25 minutes but we didn’t really threaten at all during that time. A painful watch and it s a sad state of affairs when you start to miss Johnson and Monty.

[Wull]

I think the fact he put Mckirdy on the park is a sackable offence, that performance tonight was shocking, no idea how to motivate a decent performance

[GreenCastle]

Few things..

I always think any manager who doesn’t get us top 6 should be sacked. Right now top 6 is 5 points away but feels like it’s further away.

The loss of revenue for bottom 6 again.

If Gray is to go…I would bin quite a few folk too..in no order..

Kensell
MM
Samson
Craig
May

That’s quite a few payoffs..

What would even be the damage to pay off Kensell on his crazy salary?!

[Bobby's Cinema]

There's nothing to suggest there is any improvement imminent. We are a poor poor team

Sent from my SM-A405FN using Tapatalk
Yes agreed.

As much as we are competitive and games could have arguably gone either way, we don't look like a side that's about to click and go on a run.

I just don't think we ever have controlled domination of games in the middle of the pitch. Controlled patterns of play when you feel like a goals coming. And more and more we just look like we lack real quality.

[Scotty Leither]

I’d let the BKG make the next appointment. Couldn’t be any worse than what we are seeing just now.

I do agree with your last bit.

I hope that’s what the meeting in Vegas was about. IG to have nothing to do with the team and Kensell’s exit strategy being agreed.

[ChuckNor]

We are five points off top six with a game in hand. Calm down.

[Heisenberg]

I think a draw on Sunday will see him through to St Mirren. Fail to win that too and he’ll be off. Feels like we’re at the delaying the inevitable stage if we do manage a win or two though, we aren’t a good team under SDG.

[Unseen work]

We are five points off top six with a game in hand. Calm down.

Brilliant, we should manage to get 5 points in the next 9-10 games

[Scotty Leither]

Few things..

I always think any manager who doesn’t get us top 6 should be sacked. Right now top 6 is 5 points away but feels like it’s further away.

The loss of revenue for bottom 6 again.

If Gray is to go…I would bin quite a few folk too..in no order..

Kensell
MM
Samson
Craig
May

That’s quite a few payoffs..

What would even be the damage to pay off Kensell on his crazy salary?!

I would imagine their pay offs wouldn’t be that significant given they were the cheap, lazy, utterly underwhelming appointments in the first place.

Kensell on the other hand…

[SaulGoodman]

We are five points off top six with a game in hand. Calm down.

Oh well when you put it that way..

[Chorley Hibee]

The opposite. That was worse than anything since the St Mirren second half.

We might have had a spell of possession for 25 minutes but we didn’t really threaten at all during that time. A painful watch and it s a sad state of affairs when you start to miss Johnson and Monty.

2 shots on target and 2 corners, against ****ing Ross County.

We're awful, surely there's no longer an argument to be had on that?

[easty]

We are five points off top six with a game in hand. Calm down.

Europe…here we come!

[B.H.F.C]

Team look like a collection of individuals.

No real plan other than to launch crosses or long throws in to the box.

Don’t look a well coached team. Don’t think our squad is good, but don’t think it is this bad.

[NC1875]

“my belief is still there because of how close the group is and how hard we are working to try and rectify it”

It doesn’t look like that David. It looks lacklustre and is boring as ****.

It didn’t look like anyone gave an extra 10% tonight to try and win the game.

[Paulie Walnuts]

“my belief is still there because of how close the group is and how hard we are working to try and rectify it”

It doesn’t look like that David. It looks lacklustre and is boring as ****.

It didn’t look like anyone gave an extra 10% tonight to try and win the game.

Belief and working hard have got us ****ing nowhere so far so why is it going to get us somewhere going forward?

[Donegal Hibby]

2 shots on target and 2 corners, against ****ing Ross County.

We're awful, surely there's no longer an argument to be had on that?

Aberdeen only had one more shot on target than us when they played them .. just saying.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Aberdeen only had one more shot on target than us when they played them .. just saying.

What was the score in that game?

[Chorley Hibee]

Aberdeen only had one more shot on target than us when they played them .. just saying.

Aberdeen are 21 points ahead of us!

There's a stat that should have everyone in Easter Road hanging their head in shame.

Or if that's not good enough, how about 6 wins in 31 league games.

We're a joke club from top to bottom.

[easty]

Aberdeen only had one more shot on target than us when they played them .. just saying.

Aye but they won!

Stats don't mean a thing when you get the results.

[JohnM1875]

Aberdeen only had one more shot on target than us when they played them .. just saying.

😂😂 aw come on man!

[NC1875]

Aberdeen only had one more shot on target than us when they played them .. just saying.

🥱

[supermcginn]

Aberdeen only had one more shot on target than us when they played them .. just saying.

Deary me....

[Murphys Touch]

Sadly the run just makes every next game a must win - which when you only have a handful in the last 30 odd games means his job is hanging by a thread at all times

Needs a mental run of wins, performances and luck. Not sure he has the players

[Centre Hawf]

Aberdeen only had one more shot on target than us when they played them .. just saying.

But they also had 10 more corners.

[RossScott1991]

Had a look at start under Monty for the first 11 league games. (As this weekend will be our 11th) just to compare. More points accumulated but similar theme of giving up leads in games and 0.0 sticking out v Dundee at home. As we draw 0.0 tonight

killie - 2.2 draw
st j 2.0 win
Dundee 0.0 draw
hearts 2.2 draw
rangers 0.4 defeat
Celtic 0.0 draw
st mirren 2.2 draw (stoppage equaliser conceded)
ross county 2.2 draw (stoppage equaliser conceded)
Killie 1. 0 win
Dundee 2.1 win
Aberdeen 2.0 win

the back to back 2.2 at start of a run of wins were a blow at the time for him.

3.2 ER win in quarters v St Mirren was amongst this run.

then what was probably the real first blow and killer for him the Aberdeen semi against 10 men.

it’s all been very p1sh for a while overall

[Carheenlea]

Theres just nothing there to offer real encouragement that things are going to improve.

The decline feels terminal and while it was worth having a go with David Gray, it’s clearly not working out the way it was hoped. When it’s come to hoofing the ball from back to front it’s last throw of the dice stuff to try and find something that works.

I’m not expecting David Gray to be here much longer.

[Ribs1875]

It is ridiculous he was given the job in the first place. Alarm bells rang for me as soon as he gave average Joe the captaincy. It's hard to feel sorry for him, because he put himself forward to the role of hibs manager. October is a month in football which shows you how you how well you recruited. Our players have not jelled well at all. November and particularly December are notorious months for defining a season. We will need to wait and see what happened in the next few days.

[One Day Soon]

Aberdeen only had one more shot on target than us when they played them .. just saying.

You’re getting pretty ****ing desperate mate.

[Jones28]

Pass marks for the back 4 and Goalie.

Cadden looked decent when he came on. Youan had some nice touches.

The rest were middling to total pish.

Myko and Boyle are bringing **** all to the party at the moment.

[Not In The Know]

Pass marks for the back 4 and Goalie.

Cadden looked decent when he came on. Youan had some nice touches.

The rest were middling to total pish.

Myko and Boyle are bringing **** all to the party at the moment.

Boyle can do one.

Biggest wage thief at the club. He couldn’t give a **** about anyone but himself.

[TrumpIsAPeado]

Aberdeen only had one more shot on target than us when they played them .. just saying.

If only we could... you know, score goals and prevent them up the other end, we'd be flying high. 2 minor issues that I'm sure we'll iron out if we just hold out long enough...

[HFC93]

It is ridiculous he was given the job in the first place. Alarm bells rang for me as soon as he gave average Joe the captaincy. It's hard to feel sorry for him, because he put himself forward to the role of hibs manager. October is a month in football which shows you how you how well you recruited. Our players have not jelled well at all. November and particularly December are notorious months for defining a season. We will need to wait and see what happened in the next few days.

Regarding him picking Joe Newell as captain. Who would you pick instead? I literally can't think of anyone apart from maybe Martin Boyle?

[Donegal Hibby]

Aberdeen are 21 points ahead of us!

There's a stat that should have everyone in Easter Road hanging their head in shame.

Or if that's not good enough, how about 6 wins in 31 league games.

We're a joke club from top to bottom.

The 21 points i can accept has an argument though that’s not what you started it with …

it’s called shifting the goalposts here !

You posted we only had two shots on target against f****** Ross County!!! …

which was the stick you were using , I just merely pointed out that Aberdeen who you have pointed out are flying and 21 points ahead of us had only one more on target when they played them , I think Ross County actually had more shots on target when they played Celtic too ….

I know things are bad at the minute though that point tonight wasn’t a bad one CH and with no disrespect if you want ridicule HIBS .. that’s your prerogative , not mine ..


GGTTH :flag:

[Donegal Hibby]

You’re getting pretty ****ing desperate mate.

Maybe though I do try and normally look for the positives or things to cheer me up even when things aren’t going good 👍 ……

https://www.skysports.com/football/video/30998/13245170/hearts-1-2-kilmarnock-spfl-highlights

[CallumHibs07]

"I think a clean sheet and a point away from home is never a bad thing"

Get him to ******

[greenlex]

"I think a clean sheet and a point away from home is never a bad thing"

Get him to ******

He’s actually right but we need wins. Not half arsed performances.

[andrew70]

He’s actually right but we need wins. Not half arsed performances.

It would certainly carry more weight if we were winning our home games.

[CallumHibs07]

He’s actually right but we need wins. Not half arsed performances.

No, hes not right. Happy with a point against Ross County is utter loser mentality

[Unseen work]

It would be interesting to see the reaction if Monty or Lee Johnson made that comment about a point away to Ross County.

[JimBHibees]

No, hes not right. Happy with a point against Ross County is utter loser mentality

He didn’t say he was happy just that it wasn’t a bad thing.

[flash]

Last night wasn't great but everybody has had it tough up there so far this season.

Our record in general up there isn't the best either so I can definitely see where he is coming from.

There are obviously massive issues with the level of performance but it's important to apply a bit of context regarding where we are in the table when it comes to analysing last night.

Much better Hibs teams than this one have really struggled up there.

The problem we have is that we seem unable to pick up the points at home which would make results like last night much more palatable.

Win our next two games at home and 7 points is an excellent return from these three fixtures.

Unfortunately we have shown little to suggest those two wins are coming.

[JohnM1875]

It would be interesting to see the reaction if Monty or Lee Johnson made that comment about a point away to Ross County.

They'd get slaughtered for it. Especially LJ

[flash]

They'd get slaughtered for it. Especially LJ

SDG is getting it tight as well so, if nothing else, we appear to be an equal opportunities fanbase when it comes to slaughtering our manager.

[04Sauzee]

No, hes not right. Happy with a point against Ross County is utter loser mentality

That's not what he said but bash on.

[Murphys Touch]

Last night wasn't great but everybody has had it tough up there so far this season.

Our record in general up there isn't the best either so I can definitely see where he is coming from.

There are obviously massive issues with the level of performance but it's important to apply a bit of context regarding where we are in the table when it comes to analysing last night.

Much better Hibs teams than this one have really struggled up there.

The problem we have is that we seem unable to pick up the points at home which would make results like last night much more palatable.

Win our next two games at home and 7 points is an excellent return from these three fixtures.

Unfortunately we have shown little to suggest those two wins are coming.

His issue is he NEEDS seven points. Anything less and he should be gone.

I’m not expecting Hibs to win every home game but ER should be a fortress and we pick up the odd away points. Gray has lost that wiggle room and he needs constant home WINS

[flash]

His issue is he NEEDS seven points. Anything less and he should be gone.

I’m not expecting Hibs to win every home game but ER should be a fortress and we pick up the odd away points. Gray has lost that wiggle room and he needs constant home WINS

I would say we need to win at least one of the next two and not lose the other one.

[Trinity Hibee]

SDG is getting it tight as well so, if nothing else, we appear to be an equal opportunities fanbase when it comes to slaughtering our manager.

😂

[Trinity Hibee]

I would say we need to win at least one of the next two and not lose the other one.

Agree

[Since452]

I like Gray, comes across really well. He'll always have a place in my heart for the brilliant captain he was and he's immortalised himself in the clubs history for that goal. It's horrible seeing how this is panning out but it was inevitable. As one of the mainstays of the coaching team that has seen countless managers sacked, he shouldn't have been given the top job. We need a complete clear out. Relegation is very likely if we don't do something.

[Carheenlea]

The board must be contemplating making a change - it’s a long drive back from Dingwall so plenty time for thought and assessment of where our season is going.

The problem they have may be that there is no “turning” on Gray from the support at this stage. They know a sacking will focus the attention on themselves. Any other manager than Gray would have seen clamouring from the stands for dismissal, but the lack of public dissent must be a problem from them.

I think they want to change and I think the BK would want change as well, but any change right now is not going to reflect well on Gordon, Kensell and Mackay:

[flash]

The board must be contemplating making a change - it’s a long drive back from Dingwall so plenty time for thought and assessment of where our season is going.

The problem they have may be that there is no “turning” on Gray from the support at this stage. They know a sacking will focus the attention on themselves. Any other manager than Gray would have seen clamouring from the stands for dismissal, but the lack of public dissent must be a problem from them.

