Bin strikes

[danhibees1875]

Sorry if I've missed this in another thread somewhere but the Edinburgh bin collections will be stopping for 12 days from tomorrow until the 30th.

Waste, recycling, and street cleaning all stopped - bad enough at any time but compounded with the festival being on during most of that period.

Has this happened before? I can't remember any similar strikes beforehand. Just how awful a state will the city get into between now and then?

[LunasBoots]

Sorry if I've missed this in another thread somewhere but the Edinburgh bin collections will be stopping for 12 days from tomorrow until the 30th.

Waste, recycling, and street cleaning all stopped - bad enough at any time but compounded with the festival being on during most of that period.

Has this happened before? I can't remember any similar strikes beforehand. Just how awful a state will the city get into between now and then?

I'm sure a deal will be sorted within a week when public annoyance grows at the state of the streets, my buckets here in Leith haven't been emptied for over a week as it is and are badly overflowing, would hate to see the state in two weeks if it lasts that long.

[Mon Dieu4]

The festival is the perfect time for them to strike, good luck to them, getting offered a 2% pay rise when inflation is at 10% is shocking

[silverhibee]

Sorry if I've missed this in another thread somewhere but the Edinburgh bin collections will be stopping for 12 days from tomorrow until the 30th.

Waste, recycling, and street cleaning all stopped - bad enough at any time but compounded with the festival being on during most of that period.

Has this happened before? I can't remember any similar strikes beforehand. Just how awful a state will the city get into between now and then?

Sure I seen something on twitter tonight that the council are asking people not to leave bags of rubbish outside, I take it that means keep your rubbish piled up in your house.

[1875godsgift]

Sorry if I've missed this in another thread somewhere but the Edinburgh bin collections will be stopping for 12 days from tomorrow until the 30th.

Waste, recycling, and street cleaning all stopped - bad enough at any time but compounded with the festival being on during most of that period.

Has this happened before? I can't remember any similar strikes beforehand. Just how awful a state will the city get into between now and then?

Happened in the 70's as far as I remember, with power cuts thrown in as well! Streets were a mess, but I grew up in Abbeyhill so it wasn't much different from a visit by celtc or the other team from Glasgow that went bust. In fact, it wasn't as bad as when they teams visited, because uncollected bin bags can't *****e in your stairwell.

Mind you, we didn't need so much electric in those days, dirty washing was done in the bath, wrung out on a mangle and hung out in the back green, much like the weegies when we caught them (apart from the washing bit, there's no point washing a weegie, they just melt).

[danhibees1875]

Sure I seen something on twitter tonight that the council are asking people not to leave bags of rubbish outside, I take it that means keep your rubbish piled up in your house.

It will depend on circumstances, the council website recommends using a garage, garden, or driveway - I would imagine there's plenty of people/areas where that isn't feasible. At which point the house... Or as is more likely to happen, out in the streets.

Hopefully it's all resolved quickly.

[danhibees1875]

Happened in the 70's as far as I remember, with power cuts thrown in as well! Streets were a mess, but I grew up in Abbeyhill so it wasn't much different from a visit by celtc or the other team from Glasgow that went bust. In fact, it wasn't as bad as when they teams visited, because uncollected bin bags can't *****e in your stairwell.

Mind you, we didn't need so much electric in those days, dirty washing was done in the bath, wrung out on a mangle and hung out in the back green, much like the weegies when we caught them (apart from the washing bit, there's no point washing a weegie, they just melt).

:faf:

[danhibees1875]

The festival is the perfect time for them to strike, good luck to them, getting offered a 2% pay rise when inflation is at 10% is shocking

The latest offer was 3.5% going by the article I read on it.

[Pretty Boy]

If any of my bins got emptied anything close to every 12 days it would be a vast improvement on the service. Rubbish one month and recycling the next seems to be the rota for my street.

Seriously though good luck to them. The more sectors that walk out the more pressure it applies to get this race to the bottom in terms of wages sorted.

[marinello59]

The festival is the perfect time for them to strike, good luck to them, getting offered a 2% pay rise when inflation is at 10% is shocking

:agree:

[hibsbollah]

Sure I seen something on twitter tonight that the council are asking people not to leave bags of rubbish outside, I take it that means keep your rubbish piled up in your house.

The Sun were getting excited by this instruction, big capital letters AT HOME as if it was crazy talk.

Seems pretty straightforward to me. Until the dispute gets resolved keep it secure and at home and don’t leave your bin on the pavement for 2 weeks blocking it for buggy and wheelchair users.

[Jack]

Sure I seen something on twitter tonight that the council are asking people not to leave bags of rubbish outside, I take it that means keep your rubbish piled up in your house.

Good grief!

We can't have all that rubbish on the streets with all these tourists about!!

I'm surprised the residents aren't being asked to come into town with a bin liner and take some litter home.

[danhibees1875]

The Sun were getting excited by this instruction, big capital letters AT HOME as if it was crazy talk.

Seems pretty straightforward to me. Until the dispute gets resolved keep it secure and at home and don’t leave your bin on the pavement for 2 weeks blocking it for buggy and wheelchair users.

My bins get emptied on a rotation - every week it's either waste or recycling (+food waste on both). I think that's the norm for most quieter residential areas, I miss the days of big communal bins and not caring about what day they were emptied because it just happened.

My bin was emptied last Friday and there will be a four week gap until it's emptied again. I'm lucky enough that I've a bit outdoor space that I can keep it for that time as a minor inconvenience but others won't be. The idea of keeping waste in your house for 4 weeks does seem like crazy talk.

That's just the residential aspect. The bins in town are already flooding over - Hunter square was a mess this morning.

At least businesses will have private companies still going about doing their bit over the next couple of weeks.

[Hiber-nation]

There's no rubbish scattered anywhere here until the bin men are finished. Half the recycle crates not emptied properly and chucked vigorously on to the pavement in whatever direction the guy is facing resulting in rubbish strewn over the street . Only had one handle of the food bin broken off so far but there's time. Then the guy decides to stop and have a fag and stare at me trying to fix the handle back on. Then the next week they've got a council supervisor trailing them so it's as good a service as you can get no doubt due to the number of complaints. Then back to normal the week after.

No complaints about the frequency though.

