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That document should never have been sent out by anybody in any position and anybody involved with it should go. If he was then regardless of how Hibs voted, he'd be nae better than doncaster or regan. Anybody involved with that document containing threats, bribes and blackmail would have a brass neck banging on about integrity.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Baldmans Comb
What do you mean IF???Quote:
Originally Posted by Desperate Dan
Mr Petrie is the chairman of the SFA professional game board and Vice president on the SFA main board which is responsible for all high level football governance and strategy issues.That is why he was briefing Charles Green last week??
http://www.scottishfa.co.uk/scottish....cfm?page=2560
I don't have a problem with this as it's his SFA role and not his Hibs role though fair enough if you do as of course I can see your sporting integrity argument.
We know Petrie's keeness for "financial prudence" I don't think DD's far off the mark.Quote:
Originally Posted by Seveno
More insincere than this?Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesjamieson
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSHaCzb3yYk
I agree with your principled stance, just the thought of Petrie being involved in that scandalous document and arguing to keep the Huns in the SPL makes me sick as a Hibs fanQuote:
Originally Posted by The Baldmans Comb
I still can't believe that Regan interview. Surely there are now grounds for Fifa or Uefa to act as this isn't sport any more, its a manufactured and manipulated product with glass ceilings for some and get out of jail cards for others. If clubs die because another one is suddenly three tiers down then so be it. The ones who have run a tight ship will replace them and the bust clubs can just do the whole newco thing.
This talk of social unrest has to be the end of him and the final straw. This isn't light pressure any more its full on intimidation and I'd be surprised if the law didn't become involved in some way.
This is truly embarrassing given this mans position. We were a laughing stock before due to our reliance on the old firm but its now the people running our game who are lifting their skirts to them.
...And **** the national team.
Regan and Doncaster have to go now, surely?
Also, I think it says a lot when Donald Findlay is so disgusted with the bribery and corruption that his statement gets the majority of fans on his side. I neve thought I'd see the day I agreed with anything he said.
Quote:
Originally Posted by joe breezy
That's why we need to hear from the club that RP was not working on their behalf but as an official of the sfa. If true then he should resign. I'm very suspicious of his role in all this.
(Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they're not out to get you. :greengrin
Can anybody with a bit of time on their side compile a list of e-mail addresses to be published on here?Quote:
Originally Posted by Cabbage East
I'm thinking of SFL clubs who have voted no to the newco in division 1, and who I would like to offer my support.
Also on the list would be SPL clubs who valued sporting integrity above greed and avarice, they should also be congratulated on their moral stance.
I would also like the contact details of Doncaster and Reagan to be included in the list of people we need to lobby, as their nepotism in this matter reeks of corruption.
I realise Reagan and Doncaster are at the top of there respective trees, but surely there is a complaints procedure which should enable fans to show complete distrust in the decision making of these two muppets.
Where is Regan's latest interview?
In the ScotsmanQuote:
Originally Posted by woodythehibee
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/footba...sion-1-2392610
But surely there would be social unrest if "rangers" were without a league to play in?Quote:
Originally Posted by peterdouglas
Is this why. Were likely to see the govt dip their oar in?
Well he has been out of work since we sacked him :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Minder
Still can't believe Regans statement I'm hoping someone takes him to task today but I won't hold my breathe
Sickened just when you think people are doing the right thing there's someone in a position of power tearing it apart
That interview made me speechless. If these are the public views of the the head of the SFA you have to assume this influences their whole approach to the regulation and management of our game:Quote:
Originally Posted by SiMar
Refereeing of games
Application of the rules
Disciplinary rules, penalties, appeals
Nation team player selection
National Team management appointments
This whole mess has revealed what many of us suspected for years, that corruption and bias was endemic in the game.
Romanov was right! Media monkeys and OF mafia is spot on IMO
I've fired off a few emails to various addresses. Latest one went to SFL clubs, SPL clubs, Both organisations, the Media and a few SPL fan clubs (grouped below).Quote:
Originally Posted by 1875godsgift
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Just a bit of fun research likes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatecrasher
http://www.heidtoheid.co.uk/showAllQ...flavour=Person
:greengrin Very goodQuote:
Originally Posted by reallapsedhibee
Having not got anywhere near a copy of The Scotsman this morning, is the interview indeed accurate?
This quote from Mark Dingwall of rangers supporters trust sums them up really.Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesjamieson
"We are disappointed but not surprised by this decision which has been taken out of malice rather than for the greater good of the Scottish game"
If the Newco are shoehorned into SFL1 with sanctions applied they might end up being so weakened that they don't win the league. Cue immediate league reconstruction with a 16 team SPL. It could have a silver lining after all.
This to me has always been the big picture.Quote:
Originally Posted by rcarter1
If the newco are in Div1 when the dust settles then O.K. ... The fact is that this situation has finally given the rest of Scottish football the chance to reel the OF in .... its what we do with that power from now on that really counts. All clubs in Scotland now have the power to expand the leagues .. this would allow for more than 1 promotion place in Div1 which would get rid of the newco in Div1 being guaranteed promotion to the detriment of Falkirk or whoever in a 1 promotion place situation.
It would also allow for play offs, which everybody appears to want.
This could be worked out in a weekend if the 3 bodies were to get together in a room NOW and thrash this out until it was settled.
Where Zombie rangers end up should take second place to this.
