Potential takeover/new investor?

[Edinburgh Green]

I am not against a mega rich yank, with a sports network buying into Hibs. I can also see it getting us ahead of the nonOF teams for a while and blowing about another first for the club. You have to admire someone that can make a success out of a NHL expansion team based in a desert.

My issue would be that our owner has Bournemouth as his leading team and we would be tied to them in some way. They have punched well above their weight for years before Foley got involved. I’ve lived there. It is not a football town, their stadium is smaller than ours (for that reason) and their style of football is so boring.

By likely being first to move to this model, we are potentially opening the door to other franchises moving in. Imagine if in the future Hertz were to become part of Fenway (I know, but imagine) and we were stuck tied to Bournemouth….


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


I can see the benefits to it and am largely in the yes column. The concern I have is like you mention...Bournemouth, who are hardly an English giant.

If the primary team of the group is in the Prem, then yes the benefits to Hibs would be greater as hopefully we could see players of greater quality who the group are hoping to be future (Prem) Bournemouth players loaned to us or signed with the view they step up if they show their promise.

If they get relegated however then a) the level of player we would get goes down and b) the quicker any player with promise would get moved 'up' to Bournemouth.

A positive that I think we would also gain from having financial muscle behind us is hopefully pulling in larger transfer fees or at least closer to the going rate. i.e Youan lives up to his potential however Bournemouth/Lorient aren't keen. A team bids £2m we tell them we want £5m, History has told us that we realistically aren't turning down anything around £2.5-3m and teams know that. With a billionaire behind us there is a lot better chance of digging our heels in and not budging on our valuation.

[Hibernian Verse]

Totally agree with what your saying about Newcastle owners btw , I didn't want to see them taken over either just as much as I don't want to see a club I've supported for forty years with a great history and tradition become some accessory for Bournemouth either . Difference is though whatever our views of the Saudi regime are , Newcastle United are their main priority , Bill Foley's priority is to buy or get shares in 5 or 6 clubs for Bournemouths benefit.
5 or 6 Bournemouth reserve teams basically !. Glad your about that one btw ! .

With all due respect you have said the same thing over and over again and I think we get it now.

[Donegal Hibby]

Quite funny you are talking about respect and identity but happily support a team being run by Saudi Arabia.

I suppose it is mate though I'd feel the same way if the Bournemouth owner was trying to buy shares in Newcastle United and use them for Bournemouths benefit , thankfully Newcastle United are too big to be used as a play thing for a S***** club like Bournemouth though :wink:

[Jack]

IF Hibs were to become a 'feeder' club to Bournemouth, or any other top English club we're going to have to considerably up the quality at Easter Road!

The odd player every 5 years or so is hardly going to get a billionaire EPL owner excited. Someone is going to have to supply Hibs with a conveyor belt of very good quality prospects for this to get even close.

[Donegal Hibby]

With all due respect you have said the same thing over and over again and I think we get it now.

Ok , no offense intended . I'll leave it at that mate ��

[Daniel 1875]

Yeh but if someone comes along as says I'm willing to put in 50m over five years if you give me your shares why wouldn't HSL sell them? What's the actual purpose of HSL these days?

The same as the purpose has always been. To acquire and hold 25.1% of shares on behalf of the support to stop anyone with nefarious plans for the club from doing anything against the wishes of supporters.

[Hibbyradge]

How would folk feel if they renamed Easter Road the Capital One arena? It's not the biggest issue for me as we'd all still call it ER but the kind of thing that can be done to generate money that I would argue moves us away from the community.

What if ticket prices start to go up massively? Now I know that's likely to only happen on the back of sustained success so many will shrug their shoulders but we could see people who are part of our traditional fan base priced out.

What if the price of the land ER is on is high enough that there is value in selling and building a new stadium at the edge of Edinburgh?

I feel like I'm just being a moany ******* here but football is littered with pishy owner's doing terrible things.

This guy seems to have done well with an American ice hockey team but football in Scotland is a totally different beast, and we have very little real information to tell us whether he's a good owner or not.

All of that could, some would say should, happen with any owner.

[CapitalGreen]

The same as the purpose has always been. To acquire and hold 25.1% of shares on behalf of the support to stop anyone with nefarious plans for the club from doing anything against the wishes of supporters.

“doing anything against the wishes of supporters” should read “doing anything against a majority of HSL members” as HSL doesn’t represent the whole support.

[Jones28]

Honestly don't know mate , I doubt theres any tbh . I'd imagine the clubs they own are just owned so they can put out players that they don't want and move them about from club to club . Think its quite sad that certain clubs are used like this and lose whatever respect and identity they had !!!

Says you.

I don't know a single set up like this anywhere in the world.

[oneone73]

“doing anything against the wishes of supporters” should read “doing anything against a majority of HSL members” as HSL doesn’t represent the whole support.

I don't think any supporters would want the club decanted out of ER or even closed down. That’s why HSL is important

[Daniel 1875]

“doing anything against the wishes of supporters” should read “doing anything against a majority of HSL members” as HSL doesn’t represent the whole support.

You are of course correct. But as the 25.1% only applies in the event of a special resolution, which would - in a specifically football sense - make material changes to things which make Hibernian FC, Hibernian FC, and as there are many thousands of Hibernian Supporters members, I’m not sure the two things are as separate as you suggest.

[Jones28]

“doing anything against the wishes of supporters” should read “doing anything against a majority of HSL members” as HSL doesn’t represent the whole support.

This seems unnecessarily argumentative.

They have the interests of the majority of supporters at heart.

[Donegal Hibby]

Says you.

I don't know a single set up like this anywhere in the world.

You don't know a single set up like this anywhere in the world were one club owns or has shares in 5 or 6 other clubs ! Really ?

[Jones28]

You don't know a single set up like this anywhere in the world were one club owns or has shares in 5 or 6 other clubs ! Really ?

Not the kind of set up you describe, where 3 or 4 teams all act as feeder clubs towards one club at the top.

[TrinityHFC]

This seems unnecessarily argumentative.

They have the interests of the majority of supporters at heart.

So do all the all the other fans who hold shares direct on the register which makes the stated percentage target totally pointless. Just don’t see what HSL thinks it is going to usefully do and in the meantime the missed opportunity of a way to get funds to the club is a real one.

Not sure the special resolution thing is all it is made out to be. Does everyone understand how that would actually apply? It is for a limit set of issues and there are a number of things majority owners can do outside this.

[Jones28]

So do all the all the other fans who hold shares direct on the register which makes the stated percentage target totally pointless. Just don’t see what HSL thinks it is going to usefully do and in the meantime the missed opportunity of a way to get funds to the club is a real one.

Not sure the special resolution thing is all it is made out to be. Does everyone understand how that would actually apply? It is for a limit set of issues and there are a number of things majority owners can do outside this.

I'm not denying that, I just don't see why people are so argumentative around the intentions of HSL, unless they believe the crap that Paul Kane spouted off at the very start of the initiative. He called it a Ponzi scheme.*


*Simon Pia may have said Ponzi scheme, as far as I can remember that phrase was used by one of them and their attempts to torpedo HSL were very damaging.

[BobbyT1875]

I'm not denying that, I just don't see why people are so argumentative around the intentions of HSL, unless they believe the crap that Paul Kane spouted off at the very start of the initiative. He called it a Ponzi scheme.

I ve never heard that. Do you have a link to an article ?

[Daniel 1875]

So do all the all the other fans who hold shares direct on the register which makes the stated percentage target totally pointless. Just don’t see what HSL thinks it is going to usefully do and in the meantime the missed opportunity of a way to get funds to the club is a real one.

Not sure the special resolution thing is all it is made out to be. Does everyone understand how that would actually apply? It is for a limit set of issues and there are a number of things majority owners can do outside this.

There are around 18% of shares owned outside of HSL and Bydand Sports. Roughly 10% of these are owned by anonymous entities/individuals - could they be relied upon in the event something was put forward which relied on a 75% majority vote? No one knows.

Outside of this, the remaining shares are held by individuals. Some held by actively interested Hibs fans who are up to date with current affairs, others by fans who are no longer with us, and others by fans who simply wanted the certificate which now sits at the bottom of a drawer somewhere.

The attendance at club AGMs gives a reasonable idea of the number of actively interested and engaged supporter shareholders.

The whole idea of a collective shareholder body, in the form of Hibernian Supporters, owned and run by its members (Hibs fans) is that supporters who could not afford a lump sum at the time of the share issue could, in their own way, own a small piece of their football club, and in the event action needs to be taken, can stand up and be counted when required as a support block.

[BobbyT1875]

There are around 18% of shares owned outside of HSL and Bydand Sports. Roughly 10% of these are owned by anonymous entities/individuals - could they be relied upon in the event something was put forward which relied on a 75% majority vote? No one knows.

Outside of this, the remaining shares are held by individuals. Some held by actively interested Hibs fans who are up to date with current affairs, others by fans who are no longer with us, and others by fans who simply wanted the certificate which now sits at the bottom of a drawer somewhere.

The attendance at club AGMs gives a reasonable idea of the number of actively interested and engaged supporter shareholders.

The whole idea of a collective shareholder body, in the form of Hibernian Supporters, owned and run by its members (Hibs fans) is that supporters who could not afford a lump sum at the time of the share issue could, in their own way, own a small piece of their football club, and in the event action needs to be taken, can stand up and be counted when required as a support block.

Great post. I’m not in HSL but an individual shareholder. I’d be delighted if HSL get to 26% to stop a mercer . Despite trinity continually it’s not needed …

[Donegal Hibby]

Not the kind of set up you describe, where 3 or 4 teams all act as feeder clubs towards one club at the top.

I think it's becoming quite a common thing in football that big clubs acquire shares or buy other clubs solely for there own benefit.

Not a good thing that's happening in football imo and looks like it going to happen to us which will probably lead to other spl clubs having shares or being bought by bigger clubs unfortunately.

Had hoped we were big enough and our owners would have resisted in any attempt to turn us into a feeder club tbh .😞
https://www.espn.co.uk/football/story/_/id/38008353/the-issues-multi-club-ownership-city-football-group-red-bull

[BobbyT1875]

So do all the all the other fans who hold shares direct on the register which makes the stated percentage target totally pointless. Just don’t see what HSL thinks it is going to usefully do and in the meantime the missed opportunity of a way to get funds to the club is a real one.

Not sure the special resolution thing is all it is made out to be. Does everyone understand how that would actually apply? It is for a limit set of issues and there are a number of things majority owners can do outside this.

You seem to keep repeating this line . I’m not sure how you know these things.. it’s like you predict the future . Also, should hibs Fans donate money to the club . Byland sports don’t do it …

[EastStandGates]

Never say never Donegal. If he eventually made us top dog and we started getting 1st or 2nd in league we’d be in Champs league territory regularly. Bournemouth won’t do that a maybe he sees us as a sideways move and into it. £20 mill per season for 4 years would scare the life out of the old firm especially if recruitment was top notch

It really wouldn't. £20m investment wouldn't scratch the surface, if any serious challenge was mounted to the Old Firm, which it wouldn't, they could easily chuck £20m to counteract ours. Then what you getting for your £80m investment? 3rd place max, Europa group stages max, and £5-6n from that.

I don't think we're heading for Romonav Hertz almost out the box Easter Road flats, but we're also not going to be challenging 2nd or even constantly finishing 3rd. We'll remain the same as is just now but maybe with some investments to ER and EM.

[Jones28]

I ve never heard that. Do you have a link to an article ?

https://www.hibs.net/showthread.php?341671-Paul-Kane/page4

I could only find reference to it in this thread from a few years back.

He was very vocal against HSL along with Simon Pia.

[BobbyT1875]

https://www.hibs.net/showthread.php?341671-Paul-Kane/page4

I could only find reference to it in this thread from a few years back.

He was very vocal against HSL along with Simon Pia.
Quite a call to make without proof. Happy to be proved wrong, l don’t believe Kano said that.

[Jones28]

I think it's becoming quite a common thing in football that big clubs acquire shares or buy other clubs solely for there own benefit.

Not a good thing that's happening in football imo and looks like it going to happen to us which will probably lead to other spl clubs having shares or being bought by bigger clubs unfortunately.

Had hoped we were big enough and our owners would have resisted in any attempt to turn us into a feeder club tbh .😞
https://www.espn.co.uk/football/story/_/id/38008353/the-issues-multi-club-ownership-city-football-group-red-bull


What is wrong with any this?

