Don’t sack Lee

[jeffers]

I'd say I'm about 50/50 on him and in all honesty, he's hard to defend.

He looks to me like someone whose main problem is that his players simply aren't good enough. The team selections are bizarre, but that's because he's grasping for a solution that doesn't exist with players who aren't good enough to be part of it. When we as a club have had stronger squads than this one, the team tends to pick itself - and earlier in the season when we were winning he kept a fairly settled side and let it gain those results.

I think he talks too much and he talks himself into trouble. He talked loosely earlier in the season when talking about Porteous winning the penalty against Aberdeen and by talking too much about having a say in transfers and backing our current players over the summer he's made a rod for his own back. I don't disagree with much of what he's said over the past few days but I question the need to say it and whether it makes his job any safer, any fans any happier, Hibs prospects any better or the Hibs players (who will still be expected to play for him/us and get results) any easier.

As a rule, I'm against sacking managers and I accept that I've often been wiser after the event has happened with some that I didn't want to go at the time.

I thought that was an excellent post. You make a lot of valid points and have expressed your thoughts in a really good way.

I agree with a lot of what you say, it then boils down to you looking at the negatives and believing they aren’t quite enough to sack him and me looking at them and believing they are.

I’m not going to claim the squad is great, I think it’s far from it, but I don’t believe we have the worst one in the league, yet recent results are pointing to that. An experienced, capable manager should be doing better and getting better results. Even if both him and a number of fans have lost patience with the squad, alienating a considerable number of them, which I believe he has done, is not conducive to getting good results.

I don’t know if it’s me, or the managers we’ve appointed (or maybe a combination of both) but in all the time I’ve supported us it usually gets to the stage, with a few exceptions, that I’ve wanted a manager sacked.

[hibsbollah]

I'd say I'm about 50/50 on him and in all honesty, he's hard to defend.

He looks to me like someone whose main problem is that his players simply aren't good enough. The team selections are bizarre, but that's because he's grasping for a solution that doesn't exist with players who aren't good enough to be part of it. When we as a club have had stronger squads than this one, the team tends to pick itself - and earlier in the season when we were winning he kept a fairly settled side and let it gain those results.

I think he talks too much and he talks himself into trouble. He talked loosely earlier in the season when talking about Porteous winning the penalty against Aberdeen and by talking too much about having a say in transfers and backing our current players over the summer he's made a rod for his own back. I don't disagree with much of what he's said over the past few days but I question the need to say it and whether it makes his job any safer, any fans any happier, Hibs prospects any better or the Hibs players (who will still be expected to play for him/us and get results) any easier.

As a rule, I'm against sacking managers and I accept that I've often been wiser after the event has happened with some that I didn't want to go at the time.

‘He’s grasping for a solution that doesn’t exist’ is a perfect description as I see it, you’ve absolutely nailed it. Bringing in Fish at CB and McKirdy in the deep end as a support striker in a two when that’s not the role he’s ever played, for a derby game that could define his whole time at Hibs, is like a chef just chucking the last ingredients in the cupboard at a meal even when they have no business being there. It’s a mess.

[J-C]

His managerial record is fairly poor except at Sunderland who had the highest budget in that league and still failed to gain promotion. Bells started to ring for me when he said we'll get a few good beating in the season but it's the attacking way he wants his teams to play, well so far no real attacking football but there is a few gubbings already, he's showing exactly the type of manager he is and why he was a failure at all his other clubs, get him well away from this club.

[Hibee Daft]

Nothing to do with the merits of it but see Neil Lennon throwing his oar in.

Financial package agreed for severance with Cypriot team, is available, sees Scotland as home, would like to manage in Premier again.

Might be good, might be bad, wouldn't be boring.

The main problem i have with him and guys like Alan Stubbs is there affiliation with the old firm. They will jump ship as soon as things go well.

David Gray would be my choice, has the respect of the players and fans. Hes also someone that has a deep connection to the club so isnt going to want away as much when we actually achieve some success

[Hibernian Verse]

The main problem i have with him and guys like Alan Stubbs is there affiliation with the old firm. They will jump ship as soon as things go well.

David Gray would be my choice, has the respect of the players and fans. Hes also someone that has a deep connection to the club so isnt going to want away as much when we actually achieve some success

Conversely, Gray could be a disaster and ruin his legacy. It's a no from me.

[Donegal Hibby]

His managerial record is fairly poor except at Sunderland who had the highest budget in that league and still failed to gain promotion. Bells started to ring for me when he said we'll get a few good beating in the season but it's the attacking way he wants his teams to play, well so far no real attacking football but there is a few gubbings already, he's showing exactly the type of manager he is and why he was a failure at all his other clubs, get him well away from this club.
Ho do you think is record is poor at oldham , Barnsley , Bristol city btw ?

[MWHIBBIES]

All well and dandy but I’m clearly referring to his time with us.

If losing 9 out of 11 isn’t a text book definition of a serial loser, I’m not sure what is.

I don’t think too many Hibs fans are all that bothered about that we did before he got here.

2 wins in 11 - serial loser

2 wins in 14 - winner that we need back

[GreenCastle]

Nothing to do with the merits of it but see Neil Lennon throwing his oar in.

Financial package agreed for severance with Cypriot team, is available, sees Scotland as home, would like to manage in Premier again.

Might be good, might be bad, wouldn't be boring.

As bonkers as it got under Lennon - I actually think I would take him back.

If Neilson can go back to Hearts after leaving - why don't we taken Lennon back?

I doubt the club would do it as it's too risky and we just want a "yes man".

[WhileTheChief..]

2 wins in 11 - serial loser

2 wins in 14 - winner that we need back

I think we’d pick up more points this season with Lennon taking over than sticking with LJ.

Bite me.

[Trinity Hibee]

As bonkers as it got under Lennon - I actually think I would take him back.

If Neilson can go back to Hearts after leaving - why don't we taken Lennon back?

I doubt the club would do it as it's too risky and we just want a "yes man".

