2024 General Election

[Stairway 2 7]

Wasn't this election so soon a big surprise though?

Swiney was literally just in the door when rishi stood in the rain

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But he's an ex leader completely linked to the poisonous last regime, people keep mentioning change, he's not that

[marinello59]

Wasn't this election so soon a big surprise though?

Swiney was literally just in the door when rishi stood in the rain

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We knew it was coming this year though. Given the massive swings we are seeing do you think we would have seen anything other then a Labour win in Scotland even with another four or five months?

[grunt]

But he's an ex leader completely linked to the poisonous last regime, people keep mentioning change, he's not that

I don't think SNP lost this election in the last two months.

[jamie_1875]

Jonathan Ashworth loses Labour seat, that's a shock.

[Callum_62]

Jonathan Ashworth loses Labour seat, that's a shock.Think that was on earlier and thought process was around labours stance on Israel / Gaza

He lost to an independent it think?

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[Stairway 2 7]

I don't think SNP lost this election in the last two months.

2 years, a slow decline. Two continuity candidates kept the ship sinking. They can keep going as is but if a similar result in 2026 then independence is gone for another generation

[Ozyhibby]

Hunt holds his seat. Possible leadership candidate.


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[Callum_62]

We knew it was coming this year though. Given the massive swings we are seeing do you think we would have seen anything other then a Labour win in Scotland even with another four or five months?Who can say? Probably not

If he stays on u guess we will see and the Scottish elections what he and Forbes can do

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[Andy Bee]

We knew it was coming this year though. Given the massive swings we are seeing do you think we would have seen anything other then a Labour win in Scotland even with another four or five months?

I'm not so sure, I think the SNP took the Scottish electorate for granted and it's bit them on the ass. They better wisen up sharpish or they will be completely finished.

[Moulin Yarns]

Sunk keep his seat

[Stairway 2 7]

Michelle Donelan out 8 cabinet ministers gone

[Andy Bee]

Hunt holds his seat. Possible leadership candidate.


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Probably our next PM in 5 years.

[Stairway 2 7]

Massive swing in the old port as Labour take Leith

[marinello59]

Michelle Donelan out 8 cabinet ministers gone

That is the record broken then. :greengrin

[jamie_1875]

The BBC Scotland coverage is awful, why aren't they going to the Scottish declarations that are happening.

[StevieC]

Brian Leishman wins Alloa & Grangemouth from SNP 7k majority

He’s pro-Independence

[Stairway 2 7]

Rishy Sunak concedes the election

Starmer is PM

[marinello59]

Labour now have the majority of seats in Scotland.

[Andy Bee]

He’s pro-Independence

He's Labour yeh?

[marinello59]

That’s Cherry gone now as well.

[jamie_1875]

That’s Cherry gone now as well.

Told you 10 seats would be ambitious!

[Stairway 2 7]

That’s Cherry gone now as well.

Thought that would be close but pretty comfortable

[marinello59]

Sky has the SNP at 10 seats. I will say confidently now that is garbage.

What the **** do you know?

[Stairway 2 7]

Michelle Donelan 9th cabinet minister gone

[marinello59]

Wooo hooo the Tories are out. :greengrin

[Andy Bee]

What the **** do you know? Arse!

Aye, **** both of you.

[Ozyhibby]

A grim night for the SNP. Needs to get back to focussing on core issues that affect people’s lives and also what they are elected to do. Housing, education, health. I don’t remember them talking about any of that much in recent years.
And stop talking about well being economy and start talking about growing the actual economy.


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[Stairway 2 7]

Labour win the majority and the election

[grunt]

That’s Cherry gone now as well.

One result I'm happy with.

[grunt]

A grim night for the SNP. Needs to get back to focussing on core issues that affect people’s lives and also what they are elected to do. Housing, education, health. I don’t remember them talking about any of that much in recent years.
And stop talking about well being economy and start talking about growing the actual economy.


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Education and health weren't up for grabs in this election?

[Ozyhibby]

One result I'm happy with.

Happy to be gone with the culture warriors of all stripes. Need to get back to bread and butter issues.


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[Stairway 2 7]

Jacob Rees-Mogg voted out and back to 1800s

[marinello59]

Rees Mogg gone, pleasing to say the least. :greengrin

[Moulin Yarns]

Mogg out

[Ozyhibby]

Education and health weren't up for grabs in this election?

We are judged on it in every election. Doesn’t matter that it’s devolved or not.


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[grunt]

Jacob Rees-Mogg voted out and back to 1800s

Jolly good news as dawn breaks.

[Colr]

Labour winning on gaining Rees-Mogg’s seat is perfect!

[s.a.m]

Jolly good news as dawn breaks.

:nanafunk:

[jamie_1875]

Tommy Shepherd gone.

[grunt]

Jess Phillips with just 700 majority. Under the headlines of a Labour landslide there's a lot of close and strange results.

[grunt]

Tommy Shepherd gone.

Oh dear. Also Deidre Brock?

[jamie_1875]

Oh dear. Also Deidre Brock?

Gone as well.

[grunt]

Alison Thewlis too. SNP bloodbath.

[Colr]

Any chance Laura “Lady Haw-haw” Kuntsburg can be out of work soon?

[jamie_1875]

Labour win every seat in Glasgow.

[Moulin Yarns]

Moray West snp hold

[marinello59]

Cherry giving Blackford and Sturgeon a bit of stick while Sturgeon watches on. Quite a moment. :greengrin

[Moulin Yarns]

Stephen gethins is in

[marinello59]

Stephen gethins is in

Andy Bee will be pleased, the Bridies are safe. :greengrin

[Moulin Yarns]

Andy Bee will be pleased, the Bridies are safe. :greengrin

Wrong constituency. That's Arbroath Smokies 🤣

Still waiting for Angus and Perthshire glens which is the Bridies

[marinello59]

Wrong constituency. That's Arbroath Smokies 🤣

Ah. Well that’s good too. :greengrin

[Andy Bee]

Cherry giving Blackford and Sturgeon a bit of stick while Sturgeon watches on. Quite a moment. :greengrin

It just goes to show how much it's about themselves rather than the people they should be serving, I agree though, quite a moment. :greengrin

[Andy Bee]

Wrong constituency. That's Arbroath Smokies 🤣

Still waiting for Angus and Perthshire glens which is the Bridies

I can cope with the Smokies.

[Moulin Yarns]

Ross loses

[marinello59]

Ross loses

Yes. No more than he deserves.

[Andy Bee]

Greens now with 4 seats is excellent.

[grunt]

Cherry giving Blackford and Sturgeon a bit of stick while Sturgeon watches on. Quite a moment. :greengrin

Not SNP class unfortunately. A remarkably bitter woman.

[Stairway 2 7]

Ed Conway doing a section on how efficient Labour’s vote was, they put all the money in swing seats. Read an article this week about the data analyst who had been hired to do that and get them reelection

https://archive.ph/KgYty

[Stairway 2 7]

Liam Fox losses which is nice

[Pretty Boy]

The big take away for me is that turnout looks set to be the lowest on record.

Labour will be rightly delighted, Reform will be shouting about revolution in the air but the most obvious 'winner' is apathy and disillusionment.

The theme of the night seems to be giving the incumbents a kicking for many who voted and the maligned 'none of the above' brigade sending a pretty telling message as well.

[Hibrandenburg]

Reform doing much better in leave seats it seems. We're out of the EU what are they wanting us to stop all trade and movement, radges

It was never about trade for many and all about Johnny Foreigner.

[marinello59]

Greens now with 4 seats is excellent.

Pleased about that, hopefully something they can build on.

[Pretty Boy]

Just read Scott Arthur won his seat. Great news.

Not because I'm particularly enthralled about him becoming an MP or Cherry, who I quite like losing her seat, but it means he'll be out of the transport role at Edinburgh council. Might go to someone resembling competent next.

[Andy Bee]

The big take away for me is that turnout looks set to be the lowest on record.

Labour will be rightly delighted, Reform will be shouting about revolution in the air but the most obvious 'winner' is apathy and disillusionment.

The theme of the night seems to be giving the incumbents a kicking for many who voted and the maligned 'none of the above' brigade sending a pretty telling message as well.

Exactly what I'm thinking, it's got to be the most fragile record breaking majority ever, there's gonna be trouble ahead.

[Stairway 2 7]

Pleased about that, hopefully something they can build on.

It's the only thing they will build they despise infrastructure projects even if they are green, solar farms, hs2, net zero housing.

Would vote for a good green party up here

[Stairway 2 7]

Mhairi Black says if the SNP blames the electorate for being wrong and not the SNP then they will never change and return to winning

[marinello59]

The big take away for me is that turnout looks set to be the lowest on record.

Labour will be rightly delighted, Reform will be shouting about revolution in the air but the most obvious 'winner' is apathy and disillusionment.

The theme of the night seems to be giving the incumbents a kicking for many who voted and the maligned 'none of the above' brigade sending a pretty telling message as well.