WHAT IS THE APPEAL OF OWNING MORE THAN ONE CLUB?
There is no central thread or theory to this. Some clubs want to position themselves in various markets (Europe, South America, Asia) to have easier access to emerging talent, while others attempt to dilute risk by owning a number of teams.

The article cites several groups, I've literally only heard of City Group.

[Jones28]

Quite a call to make without proof. Happy to be proved wrong, l don’t believe Kano said that.

I've edited my post, I don't like to mis-remember quotes like that.

However he was heavily associated with Simon Pia, they were extremely vocal against HSL and the "Ponzi Scheme" remark came from one of them I'm sure.

[BobbyT1875]

I've edited my post, I don't like to mis-remember quotes like that.

However he was heavily associated with Simon Pia, they were extremely vocal against HSL and the "Ponzi Scheme" remark came from one of them I'm sure.

Fair play. It came from a different group.

[SickBoy32]

I can see the benefits to it and am largely in the yes column. The concern I have is like you mention...Bournemouth, who are hardly an English giant.

If the primary team of the group is in the Prem, then yes the benefits to Hibs would be greater as hopefully we could see players of greater quality who the group are hoping to be future (Prem) Bournemouth players loaned to us or signed with the view they step up if they show their promise.

If they get relegated however then a) the level of player we would get goes down and b) the quicker any player with promise would get moved 'up' to Bournemouth.
.

Very valid concern and not one that I had thought of.

Bournemouth could easily find themselves being relegated from the championship too, given the stature of club

Another concern I have is the age of the investor - what sort of succession will this lead to? Another IG, learning on the job ?

[Jones28]

Fair play. It came from a different group.

It did?

[Iain G]

It did?

It was defo Pia and Kane and their wee brigade that claimed it was all a Ponzi scheme.

[TrinityHFC]

There are around 18% of shares owned outside of HSL and Bydand Sports. Roughly 10% of these are owned by anonymous entities/individuals - could they be relied upon in the event something was put forward which relied on a 75% majority vote? No one knows.

Outside of this, the remaining shares are held by individuals. Some held by actively interested Hibs fans who are up to date with current affairs, others by fans who are no longer with us, and others by fans who simply wanted the certificate which now sits at the bottom of a drawer somewhere.

The attendance at club AGMs gives a reasonable idea of the number of actively interested and engaged supporter shareholders.

The whole idea of a collective shareholder body, in the form of Hibernian Supporters, owned and run by its members (Hibs fans) is that supporters who could not afford a lump sum at the time of the share issue could, in their own way, own a small piece of their football club, and in the event action needs to be taken, can stand up and be counted when required as a support block.

I think if you are involved with HSL it is very unhelpful to scaremonger about people holding shares in nominee accounts. You even mentioned them not being allowed previously. I don’t think you really understand about them.

When you look at the recent history of our shares and how they’ve been made available they’re is really no opportunity or motivation for these not to be owned by Hibs fans.

Those additional shares are not going to be making their way to HSL in any numbers. Stocking up on cash to potentially give over to the owners in the future, not the club, just seems a waste.

Relying on being able to block special resolution is a bit lacking in reality. Are there any decent examples of proposals on ownership or potential sales of assets at any football club being voted on in this way?

[TrinityHFC]

It was defo Pia and Kane and their wee brigade that claimed it was all a Ponzi scheme.

Yep and is totally different to the debate about the usefulness of the scheme now. At the time it was a hugely generous offer from Sir Tom to get some more shares in the hands of fans and HSL albeit not the same as having your own share, and HSL was a decent alternative that still seen the cash go to the club and not Sir Tom.

[WhileTheChief..]

And in terms of ownership, I'd like to see is go down the fan route.

Worst possible option.

No money going into the club and everyone wanting their say. Total recipe for disaster.

We'd be in admin within a few years and begging for a wealthy owner to save us.

[BobbyT1875]

It was defo Pia and Kane and their wee brigade that claimed it was all a Ponzi scheme.

It wasn’t

[matty_f]

It wasn’t

https://x.com/simonpia1/status/709363462745538560?s=46&t=9ECFsSDsGgie80A2m3HH1A

[Hibbyradge]

Quite a call to make without proof. Happy to be proved wrong, l don’t believe Kano said that.

It was definitely said by that group.

[Bridge hibs]

It was definitely said by that group.

Jackie McNamara angered by ‘Ponzi scheme’ claims

Former Hibs star Jackie McNamara today revealed he’d felt “insulted” at his integrity being questioned after being accused of being part of a “Ponzi scheme” as he threw his weight behind a move towards fan ownership at Easter Road.

https://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/hibs/jackie-mcnamara-angered-by-ponzi-scheme-claims-884958

[neil7908]

Worst possible option.

No money going into the club and everyone wanting their say. Total recipe for disaster.

We'd be in admin within a few years and begging for a wealthy owner to save us.

Seems to work pretty well for most teams in Germany.

On the other hand, ask Man United fans how they feel about their wealthy American owners. Or Chelsea fans.

That's not to say Foley is the same as them, just that I am uncomfortable without more information why a very wealthy American would want to buy Hibs. Ron gave a pretty compelling case for trusting him imo. Until I hear from Foley I'll stay sceptical.

[BobbyT1875]

It was definitely said by that group.

Definitely wasn’t

[Jones28]

https://x.com/simonpia1/status/709363462745538560?s=46&t=9ECFsSDsGgie80A2m3HH1A


Definitely wasn’t

?? This looks pretty conclusive.

[Jones28]

Seems to work pretty well for most teams in Germany.

On the other hand, ask Man United fans how they feel about their wealthy American owners. Or Chelsea fans.

That's not to say Foley is the same as them, just that I am uncomfortable without more information why a very wealthy American would want to buy Hibs. Ron gave a pretty compelling case for trusting him imo. Until I hear from Foley I'll stay sceptical.

Works well for a country with a population of 83 million and excellent commercial deals. For us? I don't think so.

[Brightside]

You are of course correct. But as the 25.1% only applies in the event of a special resolution, which would - in a specifically football sense - make material changes to things which make Hibernian FC, Hibernian FC, and as there are many thousands of Hibernian Supporters members, I’m not sure the two things are as separate as you suggest.

So that percentage of the business is never available for sale?

[BobbyT1875]

?? This looks pretty conclusive.

Tahts not Kano and it’s not a group. It’s an individual and it’s view

[Lago]

:top marks
Worst possible option.

No money going into the club and everyone wanting their say. Total recipe for disaster.

We'd be in admin within a few years and begging for a wealthy owner to save us.

[A Hi-Bee]

He said this, she said that blah, blah, blah, school playground stuff. Only interested in today and the future, our history is written and cannot be erased. As said before it would be complete Foley to bite the hand that wants to feed us.
Hibs have always been pioneers in football, this is pioneering so I say lets go for it.
GGTTH

[A Hi-Bee]

Seems to work pretty well for most teams in Germany.

On the other hand, ask Man United fans how they feel about their wealthy American owners. Or Chelsea fans.

That's not to say Foley is the same as them, just that I am uncomfortable without more information why a very wealthy American would want to buy Hibs. Ron gave a pretty compelling case for trusting him imo. Until I hear from Foley I'll stay sceptical.

Not comparable, in the least. Apples to Bananas.
GGTTH

[Since452]

Worst possible option.

No money going into the club and everyone wanting their say. Total recipe for disaster.

We'd be in admin within a few years and begging for a wealthy owner to save us.

Yup. I've never been a fan of the fan ownership model. Fans are better at bickering on football forums and letting competent people run football clubs.

[TrinityHFC]

So that percentage of the business is never available for sale?

It doesn't hugely matter. As seen regularly when businesses attract new investment and as as happened already to some extent here, it can be further diluted away. One other reason that striving for a percentage where you think you can block stuff really doesn't work that way in reality. As the value of the business increases and the value that investors think they can add increases minority holders that can't continue to add any investment themselves will be diminished. The earlier chat about new shares being issued and potentially being offered to existing holders too is a non starter - unless anyone can argue that the private shareholders and HSL are all going to throw in much more than their initial purchase again to probably not even stand still. No chance - and that money would be going to the owners, not Hibs, so why would anyone?

[Jones28]

Tahts not Kano and it’s not a group. It’s an individual and it’s view

Kane and Pia were part of the same group.

I was right...to an extent :greengrin

[CockneyRebel]

It was defo Pia and Kane and their wee brigade that claimed it was all a Ponzi scheme.


That's how I remember it too. This managed to put loads of supporters off of joining HSL.

Rumours at the time were hinting that Paul Kane was in a cream puff because a consortium he was involved with were trying to get into Hibs and got knocked back. I repeat - only rumours.

[Daniel 1875]

I think if you are involved with HSL it is very unhelpful to scaremonger about people holding shares in nominee accounts. You even mentioned them not being allowed previously. I don’t think you really understand about them.

When you look at the recent history of our shares and how they’ve been made available they’re is really no opportunity or motivation for these not to be owned by Hibs fans.

Those additional shares are not going to be making their way to HSL in any numbers. Stocking up on cash to potentially give over to the owners in the future, not the club, just seems a waste.

Relying on being able to block special resolution is a bit lacking in reality. Are there any decent examples of proposals on ownership or potential sales of assets at any football club being voted on in this way?

I’m not sure it’s fair to say I’ve done any scaremongering - the question of ownership at the club has naturally come up as a result of this thread and I’ve done my best to answer the questions raised in relation to the purpose and intention of Hibernian Supporters.

It’s a stated fact that there are multiple nominee holdings on the club’s share register, these nominee holdings are anonymous and not registered entities. That’s not scaremongering - that’s just the fact of the matter.

‘Stocking up on cash to give to the owners’ is also not an accurate description of the situation. If there’s a share issue tomorrow, Hibernian Supporters will need the cash to at least retain the shareholding many many people have worked incredibly hard to achieve.

[greenginger]

That's how I remember it too. This managed to put loads of supporters off of joining HSL.

Rumours at the time were hinting that Paul Kane was in a cream puff because a consortium he was involved with were trying to get into Hibs and got knocked back. I repeat - only rumours.

Yeah, aided big time by Edinburgh Evening News.

I remember front page spread with a photo of about 12 clowns with stop the ponzi scheme and it’s a shake down outside the Tyres at Farmers Autocare at Queensferry Road.

[May21/05/216]

I’m not sure it’s fair to say I’ve done any scaremongering - the question of ownership at the club has naturally come up as a result of this thread and I’ve done my best to answer the questions raised in relation to the purpose and intention of Hibernian Supporters.

It’s a stated fact that there are multiple nominee holdings on the club’s share register, these nominee holdings are anonymous and not registered entities. That’s not scaremongering - that’s just the fact of the matter.

‘Stocking up on cash to give to the owners’ is also not an accurate description of the situation. If there’s a share issue tomorrow, Hibernian Supporters will need the cash to at least retain the shareholding many many people have worked incredibly hard to achieve.Debate is good Daniel I would just to say that you and the rest of hsl volunteers are doing good in my humble opinion

Sent from my SM-X200 using Tapatalk

[Lago]

I wonder what the reaction will be if this doesn't happen?

[DanishJohn]

Three things in life are are what you could call certain

Death
Day following night
Anything connected to HSL.......... and a post from Trinity Hibs !

Give it up man it's getting tedious. (Best leaving these things to the experts)

[Brightside]

I wonder what the reaction will be if this doesn't happen?

Every chance it wont happen. We've been here with other investors.

[greenginger]

I’m not sure it’s fair to say I’ve done any scaremongering - the question of ownership at the club has naturally come up as a result of this thread and I’ve done my best to answer the questions raised in relation to the purpose and intention of Hibernian Supporters.

It’s a stated fact that there are multiple nominee holdings on the club’s share register, these nominee holdings are anonymous and not registered entities. That’s not scaremongering - that’s just the fact of the matter.

‘Stocking up on cash to give to the owners’ is also not an accurate description of the situation. If there’s a share issue tomorrow, Hibernian Supporters will need the cash to at least retain the shareholding many many people have worked incredibly hard to achieve.

These multiple nominees all seem to have similar names .

Bass Rock nominees, Leith Walk nominees etc.

I wouldn’t be surprised if the were all the financed by same group or person.

Nor would I be surprised if it were the work of Archie Paton acting for Ron Gordon to get a toe hold in the Club .

However I have been unable to find any info on these nominee holdings so it just guesses on my part.

[TrinityHFC]

Three things in life are are what you could call certain

Death
Day following night
Anything connected to HSL.......... and a post from Trinity Hibs !

