Vaccine Passports for Easter Road

[Green Badger]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Can you tell me why I am wrong. This is the table/graph I am looking at. Can you tell me how I am misunderstanding it. If I am I will be the first to apologise. The rates for vaccinated individuals are in black and the table is per 100K people and from the NHS albeit in England

Attachment 25073

Here's a good explanation of why you should maybe take that report and those graphs with a pinch of salt:

https://twitter.com/JamesWard73/stat...16682389184516

[LaMotta]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Can you tell me why I am wrong. This is the table/graph I am looking at. Can you tell me how I am misunderstanding it. If I am I will be the first to apologise. The rates for vaccinated individuals are in black and the table is per 100K people and from the NHS albeit in England

Attachment 25073

The reason I think what you are asserting isnt quite right is because the graph shows infection rates per 100,000 based on overall population. (Or overall numbers of people in that age group).

Given that the majority of the population has been double vaxxed, (certainly in that age group) then it is to be expected that more vaccinated people per 100,000 people will have been infected.

As Moulin Yarns points out above somewhere, if you work out percentages of those getting infected out of the unvaccinated and vaccinated based on totals of each vaccinated status, then it would show that unvax more likely to get it.

Someone can tell me if im talking pish

[Stairway 2 7]

Ed Conway
@EdConwaySky
·
1h
These bars show you #COVID19 deaths among different age groups in England as a % of total cases in recent weeks.
The higher the bars, the higher the fatality rate.
The red bars are unvaccinated people.
The dark blue bars are fully vaccinated people
Screenshot_20210910-115550_Chrome.jpg

[Moulin Yarns]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

The reason I think what you are asserting isnt quite right is because the graph shows infection rates per 100,000 based on overall population. (Or overall numbers of people in that age group).

Given that the majority of the population has been double vaxxed, (certainly in that age group) then it is to be expected that more vaccinated people per 100,000 people will have been infected.

As Moulin Yarns points out above somewhere, if you work out percentages of those getting infected out of the unvaccinated and vaccinated based on totals of each vaccinated status, then it would show that unvax more likely to get it.

Someone can tell me if im talking pish

Yer talking pish, but I agree with you 😉

That's exactly what I tried to say.

[The dalmeny]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Ed Conway
@EdConwaySky
·
1h
These bars show you #COVID19 deaths among different age groups in England as a % of total cases in recent weeks.
The higher the bars, the higher the fatality rate.
The red bars are unvaccinated people.
The dark blue bars are fully vaccinated people
Screenshot_20210910-115550_Chrome.jpg

would have liked to see this in numbers not %s

[Stairway 2 7]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

would have liked to see this in numbers not %s

92% of adults are vaccinated, almost 100% of over 50s. Over 50s pre vaccine used to account for 95% of deaths. This gives us vaccines stopping something like 98% of deaths. It's just the vaccinated number of people are so huge and higher the older you go.

For 75% of hospitalisations now to come from the 8% who are mainly weighted younger is unbelievable.

[The dalmeny]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

92% of adults are vaccinated, almost 100% of over 50s. Over 50s pre vaccine used to account for 95% of deaths. This gives us vaccines stopping something like 98% of deaths. It's just the vaccinated number of people are so huge and higher the older you go.

For 75% of hospitalisations now to come from the 8% who are mainly weighted younger is unbelievable.

trouble is %s hide things,

almost 100% of over 50 are vaccinated but on the graph for the over 80s 3 times as many unvaccinated are dieing to every one vaccinated. So if 10 vaccinated die, that must be 30 unvaccinated die but almost 100% of that age group are vaccinated, confusing.

I suspect the numbers are there, but it starts robbing of me of my life to look into that

[wookie70]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

The reason I think what you are asserting isnt quite right is because the graph shows infection rates per 100,000 based on overall population. (Or overall numbers of people in that age group).

Given that the majority of the population has been double vaxxed, (certainly in that age group) then it is to be expected that more vaccinated people per 100,000 people will have been infected.

As Moulin Yarns points out above somewhere, if you work out percentages of those getting infected out of the unvaccinated and vaccinated based on totals of each vaccinated status, then it would show that unvax more likely to get it.

Someone can tell me if im talking pish

Right I get where you are coming from.

Is the 100K definitely including the whole population at that age group.

I took it to mean per 100k of vaccinated people(The heading is - Rates among persons vaccinated with 2 doses(per 100,000)) and 100K of unvaccinated people (heading in table being - Rates among persons not vaccinated(per 100,000)), hence my conclusion. If it had said rate per 100K of population I would have ignored it based on what you are saying. I still think I am reading the table as it reads but perhaps the wording is wrong or I have misunderstood it.

If it is how you have interpreted it, why report it like that. Surely a straight comparison what percentage in each group have Covid would be far more useful.