I think they forget one thing.... At the start of the season the clubs all sit down and agree to the RULES for clubs going into Administration or have financial difficulties.... They have gone into liquidation and become a Newco and hence have to be voted back into a league.... Remember when Annan were voted in when Gretna went bust.... Exactly the same.... But no... They are being picked upon.Quote:
Originally Posted by degenerated
The rules were set and agreed upon... So abide by them. Staring into the abyss me thinks and rightly so.
Seems to be. It is on their official site. Unbelievable.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Story So Far...
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/footba...sion-1-2392610
Won't happen like that though will it.Quote:
Originally Posted by PeeKay
Shoving them into SFL1 says we can only do without them for a season. No way will any sanctions that could effect that be put in place. Ditto no hope of league expansion, as they will want their precious 4 Old Firm games.
If that happens you may as well just have a rule that says the Old Firm must both finish in the Top 6 every season and be done with it.
Those comments are totally outrageous. His position now is completely untenable and he must resign or be emptied. He is publicly advocating a different set of rules for a company which has been in existence a matter of days, with no business track record, no financial accounts and hardly any employees/players.Quote:
Originally Posted by grunt
The head of the Scottish game is taking part in corruption, bullying and bribery.
As for the comments 'social unrest' and 'slow lingering death'. Astonishing:grr:
That's Scottish Cup and Scotland International games off the Beefster family calendar.
I'm so sickened by the whole episode, this season may be my last either way.
If they're struggling to get promotion we'll no doubt see the usual penalties at crucial points of the game to help them.
If we can only do without them for one season then what they're saying is that they're gambling Scottish football on them winning the 1st.
I suppose they'll be about 1/100 at the bookies anyway.
[QUOTE=DC_Hibs;3285372]I've fired off a few emails to various addresses. Latest one went to SFL clubs, SPL clubs, Both organisations, the Media and a few SPL fan clubs (grouped below).
Nice one!
Is it worth adding SKY to the situation? It appears that a lot of what happens to Scottish football is actually in their hands. To start with some clarity over the existing terms of the deal, and when renegotiations might kick in would help. Bottom line though, if the SPL is no longer an attractive enough product we're going to have live without the same amount of tele money - or do something that makes Scottish football interesting to people..
My other thought is that SKY themselves are trying to squeeze Rangers back into the SPL as fast as possible. If this is true, then they have a vested interest in scaring the hell out of the Scottish administrators behind the scenes, while at the same time placating fans that they will look after us, and they are the loyal guardians of Scottish football. SKY should be reminded that if they want to play hardball over Scottish football - in order to pervert the course of justice regards Rangers - the I hope supporters around the country can pull the plug on their own SKY subscriptions. By gum why we're at it, should supporters perhaps appeal to Mr Branson that an opportunity to plant a sore one in SKYs direction has just presented itself?
Bought a copy and it is all there in quotes .. 'slow lingering death', 'social unrest' etc. In the next breath Regan admits 'I can't predict what will happen' .. What a complete arse he is!Quote:
Originally Posted by The Story So Far...
Good for you:applause:Quote:
Originally Posted by The Baldmans Comb
I'm sure the guys at Clyde or Raith Rovers will be happy to take your cash.
We (my family) on the other hand will be on our way to see our family in Kilmarnock, who have supported their club for years. We'll have a pint before the match, and then after to discuss the game. They will have been on the front line to get rid of the guy who calls himself their Chairman.:aok:
Doncaster is U-turning pretty quick now as well. - from the BBC websiteQuote:
Originally Posted by TQM
"Motherwell and St Mirren had expressed concern about the financial impact of not having Rangers in the division.
But, when asked if he thought clubs would now face insolvency, Doncaster replied: "I wouldn't have thought so."
Pathetic pairing! P45s prepared .. pronto!Quote:
Originally Posted by rcarter1
What Reagan is implying is that "Rangers" cannot be suspended/expelled from football PERIOD - thus prejudicing the result of the SFA appellate tribunal still to re-convene. Also this says to "Rangers" and, I suppose, Celtic - you can do anything you want and you still won't be thrown out of scottish football - the worst they will ever get is a demotion to SFL1. :brickwall
Leopards really cant change their spots
The expectation beforehand within the SPL – shared by the Scottish Football Association – was that the outcome would be another deferral, leaving it to the Scottish Football League clubs to accept Rangers into their ranks and sparing the top division chairmen from a decision they did not want to make.
There were also some who hoped that Rangers would be able to make sufficient case – coupled with a clear and evident change of attitude – for their admission to the SPL.
However – and not for the first time in this saga – Rangers utterly misread the mood of the other SPL clubs. The faux pas occurred despite the fact that Rangers had been briefed at a meeting on Sunday attended by two other SPL chairmen and a vice-chairman, who stressed the need for humility.
Murray, in blazer and club tie, arrived at the gathering on Wednesday with the frontman for the Sevco consortium, Charles Green – who did not sport the club’s uniform – and Ally McCoist, the Ibrox manager. A presentation brochure was distributed to the delegates.
The back page featured a photograph of a Rangers title win with the words “We Are Rangers” emblazoned across it.
“The arrogance was unbelievable,” said one chairman. “The atmosphere hardened immediately. Charles Green conducted himself well enough but the Rangers chairman was arrogant and dogmatic.”
Another who was present told The Daily Telegraph: “Some people in the room wanted a reason to make a case for Rangers but the standard of the presentation was woeful.
“Ally and Charles Green were not always on the same page but that was not damaging. The chairman was another matter entirely and the brochure was substandard – you could have easily knocked something better together given half an hour. It makes you wonder what kind of management team they have.”