Affording his wages may be an issue but I would take him back. He has a better tactical knowledge than he gets credit for. Always thought he could get the team up for the big games.

[bingo70]

2 wins in 11 - serial loser

2 wins in 14 - winner that we need back

Maybe splitting hairs here but it’s not just two wins in 11, it’s 9 losses in 11.

I’m guessing Lennon would have drawn some of his last 14 games?

[One Day Soon]

‘He’s grasping for a solution that doesn’t exist’ is a perfect description as I see it, you’ve absolutely nailed it. Bringing in Fish at CB and McKirdy in the deep end as a support striker in a two when that’s not the role he’s ever played, for a derby game that could define his whole time at Hibs, is like a chef just chucking the last ingredients in the cupboard at a meal even when they have no business being there. It’s a mess.


A disturbingly good analogy. And the chef isn't striking me as Michelin grade either...

[Alfred E Newman]

A disturbingly good analogy. And the chef isn't striking me as Michelin grade either...

Especially when you consider what's at steak.i think he has had his chips.

[Donegal Hibby]

All well and dandy but I’m clearly referring to his time with us.

If losing 9 out of 11 isn’t a text book definition of a serial loser, I’m not sure what is.

I don’t think too many Hibs fans are all that bothered about that we did before he got here.
When Hibs are looking for a manager I'm always bothered about who else they have managed and how they have done at previous clubs and imo he's done well at other clubs which doesn't put him in the serial loser description imo , yes he's lost 9 out of 11 which is bad though you yourself has hinted you would like Lennon back and what I was told today is he won 3 out of 15 and left with us 8th the same position we are in now under LJ , so if this is true about Lennon is he also a serial loser ? And why would anyone want a manager back that wasn't any better than the one we have ?

[MWHIBBIES]

I think we’d pick up more points this season with Lennon taking over than sticking with LJ.

Bite me.

I don't disagree, although even Lennons mother could see he was gash without Stubbs guys. He'd struggle. Left a much better side than this 8th or 9th iirc.

[flash]

As bonkers as it got under Lennon - I actually think I would take him back.

If Neilson can go back to Hearts after leaving - why don't we taken Lennon back?

I doubt the club would do it as it's too risky and we just want a "yes man".
What do people actually mean by a "yes man" and what evidence do you have that any of our managers fit the description, whatever it is.

[silverhibee]

We hammered Bonnyrigg and should have beaten Falkirk regardless of team selection.
No matter what people think of our recent managers it's the players who let us down time and time again.

And LJ must have known about our squad when he took the job, seemingly watched us a couple of times when SDG was taking the team, had the summer window to try and move some players on, must have known some of the problems at Hibs by asking contacts he knew in Scotland, I’m sure he said he watched a load of videos of games from last season, and yet he said he was happy with what he had in midfield and started the 3 players who have been a problem for us for a good time in the games you mentioned, he brought in his own players but has basically stuck with the players who have got the last 2 managers the sack and they will see him off as well eventually, he has been a disaster for us along with the players who he keeps playing.

[Smartie]

Dudu Dahan>Ian Gordon.

[flash]

And LJ must have known about our squad when he took the job, seemingly watched us a couple of times when SDG was taking the team, had the summer window to try and move some players on, must have known some of the problems at Hibs by asking contacts he knew in Scotland, I’m sure he said he watched a load of videos of games from last season, and yet he said he was happy with what he had in midfield and started the 3 players who have been a problem for us for a good time in the games you mentioned, he brought in his own players but has basically stuck with the players who have got the last 2 managers the sack and they will see him off as well eventually, he has been a disaster for us along with the players who he keeps playing.
Absolutely.

[GreenCastle]

And LJ must have known about our squad when he took the job, seemingly watched us a couple of times when SDG was taking the team, had the summer window to try and move some players on, must have known some of the problems at Hibs by asking contacts he knew in Scotland, I’m sure he said he watched a load of videos of games from last season, and yet he said he was happy with what he had in midfield and started the 3 players who have been a problem for us for a good time in the games you mentioned, he brought in his own players but has basically stuck with the players who have got the last 2 managers the sack and they will see him off as well eventually, he has been a disaster for us along with the players who he keeps playing.

I think the one thing often forgotten is he sees the players from the outside but he doesn't know the personalities of the players till he works with them on a daily basis.

He knew McGeady obviously but all it needs is a couple akward players and that can bring down team spirit and level of training.

I would be curious to know how many players he actually met before signing though. Have a proper conversation with expectations etc.

A quite simple question a journalist or podcast could ask.

Would find it incredible if he didn't know the personality of new players before they were signed off though - sounds like a recipe for disaster.

Folk saying he didn't sign many of his own players last summer?? He had whole window to so...then he signs possibly 1 or 2 players this January meaning he's signed less than 5/10 own players in 2 windows ? Something doesn't add up.

[BSEJVT]

I don’t think there is much argument that his record is horrific.

I also don’t think that if we hadn’t been sacking managers Willy Nilly for what seems like decades that anyone would expect a Manager with such a record to survive.

IMO he is getting latitude he doesn’t deserve because of our recent past and the fact that we have turned on the players.

What’s not up for debate is that other managers have got a tune out of most of these players at some time and he has not.

If we were blooding youngsters and/or phasing out the old guard, were consistent in selection or style of play and were getting these results I might be tempted to say, give him time we can see progress.

None of the above is true though, it’s personnel and tactics bingo week after week.

His only hope is he lands lucky and then stops tinkering.

I hear about Cadden & Myko & Magennis and if they couldn’t play /needed managed fair enough.

What he didn’t need to do was chuck guys in to roles completely foreign to them and upset any balance the team had and hang them out to dry.

Sheer cowardice not to go to them after the game, but to sneak away like a snake and crucify them in the press.

Seems like the measure of the man.

I want Hibs to win every game but the sooner it is without Johnson at the club the happier I will be.

[jeffers]

Agreed.

Maloney and LJ are just too nice and players / opposition know this.