I’d say the most obvious winner is Labour and given the huge swings we have seen in Scotland it was those who voted who sent the only message that the politicians will heed. I’m not knocking anyone for spoiling their ballot paper, it’s a valid act, but that won’t even be a footnote when the story of this election is told.

[Hibrandenburg]

Farage gets in. We really need independence from a country which can elect a fascist like him. Bad time for the snp to collapse.

Is he really that different from the likes of Johnson, Rees Mogg, Patel or Braverman?

[Stairway 2 7]

Mark Harper out

11 cabinet ministers

[Moulin Yarns]

Green hold Brighton pavilion, Caroline lucas' former seat shows that they voted for the party and not just the person

[Stairway 2 7]

64 for Lib dem now, remarkable result for them

[grunt]

Is he really that different from the likes of Johnson, Rees Mogg, Patel or Braverman?
Agree with you here, I'd say those two are similar to Farage. Johnson is about Johnson, and Rees Mogg just wants his rightful place as top toff.

[marinello59]

Exactly what I'm thinking, it's got to be the most fragile record breaking majority ever, there's gonna be trouble ahead.

I said yesterday Starmer is going to have one of the shortest political honeymoons ever once he gets in to power. The signs are that they realise that they are liked but not loved and will have to deal with that quickly
I ain’t gonna look too far forward for now though, the Tories are out and it’s worth savouring the moment for a while. :greengrin

[Stairway 2 7]

I said yesterday Starmer is going to have one of the shortest political honeymoons ever once he gets in to power. The signs are that they realise that they are liked but not loved and will have to deal with that quickly
I ain’t gonna look too far forward for now though, the Tories are out and it’s worth savouring the moment for a while. :greengrin

5 years without them is glorious

[Stairway 2 7]

Turnout looks like it'll be higher than 2001 and close to 2005, although they were very low

[J-C]

Happy the Tories are now gone, disappointed but not surprised at the SNP losses, we need to take stock and come back stronger for the Scottish elections, need to make Flynn our new head with Forbes beside him. I wonder just how long the honeymoon period will last for Labour before they too fall by the wayside.

[Stairway 2 7]

11 cabinet ministers now.

Looks like the 3.5k reform votes cost D Ross his sea haha

[Andy Bee]

Pritti Pattel retains her seat, sayin nowt.

[Hibrandenburg]

I said yesterday Starmer is going to have one of the shortest political honeymoons ever once he gets in to power. The signs are that they realise that they are liked but not loved and will have to deal with that quickly
I ain’t gonna look too far forward for now though, the Tories are out and it’s worth savouring the moment for awhile. :greengrin

That's a decent summary of yesterday's election. It was all about getting the Tories out and less about people voting for that what they like. Starmer has been handed this election on a plate but only as a result of Tory failure rather than his appeal.

[Moulin Yarns]

Brendan O'Hara keeps Argyll and Bute

8 snp, hopefully at least 1 more.

[Hibrandenburg]

Truss oot!

[marinello59]

And the best saved until last. Truss has been kicked out. :greengrin

[Andy Bee]

Liz Truss heads off to the Chinese pork market.

[Moulin Yarns]

Liz truss is out

[Stairway 2 7]

Brilliant took ages to come on stage, slow clapped on and then defeated

[Stairway 2 7]

Pity they jumped as Labour won Boris, May and Goves seats

[Bostonhibby]

Laura Keunsberg sounds like she has been asked to be the coroner at her party's inquest and looks like she's about to burst into tears. Having a job hiding her disappointment.

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[Stairway 2 7]

Truss the first ex prime minister to lose their seat in over 100 years. The swing of 26% was the biggest ever Tory to Labour to swing in any election.

[Pretty Boy]

I’d say the most obvious winner is Labour and given the huge swings we have seen in Scotland it was those who voted who sent the only message that the politicians will heed. I’m not knocking anyone for spoiling their ballot paper, it’s a valid act, but that won’t even be a footnote when the story of this election is told.

Aye and no.

Obviously Labour is the real big winner but I'm not convinced there is any real enthusiasm for them.

An emphatic victory in terms of seats but projected to be the lowest share of the vote for a single winning party ever with the lowest or 2nd lowest turnout ever. A vote that tanked in one of their core voting demographics as well with independents taking seats on a single issue ticket. Their share of the vote is only sitting at about 1.6% up on 2019, less than 1% in England and actually down about 4% in Wales. Bearing in mind Labour are the biggest party in the Welsh Assembly and coupling that with the result for the SNP in Scotland it fuels the idea this election is as much about giving the incumbents a kicking as anything else.

Even among those who voted Labour the celebration seems to be primarily that the Tories lost rather than Labour won. It certainly doesn't feel like the wave of optimism there was in 1997.

Labour simply have to deliver more than they have promised in their manifesto. Ed Balls conceded as much last night. A continuation of Tory fiscal policy for the next 5 years and there are a hell of a lot of votes up for grabs that could send them straight back to opposition and god only knows who could replace them.

I'm happy the Tories are gone, I'm not upset to see the SNP take a battering but I feel almost no enthusiasm for this Labour government. I could be living in a bit of a bubble but I don't detect a particularly celebratory mood among people I know who voted Labour either.

[Andy Bee]

I hope I'll be granted a little bit of leeway regards Liz Truss but that **** has cost me an extra £3.6k a year in mortgage payments, she's an absolute thick ****** that has for some reason been able to con the country into thinking she has half a ******* brain cell. I hope the **** the ******* herpes ******** the ****** ****

[Andy Bee]

LMAO Baker is kicking off.

[Moulin Yarns]

Inverness, skye and wester Ross on a recount. Millionaire Liberal Democrat or snp to win this one.

[marinello59]

Bacon roll, coffe then off for an hours kip. It’s been an entertaining night. :greengrin

This really has been an enjoyable thread, respectful and good natured from start to finish from all who have taken part despite any political differences. Thanks to all, it’s been emotional. Roll on the Holyrood election so we can do it all again, only two years to wait. :greengrin

[marinello59]

Inverness, skye and wester Ross on a recount. Millionaire Liberal Democrat or snp to win this one.

Is that the seat that millionaire SNP guy held? :greengrin

I think that may well be SNP seat number 9.

[DaveF]

Oh well, let's see what this blue in red clothing labour govt deliver. It's a devastating result from the SNP but they now have to recover and focus on winning back the huge numbers who swallowed the 'change' message from Starmer.

[Bristolhibby]

Oh well, let's see what this blue in red clothing labour govt deliver. It's a devastating result from the SNP but they now have to recover and focus on winning back the huge numbers who swallowed the 'change' message from Starmer.

I wonder if the SNP collapse is like the red wall in 2019. The votes are “loaned”?

J

[weecounty hibby]

MacAskill only got 1k. The reason for the loss is the same as the other seats

No he didn't he got 600 or so. Eva Comrie and independent got more than him.

[Ozyhibby]

I wonder if the SNP collapse is like the red wall in 2019. The votes are “loaned”?

J

Depend on if the SNP actually listen to what voters say or if they do what most parties do when they have a set back and just putter on as before. There needs to be a proper reset here.


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[Ozyhibby]

Fair play to the Exit poll. Not far away at all.[emoji122][emoji122][emoji122]


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[Ozyhibby]

Aye and no.

Obviously Labour is the real big winner but I'm not convinced there is any real enthusiasm for them.

An emphatic victory in terms of seats but projected to be the lowest share of the vote for a single winning party ever with the lowest or 2nd lowest turnout ever. A vote that tanked in one of their core voting demographics as well with independents taking seats on a single issue ticket. Their share of the vote is only sitting at about 1.6% up on 2019, less than 1% in England and actually down about 4% in Wales. Bearing in mind Labour are the biggest party in the Welsh Assembly and coupling that with the result for the SNP in Scotland it fuels the idea this election is as much about giving the incumbents a kicking as anything else.

Even among those who voted Labour the celebration seems to be primarily that the Tories lost rather than Labour won. It certainly doesn't feel like the wave of optimism there was in 1997.

Labour simply have to deliver more than they have promised in their manifesto. Ed Balls conceded as much last night. A continuation of Tory fiscal policy for the next 5 years and there are a hell of a lot of votes up for grabs that could send them straight back to opposition and god only knows who could replace them.

I'm happy the Tories are gone, I'm not upset to see the SNP take a battering but I feel almost no enthusiasm for this Labour government. I could be living in a bit of a bubble but I don't detect a particularly celebratory mood among people I know who voted Labour either.

Even if apathy had a good night the apathetic will be ignored. As always.


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[lapsedhibee]

Fair play to the Exit poll. Not far away at all.[emoji122][emoji122][emoji122]


Yes. Other polls not so accurate. Think Labour ended up with only 35% of the vote. Landslide.

[Moulin Yarns]

Snp take Angus and Perthshire glens. Beating Stephen Kerr.