Give it up man it's getting tedious. (Best leaving these things to the experts)

If you find it tedious then move on. These discussions are quite important. Who here do you consider to be the experts on this? The subject matter is something I’ve worked in for 30yrs so I think I’m sort of informed.

[Aldo]

I’m being really lazy here and cannot be bothered looking back through the whole thread but I wonder how many of those so against this or any serious investment regularly comment about the club being mediocre in terms of the playing side.

If so what does the club do to expand our revenue in order to compete regularly for Europe and silverware?

We’ve invested well in our hospitality suites however to take is to the next level we need more investment.

I don’t get this we will be losing our identity if we get investment. We have superb infrastructure in a superb location and we’ve record sponsors etc.

Someone want to invest serious money into the club so instead of moaning about mediocracy look forward to what this could mean.

Due diligence will be done.

It’s either accept mediocracy and don’t moan about it or look positively ahead

Just my tuppence worth

FWIW I’m all for it

[Billy Whizz]

These multiple nominees all seem to have similar names .

Bass Rock nominees, Leith Walk nominees etc.

I wouldn’t be surprised if the were all the financed by same group or person.

Nor would I be surprised if it were the work of Archie Paton acting for Ron Gordon to get a toe hold in the Club .

However I have been unable to find any info on these nominee holdings so it just guesses on my part.

Do we how long these shares have been held by these companies/individuals

[Golden Bear]

I’m being really lazy here and cannot be bothered looking back through the whole thread but I wonder how many of those so against this or any serious investment regularly comment about the club being mediocre in terms of the playing side.

If so what does the club do to expand our revenue in order to compete regularly for Europe and silverware?

We’ve invested well in our hospitality suites however to take is to the next level we need more investment.

I don’t get this we will be losing our identity if we get investment. We have superb infrastructure in a superb location and we’ve record sponsors etc.

Someone want to invest serious money into the club so instead of moaning about mediocracy look forward to what this could mean.

Due diligence will be done.

It’s either accept mediocracy and don’t moan about it or look positively ahead

Just my tuppence worth

FWIW I’m all for it

:agree:

As I see it.

[DanishJohn]

These multiple nominees all seem to have similar names .

Bass Rock nominees, Leith Walk nominees etc.

I wouldn’t be surprised if the were all the financed by same group or person.

Nor would I be surprised if it were the work of Archie Paton acting for Ron Gordon to get a toe hold in the Club .

However I have been unable to find any info on these nominee holdings so it just guesses on my part.

Greenginger

I think they were there before Ron Gordon took over. It could well be the toehold you mention but I'm not sure .
Another thing I'm unclear about is Nominee Holdings. Is there not a provision in law that somewhere in Companys house (or law) the names of individuals must be revealed ?
If that is the case then why do we not know about them now?

[WhileTheChief..]

Seems to work pretty well for most teams in Germany.

On the other hand, ask Man United fans how they feel about their wealthy American owners. Or Chelsea fans.

That's not to say Foley is the same as them, just that I am uncomfortable without more information why a very wealthy American would want to buy Hibs. Ron gave a pretty compelling case for trusting him imo. Until I hear from Foley I'll stay sceptical.

Not so sure about it working in Germany. It's not exactly a shining example of a competitive league!!

No harm in being sceptical. Just don't get stressed out about something you've got no say or control in. I imagine we'll all still be supporting Hibs this time next year whatever happens.

[chippy]

If you find it tedious then move on. These discussions are quite important. Who here do you consider to be the experts on this? The subject matter is something I’ve worked in for 30yrs so I think I’m sort of informed.

You just keep repeating the same stuff though. Once is enough already

[WhileTheChief..]

I wonder what the reaction will be if this doesn't happen?

Nothing.

The rumour will simply fade away and in a few months someone will post a thread asking about 'some American dude' that was going to invest in us!

[greenginger]

Greenginger

I think they were there before Ron Gordon took over. It could well be the toehold you mention but I'm not sure .
Another thing I'm unclear about is Nominee Holdings. Is there not a provision in law that somewhere in Companys house (or law) the names of individuals must be revealed ?
If that is the case then why do we not know about them now?


These nominee holdings appeared at the first statement of shareholdings after the share issue.

Ron Gordon had been in contact with STF for several years before a deal was finally concluded.

Ive tried Companies House and other searches but find no listing of these nominees.

[TrinityHFC]

You just keep repeating the same stuff though. Once is enough already

Thanks for your worthless advice.

[Billy Whizz]

So is this investment likely to be similar to Jim Ratcliffe’s deal with the Glaziers (Obviously not on the same scale)
He’s putting in a lot of money and will hold 25% of the shares

[Stairway 2 7]

If its new shares he's buying I assume HSL are going to use the available money and buy shares to keep up the share %.

[TrinityHFC]

Greenginger

I think they were there before Ron Gordon took over. It could well be the toehold you mention but I'm not sure .
Another thing I'm unclear about is Nominee Holdings. Is there not a provision in law that somewhere in Companys house (or law) the names of individuals must be revealed ?
If that is the case then why do we not know about them now?

It is perfectly fine and normal for shares to be held in nominee companies. The only real caveat is that if you are deemed to be a person with significant control (PSC) in the entity then you would have to have your actual details noted on that register to ensure transparency over the actual ownership.

Nominees are usually used when people have number of investments so they can be managed by someone in a more efficient way.

Some of the nominees have been on Hibs register for 20 to 30 yrs. Other appeared when shares were made available again by Sir Tom. If you recall it was restricted to people that were classed as sophisticated investors or who had their application signed off by a financial advisor, so no real surprise some of the bigger purchases would have been done this way. If you have a few quid you probably don't want your name and size of investment made public either. A few reasons that nominees are used and they will be on just about every share register where shares have been made available for people to buy.

[A Hi-Bee]

Whats the hertz saying about this, lots of savvie investors over there?

[OfficialHSL]

Yup. I've never been a fan of the fan ownership model. Fans are better at bickering on football forums and letting competent people run football clubs.
Since452

I hope you don't mind us jumping in here. This is a common misconception of fan ownership, whether it be minority or majority fan ownership. It is not a bunch of Hearts Fans or Motherwell Fans that are running the Club. They have a Board of Directors, just like us, who run the Club. The Foundation of Hearts and the Well Society are simply the owners or custodians if you like.

We can't say which is the better ownership structure yet because it's early days. What we can say is that we have evidence over many years at many Clubs of privately controlled Clubs making a mess of things, in many cases with huge sums of money at their disposal.

HSL

[HoboHarry]

Whats the hertz saying about this, lots of savvie investors over there?
Nothing sensible from Kickback - it's Friday night and they are all wibbling on about Buckfast and their sisters underwear.

[Golden Bear]

I get the impression that a minority on here are almost hoping that any plans for outside investment falls thru.

It's a funny old world.

[chippy]

Since452

I hope you don't mind us jumping in here. This is a common misconception of fan ownership, whether it be minority or majority fan ownership. It is not a bunch of Hearts Fans or Motherwell Fans that are running the Club. They have a Board of Directors, just like us, who run the Club. The Foundation of Hearts and the Well Society are simply the owners or custodians if you like.

We can't say which is the better ownership structure yet because it's early days. What we can say is that we have evidence over many years at many Clubs of privately controlled Clubs making a mess of things, in many cases with huge sums of money at their disposal.

HSL
I’m astonished that a collective of working and middle class men and women many of whom have held skilled trades or professional jobs for their lifetime , some indeed who may have held leading/ managerial positions in the public and private sectors, possibly financial sector would find a way to democratically elect a group of suitable professional persons to run their business in a modern , intelligent manner

[WhileTheChief..]

Hearts fans don't seem particularly happy with Budge, their chief exec, head of recruitment or their manager.

They own their club yet can't do anything more about the situation than we could being owned by the Gordon's.

Check out Kickback anytime they're on a bad run. Endless calls for Budge to go and digs about the folk on the Foundation. They're no better off than they were under Robinson or Mercer.

[Billy Whizz]

Hearts fans don't seem particularly happy with Budge, their chief exec, head of recruitment or their manager.

They own their club yet can't do anything more about the situation than we could being owned by the Gordon's.

Check out Kickback anytime they're on a bad run. Endless calls for Budge to go and digs about the folk on the Foundation. They're no better off than they were under Robinson or Mercer.

Budge is a control freak, can’t see her going anywhere soon

[Stairway 2 7]

Hearts fans don't seem particularly happy with Budge, their chief exec, head of recruitment or their manager.

They own their club yet can't do anything more about the situation than we could being owned by the Gordon's.

Check out Kickback anytime they're on a bad run. Endless calls for Budge to go and digs about the folk on the Foundation. They're no better off than they were under Robinson or Mercer.

Fan ownership makes no difference to how a club is ran it's still a group in charge, your not going to decide a manager or if a new stand is built.

It only safeguards you from being bought. You've no chance of outside investment unless you've got a benefactor willing to give money for nothing in return or you put in the millions as a fan base and expect nothing for it. Unfortunately hearts have both so can outspend us. We've no benefactor or a vehicle to put in millions a year, so the only way we can match hearts wages is outside investment

[TrinityHFC]

Hearts fans don't seem particularly happy with Budge, their chief exec, head of recruitment or their manager.

They own their club yet can't do anything more about the situation than we could being owned by the Gordon's.

Check out Kickback anytime they're on a bad run. Endless calls for Budge to go and digs about the folk on the Foundation. They're no better off than they were under Robinson or Mercer.

There isn't a huge sample size on how a UK club can be run under fan ownership and Hearts isn't exactly a shining example of it going well.

They are also in a strange place in that on top of being fan owned they are being propped up by those fans making regular donations and getting hand outs from a wealthy individual. It is less clear how fan owned clubs can grow beyond what they currently have as they are going to be limited in being able to accept significant investment or ownership.

I think for a model like Hibs, HSL members have spent money on buying their membership. Some of that has gone to Hibs, the remainder will now go to current or future owners on share purchases. Unless they switch cup again at some stage there isn't going to be the same revenue that comes in from say FOH, so if the share does get built up, it is a decent chunk of the ownership that isn't going to positively invest any further in the business. I can see why Ron, who ultimately proved to be a good guy with the best of intentions for Hibs, did not really want to engage in the model. He'd already diluted it a bit and I think he knew well that any further investment would dilute it even more so encouraging folk to part with their hard earned for that to keep happening is something to be aware of.

[hibbie02]

HSL is supported and financed by fans who chose to do so. It is their choice to do so, as they agree with it’s aims. I am proud to do so. I supported the idea of HSL providing cash to the club during Covid and reverting back to the original aim after.

People can question the motivation if they like. It’s my money to use and I am happy to continue. If we fail at the end of the day, fair enough. I would always back any attempt for fans to try to keep some element of ownership and a level of accountability. Full fan ownership is never going to work.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[Hibs4185]

Whats the hertz saying about this, lots of savvie investors over there?

They are consulting Leslie Deans as we speak for some sound legal counsel

[TrinityHFC]

HSL is supported and financed by fans who chose to do so. It is their choice to do so, as they agree with it’s aims. I am proud to do so. I supported the idea of HSL providing cash to the club during Covid and reverting back to the original aim after.

People can question the motivation if they like. It’s my money to use and I am happy to continue. If we fail at the end of the day, fair enough. I would always back any attempt for fans to try to keep some element of ownership and a level of accountability. Full fan ownership is never going to work.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Absolutely and that's the way it goes when in a collective. I was a member, had contributed since the start and then I decided to stop when I didn't agree with the future use of the money.

The 'original' aim though was not the same as this. Originally the money went to the club as effectively a donation due to the generosity of Sir Tom giving up his shares in this fashion. Stopping any further money going to Hibs was a new direction. The game changed when the takeover happened for reasons I've gone over before and will continue to do so as Hibs develops. Hopefully members paying in fully understand the nature of the moving target they are aiming for though.

[007]

They are consulting Leslie Deans as we speak for some sound legal counsel

What's that it's spelled out Ann? "T-h-e-r-e w-a-s n-o e-v-i-d-e-n-c-e o-f m-o-n-e-y l-a-u-n-d-e-r-i-n-g...."

https://i.ibb.co/CnyKrgQ/1000-F-319598389-Af-HXV4y-Nc-Fz-Oqt-Lo-X03-Gal-KMXM104u-C5.jpg (https://ibb.co/sF49Bnq)

[Lago]

I get the impression that a minority on here are almost hoping that any plans for outside investment falls thru.

It's a funny old world.
Yip seem happy to just bumble along with the occasional highpoint like 2016.