Murray, Green and McCoist absented themselves from the meeting to allow discussion, then returned for the vote and cast theirs as a proxy for Duff & Phelps, administrators of the Rangers oldco.
Only Michael Johnston of Kilmarnock gave them any sort of support with an abstention, while the other 10 clubs – including those who had expressed a degree of willingness to help Rangers, voted ‘No’ to the newco’s admission.
The Rangers party departed and a further two-hour discussion ensued. “It was constructive,” said one who took part. “People actually listened to one another and respected the other positions. It was a huge leap of faith for integrity and it’s now up to the SFA and SFL to make their decision.”
Neil Doncaster, the SPL chief executive, said of the decision to refuse the newco entry: “Clearly there were discussions going on between the newco and the members and ultimately that could have led to a presentation and a proposal put to clubs that they might have said yes to.
“In the end the proposal put forward to the clubs was considered and they said no.”
He added: “I think [the vote] surprised a number of people. Money is important in professional football and I think what our chairmen have done today is put aside the short-term commercial considerations, that would ordinarily drive behaviour, ahead of the longer-term interests of their clubs – and supporter involvement has clearly been a huge part of that.
“Ultimately they believe they have made the right decision and one that brings a bit more clarity to an unclear world. Until we know where Rangers are playing next year we won’t be able to ascertain what the damage is to the Scottish game.
“A number of people have said the decision today has enhanced the reputation of the league but it’s not for me to say.”
Celtic released a statement in which they expressed the integrity of Scottish football as the main reason behind their opposition of newco Rangers entering the SPL.
It read: “Today’s decision to refuse access into the SPL was an overwhelming one and demonstrates the depth of feeling amongst everyone involved in Scottish football.
“Fundamentally, the Celtic Board has also been very mindful of the need to take what it believes to be the correct course of action in protecting the integrity of the game in Scotland.
“Throughout the whole sequence of events leading up to today’s decision the Celtic Board has been of the singular view that the integrity of the game in Scotland is of paramount importance.”
The Rangers Supporters’ Trust, meanwhile, accused other SPL clubs of acting out of “malice”.
Mark Dingwall, as spokesman for the Trust, said: “We are disappointed but not surprised by this decision which has been taken out of malice rather than for the greater good of the Scottish game.”
Holy ***** of course there is going to be a financial impact... Do they think we're ****ing stupid. Doncaster and Reagan don't have a ****ing clue do they!!Quote:
Originally Posted by rcarter1
It's about doing the right thing and the right thing has been done. Doing it the right way stops a free fur all... It declare liquidation, form as a new company and stay where you are.
Not read all the quotes but have Doncaster or Reagan actually come out and said Newco are in the wrong????
This whole farce has firmly knocked on the heid and should have removed any misconception that anybody may have had that Scottish fitba isnae completely and utterly rigged in favour of just two clubs. They're no even trying tae hide it now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wat Dabney
Corrupt and rotten tae the core. :agree:
Why no go through for a pint with your family, then stay in the pub during the game, giving your money to some honest tax paying public house owner, rather than stumping up cash to a club with a chairman that as good as advocates cheating and not paying tax, watch the scores on SSN in the pub then meet your family after and get the run down on another Hibs victory :wink:Quote:
Originally Posted by ronaldo7
Clear conscious :aok:
By STEPHEN HALLIDAY
Published on Thursday 5 July 2012 00:21
SCOTTISH Football Association chief executive Stewart Regan has warned that football faces a “slow lingering death” in this country if newco Rangers are denied entry to the First Division of the Scottish [COLOR=blue !important][COLOR=blue !important]Football [COLOR=blue !important]League[/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR] following the emphatic rejection yesterday of their application to retain top-flight football at Ibrox.
Regan’s remarkable comment came as he insisted admission to the First Division is now the only viable option. He also made the startling warning of “social unrest” if Rangers cease to exist.
The Scottish Premier League turned down Charles Green’s bid to have Rangers’ existing share in the organisation transferred to his newco for next season, with ten of the member clubs voting against the application. It is understood Green cast the only vote in favour, while Kilmarnock chairman Michael Johnston is believed to have abstained.
The SPL will now await the outcome of an SFL meeting next week when that organisation’s 30 clubs will vote on a proposal to accept newco Rangers into the First Division in the new season ahead of an amalgamation of the league governing bodies from 2013-14.
There is considerable opposition and resistance to the plan among SFL clubs and their [COLOR=blue !important][COLOR=blue !important]supporters[/COLOR][/COLOR] with many believing Rangers should have to apply for entry to the Third Division in the wake of their spectacular financial collapse.
But Regan last night bluntly asserted that Scottish football simply cannot afford to have Rangers outwith the top two tiers of the league structure, with his argument not confined to the commercial impact their absence would have.
“Without Rangers, there is social unrest and a big problem for Scottish society,” claimed Regan. “They have a huge fan base and to contemplate the situation where those fans don’t have a team to support, where those fans are effectively left without a game to follow, I just think that could lead to all sorts of issues, all sorts of problems for the game.
“Tribalism in football is really important. It is part of the game. People follow their clubs with pride, it is passed down from generation to generation. There are thousands of Rangers fans whose fathers and parents and grandfathers have been Rangers fans. You can’t contemplate a situation without that and if Rangers weren’t to exist that could have real dire consequences.
“There is a lot of emotion around this subject because Rangers are a huge institution in Scottish football history and they are where they are. Their fans have been hurt, they don’t know what’s happening. There hasn’t been a great deal of leadership at the club and there hasn’t been a huge amount of communication from the football authorities.