The Forfar Bridies are safe

[Ozyhibby]

Yes. Other polls not so accurate. Think Labour ended up with only 35% of the vote. Landslide.

That is only silver lining for any opposition parties today. It looks like their own supporters did not jump straight Labour.


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[Pretty Boy]

I wonder if the SNP collapse is like the red wall in 2019. The votes are “loaned”?

J

I think it's more a case of neither the SNP or Labour really getting to grips with the new political situation on Scotland (albeit the latter is a beneficiary last night).

The days of being able to call 40-45 seats in Scotland before a single vote was counted are gone. Many Labour supporters claimed that the SNP had only been loaned votes in the last decade or so and I never really bought that, I don't buy the opposite now.

The theme of last night's election was give the biggest party a kicking. That was true in England, Scotland and to a lesser extent Wales.

[Ozyhibby]

I think it's more a case of neither the SNP or Labour really getting to grips with the new political situation on Scotland (albeit the latter is a beneficiary last night).

The days of being able to call 40-45 seats in Scotland before a single vote was counted are gone. Many Labour supporters claimed that the SNP had only been loaned votes in the last decade or so and I never really bought that, I don't buy the opposite now.

The theme of last night's election was give the biggest party a kicking. That was true in England, Scotland and to a lesser extent Wales.

Incumbent parties all over Europe have had a kicking since the covid inflation took hold.


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[Andy Bee]

Snp take Angus and Perthshire glens. Beating Stephen Kerr.

The Forfar Bridies are safe

That's breakfast sorted. :greengrin

[SHODAN]

Joanna Cherry losing her seat is the one upside from a Labour central belt sweep.

[Ozyhibby]

Joanna Cherry losing her seat is the one upside from a Labour central belt sweep.

Even in her interview after losing last night she wanted to settle scores. She won’t be missed by most of her colleagues.


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[Lendo]

Anyone found any videos of Douglas Ross losing his seat yet? The Liz Truss one is good but I could really do with seeing his reaction to cheer me up.

[Stairway 2 7]

Reminds me very much of 2001 election. The turnout was lower then but similar. In both a landslide was a given for months. It's why Labour kept repeating its not inevitable, people don't vote if they think there is no point. No one really thinks of the turnout of 2001 now they just remember the victory. The same will happen to Starmer in a year the election won't matter what will matter is the cost of living, it was the main driver to votes. He'll be hoping for no major economic turmoil events and a period of low inflation, which really isn't in his control

[J-C]

Even in her interview after losing last night she wanted to settle scores. She won’t be missed by most of her colleagues.


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Compared to Tommy Sheppard who was humble, thanking supporters and offering the new Labour MP his good wishes, saying its been a bad night for the party and they need to now listen to the electorate.

[Pretty Boy]

I know there are more trustworthy things on display on toilet paper in an unflushed public toilet but am I correct in thinking the Labour manifesto mentioned voter reform and a potential change to the voting system?

I'm not totally knocking FPTP because it has kept Reform sidelined last night but the vote share and share of seats isn't going to tally up when all is said and done and that can't be claimed to be truly representative.

[StevieC]

Anyone found any videos of Douglas Ross losing his seat yet? The Liz Truss one is good but I could really do with seeing his reaction to cheer me up.

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cervgxm9djmo.amp

Bitter? 🤔

[BroxburnHibee]

Anyone found any videos of Douglas Ross losing his seat yet? The Liz Truss one is good but I could really do with seeing his reaction to cheer me up.

Gullis too. Not seen his greetin face yet

[Bristolhibby]

I know there are more trustworthy things on display on toilet paper in an unflushed public toilet but am I correct in thinking the Labour manifesto mentioned voter reform and a potential change to the voting system?

I'm not totally knocking FPTP because it has kept Reform sidelined last night but the vote share and share of seats isn't going to tally up when all is said and done and that can't be claimed to be truly representative.

No Danger Labour will change FPTP. Expect some small Lords reform (over 80s retire, etc), he’ll also need to pack the Lirds to get some representative balance.

Personally I’d scrap it and bring PR elected second chamber with elections in the mid points of a Parliamentary cycle.

J

[Pretty Boy]

Compared to Tommy Sheppard who was humble, thanking supporters and offering the new Labour MP his good wishes, saying its been a bad night for the party and they need to now listen to the electorate.

Is Cherry really saying anything that different from many of her colleagues? Albeit she is far more bitter and combative.

It's long been a criticism of the Sturgeon era, from both internal and external viewpoints, that it was her way or the highway and dissent was pretty brutally dealt with. Kate Forbes hinted as much with far more subtlety not so long ago.

Sturgeon built a formidable election winning machine but she barely advanced the cause of independence in a decade. Support largely stagnated and it allowed the suggestion that independence as a carrot just out of reach suited the party just fine to take root. I can't help but think many who didn't vote SNP last night were letting them know that won't fly anymore.

It will certainly be interesting to watch how last night's result translates to Holyrood in a couple of years. A few phone calls to the wider independence movement on Monday morning wouldn't go amiss imo. It might even tempt me back onside.

[Bristolhibby]

I know there are more trustworthy things on display on toilet paper in an unflushed public toilet but am I correct in thinking the Labour manifesto mentioned voter reform and a potential change to the voting system?

I'm not totally knocking FPTP because it has kept Reform sidelined last night but the vote share and share of seats isn't going to tally up when all is said and done and that can't be claimed to be truly representative.

Reform get 4 seats with a bigger vote than the Lib Dem’s who get 71 MPs.

As much as I hate reform and all they stand for, that’s undemocratic.

J

[Bostonhibby]

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cervgxm9djmo.amp

Bitter? [emoji848]Karma

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[Stairway 2 7]

I think the world is so messed up and Russian/Chinese online disinfo so strong that I don't want PR until the fascists are back under a rock. If we had PR we'd be midterm elections away from the far right coalition deporting people

[Stairway 2 7]

Gullis too. Not seen his greetin face yet

Forgot about that scrote, yeah feel cheated not seeing that

[danhibees1875]

Reform get 4 seats with a bigger vote than the Lib Dem’s who get 71 MPs.

As much as I hate reform and all they stand for, that’s undemocratic.

J

It's the system that everyone knows and has to play by, so I'm not sure it's necessarily undemocratic. Reform could/should have targeted fewer constituencies under the system if they wanted to maximise their seat return.

It's not wholly representative. It does afford a greater element of local representation though. I'm not sure how PR works in practice but I guess the location of MPs could easily not tie back to where they were voted in vs. "Livingston" voted Labour and now have a Labour MP for instance (obviously not everyone within Livingston is represntated there, but you need to draw the line somewhere)

FWIW, I like the Scottish Parliament system - that seems to draw on both being (more) proportional, whilst retaining local representation, and providing choice because you then have multiple MSPs representing you from an array of parties.

[Northernhibee]

I think the world is so messed up and Russian/Chinese online disinfo so strong that I don't want PR until the fascists are back under a rock. If we had PR we'd be midterm elections away from the far right coalition deporting people

Very much this.

I fell asleep just after Mordaunt lost her seat and woke up at 8am. Relieved that Reform didn’t get more seats (although four is four too many).

If Farage bangs the drum about PR all Starmer has to do is ask why we get to change our mind on the 2011 referendum about it but not the 2016 Brexit referendum

[overdrive]

Just read Scott Arthur won his seat. Great news.

Not because I'm particularly enthralled about him becoming an MP or Cherry, who I quite like losing her seat, but it means he'll be out of the transport role at Edinburgh council. Might go to someone resembling competent next.

Yep. I’m in that constituency. I despise the man. I asked him a simple question on social media in a non-offensive manner and because I then respectfully disagreed with his answer he blocked me. This is something he does regularly. Is he going to ban any constituents that don’t agree with him from his surgeries? He certainly gives the impression he hates anyone with even a slight difference in views and won’t engage. In fact will actively not engage by blocking and banning.

He has made an absolute erse of lots of transport decisions in the city. I was a member of the Labour Party and left because of him:

When it was announced a few months ago that he had won the Labour candidacy in my constituency, I was initially dismayed. How could I possibly vote Labour like I wanted to when that would mean voting for him. Then I started coming round to the idea that, like you said, at least it would get him off the council.

I voted through gritted teeth for him yesterday and made that clear in a comment I wrote on the ballot. I said he shouldn’t take that as any endorsement of him, that I voted for him purely because he was the Labour candidate and I was certain he would be an awful MP due to his arrogance and the way he treats people.

[Ozyhibby]

I think the world is so messed up and Russian/Chinese online disinfo so strong that I don't want PR until the fascists are back under a rock. If we had PR we'd be midterm elections away from the far right coalition deporting people

Silencing them in an undemocratic way can lead to unwelcome consequences.


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[Bristolhibby]

Very much this.

I fell asleep just after Mordaunt lost her seat and woke up at 8am. Relieved that Reform didn’t get more seats (although four is four too many).