I think they want to change and I think the BK would want change as well, but any change right now is not going to reflect well on Gordon, Kensell and Mackay:

I get frustrated during matches but there's no way I am hounding SDG out of the club.

Let those who created this mess fix it without our help.

[Hibstrooper]

Keep in mind that Mackay has pretty much done a Butcher and said the majority of these players aren’t good enough for us next season, look at how that turned out last time.

You can see it in the performances, we start every game slow and devoid of energy and the first half last night was a prime example of that.

I’m worried changing the manager won’t help. SDG is close to getting some form of tune from this group, it’s not perfect or great to watch but could be enough to get us through to next season.

[Aldo]

Keep in mind that Mackay has pretty much done a Butcher and said the majority of these players aren’t good enough for us next season, look at how that turned out last time.

You can see it in the performances, we start every game slow and devoid of energy and the first half last night was a prime example of that.

I’m worried changing the manager won’t help. SDG is close to getting some form of tune from this group, it’s not perfect or great to watch but could be enough to get us through to next season.

Sorry but one win in 10 is not getting close to getting a tune out of them. It’s eye bleeding hoofball for the majority of the game and has been pretty much all season.

We keep saying the next game is a must win and that’s tells you everything you need to know.

The man is a legend for that day in May 2016 but he’s a terrible coach/manager.

[B.H.F.C]

The board must be contemplating making a change - it’s a long drive back from Dingwall so plenty time for thought and assessment of where our season is going.

The problem they have may be that there is no “turning” on Gray from the support at this stage. They know a sacking will focus the attention on themselves. Any other manager than Gray would have seen clamouring from the stands for dismissal, but the lack of public dissent must be a problem from them.

I think they want to change and I think the BK would want change as well, but any change right now is not going to reflect well on Gordon, Kensell and Mackay:

For me, it’s clear that Gray isn’t the long term answer. It’s never a good game up there, always scrappy and I agree with him that a point isn’t a disaster.

But there is just nothing about us. There is no plan, there is no way of playing. It’s just kick and run and hope for the best. We don’t look coached, we don’t look drilled, we just look really poor.

We really need some results but, even if we get one or two, I don’t think it does anything for us longer term under Gray. It’s not nice as we all want him to succeed but there is zero signs that he will.

[Ribs1875]

Regarding him picking Joe Newell as captain. Who would you pick instead? I literally can't think of anyone apart from maybe Martin Boyle?

Paul Hanlon should have been kept on another season. If I was to chose from what's already there, then it would have been Jordan Obita based on the fact he got the player of the season last season. Joe Newell is a yard too slow, and doesn't lead by example in the slightest.

[Jones28]

Paul Hanlon should have been kept on another season. If I was to chose from what's already there, then it would have been Jordan Obita based on the fact he got the player of the season last season. Joe Newell is a yard too slow, and doesn't lead by example in the slightest.

Good players aren’t necessarily good captains.

[Ribs1875]

Good players aren’t necessarily good captains.

True, however leaders do. It can't be denied Obita was consistent and lead by example last season.

[Since452]

There just doesn't seem to be any style under Gray. Montyball was pish but at least you could see what he was trying to do. Same with Maloney. Johnson was all out attack and forget anything else. But there is absolutely nothing about Grays team to suggest a style. Nothing. It's a disjointed mess.

[greenpaper55]

Paul Hanlon should have been kept on another season. If I was to chose from what's already there, then it would have been Jordan Obita based on the fact he got the player of the season last season. Joe Newell is a yard too slow, and doesn't lead by example in the slightest.

Aye keeping Hanlon another year would have helped us scoring goals right enough !

[bingo70]

For me, it’s clear that Gray isn’t the long term answer. It’s never a good game up there, always scrappy and I agree with him that a point isn’t a disaster.

But there is just nothing about us. There is no plan, there is no way of playing. It’s just kick and run and hope for the best. We don’t look coached, we don’t look drilled, we just look really poor.

We really need some results but, even if we get one or two, I don’t think it does anything for us longer term under Gray. It’s not nice as we all want him to succeed but there is zero signs that he will.

Totally agree with you.

The appointment of Gray made absolutely no sense on any level to me and in my opinion was always a stop gap while other things were sorted out in the background. His back room staff further convinced me that was the case.

Said it before but he’s still managing us like he’s a caretaker, try to keep it tight and work hard rather than him implementing a positive style of play.

I really hope/hoped he would prove me wrong and even now I’m looking at this weekends game and thinking if we can beat Dundee Utd then 5 points out the last 3 games is no disaster. In reality though, I’m still pretty convinced any upturn in form will be short lived due to the lack of plan and strategy when we have the ball on the pitch. There’ll be some games where working harder than the opposition and winning the second balls is enough, that won’t lead to many consistent positive results though.

I think it’s inevitable the BK’s will get more involved, there were rumours the high heid yin from them was up last week to speak to Gray and Mackay. I can’t imagine he would have been impressed by Gray if he asked him what his plan or philosophy and vision was if the answer was to work hard and win second balls. For a modern, forward thinking football group that’s not going to cut the mustard with them, especially if they weren’t behind his appointment in the first place.

I’ll always love David Gray for all he’s done for the club and how he played for us, not just that cup final, his appointment is a bad fit for us as a club just now though imo. He should have been sent away to build a coaching and managerial career in his own right similar to Scott Brown, if he had done that and was good at it he’d have found his way back here eventually, if he wasn’t good enough to do that, he’s not good enough for the top job now.

[McGruber]

For me, it’s clear that Gray isn’t the long term answer. It’s never a good game up there, always scrappy and I agree with him that a point isn’t a disaster.

But there is just nothing about us. There is no plan, there is no way of playing. It’s just kick and run and hope for the best. We don’t look coached, we don’t look drilled, we just look really poor.

We really need some results but, even if we get one or two, I don’t think it does anything for us longer term under Gray. It’s not nice as we all want him to succeed but there is zero signs that he will.

Agree with this.. unfortunately. Was just Ibrox where we looked like we had a coherent plan. Rest of the time looks like a free for all. Look like a team of decent players in need of a good coach to set them up. Add in the baffling subs. Was desperate for Gray to make a fist of it but looks too big a job for him

[Hibee Daft]

Totally agree with you.

The appointment of Gray made absolutely no sense on any level to me and in my opinion was always a stop gap while other things were sorted out in the background. His back room staff further convinced me that was the case.

Said it before but he’s still managing us like he’s a caretaker, try to keep it tight and work hard rather than him implementing a positive style of play.

I really hope/hoped he would prove me wrong and even now I’m looking at this weekends game and thinking if we can beat Dundee Utd then 5 points out the last 3 games is no disaster. In reality though, I’m still pretty convinced any upturn in form will be short lived due to the lack of plan and strategy when we have the ball on the pitch. There’ll be some games where working harder than the opposition and winning the second balls is enough, that won’t lead to many consistent positive results though.

I think it’s inevitable the BK’s will get more involved, there were rumours the high heid yin from them was up last week to speak to Gray and Mackay. I can’t imagine he would have been impressed by Gray if he asked him what his plan or philosophy and vision was if the answer was to work hard and win second balls. For a modern, forward thinking football group that’s not going to cut the mustard with them, especially if they weren’t behind his appointment in the first place.

I’ll always love David Gray for all he’s done for the club and how he played for us, not just that cup final, his appointment is a bad fit for us as a club just now though imo. He should have been sent away to build a coaching and managerial career in his own right similar to Scott Brown, if he had done that and was good at it he’d have found his way back here eventually, if he wasn’t good enough to do that, he’s not good enough for the top job now.

He's very new to being a manager, the way he wants the team to play will change over time. He needs time and our full support.

[bingo70]

He's very new to being a manager, the way he wants the team to play will change over time. He needs time and our full support.

Surely having the team over the summer and a transfer window was the opportunity to implement a style of play?

What’s going to change in the future?

The idea that a manager will get enough time to just not bother with a strategy at first and try to implement one at some undefined period in the future is just never going to happen.

The only way he’s going to get the time he wants and maybe needs if he tries to implement his ideas early and we can see what we’re trying to do.

Working hard and hoping we can win second balls isn’t going to get him time if we continue to not pick up many points I’m afraid.

[Ribs1875]

Aye keeping Hanlon another year would have helped us scoring goals right enough !

We might not have conceded at the rate we have and dropped points in the dying minutes of games! There are goals in our team. Maybe not as much as we would like, however we are equally as culpable for giving away too many cheap goals. I'd rather have kept Hanlon who would at least featured in the team from time to time. Instead we let him go and signed Iredale, who has never kicked a ball for us.

[NC1875]

He's very new to being a manager, the way he wants the team to play will change over time. He needs time and our full support.

The only way to get time as a football manager is to win games. And it’s clear for anyone with eyes that Gray doesn’t know how to do that.

Beaten by Kelty Hearts and one win in nine and second bottom of the league. You can’t keep giving time when the end results the same. Slow, boring crap football.

David Gray will never manage a club at this level again in his lifetime. He’s winged it into the job because of a goal he scored 8 years ago.

He’s been a failure as a coach since day one and somehow ends up with the top job. Only at Hibs

[NC1875]

We might not have conceded at the rate we have and dropped points in the dying minutes of games! There are goals in our team. Maybe not as much as we would like, however we are equally as culpable for giving away too many cheap goals. I'd rather have kept Hanlon who would at least featured in the team from time to time. Instead we let him go and signed Iredale, who has never kicked a ball for us.

The same Hanlon who conceded plenty soft late goals last season and throughout his career 🤔

[blackpoolhibs]

If his style is to launch the ball long ALL THE BLOODY TIME, then he's got it off to a T.

If he wants to play football out from the back, then Ohora, Ekpetita and Miller will never ever be good enough to impliment that.

Either way its a sheite situation and poor poor tactics and planning in my opinion.:rolleyes:

The man has been at the club for years, saw what was happening and has come up with this tripe.:panic::boo hoo:

[Trinity Hibee]

The only way to get time as a football manager is to win games. And it’s clear for anyone with eyes that Gray doesn’t know how to do that.

Beaten by Kelty Hearts and one win in nine and second bottom of the league. You can’t keep giving time when the end results the same. Slow, boring crap football.

David Gray will never manage a club at this level again in his lifetime. He’s winged it into the job because of a goal he scored 8 years ago.

He’s been a failure as a coach since day one and somehow ends up with the top job. Only at Hibs

I think you are right he won’t get another job at this level. Surely earning your stripes further down the leagues is at least a minimum requirement for the Hibs job. Not having any managerial experience before reaching Hibs job shouldn’t be happening. It wouldn’t happen in any other organisation

[J-C]

Gray should've dropped down a league or 2 to start his managerial career, his inexperience is showing up and I don't want him just learning on the job at this club. We needed an experienced manager after Monty, not an even greener rookie, its a shambles.

[BoomtownHibees]

We might not have conceded at the rate we have and dropped points in the dying minutes of games! There are goals in our team. Maybe not as much as we would like, however we are equally as culpable for giving away too many cheap goals. I'd rather have kept Hanlon who would at least featured in the team from time to time. Instead we let him go and signed Iredale, who has never kicked a ball for us.

“There are goals in our team”

Lowest scorers in the league

[Smartie]

“There are goals in our team”

Lowest scorers in the league

My biggest criticism of Gray and this team is that I have absolutely no idea where the goals are going to come from.

Players who in paper look like they should carry a threat but who just don’t.

[Trinity Hibee]

My biggest criticism of Gray and this team is that I have absolutely no idea where the goals are going to come from.

Players who in paper look like they should carry a threat but who just don’t.

To me that’s because there is no agreed pattern of play. That’s quite easy to spot when watching games anyway so not telling people any to info they don’t already know.

We have players who should be able to score goals but aren’t.

[BoomtownHibees]

My biggest criticism of Gray and this team is that I have absolutely no idea where the goals are going to come from.

Players who in paper look like they should carry a threat but who just don’t.

For me its partly down to having no creativity in the middle of the park. Everything we do is to try and get balls out wide and then hopeless crosses into the box. Or use a Miller long throw

[blackpoolhibs]

To me that’s because there is no agreed pattern of play. That’s quite easy to spot when watching games anyway so not telling people any to info they don’t already know.

We have players who should be able to score goals but aren’t.

To have pattern of play, you need players who are comfortable on the ball, who have the ability to control a ball quickly move it with pace and have players capable of recieving that ball and strong enough to hold of their marker make good passes and move into spaces to do the same again.

Come on, we dont have urgency, pace or ability to do any of that, and those players you say should be able to score goals dont, so we dont have them, we have very average to poor forwards.

[Ribs1875]

Lowest scorers in the league because the tactics and shape are rotten. There are seasoned pros such as Boyle, Gayle and Hoilett. Miko has goals in him as does Youan.

[Smartie]

For me its partly down to having no creativity in the middle of the park. Everything we do is to try and get balls out wide and then hopeless crosses into the box. Or use a Miller long throw

The middle of the park definitely contributes.

I was thinking last night that it was more to do with Myko - a big, slow battering ram who offers little threat in behind. When Youan cuts in off the left Myko is often static, choking off space, and the only chance ends up being a speculative and poor shot from distance. Maybe not a coincidence that whilst his finishing may have been poor, we created more with Gayle up front at the weekend?

