Housing

[superfurryhibby]

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No it's only 16 homes. The hotel would bring jobs to a rural area and the tennis centre would help the community and the youth of Scotland. Andy had to move to Spain as we had no facilities.

I think you should read more about the development and why there was opposition to it.

I'll leave one that with you, keep in mind that permission was actually granted, though with proviso's.

[Ozyhibby]

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House prices are way disproportionate to wages. There are plenty houses, it's just that young people can't afford them.

Anyway, back to the Murray story. Permission was actually granted for the development, they wanted the public purse to part fund their hotel, luxury housing , tennis and golf development and pulled out due to rising costs etc.

We have plenty houses?
If we have plenty houses then why are they so expensive?


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[superfurryhibby]

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We have plenty houses?
If we have plenty houses then why are they so expensive?


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Greed. We could spend all day debating why that is so. and why the private sector are not going to solve the housing crisis, no matter how many houses they build. I

However, you claimed that planning stopped housing development.

Clearly that was nonsense, given that in the situation you were posting about permission was actually granted? The developers themselves cited rising costs and a number of other factors as to why they pulled out of their hotel, luxury housing, tennis and golf academy plans.

"significant increases in construction, material, energy and labour costs, a lengthy and uncertain planning process, and protracted discussions with governing bodies” were among the factors behind the decision.

[Ozyhibby]

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Greed. We could spend all day debating why that is so. and why the private sector are not going to solve the housing crisis, no matter how many houses they build. I

However, you claimed that planning stopped housing development.

Clearly that was nonsense, given that in the situation you were posting about permission was actually granted? The developers themselves cited rising costs and a number of other factors as to why they pulled out of their hotel, luxury housing, tennis and golf academy plans.

"significant increases in construction, material, energy and labour costs, a lengthy and uncertain planning process, and protracted discussions with governing bodies” were among the factors behind the decision.

So if I wanted to be greedy I could just set the price of my house at £1m and I would get it?
Planning very much stops houses getting built. The process of lodging a planning application is no longer viable on small developments. That’s why you never see small builders building one or two houses a year anymore. The planning system is only for the big volume builders who want green field sites. If I found a small patch of brownfield land in Edinburgh the planning process would prevent a single dwelling being built. The only way it’s worthwhile is if I’m building a multi unit development.

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[Moulin Yarns]

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So if I wanted to be greedy I could just set the price of my house at £1m and I would get it?
Planning very much stops houses getting built. The process of lodging a planning application is no longer viable on small developments. That’s why you never see small builders building one or two houses a year anymore. The planning system is only for the big volume builders who want green field sites. If I found a small patch of brownfield land in Edinburgh the planning process would prevent a single dwelling being built. The only way it’s worthwhile is if I’m building a multi unit development.

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That is so wrong. The planning system allows for single properties in the right places. I should know, I'm surrounded by them!!

[Ozyhibby]

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That is so wrong. The planning system allows for single properties in the right places. I should know, I'm surrounded by them!!

And yet we are still not building them. What do you think is the reason we are not building enough houses?


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[superfurryhibby]

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So if I wanted to be greedy I could just set the price of my house at £1m and I would get it?
Planning very much stops houses getting built. The process of lodging a planning application is no longer viable on small developments. That’s why you never see small builders building one or two houses a year anymore. The planning system is only for the big volume builders who want green field sites. If I found a small patch of brownfield land in Edinburgh the planning process would prevent a single dwelling being built. The only way it’s worthwhile is if I’m building a multi unit development.

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Shifting the goalposts a bit now.

Can your admit your post on the Murray development was inaccurate?

[Ozyhibby]

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Shifting the goalposts a bit now.

Can your admit your post on the Murray development was inaccurate?

It took 11 years to get conditional approval and you’re saying it’s a planning success? The conditions made it unviable and now it’s not happening. Another result for the nimbys.


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[Moulin Yarns]

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And yet we are still not building them. What do you think is the reason we are not building enough houses?


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Depends who's not building. You've complained in the past about the numbers of new student flats, so they are getting built.

In the 1970s and 80s student flats were private landlords, now those flats are likely to be Airbnb.

Volume builders used to build speculatively nowadays they sell off plan, so they have a buyer before building.

Where I live the farmer sold individual plots at £100 -£150k in the 1990s, 15 individual houses built by different architects and builders.

[superfurryhibby]

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It took 11 years to get conditional approval and you’re saying it’s a planning success? The conditions made it unviable and now it’s not happening. Another result for the nimbys.