If Farage bangs the drum about PR all Starmer has to do is ask why we get to change our mind on the 2011 referendum about it but not the 2016 Brexit referendum

Starmer won’t do that. Brexit is a boil that he doesn’t want to aggregate. Plenty of leave voters voted for Labour. It’s up to them to be honest and admit they made a mistake rather than doubling down.

J

[Stairway 2 7]

Silencing them in an undemocratic way can lead to unwelcome consequences.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Letting them lead with PR would lead to worst consequences, I don't mind Nazis being silenced

[Northernhibee]

Tell you what, I do think this is very good. Labour with a decent majority which will mean they won’t be pulled all over the place but with the vote share meaning that they can’t rest on their laurels and that they have to enact tangible change in this first term. Plenty of warning shots in the election to remind them of that too.

[Just Alf]

Was a bit tired at the time so can't remember where, but I read last night that the Australian security services have identified 5 Russian financed Web sites that have been pumping out pro reform propaganda on Facebook and other social media during the election.
:-/

[wookie70]

I think the world is so messed up and Russian/Chinese online disinfo so strong that I don't want PR until the fascists are back under a rock. If we had PR we'd be midterm elections away from the far right coalition deporting people

Arguably we are not far away from that under FPTP depending on what happens with the Tories/Reform. We would be nowhere near the move to the Far right in British politics, probably wouldn't have had Brexit if a similar system to the Scottish Election PR had been in place 20 years ago. There is a good number of racist, insular, thick voters in the UK. With FPTP they actually shift the entire political needle. With PR they would be what they are a minority that we can rightly ignore

[Stairway 2 7]

Arguably we are not far away from that under FPTP depending on what happens with the Tories/Reform. We would be nowhere near the move to the Far right in British politics, probably wouldn't have had Brexit if a similar system to the Scottish Election PR had been in place 20 years ago. There is a good number of racist, insular, thick voters in the UK. With FPTP they actually shift the entire political needle. With PR they would be what they are a minority that we can rightly ignore

I don't think so. They would fully one party group and instead of splitting the vote reforms wouldn't be wasted like now. They would have lost this time but not by much and a midterm would have Farage as deputy PM

[overdrive]

Arguably we are not far away from that under FPTP depending on what happens with the Tories/Reform. We would be nowhere near the move to the Far right in British politics, probably wouldn't have had Brexit if a similar system to the Scottish Election PR had been in place 20 years ago. There is a good number of racist, insular, thick voters in the UK. With FPTP they actually shift the entire political needle. With PR they would be what they are a minority that we can rightly ignore

The Greens would also presumably have more seats than they do now which would negate it a bit. Just taking the share of the votes as they stand just now (I know it wouldn't exactly work like that under PR and depending what type of PR is used), a Labour/Lib Dem/Green coalition would have a majority. You could see those types of parties and the likes of the independence parties and some of the independents working together to stop an ultra right wing government and that's before you take into account some moderate Tories not being happy with that sort of thing.

[Stairway 2 7]

Pretty extraordinary saying he can't put money into the NHS as his party wouldn't allow it

Jeremy Hunt, "Some Conservatives will wonder whether the scale of our crushing defeat is really justified, but when you lose the trust of the electorate, all that matters is to have the courage and humility to ask yourself why"

"Keir Starmer and Rachel Reeves are decent people.. I hope they use their majority to make much needed reforms to the NHS in the way that is difficult for the Conservative governments to do"

[lapsedhibee]

Pretty extraordinary saying he can't put money into the NHS as his party wouldn't allow it

Jeremy Hunt, "Some Conservatives will wonder whether the scale of our crushing defeat is really justified, but when you lose the trust of the electorate, all that matters is to have the courage and humility to ask yourself why"

"Keir Starmer and Rachel Reeves are decent people.. I hope they use their majority to make much needed reforms to the NHS in the way that is difficult for the Conservative governments to do"

Was he definitely talking about a need to put more money into it, or a need to change it into a Reform Party style private-insurance-based system, which Hunt himself has previously floated? :dunno:

[BroxburnHibee]

Swinney speaking well to be honest

[Bristolhibby]

There are some incredibly obvious traps for the Tories in interpreting this election and I have every confidence they will blunder straight into the jaws of the biggest bear trap they can find.

From @lewis_baston on Twitter.

[Northernhibee]

Whatever you think of the new incumbents, we’re free of one of the worst governments we’ve ever had and I don’t know about anyone else, but for this morning at least I feel ****ing fantastic.

[DaveF]

Whatever you think of the new incumbents, we’re free of one of the worst governments we’ve ever had and I don’t know about anyone else, but for this morning at least I feel ****ing fantastic.

Very happy those Muppets are gone but labour today (to me) is just the Tory party when I was younger.

I'll happily reverse that position if I see real change but with no tax increases and fiscal prudence on offer, what will that change look like.

Let's find out ..

[Stairway 2 7]

Swinney speaking well to be honest

Thought he was good. Admitted we lost the defacto referendum and now have to speak to the people about why. Hopefully just the start from admittedly the bottom

[overdrive]

The Greens would also presumably have more seats than they do now which would negate it a bit. Just taking the share of the votes as they stand just now (I know it wouldn't exactly work like that under PR and depending what type of PR is used), a Labour/Lib Dem/Green coalition would have a majority. You could see those types of parties and the likes of the independence parties and some of the independents working together to stop an ultra right wing government and that's before you take into account some moderate Tories not being happy with that sort of thing.

Something else I’ve just considered. Under PR, some of the smaller parties might get more votes than they would under FPTP for a few reasons. Firstly, some people might be put off voting for, e.g. the Greens because they have no chance of winning in a particular constituency. Some people might ordinarily vote for them but vote tactically so a particular candidate doesn’t win their constituency. Some parties might not actually field a candidate in particular constituencies under FPTP as they have no chance of winning so the electorate don’t get a chance to vote for them. They might be more inclined to field more candidates under PR since they have a better chance of actually getting elected - see PB’s earlier points around him spoiling his ballot because the SSP didn’t field a candidate in his constituency.

That would have a knock on effect on the proportion of the vote the likes of Reform receive and therefore their ability to turn that into seats.

[wookie70]

Very happy those Muppets are gone but labour today (to me) is just the Tory party when I was younger.

I'll happily reverse that position if I see real change but with no tax increases and fiscal prudence on offer, what will that change look like.

Let's find out ..


I feel like Thatcher has returned from the dead. I get we are in a much better place than we were yesterday but it is still a crap place to be in. There was some hope with Blair as there was still a huge number of left leaning MPs in the Labour Party. It never really turned out that way albeit Blair did fix quite a few things the Tories had broken but he never changed the way the UK was going in general. Market driven, privatisation and politics for power not the people. I have very little optimism with Starmer. The only glimmer of hope is that he will only last one term if he doesn't at least show he is on the way to make life better for normal people. We should at least see some benefit from his tenure

[Moulin Yarns]

Inverness, skye and west Ross shire to be counted tomorrow. Number of votes cast and numbers of ballot papers don't match.

4 cases of voter fraud in Glasgow, even with photo ID.

[wookie70]

Easy win for Corbyn. That was as easy a result to call as they come. An MP that actually lives in his constituency, does all the work others feel is beneath them and does it with class and humility. Also an MP that is a Labour MP despite not having the whip. Many of those with the whip are not even close to having the politics of a workers party. No chance he wasn't getting a good win and hard to believe they were calling it as close.

[Corstorphine Hibby]

Swinney speaking well to be honest

Really? He looks and sounds like an undertaker who's lost the body.

[McD]

Was there a recount that changed an announced outcome?


I noticed earlier that Labour were increased by 1 seat and Conservatives reduced by 1 (120 to 119), but I didn’t hear the commentators mention any change at the time. The total of results announced hadn’t changed

[Callum_62]

[emoji3510][emoji3510][emoji3510][emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240705/d7ad99c102b491988b7d4cbf40642861.jpg

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

[Bostonhibby]

https://x.com/BladeoftheS/status/1809149052413485465?t=rQjnoNx68-QolbDnNdL4Uw&s=08https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240705/1d829c5a91f5cf15d061ba686b1e2847.jpg

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[Pretty Boy]

Really? He looks and sounds like an undertaker who's lost the body.

I always think Swinney sounds like the humanoid robot in a sci fi film who hasn't been programmed quite right and gives the game away.

He's so unnatural and uncomfortable talking publicly.

[overdrive]

[emoji3510][emoji3510][emoji3510][emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240705/d7ad99c102b491988b7d4cbf40642861.jpg

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

They'll be divorced within the year. He's served his usefulness to her dad.

[superfurryhibby]

It's the system that everyone knows and has to play by, so I'm not sure it's necessarily undemocratic. Reform could/should have targeted fewer constituencies under the system if they wanted to maximise their seat return.