As for our long throws… launch into the box, Myko loses first ball then nobody nearby to win the second… rinse and repeat. When you compare it to Hearts managing to win 3 headers in our box late on on Sunday it really has you tearing your hair out. The throw itself should be a threat but repeatedly launching it at static players, repeatedly creating nothing… it is driving me mad.

451 with Myko as the focal point is the problem for me. I think we either need to find a way to get him a partner and for them to properly play as a pair or start Gayle again.

[Carheenlea]

To have pattern of play, you need players who are comfortable on the ball, who have the ability to control a ball quickly move it with pace and have players capable of recieving that ball and strong enough to hold of their marker make good passes and move into spaces to do the same again.

Come on, we dont have urgency, pace or ability to do any of that, and those players you say should be able to score goals dont, so we dont have them, we have very average to poor forwards.

The reason we’re having to resort to shelling balls from one end of the pitch to the other is exactly because of this void within the team.

And we haven’t suddenly found ourselves with this major flaw, it’s an area we’ve needed to prioritise for years, but consistent fail to do so. The only one there who may have the attributes for this is Levitt, but it’s not like he’s not been tried before.

It’s a case of just preparing for the ariel bombardment again this Sunday. Can’t wait!

[Unseen work]

To have pattern of play, you need players who are comfortable on the ball, who have the ability to control a ball quickly move it with pace and have players capable of recieving that ball and strong enough to hold of their marker make good passes and move into spaces to do the same again.

Come on, we dont have urgency, pace or ability to do any of that, and those players you say should be able to score goals dont, so we dont have them, we have very average to poor forwards.

Aberdeen have the lads Rubezic at centre half. Last season he was absolutely brutal and a bombscare on and off the ball

They have Shayden Morrison on the wing who looked absolutely shocking and offered zero threat. He’s now creating tons of chances, getting assists and got a goal last night.


Johnson somehow managed to get Myk, Boyle, Youan and Campbell scoring regularly, Hoillett was scoring/assisting regularly for Aberdeen last season, why can’t Gray?

Because he has absolutely no idea how to get his forward players into the game.

Again on Aberdeen, when they play short it’s one or two passes and then into the midfield who turn and find the forwards early, when they’re in space and can be direct and creative.

We play about 20 passes at the back, go back to Bursik who walks forward with the ball which closes the gap for the midfielders and attackers before either playing out to Marv or Ekpiteta, or going long to Myk who has no others supporting him.

Kwon, Triantis and Newell all have the ability to turn on the ball and play forward with intensity.

[Callum_62]

To have pattern of play, you need players who are comfortable on the ball, who have the ability to control a ball quickly move it with pace and have players capable of recieving that ball and strong enough to hold of their marker make good passes and move into spaces to do the same again.

Come on, we dont have urgency, pace or ability to do any of that, and those players you say should be able to score goals dont, so we dont have them, we have very average to poor forwards.Of course we do

It might not work every time but we are literally looking so devoid of anything under Gray

I know it can take sometimeS but you can't see anything on the ball that shows any progression at all

Monty was slaughtered and yes, sometimes the football was a hard watch but you could still see what we were trying to do with the ball

It genuinely feels like we are either hoping for a set piece goal or a piece of individual quality to get us a goal

There's no way the team should be as poor as we are showing and for me that's on Gray and the management team





Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

[Jones28]

Lowest scorers in the league because the tactics and shape are rotten. There are seasoned pros such as Boyle, Gayle and Hoilett. Miko has goals in him as does Youan.

Where? It would be a great time for him to get his goals out his ****ing suitcase.

[Sioux]

True, however leaders do. It can't be denied Obita was consistent and lead by example last season.

A change of captain won't make a blind bit of difference. The obsession some folk on here about the captain issue is playground stuff.

[easty]

Gray should've dropped down a league or 2 to start his managerial career, his inexperience is showing up and I don't want him just learning on the job at this club. We needed an experienced manager after Monty, not an even greener rookie, its a shambles.

:agree:

At our level you shouldn't be on a training project as our manager, it's for the same reason that we send our young players out on loan to the lower divisions, to learn the game and get experience. If you're not ready, then you shouldn't be here. We've given the managers job to a guy with no experience and who doesn't even have the coaching badges yet. His whole coaching career has been as part of a failing Hibs backroom team. The only thing that went in his favour to get this job was that he's David Gray.

[easty]

A change of captain won't make a blind bit of difference. The obsession some folk on here about the captain issue is playground stuff.

The mythical captains armband. I've never understood why so many folk think that moving it from Newells arm to O'Hora or Obita or anyone else will make any difference whatsoever. It's just an armband. The players are the same with it or without it.

[The Modfather]

Aberdeen have the lads Rubezic at centre half. Last season he was absolutely brutal and a bombscare on and off the ball

They have Shayden Morrison on the wing who looked absolutely shocking and offered zero threat. He’s now creating tons of chances, getting assists and got a goal last night.


Johnson somehow managed to get Myk, Boyle, Youan and Campbell scoring regularly, Hoillett was scoring/assisting regularly for Aberdeen last season, why can’t Gray?

Because he has absolutely no idea how to get his forward players into the game.

Again on Aberdeen, when they play short it’s one or two passes and then into the midfield who turn and find the forwards early, when they’re in space and can be direct and creative.

We play about 20 passes at the back, go back to Bursik who walks forward with the ball which closes the gap for the midfielders and attackers before either playing out to Marv or Ekpiteta, or going long to Myk who has no others supporting him.

Kwon, Triantis and Newell all have the ability to turn on the ball and play forward with intensity.

In fleeting glimpses, but it’s not the strong point to their game, or a natural attribute IMO. As we saw last night, a good 15 minutes of doing just that from Newell but offset against the 50 or 60 minutes of drifting through the game. It’s the same for the others. Kwon, Triantis, Newell, Hoilett, Campbell, JDH, Levit, NMW. One big collection of nothingness. Easy to argue a case for some individually, near impossible to make a case any are the answer and who we should build around though.

[B.H.F.C]

Aberdeen have the lads Rubezic at centre half. Last season he was absolutely brutal and a bombscare on and off the ball

They have Shayden Morrison on the wing who looked absolutely shocking and offered zero threat. He’s now creating tons of chances, getting assists and got a goal last night.


Johnson somehow managed to get Myk, Boyle, Youan and Campbell scoring regularly, Hoillett was scoring/assisting regularly for Aberdeen last season, why can’t Gray?

Because he has absolutely no idea how to get his forward players into the game.

Again on Aberdeen, when they play short it’s one or two passes and then into the midfield who turn and find the forwards early, when they’re in space and can be direct and creative.

We play about 20 passes at the back, go back to Bursik who walks forward with the ball which closes the gap for the midfielders and attackers before either playing out to Marv or Ekpiteta, or going long to Myk who has no others supporting him.

Kwon, Triantis and Newell all have the ability to turn on the ball and play forward with intensity.

Aberdeen manager has went in and implemented his own way. The signings they have made, have been made to fit that way of playing. He’s also improved every single player he inherited. Not enough managers do that these days, it’s always about them getting their own players. Do your job and make the ones you have better.

I don’t think our squad is brilliant, far from it. But there is no way Gray is getting anywhere near the maximum out of them. We have a collection of individual players, some of who are actually decent, but the manager has no idea how to make them a team.

[Unseen work]

In fleeting glimpses, but it’s not the strong point to their game, or a natural attribute IMO. As we saw last night, a good 15 minutes of doing just that from Newell last night but offset against the 50 or 60 minutes of drifting through the game. It’s the same for the others. Kwon, Triantis, Newell, Hoilett, Campbell, JDH, Levit, NMW. One big collection of nothingness. Easy to argue a case for some individually, near impossible to make a case any are the answer and who we should build around though.

I think they could, if the team was instructed to do so and set up in a way where it made it easier for them.

All of them are good technically, composed and can play a pass imo.

They might not dominate every minute of the game, but I don’t think they need to.

Again look at Aberdeen and their possession stats, it’s low but it’s because when they have the ball they play with intensity and go forward, that intensity then rubs off on them and the opposition when they don’t have it as they press all over the pitch.

[Since452]

Gray should've dropped down a league or 2 to start his managerial career, his inexperience is showing up and I don't want him just learning on the job at this club. We needed an experienced manager after Monty, not an even greener rookie, its a shambles.

It really is a sad state of affairs. When Gray inevitably goes I hope it's left to the Black Knights to appoint a new manager.

[USA_Hibee]

Gray should've dropped down a league or 2 to start his managerial career, his inexperience is showing up and I don't want him just learning on the job at this club. We needed an experienced manager after Monty, not an even greener rookie, its a shambles.

I love SDG, wish him well at Hibs and hope he turns it around.

I agree with you though. I think there is a lot to learn from getting out of your comfort zone. All he knows from his coaching time is Hibs. I don't think that's good for anyone. Just my opinion though and I hope he turns it around.

[J-C]

We have wingers that struggle to beat a man, strikers that struggle to score, players that can't press or pass and a defence that have a brain fart too often. Add in a rookie manager and coaching staff and we have recipe for relegation.

[Scotty Leither]

Aberdeen manager has went in and implemented his own way. The signings they have made, have been made to fit that way of playing. He’s also improved every single player he inherited. Not enough managers do that these days, it’s always about them getting their own players. Do your job and make the ones you have better.

I don’t think our squad is brilliant, far from it. But there is no way Gray is getting anywhere near the maximum out of them. We have a collection of individual players, some of who are actually decent, but the manager has no idea how to make them a team.

They signed the boy Devlin at RB, a player I suggested on here as a signing target and was shot down by some. They also signed a decent GK.

Both these players should have been in our sights but nah, let’s persevere with the same transfer “policy” that’s in danger of taking us down.

I really hope this recent meeting in Vegas was meaningful to the point where massive changes are on the way in January, starting with the removal of Mackay and a large turnover of directors, a new coaching team too.

[Heisenberg]

I do remember in one of the early training videos they put up Gray was really stressing to Newell about turning on the ball and playing forward quicker. There’s absolutely no evidence of that in our play now. Butcheresque stuff on display recently

[Smartie]

I do remember in one of the early training videos they put up Gray was really stressing to Newell about turning on the ball and playing forward quicker. There’s absolutely no evidence of that in our play now. Butcheresque stuff on display recently

He actually had a brilliant first 20 minutes or so to start the second half last night - when he was doing just that.

On the telly Newell got up very slowly and looked in a lot of discomfort a few minutes before he was taken off so may have been injured, albeit he still managed to make a decent contribution a couple of times between the injury and going off.

[Bobby's Cinema]

They signed the boy Devlin at RB, a player I suggested on here as a signing target and was shot down by some. They also signed a decent GK.

Both these players should have been in our sights but nah, let’s persevere with the same transfer “policy” that’s in danger of taking us down.

I really hope this recent meeting in Vegas was meaningful to the point where massive changes are on the way in January, starting with the removal of Mackay and a large turnover of directors, a new coaching team too.
I don't think we have stuck with the same policy. But either way it's still not worked. We've had an absolute nightmare of a window.

Surely we can identify 'is this player better than what we have yes or no'. We seem to be absolutely fundamentally incapable of this in recent years. More bloating of the squad. More guys are aren't good enough/ fit enough to contribute. Total lack of options/ accountability for anyone not performing.

I would stick with Gray until the new year regardless. But I do think another manager could do more with us. It might not make much sense but I stand with the manager.

[K-Zazu]

Aberdeen only had one more shot on target than us when they played them .. just saying.

Eh? What?

[Paulie Walnuts]

Eh? What?

Aberdeen had 150% of the shots on target we had. They also won the game. It’s pretty much the same as having less shots and drawing don’t ya know. :agree:

[Slim Shady]

I don't think we have stuck with the same policy. But either way it's still not worked. We've had an absolute nightmare of a window.

Surely we can identify 'is this player better than what we have yes or no'. We seem to be absolutely fundamentally incapable of this in recent years. More bloating of the squad. More guys are aren't good enough/ fit enough to contribute. Total lack of options/ accountability for anyone not performing.

I would stick with Gray until the new year regardless. But I do think another manager could do more with us. It might not make much sense but I stand with the manager.

That would see us relegated then?

[Bushwoof]

I don't think we have stuck with the same policy. But either way it's still not worked. We've had an absolute nightmare of a window.

Surely we can identify 'is this player better than what we have yes or no'. We seem to be absolutely fundamentally incapable of this in recent years. More bloating of the squad. More guys are aren't good enough/ fit enough to contribute. Total lack of options/ accountability for anyone not performing.

I would stick with Gray until the new year regardless. But I do think another manager could do more with us. It might not make much sense but I stand with the manager.
I'm not sure that's entirely fair. The McCowan debacle was bad, but Kwon and Triantis are genuinely good players who have improved the team, and Ekpiteta is starting to convince also. Even Bursik may prove to be an improvement on Marshall in time - he earned us a point last night, which Marshall didn't often do last season. We all love SDG, but he should be doing better with what we have. I hope he can.

[CallumHibs07]

That's not what he said but bash on.

Going out his way to put a positive spin on a draw pretty much shows he thinks its a decent result. Not really difficult to understand

[Donegal Hibby]

Aberdeen had 150% of the shots on target we had. They also won the game. It’s pretty much the same as having less shots and drawing don’t ya know. :agree:

For 97 minutes it was 0-0 though.

