Fenlon has to go (post Malmo)

[Treadstone]

I would be interested to see what the poll statistics would be if the poll had been conducted from sunday evening. I wonder if those supporting fenlon might have changed their minds.

They haven't been spotted in the last 24 hours.

[Northernhibee]

They haven't been spotted in the last 24 hours.

It's probably because .net does irritating overreactions like no other place.

I have my doubts about Pat but similarly think that the problems that lie far beyond manager level. If we're struggling after the first round of games then I'll probably be in the Fenlon to go camp but for just now I'll back him, albeit with some reservations.

[GreenArmyyy!]

I would be interested to see what the poll statistics would be if the poll had been conducted from sunday evening. I wonder if those supporting fenlon might have changed their minds.

To be honest before Sunday I was firmly in Fenlon's camp but not being able to get the players to bounce back or at least put on a good performance after that debacle against Malmo is criminal. If we lose the derby then he can't survive in the job. I really wanted him to succeed but he really doesn't help himself with his tactics and interviews. Saying yesterday 'if I can't do it then someone else will' or words to that effect seems like a man that has lost his drive to succeed with us.

[Hibernia&Alba]

Our possible impotence was my biggest fear before kick off yesterday, and at full time that opinion seemed confirmed. The fact we were missing a few at the back yet I remained more concerned about the possibilities going forward, is worrying in itself. We had a wee spell around the hour mark where we had a few attempts on target, but for the rest of the match we didn't look dangerous. There wasn't the creativity to cut Motherwell open and so provide Collins with a clear chance. I thought Williams looked good in goal and Thomson put in a great shift, but our play was all a bit predictable and easy to defend against. We need some pace and a bit of flair in the side quickly. It looks a bit grim this morning, and the derby is going to be a huge game. Lose that and I think Fenlon might be out the door. It's now or never wee man.

[Gustavo Fring]

who knows , if he can mastermind a cricket score win at tynecastle - it will lift the gloom and restore some pride for himself and us

[Liberal Hibby]

:agree:

Pat Fenlon, "i would have been happy with a draw. GTF Pat.



Wouldn't we all? Eight players out suspended or injured, makeshift defence and the first outing for a new forward.

Yeh I'd have taken a point and from the highlights I thought we were pretty unlucky not to get one.

[greenlex]

It's probably because .net does irritating overreactions like no other place.

I have my doubts about Pat but similarly think that the problems that lie far beyond manager level. If we're struggling after the first round of games then I'll probably be in the Fenlon to go camp but for just now I'll back him, albeit with some reservations.

Northern this is exactly where I am. It would be stupid to bin him on the back of the Euro humping after backing him in the transfer market. The performance yesterday wasnt horrendous. Hell yeh it could have been better but it wasnt bad. Folk saying things like players not trying a leg are just nonsense. If Fenlon had gone 4-4-2 yesterday and Motherwell done a Malmo and ripped the midfield a new one he would have been slaughtered for not going 4-5-1. If either of the two centre backs had done better at the goal and one of chances had gone in he would have been lucky. Lets see what the season brings when more players are available and after this team has had time together. If its looking bad then he goes. I dont think he will survive as too many have had enough already. Doesnt make it right.
Having said all of that if he cant take something next week against a bunch of laddies then that might be time. Next weeks performance has to be like our last visiit there.

[PeterboroHibee]

I thought the defence did okay yesterday apart from the two occasions they let Sutton and the guy who scored through. The problem is that required the three in midfield to provide cover almost the whole game, which meant we almost had nothing going forward.

The lack of creativity really is worrying.Thomson was very impressive, but he doesnt have the legs to carry the team like he was trying/needed to do yesterday. He should be winning the ball and have options going forward, not having to try and break to score himself. We have far too many central midfielders to the point where we have no other options and these guys are out of position. I understand he is a quality player, but I think people wanting Claros are mad, the last thing we need is another central midfielder - we need proper wingers and shouldnt be relying on Craig, Stanton, Vine, Handling etc as makeshift wide men. We are also so bloody slow, Im not saying we should sign someone just because they are quick, but it would be nice to have that variation in the squad.

[GreenArmyyy!]

Wouldn't we all? Eight players out suspended or injured, makeshift defence and the first outing for a new forward.

Yeh I'd have taken a point and from the highlights I thought we were pretty unlucky not to get one.
There is only so much you can take from highlights. If you had seen the full game then you would see why everyone is angry. I supported Fenlon to the hilt even after Malmo but yesterday tipped the edge for me.

[Treadstone]

It's probably because .net does irritating overreactions like no other place.

I have my doubts about Pat but similarly think that the problems that lie far beyond manager level. If we're struggling after the first round of games then I'll probably be in the Fenlon to go camp but for just now I'll back him, albeit with some reservations.

Granted but this isn't about one or two games its his whole abject tenure.

[Callum_62]

I wqtched the whole game

Was pretty poor viewing to be honest, we had a couple of opening, as did Well.

I dont really get the slaughtering we took on sky....i can only remember a few chances for well, maybe one or two more than us.

Our problem was being far too negative. Possibly overprotection od the defence after losing 7 goals last week.

We actually looked ok when the shackles came off the midfield and we attacked.

We need to be more adventurous next week

[Northernhibee]

Granted but this isn't about one or two games its his whole abject tenure.

He's also brought some positives. Steadied the ship and rooted out the troublemakers after CC decimated us, taken us away from being a relegation battling team and raised good cash by reaching two cup finals. Brought us the likes of Claros and Williams, developed the likes of Harris and Sparky.

He's also done a lot wrong but too many aren't looking at a balanced picture.

He's deservedly getting questions asked of him but IMO the talk of binning him now is just silly.

However if we're bottom six after the first round of games I would have to say the time would be right for him to leave.

[Beefster]

Northern this is exactly where I am. It would be stupid to bin him on the back of the Euro humping after backing him in the transfer market. The performance yesterday wasnt horrendous. Hell yeh it could have been better but it wasnt bad. Folk saying things like players not trying a leg are just nonsense. If Fenlon had gone 4-4-2 yesterday and Motherwell done a Malmo and ripped the midfield a new one he would have been slaughtered for not going 4-5-1. If either of the two centre backs had done better at the goal and one of chances had gone in he would have been lucky. Lets see what the season brings when more players are available and after this team has had time together. If its looking bad then he goes. I dont think he will survive as too many have had enough already. Doesnt make it right.
Having said all of that if he cant take something next week against a bunch of laddies then that might be time. Next weeks performance has to be like our last visiit there.

It would be stupid to bin him now after backing him in the transfer market but if he doesn't win the next game, it's time to get rid?

[PeterboroHibee]

I wqtched the whole game

Was pretty poor viewing to be honest, we had a couple of opening, as did Well.

I dont really get the slaughtering we took on sky....i can only remember a few chances for well, maybe one or two more than us.

Our problem was being far too negative. Possibly overprotection od the defence after losing 7 goals last week.

We actually looked ok when the shackles came off the midfield and we attacked.

We need to be more adventurous next week

Neither team can be proud of the performance, but at the end of the day Motherwell walked away with 3 points.

Whilst chances were few and far between, apart from the odd Hibs spell Motherwell dominated the game. They moved the ball about quicker and with more accuracy than us, had players moving positively for the ball, and McCall made changes to win the game.

[Hibby 2005]

He's also brought some positives. Steadied the ship and rooted out the troublemakers after CC decimated us, taken us away from being a relegation battling team and raised good cash by reaching two cup finals. Brought us the likes of Claros and Williams, developed the likes of Harris and Sparky.

He's also done a lot wrong but too many aren't looking at a balanced picture.

He's deservedly getting questions asked of him but IMO the talk of binning him now is just silly.