[Moulin Yarns]

I believe that the strike isn't just edinburgh. We have been told to keep putting the bins out for collection and leave for 48 hours then take them in if not emptied. Test tomorrow when the garden waste is due for collection.

I don't know about the recycling centres, whether they will be open or not.

Edit: recycling centres are open here.

[hibsbollah]

At least businesses will have private companies still going about doing their bit over the next couple of weeks.

I wonder what pay rise those workers will be getting.

[Stairway 2 7]

Might make people think about how much needless waste we produce. Get to the fill your own produce shops in the next few weeks.

[silverhibee]

My bins get emptied on a rotation - every week it's either waste or recycling (+food waste on both). I think that's the norm for most quieter residential areas, I miss the days of big communal bins and not caring about what day they were emptied because it just happened.

My bin was emptied last Friday and there will be a four week gap until it's emptied again. I'm lucky enough that I've a bit outdoor space that I can keep it for that time as a minor inconvenience but others won't be. The idea of keeping waste in your house for 4 weeks does seem like crazy talk.

That's just the residential aspect. The bins in town are already flooding over - Hunter square was a mess this morning.

At least businesses will have private companies still going about doing their bit over the next couple of weeks.

My grey bin is full and would have been due to be emptied today, I also have space at the back to put black bags as I ain’t keeping rubbish in the house for weeks, I’m four in a block, the people upstairs will also want to put bags round the back and it will be under my window or not far from it, then the foxes and seagulls will get a sniff and the bags will be burst open and rubbish everywhere, then the rats come :greengrin , the city will be one big tip by the end of the week.

[silverhibee]

Might make people think about how much needless waste we produce. Get to the fill your own produce shops in the next few weeks.

It won’t though and folk will be out at dark time dumping black bags of rubbish in the streets, will be a nightmare for folks in tower blocks, folk will just throw the rubbish out the windows.

[Stairway 2 7]

Best solution would be for the workers to be given a fair deal

[Bridge hibs]

My bins are jammed full, I have a good solution to resolve that problem, there is a pet jambo at the top of my street who has a lovely tidy garden 🫣

[He's here!]

There's no rubbish scattered anywhere here until the bin men are finished. Half the recycle crates not emptied properly and chucked vigorously on to the pavement in whatever direction the guy is facing resulting in rubbish strewn over the street . Only had one handle of the food bin broken off so far but there's time. Then the guy decides to stop and have a fag and stare at me trying to fix the handle back on. Then the next week they've got a council supervisor trailing them so it's as good a service as you can get no doubt due to the number of complaints. Then back to normal the week after.

No complaints about the frequency though.

Most of the broken boxes for glass and the food bins undoubtedly sustain their damage by being thrown back recklessly on to the pavements by a minority of grumpy f**** who clearly despise clearing away other people's refuse. Most do a decent job though.

[marinello59]

Best solution would be for the workers to be given a fair deal

It really is that simple.

[Hiber-nation]

Most of the broken boxes for glass and the food bins undoubtedly sustain their damage by being thrown back recklessly on to the pavements by a minority of grumpy f**** who clearly despise clearing away other people's refuse. Most do a decent job though.

Yep, can't tar them all with the same brush and I'm talking about a minority but there are some who are lucky to be employed at all. OK the money isn't good and it's not everyone's ideal job but acting like a spoilt brat and chucking folks rubbish crates around just because you hate your job isn't on.

[lapsedhibee]

Yep, can't tar them all with the same brush and I'm talking about a minority but there are some who are lucky to be employed at all. OK the money isn't good and it's not everyone's ideal job but acting like a spoilt brat and chucking folks rubbish crates around just because you hate your job isn't on.

Might be imagining this but in ye good olde days did they not carry a broom on the wagon so that if they accidentally dropped some glass they could sweep up the pieces? Maybe some still do, but some just leave the shatterings strewn around on the pavement/road.

[Smartie]

It really is that simple.

So are we all happy paying the extra tax that would fund it then?

[Stairway 2 7]

So are we all happy paying the extra tax that would fund it then?

Yes definitely, as long as the rises are weighted to the higher bands.

[marinello59]

So are we all happy paying the extra tax that would fund it then?

Don’t you think they should get a fair rate for the job?
The Tories have kept taxes low while they underfunded services for years. Taxing the rich more and making big businesses such as Amazon pay their fair share would be a good start. A windfall tax on all the companies profiteering while prices rise seems fair as well.

[Smartie]

Don’t you think they should get a fair rate for the job?
The Tories have kept taxes low while they underfunded services for years. Taxing the rich more and making big businesses such as Amazon pay their fair share would be a good start. A windfall tax on all the companies profiteering while prices rise seems fair as well.

Absolutely (I'm mainly being devil's advocate here).

What a fair rate is I do not know as I don't know what they're currently receiving, what they've been offered and what they're holding out for.

But is this not the council we're talking about here? They'll have their money and they'll have their budgets.

I just think it's a bit simplistic to be shouting for more money for everyone all the time without giving some serious thought about where it's to come from.

Why can the parties who suggest higher taxes or taxes on the rich find never find their way to power?

And I'm all for bashing the Tories and everything they stand for... but where do they stand in the culpability stakes when we in Scotland aren't getting our bins picked up?

The gnashing and wailing for people to be paid more invariably comes with a demand that someone else pays for it rather than the person doing the howling.

Maybe we should bash some pots and pans together for the binmen?

[Ozyhibby]

They deserve a wage rise in line with inflation except the guy who leaves my bin in front of my drive so that I have to get out my car to move it before I park. He should be sacked. Or worse.


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[Stairway 2 7]

Going through town and I'm stunned how much a tip the streets are already. Bins overflowing and pretty much every street has stuff flying about. Must be some job these guys do during the festival normally. They don't miss you until you are gone

[DaveF]

Going through town and I'm stunned how much a tip the streets are already. Bins overflowing and pretty much every street has stuff flying about. Must be some job these guys do during the festival normally. They don't miss you until you are gone

I was in town this morning (princes st) and it's a disgrace. My brother took some photos of surgeons hall which looked even worse.

This can't go on and surely an agreement will have to be reached.

[Moulin Yarns]

My green waste bins were emptied this morning. Perth and Kinross staff are brilliant 😁

[Smartie]

This is normally a pretty bad time of year for it at my work at the best of times.