[Paulie Walnuts]

For 97 minutes it was 0-0 though.

:faf:

And in the 98th minute it was 1-0. That’s what matters.

[flash]

Making a point about a draw being "not bad" is pretty much the same thing. Why didn't he come out and say its a poor result otherwise?

You need to watch the interview to acquire context to his remarks.

[blackpoolhibs]

For 97 minutes it was 0-0 though.

FFS did the cup final end 2-2?:faf:

[Donegal Hibby]

:faf:

And in the 98th minute it was 1-0. That’s what matters.

Of course though for 97 minutes a team that’s flying in the league almost ended up with the same result as us , as did the champions only for a late winner too .. fine margins I know though what are we doing? .. moaning about it being a bad result :rolleyes:

[Groathillgrump]

Aberdeen only had one more shot on target than us when they played them .. just saying.

Do you post nonsense like this just to get a reaction? :rolleyes:

[Trinity Hibee]

Of course though for 97 minutes a team that’s flying in the league almost ended up with the same result as us , as did the champions only for a late winner too .. fine margins I know though what are we doing? .. moaning about it being a bad result :rolleyes:

Aberdeen win games late on, we lose or draw them. Repeating that patterns leads to very different outcomes as we are seeing this season in the league table

I’m really not sure what you are trying to prove with this one.

[Donegal Hibby]

Aberdeen win games late on, we lose or draw them. Repeating that patterns leads to very different outcomes as we are seeing this season in the league table

I’m really not sure what you are trying to prove with this one.

The point I’m making is if a team that’s got a lot more quality than us or one that’s flying in the league struggle to win until the 88 minute or late in injury time then I don’t think a draw is as bad as some are trying to make out it is …

And your right Aberdeen have been winning games late while we have been losing or drawing them which makes keeping a clean sheet a plus too .

Anyhow can’t be looking at a draw away from home , clean sheet , unbeaten in two games as something that’s not bad as that will never do for some ( present company excluded ) as they would much rather moan about it ! .

[NC1875]

The point I’m making is if a team that’s got a lot more quality than us or one that’s flying in the league struggle to win until the 88 minute or late in injury time then I don’t think a draw is as bad as some are trying to make out it is …

And your right Aberdeen have been winning games late while we have been losing or drawing them which makes keeping a clean sheet a plus too .

Anyhow can’t be looking at a draw away from home , clean sheet , unbeaten in two games as something that’s not bad as that will never do for some ( present company excluded ) as they would much rather moan about it ! .

😂😂😂 what a load of nonsense.

We are bottom and they’re top but it’s a good result because they and Celtic were drawing with Ross county as well at some point in the game 🙈

with our resources a draw with Ross County should NEVER be classed as a good result.

[JimBHibees]

😂😂😂 what a load of nonsense.

We are bottom and they’re top but it’s a good result because they and Celtic were drawing with Ross county as well at some point in the game 🙈

with our resources a draw with Ross County should NEVER be classed as a good result.

Don’t think anyone including Gray is saying it was a good result. Wasn't a bad result given how stuffy they are there and our record

[JimBHibees]

That would see us relegated then?

Don’t think it would

[NC1875]

Don’t think anyone including Gray is saying it was a good result. Wasn't a bad result given how stuffy they are there and our record

Donegal is telling us it’s a good result. No wonder we’re so crap. Accept mediocrity throughout the whole club.

A draw with Ross County should never be accepted and classed a good result.

Some people thought Gray would change the loser mentality. Hes now embracing it.

He needs to go

[easty]

Donegal is telling us it’s a good result. No wonder we’re so crap. Accept mediocrity throughout the whole club.

A draw with Ross County should never be accepted and classed a good result.

Some people thought Gray would change the loser mentality. Hes now embracing it.

He needs to go

Donegal?

[Unseen work]

See if we were in good form, 4th in the league, winning games etc and went to Ross County on a Wednesday night and came away with a draw.

I’d probably come away saying it’s a not bad point, keeps momentum going etc

But going into the game we were bottom of the league with one win in 10 (including Celtic cup game). For me this then turned into a must win to get off the bottom of the league and get points on the board and try get a bit of confidence

We failed to do that and that’s why imo it’s a bad result

[Paulie Walnuts]

Of course though for 97 minutes a team that’s flying in the league almost ended up with the same result as us , as did the champions only for a late winner too .. fine margins I know though what are we doing? .. moaning about it being a bad result :rolleyes:

Genuinely starting to question whether you’re trolling now.

[Callum_62]

Some people thought Gray would change the loser mentality. Hes now embracing it.


Is he?

In what way is he embracing a loser mentality?


Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

[Lago]

There is nothing happening at ER that convinces me there will be any improvement in results,can't see Gray and the rest of the coaches going anywhere as it would be too much of an embarrassment for Malky,Ben & Co.

[Centre Hawf]

The point I’m making is if a team that’s got a lot more quality than us or one that’s flying in the league struggle to win until the 88 minute or late in injury time then I don’t think a draw is as bad as some are trying to make out it is …

And your right Aberdeen have been winning games late while we have been losing or drawing them which makes keeping a clean sheet a plus too .

Anyhow can’t be looking at a draw away from home , clean sheet , unbeaten in two games as something that’s not bad as that will never do for some ( present company excluded ) as they would much rather moan about it ! .

Your point about it being not a bad draw and clean sheet would genuinely hold better weight if we weren't glued to the bottom of the league going into the game and had only won 1 league game this season so far. Because I do agree it's not the easiest of trips at times, but we can say that about any away fixture at this point and make excuses as to why a draw is good.

Unless the context is we're one of the favourites to get relegated and it's viewed within the prism of survival in the league it's hard to muster any enthusiasm for the result at all.

[flash]

Donegal is telling us it’s a good result. No wonder we’re so crap. Accept mediocrity throughout the whole club.

A draw with Ross County should never be accepted and classed a good result.

Some people thought Gray would change the loser mentality. Hes now embracing it.

He needs to go

What a strange post.

Because one poster is saying last night was a good result the manager is "embracing a loser mentality"?

Respectfully that's ludicrous.

[21May16]

I don't think anyone could have any sound reasoning whatsoever to argue SDG is anything but well out his depth at this level. Not that I focus the blame on him.

[NC1875]

What a strange post.

Because one poster is saying last night was a good result the manager is "embracing a loser mentality"?

Respectfully that's ludicrous.

He’s certainly done nothing to change the loser mentality, has he ?

He’s made it worse.

[B.H.F.C]

What a strange post.

Because one poster is saying last night was a good result the manager is "embracing a loser mentality"?

Respectfully that's ludicrous.

I’ve been quite clear that I don’t think Gray is going to improve things but I don’t think he said much wrong last night. He said it wasn’t a bad result and I agree. Not a brilliant result, but not a disaster.

It’s fine talking about mentality and standards and whatever else but we don’t have any of that. Bottom line is we have a poor side and a poor manager. In the current circumstances it was an all right point albeit a terrible game/performance. We came back down the road better off than when we went up and I can’t remember coming back down from there with a win too often, when watching better Hibs sides than this one.

[chrisski33]

The point I’m making is if a team that’s got a lot more quality than us or one that’s flying in the league struggle to win until the 88 minute or late in injury time then I don’t think a draw is as bad as some are trying to make out it is …

And your right Aberdeen have been winning games late while we have been losing or drawing them which makes keeping a clean sheet a plus too .

Anyhow can’t be looking at a draw away from home , clean sheet , unbeaten in two games as something that’s not bad as that will never do for some ( present company excluded ) as they would much rather moan about it ! .

Go and troll on another forum...

[eastmainsmsh]

With Gray all the way but he has been thrown right in its not his fault to be fair time will tell

[flash]

I’ve been quite clear that I don’t think Gray is going to improve things but I don’t think he said much wrong last night. He said it wasn’t a bad result and I agree. Not a brilliant result, but not a disaster.

It’s fine talking about mentality and standards and whatever else but we don’t have any of that. Bottom line is we have a poor side and a poor manager. In the current circumstances it was an all right point albeit a terrible game/performance. We came back down the road better off than when we went up and I can’t remember coming back down from there with a win too often, when watching better Hibs sides than this one.

He is simply the wrong manager at this point in time. We needed someone with experience and a sense of calm.

[expresso]

To return to thread title - yes of course he is he's been in and around various previous management teams that absolutely stunk the place out.
It’s worth noting that no other club showed any interest in appointing him as manager in recent years.
An absolute hero for 2016 which will ensure his perpetual legend status but no one honestly was excited with his protracted appointment and thought ‘here we go!’

[blackpoolhibs]

He is simply the wrong manager at this point in time. We needed someone with experience and a sense of calm.

In a nutshell. :agree:

Yet here we are, the same people above in charge appointing new people (McKay) making the same mistakes. :rolleyes:

[Jones28]

He’s certainly done nothing to change the loser mentality, has he ?

He’s made it worse.

With respect, you and I know jack **** about what has gone on, what has worked and what hasn't.

Losers mentality etc is an easy thing to level at a team that isn't winning games but IMO it's not mentality that has seen us drop points, it's errors.

Making a mistake doesn't make someone mentally weak or fragile. Case in point Bursic, made some howlers, persevered and won us a point last night, keeping a clean sheet in the process.

Likewise Marv, shaky start and looked a bit of a clogger yet last night was his best performance of the season.

Miller too, who was awful in lots of ways against Hearts had a solid game last night and helped keep a clean sheet.

This team has its flaws but IMO having a poor mentality isn't one of them.

[21May16]

With respect, you and I know jack **** about what has gone on, what has worked and what hasn't.

Losers mentality etc is an easy thing to level at a team that isn't winning games but IMO it's not mentality that has seen us drop points, it's errors.

Making a mistake doesn't make someone mentally weak or fragile. Case in point Bursic, made some howlers, persevered and won us a point last night, keeping a clean sheet in the process.

Likewise Marv, shaky start and looked a bit of a clogger yet last night was his best performance of the season.

Miller too, who was awful in lots of ways against Hearts had a solid game last night and helped keep a clean sheet.

This team has its flaws but IMO having a poor mentality isn't one of them.

The mentality of the coaching team and players on Sunday cost us the win.

[easty]

To return to thread title - yes of course he is he's been in and around various previous management teams that absolutely stunk the place out.
It’s worth noting that no other club showed any interest in appointing him as manager in recent years.
An absolute hero for 2016 which will ensure his perpetual legend status but no one honestly was excited with his protracted appointment and thought ‘here we go!’

I don't think that is worth noting. Means nothing.

If a club had showed an interest in appointing him would that have made him any better on paper?

[Jones28]

The mentality of the coaching team and players on Sunday cost us the win.

Not sure I agree with that. They made subs and fitted square pegs in round holes to keep the same shape - NMW playing wide left for example.

We lost a point because we didn't defend a set piece well enough at one end and missed a guilt edged chance to go 2-0 up at the other.

Out of the attacking options left on the bench we had Molotnikov and McKirdy - one of whom is a boy and the other just attracts criticism whenever he steps foot on the pitch.

[21May16]

I don't think that is worth noting. Means nothing.

If a club had showed an interest in appointing him would that have made him any better on paper?

It's also incorrect. Ayr Utd were interested in SDG last season before they appointed Broony.

[Tyler Durden]

I think they could, if the team was instructed to do so and set up in a way where it made it easier for them.

All of them are good technically, composed and can play a pass imo.

They might not dominate every minute of the game, but I don’t think they need to.

Again look at Aberdeen and their possession stats, it’s low but it’s because when they have the ball they play with intensity and go forward, that intensity then rubs off on them and the opposition when they don’t have it as they press all over the pitch.

100% agreed.

It seemed clear at the outset that Gray was not going to have a possession based philosophy. That is fine if you are effective when you do have the ball or you can counter/transition quickly. Instead our approach seems to be hope for the best from set pieces.

We're not really placing any demands on the players as the game plan does not seem to value quick passing or trusting technical players to take the ball in difficult positions. Instead we hoof it into space.

[21May16]

Not sure I agree with that. They made subs and fitted square pegs in round holes to keep the same shape - NMW playing wide left for example.

We lost a point because we didn't defend a set piece well enough at one end and missed a guilt edged chance to go 2-0 up at the other.

Out of the attacking options left on the bench we had Molotnikov and McKirdy - one of whom is a boy and the other just attracts criticism whenever he steps foot on the pitch.

Fair play to disagree but if you look at our defensive subs, the likes of JDH, it was to see out the game. Our players retreated the final ten and there was no out ball at all, imo that's the attitude and mentality of the different benches and the teams. It wasn't just because we didn't defend the set piece well enough, it was all them and the likelihood in the end we would go on to concede. Even in the stands you could sense what was going to happen and again that's a mentality thing for me.

Molotnikov has been old enough to start against better teams than them and McKirdy gets on last night. They didn't on Sunday as the mentality was far too negative towards the end of the game despite losing what seems like hundreds of late goals over the last season or two.