“The SPL have now decided that Rangers won’t be coming back into the SPL. From our perspective it’s important we set out the landscape because there is only one solution for the game now.
“The only solution for the game now is that Rangers come into the Scottish [COLOR=blue !important][COLOR=blue !important]Football [COLOR=blue !important]League[/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR] and they come into it in the First Division. If Rangers were to go anywhere other than the First Division, then there would something in the region of £15.7 million worth of losses to the game.
“For the bigger clubs at the top of the league, that’s half their annual distributions. For clubs at the bottom it is basically wiping out their entire distributions, for some of the smaller clubs it’s a huge proportion of their annual turnover.
“The same will be true for most clubs. Perhaps clubs could survive for a short period of time but it’s not sustainable. Even if Rangers end up in the First Division, there is still going to be a £5 million loss of income to the SPL clubs. The game is not sustainable so there would be a slow lingering death for the game in Scotland. It would then trickle down to the SFL. From our perspective as the governing body and we cannot allow that to happen.
“If we allowed that to happen, it would simply be a dereliction of duty. Therefore, this whole decision-making process has been one of the most challenging and complex decisions that I have ever been involved in in 27 years of business as sport.
“Some clubs in the SFL are afraid of the implications of the decisions. There is the moral argument, the fear of a fans’ backlash and there are financial implications to consider. But when we look at the alternative, it is not possible to think about it without thinking of the game withering on the vine. We cannot contemplate that and the message has to be that Division One for Rangers is the only show in town as far as the future of Scottish football is concerned.”
Regan admits the influence of television contracts, which are largely predicated on the presence of Celtic and Rangers in the Scottish game, are the biggest single factor in his determination to ensure the Ibrox club drop no lower than the First Division. “We have had dialogue with the broadcasters,” he added, “and we understand what the various stakeholders from Sky television, ESPN, Sport Five and a number of the SPL’s other [COLOR=blue !important][COLOR=blue !important]commercial[/COLOR][/COLOR] partners are likely to do in the event Rangers are not in either of the top two tiers. It’s not pretty. That’s why we cannot sit back and let that happen without trying to get all parties to accept this is the only solution which can keep the game afloat.
“Without Old Firm games, the value drops, the overseas deals are almost exclusively about the Old Firm derby and that would go immediately. Then you look at the rest of the game and what it is worth. It is fair to say the broadcasters would live with a year without Rangers in the SPL, because it could be a fantastic story for them, which is why I think First Division rights will be an interest as people will want to see how this club is going to bounce back.”
Regan conceded, however, that there can be no guarantee a financially weakened Rangers will climb back to the top flight at the first attempt. “If Rangers don’t get promoted, then the game has got another year to suffer with the financial consequences that brings,” he said. “I can’t predict what will happen, because Rangers at the moment are a weakened team because of everything that has gone on.
“They are a newco at the moment, they have got very few players on their books. They are going to be entering the SFL in whatever division with a weakened team and I don’t think it’s by any means certain they are going to come back in the way they or their fans might like them to recover.
“It’s going to be a slow recovery to get back to the football fitness they have shown in the past. So we can’t look into the future and say ‘what if they don’t operate in a certain way?’. We can only look at building the foundations, to change the game for the better and provide an infrastructure that can bring financial certainty to the other 41 clubs.”
Regan confirmed that sanctions will apply to newco Rangers in the First Division and also made it clear the formation of an SPL2 will be pursued in order to accommodate the Ibrox club if they are rejected by the SFL next week. “The SFA have to transfer Rangers’ membership from oldco to newco,” he said. “That can be done with any conditions attached to it that the SFA board deem fit. We would expect a newco to carry some of the sanctions which would have related to the club had it still been in the previous incarnation. The membership cannot be transferred on financial grounds alone. It has to have a degree of sporting integrity and that means [COLOR=blue !important][COLOR=blue !important]sporting[/COLOR][/COLOR] sanctions.”
'Tribalism in football is really important. It is part of the game'
Dear oh dear...that is one of the justifications..so in effect the bitter bigotry will be a big miss to the game in Scotland if its no in his opinion manufactured to continue...any wonder that this has gone on for so long with little effective punishment....
He should be punted on the basis of that statement alone, never mind the rest of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by down-the-slope
Killie are more than their Chairman. The fans were against the Newco and "HE" decided to rail against that. "60 miles to Kilmarnock to see Hibernian play".:wink:Quote:
Originally Posted by Judas Iscariot
His abstention was wrong and I'm sure that when the Killie fans get their club back, I'll raise a glass with them.:aok:
But if they go to Div3 you can expect the same, so they have fewer divisions to climb.Quote:
Originally Posted by PeeKay
It is part of football he says well so are leagues and being promoted and relegated based on results. The man is a clown shoe.Quote:
Originally Posted by down-the-slope
Quote:
Originally Posted by down-the-slope
Giving a new twist to the phrase oft-repeated during the credit crunch:Quote:
Originally Posted by Desperate Dan
Too bigoted to fail
If NewCo are in Div1 then they are there through bribery, threats and scaremongering .. there is absolutely nothing "O.K." about that!Quote:
Originally Posted by BOVRIL
Indeed, it seems they have made a massive miscalculation tae people's reaction tae threats and blackmail. Time for them tae for once dae the right thing (if they're even cabable of that) and tae clear their desks or time for it tae be done for them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cabbage East
As i have said before If it means the death of scottish football so be it. We cannot have a sport that is designed to only work around 2 clubs. Trash the whole thing and start again. Generations of bigots will have to find something else to do at the weekend. (Maybe they can go to church) Vive la Revolution
Okay, I have deliberated, pontificated, considered and done a lot of soul searching. Regan and Doncaster's positions are untenable. We must move to a one tier system asap. The SFA as the umbrella organization should have made the proper decision. They did not and I find that scandalous. Sometimes in life when you are in a position of power you are mandated to say or do something you do not agree with. I think Petrie is in that position between his two hats. Which one is his true feelings I know not. To cast history up of him being a tight ass is a hibs.net myth in my opinion. The most important thing in this to me is that Hibs have acted with decorum in this and made the proper decision with Petrie as the spokesman. Therefore, this afternoon a season ticket will be purchased but extremely underused unfortunately.