Get someone like McInnes or Lennon in who will get more respect and replace the comfortable players in the team.

LJ was a mistake - said it from day 1 he was too nice a person and players would walk all over. It's not all about shouting and yelling but you need to have a bit more about you especially as we are too soft as a club.

Out of interest what makes you think LJ is “too nice” ?

[marinello59]

Out of interest what makes you think LJ is “too nice” ?

All part of the nice guys can’t be winners myth. I’ve never bought it.

[bingo70]

See Swindon have sacked their manager. Wonder if Lee fancies a move closer to home (think he is from Bristol isn’t he?)

Could be a good solution all round, but like when Plymouth took Williamson off our hands.

[flash]

Out of interest what makes you think LJ is “too nice” ?

Didn't think you would be in agreement with that statement Jeffers.

[jeffers]

Didn't think you would be in agreement with that statement Jeffers.

:greengrin I wasn’t going to say any more regarding my thoughts on that flash - honest. Was just wondering what made someone think he was.

[Cat Stanton]

See Swindon have sacked their manager. Wonder if Lee fancies a move closer to home (think he is from Bristol isn’t he?)

Could be a good solution all round, but like when Plymouth took Williamson off our hands.

That was glorious, wasn't it? Almost made me think there was a God after all...

He was recommended by Paul Sturrock, I think?

[Cat Stanton]

I see the EEN is unsubtly (is that the right word?) touting Neil Lennon....

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hibs/former-hibs-boss-neil-lennon-open-to-offers-as-he-considers-return-to-management-in-scotland-3975696

[silverhibee]

I believe that will be part of it.

Sacking our 3rd manager in just over a year when this latest appointment was made following what Ron Gordon described as "an incredibly thorough and vigorous" process is really not going to be a good look for the club's hierarchy.

I look at Gordon's comments about the justification behind Shaun Maloney's sacking and how badly another sacking would look on the board and the need to prevent such a bad image is the only logical conclusion I can come to as to why Lee Johnson is still in post.

There is absolutely no improvement in this Hibs side compared to 9 or 10 months ago under Maloney, if anything it's worse.

Your last sentence, that’s it in a nutshell, no improvement in our defence, none in our midfield and same goes for upfront and we are half way through the season, FFS folk were wanting rid of Maloney after a few games and yet you could see that Maloney was trying to change our style of play, it was very obvious, I have seen nothing from LJ regards what style of play he wants from this team or what he is trying to implement on the team, Porto in midfield, deary me, Fish thrown in at the deep end at right back, deary me, starting McKirdy at the weekend, deary me, leaving KM on the bench deary me, for such an experienced manager he seems to be all over the place trying to get a settled 11 players on the pitch, in fact I don’t think he even knows what his best 11 is from this squad.

[truehibernian]

Your last sentence, that’s it in a nutshell, no improvement in our defence, none in our midfield and same goes for upfront and we are half way through the season, FFS folk were wanting rid of Maloney after a few games and yet you could see that Maloney was trying to change our style of play, it was very obvious, I have seen nothing from LJ regards what style of play he wants from this team or what he is trying to implement on the team, Porto in midfield, deary me, Fish thrown in at the deep end at right back, deary me, starting McKirdy at the weekend, deary me, leaving KM on the bench deary me, for such an experienced manager he seems to be all over the place trying to get a settled 11 players on the pitch, in fact I don’t think he even knows what his best 11 is from this squad.

Not forgetting SH we have a very successful youth side, with 3 or 4 who could easily have been properly rewarded with first team action, in front of huge crowds, eager to impress, and who would have been positively supported from the stands. It’s scandalous that we are still playing Lewis in big games when there’s a young, match fit MacIntyre probably champing at the bit to get a chance - that’s how you develop talent, by putting them in, raw perhaps, but they’re talented. Holding them back for loans to lower league is stifling them. Even Mixu put in a raw Hanlon on his managerial debut in a 3-0 win where he was MotM. Laidlaw bangs them in at every age level so he surely knows where the net is, added to which, Liverpool don’t scout and trial players they don’t think have something (he even scored there too).

If I was a young player at Hibs, I’d be wanting out to progress my career, not remaining to wait until I’m 20/21. It’s scandalous they’ve been overlooked when the first team aren’t cutting the mustard.

[bingo70]

Not forgetting SH we have a very successful youth side, with 3 or 4 who could easily have been properly rewarded with first team action, in front of huge crowds, eager to impress, and who would have been positively supported from the stands. It’s scandalous that we are still playing Lewis in big games when there’s a young, match fit MacIntyre probably champing at the bit to get a chance - that’s how you develop talent, by putting them in, raw perhaps, but they’re talented. Holding them back for loans to lower league is stifling them. Even Mixu put in a raw Hanlon on his managerial debut in a 3-0 win where he was MotM. Laidlaw bangs them in at every age level so he surely knows where the net is, added to which, Liverpool don’t scout and trial players they don’t think have something (he even scored there too).

If I was a young player at Hibs, I’d be wanting out to progress my career, not remaining to wait until I’m 20/21. It’s scandalous they’ve been overlooked when the first team aren’t cutting the mustard.

It’s a really good point.

Rather than playing Fish out of position, why not throw in Megwa? He’s been playing well for the younger side at right back has he not? It’s not like Fish is much more experienced than him.

[silverhibee]

When Hibs are looking for a manager I'm always bothered about who else they have managed and how they have done at previous clubs and imo he's done well at other clubs which doesn't put him in the serial loser description imo , yes he's lost 9 out of 11 which is bad though you yourself has hinted you would like Lennon back and what I was told today is he won 3 out of 15 and left with us 8th the same position we are in now under LJ , so if this is true about Lennon is he also a serial loser ? And why would anyone want a manager back that wasn't any better than the one we have ?

No, regards Lennon, he must have a bundle of winners medals from his playing and managerial times at Leicester & Celtc, I have to ask what has LJ won in his career compared to Lennon, and the red head knows Scottish football inside out.

[jeffers]

It’s a really good point.