Seagull season and short term festival lets are not a great combination. As the folk who either don't understand or don't care about the rubbish collections stick their stuff at the front door, the seagulls attack it and you end up with ankle deep rubbish strewn across the pavement.

I'm trying to run a healthcare establishment and used to practically have the warden on speed dial until I realised that it's just best to get on and clean it yourself daily rather than suffer the damage that occurs whilst waiting for someone to come and do what you pay a fair whack for them to do for you.

[Stairway 2 7]

Video of the streets

https://mobile.twitter.com/UniteCECbranch/status/1560581879471955969

Unite CEC Branch
@UniteCECbranch
If Scot Gov didn’t see the value of council workers before, they’ve no excuse now it’s written all over the streets.

@UniteScotland
#edinburghbinstrikes #COSLAlivingcrisis #supportourstrikers

[Moulin Yarns]

Video of the streets

https://mobile.twitter.com/UniteCECbranch/status/1560581879471955969

Unite CEC Branch
@UniteCECbranch
If Scot Gov didn’t see the value of council workers before, they’ve no excuse now it’s written all over the streets.

@UniteScotland
#edinburghbinstrikes #COSLAlivingcrisis #supportourstrikers

The Scottish Government don't employ council workers!

[hibsbollah]

This is normally a pretty bad time of year for it at my work at the best of times.

Seagull season and short term festival lets are not a great combination. As the folk who either don't understand or don't care about the rubbish collections stick their stuff at the front door, the seagulls attack it and you end up with ankle deep rubbish strewn across the pavement.

I'm trying to run a healthcare establishment and used to practically have the warden on speed dial until I realised that it's just best to get on and clean it yourself daily rather than suffer the damage that occurs whilst waiting for someone to come and do what you pay a fair whack for them to do for you.

Its not that hard to do a few things as individuals, ive just done it myself. Emptied out the landfill bin, washed it out, put some disinfectant inside it, double bagged everything, made sure none of the bags were open and nothing left unbagged in the bin. It wasnt a very pleasant job, its been sitting in there a few weeks now, but it would be a lot lot worse in two weeks time.

[Stairway 2 7]

The Scottish Government don't employ council workers!

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/blame-strike-action-lies-squarely-27764898

Blame for strike action lies squarely with Scottish Government and COSLA

Up the unions

[Moulin Yarns]

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/blame-strike-action-lies-squarely-27764898

Blame for strike action lies squarely with Scottish Government and COSLA

Up the unions

Strike action is the responsibility of the unions.

Council pay is the responsibility of the councils.

Budgets are the responsibility of the councils.

[hibsbollah]

The union leader was on Radio 4 Today programme, and Nicola Sturgeon got both barrels from him. It’s definitely being presented in those terms.

Just checked, he’s from Edinburgh,Gary Smith, supporter of Keir Starmer, critic of Richard Leonard, loudly anti SNP. Interesting.

[Ozyhibby]

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/blame-strike-action-lies-squarely-27764898

Blame for strike action lies squarely with Scottish Government and COSLA

Up the unions

If my bins are not collected I’ll be holding my new Better Together coalition council accountable. They always used to get picked up when the SNP were in charge.


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[Stairway 2 7]

What the union says

No, the blame for this situation lies squarely at the doors of the local government body COSLA and the Scottish Government. It’s important to realise that Unite along with the trade unions rejected a 2 per cent pay offer in March.

So why has it taken five months for COSLA to ‘up’ their offer to 3.5 per cent? The latest paltry offer has also been swiftly rejected at a time when the cost of living crisis is really beginning to bite with energy prices rising through the roof and inflation soaring to 12.3 per cent.

Yes - even council leaders including those in Edinburgh and Glasgow agree with us that this offer is nowhere near good enough. So why even make it when you know it will be rejected?

John Swinney and the Scottish Government can point to its recent announcement of an extra £140m to councils but the bigger picture is that local government has been starved of money for over a decade.

The change in money between 2013-14 and 2019-20 for local government has decreased at more than twice the rate than the Scottish Government’s revenue budget in real terms. That’s a fact.

Local government emerged as the biggest loser from the latest Scottish Government spending review with its funding frozen for the rest of the parliament. That’s also on the Scottish Government.

Now we have the pathetic spectacle of COSLA and the Scottish Government doing a Hokey Cokey dance as they blame each other for this mess. The fact is both of them are equally to blame and it’s a mess of their own doing.

Our members are fed-up with this politicking because all they want is an offer put on the table which is fair and helps them deal with the cost of living crisis hurting families all across Scotland.

[hibsbollah]

What the union says

No, the blame for this situation lies squarely at the doors of the local government body COSLA and the Scottish Government. It’s important to realise that Unite along with the trade unions rejected a 2 per cent pay offer in March.

So why has it taken five months for COSLA to ‘up’ their offer to 3.5 per cent? The latest paltry offer has also been swiftly rejected at a time when the cost of living crisis is really beginning to bite with energy prices rising through the roof and inflation soaring to 12.3 per cent.

Yes - even council leaders including those in Edinburgh and Glasgow agree with us that this offer is nowhere near good enough. So why even make it when you know it will be rejected?

John Swinney and the Scottish Government can point to its recent announcement of an extra £140m to councils but the bigger picture is that local government has been starved of money for over a decade.

The change in money between 2013-14 and 2019-20 for local government has decreased at more than twice the rate than the Scottish Government’s revenue budget in real terms. That’s a fact.

Local government emerged as the biggest loser from the latest Scottish Government spending review with its funding frozen for the rest of the parliament. That’s also on the Scottish Government.

Now we have the pathetic spectacle of COSLA and the Scottish Government doing a Hokey Cokey dance as they blame each other for this mess. The fact is both of them are equally to blame and it’s a mess of their own doing.

Our members are fed-up with this politicking because all they want is an offer put on the table which is fair and helps them deal with the cost of living crisis hurting families all across Scotland.

See my post above. The GNB leadership blaming the Scottish Government is not that surprising. Im confused about the 'Hokey cokey dance' thing. Im not sure who actually speaks like that...

[danhibees1875]

I assume it's not in the unions interest to declare what % they are looking to get. Clearly more than 3.5%.

I wonder what the final resolution will be. I can't see it being the inflation figure (11%?) quoted previously though.