However if we're bottom six after the first round of games I would have to say the time would be right for him to leave.

He'll be binned at the end of the season as Petrie will realise that relegation is unlikely given Hearts situation therefore no real panic.

[Captain Trips]

Time to go regardless of next weeks result.

[DaveF]

Northern this is exactly where I am. It would be stupid to bin him on the back of the Euro humping after backing him in the transfer market. The performance yesterday wasnt horrendous. Hell yeh it could have been better but it wasnt bad. Folk saying things like players not trying a leg are just nonsense. If Fenlon had gone 4-4-2 yesterday and Motherwell done a Malmo and ripped the midfield a new one he would have been slaughtered for not going 4-5-1. If either of the two centre backs had done better at the goal and one of chances had gone in he would have been lucky. Lets see what the season brings when more players are available and after this team has had time together. If its looking bad then he goes. I dont think he will survive as too many have had enough already. Doesnt make it right.
Having said all of that if he cant take something next week against a bunch of laddies then that might be time. Next weeks performance has to be like our last visiit there.

After a promising opening 10 mins, our midfield gave up on attempting any sort of posession and sat way back inviting Motherwell to keep the ball.

4-4-2 could not have been any worse.

We have the players. Sadly we have an tactically incompetent manager which is holding us back.

[Callum_62]

Neither team can be proud of the performance, but at the end of the day Motherwell walked away with 3 points.

Whilst chances were few and far between, apart from the odd Hibs spell Motherwell dominated the game. They moved the ball about quicker and with more accuracy than us, had players moving positively for the ball, and McCall made changes to win the game.

3 points is all that matter ofcourse. But we were totally ripped anew one (and we were poor, and defensive)for all the dominating well done tho, they only created one more chance than us.

Think we are getting a raw deal a tad from the media actually.

Dont get me wrong, most of the game was really poor fare...a real bore

Ir that doest improve then Fenlon will have to go.

I actually think the set up yesterday was ok....but really missing the support of the full backs. Getting mcgivern back will help, and hopefully clancy too.

[Makaveli]

The time to go is now.

The fact that losing to this shadow Hearts side seems possible says everything.

[BarneyK]

Neither team can be proud of the performance, but at the end of the day Motherwell walked away with 3 points.

Whilst chances were few and far between, apart from the odd Hibs spell Motherwell dominated the game. They moved the ball about quicker and with more accuracy than us, had players moving positively for the ball, and McCall made changes to win the game.

Don't agree with this at all. For as toothless as we were, I thought we dominated much of the match and looked fairly comfortable.

[Onion]

The time to go is now.

The fact that losing to this shadow Hearts side seems possible says everything.

Not sure why Fenlon is still hanging around the club TBH. He cannot win on Sunday. If Hibs win, it will be because Hearts were weak and seen as buying a poor manager more time. If we lose, Fenlon gets sacked.

[YehButNoBut]

There`ll be a lot of us didn`t catch what he said. Could you or someone maybe sum it up, or quote what he said? That would be much appreciated. Thanks a lot!

Michael Stewart comments on Hibs


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJm_O9N30Nw&feature=youtu.be

[Gustavo Fring]

stewart is spot on . he's pulled on the green and white and he knows we should be going for the win at easter road

[greenlex]

After a promising opening 10 mins, our midfield gave up on attempting any sort of posession and sat way back inviting Motherwell to keep the ball.

4-4-2 could not have been any worse.

We have the players. Sadly we have an tactically incompetent manager which is holding us back.

Do you think Fenlon said to them before they went out to stop playing forward passes etc after say about 10 mins?

What was the score at home the last time we played at home in a competative match? What was the line up? Granted we were two goals down from the first leg but Saturday was more to do with what was available than much else I reckon. Watch what happens this Sunday when players are available against essentially a bunch of laddies. If its not a performance then I too will join the majority. Having watched the Yams on the tellybox and been at ER on Sunday I reckon we will win comfortably of not in scoreline then in manner. It wont matter to most though because as mentioned elsewhere if its a win it will be because Hearts are weak and will just be buying him more time before the inevitable.

[Gustavo Fring]

hibs are going to be met with a hostile reaction at tynecastle . the jambos have a seige mentality going on it will be noisy . can that bunch handle it ? beating them is not a foregone conclusion , the jambos may be inexperienced but they will be right up for this . locke wont be setting up for a draw he will go for it .

[Hermit Crab]

hibs are going to be met with a hostile reaction at tynecastle . the jambos have a seige mentality going on it will be noisy . can that bunch handle it ? beating them is not a foregone conclusion , the jambos may be inexperienced but they will be right up for this . locke wont be setting up for a draw he will go for it .

I honestly think they will best us. Purely because they play for the jersey!!!

[Gustavo Fring]

I honestly think they will best us. Purely because they play for the jersey!!!

that plus hibs have scored zero from 3 games so far and only conjured up about 4 shots on target

[Expecting Rain]

Couldn`t make the game due to work commitments but watched the extended highlights on Sky.
Thought there was nothing between the teams and that with Hibs bringing in basically half of a new team
that there were positive points to be taken and considered, my only gripe was that playing at home we
should have been more attack minded. Their winner was a speculative defensive header which landed
kindly for their substitute who is unknown to our league and looked very quick unfortunately!

[JCHibby]

Is he still in a job?

[GreenCastle]

Lose this weekend and he must go.

Win this weekend and give him a few more games.

Draw...depends how we play and the scoring goes but few more games.

We are 5 unbeaten against them...hopefully it's 6 Sunday evening.

[carnoustiehibee]

that plus hibs have scored zero from 3 games so far and only conjured up about 4 shots on target

I think you and hermit are on the wind up. Tyncastle hasn't been very hostile the last few times I've been, plus their or your team is ****in murder

[Waxy]

Can't see Hibs losing the derby. One thing to lose a scrappy 1-0 v motherwell but hearts? Nah. We wont lose to them.

[Brightside]

Northern this is exactly where I am. It would be stupid to bin him on the back of the Euro humping after backing him in the transfer market. The performance yesterday wasnt horrendous. Hell yeh it could have been better but it wasnt bad. Folk saying things like players not trying a leg are just nonsense. If Fenlon had gone 4-4-2 yesterday and Motherwell done a Malmo and ripped the midfield a new one he would have been slaughtered for not going 4-5-1. If either of the two centre backs had done better at the goal and one of chances had gone in he would have been lucky. Lets see what the season brings when more players are available and after this team has had time together. If its looking bad then he goes. I dont think he will survive as too many have had enough already. Doesnt make it right.
Having said all of that if he cant take something next week against a bunch of laddies then that might be time. Next weeks performance has to be like our last visiit there.

The point is tho Motherwell went 4-4-2, so for Fenlon to go with and also stick with a flat 4-5-1 is proof that he was trying to get a draw. That is really shocking and shows he doesnt rate his own players. That Motherwell team were poor and we should have got stuck in about them. WTF are we showing so much respect to average teams!

[The_Horde]

I honestly don't want him to go just yet. We've signed a fair few new players and things will take a few games to come together. He has built us a good squad and Petrie seems to have backed him well, especially if we sign Claros as expected.

The derby will make or break Fenlon. We win, he'll keep his job for the time being and it will be sweet to watch a full house of jambos go home devastated as we so often have for big games. If we lose he will be under immense pressure to walk/be sacked. I'm not even sure a draw will save him from that pressure.

If we win the derby (or if by some miracle he survives a defeat) we need to get back to playing the football we played at the start of last season in the following games or even I will begin to lose interest. If Fenlon can't survive this pressure and get us out the other side playing good football then be needs to leave. But he deserves the chance to get it right IMO.