Rather than playing Fish out of position, why not throw in Megwa? He’s been playing well for the younger side at right back has he not? It’s not like Fish is much more experienced than him.

Made a similar point more than once. We’ve spent vast sums on development players but when was the last time we gave a youngster a chance in the first team. Doig ?

[Just_Jimmy]

Made a similar point more than once. We’ve spent vast sums on development players but when was the last time we gave a youngster a chance in the first team. Doig ?Yeah and what's the point of developing players from other clubs when we've got players of our own. Unless these loans are outstanding and clearly better then we should be developing our own first and always.

Sent from my SM-G991B using Tapatalk

[JimBHibees]

Yeah and what's the point of developing players from other clubs when we've got players of our own. Unless these loans are outstanding and clearly better then we should be developing our own first and always.

Sent from my SM-G991B using Tapatalk

Totally agree why not give some of the young players a chance even 15 or 20 mins from the bench especially when the first team have been so poor and 3 or 4 know they are starting irrespective of performance

[bingo70]

Yeah and what's the point of developing players from other clubs when we've got players of our own. Unless these loans are outstanding and clearly better then we should be developing our own first and always.

Sent from my SM-G991B using Tapatalk

If players we can get on loan are better than ours then I’ve no issue with that, that’s the real world and our young players need to learn to live with that.

Playing young players out of position which blocks our own players from coming through is wrong. Even if Megwa played and didn’t play great, would still have been great experience for him which he could learn from.

Playing Fish there made no sense at all.

[silverhibee]

I think the one thing often forgotten is he sees the players from the outside but he doesn't know the personalities of the players till he works with them on a daily basis.

He knew McGeady obviously but all it needs is a couple akward players and that can bring down team spirit and level of training.

I would be curious to know how many players he actually met before signing though. Have a proper conversation with expectations etc.

A quite simple question a journalist or podcast could ask.

Would find it incredible if he didn't know the personality of new players before they were signed off though - sounds like a recipe for disaster.

Folk saying he didn't sign many of his own players last summer?? He had whole window to so...then he signs possibly 1 or 2 players this January meaning he's signed less than 5/10 own players in 2 windows ? Something doesn't add up.

I was chatting with a ex player and he mentioned that it was funny that the two players he has been sticking up for are the two who would have no hesitation in questioning him and having a go at him in the changing room, Aiden and Ryan, he has thrown everyone else under the bus , as folk have sai, he is an experienced manager and he knows how to deal with the press and players, everybody else’s fault apart from LJ. A bit like Lennon bout he couldn’t lace Lennon boots.

[silverhibee]

Not forgetting SH we have a very successful youth side, with 3 or 4 who could easily have been properly rewarded with first team action, in front of huge crowds, eager to impress, and who would have been positively supported from the stands. It’s scandalous that we are still playing Lewis in big games when there’s a young, match fit MacIntyre probably champing at the bit to get a chance - that’s how you develop talent, by putting them in, raw perhaps, but they’re talented. Holding them back for loans to lower league is stifling them. Even Mixu put in a raw Hanlon on his managerial debut in a 3-0 win where he was MotM. Laidlaw bangs them in at every age level so he surely knows where the net is, added to which, Liverpool don’t scout and trial players they don’t think have something (he even scored there too).

If I was a young player at Hibs, I’d be wanting out to progress my career, not remaining to wait until I’m 20/21. It’s scandalous they’ve been overlooked when the first team aren’t cutting the mustard.

Yip, but they aren’t getting a look in for some reason, probably have more experience than some players getting a game recently, Fish for example, European youth football from last season as well for some, I do think some will be wanting away in the summer. :wink:

[Donegal Hibby]

No, regards Lennon, he must have a bundle of winners medals from his playing and managerial times at Leicester & Celtc, I have to ask what has LJ won in his career compared to Lennon, and the red head knows Scottish football inside out.
The other poster I was replying to said that fans weren't bothered about clubs LJ had managed in the past when he called him a serial loser , I was merely pointing out that at 4 previous clubs he left them in a better position than when he took over and guided one to a final before leaving and lifting a trophy at another , it was pointed out that LJ has Hibs in 8th place losing 9 out of 11 which makes him a serial loser according to the poster yet he's wanting back a guy that left us in 8th place and only won 3 out of 15 , to me if ones a serial loser so had to be the other as well , I don't see it as a great upgrade myself and don't forget the way he left was unpleasant to say the least!

[blackpoolhibs]

If players we can get on loan are better than ours then I’ve no issue with that, that’s the real world and our young players need to learn to live with that.

Playing young players out of position which blocks our own players from coming through is wrong. Even if Megwa played and didn’t play great, would still have been great experience for him which he could learn from.

Playing Fish there made no sense at all.
:top marks

[WhileTheChief..]

When Hibs are looking for a manager I'm always bothered about who else they have managed and how they have done at previous clubs and imo he's done well at other clubs which doesn't put him in the serial loser description imo , yes he's lost 9 out of 11 which is bad though you yourself has hinted you would like Lennon back and what I was told today is he won 3 out of 15 and left with us 8th the same position we are in now under LJ , so if this is true about Lennon is he also a serial loser ? And why would anyone want a manager back that wasn't any better than the one we have ?

Lennon took us to our record points total and Europe. I don't think LJ would manage that , no matter how long he gets.

It's also been a few years since he left us. People change, gain experience, learn and move on. I think he would be a better manager for us now than when he left us.

Did you not enjoy watching Lennon's side more than what you've been watching recently? Even during his last few months and run of results, ER never felt as flat as it does now. He still had way more support from the stands and on here, than LJ is getting.

And when he left, although a lot of people were happy / delighted, there were more that were shocked / surprised / disappointed. I doubt that will be the case if LJ leaves us in the next month.



I don't disagree, although even Lennons mother could see he was gash without Stubbs guys. He'd struggle. Left a much better side than this 8th or 9th iirc.

I'd still prefer a struggling Lennon to what we've got now.