It's not wholly representative. It does afford a greater element of local representation though. I'm not sure how PR works in practice but I guess the location of MPs could easily not tie back to where they were voted in vs. "Livingston" voted Labour and now have a Labour MP for instance (obviously not everyone within Livingston is represntated there, but you need to draw the line somewhere)

FWIW, I like the Scottish Parliament system - that seems to draw on both being (more) proportional, whilst retaining local representation, and providing choice because you then have multiple MSPs representing you from an array of parties.

I think FPTP is deeply undemocratic, that surely isn't in doubt. The combined Tory/Reform vote was 38% of the total vote, yet between them they get around 1/5th of the seats available. The Libs Dems get 12% of the vote and gain 60 + seats.

The question for democracy is surely how do you bring about electoral reform that reflects local views and choices and somehow reconciles with the bigger picture and national voting trends.

I don't have the answers to these conundrums, but note the irony in posts that purport to support democracy, yet can't accept that (sadly) a significant part of the British electorate want right wing government. Can it be a case of I support democracy, but only if it fits with my political views?

[Pretty Boy]

I think FPTP is deeply undemocratic, that surely isn't in doubt. The combined Tory/Reform vote was 38% of the total vote, yet between them they get around 1/5th of the seats available. The Libs Dems get 12% of the vote and gain 60 + seats.

The question for democracy is surely how do you bring about electoral reform that reflects local views and choices and somehow reconciles with the bigger picture and national voting trends.

I don't have the answers to these conundrums, but note the irony in posts that purport to support democracy, yet can't accept that (sadly) a significant part of the British electorate want right wing government. Can it be a case of I support democracy, but only if it fits with my political views?

It just doesn't stack up. Labour are going to get about 2-2.5M votes less than 2017 yet walk away with 180 more seats and a supposed huge mandate.

2019 was billed as a disaster for the Lib Dems when they won 11 seats yet last night they got less votes (3.6 v 3.4M) and hail a great success with 71 seats.

I'm not upset to see fascists locked out of power but everyone would do well to remember it will be the party you support who are on the end of the peculiarities of the system one day.

[Stairway 2 7]

I think FPTP is deeply undemocratic, that surely isn't in doubt. The combined Tory/Reform vote was 38% of the total vote, yet between them they get around 1/5th of the seats available. The Libs Dems get 12% of the vote and gain 60 + seats.

The question for democracy is surely how do you bring about electoral reform that reflects local views and choices and somehow reconciles with the bigger picture and national voting trends.

I don't have the answers to these conundrums, but note the irony in posts that purport to support democracy, yet can't accept that (sadly) a significant part of the British electorate want right wing government. Can it be a case of I support democracy, but only if it fits with my political views?

They aren't right wing they are fascists, candidates calling Sunak a Pa@@ others saying we should shoot at the boats in the channel. Would you let Hitler have his fair shot and let him in if he wins.

[JimBHibees]

Reform get 4 seats with a bigger vote than the Lib Dem’s who get 71 MPs.

As much as I hate reform and all they stand for, that’s undemocratic.

J

Agree it is a terrible system

[Stairway 2 7]

It just doesn't stack up. Labour are going to get about 2-2.5M votes less than 2017 yet walk away with 180 more seats and a supposed huge mandate.

2019 was billed as a disaster for the Lib Dems when they won 11 seats yet last night they got less votes (3.6 v 3.4M) and hail a great success with 71 seats.

I'm not upset to see fascists locked out of power but everyone would do well to remember it will be the party you support who are on the end of the peculiarities of they system one day.

But you're not adding in the opposition totals to that Corbyn got the tories out to vote better than any Tory leader. The system is crap but it's been the same for hundreds of years so you try and win that system. There is no point in having enormous wins in safe seats. Labour spent no money in safe seats and concentrated on a selection of seats. Lib dems did the same concentrating everything on 100 seats. If Reform were smarter they would concentrate on 20 and win them. More parties will do the same in 5 years

[Just Alf]

They'll be divorced within the year. He's served his usefulness to her dad.I thought that was a photoshop joke, but just noticed on the BBC its actually REAL! :rofl:

Clearly none of his party/staff wanted to help him so he roped in his wife!

[marinello59]

The morning after the night before.
And the Tories are OUT. I'm going to enjoy that all day long. :greengrin

[Stairway 2 7]

The morning after the night before.
And the Tories are OUT. I'm going to enjoy that all day long. :greengrin

Still wanting to see Jonathan Gullis's demise

[nonshinyfinish]

Was there a recount that changed an announced outcome?

I noticed earlier that Labour were increased by 1 seat and Conservatives reduced by 1 (120 to 119), but I didn’t hear the commentators mention any change at the time. The total of results announced hadn’t changed

Might have been Poole – I think that went to two recounts and was eventually a Labour win by 18 votes, but I don't know if it had previously been called the other way.


The question for democracy is surely how do you bring about electoral reform that reflects local views and choices and somehow reconciles with the bigger picture and national voting trends.

IMO the Scottish parliament system or something like it (basically any of these: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mixed_electoral_system) is about the best compromise: you elect constituency MPs normally so everyone has a local representative, and then the second part evens things out so that you end up with parties getting approximately the same percentage of seats as their percentage of votes.

The downsides are the additional complexity and the fact that unpopular politicians can sneak in on the list, but IMO those downsides are significantly less bad than the glaring deficiencies of FPTP.

[McSwanky]

Still wanting to see Jonathan Gullis's demise

https://x.com/MittensOff/status/1809068328285040888

[Colr]

In NYC at the moment. Very little coverage here!

[superfurryhibby]

They aren't right wing they are fascists, candidates calling Sunak a Pa@@ others saying we should shoot at the boats in the channel. Would you let Hitler have his fair shot and let him in if he wins.



I think democracy means that anyone is allowed to express a view, whether I like them or not, within the boundaries of the law.

Not sure why you need to go straight settings on max and cite Hitler in response to a reasonable question though.

[J-C]

FPTP only works when there's just 2 parties, otherwise it's useless as we've just seen.

[Colr]

They aren't right wing they are fascists, candidates calling Sunak a Pa@@ others saying we should shoot at the boats in the channel. Would you let Hitler have his fair shot and let him in if he wins.

Well said.

[marinello59]

Still wanting to see Jonathan Gullis's demise

I'm struggling to find any video but he seems to be taking it well. :greengrin

28000

[Northernhibee]

Still wanting to see Jonathan Gullis's demise

Politics loss is the Blackpool Zoo Ape Enclosure’s gain

[Stairway 2 7]

https://x.com/MittensOff/status/1809068328285040888

Oh man thank you so much for that made my Friday already

[Bristolhibby]

I think FPTP is deeply undemocratic, that surely isn't in doubt. The combined Tory/Reform vote was 38% of the total vote, yet between them they get around 1/5th of the seats available. The Libs Dems get 12% of the vote and gain 60 + seats.

The question for democracy is surely how do you bring about electoral reform that reflects local views and choices and somehow reconciles with the bigger picture and national voting trends.

I don't have the answers to these conundrums, but note the irony in posts that purport to support democracy, yet can't accept that (sadly) a significant part of the British electorate want right wing government. Can it be a case of I support democracy, but only if it fits with my political views?

It’s a case for Independence right enough! Get shot of these right wing bar stewards. Sadly that’s been put on the back burner for a while.

Will need to confront them every day.

J

[Stairway 2 7]

I think democracy means that anyone is allowed to express a view, whether I like them or not, within the boundaries of the law.

Not sure why you need to go straight settings on max and cite Hitler in response to a reasonable question though.

To know if you think anyone should be banned and emphasise the path that fascists can travel. I do actually obviously prefer the Scottish Parliaments system. I also go though with Leo "If you cannot convince a fascist, acquaint his head with the pavement" - Leon Trotsky

[H18 SFR]

Would anyone really be surprised to ultimately see the SNP go into the election two years from now with dedacto, branch party and brexit as their three main strategical points?

[Stairway 2 7]

Pretty interesting age splits for the election or perhaps not. 18-24 Labour well ahead, green do well, tories 3rd, Lib Dems 4th and reform tiny behind other.
25-34 tories 4th behind Lab, green, LD
55 and above the only age band that reform/tories do better than Labour. Just the older groups that voted reform and tories

We need national service for pensioners the kids are alright

28001

[superfurryhibby]

To know if you think anyone should be banned and emphasise the path that fascists can travel. I do actually obviously prefer the Scottish Parliaments system. I also go though with Leo "If you cannot convince a fascist, acquaint his head with the pavement" - Leon Trotsky

Right, that's a less hysterical response right enough.

My political views are completely irrelevant to the question I asked.

I am also unconvinced that quoting Trotsky and endorsing extreme violence is a reasonable point when someone is trying to discuss the clear anti-democratic nature of our so called democracy.

However, if we are quoting the ice pick fellae, then how about this one ""Everyone has a right to be stupid, but Comrade MacDonald abuses the privilege." Leon Trotsky.