[Kato]

All councils across the UK have had their budgets cut since 2010. I'm not sure about Scotland but English councils have lost 40% of the Govt funding. With that kind of austerity it would be difficult for Scottish councils budgets to remain the same. The devolved parliament only gets so much pocket money.

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[marinello59]

I assume it's not in the unions interest to declare what % they are looking to get. Clearly more than 3.5%.

I wonder what the final resolution will be. I can't see it being the inflation figure (11%?) quoted previously though.

Nicola Sturgeon’s mention of 5% was no accident, it’s what she the thinks Councils should be offering. I cant see that being acceptable to the Union either.

[Moulin Yarns]

All councils across the UK have had their budgets cut since 2010. I'm not sure about Scotland but English councils have lost 40% of the Govt funding. With that kind of austerity it would be difficult for Scottish councils budgets to remain the same. The devolved parliament only gets so much pocket money.

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Aye, but still some think that there is a magic money tree 🤔

[hibsbollah]

Nicola Sturgeon’s mention of 5% was no accident, it’s what she the thinks Councils should be offering. I cant see that being acceptable to the Union either.

Smith was pressed on that on the radio and he wouldnt commit to a figure.

[danhibees1875]

Nicola Sturgeon’s mention of 5% was no accident, it’s what she the thinks Councils should be offering. I cant see that being acceptable to the Union either.

Thanks - I didn't know she had said that. :aok:

[Pretty Boy]

Aye, but still some think that there is a magic money tree 🤔

The populist freeze Scot Gov enforced for years that disproportionately impacted services used by the lowest earners means there are a fair few leaves less than there should be though.

[grunt]

The populist freeze Scot Gov enforced for years that disproportionately impacted services used by the lowest earners means there are a fair few leaves less than there should be though.
As I understand it that freeze was relaxed this year but some Councils didn't put up CT as much as they could have?

[Hibrandenburg]

I remember visiting Naples during their bin strike and thinking what a rotten shame it was that tonnes of rubbish had been allowed to pile high in the streets. I went back a few years after the bin strikes and nothing had changed.

[Ozyhibby]

I remember visiting Naples during their bin strike and thinking what a rotten shame it was that tonnes of rubbish had been allowed to pile high in the streets. I went back a few years after the bin strikes and nothing had changed.

Think that might be mafia related?


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[Bridge hibs]

Think that might be mafia related?


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkYeah there is a documentary about that on Youtube, Naples Mafia controlling all domestic and industrial waste including hospital waste and toxic waste/chemicals which has been dumped on farm land and in neighbourhoods

[CropleyWasGod]

Will the binmen get overtime when they clear up the backlog?

Please say yes.

[stoneyburn hibs]

Nicola Sturgeon’s mention of 5% was no accident, it’s what she the thinks Councils should be offering. I cant see that being acceptable to the Union either.

There is no chance that 5% will be accepted, nor should it.
It's not even close.

[stoneyburn hibs]

Will the binmen get overtime when they clear up the backlog?

Please say yes.

Hopefully.

No Overtime at West Lothian Council, but they're putting everything to outside contractors, joke and it's costing the taxpayer an absolute fortune.

[Glory Lurker]

Can't multi quote on the phone, but to reply to Stoney and CWG, overtime would go some way to making up for that wages that striking members chose to forego. Why would any boss think that was a good idea?

By the way, I say that as someone who has been on strike before. It was never in my mind that I could make a bit up by getting paid more than my usual rate to do what I would have been doing when I was off.

[danhibees1875]

Can't multi quote on the phone, but to reply to Stoney and CWG, overtime would go some way to making up for that wages that striking members chose to forego. Why would any boss think that was a good idea?

By the way, I say that as someone who has been on strike before. It was never in my mind that I could make a bit up by getting paid more than my usual rate to do what I would have been doing when I was off.

There will be a huge backlog of work to be done, and it'll need to be actioned as quickly as possible. That will probably require overtime to do, and I'd imagine they will get paid for doing it.

The bosses might not want to do it from their viewpoint of paying out similar amounts (presumably they'll make some efficiencies, and having contracted parts out that will mean they're not paying the strikers every penny of what they would have received) and had the streets like this for 2 weeks; but by the end of the strike it will be the best way forward.

[degenerated]

What the union says

No, the blame for this situation lies squarely at the doors of the local government body COSLA and the Scottish Government. It’s important to realise that Unite along with the trade unions rejected a 2 per cent pay offer in March.

So why has it taken five months for COSLA to ‘up’ their offer to 3.5 per cent? The latest paltry offer has also been swiftly rejected at a time when the cost of living crisis is really beginning to bite with energy prices rising through the roof and inflation soaring to 12.3 per cent.

Yes - even council leaders including those in Edinburgh and Glasgow agree with us that this offer is nowhere near good enough. So why even make it when you know it will be rejected?

John Swinney and the Scottish Government can point to its recent announcement of an extra £140m to councils but the bigger picture is that local government has been starved of money for over a decade.

The change in money between 2013-14 and 2019-20 for local government has decreased at more than twice the rate than the Scottish Government’s revenue budget in real terms. That’s a fact.

Local government emerged as the biggest loser from the latest Scottish Government spending review with its funding frozen for the rest of the parliament. That’s also on the Scottish Government.

Now we have the pathetic spectacle of COSLA and the Scottish Government doing a Hokey Cokey dance as they blame each other for this mess. The fact is both of them are equally to blame and it’s a mess of their own doing.

Our members are fed-up with this politicking because all they want is an offer put on the table which is fair and helps them deal with the cost of living crisis hurting families all across Scotland.The Scottish government gave money to COSLA to enable a 5% pay rise, Labour and the Tories voted against that and went with a 3.5% offer instead.

https://www.thenational.scot/news/20629244.snp-slate-labour-tories-selling-out-council-workers-pay-rise/

[J-C]

Shocking that this clowncil went ahead with the tram extension and also the £12m bloody cycleway from Roseburn to Leith, when the roads are a disgrace and they're offering a pittance to the workers, worst run council in Scotland.

[J-C]

See my post above. The GNB leadership blaming the Scottish Government is not that surprising. Im confused about the 'Hokey cokey dance' thing. Im not sure who actually speaks like that...

Surprise surprise an anti SNP person now blame Labour run Edinburgh Clowncil for pay dispute.