[MWHIBBIES]

Lennon took us to our record points total and Europe. I don't think LJ would manage that , no matter how long he gets.

It's also been a few years since he left us. People change, gain experience, learn and move on. I think he would be a better manager for us now than when he left us.

Did you not enjoy watching Lennon's side more than what you've been watching recently? Even during his last few months and run of results, ER never felt as flat as it does now. He still had way more support from the stands and on here, than LJ is getting.

And when he left, although a lot of people were happy / delighted, there were more that were shocked / surprised / disappointed. I doubt that will be the case if LJ leaves us in the next month.




I'd still prefer a struggling Lennon to what we've got now.

No one enjoyed watching Lennons side. Lennon with 90% of Stubbs side? Maybe.

[WhileTheChief..]

I see the EEN is unsubtly (is that the right word?) touting Neil Lennon....

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hibs/former-hibs-boss-neil-lennon-open-to-offers-as-he-considers-return-to-management-in-scotland-3975696

Was also in the Record. Last time it was the Sun that made it happen :wink:

If that's not an invitation to RG for talks, I don't know what is.

Us or Aberdeen, can't see him going anywhere else. I really hope we at least speak to him.

[Since452]

Lennon took us to our record points total and Europe. I don't think LJ would manage that , no matter how long he gets.

It's also been a few years since he left us. People change, gain experience, learn and move on. I think he would be a better manager for us now than when he left us.

Did you not enjoy watching Lennon's side more than what you've been watching recently? Even during his last few months and run of results, ER never felt as flat as it does now. He still had way more support from the stands and on here, than LJ is getting.

And when he left, although a lot of people were happy / delighted, there were more that were shocked / surprised / disappointed. I doubt that will be the case if LJ leaves us in the next month.




I'd still prefer a struggling Lennon to what we've got now.

I remember a struggling Lennon and would choose this over that every time. Still remember the disappointment when the floodlights came back on at Rugby Park and we were forced to continue playing.

[WhileTheChief..]

No one enjoyed watching Lennons side. Lennon with 90% of Stubbs side? Maybe.

You're unbelievable.

Disagreeing for the sake of it.

[WhileTheChief..]

I remember a struggling Lennon and would choose this over that every time. Still remember the disappointment when the floodlights came back on at Rugby Park and we were forced to continue playing.

Sure. I know there's plenty of you feel similarly and pick out a few examples of when things were gash. I remember these games too.

Still don't think it was anywhere near as grim as it is now.

[Heisenberg]

You're unbelievable.

Disagreeing for the sake of it.

I agree with him. Lennon absolutely fell to bits once he lost that squad. His behaviour towards the end was way worse than anything LJ has said or done in the last few weeks.

[B.H.F.C]

I remember a struggling Lennon and would choose this over that every time. Still remember the disappointment when the floodlights came back on at Rugby Park and we were forced to continue playing.

I know Lennon has been spoken about a lot but it wasn’t as bad as this IMO.

This run has been L9 and W2 from 11. Lennon’s time was up but in the month before he went we still managed to beat Celtic and draw with Rangers twice.

[HendoDelivered]

Sunderland fans on LJ - https://rokerreport.sbnation.com/2022/1/31/22909082/lee-johnson-departs-how-will-history-view-his-tenure-at-sunderland

https://wisemensay.co.uk/streaky-lee-the-unwanted-reputation-johnson-just-cant-shake/

Bristol fans on LJ - https://rokerreport.sbnation.com/2020/12/4/22152224/is-lee-johnson-any-good-bristol-city-fan-gives-honest-views-on-sunderland-managerial-candidate


https://thisisfutbol.com/2020/02/twitter/bristol-city-fans-slam-lee-johnsons-post-match-comments-on-the-teams-identity/

RR: And weaknesses - what would you say his biggest weaknesses as a manager are?

The One Robin: Inconsistency with team selection was a huge weakeness of his.

He often had Knee jerk reactions after a defeat, making multiple changes every game, with our fans often making jokes, comparing Johnson’s selections to simply drawing names at random, kind of like a raffle.

He also often has favourites, picking players that he knows are not playing well, leaving out players who quite frankly deserved a chance.”

[MWHIBBIES]

You're unbelievable.

Disagreeing for the sake of it.

Not at all, I think you're talking rubbish, surely not so difficult to believe?

[ErinGoBraghHFC]

I remember a struggling Lennon and would choose this over that every time. Still remember the disappointment when the floodlights came back on at Rugby Park and we were forced to continue playing.

That’s not the game where Efe started centre mid is it?[emoji1787]


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[Hibs4185]

No one enjoyed watching Lennons side. Lennon with 90% of Stubbs side? Maybe.

One of the best performances I’ve seen is pumping Aberdeen 4-0 at Easter road under Lennon. It was the one of the most complete performance’s I’ve seen.

I don’t particularly like Lennon or won’t him back but for me there is only one person that could get a tune out of this squad.

We have good players, just like Newcastle, but unfortunately we can’t afford Eddie Howe

[MWHIBBIES]

One of the best performances I’ve seen is pumping Aberdeen 4-0 at Easter road under Lennon. It was the one of the most complete performance’s I’ve seen.

I don’t particularly like Lennon or won’t him back but for me there is only one person that could get a tune out of this squad.

We have good players, just like Newcastle, but unfortunately we can’t afford Eddie Howe

I don't think you seen that dude. It didn't happen.

[Hibs4185]

I don't think you seen that dude. It didn't happen.

2-0 sorry. Should’ve been 4-0 though

[IberianHibernian]

LC elimination , league results and lack of progress in performances generally would be considered enough to sack a manager by many clubs . Throw in , public condemnation of club´s contracts policy and public berating of players , then case to sack LJ is overwhelming . But has he not still got 3 and a half years of contract to go which could mean we`d have to pay him and his team considerable compensation . There have been several threads here in recent years where question of paying off sacked managers has come up and no two cases seem to be the same but I suspect main reasons he`s still with us are that we can`t afford to sack him and that we don`t have an obvious replacement available ( We can give names like Lennon but we don`t know if he`d want to return to us or his conditions, likewise any other possible new manager ) .