[Hibs4185]

What's that it's spelled out Ann? "T-h-e-r-e w-a-s n-o e-v-i-d-e-n-c-e o-f m-o-n-e-y l-a-u-n-d-e-r-i-n-g...."

https://i.ibb.co/CnyKrgQ/1000-F-319598389-Af-HXV4y-Nc-Fz-Oqt-Lo-X03-Gal-KMXM104u-C5.jpg (https://ibb.co/sF49Bnq)

You must know Leslie well 😜

[Jack]

Thanks for your worthless advice.

Touché

[Alex Trager]

https://x.com/simonpia1/status/709363462745538560?s=46&t=9ECFsSDsGgie80A2m3HH1A

All of they tweets in that thread angered me.

Then I thought ‘get it ****ing up them’. Mr Murray showing his awareness and Pia being Pia.

[madsen5]

What's that it's spelled out Ann? "T-h-e-r-e w-a-s n-o e-v-i-d-e-n-c-e o-f m-o-n-e-y l-a-u-n-d-e-r-i-n-g...."

https://i.ibb.co/CnyKrgQ/1000-F-319598389-Af-HXV4y-Nc-Fz-Oqt-Lo-X03-Gal-KMXM104u-C5.jpg (https://ibb.co/sF49Bnq)

Thats Leslie Deans deceased.

[hibbie02]

Absolutely and that's the way it goes when in a collective. I was a member, had contributed since the start and then I decided to stop when I didn't agree with the future use of the money.

The 'original' aim though was not the same as this. Originally the money went to the club as effectively a donation due to the generosity of Sir Tom giving up his shares in this fashion. Stopping any further money going to Hibs was a new direction. The game changed when the takeover happened for reasons I've gone over before and will continue to do so as Hibs develops. Hopefully members paying in fully understand the nature of the moving target they are aiming for though.

I do and so do many others. Your campaign against us is not benefiting anyone.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[banchoryhibs]

Absolutely and that's the way it goes when in a collective. I was a member, had contributed since the start and then I decided to stop when I didn't agree with the future use of the money.

The 'original' aim though was not the same as this. Originally the money went to the club as effectively a donation due to the generosity of Sir Tom giving up his shares in this fashion. Stopping any further money going to Hibs was a new direction. The game changed when the takeover happened for reasons I've gone over before and will continue to do so as Hibs develops. Hopefully members paying in fully understand the nature of the moving target they are aiming for though.

Your understanding of HS's original aims is not accurate. Initially all donations received by HS were transferred to the club as payment for shares that had not been allocated to any individual. There was no free gift, the shares were not previously held by STF and HS grew a meaningful share in the ownership of the club.
Covid then happened and donations were then gifted to the club to help it survive the crisis.
Post covid HS reverted to the original aim to use donations to purchase shares as and when they become available.
HS members fully endorsed these policies.
Nobody knows when, or how, further shares will become available but, rest assured, if there is a new share issue HS will be at the front of the queue to purchase these. In this instance all money goes to the club. If other shares become available the money would go to whomsoever.

[chippy]

Your understanding of HS's original aims is not accurate. Initially all donations received by HS were transferred to the club as payment for shares that had not been allocated to any individual. There was no free gift, the shares were not previously held by STF and HS grew a meaningful share in the ownership of the club.
Covid then happened and donations were then gifted to the club to help it survive the crisis.
Post covid HS reverted to the original aim to use donations to purchase shares as and when they become available.
HS members fully endorsed these policies.
Nobody knows when, or how, further shares will become available but, rest assured, if there is a new share issue HS will be at the front of the queue to purchase these. In this instance all money goes to the club. If other shares become available the money would go to whomsoever.
Thanks for clearing up these misconceptions

[Rick Rude]

I get the impression that a minority on here are almost hoping that any plans for outside investment falls thru.

It's a funny old world.

I think there's some on here (not sure about in the real world) that have a fear of Hibs actually being good for once.

[NYHibby]

So Gordon family willing to divest part of their shareholding? Would the new investor bring in new cash or would it just be a secondary transfer with no extra cash for Hibs?

It’s my understanding that all of the shares that can be issued by the directors without a shareholder vote have now been allocated. To issue new shares will require a special resolution, which needs to pass with 75%. The majority owners have only 67%, meaning they need to get HSL to agree or not quite 50% of all other minority shareholders.

If I was HSL, I would refuse to vote for that resolution unless pre-emption rights for existing shareholders are reinstated. This means that HSL and people like me have a chance to buy new shares before outside investors to prevent our shareholdings being diluted.

[JimBHibees]

Nothing sensible from Kickback - it's Friday night and they are all wibbling on about Buckfast and their sisters underwear.

:faf:

[BobbyT1875]

It’s my understanding that all of the shares that can be issued by the directors without a shareholder vote have now been allocated. To issue new shares will require a special resolution, which needs to pass with 75%. The majority owners have only 67%, meaning they need to get HSL to agree or not quite 50% of all other minority shareholders.

If I was HSL, I would refuse to vote for that resolution unless pre-emption rights for existing shareholders are reinstated. This means that HSL and people like me have a chance to buy new shares before outside investors to prevent our shareholdings being diluted.
I won’t be voting for that resolution if it was tabled. Was the pre -emotion rights removed as part of byland buying out Hibernian holding shares ?

[NYHibby]

I won’t be voting for that resolution if it was tabled. Was the pre -emotion rights removed as part of byland buying out Hibernian holding shares ?

No, I believe it was done when STF decided to start selling shares again as part of the package of amendments made then.

The articles weren’t amended when the current majority owners bought out HFC Holdings. From memory, there were no shareholders votes as part of that. They bought all of Holdings’ shares and were issued all of the remaining shares the directors could allocate. Hence why issuing any new shares would require a special resolution.

[Leithenhibby]

Thanks for your worthless advice.

If the cap fits...:rolleyes:

[TrinityHFC]

Your understanding of HS's original aims is not accurate. Initially all donations received by HS were transferred to the club as payment for shares that had not been allocated to any individual. There was no free gift, the shares were not previously held by STF and HS grew a meaningful share in the ownership of the club.
Covid then happened and donations were then gifted to the club to help it survive the crisis.
Post covid HS reverted to the original aim to use donations to purchase shares as and when they become available.
HS members fully endorsed these policies.
Nobody knows when, or how, further shares will become available but, rest assured, if there is a new share issue HS will be at the front of the queue to purchase these. In this instance all money goes to the club. If other shares become available the money would go to whomsoever.

The initial offer of shares to individuals and HSL was possible because Sir Tom was willing to dilute his holding with the money going to the club and not any existing shareholder.

The combined aims of money going in to the club and fans being able to build up a shareholding was fine.

I just think the current aims are wrong and destined to not work as and when investment come in, that’s all. It is hardly a negative campaign against anyone as some people in this thread seem to be suggesting. It is called discussion. If any fan collectives are to be in any way successful then members, and I am one in HSL, should be able to debate.

If anyone wants to report my posts then please do otherwise please stick to debating what I’m saying.

[CentreLine]

The initial offer of shares to individuals and HSL was possible because Sir Tom was willing to dilute his holding with the money going to the club and not any existing shareholder.

The combined aims of money going in to the club and fans being able to build up a shareholding was fine.

I just think the current aims are wrong and destined to not work as and when investment come in, that’s all. It is hardly a negative campaign against anyone as some people in this thread seem to be suggesting. It is called discussion. If any fan collectives are to be in any way successful then members, and I am one in HSL, should be able to debate.

If anyone wants to report my posts then please do otherwise please stick to debating what I’m saying.

Think you quoted the wrong person on this occasion. Banchory’s post was pretty informative and balanced. I get your point though.

As an HSL member you’ll have had the chance to enter the draw to enjoy match day hospitality at ER. This is certainly a good example where HSL are still putting money in to the club, only without the benefit of being tax free. I do fee the club could be more interactive with, currently, its second largest shareholder though.

[A Hi-Bee]

No good crying over spilled milk. To get back to reality about our potential NEW investor, if Bill Foley also opens up his franchise in Auckland to play in the Australian A league, then not only do we get Yankee dollars but we also get loadsa Dingo dollars, bring it on I say.
Perhaps non, Hibs supporters may not like this but this is but it would be a dark night if nothing happens now, I say lets go for it.
The fact that it will piss off hertz, sheep and Atillas is a real added bonus.

GGTTH

:thumbsup:

[CropleyWasGod]

It’s my understanding that all of the shares that can be issued by the directors without a shareholder vote have now been allocated. To issue new shares will require a special resolution, which needs to pass with 75%. The majority owners have only 67%, meaning they need to get HSL to agree or not quite 50% of all other minority shareholders.

If I was HSL, I would refuse to vote for that resolution unless pre-emption rights for existing shareholders are reinstated. This means that HSL and people like me have a chance to buy new shares before outside investors to prevent our shareholdings being diluted.

I'm not sure that non-HS shareholders would be that bothered about their share value being diluted.

If it's framed as a simple "pass this resolution and there will be £x extra for the club", it wouldn't be that difficult a motion to carry. Those who would vote against it would be painted as unambitious and short-sighted. (not necessarily how I would paint them, to be clear).

[TrinityHFC]

I'm not sure that non-HS shareholders would be that bothered about their share value being diluted.

If it's framed as a simple "pass this resolution and there will be £x extra for the club", it wouldn't be that difficult a motion to carry. Those who would vote against it would be painted as unambitious and short-sighted. (not necessarily how I would paint them, to be clear).

I think that’s right. It’s also 75% of the votes actually cast so there would need to be a decent movement of private shareholders against it. The argument as you say would be what is more important between future investment and growth versus the percentage of the club that HSL own.

[chippy]

I think that’s right. It’s also 75% of the votes actually cast so there would need to be a decent movement of private shareholders against it. The argument as you say would be what is more important between future investment and growth versus the percentage of the club that HSL own.
Who are they anyway these HS supporters , what do they think they are ? Just a few thousand honest to goodness Hibernian supporters……..but let them eat cake…..who cares about them … not us anyway

[GloryGlory]

I think that’s right. It’s also 75% of the votes actually cast so there would need to be a decent movement of private shareholders against it. The argument as you say would be what is more important between future investment and growth versus the percentage of the club that HSL own.

I'm both an HSL member and own a small number of shares in my own name. I'm more concerned about Hibs being more successful than whether my personal shareholding is 0.000001% or 0.0000011%. Same for my miniscule share of the total HSL shareholding.

[OfficialHSL]

Absolutely and that's the way it goes when in a collective. I was a member, had contributed since the start and then I decided to stop when I didn't agree with the future use of the money.

The 'original' aim though was not the same as this. Originally the money went to the club as effectively a donation due to the generosity of Sir Tom giving up his shares in this fashion. Stopping any further money going to Hibs was a new direction. The game changed when the takeover happened for reasons I've gone over before and will continue to do so as Hibs develops. Hopefully members paying in fully understand the nature of the moving target they are aiming for though.

Trinity
We hope you don't mind us clarifying something here. Your post, we think, gives the impression that HSL changed. For the avoidance of doubt that is not correct. Our primary objective has remained the same since day one - to acquire as many shares in the Club as possible. We will always try to do that. It may be that your thoughts have changed since then and of course your are perfectly entitled to do that. We just don't want Members or indeed others drawing the wrong conclusions from your post.

HSL

[blackpoolhibs]

Trinity
We hope you don't mind us clarifying something here. Your post, we think, gives the impression that HSL changed. For the avoidance of doubt that is not correct. Our primary objective has remained the same since day one - to acquire as many shares in the Club as possible. We will always try to do that. It may be that your thoughts have changed since then and of course your are perfectly entitled to do that. We just don't want Members or indeed others drawing the wrong conclusions from your post.

HSL

Well said. :top marks

[TrinityHFC]

Who are they anyway these HS supporters , what do they think they are ? Just a few thousand honest to goodness Hibernian supporters……..but let them eat cake…..who cares about them … not us anyway

Not sure what your point is? We’re talking about the ownership structure of a business. What are you looking for the smaller shareholders to have?

[OfficialHSL]

I’m astonished that a collective of working and middle class men and women many of whom have held skilled trades or professional jobs for their lifetime , some indeed who may have held leading/ managerial positions in the public and private sectors, possibly financial sector would find a way to democratically elect a group of suitable professional persons to run their business in a modern , intelligent manner

It would appear that most have done just that and have adopted a prudent governance structure.