GGTTH
On that statement alone, I agree with him. Football is, to a great extent, about tribalism. That's the bit that Mercer misunderstood when he tried to take us over. Quote "this isn't football, it's tribalism"... that was the point at which I realised he just didn't get it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Desperate Dan
I actually quoted the wrong post and didnae change it. I meant the whole statement should be enough tae see him emptied, never mind his part in the rest of the dirty dealings.Quote:
Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod
*******. To think I wasted a minute of my life on my post. :greengrinQuote:
Originally Posted by Desperate Dan
The question that always raises it's head in this fiasco - is who are Doncaster/Regan acting for?
And why are they running about like Abbott & Costello so desperately to have Rangers in SFL1 or SPL2 against the wishes of almost everyone?
There has to a massive motive - money is usually the culprit.
So what is the desperation?
Neil Doncaster presided over the signing of commercial contract's with a get-out clause for the partner's stipulating -
"If Rangers or Celtic leave the SPL the agreement is terminated."
What it should have said.........
"If Rangers or Celtic VOLUNTARILY leave the SPL the agreement is terminated."
This is the financial meltdown - caused by Doncaster's incompetence - he is to blame - it his fault for missing what is a standard item. Either of these clubs could leave the SPL if they were relegated and he didn't spot it. Now he's running about trying to save his own career and he has everyone in Scottish football up in arms. Crikey! Even 75% of Rangers fans accept they have to go to Div 3 and still we talk of forcing leagues; every fan spending time and emotion to block this; clubs wasting time; clubs being threatened; talk of social unrest, and all to save one man's career.
He blew it - he missed out one word - voluntarily. Boot him - we need a competent CE who won't bring financial meltdown upon us.
Regan has also bought into this and shown himself incompetent as a CE -boot him too.
All of this because of one man's inability to do his job is the only thing that make's sense in why a continual railroading is on the agenda.
sorry :greengrinQuote:
Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod
Jane Lewis@JaneLewisSportNewco Rangers say their pre-season trip to Germany is off. The team was due to play three games in Germany between 18-25 July
what team? :greengrinQuote:
Originally Posted by s.a.m
The Portman Hotel Kilmarnock best looking bar staff at any away pub. Worth the 60 mile trip alone. :drool:Quote:
Originally Posted by Judas Iscariot
Sportsound last night
I may be mistaken but when Cosgrove was grilling Traynor about what the DR had actually exposed during 4 months, Traynor claimed they broke the Ticketus deal. When challenged by Cosgrove that the RTC had in fact beat them to it, did I hear right, when Traynor replied that Graham Speirs hadn't beaten him to it.
Had he just exposed Graham Speirs as the man behind the RTC ?
Anyone else hear this last night, or did I get it wrong ?
Apols if already posted, Cowdenbeath statement:
http://www.cowdenbeathfc.com/index.p...ewNews&id=1075
Even Donald Findlay gets the integrity argument and won't vote for Div1. Struggling to see where any votes for the Hun are going to come from?
Just typical Fatty petulance. There's no way Traynor knows the identity of RTC or it would've been splashed all over the paper quicker than you can say, "irresponsible rabble rousing".Quote:
Originally Posted by Gingertosser
Have been following this whole drawn-out saga with amusement, boredom and anger all in equal measure.
If there is anything that has sent me into a rage about this whole sorry mess, it has been the arrogance and out-and-out bias shown by Dungcaster and the other prat, and the arrogance of The Artist Formerly Known As Rangers. That statement by Regan in The Scotsman makes me furious, their bias isn't even hidden anymore, they are making it very clear that in their eyes Scottish Football is nothing without Rangers and the rest of us simply don't matter. The desperation of the arguements would be hilarious if the demented nutters making these statements weren't so serious about it. As for The Artist Formerly Known As Rangers, their arrogance is pathetic. "We Are Rangers". Yes we know you are. Big deal. get in line along with everyone else.
Total farce, scandal, absolutely clear to all that Scottish Football is corrupted to the core and RIGGED in favour of the OF.
I for one am not interested in RIGGED sport run by corrupt individuals.
This whole thing totally honks and if Dungcaster and Regan's heads do not roll after this I will eat my own Hibs shirt.
Gene
You know the situation is dire when you agree with Findlay.Quote:
Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens
BBC reporting that SFA now showing their true colours (blue of course) in blocking the transfer of registration for ex-hun players.
On the small matter which now arises for the SPL as to finalising the identity of Club 12, why should this decision await the SFL vote next Thursday as indicated by Doncaster yesterday?
I don't see why they can't make this decision prior to next week's vote. Indeed it's essential that they do so if by delaying they effectively force three clubs rather than just one to abstain from next week's vote.Quote:
The SPL’s next priority is to identify who will replace Rangers as Club 12 in the new season which kicks off on 4 August. Three First Division clubs – Dunfermline, Dundee and Falkirk – currently meet SPL criteria.