[Donegal Hibby]

Lennon took us to our record points total and Europe. I don't think LJ would manage that , no matter how long he gets.

It's also been a few years since he left us. People change, gain experience, learn and move on. I think he would be a better manager for us now than when he left us.

Did you not enjoy watching Lennon's side more than what you've been watching recently? Even during his last few months and run of results, ER never felt as flat as it does now. He still had way more support from the stands and on here, than LJ is getting.

And when he left, although a lot of people were happy / delighted, there were more that were shocked / surprised / disappointed. I doubt that will be the case if LJ leaves us in the next month.



I'd still prefer a struggling Lennon to what we've got now.
Yes Lennon done well with the record points and getting us to Europe and I'd say LJ probably wouldn't either as imo a lot of teams are much stronger now in the league than when Lennon was at us , I'd also say Lennon took over at Hibs in the best time possibly anyone could have too , we were on a high after winning the cup , had a good team built by a previous manager with players like Mcginn , stokes , Cummings etc etc and in the championship where we were the big boys , Lee Johnson has came into a club struggling with league form under two previous manager's ( who both lost there jobs) also left with players on long contracts that he probably doesn't want and will be hard to move on as well as a much poorer recruitment team imo again , much much different scenarios between NL and LJ being Hibs manager and your right people do learn more and gain experience as years go by though I think Lennon will always be a volatile character ready to explode and the club will know this and he won't even be considered even if the job becomes available. I think watching Hibs towards the end of Lennon's time wasn't any better than watching Johnson side at times only difference being Lennon had it much easier imo !

[CMac1988]

Some quick thoughts on Lennon since he's being discussed.

Lennon brought belief with him. That transcended through the squad and to the fans and whilst he inherited most his squad and took a bit to get going, for the 2nd half of his first season in the premiership I've never enjoyed myself more as a Hibs fan with regards to league football. Every game was exciting and we could genuinely beat anyone. Unfortunately this was short lived and the end of Lennon's tenure was a messy affair and there is I'll always be that element of self destruction with him in charge.

He had the team working as hard as they ever had and they were up for every game. As above the flip side is also true in that when Lennon lost so did they.

Not sure this team will ever work that hard for LJ. The quality in the side is much diminished from a few years back and we were back to being mentally weak which is something I was hoping was over after Stubbs and Lennon.

[Jones28]

Sure. I know there's plenty of you feel similarly and pick out a few examples of when things were gash. I remember these games too.

Still don't think it was anywhere near as grim as it is now.

I think you’re right in some sense, but maybe it was because we were coming off the back of a good season where we nearly finished second?

I still think Lennon struggled when he had to put his own stamp on the team. That line up at Kilmarnock still gives me the shivers. 7 defenders on the park wasn’t it?

And we still got pumped.

[Iain G]

I think you’re right in some sense, but maybe it was because we were coming off the back of a good season where we nearly finished second?

I still think Lennon struggled when he had to put his own stamp on the team. That line up at Kilmarnock still gives me the shivers. 7 defenders on the park wasn’t it?

And we still got pumped.

But he is a natural born wiener!

[The Harp Awakes]

At present we're heading in one direction and that's the Championship. There's nothing to lose. Give Lennon a year/18 month contract to get us out of this mess.

If he improves us, and I think he will, extend his contract.

I want watching Hibs to be exciting again. No way Lennon would have allowed that meek performance at Tiny.

[green day]

No way Lennon would have allowed that meek performance at Tiny.

Have you forgotten his deliberate team selections toward the end of his time when his toys were out the pram?

Remarkably reminiscent to Johnsons obvious "sack me now" crap on Monday.

[Bridge hibs]

Have you forgotten his deliberate team selections toward the end of his time when his toys were out the pram?

Remarkably reminiscent to Johnsons obvious "sack me now" crap on Monday.Im sure I remember an issue with David Gray with Lennon not playing him saying he was injured and Gray insisting he was fit and ready to play, yet folk on here dont trust what Johnson says

[The Harp Awakes]

Have you forgotten his deliberate team selections toward the end of his time when his toys were out the pram?

Remarkably reminiscent to Johnsons obvious "sack me now" crap on Monday.

It went sour in the end for Lennon sure and he lost the plot. Was that all down to Lennon or was it because he felt the club weren't keeping his back or backing him financially - abuse at Tinygate and repeatedly at Ibrox, or the Kamberi incident. Who, knows. I'm not an insider so I don't. I can remember a few long standing Hibs players saying he was the best Manager they had worked under.

What I loved about Lennon was the way he and his teams refused to be intimidated going to Ibrox and Tiny. He wouldn't allow the meek performances which have resurfaced since he left. The period back in the Premiership after relegation was the last time I was excited going to watch Hibs.

[green day]

What I loved about Lennon was the way he and his teams refused to be intimidated going to Ibrox and Tiny. He wouldn't allow the meek performances which have resurfaced since he left. The period back in the Premiership after relegation was the last time I was excited going to watch Hibs.

I dont necessarily disagree with that, and I certainly enjoyed that never say die attitude - my dad when he was alive loved Lennon and his "up you" attitude to Rangers and Hearts.

However, I just cant overlook the way that he put out a few terrible selections "as a signal" to the board toward the end.

All managers are in that seat for a limited period - we fans are with the club forever.

We deserve managers that dont disresepect that bond.

As a comparison, he would never ever have done that as Celtic manager whatever the circumstances.

[Hibs90]

Lennon is good at getting results when taking over a squad that's already been built, but when he has to piece together his own that's usually where it comes apart.


It's a big fat no, as what this team needs is a rebuild.

[Heisenberg]

It went sour in the end for Lennon sure and he lost the plot. Was that all down to Lennon or was it because he felt the club weren't keeping his back or backing him financially - abuse at Tinygate and repeatedly at Ibrox, or the Kamberi incident. Who, knows. I'm not an insider so I don't. I can remember a few long standing Hibs players saying he was the best Manager they had worked under.