HSL

[TrinityHFC]

Trinity
We hope you don't mind us clarifying something here. Your post, we think, gives the impression that HSL changed. For the avoidance of doubt that is not correct. Our primary objective has remained the same since day one - to acquire as many shares in the Club as possible. We will always try to do that. It may be that your thoughts have changed since then and of course your are perfectly entitled to do that. We just don't want Members or indeed others drawing the wrong conclusions from your post.

HSL

The game changed though when the ownership did. HSL asked members what they wanted to do and they voted to not provide donations to Hibs. That’s fine but my point is that’s now a model that won’t work for HSL in future.

I’d think the aims of fans joining HSL were mixed. Some would have wanted to see a build up of shares for whatever means that supports, others would have seen it as a way of also making a donation. I was in that category, so that did change and that’s why I continue to be a member but I’m not putting more money in as it will never now go to Hibs.

[OfficialHSL]

I think that’s right. It’s also 75% of the votes actually cast so there would need to be a decent movement of private shareholders against it. The argument as you say would be what is more important between future investment and growth versus the percentage of the club that HSL own.

Your point and CWG is valid and why our goal is to ultimately achieve 25.1%. As with many aspects of business it surely can't do any harm to have appropriate checks and balance.

HSL

[NYHibby]

I'm not sure that non-HS shareholders would be that bothered about their share value being diluted.

If it's framed as a simple "pass this resolution and there will be £x extra for the club", it wouldn't be that difficult a motion to carry. Those who would vote against it would be painted as unambitious and short-sighted. (not necessarily how I would paint them, to be clear).

This is why I said HSL should demand something, like reinstatement of pre-emption rights, in return for supporting it. The current majority owners and any new outside investors would prefer to have the vote wrapped up in advance and also not have to rely on small, unpredictable shareholders. Getting HSL’s votes is the only way to do that.

Reinstatement of pre-emption rights is not a cure all. In some takeover scenarios it would be meaningless. But there are some scenarios where it at least keeps open more doors for HSL and other minority shareholders remaining at a combined 25%+1 or results in more equity investment than there would otherwise be as the new investors would need to buy more shares than they otherwise would to dilute HSL and others.


I think that’s right. It’s also 75% of the votes actually cast so there would need to be a decent movement of private shareholders against it. The argument as you say would be what is more important between future investment and growth versus the percentage of the club that HSL own.

This is only correct if they call a general meeting to pass the resolution. It is total voting rights if they do it by post, which I think would be the preference if they’d have to mail something (notice of the meeting) to everyone anyway.

[chrisski33]

Hopefully delivers the goods if hasbt had second thoughts after today

[neil7908]

I've been posting regularly about my concerns but I'm raging after tonight. I've just seen too many of these so near but yet so far type performances over the years.

The way I feel now I'd take investment from North Korea if it meant we could start winning these games as often as we should.

[Glory Lurker]

I've been posting regularly about my concerns but I'm raging after tonight. I've just seen too many of these so near but yet so far type performances over the years.

The way I feel now I'd take investment from North Korea if it meant we could start winning these games as often as we should.

With you, chief, although wouldn't go as far as North Korea (ken it was tongue in cheek).

[ScottB]

Thing is, Bournemouth are currently benefitting from his wealth and his teams stats, scouting and what not, and they’re currently on track to end the season with about 20 points.

What evidence is there that he or his team actually know what they’re doing? Bournemouth are relegation candidates, are they identifying gems? Blooding young players in their droves? Because on the surface they look like they’re at risk of going down despite the guy who is ‘guaranteeing’ us third place’s best efforts…

For the record, I have no objection to being in a club network, but if we’re going to be that, let it be in a network with a successful club and ownership group that actually knows what it’s doing.

[zitelli62]

Bring it on I'm fed up losing games we should win any investment appreciated.

[hibee1875]

What’s the time frame on this if it is to go ahead?

[oxymoron]

Thing is, Bournemouth are currently benefitting from his wealth and his teams stats, scouting and what not, and they’re currently on track to end the season with about 20 points.

What evidence is there that he or his team actually know what they’re doing? Bournemouth are relegation candidates, are they identifying gems? Blooding young players in their droves? Because on the surface they look like they’re at risk of going down despite the guy who is ‘guaranteeing’ us third place’s best efforts…

For the record, I have no objection to being in a club network, but if we’re going to be that, let it be in a network with a successful club and ownership group that actually knows what it’s doing.

I get your point, but to be fair, finishing third in Scotland is a whole different ball game to even surviving in the English top flight. The levels of foreign investment put it on a unique level in the football world never mind any comparisons with Scotland. I think the margins between third and sixth/ seventh here are so slim that it wouldn't take much to tip the scale. The potentially exciting bit is the potential to break into the top two. With the right momentum and good decisions i don't think thats impossible, and the Champions League would be a whole lot more interesting to the investors than the other European competitions.

[Eyrie]

I don't think that anyone is going to invest enough money in Hibs for us to compete with the Ugly Sisters. That would be £25k per week x 25 players ie £32.5m per season (plus transfer fees less additional prize money) and the rewards just don't justify that.

However a smaller up front investment of say £8m per season would provide enough for us to secure third on a regular basis which would provide sufficient income (prize money, attendances, sponsorship, transfer fees) to massively reduce the annual investment and it could become self financing until/unless Aberdeen or Hearts can match it.

Keeping Bournemouth in the English top flight each season is an achievement but having Hibs makes the group stages in Europe at least one season in two and challenging for cups would provide a more tangible reward for an investor.

[Chorley Hibee]

Get the investment done.

Fed up of just bumbling along as we do.

[Jack]

I don't think that anyone is going to invest enough money in Hibs for us to compete with the Ugly Sisters. That would be £25k per week x 25 players ie £32.5m per season (plus transfer fees less additional prize money) and the rewards just don't justify that.

However a smaller up front investment of say £8m per season would provide enough for us to secure third on a regular basis which would provide sufficient income (prize money, attendances, sponsorship, transfer fees) to massively reduce the annual investment and it could become self financing until/unless Aberdeen or Hearts can match it.

Keeping Bournemouth in the English top flight each season is an achievement but having Hibs makes the group stages in Europe at least one season in two and challenging for cups would provide a more tangible reward for an investor.

I don't think anyone has said there would be sufficient investment to complete with the old firm other than a few on here who haven't been following what little we've had to go on 🤔

One of the first things to strike me about the speculation was that tieing down 3rd was both sensible and pragmatic.

[JohnM1875]

Get that money in and invested in the team pronto. Sick of days like yesterday. Shocking record at Hampden.

Must be done but not announced if BK was telling folk in hospitality about major investment after the Celtic game.

[Stairway 2 7]

Get it done, create new shares if they want that. Giving it a chance is better than bumbling along as is. Outside investment is the only way we can compete with Hearts and Aberdeen financially

[GloryGlory]

What’s the time frame on this if it is to go ahead?

They have been talking for "a few weeks" according to reports. I would imagine that, once some sort of agreement in principle is outlined, the lawyers and accountants will move in to do due diligence. So could take a couple more months, unless agreement was reached quite quickly and the due diligence is already in progress.

The good thing is Hibs are based in Edinburgh and our customer market is basically east Scotland, all our property is here, all our employees are based here and contracts are all here, so it's not as if the due diligence is looking at multiple business operations in a multinational context, which takes time.

[Greenworld]

They have been talking for "a few weeks" according to reports. I would imagine that, once some sort of agreement in principle is outlined, the lawyers and accountants will move in to do due diligence. So could take a couple more months, unless agreement was reached quite quickly and the due diligence is already in progress.

The good thing is Hibs are based in Edinburgh and our customer market is basically east Scotland, all our property is here, all our employees are based here and contracts are all here, so it's not as if the due diligence is looking at multiple business operations in a multinational context, which takes time.I suspect talks have been going on for some time before we got a sniff of it. I hope that is the case and we can bring in a few players at the next window.

Sent from my SM-G975U1 using Tapatalk

[GloryGlory]

I suspect talks have been going on for some time before we got a sniff of it. I hope that is the case and we can bring in a few players at the next window.

Sent from my SM-G975U1 using Tapatalk

I wonder if Ron's passing prompted Foley's interest in acquiring a shareholding? Could have been talking for a few months, rather than a few weeks.

[Greenworld]

I wonder if Ron's passing prompted Foley's interest in acquiring a shareholding? Could have been talking for a few months, rather than a few weeks.Speculation but perhaps Ron started a discussion on knowing his illness was terminal. That would not suprise me knowing how driven he was for Hibs. Either way it certainly brings an excitement to see how it pans out.

Sent from my SM-G975U1 using Tapatalk

[ScottB]

I get your point, but to be fair, finishing third in Scotland is a whole different ball game to even surviving in the English top flight. The levels of foreign investment put it on a unique level in the football world never mind any comparisons with Scotland. I think the margins between third and sixth/ seventh here are so slim that it wouldn't take much to tip the scale. The potentially exciting bit is the potential to break into the top two. With the right momentum and good decisions i don't think thats impossible, and the Champions League would be a whole lot more interesting to the investors than the other European competitions.

I’m not sure catching the Old Firm is going to be viable, or whether we’d be able to meet the FFP requirements to still be able to play in the Champions League even if it was.

I guess the other point I was driving at is, if being in the Bournemouth / Foley network isn’t that appealing in a sporting sense beyond some cash, what happens when other networks move in?

If we assume Scotland is a market ripe for investment, and we go with Foley. What happens with the club networks that actually develop players; City Group, Brighton etc turn up looking for clubs? Or even just ones with deeper pockets like Newcastle or Chelsea? Do we get left behind as, say, Hearts and Aberdeen benefit from ending up in better networks?

I’m not sure what we gain from being the first, the price we sell for presumably ends up being less, other clubs then potentially end up with better partners…

On paper I’d say we are the most attractive option; excellent training centre, nice stadium, appealing city etc all make for a decent place to send prospects to. If we’re going to do this, let’s play the market, who else is out there, who else might be interested? What is their plan beyond having some cash?

[CapitalGreen]

I’m not sure catching the Old Firm is going to be viable, or whether we’d be able to meet the FFP requirements to still be able to play in the Champions League even if it was.

I guess the other point I was driving at is, if being in the Bournemouth / Foley network isn’t that appealing in a sporting sense beyond some cash, what happens when other networks move in?

If we assume Scotland is a market ripe for investment, and we go with Foley. What happens with the club networks that actually develop players; City Group, Brighton etc turn up looking for clubs? Or even just ones with deeper pockets like Newcastle or Chelsea? Do we get left behind as, say, Hearts and Aberdeen benefit from ending up in better networks?

I’m not sure what we gain from being the first, the price we sell for presumably ends up being less, other clubs then potentially end up with better partners…

On paper I’d say we are the most attractive option; excellent training centre, nice stadium, appealing city etc all make for a decent place to send prospects to. If we’re going to do this, let’s play the market, who else is out there, who else might be interested? What is their plan beyond having some cash?

Brentford’s owner has had a team in Denmark and Brighton owner has had a team in Belgium for a number of years yet there has been no massive influx of other groups investing in teams in those leagues, why do you think it will happen here?

[Since90+2]

Brentford’s owner has had a team in Denmark and Brighton owner has had a team in Belgium for a number of years yet there has been no massive influx of other groups investing in teams in those leagues, why do you think it will happen here?

Perhaps because the ability to move players between Scotland and the biggest football market in the world in England is far easier than EU countries. That's both from a footballing culture wise and more practically due to EU rules.

[ScottB]

Brentford’s owner has had a team in Denmark and Brighton owner has had a team in Belgium for a number of years yet there has been no massive influx of other groups investing in teams in those leagues, why do you think it will happen here?

City Group own one, reportedly Newcastle are buying into a Belgian club also, Everton’s prospective owners already have one.

It may or may not, ultimately it’s not been allowed here before now. Will Foley be the only one to give it a look? Maybe, maybe not.

We went through a spell of Americans in general buying in, wouldn’t be a shock if we see a similar thing happen with club networks.

[Ozyhibby]

Brentford’s owner has had a team in Denmark and Brighton owner has had a team in Belgium for a number of years yet there has been no massive influx of other groups investing in teams in those leagues, why do you think it will happen here?

How many players actually move between those clubs?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ScottB]

How many players actually move between those clubs?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Brighton have certainly sent a few guys to Belgium, most recently Mitoma.

[Musselbound]

Some thoughts on this after having a few days to digest the info and think it over... There seems to be a lot of assumption around that this investment would be enough to 'guarantee' third place. This is a lot easier to say than do. With our current finances we should be virtually guaranteed top 5 each season but not so. There have been times when European Group Stage football should have nailed down third place for Hearts or Aberdeen but that's never happened yet.