[Chorley Hibee]

I'm not sure that's entirely fair. The McCowan debacle was bad, but Kwon and Triantis are genuinely good players who have improved the team, and Ekpiteta is starting to convince also. Even Bursik may prove to be an improvement on Marshall in time - he earned us a point last night, which Marshall didn't often do last season. We all love SDG, but he should be doing better with what we have. I hope he can.

I'm sorry, but I genuinely scratch my head and ask myself what game I'm watching when I hear people continually waxing lyrical about Triantis and Kwon.

I've seen almost nothing from them (Triantis especially) that warrants this level of praise from so many on here.

The centre of the park remains as big a joke as it's been for years, and the idea there's been some massive improvement with these two is just a fantasy.

[expresso]

I don't think that is worth noting. Means nothing.

If a club had showed an interest in appointing him would that have made him any better on paper?

Why do you think certain managers and players attract interest from other clubs?

Quality maybe?

[expresso]

It's also incorrect. Ayr Utd were interested in SDG last season before they appointed Broony.

That ‘rumour’ was totally debunked by people at Ayr

[Jones28]

Fair play to disagree but if you look at our defensive subs, the likes of JDH, it was to see out the game. Our players retreated the final ten and there was no out ball at all, imo that's the attitude and mentality of the different benches and the teams. It wasn't just because we didn't defend the set piece well enough, it was all them and the likelihood in the end we would go on to concede. Even in the stands you could sense what was going to happen and again that's a mentality thing for me.

Molotnikov has been old enough to start against better teams than them and McKirdy gets on last night. They didn't on Sunday as the mentality was far too negative towards the end of the game despite losing what seems like hundreds of late goals over the last season or two.

The problem for me is not the subs themselves, its the lack of depth in quality. We have a situation where our most expensive ever player is out on loan meaning we have 2 recognised strikers, so if you start them together and one of them has to come off you're either changing formation or putting a none-striker up front - sqaure pegs and round holes again.

McKirdy and Molotnikov came on last night and did absolutely nothing, in fact Molotnikov looked lost and got skinned way too easily for a chance for them.

I agree that the team dropped in prior to their goal at the weekend, but that happens to all teams in every league. I don't think we concede if firstly Bursic picks the ball up instead of flapping for it and secondly if we could somehow have won a header against the shortest player on the pitch.

[Donegal Hibby]

Donegal is telling us it’s a good result. No wonder we’re so crap. Accept mediocrity throughout the whole club.

A draw with Ross County should never be accepted and classed a good result.

Some people thought Gray would change the loser mentality. Hes now embracing it.

He needs to go

No I’m not …

I’ve never said it was a good result and I’m saying it’s a decent result considering there record at home in they haven’t been beaten to often and on the two occasions they have it’s taken two late goals to do so …

It’s certainly not as bad a result as some of you are making out it is which is the point I’m making …

If you get your wish and Gray goes who are you wanting then btw ?

[easty]

Why do you think certain managers and players attract interest from other clubs?

Quality maybe?

It's that same ***** logic that people try to use to say Hanlon and Stevenson were nae good. Just bollocks really.

[Donegal Hibby]

Genuinely starting to question whether you’re trolling now.

If you think that then there’s no point in having any future conversations with you :aok:

[21May16]

The problem for me is not the subs themselves, its the lack of depth in quality. We have a situation where our most expensive ever player is out on loan meaning we have 2 recognised strikers, so if you start them together and one of them has to come off you're either changing formation or putting a none-striker up front - sqaure pegs and round holes again.

McKirdy and Molotnikov came on last night and did absolutely nothing, in fact Molotnikov looked lost and got skinned way too easily for a chance for them.

I agree that the team dropped in prior to their goal at the weekend, but that happens to all teams in every league. I don't think we concede if firstly Bursic picks the ball up instead of flapping for it and secondly if we could somehow have won a header against the shortest player on the pitch.

I thought the subs indicated how we were going to go the remainder of the game, there was absolutely no positivity in them at all. There is a lack of depth in quality I agree, perhaps it's a game management issue then and don't completely blow your load with no alternatives late on, I don't know.

The did look lost, yeah but at the very least it would have given us an out ball and if that doesn't work at least there's a couple of their players that have to stay further back the pitch. The mentality was to drop deep and defend what we had despite recent history indicating it was a disaster waiting to happen. Totally agree the individual mistakes are equally to blame btw. I would argue against it happening to all teams either, it didn't even for Aberdeen last night and that was against a much better team, they still attacked the huns and for that they weren't bombarded and again I put that down to the difference in mentality.

[Jones28]

I thought the subs indicated how we were going to go the remainder of the game, there was absolutely no positivity in them at all. There is a lack of depth in quality I agree, perhaps it's a game management issue then and don't completely blow your load with no alternatives late on, I don't know.

The did look lost, yeah but at the very least it would have given us an out ball and if that doesn't work at least there's a couple of their players that have to stay further back the pitch. The mentality was to drop deep and defend what we had despite recent history indicating it was a disaster waiting to happen. Totally agree the individual mistakes are equally to blame btw. I would argue against it happening to all teams either, it didn't even for Aberdeen last night and that was against a much better team, they still attacked the huns and for that they weren't bombarded and again I put that down to the difference in mentality.

I don't disagree but it comes down to the depth of the squad again. If you haven't got the people to make attacking changes then what do you do? Make no subs even though the data is screaming at you to do so?

Aberdeen point is fair, though they're a team full of confidence - and rightly so. It's different when you're scrabbling around at the bottom of the table.

[Centre Hawf]

No I’m not …

I’ve never said it was a good result and I’m saying it’s a decent result considering there record at home in they haven’t been beaten to often and on the two occasions they have it’s taken two late goals to do so …

It’s certainly not as bad a result as some of you are making out it is , is the point I’m making …

If you get your wish and Gray goes who are you wanting then btw ?

Derek McInnes :greengrin

[21May16]

I don't disagree but it comes down to the depth of the squad again. If you haven't got the people to make attacking changes then what do you do? Make no subs even though the data is screaming at you to do so?

Aberdeen point is fair, though they're a team full of confidence - and rightly so. It's different when you're scrabbling around at the bottom of the table.

I would have went the two attackers on the bench even if deep down they would have been ineffective, especially when the alternative was JDH and M-W on the left wing....

All good mate, nice debating without chaos erupting :greengrin

[The Modfather]

Derek McInnes :greengrin

Killmarnock now into the top 6 and only 4 points off 4th after juggling Europe and their sendings off. Looking like it will be another good season for them.

I wonder if we could tempt McInness with the Black Knights running the football side and pitching their structure to him. He can point to his consistent success in our league and also point to helping develop guys like Maddison on loan so we can be trusted with the Bournemouth youngsters on the cusp of breaking through but in normal circumstances too good for our league. A proper and functioning football side, as well as the kind of budgets we have nowadays might tempt Mcinnes.

The same set up replacing Gray and all we can realistically attract are journeyman experienced managers like Johnson, where it’s 50/50 we get them doing a good job or churning through another club while making a living.

[21May16]

Killmarnock now into the top 6 and only 4 points off 4th after juggling Europe and their sendings off. Looking like it will be another good season for them.

I wonder if we could tempt McInness with the Black Knights running the football side and pitching their structure to him. He can point to his consistent success in our league and also point to helping develop guys like Maddison on loan so we can be trusted with the Bournemouth youngsters on the cusp of breaking through but in normal circumstances too good for our league. A proper and functioning football side, as well as the kind of budgets we have nowadays might tempt Mcinnes.

The same set up replacing Gray and all we can realistically attract are journeyman experienced managers like Johnson, where it’s 50/50 we get them doing a good job or churning through another club while making a living.

Would love McInness.

They style of football stuff is a load of guff too imo - is it any worse than Maloney? Monty? Now? He wouldn't be hounded because of the style of football at all - he would be hounded if the results were as ***** as the others mentioned.

[Centre Hawf]

Killmarnock now into the top 6 and only 4 points off 4th after juggling Europe and their sendings off. Looking like it will be another good season for them.

I wonder if we could tempt McInness with the Black Knights running the football side and pitching their structure to him. He can point to his consistent success in our league and also point to helping develop guys like Maddison on loan so we can be trusted with the Bournemouth youngsters on the cusp of breaking through but in normal circumstances too good for our league. A proper and functioning football side, as well as the kind of budgets we have nowadays might tempt Mcinnes.

The same set up replacing Gray and all we can realistically attract are journeyman experienced managers like Johnson, where it’s 50/50 we get them doing a good job or churning through another club while making a living.

I like what you're saying to be honest. I don't think DM would ever come here while Ben, Ian, Malky are all running/interfering the way they are. It's clear he prefers to be a bit more in control than he probably would be here at the moment.

But if as you say you put him in with the Black Knights working closely with him to discuss what he needs/wants I could see it working so much better than it currently is. For me someone like Derek McInnes would be a fantastic long term appointment for the club if the correct support structure is in place. I think he'd strike the right balance of making sure whatever team we have is able to compete properly while also being able to see a bigger picture that we'll likely always need to have under this current ownership situation.

Of course that's just my opinion and I know he isn't for everyone. For what it's worth like Aberdeen I'd be willing to trust the Black Knight's on appointing someone similar to Thielin, who that is though I honestly couldn't say.

[supermcginn]

Genuinely starting to question whether you’re trolling now.

I've been convinced for weeks he's paid by the club to try and put a positive spin on absolutely everything, no matter how ridiculous!

[Badge]

Donegal?

Oh yes please

[judas]

Gray is not out of his depth.

He will grow and develop if we let him.

Let’s get away from this expensive short term managerial lottery game and stick with our guy.

[B.H.F.C]

Gray is not out of his depth.

He will grow and develop if we let him.

Let’s get away from this expensive short term managerial lottery game and stick with our guy.

What is there to back that up other than blind hope?

[21May16]

Gray is not out of his depth.

He will grow and develop if we let him.

Let’s get away from this expensive short term managerial lottery game and stick with our guy.


Based on what? Genuinely intrigued to know where you gather the opinion he will grow and develop the team and what it's based on?

[Basildon Hibs]

I'm sorry, but I genuinely scratch my head and ask myself what game I'm watching when I hear people continually waxing lyrical about Triantis and Kwon.

I've seen almost nothing from them (Triantis especially) that warrants this level of praise from so many on here.

The centre of the park remains as big a joke as it's been for years, and the idea there's been some massive improvement with these two is just a fantasy.

Correct. Midfield had been soft as ***** and lacking in good tactical players for years.

👍

[Basildon Hibs]

I've been convinced for weeks he's paid by the club to try and put a positive spin on absolutely everything, no matter how ridiculous!

👍👊

[Nicho87]

I’m all for keeping gray, I was 100% monty out. But for me and I’ve said previously the board and recruitment team are the ones we should be after

On the footballing side.

Motherwell who beat us sit fourth have lost only less game than us.

Covering a few of these draws I trust gray to turn this round. Just hope the kamakazi board give him the time.

[Ribs1875]

It's safe to say there are many valid points being raised, with many difference in opinions. I think we can all agree the decision making by the hierarchy of the club has to be brought in question. All aspects of recruitment has been unacceptable for a long time. The only player I can think of that's been brought in during this regime and sold for a profit was Elias Melkersen. Considering the amount of players who have came and gone in that time shows us we are not longer scouting properly. Seems like agents are bringing the attention of their clients to us, but who knows.

What ever happens, it beats being a deluded hearts fan who go around giving themselves the title of "3rd biggest team in Scotland". Last I checked I didn't give a toss who came 3rd in any sporting event.

[Aldo]

I’m all for keeping gray, I was 100% monty out. But for me and I’ve said previously the board and recruitment team are the ones we should be after

On the footballing side.

Motherwell who beat us sit fourth have lost only less game than us.

Covering a few of these draws I trust gray to turn this round. Just hope the kamakazi board give him the time.

I don’t care about other clubs etc I care about Hibs.

We have 1 win in 10 this season, the football is horrendous and the longer we go without a win the harder it becomes to get a win.

I see zero improvement infact regression from
montyball.

There is no evidence to suggest he will turn this around. The last few weeks it’s been o this game is a must win game. Do we really want that. I don’t.

So when do you say enough is enough?!

We left it too late in the Duff Jimmy era and he went on a run of 1 win in 15. We are 1 in 10. I just don’t see when or where the next win is coming from.

If this was anyone bar SDG folk would be calling for the managers head.

Time for the BKG for me.

[SickBoy32]

I don’t care about other clubs etc I care about Hibs.

We have 1 win in 10 this season, the football is horrendous and the longer we go without a win the harder it becomes to get a win.

I see zero improvement infact regression from
montyball.

There is no evidence to suggest he will turn this around. The last few weeks it’s been o this game is a must win game. Do we really want that. I don’t.

So when do you say enough is enough?!

We left it too late in the Duff Jimmy era and he went on a run of 1 win in 15. We are 1 in 10. I just don’t see when or where the next win is coming from.

If this was anyone bar SDG folk would be calling for the managers head.

Time for the BKG for me.

The regression from Monty that you mention is quite simple, his name is Maolida.

We are a team with a glaring lack of any goal threat. Hoilett, and at times Boyle, are our only true danger men.

Should’ve got Nisbet in the summer.

Can’t understand folk thinking another roll of the dice for a new manager will fix it. Reality is, way too many of the current squad are really poor footballers.