[Colr]

I think the world is so messed up and Russian/Chinese online disinfo so strong that I don't want PR until the fascists are back under a rock. If we had PR we'd be midterm elections away from the far right coalition deporting people

Fascism never goes away. It requires constant pressure to keep it down

[CropleyWasGod]

Is suppressing the political views of any ideology, no matter how distasteful, not undemocratic in itself?

And also a boost to those ideologies ?(cf Thatcher/Sinn Fein)

[Stairway 2 7]

Fascism never goes away. It requires constant pressure to keep it down

Indeed they are all just rebrands of the brown shirts, NF, BNP, Brexit party.

I don't believe in free speech for all if that speech is racist or can cause death and suffering. I don't care if they want to get rid of the NHS or whatever it's all smoke and mirrors most voters probably didn't know their manifesto. It was all racism

[Stairway 2 7]

SNP need a reboot SNP/Green/ALBA 34% of the vote

2019: SNP won 1.2m votes

2024: 708,759

Almost all the SNP voters lost went to Labour

[marinello59]

Would anyone really be surprised to ultimately see the SNP go into the election two years from now with dedacto, branch party and brexit as their three main strategical points?

I think the SNP need to take a fair bit of time deciding where they go next. I'm trying not to make comment at any length on were I think the SNP have gone wrong this morning, people are not only disappointed, they are hurting and the last thing I want to do is rub salt in to anyone's wounds. People haven't been hoodwinked in to voting for Labour , nor has apathy won, Scots actively voted for change last night. As Flynn has suggested , a serious re-think is required. Interesting times ahead.

[wookie70]

SNP need a reboot SNP/Green/ALBA 34% of the vote

2019: SNP won 1.2m votes

2024: 708,759

Almost all the SNP voters lost went to Labour

2015 1.45M votes for SNP. Not the greatest decade for Indi

[Colr]

Is suppressing the political views of any ideology, no matter how distasteful, not undemocratic in itself?

And also a boost to those ideologies ?(cf Thatcher/Sinn Fein)

Who said suppress?

[Colr]

Indeed they are all just rebrands of the brown shirts, NF, BNP, Brexit party.

I don't believe in free speech for all if that speech is racist or can cause death and suffering. I don't care if they want to get rid of the NHS or whatever it's all smoke and mirrors most voters probably didn't know their manifesto. It was all racism
Yup. It needs challenged at every turn.

One of the Tories great failings over the last few decades is their attempt to appease their fascists instead of standing up to them.

[superfurryhibby]

2015 1.45M votes for SNP. Not the greatest decade for Indi

SNP vote down by less than 2% from the last election. Also, much lower electoral turnout than 2015.

It's pretty poor for the SNP, but the case for Independence is far greater than any one party. It's not going away.

[Stairway 2 7]

SNP vote down by less than 2% from the last election. Also, much lower electoral turnout than 2015.

It's pretty poor for the SNP, but the case for Independence is far greater than any one party. It's not going away.

How 2% their vote went from 1.2 million to 700k

[wookie70]

SNP vote down by less than 2% from the last election. Also, much lower electoral turnout than 2015.

It's pretty poor for the SNP, but the case for Independence is far greater than any one party. It's not going away.

Hope it isn't going away but it has been massively harmed by not being as competent, the whiff of corruption and not actively pursuing Indi. Swinney may not be the greatest orator but he gets what has went wrong. He will need someone like Flynn to have the charisma to actually get the Indi bus rolling again in terms of having a chance to reach its destination. Convincing the likes of me it is a necessity doesn't do any good, just like Corbyn being able to attract more voters than Starmer makes no odds.

[marinello59]

Starmer now in position and first speech delivered. Not the most exciting speech ever but it looks like boring and competent is in. After the chaos of the past few years it’s not the worst outlook to be facing.

[Colr]

We need national service for pensioners the kids are alright

28001

Get them in the fields!

[Moulin Yarns]

How 2% their vote went from 1.2 million to 700k

Share of the vote rather than the first number?

[lapsedhibee]

Scots actively voted for change last night.

Indeed they/we did. But was it mostly change from the Tories, or change from the SNP? A bit of both no doubt, but I think Curtice was hinting that the first sort of change was perhaps the greater driver.

[Stairway 2 7]

Share of the vote rather than the first number?

Nah they had 30% this time, 45% last time and that gave them 81% of seats

[Stairway 2 7]

Indeed they/we did. But was it mostly change from the Tories, or change from the SNP? A bit of both no doubt, but I think Curtice was hinting that the first sort of change was perhaps the greater driver.

16% swing from snp voters going to Labour I read, a massive swing in Scotland and a mandate for Starmer.

Thing is I think Scotland will always give Labour a chance to govern if it means defeating the tories, especially since older people vote and Labour was Scotland for years. Problem is if Starmer doesn't perform which is likely or when tories get back in I think SNP will be stronger than before, demographics are on independence's side imo

[superfurryhibby]

Hope it isn't going away but it has been massively harmed by not being as competent, the whiff of corruption and not actively pursuing Indi. Swinney may not be the greatest orator but he gets what has went wrong. He will need someone like Flynn to have the charisma to actually get the Indi bus rolling again in terms of having a chance to reach its destination. Convincing the likes of me it is a necessity doesn't do any good, just like Corbyn being able to attract more voters than Starmer makes no odds.

In terms of harm, support for independence remains very high but the SNP have been found wanting in terms of direction, governance and dynamism required. After 17 years in power, people have become disillusioned by them but not necessarily with the cause.

Equally, I think the appeal of the right in Britain isn't going away. Despite Labour winning all those seats, it's vote was 4-5% less than the combined Tory/Reform vote.

My teenage son and I were just talking about this. he was asking about the demographics of voting and suggesting that the right appeals to people who feel they have something to lose and those who are so marginalised and alienated that they can't see they have the most to gain.

Populism and the right will always endure whilst we as a society continue to endorse inequality, economies based on growth and consumerism, with free market capitalism shafting everyone senseless, from utilities to the cost of food.

[wookie70]

Trying to understand the mentality of Clacton. Average age over 50 and rising more than the England average, identifying as white ethnic 95.3%, top 10% for deprived areas in England and top 20% for least education(18.8% of working age have zero qualifications) and skills. Sums up Reform voters nicely. Thick enough to think that after decades of voting Tory that the obvious change needed is to vote Extreme Tories.

[Hibrandenburg]

There are some incredibly obvious traps for the Tories in interpreting this election and I have every confidence they will blunder straight into the jaws of the biggest bear trap they can find.

From @lewis_baston on Twitter.

As a non Tory, my interpretation is quite glum. Put simply, some Tories decided that what has happened the last few years was completely unacceptable and either abstained or gave their votes to Labour or the LibDems, many decided that the Tory behaviour the last few years was acceptable and voted for them again, but most worrying is the group who decided they weren't fascist enough and voted Reform. The far right haven't gone away, they're merely regrouping.

[marinello59]

Indeed they/we did. But was it mostly change from the Tories, or change from the SNP? A bit of both no doubt, but I think Curtice was hinting that the first sort of change was perhaps the greater driver.


Both factors were at work but the size of swing we saw suggests a significant number were driven by a desire to reject the SNP. My guess is it wasn’t an either / or decision, they wanted to see both Parties given a kicking. Just a guess though. I don’t think any of us here expected to see the scale of the defeat suffered by the SNP last night. I certainly didn’t, I called the exit poll forecast in Scotland garbage. :greengrin

[Moulin Yarns]

Nah they had 30% this time, 45% last time and that gave them 81% of seats

UK wide?

Total seats
9
Change
-38
Total votes
708,759
Share
2.5%
Share change
-1.3

[Stairway 2 7]

First time ever the cabinet reflects the nation on what type of school they went to

Andy_Hazel
Based on Labour’s shadow cabinet, 84% went to comprehensive schools, 10% went to private schools and 6% to state grammar schools.
That would mean for the first time the cabinet closely reflected British society

[Moulin Yarns]

First time ever the cabinet reflects the nation on what type of school they went to

Andy_Hazel
Based on Labour’s shadow cabinet, 84% went to comprehensive schools, 10% went to private schools and 6% to state grammar schools.
That would mean for the first time the cabinet closely reflected British society

And the secretary of state for Scotland went to Wester Hailes school and Edinburgh University and is a fat jambo. How does that fit? 🤣

[Stairway 2 7]

And the secretary of state for Scotland went to Wester Hailes school and Edinburgh University and is a fat jambo. How does that fit? 🤣

He's undoubtedly working class but also an areshole and not because his football team, although that makes him worse

[lapsedhibee]

Both factors were at work but the size of swing we saw suggests a significant number were driven by a desire to reject the SNP. My guess is it wasn’t an either / or decision, they wanted to see both Parties given a kicking. Just a guess though.