Also what happens if Bournemouth get relegated from the Premier League and end up somewhere like say where Norwich are at the moment?

We've had a number of players on loan from big English clubs in the past that haven't really improved our team.

So I won't be getting excited until I see evidence of a very significant level of investment in our first team and players that are a lot better than we currently have.

[A Hi-Bee]

Sooner the better.

[Renfrew_Hibby]

Can we no just find someone to ***** all his money at us like the guy did at Blackburn all those years ago.

I just want a we bit of hope, expectancy and excitement

[Donegal Hibby]

Can we no just find someone to ***** all his money at us like the guy did at Blackburn all those years ago.

I just want a we bit of hope, expectancy and excitement

I'd love us to find our very own Jack Walker too , rich and is a supporter of the club and has its best interests as the main priority above any other clubs . That I'd be all for mate 👍

[Gmack7]

Any other info to suggest this might happen? I certainly hope it does

[matty_f]

Any other info to suggest this might happen? I certainly hope it does

I heard that it’s still on the table, hopefully hear more about it soon.

[matty_f]

Any other info to suggest this might happen? I certainly hope it does

I heard that it’s still on the table, hopefully hear more about it soon.

[Hibby Kay-Yay]

I heard that it’s still on the table, hopefully hear more about it soon.

I just wanna wish you both good luck, we’re all counting on you.

[Heedersnvolleys]

I saw a Ferrari going towards the training center yesterday through Tranent and the driver looked awfy like the guy fi Bournemouth

[Torto7]

I saw a Ferrari going towards the training center yesterday through Tranent and the driver looked awfy like the guy fi Bournemouth

No way he drove a Ferrari up from the south coast. He might have hired one mind.

[Dazzjw1875]

Some posts on twitter are suggesting he has completed his minority stake takeover, to be announced the morn I would assume if true?

[A Hi-Bee]

Some posts on twitter are suggesting he has completed his minority stake takeover, to be announced the morn I would assume if true?


Hope it is true. if only to piss the Atillas and the diet Attilas off.

:thumbsup:

[Bridge hibs]

Some posts on twitter are suggesting he has completed his minority stake takeover, to be announced the morn I would assume if true?

Would have expected the main media outlets would be all over that if it was true rather than couple of lines in a tweet or whatever they are called

[CapitalGreen]

Would have expected the main media outlets would be all over that if it was true rather than couple of lines in a tweet or whatever they are called

No idea if there is any truth in the tweet but Foley’s investment was being discussed on here for 6 weeks before anyone on the main media outlets reported on it.

[bingo70]

Would have expected the main media outlets would be all over that if it was true rather than couple of lines in a tweet or whatever they are called

It was all over the Twittersphere and .net months before the BBC started to report it last week.

[bingo70]

https://x.com/fabrizioromano/status/1722312780668162553?s=46&t=VghJuoU_bl8ISs-zf5CmHg

Could this be a potential spanner in the works?

[Alex Trager]

Hope it is true. if only to piss the Atillas and the diet Attilas off.

:thumbsup:

Good way to get it up the swear filter. Will utilise from now on.

[Hibs90]

Nothing on companies house

[JohnM1875]

https://x.com/fabrizioromano/status/1722312780668162553?s=46&t=VghJuoU_bl8ISs-zf5CmHg

Could this be a potential spanner in the works?

Could work in our favour? Doesn’t that mean that Bournemouth couldn’t loan players from us or his other teams, doesn’t mean we couldn’t loan them from Bournemouth or other teams.

The good ones could come to Hibs for an easier work permit then shipped off to Bournemouth for a fee

Could be completely wrong about that though.

[Bridge hibs]

No idea if there is any truth in the tweet but Foley’s investment was being discussed on here for 6 weeks before anyone on the main media outlets reported on it.

Yeah Im aware of that, I was meaning more that it was a done deal

[ScottB]

Did we need that SFA rule to change first?

[ScottB]

https://x.com/fabrizioromano/status/1722312780668162553?s=46&t=VghJuoU_bl8ISs-zf5CmHg

Could this be a potential spanner in the works?

Think that’s aimed at them not being able to loan players back from Saudi clubs, cough Newcastle cough, than the chance of us having a Premier League quality player to send down there.

[Daniel 1875]

Did we need that SFA rule to change first?

Not for a minority stake.

[Greencore]

Not sure what to make of this. Talk about an 8 figure sum for 5 years? Also saw on a Spanish twitter page he's in neogations with an option to increase and buy

[GloryGlory]

Not sure what to make of this. Talk about an 8 figure sum for 5 years? Also saw on a Spanish twitter page he's in neogations with an option to increase and buy

Any links to these twitter reports/rumours?

[CapitalGreen]

https://x.com/fabrizioromano/status/1722312780668162553?s=46&t=VghJuoU_bl8ISs-zf5CmHg

Could this be a potential spanner in the works?

Can’t see us loaning any players to Bournemouth anytime soon.

[Greencore]

Any links to these twitter reports/rumours?

https://twitter.com/WeArePLeague/status/1722231593648152920?t=1A-PAKaFxFKF8QEQPf-REg&s=19

[Greencore]

Any links to these twitter reports/rumours?

https://twitter.com/Mercado_Ingles/status/1722057107388686833?t=5W9bDpRQHb674gVrPtoLwA&s=19

[Greencore]

Any links to these twitter reports/rumours?

https://twitter.com/PedzKeenan/status/1722297445659320442?t=PU8ozf_Birj-m9S44zXyqA&s=19

[GloryGlory]

https://twitter.com/Mercado_Ingles/status/1722057107388686833?t=5W9bDpRQHb674gVrPtoLwA&s=19

Thanks!

[Haymaker]

Not sure what to make of this. Talk about an 8 figure sum for 5 years? Also saw on a Spanish twitter page he's in neogations with an option to increase and buy

Sensible to put an option in, if the Gordon's ever want to sell fully he would want to be first informed and able to get in early if he's been investing/building the club for a while.

[Heedersnvolleys]

No way he drove a Ferrari up from the south coast. He might have hired one mind.

That explains it as it was nae red it was $#!ty maroon colour

[Keepthefaith]

translation below - doesn't tell us much more:rolleyes:

Bournemouth owner and owner Bill Foley is negotiating the purchase of Scottish side Hibernian, primarily as a minority shareholder with options to buy and increase his stake in the club over time. [Sky]

[Since452]

translation below - doesn't tell us much more:rolleyes:

Bournemouth owner and owner Bill Foley is negotiating the purchase of Scottish side Hibernian, primarily as a minority shareholder with options to buy and increase his stake in the club over time. [Sky]

He's 78. You'd imagine that time won't be too long.

[HoboHarry]

So we have a Knight called William at the top table with a possibility of becoming top man? Our very own in-house King William should have the Sevco mutants apoplectic.....

[Glory Lurker]

Ha! I had actually forgotten all about this! Saturday must have hit me harder than I thought.

[Fuzzywuzzy]

Any relation to glen, Gary and Gordon?🫣

[Gmack7]

Any relation to glen, Gary and Gordon?🫣

If he is he hasn't been seen in the Clermiston inn

[Slim Shady]

Any relation to glen, Gary and Gordon?🫣

He had a laddie called Axel. Not involved in family business. Think he’s a detective in Detroit or L.A.

[jakedance]

A tie in with a Premiership club seems like a good idea but what happens when they’re, inevitably, a mid table Championship club? I’m not blind to the gulf in finances between Hibs and that level, and I don’t have a problem with the model, per se, but I’d want to understand how much our prospects are tied to the success of the favoured club. Or am I missing something?

[Nicho87]

Get yer bank card out bill. January sales here we come.

[CapitalGreen]

A tie in with a Premiership club seems like a good idea but what happens when they’re, inevitably, a mid table Championship club? I’m not blind to the gulf in finances between Hibs and that level, and I don’t have a problem with the model, per se, but I’d want to understand how much our prospects are tied to the success of the favoured club. Or am I missing something?

Why is it inevitable that they are a mid table Championship club? They’ve spent 7 of the last 9 seasons in the Premier League. Even if they are relegated they’ll more likely than not bounce straight back up.

[jakedance]

Why is it inevitable that they are a mid table Championship club? They’ve spent 7 of the last 9 seasons in the Premier League. Even if they are relegated they’ll more likely than not bounce straight back up.

Fair point. Inevitable is too strong a word but I don’t see them playing at that level long term. My question is what’s the impact on us if Bournemouth slide into mediocrity and is that a risk worth taking?

[Jack]

A tie in with a Premiership club seems like a good idea but what happens when they’re, inevitably, a mid table Championship club? I’m not blind to the gulf in finances between Hibs and that level, and I don’t have a problem with the model, per se, but I’d want to understand how much our prospects are tied to the success of the favoured club. Or am I missing something?

A better question might just be "How does the performance or prospects of individual clubs in the group affect the others?

For example, as it stands at the moment, Hibs have the best chance of qualifying for a European competition.

Can we get a loan of a handful of £20m Bournemouth players till at least Christmas* please?

* Next season, next Christmas!

[LancashireHibby]

I genuinely don’t see a scenario where we are the preferred club should there ever be a choice between funding, potential players and the like.

[Dmas]

A tie in with a Premiership club seems like a good idea but what happens when they’re, inevitably, a mid table Championship club? I’m not blind to the gulf in finances between Hibs and that level, and I don’t have a problem with the model, per se, but I’d want to understand how much our prospects are tied to the success of the favoured club. Or am I missing something?

Obviously making Bournemouth a premier league club will be a main objective but selling players will be another, players performing in the championship will carry a higher value than someone performing at our level so I’d think even if they become a mid table club down there in championship they would still carry favour if we are playing in Europe or not

[Phil MaGlass]

Bournemouth wont be fighting for European spots just survival, there's maybe a better chance of their good young boys coming our way I would think?

[Mick O'Rourke]

Any relation to glen, Gary and Gordon?��

Amateurs ! Are they not jambos ?
I cannae mind ...no seen them fur years.
Barred oot the Clerry off and on then off again back in the day....... like masel !!
Their faither sometimes had a jar with my auld man in Mathers(West End) many moons ago .

I remember a Peter Foley,originally from Muirhouse.(1970s)
Good Hibs laddie.No seen him either for a long time/
And a Peter Foley was an official at the Hibs club/bus convener? with one of the branches when i was younger.:hmmm: i think !
Not an uncommon Irish name amongst the faithful back in my youth.

[Mick O'Rourke]

If he is he hasn't been seen in the Clermiston inn
:greengrin


:drunk:

[04Sauzee]

Rumours are that Bournemouth are about change their technical director.

Sources: Bournemouth chief Richard Hughes to leave the club
Bournemouth technical director Richard Hughes is set to leave his role at the club before the end of the year, sources have told Football Insider.

Hughes, 44, has been the Cherries’ football and recruitment chief since 2014 following his retirement as a player the same year

[Mick O'Rourke]

Rumours are that Bournemouth are about change their technical director.

Sources: Bournemouth chief Richard Hughes to leave the club
Bournemouth technical director Richard Hughes is set to leave his role at the club before the end of the year, sources have told Football Insider.

Hughes, 44, has been the Cherries’ football and recruitment chief since 2014 following his retirement as a player the same year

Whinging fan camp down there by all accounts.
Dont see him coming here though.
Loves the South of England/London too much. i think.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZacOeAW6J4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W520H5aX0Iw

[04Sauzee]

Whinging fan camp down there by all accounts.
Dont see him coming here though.
Loves the South of England/London too much. i think.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZacOeAW6J4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W520H5aX0Iw

Nah wasn't expecting him to come here, just interested to see if he does go, what Bournemouth will do to replace him.

[HoboHarry]

Whinging fan camp down there by all accounts.
Dont see him coming here though.
Loves the South of England/London too much. i think.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZacOeAW6J4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W520H5aX0Iw
He won't be short of offers, well equipped to work in England and Italy with his upbringing.

[Mick O'Rourke]

Nah wasn't expecting him to come here, just interested to see if he does go, what Bournemouth will do to replace him.
Yes
The overall facts are not yet clear on his leaving.
He has been there awhile
Maybe fancies a new challenge
He also has been around some good football people down south.and elsewhere
He was born in Glasgow.... But seems to be a real anglophile now
But who knows what he and Foley may have up their sleeve ,if Bill comes on board at Hibs.

[bingo70]

Rumours are that Bournemouth are about change their technical director.