[stoneyburn hibs]

Can't multi quote on the phone, but to reply to Stoney and CWG, overtime would go some way to making up for that wages that striking members chose to forego. Why would any boss think that was a good idea?

By the way, I say that as someone who has been on strike before. It was never in my mind that I could make a bit up by getting paid more than my usual rate to do what I would have been doing when I was off.

I should have said that it was building services that I was talking about regarding the overtime ban.
I don't know what is happening regarding the bins.
Apologies.

[danhibees1875]

Shocking that this clowncil went ahead with the tram extension and also the £12m bloody cycleway from Roseburn to Leith, when the roads are a disgrace and they're offering a pittance to the workers, worst run council in Scotland.

Whether they've been done well or not with those projects is up for discussion I'm sure, but tram ways and cyclepaths would seem like inherently good ideas - they are the areas cities should be investing in.

[ronaldo7]

The Scottish government gave money to COSLA to enable a 5% pay rise, Labour and the Tories voted against that and went with a 3.5% offer instead.

https://www.thenational.scot/news/20629244.snp-slate-labour-tories-selling-out-council-workers-pay-rise/

An interesting name popped up in that article. Johanna Baxter, last seen dancing with Tories in 2014 at the after party of Indyref1. I wondered what she got up to next.

Still dancing with the Tories it seems.

[GRA]

Pay them what they deserve. Their workers will, by in large, be in the lowest income category and hit hardest by the current cost of living crisis. We'll realise come the end of August when edinburgh looks like an absolute tip.

[degenerated]

An interesting name popped up in that article. Johanna Baxter, last seen dancing with Tories in 2014 at the after party of Indyref1. I wondered what she got up to next.

Still dancing with the Tories it seems.I'm sure she stood for labour as MSP and got well and truly beaten by SNP. She is now on Labours Scottish Executive Committee and current Vice-Chair of the National Executive Committee.

Given that dancing with the Tories is a pre-requisite for being in Sarwars Scottish Labour branch office then it's hardly a surprise.

[Stairway 2 7]

Pay them what they deserve. Their workers will, by in large, be in the lowest income category and hit hardest by the current cost of living crisis. We'll realise come the end of August when edinburgh looks like an absolute tip.

It's already a tip. Was up town before the game and I've never seen anything like it, tons of rubbish all over the streets. Should never have got like this, they have been underpayed for years

[Itsnoteasy]

It's already a tip. Was up town before the game and I've never seen anything like it, tons of rubbish all over the streets. Should never have got like this, they have been underpayed for years

If there not happy with what is being paid look for something that pays more.

[Stairway 2 7]

If there not happy with what is being paid look for something that pays more.

Or unionise and get paid a fair rate.

[Pretty Boy]

Or unionise and get paid a fair rate.

Yep.

The 'just get a better job' argument doesn't work. If everyone just 'got a better job' then we'd be left with no one to do essential jobs that pay crap rates (and non essential jobs as well come to that). The last few days demonstrates people aren't willing to deal with their own rubbish so if all the bin men went off to become lawyers we'd be toiling.

The last couple of years should have proven that a lot of the people who really keep society going are both underappreciated and underpaid. Cleaners, bin men, retail workers, warehouse pickers etc etc. Time to demand they are paid a fair rate for their labour rather than empty plaudits.

[grunt]

The last couple of years should have proven that a lot of the people the people who really keep society going are both underappreciated and underpaid. Cleaners, bin men, retail workers, warehouse pickers etc etc. Time to demand they are paid a fair rate for their labour rather than empty plaudits.
Great post.

[Stairway 2 7]

Festival bringing in scab workers although it's certainly not working. Ram your 5% increase

https://www.conter.scot/2022/8/19/exclusive-cleaners-hired-to-undermine-strikers-during-edinburgh-festival/

[hibsbollah]

North Bridge this afternoon, rubbish blowing up and down both sides of the street crowded with people, broken glass everywhere.All the rubbish piled up high around the bins which you cant even see. Two more weeks of this in the middle of the festival, doesnt bear thinking about.

[lapsedhibee]

If there not happy with what is being paid look for something that pays more.

:agree: Or marry an heiress.

[hibsbollah]

:agree: Or marry an heiress.

Scratchcards always an option too. See? Capitalism=Choices.

[stu in nottingham]

Yeah there is a documentary about that on Youtube, Naples Mafia controlling all domestic and industrial waste including hospital waste and toxic waste/chemicals which has been dumped on farm land and in neighbourhoods

The Camorra have been dumping toxic industrial and nuclear waste in the Naples area way back since the 1990s.

[marinello59]

Surprise surprise an anti SNP person now blame Labour run Edinburgh Clowncil for pay dispute.

Surprise surprise , people doing the Tories work by deflecting from the Workers valid claim and going down the Thatcherite route of portraying them being motivated than something other than fair treatment.
It’s simple; who’s side are you on? I’ve chosen and it’s not the bosses no matter who they may be. It’s sad seeing some self proclaimed socialists on here base their support on who the employers are.

[hibsbollah]

Surprise surprise , people doing the Tories work by deflecting from the Workers valid claim and going down the Thatcherite route of portraying them being motivated than something other than fair treatment.
It’s simple; who’s side are you on? I’ve chosen and it’s not the bosses no matter who they may be. It’s sad seeing some self proclaimed socialists on here base their support on who the employers are.

Personally i'm completely supportive of the workers in this dispute. I haven't read anybody, self-proclaimed socialist or not, say otherwise on here, have you?

[marinello59]

Personally i'm completely supportive of the workers in this dispute. I haven't read anybody, self-proclaimed socialist or not, say otherwise on here, have you?

The Glasgow bin strikers thread had a couple who were happy to decry the workers as politically motivated against the SNP employers. There have been similar posts on here about the support or otherwise of the SNP strike supporters as being ‘interesting’ , straight out of the anti Union Tory playbook.
Who’s side are you on! :greengrin

[marinello59]

Or unionise and get paid a fair rate.

:agree:
The only way that we can take back real control of our lives from the establishment Governments both sides of the border.

[3pm]

I never knew this was on and I am not here to criticise when folk think they are worth more cash but it's sad to see Edinburgh rubbish strewn at such a great time for the city. 😭

[ronaldo7]

:agree:
The only way that we can take back real control of our lives from the establishment Governments both sides of the border.

When we get over 100 years in government, we can get classified as establishment.