Impossible to know which is why if not the voting system then at least ballot papers need to be much more sophisticated. As a priority there should be boxes for not just candidates but also for why you're voting the way you are:

To give the Tories a kicking, Tick here
To give the SNP a kicking, Tick here
PB, Tick here
To save anyone else drawing out a whole cock and balls, Tick here
etc etc

[marinello59]

Impossible to know which is why if not the voting system then at least ballot papers need to be much more sophisticated. As a priority there should be boxes for not just candidates but also for why you're voting the way you are:

To give the Tories a kicking, Tick here
To give the SNP a kicking, Tick here
PB, Tick here
To save anyone else drawing out a whole cock and balls, Tick here
etc etc

:greengrin

[marinello59]

And the secretary of state for Scotland went to Wester Hailes school and Edinburgh University and is a fat jambo. How does that fit? 🤣

I would hope to see Murray moved to another role. If we are to see a much needed reset in the relationship between Westminster and Holyrood a new face would be preferable.

[Moulin Yarns]

Reform candidate for Perth and Kinrosshire, Pete Wisharts seat is the mother of the Provost of Perth and Kinross council!!!

[Stairway 2 7]

Starmer is now been PM for the shortest time ever, in 7 weeks it'll be Truss again

[lapsedhibee]

Reform candidate for Perth and Kinrosshire, Pete Wisharts seat is the mother of the Provost of Perth and Kinross council!!!

Excellent line on Reform by Marina Hyde:

Meanwhile, it’s incredible to think that only a short while ago we thought we’d eradicated measles and Nigel Farage. Both have now been brought back, largely by the same people.

[Stairway 2 7]

Excellent line on Reform by Marina Hyde:

Meanwhile, it’s incredible to think that only a short while ago we thought we’d eradicated measles and Nigel Farage. Both have now been brought back, largely by the same people.
She's spot. They talk about taking social media away from kids. When you see the vote share then they should ban old people from Facebook if they are just going to get duped by bigotry and bots.

[CropleyWasGod]

Impossible to know which is why if not the voting system then at least ballot papers need to be much more sophisticated. As a priority there should be boxes for not just candidates but also for why you're voting the way you are:

To give the Tories a kicking, Tick here
To give the SNP a kicking, Tick here
PB, Tick here
To save anyone else drawing out a whole cock and balls, Tick here
etc etc

Boom :greengrin:greengrin

Edit. Having just read the post above, can I suggest another line:-

If you're old, just **** off.

[Colr]

She's spot. They talk about taking social media away from kids. When you see the vote share then they should ban old people from Facebook if they are just going to get duped by bigotry and bots.

They’re an amazing generation. Their fathers had to risk their lives fighting fascism, and they vote for it.

[marinello59]

Cabinet appointment time.
Angela Rayner the first to arrive. I’d love to see more politicians like her in Government.

[Colr]

Cabinet appointment time.
Angela Rayner the first to arrive. I’d love to see more politicians like her in Government.

Ginger?

[CropleyWasGod]

Cabinet appointment time.
Angela Rayner the first to arrive. I’d love to see more politicians like her in Government.

Tax-avoiders? :greengrin

[Stairway 2 7]

Boom :greengrin:greengrin

Edit. Having just read the post above, can I suggest another line:-

If you're old, just **** off.

Not f off that's unfair just don't vote. I'd let only under 35s vote they seem to know what they are doing, I'd be excluded but it's a sacrifice I'd make.

Probably why I'll no make it as a politician, I'd no vote for me anyway

"I don't wish to belong to any club that would accept me as a member." Groucho Marx

[marinello59]

Ginger?


Tax-avoiders? :greengrin

I was thinking working class but I now realise my mistake in leaving it open :greengrin

[marinello59]

Farage getting a good heckling. :greengrin

[Silversand]

Interesting stathttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240705/387eb44231227fbc3941dbafdc2473be.jpg

Sent from my SM-S928B using Tapatalk

[Stairway 2 7]

I was thinking working class but I now realise my mistake in leaving it open :greengrin

I didn't realise Wes Streeting wasn't a posh boy and had a tough upbringing. Grandad was a friend of the Krays and his gran was inside for armed robbery, council estate to Cambridge. He's still an erse mind but he's done well for himself

[Stairway 2 7]

Farage getting a good heckling. :greengrin

https://x.com/PolitlcsUK/status/1809222879743234406

We'll done those people

[weecounty hibby]

https://x.com/PolitlcsUK/status/1809222879743234406

We'll done those people

Cantvwait to see that level of debate and counter argument from him in Parliament. Absolute con man

[McD]

Cantvwait to see that level of debate and counter argument from him in Parliament. Absolute con man



We’ll see how the Speaker deals with him, at every debate he’s talked and shouted over every other person, arrogant and ignorant, needs to be shut down quick if he starts that nonsense in the commons

[Corstorphine Hibby]

First time ever the cabinet reflects the nation on what type of school they went to

Andy_Hazel
Based on Labour’s shadow cabinet, 84% went to comprehensive schools, 10% went to private schools and 6% to state grammar schools.
That would mean for the first time the cabinet closely reflected British society

Not forgetting that the top boy is a First knight of the realm.

[Berwickhibby]

Not forgetting that the top boy is a First knight of the realm.

Not a born and bred one…got it through the job he had as head of DPP as every head off DPP and Met commissioner get.

[marinello59]

I didn't realise Wes Streeting wasn't a posh boy and had a tough upbringing. Grandad was a friend of the Krays and his gran was inside for armed robbery, council estate to Cambridge. He's still an erse mind but he's done well for himself

There are a few in the cabinet who had pretty tough upbringings.
Eton seems to be a bit under-represented so far though. :greengrin

[grunt]

What do people want to see Starmer doing in the early days of his Government?
Maybe I'm sensitive but I've been hearing a number of comments from him and others about "all four countries of the UK" and "working together as a union" so I'm wondering what he has in mind.

Here's a few things he could get on with:

Make a significant and public move towards improving relations with the EU
It's not on my Wishlist but I think it would be a good idea to arrange something with France to address "small boats"
Appoint a commission to go after PPE fraudsters (Mone I'm looking at you) and the politicians who enabled / profited from it and other COVID get-rich schemes. I'm talking jail time and significant fines
Organise international response to Gaza genocide
Deal with significant industrial relations issues which have been around for ages (trains, NHS, Doctors)
Something around clean energy - I've seen people talking about reversing the ban on onshore wind
On the subject of reversing I'd like to see him very quickly reversing some of Bravermans / Patels onerous anti-migrant laws, and close the barge and cancel the hire contract.
I'd like to see him cancel a number of the crony contracts which the previous Government put in place - and not offering compensation, just cancel the contract and let the injured party sue.

Let's see what he's got to offer.

[Colr]

What do people want to see Starmer doing in the early days of his Government?
Maybe I'm sensitive but I've been hearing a number of comments from him and others about "all four countries of the UK" and "working together as a union" so I'm wondering what he has in mind.

Here's a few things he could get on with:

Make a significant and public move towards improving relations with the EU
It's not on my Wishlist but I think it would be a good idea to arrange something with France to address "small boats"
Appoint a commission to go after PPE fraudsters (Mone I'm looking at you) and the politicians who enabled / profited from it and other COVID get-rich schemes. I'm talking jail time and significant fines
Organise international response to Gaza genocide
Deal with significant industrial relations issues which have been around for ages (trains, NHS, Doctors)
Something around clean energy - I've seen people talking about reversing the ban on onshore wind
On the subject of reversing I'd like to see him very quickly reversing some of Bravermans / Patels onerous anti-migrant laws, and close the barge and cancel the hire contract.
I'd like to see him cancel a number of the crony contracts which the previous Government put in place - and not offering compensation, just cancel the contract and let the injured party sue.

Let's see what he's got to offer.


Redirect funding from Housing Associations to councils to get housebuilding moving.

[Bristolhibby]

What do people want to see Starmer doing in the early days of his Government?
Maybe I'm sensitive but I've been hearing a number of comments from him and others about "all four countries of the UK" and "working together as a union" so I'm wondering what he has in mind.

Here's a few things he could get on with:

Make a significant and public move towards improving relations with the EU
It's not on my Wishlist but I think it would be a good idea to arrange something with France to address "small boats"
Appoint a commission to go after PPE fraudsters (Mone I'm looking at you) and the politicians who enabled / profited from it and other COVID get-rich schemes. I'm talking jail time and significant fines
Organise international response to Gaza genocide
Deal with significant industrial relations issues which have been around for ages (trains, NHS, Doctors)
Something around clean energy - I've seen people talking about reversing the ban on onshore wind
On the subject of reversing I'd like to see him very quickly reversing some of Bravermans / Patels onerous anti-migrant laws, and close the barge and cancel the hire contract.
I'd like to see him cancel a number of the crony contracts which the previous Government put in place - and not offering compensation, just cancel the contract and let the injured party sue.

Let's see what he's got to offer.

Remove voter ID and lower voting age to 16 for the rest of the U.K.

Get the immigration Taskforce up and running with a legal rout for applicants in France.