Sources: Bournemouth chief Richard Hughes to leave the club
Bournemouth technical director Richard Hughes is set to leave his role at the club before the end of the year, sources have told Football Insider.

Hughes, 44, has been the Cherries’ football and recruitment chief since 2014 following his retirement as a player the same year

Didn’t seem to be very popular with the Bournemouth fans going by their reaction on Twitter.

When the news of Foley investing in Hibs broke, the media were saying it would mean a new technical director coming in. Is that the same job as Brian McDermott does for us just now? Would be disappointed if he wasn’t required in the new regime.

[A Hi-Bee]

As part of a group of clubs it aint done Girona any harm at all. Top of the Spanish la Liga.
What are we waiting on Hibs, get it done.

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/67369969

:thumbsup:

[H18S NX]

Amateurs ! Are they not jambos ?
I cannae mind ...no seen them fur years.
Barred oot the Clerry off and on then off again back in the day....... like masel !!
Their faither sometimes had a jar with my auld man in Mathers(West End) many moons ago .

I remember a Peter Foley,originally from Muirhouse.(1970s)
Good Hibs laddie.No seen him either for a long time/
And a Peter Foley was an official at the Hibs club/bus convener? with one of the branches when i was younger.:hmmm: i think !
Not an uncommon Irish name amongst the faithful back in my youth....Peter is still going about m8 and still uses the Hibs club,spoke to him a few weeks ago,BTW,who disnae get barred oot the Clerry? It was a badge of honour Mick as i am sure you know m8.

[NAE NOOKIE]

Fair point. Inevitable is too strong a word but I don’t see them playing at that level long term. My question is what’s the impact on us if Bournemouth slide into mediocrity and is that a risk worth taking?

Once he's heard SOL being sung at ER Bournemouth will get dropped like a hot tattie and the Hibees will be his club of choice :greengrin

[ScottB]

As part of a group of clubs it aint done Girona any harm at all. Top of the Spanish la Liga.
What are we waiting on Hibs, get it done.

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/67369969

:thumbsup:

I’d say there’s likely a big difference between the City Group and a personal Guardiola family stake and Bournemouth, sadly…

[Nevi_SOL]

Went very quiet

[Greencore]

Went very quiet

These things normally are.

[hibsforeurope]

Went very quiet

I'd imagine nothing will be done until after our annual accounts are published, made available to Foley. if i was guessing an announcement may tie in with the AGM, unless it's in April like last year.

[CropleyWasGod]

I'd imagine nothing will be done until after our annual accounts are published, made available to Foley. if i was guessing an announcement may tie in with the AGM, unless it's in April like last year.

If he's interested, he will already have them, together with the current year's information.

[Ringothedog]

I'd imagine nothing will be done until after our annual accounts are published, made available to Foley. if i was guessing an announcement may tie in with the AGM, unless it's in April like last year.

I would think that he has already had access to all this information. Nobody would invest blindly.

[hibsforeurope]

I would think that he has already had access to all this information. Nobody would invest blindly.

I wasn't suggesting he would invest blindly, just trying to guess (like almost everyone else) when/if we might here some confirmation of a deal.

[chippy]

These things normally are.

Make the announcement after we’ve made 3 quality signings. Why do it now as it will just increase fees, wages demanded by clubs players and agents

[7Hero]

Deals already done we will be the last to know.btijg in the January sales .

[GloryGlory]

Deals already done we will be the last to know.btijg in the January sales .

You got a source for this?

[superfurryhibby]

We've seen that the likes of 5 million + per year isn't making a huge difference to on field performance in Gorgie.

Given our managerial turnaround since the Gordon's came in and our own on-field issues, who's to say we would do any better with a similar amount of cash? The difference being that we would be selling a significant share of our club to someone with no emotional investment in Hibs at all (we surely accept that isn't the case for the Gordon family). Does this not add vulnerability?

We've also seen that Hibs can generate a much greater turnover through smart commercial initiatives and most agree that there is more to be derived from that going forward.

I see that most people are in favour of more external investment, but there's very little discussion around what happens if it turns sour.

[ScottB]

In terms of managerial turn around, there’s only like 19 clubs in the Scottish leagues with a manager who has been in post for longer than a year, and only two of them in the top flight.

I’m not sure we’re markedly more trigger happy than anybody else is these days…

[Paulie Walnuts]

In terms of managerial turn around, there’s only like 19 clubs in the Scottish leagues with a manager who has been in post for longer than a year, and only two of them in the top flight.

I’m not sure we’re markedly more trigger happy than anybody else is these days…

We’re not really.

In the last decade we’ve had 8. Hearts have had 8. Motherwell 7, Dundee 8, Killie 9, St Mirren 10.

I can’t be bothered looking up everybody in our league but I’d suggest we’re probably fairly average.

[Islington Hibs]

We’re not really.

In the last decade we’ve had 8. Hearts have had 8. Motherwell 7, Dundee 8, Killie 9, St Mirren 10.

I can’t be bothered looking up everybody in our league but I’d suggest we’re probably fairly average.


Those are fascinating stats and an utter inditement of how clubs should be run. No sensible business would hire and fire on that basis.

[HoboHarry]

Those are fascinating stats and an utter inditement of how clubs should be run. No sensible business would hire and fire on that basis.
Football isn't a sensible business.

[Onceinawhile]

I see the Washington capitals pumped the Vegas golden knights last night.

[Dazzjw1875]

Deals already done we will be the last to know.btijg in the January sales .

Tbf your not the first to say this, but if it is indeed done why is nothing being announced or indeed mentioned elsewhere by folk in the know.

[bingo70]

Tbf your not the first to say this, but if it is indeed done why is nothing being announced or indeed mentioned elsewhere by folk in the know.

Is that not a bit contradictory? You said at the start he’s not the first to say it?

Other folk in the know are saying it’s a done deal, the media have also reported negotiations are taking place, there’s not much else they can say until it’s made official.

I would guess there is a lot of legal paperwork to conclude before it can be announced officially and that’s what the hold up is but who knows.

[cabbageandribs1875]

i just caught the end of a news item on CNN news the other day about the Vegas Golden Knights visiting the Whitehouse for a ceremony with Joe Biden

Joe Biden welcomes NHL Stanley Cup winners Vegas Golden Knights to White House (yahoo.com) (https://uk.news.yahoo.com/joe-biden-welcomes-nhl-stanley-002817052.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuYmluZy5jb20v&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAA4v2FvWdGCzdZctIiBhTNdVKhHA azqKNoFB1NtU10O635kixbvkW594q1KsMb75ap_GCLLRjEDWjG 7-1CZOQ2YBiCVX3ePIP-Wd_Ek8YX6c8ZHn3WVQezeXa5M_DtyLQKdadEDiC0xuTHfXnEiX sjT_JQVAX9Os-FuHj60P2tg0)



nae mention of the Hibs though :I'm waiti:I'm waiti

[Donegal Hibby]

Hands Off Hibs 💚

[Since90+2]

Hands Off Hibs 💚

Eh?

[Hibs4185]

i just caught the end of a news item on CNN news the other day about the Vegas Golden Knights visiting the Whitehouse for a ceremony with Joe Biden

Joe Biden welcomes NHL Stanley Cup winners Vegas Golden Knights to White House (yahoo.com) (https://uk.news.yahoo.com/joe-biden-welcomes-nhl-stanley-002817052.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuYmluZy5jb20v&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAA4v2FvWdGCzdZctIiBhTNdVKhHA azqKNoFB1NtU10O635kixbvkW594q1KsMb75ap_GCLLRjEDWjG 7-1CZOQ2YBiCVX3ePIP-Wd_Ek8YX6c8ZHn3WVQezeXa5M_DtyLQKdadEDiC0xuTHfXnEiX sjT_JQVAX9Os-FuHj60P2tg0)



nae mention of the Hibs though :I'm waiti:I'm waiti

They told Joe Biden to announce the hibee deal but he forgot and walked off stage 🤷

[Green_one]

They told Joe Biden to announce the hibee deal but he forgot and walked off stage 🤷

Then fell over:greengrin

[matty_f]

Then fell over:greengrin

And did a backflip.

[HFC93]

Hands Off Hibs 💚

Why?

[Donegal Hibby]

Why?

I'm not keen on the idea of someone buying into or taking over Hibs that owns / has shares in other clubs were our football club won't be the main priority but is just one of a number of clubs being acquired by Bill Foley to help in Bournemouths progression . Looks like it's going to happen so I'm not going to get into an argument with anyone about it .👍

[RoxburghHibs]

I'm not keen on the idea of someone buying into or taking over Hibs that owns / has shares in other clubs were our football club won't be the main priority but is just one of a number of clubs being acquired by Bill Foley to help in Bournemouths progression . Looks like it's going to happen so I'm not going to get into an argument with anyone about it .👍

It’s a fair concern to have. Bottom line is we all just want Hibs to prosper so any new investment whilst welcome will understandably draw cautious questions.

I have a good feeling about this - not sure it’s justified- but it’s likely based on the fact we’ve underachieved for so long I’m open to investment that will push us upwards

[McD]

I'm not keen on the idea of someone buying into or taking over Hibs that owns / has shares in other clubs were our football club won't be the main priority but is just one of a number of clubs being acquired by Bill Foley to help in Bournemouths progression . Looks like it's going to happen so I'm not going to get into an argument with anyone about it .👍



We don’t know it’s to help in bournemouths progression (equally we don’t know that it isn’t either)

What if it helps our progression too? Whatever the specifics around money etc could be, if we were finishing third 3 -4 seasons out of 5, getting to group stage European football most seasons, and likely to achieve these and by achieving these, have better players to watch, wouldn’t that be a net positive?

[RoxburghHibs]

We don’t know it’s to help in bournemouths progression (equally we don’t know that it isn’t either)

What if it helps our progression too? Whatever the specifics around money etc could be, if we were finishing third 3 -4 seasons out of 5, getting to group stage European football most seasons, and likely to achieve these and by achieving these, have better players to watch, wouldn’t that be a net positive?

This is where I am.

If this backing were to see us finishing 3rd most seasons (maybe even challenging top 2 or at least closing the gap on them), getting to group stages in Europe, and winning a cup here and there that would be a massive step forward for us.

[bingo70]

https://www.footballscotland.co.uk/spfl/scottish-premiership/bill-foley-further-hibs-takeover-28144160

Bill Foley confirms he’s getting involved with a Scottish club. Interestingly a Dutch club as well, I haven’t heard about that, wonder who that is.

[Bridge hibs]

The billionaire owner of Bournemouth has dropped a further hint that his plans to buy Hibs could come to fruition in the near future after he launched an A-League franchise

Buy hibs ? I thought he was only buying a percentage 😵

[bingo70]

The billionaire owner of Bournemouth has dropped a further hint that his plans to buy Hibs could come to fruition in the near future after he launched an A-League franchise

Buy hibs ? I thought he was only buying a percentage 😵

Seems to be mixed messages on that one. Initially it was reported it was to become a minority shareholder. There are quotes from him though where he states he doesn’t do minority shareholder as he’s a self confessed control freak. Reports have since come out that i read on some random Spanish twitter account with millions of followers and appeared credible that although initially it would be a minority shareholder, the plan would be to increase that later to become a major shareholder.

I’ve really no idea but I wonder if doing it this way is to give the Gordon family reassurances he’s in it for the long haul.

[MagicSwirlingShip]

What’s the Dutch team he he interested in?

[Donegal Hibby]

From owning shares to now buying us along with other clubs so that we can be in a pyramid of clubs with the main focus to develop players for our lord and master " Bournemouth" !!. Really concerning times that our football will lose its identity by becoming one of there feeder clubs now 😞

[Stairway 2 7]

From owning shares to now buying us along with other clubs so that we can be in a pyramid of clubs with the main focus to develop players for our lord and master " Bournemouth" !!. Really concerning times that our football will lose its identity by becoming one of there feeder clubs now 😞

If we have players that can feed into the EPL we'll be 10 levels above where we are now. Boyle, Nisbet, Newel even Porteous aren't that level. John McGinn is the only player in decades probably that would be in that level. If we were to be a feeder club it would take massive investment year on year and a enormous shift in quality of player.