[Aldo]

;3705164"]I honestly don't want him to go just yet. We've signed a fair few new players and things will take a few games to come together. He has built us a good squad and Petrie seems to have backed him well, especially if we sign Claros as expected.

The derby will make or break Fenlon. We win, he'll keep his job for the time being and it will be sweet to watch a full house of jambos go home devastated as we so often have for big games. If we lose he will be under immense pressure to walk/be sacked. I'm not even sure a draw will save him from that pressure.

If we win the derby (or if by some miracle he survives a defeat) we need to get back to playing the football we played at the start of last season in the following games or even I will begin to lose interest. If Fenlon can't survive this pressure and get us out the other side playing good football then be needs to leave. But he deserves the chance to get it right IMO.

Ben. The prob won't be the derby tbh... False hopes as Derby should really take care of itself... The prob is his inability to take the team forward. No tactics etc

Really nice guy but I think his time has come

[The_Horde]

Ben. The prob won't be the derby tbh... False hopes as Derby should really take care of itself... The prob is his inability to take the team forward. No tactics etc

Really nice guy but I think his time has come

I just meant that should we lose the derby the pressure will probably be too much for him to stay. If we win he might well end up staying longer and if that does happen he needs to get us back to playing how we were at the start of last season or he'll be gone by AGM time.

[Paisley Hibby]

Ben. The prob won't be the derby tbh... False hopes as Derby should really take care of itself... The prob is his inability to take the team forward. No tactics etc

Really nice guy but I think his time has come

My feelings too. I've wanted him to go for a while and was really angry that he wasn't sacked straight after the Malmo game. However, watching his interview last night I just felt sorry for him. He's a dead man walking and he knows it.

[BH Hibs]

I'm sure this has been mentioned before if not on this thread but previously on this board but who is in charge of fitness as it was plain to see after 75 mins we were blowing out our backsides? I think this is one of Fenlon's or his coaching staff's biggest failings. Don't want to turn this into an East Mains debate. :-)

[Keith_M]

Just a minor point on formations.

I personally don't think that 4-5-1 is intrinsically negative. A lot of team play this formation and can switch it to 4-3-3 during the game to make it more atacking.


My main issue is that Fenlon doesn't seem to be aware how to vary tactics/setup during a game. I realise we were short of some players but these were mostly defensive. There was no reason whatsoever he couldn't have set out to be more attack minded.

[silverhibee]

Wouldn't we all? Eight players out suspended or injured, makeshift defence and the first outing for a new forward.

Yeh I'd have taken a point and from the highlights I thought we were pretty unlucky not to get one.


Erm no we wouldn't, biggest majority of folk who were at the game were not happy that the manager decided after the 2nd half to play for a draw, Motherwell gave there new forward a run out too and he happened to score the winner.

Thing is we never got the draw we got beat on our first outing at home and the manager was very negative with his tactics, our first game of the season and the manager is being negative, what chance do we have for the rest of the season if he is going to be that negative and in charge, none, i watched the game from my seat up in the East and thought Motherwell created the better chances, and i also watched the highlights last night, i didn't think we were lucky to get a draw, Sutton should have scored with his one on one with our goalie, a great save by Williams from a McManus header, and they also had another couple half chances as well as there new striker getting on the scoresheet for Well, as for Hibs, Robertson shot on goal which was well saved by there keeper, and a half chance for Collins with a header that went wide.

Have you read what Fenlon had to say after the game, he seemed to think it was okay to get beat 1-0 as it was a improvement on last seasons first game where we lost 3-0 :rolleyes: deary ****ing me.

[HFC 0-7]

4-5-1 is not a negative formation. The tactics you deploy within that formation decide whether its negative or positive. I have seen 4-5-1 set ups with both wingers hitting the by line and causing all sorts of difficulties for opposition. I have seen 4-5-1 with the midfield set high up the pitch feeding off balls from the loan striker and then feeding the wingers.

the problem with our 4-5-1 is the gap between midfield and attack. We also have an inability to move the midfield forward as a unit and press a team back. You can see that when we have the ball the midfield is all over the place with a reluctance for players to get ahead of the ball. IMO we seem to have defending on our minds for the most part, when a hibs player is on the ball the players around take up a position where they can receive a pass but at the same time still be in a position to defend should we lose possession. We do not commit players forward from midfield and haven't for some time so even in a 4-4-2 the strikers will become isolated.

[Captain Trips]

Lose this weekend and he must go.

Win this weekend and give him a few more games.

Draw...depends Iow we play and the scoring goes but few more games.

We are 5 unbeaten against them...hopefully it's 6 Sunday evening.

Why give him more games for beating Hearts? If its that touch and go he has to go now or after that match regardless. What if we lose to Hearts but win game after or beat Hearts and then lose game after? Still same points. Gone too far its time to go.

[Aldo]

Erm no we wouldn't, biggest majority of folk who were at the game were not happy that the manager decided after the 2nd half to play for a draw, Motherwell gave there new forward a run out too and he happened to score the winner.

Thing is we never got the draw we got beat on our first outing at home and the manager was very negative with his tactics, our first game of the season and the manager is being negative, what chance do we have for the rest of the season if he is going to be that negative and in charge, none, i watched the game from my seat up in the East and thought Motherwell created the better chances, and i also watched the highlights last night, i didn't think we were lucky to get a draw, Sutton should have scored with his one on one with our goalie, a great save by Williams from a McManus header, and they also had another couple half chances as well as there new striker getting on the scoresheet for Well, as for Hibs, Robertson shot on goal which was well saved by there keeper, and a half chance for Collins with a header that went wide.

Have you read what Fenlon had to say after the game, he seemed to think it was okay to get beat 1-0 as it was a improvement on last seasons first game where we lost 3-0 :rolleyes: deary ****ing me.

PF is the man in charge of team affairs and part of his job is to change the team and set up when things are maybe not going right. He had the opportunity to bring in a forward when SR went off but chose to bring on another midfielder.

Going for a draw at home and then saying we've improved cos we got beaten 3-0 at the start of the previous season but only 1 nil at start of this season says it all.

Pat thanks but no thanks
U

[Treadstone]

If Fenlon gets a few more games by beating the yams then so be it. I will NEVER want us to lose to them to satisfy another agenda.

Ps I am not, never have and never will be a Fenlon fan.

[Keith_M]

I can't believe I just read this but Fenlon thinks the game on Sunday is at least an improvement on last season's first game of the season against Dundee Utd because we didn't lose by as many goals!



All hail the progress!

[BH Hibs]

PF is the man in charge of team affairs and part of his job is to change the team and set up when things are maybe not going right. He had the opportunity to bring in a forward when SR went off but chose to bring on another midfielder.

Going for a draw at home and then saying we've improved cos we got beaten 3-0 at the start of the previous season but only 1 nil at start of this season says it all.

Pat thanks but no thanks
U

It's decisions and quotes like this that make me feel more and more he's out his depth. Also with regards to the Robertson substitution he seemed to take an age to make the change where everyone could see he was done. I know you can't plan for injuries but at that stage of the game I feel he could've been better prepared as we were tiring badly

[Hermit Crab]

that plus hibs have scored zero from 3 games so far and only conjured up about 4 shots on target

The never had a shot at goal yesterday but our defence will let them fire at will.

[brog]

Someone on this thread likened PF to Mogadon Miller. I think the main element of truth in that is that he PF, spends far too much time worrying about the opposition, he was proud yesterday, rightly to some extent, that we had neutralised McFadden. As Budgie said to Miller (in his book), what about telling us what we're going to do to them! That's the culture change which needs to happen. I know John Collins gets a mixed reception from this forum but when he called Them, a pub team, that showed contempt not fear. That's what we need now.