[Ronniekirk]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Can you not purchase the flu vaccine already ?
My employment give me a voucher for it to get it free from Lloyds chemist within certain months

Yes I get mine on the 18 th September from boots


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Stairway 2 7]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

trouble is %s hide things,

almost 100% of over 50 are vaccinated but on the graph for the over 80s 3 times as many unvaccinated are dieing to every one vaccinated. So if 10 vaccinated die, that must be 30 unvaccinated die but almost 100% of that age group are vaccinated, confusing.

I suspect the numbers are there, but it starts robbing of me of my life to look into that

Because vaccines are unbelievably good and stop 97% of serious illness, but 3% of a massive number is still big. People will still die if vaccinated, but the numbers will be low enough for us all to live and the NHS to cope whilst functioning

[Stokesy's on fire]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Stokesy’s on fire = Hibs.net’s Janey Godley

Jane Godley is another one of Sturgeons Muppet's. The sooner this modern day Thatcher is removed the better

[LaMotta]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Right I get where you are coming from.

Is the 100K definitely including the whole population at that age group.

I took it to mean per 100k of vaccinated people(The heading is - Rates among persons vaccinated with 2 doses(per 100,000)) and 100K of unvaccinated people (heading in table being - Rates among persons not vaccinated(per 100,000)), hence my conclusion. If it had said rate per 100K of population I would have ignored it based on what you are saying. I still think I am reading the table as it reads but perhaps the wording is wrong or I have misunderstood it.

If it is how you have interpreted it, why report it like that. Surely a straight comparison what percentage in each group have Covid would be far more useful.

You could be right.

If I am right then I very much agree with your last point though.

[Peevemor]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Jane Godley is another one of Sturgeons Muppet's. The sooner this modern day Thatcher is removed the better

If you're likening Sturgeon to Thatcher, I find it hard to believe that you lived through Thatcher. If you did then you werent paying attention.

[wookie70]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

You could be right.

If I am right then I very much agree with your last point though.

Thanks, I am not setting out to misrepresent tables etc and certainly not to scare people and appreciate you challenging without calling me stupid or selfish.

I mistrust the Government and media and with all the spin I like to look at the stats and try and make my own mind up.

I will say the stats in the document do an excellent job of convincing me that having the vaccination was a good choice for me(and most others), with a highlight on choice. The part I am prattling on about took me by surprise because if it is how I interpret, and how I think it is written, then I feel it needs explanation. It doesn't mean the vaccine isn't better at stopping transmission but it may indicate that it only works for a short time and that those that were early adopters may already be back to square one at least in terms of their danger to others. Studies are suggesting that for Pfizer already. If so, surely that makes passports a ridiculous thing to bring in particularly as they have a duration of a year and that isn't even based on what date you were vaccinated rather when you applied for the passport.

I'm sticking to my guns on the figures we are discussing. I can't see how that table can be read as per 100k of population. Maybe that is what the data is but it certainly isn't headed that way.

[The dalmeny]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Because vaccines are unbelievably good and stop 97% of serious illness, but 3% of a massive number is still big. People will still die if vaccinated, but the numbers will be low enough for us all to live and the NHS to cope whilst functioning

Not disputing the effectiveness of vaccination. My problem is with the graph because the comparison is vaccinated v unvaccinated. over 80s could represent a total of 100 people 50-59 could be 10000

[lord bunberry]

How many pages has it been since this thread had anything to do with football? There’s a thread on the holy ground to talk about this kind of thing. I click on this thread now and again to try and find out what’s going to be happening when I need to show my passport at the football and all I read is page after page of people arguing about covid.

[Moulin Yarns]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

If you're likening Sturgeon to Thatcher, I find it hard to believe that you lived through Thatcher. If you did then you werent paying attention.

I'm wondering if there’s been a change of username 🤔

[Hibs90]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Jane Godley is another one of Sturgeons Muppet's. The sooner this modern day Thatcher is removed the better

Cheers for that, funniest thing I've read on here possibly ever.

[Stokesy's on fire]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Cheers for that, funniest thing I've read on here possibly ever.

More than welcome

[wookie70]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Here's a good explanation of why you should maybe take that report and those graphs with a pinch of salt:

https://twitter.com/JamesWard73/stat...16682389184516

Thanks that explains it better. I don't use twitter very often so was unaware anyone else had even noticed that.

Assuming that twitter author is correct, I was right it is 100k of vaccinated v 100k of unvaccinated. I mentioned in previous posts some of the reasons the figures could be the opposite of what was expected could be behaviour of the vaccinated and the vaccine losing its effectiveness over time. I have noted in this thread that previous data are based on figures before Delta and the picture may have changed. I have suggested that antibodies from prior infection play a large part in stopping people getting covid again and maybe even more than the vaccine(given reports I linked to). I missed out the willingness to be tested but not sure I agree with him there but who knows and how would you ever find out.

The big reason these the figures distort this is that the Government are using a set of figures for the unvaccinated that the author on twitter says are out of date and he presents a more expected graph that he is pretty sure better reflects the unvaccinated population but he isn't sure is spot on either.