Or we can stay midtable outspent by hearts and Aberdeen year on year

[DaveF]

From owning shares to now buying us along with other clubs so that we can be in a pyramid of clubs with the main focus to develop players for our lord and master " Bournemouth" !!. Really concerning times that our football will lose its identity by becoming one of there feeder clubs now 😞

We know. You have said 'feeder club' a million times before 🙄

[Hibernian Verse]

From owning shares to now buying us along with other clubs so that we can be in a pyramid of clubs with the main focus to develop players for our lord and master " Bournemouth" !!. Really concerning times that our football will lose its identity by becoming one of there feeder clubs now 😞

I can hear an echo

[Greenworld]

What’s the Dutch team he he interested in?Ak alkmaar

Sent from my SM-G975U1 using Tapatalk

[matty_f]

From owning shares to now buying us along with other clubs so that we can be in a pyramid of clubs with the main focus to develop players for our lord and master " Bournemouth" !!. Really concerning times that our football will lose its identity by becoming one of there feeder clubs now 😞

A feeder club would be a step up from where we are now. At the moment we're lucky if we get a player that's good enough to move upwards from Hibs, our best players have gone to the heady heights of the English Championship or Saudi Arabia.

If we're getting players on a track to the Premiership then that's got to beat good thing. In what way do we lose our identify? That's just a cliche thrown out with no real meaning.

[SickBoy32]

If we have players that can feed into the EPL we'll be 10 levels above where we are now. Boyle, Nisbet, Newel even Porteous aren't that level. John McGinn is the only player in decades probably that would be in that level. If we were to be a feeder club it would take massive investment year on year and a enormous shift in quality of player.

Or we can stay midtable outspent by hearts and Aberdeen year on year

Valid concerns from the poster IMO.

Additional concerns:
- Foleys age / succession planning.
- Bournemouth's long term future in the EPL, certainly not a given.
- General group structure, will this impact our future ability to get the best price from the wider market for any sellable players?
- And in the real world, how many players from a club in NZ are going to end up being good enough for the EPL? (Not many / none!)

Bit in bold, Aberdeen finished 3rd last year, Hearts the season before, ourselves the year before that. We've also won both cups more recently than either side. I don't think being outspent (marginally, if at all IMO) really counts for anything - it just comes down to the quality of coach / scouting team at a particular point in time

[Mick O'Rourke]

Seems to be mixed messages on that one. Initially it was reported it was to become a minority shareholder. There are quotes from him though where he states he doesn’t do minority shareholder as he’s a self confessed control freak. Reports have since come out that i read on some random Spanish twitter account with millions of followers and appeared credible that although initially it would be a minority shareholder, the plan would be to increase that later to become a major shareholder.

I’ve really no idea but I wonder if doing it this way is to give the Gordon family reassurances he’s in it for the long haul.

Reminding me some of a guy named Murdoch.
And i dont refer to Oor Wullies pal, PC Murdoch.

[The Harp]

Must admit to being concerned over this. Foley's investment in the Club would be welcome, but taking us over, and adding to his portfolio, isn't for me.
I want Hibs' owner's main focus of attention to be solely on Hibs, and not have us as some kind of secondary outfit behind Bournemouth.

[bingo70]

From owning shares to now buying us along with other clubs so that we can be in a pyramid of clubs with the main focus to develop players for our lord and master " Bournemouth" !!. Really concerning times that our football will lose its identity by becoming one of there feeder clubs now 😞

How do you see it panning out in practise and what specifically are you worried about. I don’t mean things like losing our identity, I mean actual practical tangible things happening that would be bad for our club?

We will still have a board of directors at Hibs focused on making us as good as possible, same applies to our management team. We won’t be sitting about discussing how we can make Bournemouth better.

The only down side I can think of is if we have a really outstanding player we won’t get market value for him if he goes to another club in the group. That would be a bit ****. In all honesty though, if we only got that player because we are part of the group or if to compensate for that player we get say 10 other players we previously couldn’t afford then that more than makes up for it.

The whole purpose of groups like this is for them all to be successful and to assist each other to get better. If we are crap and lingering about the bottom of the league then were no good to anybody else in the group.

I’m all for it.

[Since452]

From owning shares to now buying us along with other clubs so that we can be in a pyramid of clubs with the main focus to develop players for our lord and master " Bournemouth" !!. Really concerning times that our football will lose its identity by becoming one of there feeder clubs now ��

We're a feeder club already really. We just don't have any players that "bigger" clubs want to take. If we did they'd be gone in a flash. If we had players that were good enough to make the step up to the EPL that would only be a good thing for Hibs?

[hibsforeurope]

From owning shares to now buying us along with other clubs so that we can be in a pyramid of clubs with the main focus to develop players for our lord and master " Bournemouth" !!. Really concerning times that our football will lose its identity by becoming one of there feeder clubs now 😞

Not sure how this sale/takeover/investment would lead to us losing our identity? we would still be Hibs, we would just be owned by a different American owner than we are currently.

[GloryGlory]

Not sure how this sale/takeover/investment would lead to us losing our identity? we would still be Hibs, we would just be owned by a different American owner than we are currently.

And we'd still be in the same place in the football pyramid, but maybe with the chance to be more successful more often.

[Hibbyradge]

How do you see it panning out in practise and what specifically are you worried about. I don’t mean things like losing our identity, I mean actual practical tangible things happening that would be bad for our club?

We will still have a board of directors at Hibs focused on making us as good as possible, same applies to our management team. We won’t be sitting about discussing how we can make Bournemouth better.

The only down side I can think of is if we have a really outstanding player we won’t get market value for him if he goes to another club in the group. That would be a bit ****. In all honesty though, if we only got that player because we are part of the group or if to compensate for that player we get say 10 other players we previously couldn’t afford then that more than makes up for it.

The whole purpose of groups like this is for them all to be successful and to assist each other to get better. If we are crap and lingering about the bottom of the league then were no good to anybody else in the group.

I’m all for it.

I think I agree.

In reality, how often are we going to have a player good enough for Bournemouth to want?

If they're relying on us to feed them, they're going to be very hungry!

[Jones28]

From owning shares to now buying us along with other clubs so that we can be in a pyramid of clubs with the main focus to develop players for our lord and master " Bournemouth" !!. Really concerning times that our football will lose its identity by becoming one of there feeder clubs now 😞

Absolute pish.

But you know that of course, because you've been told before and had the same replies over and over again.

[Donegal Hibby]

We know. You have said 'feeder club' a million times before 🙄

Slight exaggeration from you there D 😂 or is it that nobody's entitled to a different opinion from your own !.

[Jones28]

A feeder club would be a step up from where we are now. At the moment we're lucky if we get a player that's good enough to move upwards from Hibs, our best players have gone to the heady heights of the English Championship or Saudi Arabia.

If we're getting players on a track to the Premiership then that's got to beat good thing. In what way do we lose our identify? That's just a cliche thrown out with no real meaning.

I hear Foley is to rename us Hibournemouth, ER is to be renamed the Leithality and we will start playing in stripes next season - green and white 2024/25, green and black 25/26 and finally transitioning to red and black in 26/27.

[Stairway 2 7]

The vocal minority will complain but it'll all come down to results. If there's an improvement then no one will care where we are in a pyramid, if we do worse than now there will be criticism. It's hard to think after investment we'd be worse off

[Paulie Walnuts]

Absolute pish.

But you know that of course, because you've been told before and had the same replies over and over again.

Just because they’ve been ‘told before’ it doesn’t mean they now need to succumb to the opinion of the person that ‘told’ them.

And I say that as someone who wants this to happen.

I don’t think it’s unfair to say we’ll be a feeder club. That’s fine with me, but if someone doesn’t fancy the way that might look, they’re perfectly entitled to feel that way.

In terms of losing our identity, absolutely nobody can say for certain either way how this is going to look, so again, I’m not sure them being ‘told’ by people who also have no idea how this will look is all that valid. I like the idea of Hibs being a community club and partnering with local business for things. Use Pilot as an example. We do loads with them, but what if any ventures like this in future are to be ventures that are group specific rather than club specific and see us partnering with Heineken as a group instead of Pilot as our own individual club etc? I wouldn’t be all that bothered, but if that would bother some fans then they’re perfectly entitled to not like the idea of it.

Like I said, I’m all for it, even if we lose our community side of things, as quite frankly I’m pretty fed up of Scottish football/our mid table place in the pecking order as things stand. I don’t see Donegals concerns as being all that unreasonable though and the idea of someone being told how this is going to go when nobody knows whether it’s even going to happen, let alone what it’ll look like, is nonsense.

[weecounty hibby]

From owning shares to now buying us along with other clubs so that we can be in a pyramid of clubs with the main focus to develop players for our lord and master " Bournemouth" !!. Really concerning times that our football will lose its identity by becoming one of there feeder clubs now 😞

Hibs have been a feeder club my entire 50 years of watching us. Usually to the bigot twins, sometimes to big English clubs(many years ago now) often to clubs we would consider to not be of our stature in the game. If we at any point manage to supply EPL level players we will be lightyears above our current position. Is it because its Bournemouth that uts an issue or would it be the same if ut was the City group? You may not like it but sadly teams like Bournemouth with not even a small % of the history we have are now so far above our level that a link with them makes sense. Just take a look at the English lower leagues and you will see loads of clubs who you would think would be better than Bournemouth but they're not. Between English league 1 and 2 there are about a dozen clubs that used to be in the premier or old div1. Football has changed massively and if this benefits Hibs, which I think it will, then I'm all for it.

[Donegal Hibby]

Must admit to being concerned over this. Foley's investment in the Club would be welcome, but taking us over, and adding to his portfolio, isn't for me.
I want Hibs' owner's main focus of attention to be solely on Hibs, and not have us as some kind of secondary outfit behind Bournemouth.

This is very much were I'm at with it too , all great getting a new owner that's going to invest in the club who make Hibs his main priority though to become 4th or 5th on a list of priorities isn't for me either.

[Donegal Hibby]

Absolute pish.

But you know that of course, because you've been told before and had the same replies over and over again.

Fair enough I bow out to your superior knowledge on the matter 👍

[Unseen work]

If we have players that can feed into the EPL we'll be 10 levels above where we are now. Boyle, Nisbet, Newel even Porteous aren't that level. John McGinn is the only player in decades probably that would be in that level. If we were to be a feeder club it would take massive investment year on year and a enormous shift in quality of player.

Or we can stay midtable outspent by hearts and Aberdeen year on year

Bang on.

Even half the Celtic and rangers team would improve us but wouldn’t get a look in at Bournemouth.

If we’re at a stage where our players potentially go from us to Bournemouth that is a very good thing.

Unless they get relegated and then very average 🤣

[Jones28]

Just because they’ve been ‘told before’ it doesn’t mean they now need to succumb to the opinion of the person that ‘told’ them.

And I say that as someone who wants this to happen.

I don’t think it’s unfair to say we’ll be a feeder club. That’s fine with me, but if someone doesn’t fancy the way that might look, they’re perfectly entitled to feel that way.

In terms of losing our identity, absolutely nobody can say for certain either way how this is going to look, so again, I’m not sure them being ‘told’ by people who also have no idea how this will look is all that valid. I like the idea of Hibs being a community club and partnering with local business for things. Use Pilot as an example. We do loads with them, but what if any ventures like this in future are to be ventures that are group specific rather than club specific and see us partnering with Heineken as a group instead of Pilot as our own individual club etc? I wouldn’t be all that bothered, but if that would bother some fans then they’re perfectly entitled to not like the idea of it.

Like I said, I’m all for it, even if we lose our community side of things, as quite frankly I’m pretty fed up of Scottish football/our mid table place in the pecking order as things stand. I don’t see Donegals concerns as being all that unreasonable though and the idea of someone being told how this is going to go when nobody knows whether it’s even going to happen, let alone what it’ll look like, is nonsense.

PP has made the same argument over and over again to the point that everyone knows thats their opinion that they don't need to keep banging on about it at every turn.

It adds nothing to the conversation.

[Jones28]

Fair enough I bow out to your superior knowledge on the matter 👍

Haha ok cheerio.

[hibbie02]

I just can’t get my head around us having Bournemouth as some sort of pinnacle to aim for. They are a poor Premier League club, with a crap stadium and a much smaller fan base than us. I’ve lived in Bournemouth and a football town it is not.

Even if he pumped a billion quid into Bournemouth, they might have better players and a new stadium, but they would never fill it and it is highly doubtful they would ever reach European level. Unfortunately for Bournemouth, their billionaire is not as rich as the big teams.

I just can’t see what the attraction is of Bournemouth as a club, to an old man with too much money. If we are tied into that, it might get us a short term boost, but once the whole multi club concept is understood, I fear our rivals might get snapped up by owners/budgets much bigger than us and we will still be shackled to bleeding Bournemouth…


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