15 years is kindergarten.

[hibsbollah]

The Glasgow bin strikers thread had a couple who were happy to decry the workers as politically motivated against the SNP employers. There have been similar posts on here about the support or otherwise of the SNP strike supporters as being ‘interesting’ , straight out of the anti Union Tory playbook.
Who’s side are you on! :greengrin

I agree with you about the importance of knowing who the real enemies are.

[Paulie Walnuts]

No issues with the bin drivers striking but what an absolute mess the city is already in.

[Ozyhibby]

Completely support striking workers. Restraint has not been shown by bankers, CEO’s etc when it comes to paying themselves. It’s time working people were listened to.


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[J-C]

Whether they've been done well or not with those projects is up for discussion I'm sure, but tram ways and cyclepaths would seem like inherently good ideas - they are the areas cities should be investing in.


When Edinburgh council are skint and paying back the Scottish Government for the tram debacle, continuing with the trams and spending more money on cycleways is shocking considering money is needed elsewhere for things like bin men etc, maybe these vanity projects should've been put on the back burner.

[Sylar]

North Bridge this afternoon, rubbish blowing up and down both sides of the street crowded with people, broken glass everywhere.All the rubbish piled up high around the bins which you cant even see. Two more weeks of this in the middle of the festival, doesnt bear thinking about.

I was in for the festival today and walked from Haymarket to Pleasance, then Nicholson Gardens down to Princes Street (via Cockburn St) and was genuinely shocking how bad things were.

No way it can continue til the end of the festival, surely.

[LunasBoots]

Our buckets weren't picked up a week before the strikes, you can imagine the mess the area is in now.

[J-C]

I was in for the festival today and walked from Haymarket to Pleasance, then Nicholson Gardens down to Princes Street (via Cockburn St) and was genuinely shocking how bad things were.

No way it can continue til the end of the festival, surely.


The bin guys are generally out in force either at night or early morning during the festival due to the amount of garbage daily, I was working yesterday and driving around I've never seen so much rubbish lying around, bins were full to the brim, needs sorted asap for health reasons also as the rats and foxes will be having great time sifting through it all.

[Stairway 2 7]

Some job the lads must do normally in the festival

[LewysGot2]

City is an absolute state.

Folk online saying locals should take their litter home but this time of year there's thousand of non locals most of whom won't realise that there is a strike.

The Council have been ineffective in communicating about this too

[Stairway 2 7]

A group of artists from Edinburgh art Festival organised a litter pick for next week. They have cancelled because the backlash of helping scab.

[Scotty Leither]

Maybe the managers at the Cooncil could go “back to the floor” for a fortnight and empty them themselves?

[Stairway 2 7]

All binmen across Scotland going on strike over 4 days the first the 26th. Scot gov is going to have to increase funding.

Nhs has rejected scot gov offer and are balloting for strike action

[Stairway 2 7]

Cosla to offer 5% can't see it being accepted. Why did it take 5 months to offer this

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-62611176

[Moulin Yarns]

All binmen across Scotland going on strike over 4 days the first the 26th. Scot gov is going to have to increase funding.

Nhs has rejected scot gov offer and are balloting for strike action

Councils could cut other things from their budgets, greenspace maintenance is an easy one, libraries, not so much. My area already reduced the opening hours of libraries. There are some things that are statutory requirements while others are not.

[Moulin Yarns]

Cosla to offer 5% can't see it being accepted. Why did it take 5 months to offer this

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-62611176

Because the government has provided additional funding, while cutting something else, presumably.

[Stairway 2 7]

Councils could cut other things from their budgets, greenspace maintenance is an easy one, libraries, not so much. My area already reduced the opening hours of libraries. There are some things that are statutory requirements while others are not.

Councils are already running on fumes. Government has to step in or the whole of Scotland will be looking like Edinburgh.

[Stairway 2 7]

Because the government has provided additional funding, while cutting something else, presumably.

They only just gave the extra funding now to reach 5%, so a real time cut.

The government also offering the NHS 5% which I assume will soon be rejected

[Ozyhibby]

They only just gave the extra funding now to reach 5%, so a real time cut.

The government also offering the NHS 5% which I assume will soon be rejected

SG working to a fixed budget as well so we will soon reach a stalemate where neither party can do anything. We will be at the mercy of Truss.


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[Stairway 2 7]

SG working to a fixed budget as well so we will soon reach a stalemate where neither party can do anything. We will be at the mercy of Truss.


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That's the nature of being in government working with a budget. Workers wages should be at the top of the list.

As much as I want independence, people voted for devolution and rejected independence. I'm sure that will change but we need to responsibly budget with the tools we have

[Bridge hibs]

They only just gave the extra funding now to reach 5%, so a real time cut.

The government also offering the NHS 5% which I assume will soon be rejectedIt has been rejected, was on social media pages a few days ago, unions are to ballot for industrial action on the 3rd of October

On Monday we closed our consultative ballot on NHS pay.

Today we met with the other unions and professional organisations who represent NHS workers in Scotland.

At the meeting we reported that 91% of our voting members had soundly rejected the Government's pay offer and 83% said they would be prepared to take Industrial Action.

As a result of that unprecedented ballot outcome UNISON is now moving to a formal Industrial Action Ballot on 3 Oct.

[Ozyhibby]

That's the nature of being in government working with a budget. Workers wages should be at the top of the list.

As much as I want independence, people voted for devolution and rejected independence. I'm sure that will change but we need to responsibly budget with the tools we have

The UK govt doesn’t have a fixed budget though. If the UK govt decides it needs to pay workers in England more it can just do so without worrying about it. In Scotland we have to wait and see what they do in England first.


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[Stairway 2 7]

It has been rejected, was on social media pages a few days ago, unions are to ballot for industrial action on the 3rd of October

On Monday we closed our consultative ballot on NHS pay.

Today we met with the other unions and professional organisations who represent NHS workers in Scotland.

At the meeting we reported that 91% of our voting members had soundly rejected the Government's pay offer and 83% said they would be prepared to take Industrial Action.