[Unseen work]

Just wondering if this is the reason so many would like to keep Fenlon in charge? That we can't be bothered with sacking yet another manager with not a guaranteed good manager coming in, and If things don't pick up straight away needing to hear the "give him time, not his squad etc"

Are alot just wanting to see if he can finalllllly turn things around this season? He has his own squad which on paper does look good, and once everyone is fit plus hopefully another signing might see us kick on?

[rcarter1]

Just wondering if this is the reason so many would like to keep Fenlon in charge? That we can't be bothered with sacking yet another manager with not a guaranteed good manager coming in, and If things don't pick up straight away needing to hear the "give him time, not his squad etc"

Are alot just wanting to see if he can finalllllly turn things around this season? He has his own squad which on paper does look good, and once everyone is fit plus hopefully another signing might see us kick on?

Im not a fan of his tactics used thus far (is anyone?). But the team is building well, and if we can clear up injury wise then maybe we will see improvements. If the club have learned how to appoint the right man, and have said man in the wings then I could be bothered for change. If the only option is to sack and search then I definetely cant be bothered.. :dizzy:

[basehibby]

Just wondering if this is the reason so many would like to keep Fenlon in charge? That we can't be bothered with sacking yet another manager with not a guaranteed good manager coming in, and If things don't pick up straight away needing to hear the "give him time, not his squad etc"

Are alot just wanting to see if he can finalllllly turn things around this season? He has his own squad which on paper does look good, and once everyone is fit plus hopefully another signing might see us kick on?


More a recognition that

a) He has not been a complete disaster - despite a couple of horsings we'd love to forget there has also been 2 cup finals on the trot and definite improvement in league position.

b) A large part of the reason Hibs have gone downhill over the last 5 years or so is a relentless turnover of managers and players. Meaning a never ending transitional team which never ultimately progresses.

I've been a supporter of Fenlon's but am happy to admit he has weaknesses - he seems a bit tactically naive for a start which has cost us on occasion (although that can be improved on). But then there's very few managers out there who tick ALL the boxes - Kenny Sheils for example did well with Killie but was rightly criticised for talking out his erse half the time. Mowbray did excellently for Hibs but apparently couldn't spot a keeper to save his life. Butcher has done brilliantly in the Highlands but has somehow flopped whenever he's managed south of Loch Ness. I could go on - very few managers out there are beyond criticism.

Fenlon is no exception but on the plus side has a remarkable track record of success in Ireland which he HAS to some extent brought over the Irish Sea to Hibs - (2 Cup Finals in a row for the first time in my life time - edit - as a supporter) is not to be sniffed at). He's had a shocking start to this season with the 0-7 debacle BUT is that REALLY cause to forget the positives and rip it all up and start again? Not in my opinion. We need to give him the chance to finish the job he's started - let his latest round of team building get a chance to settle and see what it produces. If after a dozen games or so it seems we are going backwards rather than continuing to improve THEN pull the trigger - doing so now will condemn us to yet MORE disruption without ever knowing whether he could ultimately take us forward.

[The Green Goblin]

Michael Stewart comments on Hibs


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJm_O9N30Nw&feature=youtu.be


Cheers mate. Much appreciated. I think he`s right too.

[coldingham hibs]

More a recognition that

a) He has not been a complete disaster - despite a couple of horsings we'd love to forget there has also been 2 cup finals on the trot and definite improvement in league position.

b) A large part of the reason Hibs have gone downhill over the last 5 years or so is a relentless turnover of managers and players. Meaning a never ending transitional team which never ultimately progresses.

I've been a supporter of Fenlon's but am happy to admit he has weaknesses - he seems a bit tactically naive for a start which has cost us on occasion (although that can be improved on). But then there's very few managers out there who tick ALL the boxes - Kenny Sheils for example did well with Killie but was rightly criticised for talking out his erse half the time. Mowbray did excellently for Hibs but apparently couldn't spot a keeper to save his life. Butcher has done brilliantly in the Highlands but has somehow flopped whenever he's managed south of Loch Ness. I could go on - very few managers out there are beyond criticism.

Fenlon is no exception but on the plus side has a remarkable track record of success in Ireland which he HAS to some extent brought over the Irish Sea to Hibs - (2 Cup Finals in a row for the first time in my life time - edit - as a supporter) is not to be sniffed at). He's had a shocking start to this season with the 0-7 debacle BUT is that REALLY cause to forget the positives and rip it all up and start again? Not in my opinion. We need to give him the chance to finish the job he's started - let his latest round of team building get a chance to settle and see what it produces. If after a dozen games or so it seems we are going backwards rather than continuing to improve THEN pull the trigger - doing so now will condemn us to yet MORE disruption without ever knowing whether he could ultimately take us forward.


Forget results, league position & cups, the football is dire to watch that's what matters. Fenlon has to go or we will never see attractive football at Easter Road and crowds will dwindle. Who wants to watch Hibs winning 1-0 with one shot at goal, not me thanks.

[The Green Goblin]

Forget results, league position & cups, the football is dire to watch that's what matters. Fenlon has to go or we will never see attractive football at Easter Road and crowds will dwindle. Who wants to watch Hibs losing 1-0 with one shot at goal, not me thanks.

Fixed that for you.

[coldingham hibs]

Fixed that for you.

I did mean winning 1-0, I wasn't talking about Sunday.

What I was highlighting is the fact I would prefer to watch us attack and lose a game rather than play dire, boring football and scraping a 1-0 win.

[greenlex]

I can't believe I just read this but Fenlon thinks the game on Sunday is at least an improvement on last season's first game of the season against Dundee Utd because we didn't lose by as many goals!



All hail the progress!
Where and when did he say this?

[The Green Goblin]

I did mean winning 1-0, I wasn't talking about Sunday.

What I was highlighting is the fact I would prefer to watch us attack and lose a game rather than play dire, boring football and scraping a 1-0 win.


Fair dos - and I really wasn`t trying to be smart with you and I agree with your post above. Just these days, it`s often a case of being over cautious and losing. That`s all I meant. Maybe a smiley would have helped. :wink:

[chrisski33]

Where and when did he say this?

On bbc he mentioned that we lost 3-0 in our first game last season but we only lost 1-0 on sunday.
Time he went!

[YehButNoBut]

The Daily Express keeping tabs on our poll

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/420006/Hibernian-fans-growing-restless-for-Pat-Fenlon-s-head

Hibernian fans growing restless for Pat Fenlon's head

AN online poll of Hibs fans has resulted in an overwhelming vote for boss Pat Fenlon to quit.


Fenlon was booed off following Sunday’s defeat but said: “I don’t feel pressure, it’s about trying to win football matcheshttp://images.intellitxt.com/ast/adTypes/lb_icon1.png (http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/420006/Hibernian-fans-growing-restless-for-Pat-Fenlon-s-head#).”

However, the patience of supportershttp://images.intellitxt.com/ast/adTypes/icon1.png (http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/420006/Hibernian-fans-growing-restless-for-Pat-Fenlon-s-head#) is wearing thin following three straight defeats in competitive action in recent days, and with memories still fresh of another disappointing season that climaxed in May’s Scottish Cup Final loss to Celtic.


As of yesterday afternoon, the question of ‘Should the managerhttp://images.intellitxt.com/ast/adTypes/icon1.png (http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/420006/Hibernian-fans-growing-restless-for-Pat-Fenlon-s-head#) stay or go’ had met with 439 voting ‘Go’ (almost 68 per cent) and 207 responding with ‘Stay’ (32 per cent).