“Our clubs have not made a decision on that yet,” added Doncaster. “We will do so in due course after the SFL have deliberated.
Is this a further subtle form of manipulating the process in RFC's favour?
The interview was also being run as the main sport story in The Herald today.
Quite astonishing points of view from Regan - particularly the societal breakdown angle...
Why would Falkirk be introduced to this? - it is manipulation.Quote:
Originally Posted by BEEJ
Yep the sort of perverted terrorist and political tribalism that is very much the make up of the Old Firm games are something that football and particularly society can well do without. An idiotic comment.Quote:
Originally Posted by down-the-slope
Sporting tribalism fine, tribalism extolling the virtues of murderous terrorist organisations and 300 year old battles, not fine. I wonder if his social unrest comment is shared by the Ambulance and hospital staff that deal with the fallout of this tribalism as to be honest I bet they are delighted there isnt the 4 times a year carnage after an OF Game next year.Quote:
Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod
Yeah, agreed. Probably wrong to concentrate on one bit of a wholly ludicrous statement.Quote:
Originally Posted by JimBHibees
So dos this mean SPL and by implication have been sponsoring bigotry and tribalism since 1998?
Great strapline!
Sorry if already posted: -
http://www.scottishfootballblog.co.u...evolution.html
Rangers newco: Looking for a revolution
A drookit summer has seen Scottish football drowning in uncertainty and indecision.
We finally got a decision yesterday. The SPL chairmen voted against letting the Rangers newco into the top flight.
That was hardly surprising. Some of the chairmen - 10 said "no" - might have voted with a heavy heart and some might very well be daft.
But not daft enough to risk losing the core of their own support.
A predictable decision and not one that removed much uncertainty.
Too many clubs - the Rangers newco among them - don't yet know what league they will be playing in when the season kicks off in just a few weeks.
That the SPL saying "no" would force Rangers into the Third Division seemed the most plausible outcome until a few days ago.
Then the argument that the only way for Scottish football to survive was to parachute Rangers into the First Division was unleashed.
If the SFL clubs didn't agree then the SPL - whose role in all this should have ended yesterday when they said an emphatic "no" - would engineer a breakaway SPL2 to accommodate the newco.
Last night that theme was picked up by the SFA's Stewart Regan in a series of quotes that should - in a game governed by any sanity - disqualify him from holding office.
He has certainly destroyed any lingering hope that the SFA will adopt a neutral stance in any of this.
I don't really care that Regan diminishes himself with every utterance. I do care that he diminishes our game when he's doing it.
When a director of a First Division club stands on the steps of Hampden and denounces our game as "corrupt" then something is rotten to the core.
And for what?
Regan is giving up. Aided and abetted by the SPL's Neil Doncaster - who should really be run out of Hampden forthwith - he's surrendering.
He's seeking comfort in a broken business model. His vision of Scottish football is one where any real change is possible only if it suits the needs of television companies whose commitment to Scotland is half hearted at best.
He's saying that we can only thrive if we fix the game to allow a quick route back to the top flight for a club that has seen the most gargantuan mismanagement in Scottish football history.
A quick fix that most fans of that club seem to reject themselves.
He's saying that it's OK to bully lower league clubs if it provides solace for all the SPL clubs who have mismanaged their own finances.
And he's turning this cowardice on it's head and painting himself as some sort of hero.
He sees something heroic in saying that he's worked out a way to return as quickly as possible to a flawed status quo.
We deserve more. More than Regan and Doncaster, a couple of middle ranking marketing men who have fallen into the trap of believing their own lies.
More than footballing authorities who care not a jot for moving the game forward.
What could we learn from this long, bleak summer?
We know that fans care about the future, that they're prepared to speak up and show their passion.
Would the future of the Scottish game be better served by harnessing that passion or by allowing Regan to disenfranchise more and more supporters?
We've seen that the SPL experiment has failed. It's failed to create a sustainable model for its clubs, failed to create an environment that could predict or halt a huge corporate collapse in its midst.
The SPL was the game's attempt to hitch a lift to a promised land, to the riches of unfettered sporting capitalism. Scottish football didn't get there. It got run over and left behind.
Greed, chasing the quick buck, canoodling with corporate sponsors and ignoring the fans hasn't worked.
But the fans are still there. They still care.
Could we not take the positives from that and create a more sustainable game, a more sensible game?
A new football model for Scotland that has fans and communities at its heart? A game that we could again be proud of?
It won't be easy. Of course it won't.
But if Dundee United or Hibs, Hearts or Aberdeen, Kilmarnock or Elgin, Cowdenbeath or Stranraer are surviving only on the back of four Old Firm games a season and 30 pieces of Sky's silver then we need to make hard decisions.
We need to reinvent. We need to involve the fans in that reinvention.
And we need to do it quickly.
It will take vision though. It will take inspiration.
When we look for vision or inspiration at Hampden what do we find?
Stewart Regan and Neil Doncaster.
Their vision condemns us to relive the mistakes of the past. Their vision won't halt the "slow, lingering death" of Scottish football it will only perpetuate it.
Don't believe them, stand up to them. Tell your club how you feel, shout it from the rooftops.
Every fan of every club should have had enough of being let down by non entities like this.
It's our game and they are our clubs.
Now is the time to prove it.
We now know without any doubt, those at the top of OUR game are corrupt. Where does this corruption stop, every dodgy decision that goes against us now, every penalty?