What I loved about Lennon was the way he and his teams refused to be intimidated going to Ibrox and Tiny. He wouldn't allow the meek performances which have resurfaced since he left. The period back in the Premiership after relegation was the last time I was excited going to watch Hibs.

His team bottled it at tiny a few times. He ****ed up the team selection when we were going for second then took the huff and didn’t turn up at training for days when we lost.

I can’t argue that the first season back up was electric at times but he has many flaws and I wouldn’t want him in with this squad of players.

[Brightside]

The last thing Lennon would do is bring the squad together. He also is a very poor fit socially for us. I know most wouldn't be bothered but having managers out on the piss is never a good look (as per recent Derby). I don't think there is a hope in hell that Lennon will be back at Hibs and I'm personally very happy about that. (Despite Gary Parker being a superb fountain of gossip)

[GreenGray]

Lennon is good at getting results when taking over a squad that's already been built, but when he has to piece together his own that's usually where it comes apart.


It's a big fat no, as what this team needs is a rebuild.

This point is what’s stuck in my head, on the face of it may seem like the right thing to do but when you really think about it it has disaster written all over it.

Is there someone like Lennon, similar mentality etc. but without the extra baggage?


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[flash]

The last thing Lennon would do is bring the squad together. He also is a very poor fit socially for us. I know most wouldn't be bothered but having managers out on the piss is never a good look (as per recent Derby). I don't think there is a hope in hell that Lennon will be back at Hibs and I'm personally very happy about that. (Despite Gary Parker being a superb fountain of gossip)

Pretty sure the one period i was privvy to inside info it was coming from Gary Parker too.

[MWHIBBIES]

LC elimination , league results and lack of progress in performances generally would be considered enough to sack a manager by many clubs . Throw in , public condemnation of club´s contracts policy and public berating of players , then case to sack LJ is overwhelming . But has he not still got 3 and a half years of contract to go which could mean we`d have to pay him and his team considerable compensation . There have been several threads here in recent years where question of paying off sacked managers has come up and no two cases seem to be the same but I suspect main reasons he`s still with us are that we can`t afford to sack him and that we don`t have an obvious replacement available ( We can give names like Lennon but we don`t know if he`d want to return to us or his conditions, likewise any other possible new manager ) .

Has there ever actually been an example of a club being unable to afford to sack a manager? Certainly not at Hibs. That is not the reason. You lose significantly more money by getting beat every week than you do sacking a manager.

[jeffers]

Has there ever actually been an example of a club being unable to afford to sack a manager? Certainly not at Hibs. That is not the reason. You lose significantly more money by getting beat every week than you do sacking a manager.

Also taking into consideration I believe we include a termination clause when they sign the contract, after getting burned with Butcher we’d be crazy not to.

[WhileTheChief..]

I think you’re right in some sense, but maybe it was because we were coming off the back of a good season where we nearly finished second?

I still think Lennon struggled when he had to put his own stamp on the team. That line up at Kilmarnock still gives me the shivers. 7 defenders on the park wasn’t it?

And we still got pumped.

Yeah but it's telling that that game is one of a handful that stick out for being really bad out of 2.5 seasons.

Folk go on about it being Stubb's team.

Stubbs couldn't get that side out the Championship, Lennon did it at a canter. We were top of the league for pretty much the whole season and when we beat Dundee Utd around Xmas or New Year, it was never in doubt.

First season up is the best season I've ever experienced at ER since the 70s.

I'm not saying he's a footballing Messiah, but I absolutely think he would do better than we're doing now. That's got to be a good thing.

[Hibbyradge]

Bring Lennon back.

I've missed our manager being asked about Celtic during press conferences.

[Since452]

At present we're heading in one direction and that's the Championship. There's nothing to lose. Give Lennon a year/18 month contract to get us out of this mess.

If he improves us, and I think he will, extend his contract.

I want watching Hibs to be exciting again. No way Lennon would have allowed that meek performance at Tiny.

Do you not remember Lennons meek performance at Tiny?

[Steven79]

Do you not remember Lennons meek performance at Tiny?Oh I do!

Was living in Bradford at the time and came up and down by train which included a 3 hour stop off in Manchester overnight to see Lennon throw the white flag up with his lineup.

We would have thrashed them if we had played our normal game.



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[allezsauzee]

Lennon is good at getting results when taking over a squad that's already been built, but when he has to piece together his own that's usually where it comes apart.


It's a big fat no, as what this team needs is a rebuild.

Lennon often didn't get to bring in the players actually wanted because we were being too tight with cash. Now we seem to be happy to splash the cash but it's being spent on numpties. This would seem the ideal time to have a manager like him.

[Hibs90]

Yeah but it's telling that that game is one of a handful that stick out for being really bad out of 2.5 seasons.

Folk go on about it being Stubb's team.

Stubbs couldn't get that side out the Championship, Lennon did it at a canter. We were top of the league for pretty much the whole season and when we beat Dundee Utd around Xmas or New Year, it was never in doubt.

First season up is the best season I've ever experienced at ER since the 70s.

I'm not saying he's a footballing Messiah, but I absolutely think he would do better than we're doing now. That's got to be a good thing.

If Stubbs had stayed on after the SC win he more than likely would have got us out at that time.

[MWHIBBIES]

Yeah but it's telling that that game is one of a handful that stick out for being really bad out of 2.5 seasons.

Folk go on about it being Stubb's team.

Stubbs couldn't get that side out the Championship, Lennon did it at a canter. We were top of the league for pretty much the whole season and when we beat Dundee Utd around Xmas or New Year, it was never in doubt.

First season up is the best season I've ever experienced at ER since the 70s.

I'm not saying he's a footballing Messiah, but I absolutely think he would do better than we're doing now. That's got to be a good thing.

Stubbs won the cup with it, and reached another final. An achievement far beyond promotion with the same number of points as Stubbs got a season before in a much harder league.

It was most of the season after McGinn left. Lennon had already ****ed up renewing McGeouch and let Fyvie go.