Russian Inteference in elections enquiry with some proper teeth. Get ready to strip out some Lords.

House of Lord reform. Get a retirement age in place ASAP.

J

[Silversand]

What do people want to see Starmer doing in the early days of his Government?
Maybe I'm sensitive but I've been hearing a number of comments from him and others about "all four countries of the UK" and "working together as a union" so I'm wondering what he has in mind.

Here's a few things he could get on with:

Make a significant and public move towards improving relations with the EU
It's not on my Wishlist but I think it would be a good idea to arrange something with France to address "small boats"
Appoint a commission to go after PPE fraudsters (Mone I'm looking at you) and the politicians who enabled / profited from it and other COVID get-rich schemes. I'm talking jail time and significant fines
Organise international response to Gaza genocide
Deal with significant industrial relations issues which have been around for ages (trains, NHS, Doctors)
Something around clean energy - I've seen people talking about reversing the ban on onshore wind
On the subject of reversing I'd like to see him very quickly reversing some of Bravermans / Patels onerous anti-migrant laws, and close the barge and cancel the hire contract.
I'd like to see him cancel a number of the crony contracts which the previous Government put in place - and not offering compensation, just cancel the contract and let the injured party sue.

Let's see what he's got to offer.Longer term, the Gordon Brown / Daily Record "ending child poverty" statement is probably the single most important one for me, although I doubt it will happen, I know it was just empty rhetoric to get Scots to vote Labour [emoji22]https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240705/fb3c0a34d2686c5257b738ef4aec793d.jpg

Sent from my SM-S928B using Tapatalk

[grunt]

Actually quite pleased about this appointment

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GRu5--vW4AE4Tji?format=jpg&name=large

[J-C]

Reform like Trump are aimed towards the thick and stupid and there's thousands of them out there.

[grunt]

Russian Inteference in elections enquiry with some proper teeth. Get ready to strip out some Lords.
Yep - I'd forgotten about both of these.

Maybe he could let us know what Charlotte Owen did to get her life peerage.

[grunt]

Reform like Trump are aimed towards the thick and stupid and there's thousands of them out there.And yet I get into all sorts of trouble on here when I suggest that all Leave voters were thick and stupid. :greengrin

[J-C]

I'd like to see Starmer finally hammer huge conglomerate companies, Amazon, oil companies, Starbucks and all companies like Tesco and Morrisons who show millions in profit while their goods for sale are ridiculously high.

[grunt]

I'd like to see Starmer finally hammer huge conglomerate companies, Amazon, oil companies, Starbucks and all companies like Tesco and Morrisons who show millions in profit while their goods for sale are ridiculously high.
Don't remember seeing that in the manifesto ...

[Colr]

No Conservative MPs in Inner London for first time

[Lendo]

Immediate Wishlist:

Release of any Russian interference evidence to the public in full. Immediate acquittal or pardons of all sub-post masters/mistresses and suitable compensation paid to each.

[Paul1642]

Reform gain their 5th seat. Didn’t see that one coming.

[Moulin Yarns]

There are a few in the cabinet who had pretty tough upbringings.
Eton seems to be a bit under-represented so far though. :greengrin

What are you saying about wester Hailes? Not to mention the knight of the realm, his father was a tool maker, and boy did he ever make a tool? 🤣

[Ozyhibby]

Some impressive fantasy wish lists for Starmer. That’s what happens when you are voted in without making clear what your plan is for govt. People will be very easily disappointed when you don’t live up to the make believe idea they had of you.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Paul1642]

Some impressive fantasy wish lists for Starmer. That’s what happens when you are voted in without making clear what your plan is for govt. People will be very easily disappointed when you don’t live up to the make believe idea they had of you.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don’t think Labour have been voted into power with the expectation of doing anything great. Just doing better then the awful Tory’s will be fine for now.

[Hibs4185]

Oh dear. Also Deidre Brock?

Absolutely gutted with the results for the SNP but I’m glad she’s gone. Hopeless

[McD]

What do people want to see Starmer doing in the early days of his Government?
Maybe I'm sensitive but I've been hearing a number of comments from him and others about "all four countries of the UK" and "working together as a union" so I'm wondering what he has in mind.

Here's a few things he could get on with:

Make a significant and public move towards improving relations with the EU
It's not on my Wishlist but I think it would be a good idea to arrange something with France to address "small boats"
Appoint a commission to go after PPE fraudsters (Mone I'm looking at you) and the politicians who enabled / profited from it and other COVID get-rich schemes. I'm talking jail time and significant fines
Organise international response to Gaza genocide
Deal with significant industrial relations issues which have been around for ages (trains, NHS, Doctors)
Something around clean energy - I've seen people talking about reversing the ban on onshore wind
On the subject of reversing I'd like to see him very quickly reversing some of Bravermans / Patels onerous anti-migrant laws, and close the barge and cancel the hire contract.
I'd like to see him cancel a number of the crony contracts which the previous Government put in place - and not offering compensation, just cancel the contract and let the injured party sue.

Let's see what he's got to offer.



Wouldn’t be unhappy to see any/all of these

[BroxburnHibee]

Have they binned the Rwanda plan yet?

[SHODAN]

Have they binned the Rwanda plan yet?

Nothing will be binned. Starmer has ruled out scrapping most Tory bills.

[marinello59]

Nothing will be binned. Starmer has ruled out scrapping most Tory bills.

He’s said Rwanda won’t be happening. They are going to go after the gangs and cooperate more with the French authorities. Yvette Cooper is Home Secretary, a politician I would trust to deliver.

[marinello59]

I don’t think Labour have been voted into power with the expectation of doing anything great. Just doing better then the awful Tory’s will be fine for now.

Boring and competent will be the way for the next year or so. Thats not a bad thing after years of chaos both sides of the border. They set out clearly what they intend to do in their manifesto. Nobody seems to read any of them any more but to be fair they aren’t very exciting.

[DaveF]

Making a dent in the disaster that calls itself the care system would be welcome by many people.

[Ozyhibby]

Boring and competent will be the way for the next year or so. Thats not a bad thing after years of chaos both sides of the border. They set out clearly what they intend to do in their manifesto. Nobody seems to read any of them any more but to be fair they aren’t very exciting.

They promised planning reform to build houses. Costs nothing to do so no budget excuses. It won’t affect Scotland but might spur the SG to do the same. I would expect them to get on with this given they can’t do other things due to their fiscal rules.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[marinello59]

They promised planning reform to build houses. Costs nothing to do so no budget excuses. It won’t affect Scotland but might spur the SG to do the same. I would expect them to get on with this given they can’t do other things due to their fiscal rules.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I hope they do this and I expect them to do this. Like you say it’s a relatively easily delivered pledge.

[MKHIBEE]

Making a dent in the disaster that calls itself the care system would be welcome by many people.
It will need more than a dent. The provision of care for the elderly in this country is appalling and there is nothing being done to attract and keep suitably qualified staff to improve the standard

[Hibs4185]

He’s said Rwanda won’t be happening. They are going to go after the gangs and cooperate more with the French authorities. Yvette Cooper is Home Secretary, a politician I would trust to deliver.

Aye because the Tories, Border Force and the French have never bothered about the gangs.

[Keith_M]

Over 4 million vote for Reform

I find that quite shocking

[jamie_1875]

Over 4 million vote for Reform

I find that quite shocking

In Scotland their vote was 165,045, compared to the Scottish Greens on 90,647 and Alba made their breakthrough with 11,784 and lost all 19 of their deposits....

If Reform repeat that result in 2026 they will have MSPs at Holyrood.

[Ozyhibby]

I hope they do this and I expect them to do this. Like you say it’s a relatively easily delivered pledge.

It should be if you have courage but Labour won a lot of seats in the south which will have thin majorities. That’s where opposition to this will come from and so they will need to put country before party. Will they do it?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Paul1642]

Over 4 million vote for Reform

I find that quite shocking

Last time they took a similar amount of votes in 2015 it caused Cameron to promise the vote on leaving the EU thinking it was a sure win for remain and golden ticket to killing of UKIP. We all know how that ended but in theory there was a solution to their rise.

This time around there is no such solution. Unless their MPs do something catastrophically stupid (which is probably likely), they will probably increase their vote at the next election.

I think the days of Labour vs Conservatives with everyone else being a complete side note (excluding the odd Lib Dem minor surge) are gone and potentially not coming back.

First past the post will keep their seats low but the more success they have, the more chance in their vote snowballing as people attracted to them will no longer feel it’s a wasted vote as they might have done this time around.

[SneakersO'Toole]

In Scotland their vote was 165,045, compared to the Scottish Greens on 90,647 and Alba made their breakthrough with 11,784 and lost all 19 of their deposits....

If Reform repeat that result in 2026 they will have MSPs at Holyrood.

Reform won around a 7% share of the vote north of the Border, half the UK-wide total of 14%.

Is there a proportionate amount of fascists in Scotland as there is in England?!