The seed of doubt has gone, we know the SPL and the SFA will fight to give rantic preferential treatment. Could referee's and linesmen be next on their radar, make sure both teams win, we cant have any teams beating their favorites, am i wrong or too late?
Great article and completely spot on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stevie Reid
Judging by the statements made by Cowdenbeath and Clyde boards along with fans comments on the media sites I can't help but think that Doncaster and Reagan's response to the SPL no vote and the vivid language and scaremongering they have been using has only helped drive them closer to the conclusion that they don't want.Quote:
Originally Posted by JimBHibees
Well they say most murders are the result of an issue related to sex or murder so I agree with what you are saying.
So they are running about like Abbott & Costello for one of those things. Sex or money. Probably money like you say. But perhaps also blackmail? Perhaps someone, or rather somehun, has threatened to:
A) kill them
B) expose the "sauna photographs"
C) burn their houses down
D) expose their complicity/duplicity in the long running pro-Hun or pro-OF rotten apple cart
In other words, in all seriousness, perhaps someone with a lot of power or someone holding a lot of photographs is leaning on them big style? That's certainly the way they are behaving, like small time mobsters sweating to save their dough before the big boys come over from Chicago and fit them with Cuban ties.
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexedwards
Herein lies the problem though: How do we get rid of the suits in charge of our game?
FIFA expressly forbids political involvement, so we can't ask the government to do it. We (the fans) have absolutely no power over the game, despite that without us there'd be nothing.
We need to find a way to get these guys out, then give the fans power. I'd like to see us able to vote for who we want to be in charge of the game. Candidates would serve fixed terms and have to campaign. I'd nominate that guy from Raith Rovers for a kick off.
Makes sense as soon as possible to sort out League's for this season
Dunfermline/Dundee into SPL
Newco into 3rd Division and sort out all the other teams in SFL 2/3 by knocking them up a place.
Seems simple or am I being to optimistic?
This is it for me.Quote:
Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs
We have all suspected for most of our football watching lives that the playing field was more squint than the old Easter Road slope.... But we didn't want to believe that we were right, as that would mean the game was corrupt. Surely not?!!
I have followed the financial shenanigans with rapt attention throughout this whole sordid saga but never really thought we would end up here.
Some of the statements and behaviour of the Succulent Lamb media and those entrusted with our beloved game have frankly both shocked and appalled me. It had been way worse than any of our previous paranoid inclinations would have suggested.
I'm afraid the genie is out of the bottle now though.
The only way back (well forward actually) for the game in Scotland is to listen to the fans and put sporting integrity and fairness back at the front.
I actually think we're now at a point where that is the only feasible solution so am strangely encouraged about the future.
Which is exactly what makes us the most powerful entity in the game!Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottB
Whats more powerful.... 10's (maybe even 100's) of thousands of football fans, or a few guys in suites with fancy titles?
We ARE the game and if they want to threaten us with their so called "proposals", then we should start fighting back with a few proposals of our own.
WE have the power to change the game for the better. Its OUR game.
The more logical (if slightly biased) solution is this....Quote:
Originally Posted by goldenhibby
Leave the SFL1, 2 and 3 as it is, and have an 11 team SPL next season, with, either no relegation from the SPL or a play off to bring the number up to 12 for the following season, with the SFL bringing up clubs to create the vacancy in the SFL 3.
Benefits:
- all clubs are in the right league next season with no Dunfermline/Dundee debate
- Everybody knows the situation for the endo of next season
- Junior clubs have time to prepare their bids
- Oh aye, and no Rangers (in any form) next season
Problems:
- one SPL team have a free week every week
- eh, that's all
Dear Sir/Madam,
Thank you for contacting the club and for expressing your views. I am sure that you will appreciate that the club has received an extraordinary number of emails and letters from supporters on this subject. Due to the volume of correspondence we are simply unable to reply to each email and letter by specifically responding to each point raised. I can assure you however that every comment has been read and fully understood by the Directors of the Club.
As regards the possible admission of a Rangers Newco to the SPL, the Club made it known some time ago that it would vote against such a proposal. The Club also made known its view that there should be no further delay and that a vote should proceed on 4 July 2012. As widely reported the vote took place on 4 July 2012 and Hibernian along with other clubs voted overwhelmingly to reject the admission of a Rangers Newco into the SPL. It is now certain that Rangers will not participate in the SPL for season 2012/13.
Rangers’ representatives have now confirmed that they will formally apply for admission to the SFL for season 2012/13. It will now be for other bodies to determine if and at what level Rangers might be accommodated within Scottish football from 2012/13 onwards.
This decision has been made at a difficult time for Scottish football and will mean that all SPL clubs will suffer some financial damage. Our Club, along with the others, will need every supporter to get behind their club and play a positive role in ensuring the future viability of our Club and of the professional game in Scotland.
Thank you again for your email and for your continued support of your Club.
Regards
Scott Lindsay/Rod Petrie
Less income from less home games.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pitlochry hibee
What happens at the split?
Yes, but at present there is no means for us to exercise that power.Quote:
Originally Posted by wee_hibee
How do we do it? Do we boycott games, which will really only serve to weaken our own clubs? Do we boycott the handful of Scotland games a year then?
Thus far the powers at be have at every opportunity ignored the fans, be it the numerous petitions, our thoughts on League Reconstruction etc. The clubs have finally listened to us, perhaps they will do so again.
While we do have the power, using it is rather more difficult.