I'll read the report again but surely that would have been a useful disclaimer to put in bold.

The tweet does however temper my view on whether the 40-79 cohort are more likely to have covid if vaccinated or unvaccinated. I think I will have the view of needs further studies/info/clarification. That seems to be what pretty much every scientific paper says anyway.

I hope the author is right though and that the vaccine is still doing a decent job of stopping transmission. We are potentially inviting a world of pain having 50k crowds if he is wrong and the Govts figures are correct.

I'm sure those that accused me of not understanding percentages will be along shortly

[wookie70]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

How many pages has it been since this thread had anything to do with football? There’s a thread on the holy ground to talk about this kind of thing. I click on this thread now and again to try and find out what’s going to be happening when I need to show my passport at the football and all I read is page after page of people arguing about covid.

Unless exempt you will from 1st Oct.

[Sir David Gray]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

How many pages has it been since this thread had anything to do with football? There’s a thread on the holy ground to talk about this kind of thing. I click on this thread now and again to try and find out what’s going to be happening when I need to show my passport at the football and all I read is page after page of people arguing about covid.

It was confirmed yesterday as 1st October, first time it will be used at Easter Road will be 16th October.

The SPFL and SFA Joint Response Group are in consultations with the Government to see if they can get away with doing spot checks rather than checking every single supporter over the of 18.

[CMurdoch]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Ed Conway
@EdConwaySky
·
1h
These bars show you #COVID19 deaths among different age groups in England as a % of total cases in recent weeks.
The higher the bars, the higher the fatality rate.
The red bars are unvaccinated people.
The dark blue bars are fully vaccinated people
Screenshot_20210910-115550_Chrome.jpg

If that is accurate and I am interpreting it the right way it clearly points a massive reason to be vaccinated.
For example in the 50-59 age group I am reading that of the people in that group who had covid in that time period 1.3% of the unvaxinated group died compared to 0.1% of the vaccinated group. In essence a person between those ages was 13 times more likely to have died if not vaccinated.

[LaMotta]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Thanks, I am not setting out to misrepresent tables etc and certainly not to scare people and appreciate you challenging without calling me stupid or selfish.

I mistrust the Government and media and with all the spin I like to look at the stats and try and make my own mind up.

I will say the stats in the document do an excellent job of convincing me that having the vaccination was a good choice for me(and most others), with a highlight on choice. The part I am prattling on about took me by surprise because if it is how I interpret, and how I think it is written, then I feel it needs explanation. It doesn't mean the vaccine isn't better at stopping transmission but it may indicate that it only works for a short time and that those that were early adopters may already be back to square one at least in terms of their danger to others. Studies are suggesting that for Pfizer already. If so, surely that makes passports a ridiculous thing to bring in particularly as they have a duration of a year and that isn't even based on what date you were vaccinated rather when you applied for the passport.

I'm sticking to my guns on the figures we are discussing. I can't see how that table can be read as per 100k of population. Maybe that is what the data is but it certainly isn't headed that way.

I totally see the point you are making based on those figures on pg 14.

That said, on page 7 of same report it states categorically that the Vaccine helps reduce transmission:

Screenshot_20210910-140611_Drive.jpg

[Lancs Harp]

Just knew I would need a passport to come and watch Hibs one day.

Without trawling through the thread will I need a my vaccine passport for the St Johnstone match at the end of the month? I am double jabbed anyway.

[Stairway 2 7]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Just knew I would need a passport to come and watch His one day.

Without trawling through the thread will I need a my vaccine passport for the St Johnstone match at the end of the month? I am double jabbed anyway.

Nope first game hibs United in the league. Actually had a mate that took his passport for the border check when going down to Blackpool many moons ago.

[ekhibee]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

If you're likening Sturgeon to Thatcher, I find it hard to believe that you lived through Thatcher. If you did then you werent paying attention.

This.

[lord bunberry]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Unless exempt you will from 1st Oct.

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

It was confirmed yesterday as 1st October, first time it will be used at Easter Road will be 16th October.

The SPFL and SFA Joint Response Group are in consultations with the Government to see if they can get away with doing spot checks rather than checking every single supporter over the of 18.

Thanks. You’d think season ticket holders would be able to show their vaccination status at the ticket office or online beforehand and that would suffice for a predetermined period. I don’t really see the point in having to show your status for every game, it’s not going to change.

[ekhibee]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Thanks. You’d think season ticket holders would be able to show their vaccination status at the ticket office or online beforehand and that would suffice for a predetermined period. I don’t really see the point in having to show your status for every game, it’s not going to change.

I know what you mean, but I got both my jags by the middle of May and have the letter to proove it, but since then I have contracted COVID, so maybe my status has changed, I dunno.

[lord bunberry]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I know what you mean, but I got both my jags by the middle of May and have the letter to proove it, but since then I have contracted COVID, so maybe my status has changed, I dunno.

As far as I’m aware it’s only to prove your vaccination status.