If folk want to kick off at something, why not go after the real issue, and try and enact change at that level? Ie Kensell and Gordon.

[Aldo]

The regression from Monty that you mention is quite simple, his name is Maolida.

We are a team with a glaring lack of any goal threat. Hoilett, and at times Boyle, are our only true danger men.

Should’ve got Nisbet in the summer.

Can’t understand folk thinking another roll of the dice for a new manager will fix it. Reality is, way too many of the current squad are really poor footballers.

If folk want to kick off at something, why not go after the real issue, and try and enact change at that level? Ie Kensell and Gordon.

Boyle is done for me unless he steps it up and proves me wrong.

Nisbet was never ever coming back.

My previous posts on this matter cover the collective cluster **** to get us in this position. This includes Gray who should never have been appointed in the first place. His team, his selections, his tactics, his subs and his style.

I have seen zero evidence that Gray will take us where we need to be as a club. He said he wanted leaders and the right type of player, we have the opposite.

Yes we all want IG to step back and yes they’ve ****ed up but you cannot say allowing Gray to continue with his style will get us out of this mess. This the next game is huge tells the story.

Yes I hope he proves me and many others wrong but as I said I’d let the BKG take over the on field football operations and see where we go.

Cannot be any worse.

[PatHead]

Unfortunately one of our heroes is facing the sack, most of us could see it coming at the appointment but the club comes first. Maybe he should get someone with experience to give him a hand for a few months, he should give Alex McLeish a call and see if he's up for a mentoring roll till Christmas, he couldn't make it any worse.

Is that not what Mackay is meant to be doing?

[GreenCastle]

Myziane and Youan - goals and assists - big part of last season especially January onwards when Myziane scored 10 in 18.

Doubt any of our strikers will even get 10 this full season.

Myziane just scored 2 in Saudi league against Ronaldos team (but he wasn’t playing) Brazil back up keeper and Sadio Mane /Laportes team Al Nassar !

[Donegal Hibby]

Derek McInnes :greengrin

One of the bookies has him favourite for the Sevco Job .

[Trinity Hibee]

One of the bookies has him favourite for the Sevco Job .

He has rejected that job before I think eh? He might take it if offered as it could be his last chance but that’s not an appealing job as you won’t get close to Celtic and no funds available for players

[Crab apple]

Myziane and Youan - goals and assists - big part of last season especially January onwards when Myziane scored 10 in 18.

Doubt any of our strikers will even get 10 this full season.

Myziane just scored 2 in Saudi league against Ronaldos team (but he wasn’t playing) Brazil back up keeper and Sadio Mane /Laportes team Al Nassar !

We could really do with a Myziane type signing in January.

[21May16]

Myziane and Youan - goals and assists - big part of last season especially January onwards when Myziane scored 10 in 18.

Doubt any of our strikers will even get 10 this full season.

Myziane just scored 2 in Saudi league against Ronaldos team (but he wasn’t playing) Brazil back up keeper and Sadio Mane /Laportes team Al Nassar !

Monty came in from LJ, a team that wasn’t his or had time to mould into his and got instant results, a lot better than we are seeing now.

So the argument has to be was Monty better or was the players at the start of last season better than what we are left with and have recruited since then/in the summer?

[21May16]

He has rejected that job before I think eh? He might take it if offered as it could be his last chance but that’s not an appealing job as you won’t get close to Celtic and no funds available for players

He would be mad not to at least give it a go. Boyhood club and all that. Fail, get the payoff and wait for the Killie job again.

[Chorley Hibee]

We could really do with a Myziane type signing in January.

Well there's at least a million pound available from not signing McCowan.

It'll be interesting to see if we see any of that money spent in January.

[Paulie Walnuts]

He would be mad not to at least give it a go. Boyhood club and all that. Fail, get the payoff and wait for the Killie job again.

Not convinced Clement will be going anywhere. Is their board not largely interim appointments? If so I’m not convinced any of them will want to sack a manager at significant cost after a £17m loss has just been announced.

[Donegal Hibby]

He has rejected that job before I think eh? He might take it if offered as it could be his last chance but that’s not an appealing job as you won’t get close to Celtic and no funds available for players

Yeah , think he was smart not to then , wasn’t King there at that time ? . It’s a poisoned chalice of a job as Celtic are so far ahead now and as you say no funds available for players. Might be better staying where he is in truth.

[21May16]

Not convinced Clement will be going anywhere. Is their board not largely interim appointments? If so I’m not convinced any of them will want to sack a manager at significant cost after a £17m loss has just been announced.

Makes it even more mental they gave him a new contract in the summer knowing the losses.

Their board is almost as incompetent as ours.

[21May16]

Yeah , think he was smart not to then , wasn’t King there at that time ? . It’s a poisoned chalice of a job as Celtic are so far ahead now and as you say no funds available for players. Might be better staying where he is in truth.

His stock was on the rise then, he turned down another basket case in Sunderland at the same period too. I don’t think he foresaw it going downhill with the ungrateful Aberdeen supporters.
Huns are his team and the money will surpass anything else he will ever earn as a manager. The only reason he won’t go there would be to wait for the Scotland job in 18 months.

[Donegal Hibby]

His stock was on the rise then, he turned down another basket case in Sunderland at the same period too. I don’t think he foresaw it going downhill with the ungrateful Aberdeen supporters.
Huns are his team and the money will surpass anything else he will ever earn as a manager. The only reason he won’t go there would be to wait for the Scotland job in 18 months.

I’m not the guy’s biggest fan though don’t think he’s in any way stupid which is why I wonder with the way Sevco are right now and the gap between them and Celtic both team/ financially wise might he turn it down again.. money might come into it though…

Another thing is would most Scotland fans be happy and see him as a step up from Clarke ?

[21May16]

I’m not the guy’s biggest fan though don’t think he’s in any way stupid which is why I wonder with the way Sevco are right now and the gap between them and Celtic both team/ financially wise might he turn it down again.. money might come into it though…

Another thing is would most Scotland fans be happy and see him as a step up from Clarke ?

He’s not daft, it’s why, with nowhere else really to go bar Scotland he would be daft not to take the orange quid even if he does get sacked, there’s very little career progression for him at this point.

As for being a step up from Clarke, yes. And I like Steve Clarke. It will hopefully be Moyes though.

[James70]

I don't think that David Gray will be the long term answer unless he gets a better coaching team behind him. I do have confidence that he will keep us up. Bowie will be back in the New Year and we will have money to spend in January if required.

[He's here!]

The regression from Monty that you mention is quite simple, his name is Maolida.

We are a team with a glaring lack of any goal threat. Hoilett, and at times Boyle, are our only true danger men.

Should’ve got Nisbet in the summer.

Can’t understand folk thinking another roll of the dice for a new manager will fix it. Reality is, way too many of the current squad are really poor footballers.

If folk want to kick off at something, why not go after the real issue, and try and enact change at that level? Ie Kensell and Gordon.

Bowie looked a genuine goal threat. His injury was a big blow.

[21May16]

I don’t think the club will risk Bowie until next season.

[Since452]

Monty came in from LJ, a team that wasn’t his or had time to mould into his and got instant results, a lot better than we are seeing now.

So the argument has to be was Monty better or was the players at the start of last season better than what we are left with and have recruited since then/in the summer?

If instant results mean 3 wins in his first 10 games then yes. Better than Gray mind you. It wasn't much of a new manager bounce. I'm certain we'd have done the same or better if LJ hadn't been sacked.

[21May16]

If instant results mean 3 wins in his first 10 games then yes. Better than Gray mind you. It wasn't much of a new manager bounce. I'm certain we'd have done the same or better if LJ hadn't been sacked.

We lost one in 12 when he came in. There’s absolutely no danger of that happening at the moment and much much better than our results so far this season even if you take out the Kelty embarrassment.

[Crab apple]

I don’t think the club will risk Bowie until next season.

I agree it will be next season before we see a fully fit Bowie again.

[21May16]

I agree it will be next season before we see a fully fit Bowie again.

Unless we are in big trouble I’m comfortable with that and even then it would still be a risk for me.

[Unseen work]

He now has a worse win % than Jack Ross did at Dundee United

Ross only lasted 7 games

[Keith_M]

He now has a worse win % than Jack Ross did at Dundee United

Ross only lasted 7 games


I think losing 9-0 at home was a major difference.

Any manager would be out the door after that.

[Trinity Hibee]

He now has a worse win % than Jack Ross did at Dundee United

Ross only lasted 7 games

7 games is ridiculous when you think about it. Football management is mad isn’t it!

[TrinityHFC]

He now has a worse win % than Jack Ross did at Dundee United

Ross only lasted 7 games

There was a 7-0 and a 9-0 in there though.

[Smartie]

7 games is ridiculous when you think about it. Football management is mad isn’t it!

Sacking Ross after 7 games proved to be a resounding success for United - as they handed the same group of players over to new manager (the second of 3 they’d have that season) with no chance to change the squad for months, in a season that ended in relegation for them anyway.

Wonder if there are any lessons to be learned there?

[Trinity Hibee]

Sacking Ross after 7 games proved to be a resounding success for United - as they handed the same group of players over to new manager (the second of 3 they’d have that season) with no chance to change the squad for months, in a season that ended in relegation for them anyway.

Wonder if there are any lessons to be learned there?

Ye fair enough. Wasn’t suggesting JR shouldn’t have been sacked by DU, Just generally football management is chaos isn’t it. He was sacked 30th August.

It wouldn’t surprise me if we do sack Gray but at least he’ll have made it to November!

[Smartie]

Ye fair enough. Wasn’t suggesting JR shouldn’t have been sacked by DU, Just generally football management is chaos isn’t it. He was sacked 30th August.

It wouldn’t surprise me if we do sack Gray but at least he’ll have made it to November!

I get your point, it’s absolutely nuts.

Problem is, there often is a short term boost that comes with the “new manager bounce” so boards will always be tempted to react when fans start kicking off - arguably they have justification.

It’s really not the way to bring about sustainable, long-term results though and at some point we really need to ask ourselves when we’re going to break that cycle.

[TrinityHFC]

I get your point, it’s absolutely nuts.

Problem is, there often is a short term boost that comes with the “new manager bounce” so boards will always be tempted to react when fans start kicking off - arguably they have justification.

It’s really not the way to bring about sustainable, long-term results though and at some point we really need to ask ourselves when we’re going to break that cycle.

I think we do ask ourselves - then totally throw that out the window when trouble hits.

[Libby Hibby]

Gray is not out of his depth.

He will grow and develop if we let him.

Let’s get away from this expensive short term managerial lottery game and stick with our guy.

I so wanted him to do well but in the short time he’s been in charge, we have regressed, we play with no pace or purpose and if we don’t replace him soon then we’ll be relegated by February.

[eastmainsmsh]

Under current board what manager would come here its a shambles if Gray got sacked how many is that since Gordon's came 🤔

[Callum_62]

Under current board what manager would come here its a shambles if Gray got sacked how many is that since Gordon's came [emoji848]It's a shambles the guys who's won 1 in 10 in the league is sacked?

Not quite shambles territory for me - especially with the performances we are putting in



Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

[21May16]

Under current board what manager would come here its a shambles if Gray got sacked how many is that since Gordon's came 🤔

Every single one of their appointments of their own have been farcical.

[JimBHibees]

I don’t think the club will risk Bowie until next season.

Why not

[Cabbage-Patch]

Under current board what manager would come here its a shambles if Gray got sacked how many is that since Gordon's came 🤔

I'm hoping Black Knights will fully lead next manager hunt. I would hope they could offer some more credibility to the role. Ian Gordon and Kensall should be kept as far away from it as possible

[Real Emerald]

I'm hoping Black Knights will fully lead next manager hunt. I would hope they could offer some more credibility to the role. Ian Gordon and Kensall should be kept as far away from it as possible

If the BKs took over that responsibility then surely MM would have to go too? He chose Gray as the outstanding candidate along with the coaching team. He obviously had a hand in recent recruitment. It would make no sense prolonging his employment.

[21May16]

Why not

To protect the main asset the club has doing his hammy again. He won’t be anywhere near fit until February at the earliest.

[superfurryhibby]

To protect the main asset the club has doing his hammy again. He won’t be anywhere near fit until February at the earliest.

Bowie isn’t the main asset at the club.

[One Day Soon]

Bowie isn’t the main asset at the club.

There’s a main asset at the club?

[marinello59]

There’s a main asset at the club?

The fans.

[One Day Soon]

The fans.

I wish they’d think of protecting that asset.

[RIP]

If the BKs took over that responsibility then surely MM would have to go too? He chose Gray as the outstanding candidate along with the coaching team. He obviously had a hand in recent recruitment. It would make no sense prolonging his employment.

Who's to say David Gray wasn't the best candidate out of those who applied?

Every time the board sacks a manager, the pool of willing and able candidates shrinks further.

[Real Emerald]

Who's to say David Gray wasn't the best candidate out of those who applied?

Every time the board sacks a manager, the pool of willing and able candidates shrinks further.

David Gray and his team had no previous experience in the jobs they were being employed to do. No CV to go on, just a hunch on a really good guy who had been part of a failed regime over a number of seasons.