As a result of that unprecedented ballot outcome UNISON is now moving to a formal Industrial Action Ballot on 3 Oct.
Thanks just reading about it. 90% rejected the offer. Could be a big political story in a time when they are still struggling with covid pressure. Hopefully a deal can be found

https://www.csp.org.uk/news/2022-08-12-pay-offer-rejection-members-scotland-results-ballot-industrial-action

[Stairway 2 7]

The UK govt doesn’t have a fixed budget though. If the UK govt decides it needs to pay workers in England more it can just do so without worrying about it. In Scotland we have to wait and see what they do in England first.


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Such is life though we voted for the status quo to remain. We could have increased council tax to help pay also. But you need to give yourself flexibility if in charge, until things change and we get independence

[hibsbollah]

A group of artists from Edinburgh art Festival organised a litter pick for next week. They have cancelled because the backlash of helping scab.

I think any talk of the S word in relation to small scale community groups or residents getting together to pick up rubbish during a bin strike is beyond ridiculous, to be honest. Need to get things in proportion.

[lucky]

It has been rejected, was on social media pages a few days ago, unions are to ballot for industrial action on the 3rd of October

On Monday we closed our consultative ballot on NHS pay.

Today we met with the other unions and professional organisations who represent NHS workers in Scotland.

At the meeting we reported that 91% of our voting members had soundly rejected the Government's pay offer and 83% said they would be prepared to take Industrial Action.

As a result of that unprecedented ballot outcome UNISON is now moving to a formal Industrial Action Ballot on 3 Oct.

I hope that Unison get enough people to vote in the industrial action ballot. To reach the 40% fresh hold is a real challenge in the NHS as there are lots of different locations and departments across Scotland to organise. It’s time whose in power realise that Britain deserves a pay rise and trying to offer below inflation and around 5% won’t necessary mean workers will accept it. The trade union movement is galvanised and theres a big march and rally in Edinburgh on the 8th September which Cosla and the Scottish Government will be the target more than the detached Westminster one

[danhibees1875]

A group of artists from Edinburgh art Festival organised a litter pick for next week. They have cancelled because the backlash of helping scab.

That's a shame they've been discouraged!

[Bridge hibs]

I hope that Unison get enough people to vote in the industrial action ballot. To reach the 40% fresh hold is a real challenge in the NHS as there are lots of different locations and departments across Scotland to organise. It’s time whose in power realise that Britain deserves a pay rise and trying to offer below inflation and around 5% won’t necessary mean workers will accept it. The trade union movement is galvanised and theres a big march and rally in Edinburgh on the 8th September which Cosla and the Scottish Government will be the target more than the detached Westminster oneI have three Nieces who all work as Nurses, they have had enough, the wards they work in are on their knees, staffing levels are dangerously low, staff sickness with colleagues who have simply pulled the plug and have left. I was speaking to one of my Nieces last week who told me she turned up for shift in the morning in her 35 bedded ward and staffing was her, another Nurse and a CSW, to run a whole ward

This has not improved and as much as she would strike if required she couldnt, she says if it comes down to it then there will be staged walk outs throughout the service but many wont be able to because they simply dont have the staff numbers to do that, they cant even get bank in to cover those shifts. A lot of bank staff that covered her ward were Fife and Borders based but since the car parking fiasco they have now picked up shifts near to where they live.

Bright young lassies with young families who will most likely leave the service very soon, in fact I think the youngest of the three has handed in her notice and is heading abroad

[lucky]

That's a shame they've been discouraged!

No it’s not. If any artist did try and do this then they be quite rightly called out for being a scab and it would effect their careers going forward. The bin men and women don’t want to be on strike but have been taken for mugs by the Scottish Government and Cosla with the failure to put a reasonable offer on the table for them to consider. Whoever at Cosla thought that 3.5% increase was going to accepted need to have a long hard look at themselves. The new improved offer of 5% is not a guarantee especially as most of these workers are not in great money in the first place.

[degenerated]

They only just gave the extra funding now to reach 5%, so a real time cut.

The government also offering the NHS 5% which I assume will soon be rejectedDidn't the council only offer 3.5% though.

[Stairway 2 7]

Didn't the council only offer 3.5% though.

Yes then 5 which will be rejected the same as the NHS. Undervalued staff getting offers of far bellow inflation isn't on

[Stairway 2 7]

I think any talk of the S word in relation to small scale community groups or residents getting together to pick up rubbish during a bin strike is beyond ridiculous, to be honest. Need to get things in proportion.

Disagree. The council has to see the work these people do. If everyone cleaned up the council would hold out longer. Put the bins out on the street, leave the rubbish, let the people see what the workers deal with every night and what edin would look like without them.

[degenerated]

Yes then 5 which will be rejected the same as the NHS. Undervalued staff getting offers of far bellow inflation isn't onThe problem for Scotland is that in order to fund it we need to cut spending elsewhere.

[Stairway 2 7]

The problem for Scotland is that in order to fund it we need to cut spending elsewhere.

Or don't freeze council tax. We have a budget to work with, we can't borrow our way out of it. So yes you either cut somewhere else or raise tax

[degenerated]

Or don't freeze council tax. We have a budget to work with, we can't borrow our way out of it. So yes you either cut somewhere else or raise taxCouncils have the ability to raise council taxes now.

[Stairway 2 7]

Councils have the ability to raise council taxes now.

Exactly and most have confirmed they will raise it now. The snp continually froze it. Council have had less money in real terms every year due to the freezes. They have had to continuously cut.

[degenerated]

Exactly and most have confirmed they will raise it now. The snp continually froze it. Council have had less money in real terms every year due to the freezes. They have had to continuously cut.Perhaps if it hadn't increased near on 50% in the years labour ruled the roost after devolution then that freeze might not have been the vote winner it was.

However, we are where we are with that.

If the solution to raising workers wages in the public sector in line with inflation is to do that through council tax increases then it's going to have a hell of an impact on people's ability to afford energy and food.

[hibsbollah]

Disagree. The council has to see the work these people do. If everyone cleaned up the council would hold out longer. Put the bins out on the street, leave the rubbish, let the people see what the workers deal with every night and what edin would look like without them.

OK, by that logic I will empty my bags out all over the street, to to demonstrate my solidarity.
Real solidarity has nothing to do with performative pish like calling people scabs for picking up rubbish around their local area.

[DaveF]

OK, by that logic I will empty my bags out all over the street, to to demonstrate my solidarity.
Real solidarity has nothing to do with performative pish like calling people scabs for picking up rubbish around their local area.