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Judy Murray won an eight-year planning battle to build the complex south of Dunblane at the end of 2021.

But the scheme continued to face opposition from local campaigners due to the site being located on green-belt land.

At the heart of this project was an exclusive luxury housing development that would have been damaging to the local landscape and would have eroded ancient woodlands and crucial greenbelt land.

"A statement from the charity said “significant increases in construction, material, energy and labour costs, a lengthy and uncertain planning process, and protracted discussions with governing bodies” were among the factors behind the decision.

Scottish Green MSP Mark Ruskell

“We all want to see a fitting tennis legacy for Andy Murray across Scotland, but building an inaccessible private sports centre, reliant on public funding, in a location that has very little local support was never going to end well.

[Ozyhibby]

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Depends who's not building. You've complained in the past about the numbers of new student flats, so they are getting built.

In the 1970s and 80s student flats were private landlords, now those flats are likely to be Airbnb.

Volume builders used to build speculatively nowadays they sell off plan, so they have a buyer before building.

Where I live the farmer sold individual plots at £100 -£150k in the 1990s, 15 individual houses built by different architects and builders.

I’ve not complained about student flats? I’m in favour of them.


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[Kato]

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It’s almost like we enjoy being poor.


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Crabs in a bucket mentality.

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[hibee]

I live in a relatively new build home built on part of the local farmers land that he sold. Any time there’s a new planning application the people who live around here complain about the loss of green space.

These people never seem to acknowledge that their house is also sitting on what was another one of the same farmers fields not that long ago.

They always say things like we won’t have any green space left when in reality I walk 2 minutes from my house and can only see green space for as far as my eyes can see!

[superfurryhibby]

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I live in a relatively new build home built on part of the local farmers land that he sold. Any time there’s a new planning application the people who live around here complain about the loss of green space.

These people never seem to acknowledge that their house is also sitting on what was another one of the same farmers fields not that long ago.

They always say things like we won’t have any green space left when in reality I walk 2 minutes from my house and can only see green space for as far as my eyes can see!

Give it another twenty years, I'm sure that can be remedied for you.

[RyeSloan]

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It took 11 years to get conditional approval and you’re saying it’s a planning success? The conditions made it unviable and now it’s not happening. Another result for the nimbys.


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It appears the story actually goes all the way back to 1988!

Oddly planning permission was actually granted at one point for an earlier version of the scheme:

https://www.urbanrealm.com/features/...and_Forth.html

[hibee]

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Give it another twenty years, I'm sure that can be remedied for you.

If I’m still fit enough to go for walks in 20 years I’ll be delighted regardless of the view

[Bristolhibby]

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I live in a relatively new build home built on part of the local farmers land that he sold. Any time there’s a new planning application the people who live around here complain about the loss of green space.

These people never seem to acknowledge that their house is also sitting on what was another one of the same farmers fields not that long ago.

They always say things like we won’t have any green space left when in reality I walk 2 minutes from my house and can only see green space for as far as my eyes can see!

True, my estate (40 houses and flats) was built on a village on farmers fields back in 2008. I have the village life in a modern (insulated) house.

More houses were built over the A4 in the other village.

No issues with facilities. The village has a good primary, shop, pub, Indian / another pub and a massive country house / hotel / golf course.

J

[Ozyhibby]

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Give it another twenty years, I'm sure that can be remedied for you.

Yip. If they apply for planning now that will just about do it.


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[Moulin Yarns]

Might not be in the central belt, but plenty of development elsewhere.

https://www.perthwest.com/

https://www.thespringfieldgroup.co.u...tha-park-perth

That's 4000 new homes with all the associated infrastructure, schools, shops, surgery etc within an hour of Edinburgh.

[Moulin Yarns]

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I’ve not complained about student flats? I’m in favour of them.


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Apologies, someone else did. Anyways, the rest of my post stands.

[Stairway 2 7]

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Might not be in the central belt, but plenty of development elsewhere.

https://www.perthwest.com/

https://www.thespringfieldgroup.co.u...tha-park-perth

That's 4000 new homes with all the associated infrastructure, schools, shops, surgery etc within an hour of Edinburgh.

We can all put up single examples or say plenty getting built near me but it's better to go with actual nationwide figures. Housebuilding is well behind target. We've even lower spare homes than England and a quarter of the free homes that every western European nation has. Scotland has now got massive net immigration 48,800 people last year. They all need homes also. I'd say it's by far the biggest crisis hitting people my age and younger.


https://news.stv.tv/politics/housebuilding-in-scotland-plummets-official-figures-reveal

Statistics released by the Scottish Government show that overall there were 20,992 new homes built across all sectors in 2023, a fall of 11% since the year before.