With another poll having been started questioning the position of chairman Rod Petrie, it now remains to be seen how much time the Hibs board – who have backed Fenlon in the transfer market this summerhttp://images.intellitxt.com/ast/adTypes/icon1.png (http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/420006/Hibernian-fans-growing-restless-for-Pat-Fenlon-s-head#) – are willing to give the manager to turn things around.

[Beefster]

Where and when did he say this?

I suspect that your point is that he didn't say exactly what keekaboo said. The sentiment was right though - our defeat in the opening game this season wasn't as bad as the opening game last season.

[greenlex]

I suspect that your point is that he didn't say exactly what keekaboo said. The sentiment was right though - our defeat in the opening game this season wasn't as bad as the opening game last season.

Of course he could have been talking about the performance rather than result I assume he wasn't just having a ramble and was answering a question so would have liked to have known what the question was to put some context to it. It's already been "quoted" here several times and has be one a stick to beat him with. He obviously has enough sticks beating him without one that has been Bourne out of nothing. Again can anyone point me to the interview?

[silverhibee]

Of course he could have been talking about the performance rather than result I assume he wasn't just having a ramble and was answering a question so would have liked to have known what the question was to put some context to it. It's already been "quoted" here several times and has be one a stick to beat him with. He obviously has enough sticks beating him without one that has been Bourne out of nothing. Again can anyone point me to the interview?


Post match interview with BBC after the game, sure the question was something along the lines of " do you think you deserved anything from the game today Pat", reply went something like this, " yes i think we deserved a point from game, we matched Motherwell today and the performance was good from the players to get a draw, we went up to Dundee last season in our first game and lost 3-0 to Utd and then went on to have a good first half in the season and then went on a poor run of form in the second half of the season, i hope to do the same after today's defeat and go on and win next week and go on a good run from there", that's what i remember from the interview but with folk in the car blethering about how pish we were it was hard to hear it all. :greengrin

Found this link from the Record.

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/hibs-manager-pat-fenlon-under-2125393

[hibsitis]

My feelings too. I've wanted him to go for a while and was really angry that he wasn't sacked straight after the Malmo game. However, watching his interview last night I just felt sorry for him. He's a dead man walking and he knows it.

He doesn't have to go through it all. If he had any self respect he'd resign, so if he's miserable he's only got himself to blame.

[jabis]

personally,I feel the whinging,nae sayers,do more damage to the club than PF.Lets have a poll to see if the people that boo Hibs should get the elbow :aok:

[Northernhibee]

personally,I feel the whinging,nae sayers,do more damage to the club than PF.Lets have a poll to see if the people that boo Hibs should get the elbow :aok:

:top marks:top marks

[Russian Hibs Fan]

He shoild have gone straight away after the 0-7!!! :grr:

[greenlex]

Post match interview with BBC after the game, sure the question was something along the lines of " do you think you deserved anything from the game today Pat", reply went something like this, " yes i think we deserved a point from game, we matched Motherwell today and the performance was good from the players to get a draw, we went up to Dundee last season in our first game and lost 3-0 to Utd and then went on to have a good first half in the season and then went on a poor run of form in the second half of the season, i hope to do the same after today's defeat and go on and win next week and go on a good run from there", that's what i remember from the interview but with folk in the car blethering about how pish we were it was hard to hear it all. :greengrin

Found this link from the Record.

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/hibs-manager-pat-fenlon-under-2125393

So taking the quote he said we were better than the first game of last season. He s 100% correct. Both performance and result were in fact better. Not in the context of overall improvement but in relation to both starts tothe season.

[The Green Goblin]

So taking the quote he said we were better than the first game of last season. He s 100% correct. Both performance and result were in fact better. Not in the context of overall improvement but in relation to both starts tothe season.

Technically he is correct, but we lost both. Is it really an optimistic comparison to be making? That we lost by less goals? What does that say about the targets he is setting? I think that's the point some folks are making really.

[Captain Trips]

Technically he is correct, but we lost both. Is it really an optimistic comparison to be making? That we lost by less goals? What does that say about the targets he is setting? I think that's the point some folks are making really.

Indeed, maybe we should bring back CC as he lost 0-2 to Celtic on the opening day in 2011/12 season where as a year later PF lost 3-0 on the opening day of 2012/13.

[Beefster]

personally,I feel the whinging,nae sayers,do more damage to the club than PF.Lets have a poll to see if the people that boo Hibs should get the elbow :aok:

Personally, I think that the folk who don't attend many games and then whinge on Hibs.net about the folk who do attend do more damage to the club. They're a bigger part of the problem than someone who sits until the end, watching us get pumped, and then does a bit of pantomime booing.

I don't know your circumstances but there are plenty on here that like to pontificate how those of us who go to the game shouldn't leave early, should give Fenlon time, shouldn't do this, shouldn't do that etc but don't actually go to that many games themselves.

[Aldo]

Someone on this thread likened PF to Mogadon Miller. I think the main element of truth in that is that he PF, spends far too much time worrying about the opposition, he was proud yesterday, rightly to some extent, that we had neutralised McFadden. As Budgie said to Miller (in his book), what about telling us what we're going to do to them! That's the culture change which needs to happen. I know John Collins gets a mixed reception from this forum but when he called Them, a pub team, that showed contempt not fear. That's what we need now.

Folk slagged Miller but look at the players he brought to the club

Wright (both Paul and Keith)
Jackson
Crunchie
O'Neil
Leighton
Goram
McLeod

McGinlay

Miller did a good job IMHO win us a cup and got us to other finals.

Just a shame we couldn't push on. Sounds familiar doesn't it.

[Stevie Reid]

Technically he is correct, but we lost both. Is it really an optimistic comparison to be making? That we lost by less goals? What does that say about the targets he is setting? I think that's the point some folks are making really.

My take on it was that we were awful against Dundee Utd at Tannadice last season, yet went on to win 7, draw 3 and lose only 2 of our next 12 league games - therefore it is not too much of a stretch of the imagination that we could kick on after Sunday.

I would say that we were the better team for the first half of the first half, and the first half of the second, with Motherwell being the better side in the latter stages of both - neither side created a great deal until Motherwell towards the end, when they had the better chances and just edged a narrowly deserved victory. We were unlucky with Harris being injured during our best spell of the game, but these things happen in football.

Fenlon has to accept that the horrendous defeat to Malmo has put enormous pressure and scrutiny on all of our early season results and performances, but Sunday was not the unmitigated disaster that an absurd amount of posters on here would have you believe. Last season's opener was much, much worse and things got a whole lot better very quickly. We must improve a lot, and very soon, but that's far from impossible after Sunday's performance - we will add more quality to the squad too.

37 games and 111 points still to play for, let's see what happens. If we lose on Sunday from a completely inept performance where we fail to show up, then I very much doubt I would feel inclined to attempt to defend him again, but he doesn't deserved to be pilloried after our opening league game of the season.

[greenlex]

My take on it was that we were awful against Dundee Utd at Tannadice last season, yet went on to win 7, draw 3 and lose only 2 of our next 12 league games - therefore it is not too much of a stretch of the imagination that we could kick on after Sunday.

I would say that we were the better team for the first half of the first half, and the first half of the second, with Motherwell being the better side in the latter stages of both - neither side created a great deal until Motherwell towards the end, when they had the better chances and just edged a narrowly deserved victory. We were unlucky with Harris being injured during our best spell of the game, but these things happen in football.

Fenlon has to accept that the horrendous defeat to Malmo has put enormous pressure and scrutiny on all of our early season results and performances, but Sunday was not the unmitigated disaster that an absurd amount of posters on here would have you believe. Last season's opener was much, much worse and things got a whole lot better very quickly. We must improve a lot, and very soon, but that's far from impossible after Sunday's performance - we will add more quality to the squad too.