I like David Gray and think he’ll make a good manager in time but there’s no way MM can justify he was the best fit for the job unless as you say, the rest of the candidates were even less qualified? It was a bizarre and ridiculous decision to give him the job.

I still hope he can get results and pull us out of this mess as he’s a really decent guy who was thrown under the bus.

[Brizo]

I remain confident that SDG will turn things around. I also think he's benefiting from the fact that he is SDG and that our ownership having acquired the reputation of serial sackers know that every sacking just amplifies their incompetence in running the football side of things.

There will come a tipping point however and if we were bottom 2 at Christmas or become detached from the other teams before then , the ownership have a huge decision to make. The possibility of relegation would set alarm bells ringing and potentially playing in the Championship in our 150th season would be a disaster particularly as our owners seem to view that historic anniversary (as they do most things) mainly from a commercial viewpoint.

Learning on the job is far from ideal when you're following a succession of failed appointments and I'm hoping SDG can learn from the mistakes he has made in his short time in permanent charge.

[Since452]

I remain confident that SDG will turn things around. I also think he's benefiting from the fact that he is SDG and that our ownership having acquired the reputation of serial sackers know that every sacking just amplifies their incompetence in running the football side of things.

There will come a tipping point however and if we were bottom 2 at Christmas or become detached from the other teams before then , the ownership have a huge decision to make. The possibility of relegation would set alarm bells ringing and potentially playing in the Championship in our 150th season would be a disaster particularly as our owners seem to view that historic anniversary (as they do most things) mainly from a commercial viewpoint.

Learning on the job is far from ideal when you're following a succession of failed appointments and I'm hoping SDG can learn from the mistakes he has made in his short time in permanent charge.

Your last paragraph sums it up for me. After the Montgomery experiment we really needed an experienced manager to steady the ship. Not so someone with even less experience.

[bingo70]

Your last paragraph sums it up for me. After the Montgomery experiment we really needed an experienced manager to steady the ship. Not so someone with even less experience.

I don’t agree we needed someone with managerial experience.

We needed someone with a vision on how to play and build a squad around that.

Tony Mowbray never had experience but from his first friendly it was clear the way we wanted to play and we brought in players to play that way.

If Gray was to be sacked tomorrow and we replaced him with someone who has never been a manager before I’d be fine with that, I’d expect them to have more and better experience than 3rd in command for 4 failed managers though.

[The Modfather]

I don’t agree we needed someone with managerial experience.

We needed someone with a vision on how to play and build a squad around that.

Tony Mowbray never had experience but from his first friendly it was clear the way we wanted to play and we brought in players to play that way.

If Gray was to be sacked tomorrow and we replaced him with someone who has never been a manager before I’d be fine with that, I’d expect them to have more and better experience than 3rd in command for 4 failed managers though.

Agree with this. We do need an experienced manager to re-set the squad and, until the Black Knights get to run the football side, can manage upwards. However, in isolation, I generally want another young manager who is on the way up. Someone whose image of a team includes, pace, high tempo, drive from midfield and pressing. Who is also serious about giving youngsters an opportunity. Essentially another Mowbray. I’d be less keen on a Maloney type like the new generation, slow tempo, no drive and over focused on stats.

[Bushwoof]

Things aren't going as well under SDG so far as we'd have hoped, no question.

But before calling for his head, lets not forget that SDG played a huge, huge part in that great day in 2016. If that wasn't in the top 5 moments of your entire life then I'm not sure you can be a genuine hibby. While there's little room for sentiment in football, we seem to have forgotten too soon what contribution he has made to this club, and, much more than that, to all of our lives. I'd happily take 3 relegations in exchange for 21/5/16. Let's cut him some slack.

[easty]

Things aren't going as well under SDG so far as we'd have hoped, no question.

But before calling for his head, lets not forget that SDG played a huge, huge part in that great day in 2016. If that wasn't in the top 5 moments of your entire life then I'm not sure you can be a genuine hibby. While there's little room for sentiment in football, we seem to have forgotten too soon what contribution he has made to this club, and, much more than that, to all of our lives. I'd happily take 3 relegations in exchange for 21/5/16. Let's cut him some slack.

I'd sack him, thank him for what he done in 2016 a million times, then appoint a manager who doesn't get us relegated even once, never mind three times...

[21May16]

Agree with this. We do need an experienced manager to re-set the squad and, until the Black Knights get to run the football side, can manage upwards. However, in isolation, I generally want another young manager who is on the way up. Someone whose image of a team includes, pace, high tempo, drive from midfield and pressing. Who is also serious about giving youngsters an opportunity. Essentially another Mowbray. I’d be less keen on a Maloney type like the new generation, slow tempo, no drive and over focused on stats.

The problem is there’s not many genuine Mowbrays out there that implemented his style in the same way he talked about the game. Many coaches will talk a good game, SDG may have done the same then when it comes to it then it’s completely different. Johnson was one of them, the Gordon’s got completely suckered in with all his *****.

[McD]

Things aren't going as well under SDG so far as we'd have hoped, no question.

But before calling for his head, lets not forget that SDG played a huge, huge part in that great day in 2016. If that wasn't in the top 5 moments of your entire life then I'm not sure you can be a genuine hibby. While there's little room for sentiment in football, we seem to have forgotten too soon what contribution he has made to this club, and, much more than that, to all of our lives. I'd happily take 3 relegations in exchange for 21/5/16. Let's cut him some slack.


He’s playing a huge huge part in a disastrous season



I'd sack him, thank him for what he done in 2016 a million times, then appoint a manager who doesn't get us relegated even once, never mind three times...


Yes. The Scottish cup win shouldn’t play a part in evaluating his performance as manager. We need someone who can galvanise the squad and fan base, get us playing decent and more importantly winning football, all of which appears to be beyond Gray at the moment.

[NC1875]

Things aren't going as well under SDG so far as we'd have hoped, no question.

But before calling for his head, lets not forget that SDG played a huge, huge part in that great day in 2016. If that wasn't in the top 5 moments of your entire life then I'm not sure you can be a genuine hibby. While there's little room for sentiment in football, we seem to have forgotten too soon what contribution he has made to this club, and, much more than that, to all of our lives. I'd happily take 3 relegations in exchange for 21/5/16. Let's cut him some slack.

😂😂😂😂 genuinely don’t know if you’re taking the piss or not.

Gray will never be a successful Hibs manager, that doesn’t change because he scored a goal 8 years ago. Sentiment FC

Michael Oneil was at the Derby sitting next to David Marshall, get him in and thank Gray for trying but it’s never going to work.

[Groathillgrump]

Things aren't going as well under SDG so far as we'd have hoped, no question.

But before calling for his head, lets not forget that SDG played a huge, huge part in that great day in 2016. If that wasn't in the top 5 moments of your entire life then I'm not sure you can be a genuine hibby. While there's little room for sentiment in football, we seem to have forgotten too soon what contribution he has made to this club, and, much more than that, to all of our lives. I'd happily take 3 relegations in exchange for 21/5/16. Let's cut him some slack.

Sorry but scoring that goal doesn't absolve him from criticism as a manager.

Of course we'll always be grateful for his contribution to the cup win but now he has to be judged purely on results and things aren't looking too clever at the moment.

I really hope David turns things around but if performances and results don't pick up soon he'll face the chop just like any other manager. And rightly so.

[Since452]

The problem is there’s not many genuine Mowbrays out there that implemented his style in the same way he talked about the game. Many coaches will talk a good game, SDG may have done the same then when it comes to it then it’s completely different. Johnson was one of them, the Gordon’s got completely suckered in with all his *****.

I wish he was still our manager

[Onion]

Under current board what manager would come here its a shambles if Gray got sacked how many is that since Gordon's came 🤔

Sacking of SDG with Hibs at foot of table would trigger Foley & BKG, who made their position patently clear via BBC. If Gordon/ Kensell continue taking the lead in buggering up manager recruitment, you could sell tickets for a stream of that Board Meeting.

[Onion]

Sorry but scoring that goal doesn't absolve him from criticism as a manager.

Of course we'll always be grateful for his contribution to the cup win but now he has to be judged purely on results and things aren't looking too clever at the moment.

I really hope David turns things around but if performances and results don't pick up soon he'll face the chop just like any other manager. And rightly so.

Agreed. If this was your best pal, you'd already be having quiet word asking him if this is what he really wants. There's no way SDG can be enjoying this, and sometimes folk need savings from themselves. SDG needs to know that failing as a manager will not diminish what he did for this club back in May 16, and if he chose to walk away fans would understand. Any criticism would rightly be reserved for Gordon, Kensell, MM and the rest of Hibs Board who have hidden behind a Hibs Legend.

[hibeerealist]

Agreed. If this was your best pal, you'd already be having quiet word asking him if this is what he really wants. There's no way SDG can be enjoying this, and sometimes folk need savings from themselves. SDG needs to know that failing as a manager will not diminish what he did for this club back in May 16, and if he chose to walk away fans would understand. Any criticism would rightly be reserved for Gordon, Kensell, MM and the rest of Hibs Board who have hidden behind a Hibs Legend.


Unfortunately, SDG will not walk away - like virtually all managers he will be "mutualled" or fired, its how these things always end.

[Bushwoof]

Sorry but scoring that goal doesn't absolve him from criticism as a manager.

Of course we'll always be grateful for his contribution to the cup win but now he has to be judged purely on results and things aren't looking too clever at the moment.

I really hope David turns things around but if performances and results don't pick up soon he'll face the chop just like any other manager. And rightly so.
No, it doesn't, but for me it gives him enough goodwill to last to the end of the season, and if even we go down the level of disappointment would only be a tiny percentage of the elation at winning the cup in 2016. I feel I owe him that - if he was to choose to pack it in then fine, but to sack him would be a tragedy. It was bad enough with Sauzee - that diminished the club, however necessary it might have been, and to do the same to SDG would be far worse.

[Unseen work]

See on Gray and his style, I thought pre season/early cup competition it seems quite clear in that we would have a midfield of

Newell
NMW Campbell

With NMW and Campbell going really high to press the opposition and win it back. Albeit it was against much lower opposition it seemed to be effective

I find it weird that we’ve completely done away with that intensity/pressing

[Lago]

No, it doesn't, but for me it gives him enough goodwill to last to the end of the season, and if even we go down the level of disappointment would only be a tiny percentage of the elation at winning the cup in 2016. I feel I owe him that - if he was to choose to pack it in then fine, but to sack him would be a tragedy. It was bad enough with Sauzee - that diminished the club, however necessary it might have been, and to do the same to SDG would be far worse.
Oh well relegation will be OK as long as David Gray is still in charge, bizarre thinking.

[Bushwoof]

Oh well relegation will be OK as long as David Gray is still in charge, bizarre thinking.
Bizarre interpretation of what I wrote!

[Greenio]

I dont think hes out his depth

I think hes learning as he goes as eveyone should always be

Weve lost, but not badly

Ive more faith in Gray than i did the last managers weve had.

Hell get them winnings soon

[21May16]

Unfortunately, SDG will not walk away - like virtually all managers he will be "mutualled" or fired, its how these things always end.

And neither he should.

[NC1875]

I dont think hes out his depth

I think hes learning as he goes as eveyone should always be

Weve lost, but not badly

Ive more faith in Gray than i did the last managers weve had.

Hell get them winnings soon

If we were playing good football or we could see what he’s trying to do I’d tend to agree we’ll win eventually but we’re not.

The footballs crap and we’re not winning games. There’s nothing enjoyable about that and I doubt it’s suddenly going to change

[21May16]

I dont think hes out his depth

I think hes learning as he goes as eveyone should always be

Weve lost, but not badly

Ive more faith in Gray than i did the last managers weve had.

Hell get them winnings soon

What indication has the way the team is set up, the way we play and substitutes make you feel he’s in control and not out his depth? Asked this already as genuinely intrigued. We have won one top flight game all season chucked away leads and out the cup because we lost to part time Kelty. Can you see what he’s trying to do? I wish I did so if you can explain I could maybe jump on board with it.

[McD]

I dont think hes out his depth

I think hes learning as he goes as eveyone should always be

Weve lost, but not badly

Ive more faith in Gray than i did the last managers weve had.

Hell get them winnings soon



What’s he learning? The football is just as crap, the tactics are awful and haven’t worked yet no changes, makes the same substitutions that make us worse. The recruitment is partly on him as he was part of it.

[Smartie]

Agree with this. We do need an experienced manager to re-set the squad and, until the Black Knights get to run the football side, can manage upwards. However, in isolation, I generally want another young manager who is on the way up. Someone whose image of a team includes, pace, high tempo, drive from midfield and pressing. Who is also serious about giving youngsters an opportunity. Essentially another Mowbray. I’d be less keen on a Maloney type like the new generation, slow tempo, no drive and over focused on stats.

If only we could swap our current squad for the one Mowbray inherited.

Whether any new man is experienced or inexperienced doesn't matter, we'll be hounding them out in 10 games or so anyway.

[Smartie]

😂😂😂😂 genuinely don’t know if you’re taking the piss or not.

Gray will never be a successful Hibs manager, that doesn’t change because he scored a goal 8 years ago. Sentiment FC

Michael Oneil was at the Derby sitting next to David Marshall, get him in and thank Gray for trying but it’s never going to work.