There was an even bigger fall for the number of newly built homes being started last year.

Some 16,017 houses started construction, a decrease of 24% and 5,009 fewer than 2022

Statistics show 2,073 housing association new build starts in 2023, the lowest level since 1988.

“Local authority starts (1,192 homes) in 2023 were at the lowest number since 2013”.

[Moulin Yarns]

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We can all put up single examples or say plenty getting built near me but it's better to go with actual nationwide figures. Housebuilding is well behind target. We've even lower spare homes than England and a quarter of the free homes that every western European nation has. Scotland has now got massive net immigration 48,800 people last year. They all need homes also. I'd say it's by far the biggest crisis hitting people my age and younger.


https://news.stv.tv/politics/housebuilding-in-scotland-plummets-official-figures-reveal

Statistics released by the Scottish Government show that overall there were 20,992 new homes built across all sectors in 2023, a fall of 11% since the year before.

There was an even bigger fall for the number of newly built homes being started last year.

Some 16,017 houses started construction, a decrease of 24% and 5,009 fewer than 2022

Statistics show 2,073 housing association new build starts in 2023, the lowest level since 1988.

“Local authority starts (1,192 homes) in 2023 were at the lowest number since 2013”.

As I said earlier Airbnb has a lot to answer for when it comes to small affordable flats in the cities. The kind that used to be the first step on the ladder.

My first flat, 1 bedroom in grangemouth in 1979 £4k now, £53k

[Ozyhibby]

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As I said earlier Airbnb has a lot to answer for when it comes to small affordable flats in the cities. The kind that used to be the first step on the ladder.

My first flat, 1 bedroom in grangemouth in 1979 £4k now, £53k

Not just Airbnb. The government encourage it with favourable tax rules compared to a standard let house. It can save you thousands a year in tax by doing a holiday let rather than rent to a resident.


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[CropleyWasGod]

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Not just Airbnb. The government encourage it with favourable tax rules compared to a standard let house. It can save you thousands a year in tax by doing a holiday let rather than rent to a resident.


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That's stopping in April.

[Andy Bee]

I've asked this before in here but just to clarify. When you own an AirBNB do you pay council tax and if so do you pay double after a year like a normal property?

[Stairway 2 7]

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As I said earlier Airbnb has a lot to answer for when it comes to small affordable flats in the cities. The kind that used to be the first step on the ladder.

My first flat, 1 bedroom in grangemouth in 1979 £4k now, £53k

To have the same the same amount of spare homes as Germany France Holland ect we'd need about 250,000 extra homes in Scotland. There are 30k rooms on Airbnb they could all become houses and it still wouldn't help as net immigration it 50k people.

I just don't understand how people can see the fact and not scream for mass house building. I'm so fortunate I've got a home but too many just don't. There are around 10k homeless children in Scotland and 45 net get added to that number each day. It's a disgrace and a large number of people in their nice homes just don't care

[CropleyWasGod]

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I've asked this before in here but just to clarify. When you own an AirBNB do you pay council tax and if so do you pay double after a year like a normal property?

No, but you do pay business rates.

[Ozyhibby]

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That's stopping in April.

I know but it’s been a long time and it was a big driver of investors moving to serviced accommodation. Especially for higher rate tax payers.


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[overdrive]

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I know but it’s been a long time and it was a big driver of investors moving to serviced accommodation. Especially for higher rate tax payers.


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I think we'll start to see a move in the other direction. My mate runs a letting agency. It was purely short-term serviced apartments until recently. They are now moving towards a mix of short-term serviced apartments, medium-term serviced apartments (e.g. letting to businesses, film crews, etc.) and residential. He says the regulatory framework now means that purely short-term holiday lets isn't sustainable as a business. He points out that short-term and medium-term lets can be something that's actually required beyond tourism. They take a lot of insurance lets, i.e. folk that need short-term re-housing where their home has been damaged due to fire, flood, etc.

Its a dangerous business - he went to speak to a tenant last week after receiving complaints from neighbours and the guy hadn't responded to his emails. Guy pulled a knife out on him. Despite that, he can't easily get rid of the guy.

[Ozyhibby]

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Its a dangerous business - he went to speak to a tenant last week after receiving complaints from neighbours and the guy hadn't responded to his emails. Guy pulled a knife out on him. Despite that, he can't easily get rid of the guy.

Not at all, it’s practically free money, landlords are raking it in for absolutely no work.


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