37 games and 111 points still to play for, let's see what happens. If we lose on Sunday from a completely inept performance where we fail to show up, then I very much doubt I would feel inclined to attempt to defend him again, but he doesn't deserved to be pilloried after our opening league game of the season.
Couldn't really have out it better myself. The performances in the two games were night and day. It suits the Femlon bashing to make out be us delighted with a one nil defeat tho. Won't stop it though. Folks had made their minds up before a ball was kicked on Sunday. Bring on the Hearts.

[Hibiza]

:fenlon
OK I'll start it but surely if Pat has any respect or cares for this club he will offer his resignation.

The worst result ever by a Scottish club in Europe, and that cup final, I don't like to call for a mangers head but surely there is no argument after that.

The players & the fans must have lost all confidence in him.

Sorry Pat you're a nice guy but not up to the Hibs job. :agree:

:fenlon

[J-C]

My take on it was that we were awful against Dundee Utd at Tannadice last season, yet went on to win 7, draw 3 and lose only 2 of our next 12 league games - therefore it is not too much of a stretch of the imagination that we could kick on after Sunday.

I would say that we were the better team for the first half of the first half, and the first half of the second, with Motherwell being the better side in the latter stages of both - neither side created a great deal until Motherwell towards the end, when they had the better chances and just edged a narrowly deserved victory. We were unlucky with Harris being injured during our best spell of the game, but these things happen in football.

Fenlon has to accept that the horrendous defeat to Malmo has put enormous pressure and scrutiny on all of our early season results and performances, but Sunday was not the unmitigated disaster that an absurd amount of posters on here would have you believe. Last season's opener was much, much worse and things got a whole lot better very quickly. We must improve a lot, and very soon, but that's far from impossible after Sunday's performance - we will add more quality to the squad too.

37 games and 111 points still to play for, let's see what happens. If we lose on Sunday from a completely inept performance where we fail to show up, then I very much doubt I would feel inclined to attempt to defend him again, but he doesn't deserved to be pilloried after our opening league game of the season.

My big problem about sunday was, yes we had the slightly better of the 1st 20-25 mins but instead of going for the jugular, we sat back and looked happy with a point for the rest of the match and eventually it came back to bite us. This is my biggest gripe re Fenlon, he's yet to address our lack of attacking options in around 2 years, we're still looking and waiting for the game changing AM and that speedy match winning winger, will he ever get them or will it be a case of top 6 maybe, 7/8th probably yet again this season.

[greenlex]

My big problem about sunday was, yes we had the slightly better of the 1st 20-25 mins but instead of going for the jugular, we sat back and looked happy with a point for the rest of the match and eventually it came back to bite us. This is my biggest gripe re Fenlon, he's yet to address our lack of attacking options in around 2 years, we're still looking and waiting for the game changing AM and that speedy match winning winger, will he ever get them or will it be a case of top 6 maybe, 7/8th probably yet again this season.
What were the attacking options?

[blackpoolhibs]

What were the attacking options?

Just with the team he had on the park, he should have had them defending further up the park. He should have had the midfield getting nearer their opponents and had them supporting Collins more.

There was no need to change anyone unless they were injured, thats just one thing in my opinion he could have done to have us attack better.

[JimBHibees]

My big problem about sunday was, yes we had the slightly better of the 1st 20-25 mins but instead of going for the jugular, we sat back and looked happy with a point for the rest of the match and eventually it came back to bite us. This is my biggest gripe re Fenlon, he's yet to address our lack of attacking options in around 2 years, we're still looking and waiting for the game changing AM and that speedy match winning winger, will he ever get them or will it be a case of top 6 maybe, 7/8th probably yet again this season.

He has been unlucky big time with regard to injuries that is for sure. Added to the defensive injuries, Harris on Sunday to me was getting into the game when injured. A more defensive performance was understandable to an extent in reaction to the 7-0 disaster the game before however it didnt make for exciting viewing that is true. IMO he should have played that team against Malmo to try and keep us in the tie. I think rather than Stanton maybe Handling could have come on wide right and Craig switched to his more favoured side. Not sure it would have made much difference as rank bad defending of the same ball twice left us open.

One good thing for Sunday is McGivern seems to be on the way back and hopefully he starts on Sunday. I also think PF may not subject Mullen to the inevitable dogs abuse and bring back Maybury which I think would be the right decision.

[JimBHibees]

Just with the team he had on the park, he should have had them defending further up the park. He should have had the midfield getting nearer their opponents and had them supporting Collins more.

There was no need to change anyone unless they were injured, thats just one thing in my opinion he could have done to have us attack better.

Agree with that. The time late in the second half where Collins was closing down 3 defenders to look round and see 3 midfielders 30 yards away was embarressing.

[J-C]

What were the attacking options?

That is what I was getting at, he's had 2 years to bring in the type of players needed to attack and take the game to the other team, yet he still goes around buying CM/DM when AM is what we are needing.

He could've brought on Taiwo and pushed Robertson or Craig further forward at the start of the 2nd half. I thought Jones was anonymous for most of the game, sat very deep and Taiwo would've been a better option, allowing Craig/Robertson more attacking freedom.

[Captain Trips]

Couldn't really have out it better myself. The performances in the two games were night and day. It suits the Femlon bashing to make out be us delighted with a one nil defeat tho. Won't stop it though. Folks had made their minds up before a ball was kicked on Sunday. Bring on the Hearts.

I will "bash" as you put it based on results not comparisons of games 1 year apart, so yes I had my mind made up before a ball was kicked in the 2012/13 season never mind this one.

[Speedway]

Mowbray will be looking for a job soon if he carries on going as he is.

[Allan45]

Bring on a more confident Hibs team this Sunday...no more booing....I say stick with the Manager for the next 4 or 5 games, a win on Sunday is a win, but Pat needs the team to keep on winning from then on, allow the team to gel quickly. Every player feels the fans frustration....we have the making for a good team this season.....lets bring it into life Sunday with at least a 2 goal cushion. Hearts will go for it from the start, nothing to lose...Hibs have everything to lose.....Hibees...Hibees...Hibees....:flag:get into THEM!

[theonlywayisup]

Folk slagged Miller but look at the players he brought to the club

Wright (both Paul and Keith)
Jackson
Crunchie
O'Neil
Leighton
Goram
McLeod

McGinlay

Miller did a good job IMHO win us a cup and got us to other finals.

Just a shame we couldn't push on. Sounds familiar doesn't it.

We did go close after the 1991 win, with a loss against the Huns thanks to Sally's fluke in 1993. At 1-1, I really did think we would win it. Good team we had, better than the 1991 team.

[The Green Goblin]

We did go close after the 1991 win, with a loss against the Huns thanks to Sally's fluke in 1993. At 1-1, I really did think we would win it. Good team we had, better than the 1991 team.

I remember that. Was sure we were going to sneak it. Total sickener. I can still remember the gutted feeling when Fat Sally's total hit 'n' hope effort went in and the awful sight of all those huns celebrating at the other end. Stuff of nightmares... Still, they're deid (almost for the 2nd time) and we're no. :greengrin

[Hibercelona]

It annoys me when we lose a game and the manager and fans alike come out with the "deserved more" nonsense.

If we continue to make errors like that through out the season, then a clean sheet will be an extremely rare occurrence for us and our win percentage will be less that satisfactory.

Either we cut out the defensive errors that are an embarrassment at any level of football, or we'll continue to lose more games than we win.

[macd123]

Mowbray will be looking for a job soon if he carries on going as he is.

Ever noticed how managers of teams where John Park is involved sign good players and do well? The problem comes later (mcleish, mowbray, strachan). No wonder lennon stayed at celtic.