We were excellent that season back up, and alright in the championship winning season. I missed about 3 games total over those 2 season. I was loving it.

We were absolutely hopeless when the key guys stubbs signed left. Lennon was the one who started losing games to Hearts again. That cup defeat where he played for 0-0. The embarrassing 2-1 when we were 20 points ahead and going for 2nd. His last derby at Easter Road.

There is very little to suggest he'd do better with the current side.

[Nutmegged]

The other poster I was replying to said that fans weren't bothered about clubs LJ had managed in the past when he called him a serial loser , I was merely pointing out that at 4 previous clubs he left them in a better position than when he took over and guided one to a final before leaving and lifting a trophy at another , it was pointed out that LJ has Hibs in 8th place losing 9 out of 11 which makes him a serial loser according to the poster yet he's wanting back a guy that left us in 8th place and only won 3 out of 15 , to me if ones a serial loser so had to be the other as well , I don't see it as a great upgrade myself and don't forget the way he left was unpleasant to say the least!

Lennon got us promoted, unspectacularly but without too much fuss whilst also giving our defence of the Scottish Cup a damn good go, in 2017-18 we finished with our highest ever points total, losing McGinn, McGeouch and Allan was always going to take a while to revover from and MacLaren taking an age to re-join then not being anywhere near the fitness leslvels meant we weren't as strong up top either, Lennon wasn't perfect, far from it but for one of the very few times in my 35+ years supporting Hibernian I felt like we had a leader and someone if given time could take us places.

[cameronw-hfc]

Lennon got us promoted, unspectacularly but without too much fuss whilst also giving our defence of the Scottish Cup a damn good go, in 2017-18 we finished with our highest ever points total, losing McGinn, McGeouch and Allan was always going to take a while to revover from and MacLaren taking an age to re-join then not being anywhere near the fitness leslvels meant we weren't as strong up top either, Lennon wasn't perfect, far from it but for one of the very few times in my 35+ years supporting Hibernian I felt like we had a leader and someone if given time could take us places.


He also left us in a shambles. The downturn in form besides one season where everyone was crap started under Lennon. Becky stabilized the ship a little bit, Jack Ross came in and done well for a season but we could all see we weren't third because we were great, it was because everyone else was just worse.

Lennon was fun, but the longer time goes the better his spell seems at Hibs.

[FitbaFolkKen]

He also left us in a shambles. The downturn in form besides one season where everyone was crap started under Lennon. Becky stabilized the ship a little bit, Jack Ross came in and done well for a season but we could all see we weren't third because we were great, it was because everyone else was just worse.

Lennon was fun, but the longer time goes the better his spell seems at Hibs.

This is classic Hibs, we finish third once in a blue moon and instead of enjoying finishing third and a load of cup finals we decide that we only got third because everyone else is rubbish and play it down.

Of course everyone else was worse, we were better than them. We only finished above them because they weren’t as good as us……

The major problem I have is Ross didn’t get what he felt was needed to build on third and that’s why we are where we are now.


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[tonyrougier123]

This is classic Hibs, we finish third once in a blue moon and instead of enjoying finishing third and a load of cup finals we decide that we only got third because everyone else is rubbish and play it down.

Of course everyone else was worse, we were better than them. We only finished above them because they weren’t as good as us……

The major problem I have is Ross didn’t get what he felt was needed to build on third and that’s why we are where we are now.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Everybody else is still garbage but we are as bad now.
I’ll tell you I mind some good stuff under Ross and I bought most of the games on PPV so I wasn’t as bored as some supporters were.

Trouble started when we brought in guys like Murphy to replace horgan who was a wee terrier and a whippet,really started whipping good balls in for Nisbet and doidge and we enjoyed a good spell at that time.

[MWHIBBIES]

Everybody else is still garbage but we are as bad now.
I’ll tell you I mind some good stuff under Ross and I bought most of the games on PPV so I wasn’t as bored as some supporters were.

Trouble started when we brought in guys like Murphy to replace horgan who was a wee terrier and a whippet,really started whipping good balls in for Nisbet and doidge and we enjoyed a good spell at that time.

A good spell of that 1 match Vs Livi.

Murphy was with us that entire season we finished 3rd. The problem came when we signed no one the following summer.

[blackpoolhibs]

He also left us in a shambles. The downturn in form besides one season where everyone was crap started under Lennon. Becky stabilized the ship a little bit, Jack Ross came in and done well for a season but we could all see we weren't third because we were great, it was because everyone else was just worse.

Lennon was fun, but the longer time goes the better his spell seems at Hibs.

What a load of sheite, i'd kill for us to be as sheite as we were then, in this sheite league we now play in.

[Brightside]

What a load of sheite, i'd kill for us to be as sheite as we were then, in this sheite league we now play in.

Everyone else is still *****. So yes please let us be as ***** as we were then.

[bingo70]

Everyone else is still *****. So yes please let us be as ***** as we were then.

For me, all this board has been missing the last week or so has been a good Jack Ross debate so let’s get one going.

For me he was to boring and didn’t win enough big games.

Danderhall Hibs around for comment?

[The Modfather]

For me, all this board has been missing the last week or so has been a good Jack Ross debate so let’s get one going.

For me he was to boring and didn’t win enough big games.

Danderhall Hibs around for comment?

Can we just skip to, what counts as a big game? And folk wanting 1970s Brazil football or 3 points, with seemingly nothing in between 😀

[bingo70]

Can we just skip to, what counts as a big game? And folk wanting 1970s Brazil football or 3 points, with seemingly nothing in between 😀

Absolutely not.

Pick a side and die on that hill.

PS, my final word on the matter, Aberdeen wasn’t a big game.

[supermcginn]

For me, all this board has been missing the last week or so has been a good Jack Ross debate so let’s get one going.

For me he was to boring and didn’t win enough big games.

Danderhall Hibs around for comment?

His disastrous spell at Dundee Utd has finished him off. He'll need to go back down the leagues.