If he turns out not to be, it'll be as much to do with the entitled pricks who failed to resist the temptation to turn on him after less than 10 league games, or give him more than one transfer window to transform a truly lamentable squad of players.

[HoboHarry]

If he turns out not to be, it'll be as much to do with the entitled pricks who failed to resist the temptation to turn on him after less than 10 league games, or give him more than one transfer window to transform a truly lamentable squad of players.
:top marks:agree:

[NC1875]

If he turns out not to be, it'll be as much to do with the entitled pricks who failed to resist the temptation to turn on him after less than 10 league games, or give him more than one transfer window to transform a truly lamentable squad of players.

Not been called an entitled prick before. Thanks 👍🏼

Like many posts above, if people could see a plan they’d maybe get on board with it.

You keep slavering into your 2016 David Gray pillow at night while we sleepwalk into the championship.

[DIXIHIBS]

If he turns out not to be, it'll be as much to do with the entitled pricks who failed to resist the temptation to turn on him after less than 10 league games, or give him more than one transfer window to transform a truly lamentable squad of players.

Exactly. Plenty on here agreed it would at least a couple of windows to move on/replace a huge number of under performers. 10 games in and it's all changed. Many are using Aberdeen's crazy turnaround after 1 window as an example...unfair imho as what has happened there is very unusual.

[Unseen work]

If he turns out not to be, it'll be as much to do with the entitled pricks who failed to resist the temptation to turn on him after less than 10 league games, or give him more than one transfer window to transform a truly lamentable squad of players.

Entitled pricks is some take for fans that don’t think 1 win in 10 is good enough

He signed 12 players in the summer

People are scared about relegation and rightly so.

Everyone will want SDG to turn it round, more than any other manager. But there have been no signs of that

[Paulie Walnuts]

If he turns out not to be, it'll be as much to do with the entitled pricks who failed to resist the temptation to turn on him after less than 10 league games, or give him more than one transfer window to transform a truly lamentable squad of players.

Err, no.

If David Gray fails as Hibs manager then the fans will not be as much to blame as David Gray.

[Centre Hawf]

I have sympathy for Dave Gray at the moment. I think this squad is absolutely horrendous and the complaints about subs are fine until you remember the choices off the bench at times are Levitt/JDH/Campbell/Cadden/Rocky and the two striker options at the moment are Mykola and a 35 year old Dwight Gayle. Sometimes Harry McKirdy. Just a rotten list of players to even have to think about turning to.

I don't know who signed who or what the process is for getting players still, but I doubt Gray is out there picking Bursik for example and imagine he's got to work with what he's given in some situations from Mackay and Ian Gordon. But until next summer I honestly don't fully believe anyone is going to get us into the top 6 with this current crop. Unless he has us flirting or fighting relegation around January then I'd probably like to just see us keep Gray in to at least help clear out the chancers and wastes of wages we have.

Right now changing Dave Gray won't change anything for me.

[McD]

Err, no.

If David Gray fails as Hibs manager then the fans will not be as much to blame as David Gray.



Come on now, the fans take the training, set out the tactics, coach the players to improve, practice set pieces, monitor player fitness and implement individual programmes to get them all at peak condition, pick the side, motivate them with the right words and actions of encouragement, make adjustments during matches, substitute the right players at the right time… don’t they?


Yeah the fans are definitely to blame for the situation the team is in :rolleyes:

[Unseen work]

Exactly. Plenty on here agreed it would at least a couple of windows to move on/replace a huge number of under performers. 10 games in and it's all changed. Many are using Aberdeen's crazy turnaround after 1 window as an example...unfair imho as what has happened there is very unusual.

Aberdeen are the extreme.

Folk aren’t saying we need a manager that comes in and wins 15/16, just more than 1 in 10

Had SDG even been 6/8th in the league with a couple of wins I suspect more would be happy enough and saying it takes time etc

We’re losing late goals and chucking away points like you see relegated teams doing

[Smartie]

Not been called an entitled prick before. Thanks 👍🏼

Like many posts above, if people could see a plan they’d maybe get on board with it.

You keep slavering into your 2016 David Gray pillow at night while we sleepwalk into the championship.

Even if that's what you think, it's the sort of thing that should only really be written down by fans of that lot over the road.

And that sleepwalk could be a long one, given it's the first day of November.

The dynamic that exists between our current board and the likes of yourself is absolutely toxic for our club. They raise expectations, you howl at the first sign of expectations not being met, they pull the trigger at the earliest opportunity and the cycle of constant transition continues, nothing whatsoever ever getting the chance to be built.

I'm not exactly loving the football at the moment either and I'm perfectly prepared to call time on David Gray if need be. I'm pretty sure I want that to be once I'm absolutely content he's not up to the task and I"m nowhere near there yet.

What does "a plan" with this group of players look like to you? What specifically does a new manager do that David Gray is not currently doing?

IMO a very good number 10 goes a long, long way towards helping us look like we've got "a plan" than anything the manager is or isn't doing.

[Smartie]

Err, no.

If David Gray fails as Hibs manager then the fans will not be as much to blame as David Gray.

If he gets time and proves himself to be inadequate, then no.

If the angry mob start howling again and the trigger happy mob in our boardroom react, AGAIN?

At some point we need to take a bit of responsibility for our own role in things.

[Unseen work]

Even if that's what you think, it's the sort of thing that should only really be written down by fans of that lot over the road.

And that sleepwalk could be a long one, given it's the first day of November.

The dynamic that exists between our current board and the likes of yourself is absolutely toxic for our club. They raise expectations, you howl at the first sign of expectations not being met, they pull the trigger at the earliest opportunity and the cycle of constant transition continues, nothing whatsoever ever getting the chance to be built.

I'm not exactly loving the football at the moment either and I'm perfectly prepared to call time on David Gray if need be. I'm pretty sure I want that to be once I'm absolutely content he's not up to the task and I"m nowhere near there yet.

What does "a plan" with this group of players look like to you? What specifically does a new manager do that David Gray is not currently doing?

IMO a very good number 10 goes a long, long way towards helping us look like we've got "a plan" than anything the manager is or isn't doing.

A plan could mean absolutely anything. Monty, for example, had a clear plan with how he was playing.

I’ve been saying we need a number 10 for years. However with our current play, I’ve absolutely no faith we would get the best out of him.

On Wednesday we played Hoillett as a 10, Youan and Boyle wide and Myk up top. We hardly had a plan to get any of them on the ball in dangerous positions.

Plenty managers would be able to come up with something to get them on the ball

[Paulie Walnuts]

If he gets time and proves himself to be inadequate, then no.

If the angry mob start howling again and the trigger happy mob in our boardroom react, AGAIN?

At some point we need to take a bit of responsibility for our own role in things.

If he gets sacked it will be because he’s done a terrible job. The suggestion that fans will be as much to blame for a terrible job as the man actually doing the job is just daft.

At this point in time the fans have backed David Gray and his team to the hilt. They have been absolutely abysmal. If Gray fails, it’s on him and the board. Not the fans.

[Smartie]

I have sympathy for Dave Gray at the moment. I think this squad is absolutely horrendous and the complaints about subs are fine until you remember the choices off the bench at times are Levitt/JDH/Campbell/Cadden/Rocky and the two striker options at the moment are Mykola and a 35 year old Dwight Gayle. Sometimes Harry McKirdy. Just a rotten list of players to even have to think about turning to.

I don't know who signed who or what the process is for getting players still, but I doubt Gray is out there picking Bursik for example and imagine he's got to work with what he's given in some situations from Mackay and Ian Gordon. But until next summer I honestly don't fully believe anyone is going to get us into the top 6 with this current crop. Unless he has us flirting or fighting relegation around January then I'd probably like to just see us keep Gray in to at least help clear out the chancers and wastes of wages we have.

Right now changing Dave Gray won't change anything for me.

I think the squad as it stands is horrendous. It needs added to in places and trimmed in places at the earliest opportunity.

I actually think there are a few half-decent pieces to be built around and a few of the loan players we currently have should be good enough to do a job.

It needs 2 or 3 really good, well-sourced players to come in early in January and hit the ground running and then I think we can see a very different complexion on things.

I'm 100% convinced it needs 2 or 3 players rather than a new head coach with a different "plan" unless the plan is to send Martin Boyle back in time 5 years to rediscover his former self and carry us going forward again. Our attacking play is woefully short of adequate personnel both amongst the starters and especially the depth on the bench - hence our subs ALWAYS weakening us.

We just need to scrape what we can between now and January, be confident, decisive and make the necessary changes then and get through the season whilst planning for next season, rejecting the temptation to reach for the panic button.

[superfurryhibby]

If he gets time and proves himself to be inadequate, then no.

If the angry mob start howling again and the trigger happy mob in our boardroom react, AGAIN?

At some point we need to take a bit of responsibility for our own role in things.

If the fans had as much influence as you suggest, then surely we would have been signing decent players and bringing in people who know what they are doing with managing the team and overseeing our football operations?

Instead we get Malky Mackay, the current host of untested coaches and a large number of new signings who have failed to make sufficient impact.

[Smartie]

If he gets sacked it will be because he’s done a terrible job. The suggestion that fans will be as much to blame for a terrible job as the man actually doing the job is just daft.

At this point in time the fans have backed David Gray and his team to the hilt. They have been absolutely abysmal. If Gray fails, it’s on him and the board. Not the fans.

But how do you define "backing David Gray to the hilt"?

We turn up in decent numbers, the number that went to Dingwall the other night deserving of special credit. The fans aren't turning their back on the team and that is absolutely to their credit.

But disquiet on here suggesting he's not good enough after 10 league games... is backing someone for 10 games then deciding he's not up to scratch really backing him to the hilt?

There are different ways for fans and for boards to back a manager. I sincerely hope the numbers continue to turn up and that the team gives them something to celebrate soon.

I'm more concerned about how the board back the manager. Again, that can be done in different ways. It can be by providing funds for players but can also be by not reacting to calls for the manager's head throughout a difficult spell.

[B.H.F.C]

If he gets time and proves himself to be inadequate, then no.

If the angry mob start howling again and the trigger happy mob in our boardroom react, AGAIN?

At some point we need to take a bit of responsibility for our own role in things.

Not with this one, with these results. Folk already had reservations, more than I can remember with any other, about him even getting the job.

I hope we get some results. We can’t let the months roll on still being where we are in the league.

I think we’re in a difficult situation here. We badly need results, which I badly hope we get. I think those results would just be a sticking plaster though, I just don’t see what Gray is trying to build and develop. We need to get some results first and foremost, I just can’t see it being a successful long term appointment with what we’re seeing though.

[21May16]

If he turns out not to be, it'll be as much to do with the entitled pricks who failed to resist the temptation to turn on him after less than 10 league games, or give him more than one transfer window to transform a truly lamentable squad of players.

The only entitled pricks are the people in charge of running the club.

Being concerned about how ***** we are doesn’t make any of the support entitled and it doesn’t make you a better fan.

[NC1875]

I think the squad as it stands is horrendous. It needs added to in places and trimmed in places at the earliest opportunity.

I actually think there are a few half-decent pieces to be built around and a few of the loan players we currently have should be good enough to do a job.

It needs 2 or 3 really good, well-sourced players to come in early in January and hit the ground running and then I think we can see a very different complexion on things.

I'm 100% convinced it needs 2 or 3 players rather than a new head coach with a different "plan" unless the plan is to send Martin Boyle back in time 5 years to rediscover his former self and carry us going forward again. Our attacking play is woefully short of adequate personnel both amongst the starters and especially the depth on the bench - hence our subs ALWAYS weakening us.

We just need to scrape what we can between now and January, be confident, decisive and make the necessary changes then and get through the season whilst planning for next season, rejecting the temptation to reach for the panic button.

So Gray just keeps doing the same until we get these 2-3 players in January ?

It’s his job to win football games. He’s had 12-15 games, numerous training sessions, signed a whole team and yet we are worse than last season.

If we win on Sunday and go on a run everyone will be happy. But as we’ve seen so far, that’s unlikely to happen.

If there were any positives people would buy into it and give him time. There are literally none. Other than who he is.

Any other manager with his record at any other team in the league would be gone by now. As Hearts and St Johnstone have shown. That’s before you throw in getting beat off Kelty Hearts.

David Gray shouldn’t be getting to learn on the job at Hibs because of who he is.

So far he has shown absolutely nothing to suggest he knows what he’s doing or that he’ll turn this around.

It’s all the “entitled pricks” fault though 👍🏼

[Smartie]

If the fans had as much influence as you suggest, then surely we would have been signing decent players and bringing in people who know what they are doing with managing the team and overseeing our football operations?

Instead we get Malky Mackay, the current host of untested coaches and a large number of new signings who have failed to make sufficient impact.

What happened the day after the first chants to get Jack Ross out appeared at Livingston?

What happened the day after the first chants to get Lee Johnson reared their heads at Easter Road when we lost to Livingston?

What happened the week after it got really ugly for Monty when we lost badly at home to Aberdeen in April / May just gone?


I mean, if we could just chant and the 2014 / 2015 version of Scott Allan hitting his stride happened to appear and play for us then I'd be all over that, but unfortunately the only way we seem to be able to impact change is by calling for our manager's head, and I think we need to be a bit careful with the frequency with which we go there.