[blackpoolhibs]

It annoys me when we lose a game and the manager and fans alike come out with the "deserved more" nonsense.

If we continue to make errors like that through out the season, then a clean sheet will be an extremely rare occurrence for us and our win percentage will be less that satisfactory.

Either we cut out the defensive errors that are an embarrassment at any level of football, or we'll continue to lose more games than we win.


I think you could be onto something here.

[Shields Hibee]

Bohs, Pat's old team are currently rock bottom of LoI with -20 goal difference having conceded 39 already this season!

They must have pulled defensive training following Pat's departure.

[OrdHibby]

Bohs, Pat's old team are currently rock bottom of LoI with -20 goal difference having conceded 39 already this season!

They must have pulled defensive training following Pat's departure.

thats because he bought his success there and bankrupt them. Michael O'Neil wiped the floor with him his last two seasons there because he couldn't buy no more. On a level playing field he got horse whipped yet our board thought we would be better of with him. Still ehh what **** (dizzy)

[Chump]

My take on it was that we were awful against Dundee Utd at Tannadice last season, yet went on to win 7, draw 3 and lose only 2 of our next 12 league games - therefore it is not too much of a stretch of the imagination that we could kick on after Sunday.

I would say that we were the better team for the first half of the first half, and the first half of the second, with Motherwell being the better side in the latter stages of both - neither side created a great deal until Motherwell towards the end, when they had the better chances and just edged a narrowly deserved victory. We were unlucky with Harris being injured during our best spell of the game, but these things happen in football.

Fenlon has to accept that the horrendous defeat to Malmo has put enormous pressure and scrutiny on all of our early season results and performances, but Sunday was not the unmitigated disaster that an absurd amount of posters on here would have you believe. Last season's opener was much, much worse and things got a whole lot better very quickly. We must improve a lot, and very soon, but that's far from impossible after Sunday's performance - we will add more quality to the squad too.

37 games and 111 points still to play for, let's see what happens. If we lose on Sunday from a completely inept performance where we fail to show up, then I very much doubt I would feel inclined to attempt to defend him again, but he doesn't deserved to be pilloried after our opening league game of the season.

So to summarise.....

get off his back all you Fenlon haters but if we lose on Sunday I'll join you!!

[Beefster]

So to summarise.....

get off his back all you Fenlon haters but if we lose on Sunday I'll join you!!

There's been a lot "You guys are crazy wanting the manager sacked before the league starts / after the first league game but, if we lose the next game, I want him sacked" on here in the last couple of weeks.

Either way, whether we win or lose on Sunday, Fenlon won't be going anywhere.

[YehButNoBut]

There's been a lot "You guys are crazy wanting the manager sacked before the league starts / after the first league game but, if we lose the next game, I want him sacked" on here in the last couple of weeks.

Either way, whether we win or lose on Sunday, Fenlon won't be going anywhere.

Can't agree with that as if we lose to what is the weakest Hearts team I can remember there will be little chance in him surviving, he must be aware of that.

[Stevie Reid]

So to summarise.....

get off his back all you Fenlon haters but if we lose on Sunday I'll join you!!

No. Very poor summary.

[greenlex]

There's been a lot "You guys are crazy wanting the manager sacked before the league starts / after the first league game but, if we lose the next game, I want him sacked" on here in the last couple of weeks.

Either way, whether we win or lose on Sunday, Fenlon won't be going anywhere.
The performance on sunday is more important than the result in terms of him staying are concerned. If we cant take this game by the scruff of the neck and dominate against a bunch of laddies, Derby or not, then yes I think he should be relieved. The result will come if we do. If we dominate without scoring and they sneak a winner then that shouldnt be enough for that to happen. They will no doubt be up for it and have spells of pressure but overall the performance is the key.

[marinello59]

The performance on sunday is more important than the result in terms of him staying are concerned. If we cant take this game by the scruff of the neck and dominate against a bunch of laddies, Derby or not, then yes I think he should be relieved. The result will come if we do. If we dominate without scoring and they sneak a winner then that shouldnt be enough for that to happen. They will no doubt be up for it and have spells of pressure but overall the performance is the key.

How about if we dominate play without scoring or even looking like we could score?

[greenlex]

How about if we dominate play without scoring or even looking like we could score?
That's not going to happen but if it did he should go.

[marinello59]

That's not going to happen but if it did he should go.

Hopefully not.
I do agree with you, it's all about the performance. I rather suspect that even if we play badly and lose those running the club will resist all pressure to remove him from his position though.

[The Sea-gull]

PS - disclaimer for this post is that if you read many of my other posts you will detect I am not a huge Fenlon fan but am trying to look at the bigger picture.

If we get beat on Sunday (especially with an abject performance and/or thumping scoreline) this board will go into "meltdown" with Fenlon out posts.

I still think two games into the season it is too early for him to go though. We have made minimal progress under Fenlon but he has achieved what realistically should have been his minimum targets in each of the last two seasons. He joined us in 11/12 when were all over the place on the park and heading for the drop - we beat relegation, just. Nothing to shout about but he still met the minimum realistic expectation of him that season.

Last season, given the turmoil of the previous couple of years, he had to get us at least competing for top 6 which he did, again doing the minimum which could have been reasonably expected of him and it was a vast improvement on the relegation struggle of the season before. I'm not saying that we should accept just missing out on the top 6 at Hibs but under the circumstances last season's league placing was not that bad.

I just feel that his performance in season 11/12 was enough to be given a crack at things last season and last season's efforts were just enough to give him a crack at this season. His target for this season has to be top 6 minimum and the minute it does not look like he will achieve this then he has to go. Two games into the season would be too early to make that call, no matter who they were against and how they went.

As I say at the start of my post, I am no Fenlon fan. I don't think he should ever have got the job because he lacked the credentials to even be considered for the Hibs job and I also don't think he is up to the job and this will be proven in the long term. I would though be "delighted to be proved wrong". He is here though, he is running out of time but still deserves a little more time to show he can get us into the top 6 and two games into the season is too early to sack him. The time he has now though is fast turing into games/weeks and months rather than end of season reviews and transfer windows.

[Beefster]

The performance on sunday is more important than the result in terms of him staying are concerned. If we cant take this game by the scruff of the neck and dominate against a bunch of laddies, Derby or not, then yes I think he should be relieved. The result will come if we do. If we dominate without scoring and they sneak a winner then that shouldnt be enough for that to happen. They will no doubt be up for it and have spells of pressure but overall the performance is the key.

I think it's irrelevant how we play or how adventurous he is with his tactics. Win, lose or draw, it won't be his last game.

[carnoustiehibee]

I think it's irrelevant how we play or how adventurous he is with his tactics. Win, lose or draw, it won't be his last game.

If we get beat it HAS to be his last game. No team this season should get beat from that hearts side

[Leithenhibby]

If we get beat it HAS to be his last game. No team this season should get beat from that hearts side

PF has taken us forward from CC :agree: They will get points and they WILL beat teams....

[carnoustiehibee]

PF has taken us forward from CC :agree: They will get points and they WILL beat teams....

My gran coulda done a better job than calderwood. That little stat counts for nothing.

Any team getting beat from a hearts u21 squad this season would be shameful. They will hardly even score this year never mind rack up points

[Steve20]

He should have gone already. If he doesn't win on Sunday, then surely he has to be sacked. He's managed us to our two worst games in my lifetime, losing to a Hearts team in the state they're in would surely be it for him.

[Leithenhibby]

My gran coulda done a better job than calderwood. That little stat counts for nothing.