I am actually starting to think the comments by Regan and Doncaster are part of a carefully planned campaign to try and mitigate the backlash and fallout with the Hun being dropped down. They are if you think about it in many ways protecting the clubs with their ludicrous pro-Rangers comments. It has in many ways taken the heat off the clubs at this time which is likely to lead in the end with the right decisions being made. One down one to go.
A reasonable response I think.Quote:
Originally Posted by TQM
We do EVERYTHING we can to be heard.Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottB
We don't need to boycott games, but we can however create big banners to let our feelings be known, we can also get the fans from every club to come together and perform major protests against this.
People need to get angry. People don't get angry enough these days and just accept what their spoon fed.
I was mystified that Regan could put out that interview, which on a first reading (and indeed second reading) is astonishing.
However, for the sake of debate (and because I admit to being a bit of a Regan apologist as I'm impressed with other stuff he has done for the grassroots of the game), I think it warrants further analysis:
1) He doesnt say that Rangers need to be in because of an affection for or allegiance to Rangers. I dont think he has any. It isnt a case that we need Rangers to help Rnagers, it is that he belives we need Rangers for the sake of everyone else. (I dont agree with him, but thats opinion).
2) Assuming the above, it doesnt indicate corruption at all.
3) Assuming he believes that the financial implications of no hun would result in the administration/liquidation of several member clubs, he presumably has a duty to work in th einterest of those clubs if he genuinely believes them to be at risk.
4) The "social unrest" related to no hun, not div3 hun. Stupid thing to say either way, bit not scaremongering to ge tthem to div 1
5) I agree with the tribalism element. Of course thats what football is.
I believe he is wrong - I'd stress that. I think allowing the hun back into div 1 will absolutely kill the game because of the strength of feeling, but I can see where he is coming from when you take the understandable distaste for hundom out of the consideration process.
Fab post m8, I have emailed a few clubs after each statement they have issued one at a time but now i can do it all in one go...:thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by DC_Hibs
Apologise all you want for him :greengrinQuote:
Originally Posted by Twa Cairpets
What I took out of his statement can be put far more succinctly than your summary, and that is that the guy is a complete bellend who should be removed from office before he does anything further to harm not only the game but people's perceptions of the country.
He taking that ****** idiot Doncaster with him as well.
Perhaps I'm being too cynical here. But what we have here are structures where the guys at the top can decide how long they want to do their jobs, what they fancy doing with them, with no method for them to be removed by anybody. We can wave banners and be as angry as we like, they can choose to ignore it and happily cash their paychecks.Quote:
Originally Posted by wee_hibee
I suspect Regan and Doncaster will stay in their no doubt nice offices for a long time to come. Their never flinching support of Rangers will keep the media onside with them and eliminate one big source of pressure.
Football is corrupt to the core, anyone expecting FIFA or UEFA to do anything about it forgets how corrupt both those bodies are as well. They, like our own authorities will be desperate to sweep this under the rug. The key thing once these muppets are gone is that we create a system where by such things cannot happen again. Directly elected by the fans would be something I'd like to see, but any system where by someone can't just take the job then do whatever they like for as long as they fancy would be an improvement.
You need a ladder to climb a ladder, take away their ladder and they'll have nothing to stand on.Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottB
These guys are "high up", because we're their ladder.
Without us there as their stepping stones, they have nothing to keep them up there.
We are their power and without us, they have none.
Has it been announced who the "1" out of the 12 were?
KillieQuote:
Originally Posted by West Upper Pie
Old Huns voted yes, Killie abstained.Quote:
Originally Posted by West Upper Pie
Speaking to a Killie fan at my work today about yesterday and was saying the the board of killie wanted a yes vote but the fans wanted a know which is why they chose to abstain, meaning they didnt want to vote against their own beleifs but didnt want to go against the fans either.
Agree with your analysis of Doncaster.Quote:
Originally Posted by degenerated
As for the rest of the post, you've not actually addressed any of the points, but just name called. Hey - you may be right, and he may be a bellend, but what comes after? This whole thing started with the huns under the watch of the old style SFA with its endless committees and being headed up by the like of Gordon Smith. Whether or not you agree with the Regans stance on the huns (and I emphatically dont), scottish football is more than just the SPL and SFL, and Regan has modernised and streamlined the administration of the sport dramtically. Do we really want a return to how it was before? Because the fallout has happened on Regans watch doesnt make him cuplable. He's been (in my opinion) disingenuous in his comments, but if his belief is that more clubs will go bust then he has a duty to say it. Again, I stress that my view is that the long term moral/financial impact of some other teams going bump is preferable to the short term financial benefit.
I am beginning to think that if this whole thing is not sorted out next week, that Scottish Football should be put out of its misery.
When the SFL vote not to accept Newco into Division one as they surely will, that must be the end of the saga.
If Doncaster, Regan, et al continue and try to create an SPL2 in order to accommodate the ****, that will be the end for me. It will prove that they are prepared to pull the whole house down rather than admit defeat.
How the hell are teams expected to build for next season with all these distractions?
11 Team SPL Proposal.
As suggested earlier by another poster, we could just have an 11 team SPL this season. To accomplish this fairly, do away with the split and play each other 4 times, making a total of 40 games.
This would mean that each club would have one extra home game, thereby helping in a small way to make up for any missing cash from home gate v Rankers.
How does that sound?
:dunno:
I totally agree and it has already been shown, by the vote yesterday, that we can demonstrate our power. We won by flooding our Clubs with letter and email so we just need to do it again.Quote:
Originally Posted by wee_hibee