Any team getting beat from a hearts u21 squad this season would be shameful. They will hardly even score this year never mind rack up points


Brave man, with the game on Sunday fast approaching............ :wink:

[Stuarty27]

What I couldn't understand about Sunday was why Fenlon decided to go back to 4-5-1. since the Falkirk game at half time we had been playing 442 and in good form scoring and creating goals.

On Sunday the centre of the park was far to crowded and the guys were just getting in each others way and Collins was left isolated up the park. He has to start 442 against Hearts IMO

[Tyler Durden]

If we get beat it HAS to be his last game. No team this season should get beat from that hearts side

And yet that Hearts side are the bookies favourites to win this match. 1.4 to Hibs 1.875 roughly.

Is that because of Fenlon or is it a false price? It would suggest that objective observers don't fancy Pat's chances of turning things around, certainly not in short term.

[JimBHibees]

And yet that Hearts side are the bookies favourites to win this match. 1.4 to Hibs 1.875 roughly.

Is that because of Fenlon or is it a false price? It would suggest that objective observers don't fancy Pat's chances of turning things around, certainly not in short term.

Or more likely our absolutely appalling record at that ground.

[ahibby]

Last season we finished higher in the league than the previous and we lost the cup by a smaller margin against a better side than the previous. So based on that he improved on the previous season, and I'm sure that unless we have imploded by Christmas he will be here this season irrespective of what happens on Sunday. Although some press would have us believe otherwise. I feel the club have invested heavily in his side compared with previous seasons.

[The Sea-gull]

If we get beat it HAS to be his last game. No team this season should get beat from that hearts side

Keep reading comments like this. Really don't think Hearts, especially in an early season Edinburgh derby at Tynecastle - their first home competitive game since admin, will be as bad a side as some are painting them. To say they'll be up for it is an undertsatement.

A draw would not be a bad result at all and sadly that is what I think Pat, given his situation, will play for, him taking the view that not losing is better than rolling the dice and going all out for a win but risking leaving us open.

[carnoustiehibee]

Keep reading comments like this. Really don't think Hearts, especially in an early season Edinburgh derby at Tynecastle - their first home competitive game since admin, will be as bad a side as some are painting them. To say they'll be up for it is an undertsatement.

A draw would not be a bad result at all and sadly that is what I think Pat, given his situation, will play for, him taking the view that not losing is better than rolling the dice and going all out for a win but risking leaving us open.

Can never understand this mentality

Some people are just born losers I suppose

[JimBHibees]

Keep reading comments like this. Really don't think Hearts, especially in an early season Edinburgh derby at Tynecastle - their first home competitive game since admin, will be as bad a side as some are painting them. To say they'll be up for it is an undertsatement.

A draw would not be a bad result at all and sadly that is what I think Pat, given his situation, will play for, him taking the view that not losing is better than rolling the dice and going all out for a win but risking leaving us open.

Agree to an extent our record at that ground must be one of the worst in world football something like 5 wins in 25 years or so. Given the siege mentality at the PBS they will be more wound up that ever for this and with Thomson now considering 2 footed tackles are ok I do have concerns about this game. We are going into it with little confidence and this is their first game at home. Their result last week was a 1-0 defeat to the form team in the league so hardly an unmitigated disaster also.

In saying that guys like Nelson, Thomson, Maybury, OTJ, McGivern have excellent experience and physicality and I think we can do well in this match up. We have to match their intensity right from the start though or it could be a long 90 mins. We may well lose this match however if we do we will probably have contributed to our downfall as I just cant see us not making a number of very good chances against this Hearts team whether we take them is the issue.

We can never be complacent that is for sure.

[silverhibee]

Hopefully not.
I do agree with you, it's all about the performance. I rather suspect that even if we play badly and lose those running the club will resist all pressure to remove him from his position though.

Nah, its all about the results and getting points, many a manger will tell you that. :greengrin

[B'Briggs Hibee]

I wouldn't not now be sad to see fenlon go. The football we play is absolutely appalling. Does he actively tell them to just hoof it ? My eyes are bleeding here.

[YehButNoBut]

I wouldn't not now be sad to see fenlon go. The football we play is absolutely appalling. Does he actively tell them to just hoof it ? My eyes are bleeding here.

No fan of Fenlon but surely if you have decent players they can work it out for themselves & perform to their abilities, lot of blame has to go to the players as well they should be capable of better despite Fenlon.

[Keith_M]

Well, it's highly unlikely we will but I agree with the sentiment.


I wish he would just sod off now and leave Nicholl in charge. It surely couldn't be any worse.

[Bishop Hibee]

Petrie can go with him. Time for a new Chairman/Chief Exec with fresh ideas and a fresh vision for the club.

[OrdHibby]

I'll pay for his flight back to wherever he came from.
Absolute embarrassment.

[lord bunberry]

What's the point of signing midfielders when the ball is constantly played over their heads, absolutely shocking to watch

[hibee_girl]

No fan of Fenlon but surely if you have decent players they can work it out for themselves & perform to their abilities, lot of blame has to go to the players as well they should be capable of better despite Fenlon.

:agree:

[B'Briggs Hibee]

Couldn't agree more. I agree with what's been said about players figuring it out for themselves but surely they are just doing what they have been told ?

[Keith_M]

Anyone change their mind yet?

[Keith_M]

No fan of Fenlon but surely if you have decent players they can work it out for themselves & perform to their abilities, lot of blame has to go to the players as well they should be capable of better despite Fenlon.


I agree with that up to a point... BUT if the players have been given a gameplan and some decide to ignore it, the team might just end up even more disjointed.


TBH, I'd love to know what the gameplan is supposed to be.

[OrdHibby]

the game plan, if any, is to HOOF the ball to the ****bo's keeper

[IWasThere2016]

Torture to watch. Please go!

[IWasThere2016]

Dire football .. I am struggling to remember anything as bad - we offer nothing! Fenlon out please.

[banchoryhibs]

Is Jimmy Nicholl contributing anything? If not them he can join Fenlon in the taxi:furious:

[Beefster]

We once lost to Hearts. It's all progress.

[Alfred E Newman]

The tactics may be grim but the players have to take some responsibility for being unable to show even some basic skills.

[hibee_girl]

The tactics may be grim but the players have to take some responsibility for being unable to show even some basic skills.

:agree:

[mcfly]

This is it for me. Too defensive, too negative, no pace, no width and can hardly string a pass.

Spent money on a striker and give him no service.

Please leave NOW

[Keith_M]

Losing to THIS Hearts team should be an instant sackable offence!!!!!



Are you feeling under pressure now, you Twat!

[pontius pilate]

Get him to **** honestly getting beat from this shower of ***** and negative tactics negative substitutions you're time is up please for the sake of our club go

[mutley]

I'm starting to regret but my ST now! If it means I have to watch this week in week out

[ekhibee]

Losing to THIS Hearts team should be an instant sackable offence!!!!!



Are you feeling under pressure now, you Twat!

This.

[PJ IronHIbee]

Embarrassing

[Gerard]

There is still time to make this a good season. I can't see that happening with PF

[Jones28]

Can I vote "go" twice?

[Del Boy]

Embarrassing beyond belief.

[Golden Bear]

We need a right back but otherwise a new manager could have us playing decent and winning football within a very short period of time.

Fenlon just go and make it quick.

[CRAZYHIBBY]

He is hopeless, he replaced an entire team and they are still ****. Caldwell has scored 8 times against hearts at various levels yet still left on the bench.

[John_the_angus_hibby]

He is hopeless, he replaced an entire team and they are still ****. Caldwell has scored 8 times against heats at various levels yet still left on the bench.

This.

Fenton can leave. Now. On final whistle. Just go and never. Ever. Come back. My eyes are bleeding and my soul is crushed you sad excuse of a football manager.