I often pick up litter when out with the dog as today's teenagers* seem to be hell bent on chucking as much as crap as they can around the streets and woodland.

*Not every teenager obviously.

[Ozyhibby]

I often pick up litter when out with the dog as today's teenagers* seem to be hell bent on chucking as much as crap as they can around the streets and woodland.

*Not every teenager obviously.

And not ‘today’s teenagers’. Litter was a far bigger problem when I was younger than it is now. The 70’s and 80’s were a disgrace for litter lying about the streets. Don’t kid on it was better in your day, it wasn’t. Teenagers these days are far more thoughtful than in days gone by.


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[hibsbollah]

I often pick up litter when out with the dog as today's teenagers* seem to be hell bent on chucking as much as crap as they can around the streets and woodland.

*Not every teenager obviously.

Me too. I generally have a few items of other peoples rubbish stuffed into my pockets after a stot up the Pentlands or wherever, its a habit i picked up from my mum. I just do it without thinking really.

[hibsbollah]

And not ‘today’s teenagers’. Litter was a far bigger problem when I was younger than it is now. The 70’s and 80’s were a disgrace for litter lying about the streets. Don’t kid on it was better in your day, it wasn’t. Teenagers these days are far more thoughtful than in days gone by.


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23191_Post lockdown littering sheet_4.pdf (keepbritaintidy.org) (https://www.keepbritaintidy.org/sites/default/files/resources/23191_Post%20lockdown%20littering%20sheet_4.pdf)
Are you sure? Keep Britain Tidy says littering is 'at an all time high'.

[DaveF]

And not ‘today’s teenagers’. Litter was a far bigger problem when I was younger than it is now. The 70’s and 80’s were a disgrace for litter lying about the streets. Don’t kid on it was better in your day, it wasn’t. Teenagers these days are far more thoughtful than in days gone by.


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It's fine, I don't live is some haze of glorious yesteryear, but it just irks me when I see kids discarding litter without thought. Anyway, back to the main topic...

[grunt]

OK, by that logic I will empty my bags out all over the street, to to demonstrate my solidarity.
Real solidarity has nothing to do with performative pish like calling people scabs for picking up rubbish around their local area.
:agree:

[lyonhibs]

The Scottish government gave money to COSLA to enable a 5% pay rise, Labour and the Tories voted against that and went with a 3.5% offer instead.

https://www.thenational.scot/news/20629244.snp-slate-labour-tories-selling-out-council-workers-pay-rise/

5% as an alternative to 3.5% when inflation is at 10% is like upgrading your chocolate fireguard to a paper one. It would also have been dingied by the Unions, and fair play to them.

[grunt]

5% as an alternative to 3.5% when inflation is at 10% is like upgrading your chocolate fireguard to a paper one. It would also have been dingied by the Unions, and fair play to them.
Citibank forecasting inflation of 18.6% for January.

[Moulin Yarns]

Me too. I generally have a few items of other peoples rubbish stuffed into my pockets after a stot up the Pentlands or wherever, its a habit i picked up from my mum. I just do it without thinking really.

Careful, you will be called a Scab!

[lapsedhibee]

Citibank forecasting inflation of 18.6% for January.

Wheelbarrows may be in short supply next year. Stock up now. https://i.pinimg.com/736x/14/95/59/1495598273fb7efcad5dcaded222b5ec.jpg

[Paul1642]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-62629776

Not a Scottish issue but criminal barristers in England and Wales refuse a 15% pay rise and strike to request 25%. What planet are they living on!

Meanwhile police in England and Wales (and as of a few days ago Scotland too) accept 5%. Mental.

[hibsbollah]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-62629776

Not a Scottish issue but criminal barristers in England and Wales refuse a 15% pay rise and strike to request 25%. What planet are they living on!

Meanwhile police in England and Wales (and as of a few days ago Scotland too) accept 5%. Mental.

A 15% and 25% increase from how much though?
That link suggests their income from legal Aid cases has fallen by 26% since 2006, so maybe its more justified than it looks initially. You cant just look at one years settlement.

[Stairway 2 7]

OK, by that logic I will empty my bags out all over the street, to to demonstrate my solidarity.
Real solidarity has nothing to do with performative pish like calling people scabs for picking up rubbish around their local area.

Wasn't me that was calling them scabs, although i agree people 100% shouldnt be organising mass clean ups. It was shared by the James connoly society and Kirsten Muat of gmb saying this isn't helping as they want the council to see what the city is without them.

[superfurryhibby]

Disagree. The council has to see the work these people do. If everyone cleaned up the council would hold out longer. Put the bins out on the street, leave the rubbish, let the people see what the workers deal with every night and what edin would look like without them.

Guaranteed overtime tidying it up too, once they start back at work.

[degenerated]

5% as an alternative to 3.5% when inflation is at 10% is like upgrading your chocolate fireguard to a paper one. It would also have been dingied by the Unions, and fair play to them.I didn't suggest it shouldn't be dingied. I was more curious as to why when the council were given finding to offer 5% they appear to have offered less.

[Paul1642]

A 15% and 25% increase from how much though?
That link suggests their income from legal Aid cases has fallen by 26% since 2006, so maybe its more justified than it looks initially. You cant just look at one years settlement.

Article goes on to say that Barristers with 0-2 years service are paid 25k before expenses with the medium salary being 79k!

Sounds like they need to revise their pay band structure rather than demand 25% from the public whilst others who already earn much less than them are struggling to get above 5%.

I also imagine that 26% is real time compared with the cost of living rather than an actually decrease. Welcome to the public sector.

[Jack]

Article goes on to say that Barristers with 0-2 years service are paid 25k before expenses with the medium salary being 79k!

Sounds like they need to revise their pay band structure rather than demand 25% from the public whilst others who already earn much less than them are struggling to get above 5%.

I also imagine that 26% is real time compared with the cost of living rather than an actually decrease. Welcome to the public sector.

They don't make their money until the cases have been closed. It means the offer won't kick in for upto 3 years. In the meantime their income from current cases drops further behind due to out of control inflation.

[Pretty Boy]

Wasn't me that was calling them scabs, although i agree people 100% shouldnt be organising mass clean ups. It was shared by the James connoly society and Kirsten Muat of gmb saying this isn't helping as they want the council to see what the city is without them.

I would hope most people can see the difference between dealing with your own rubbish as best you can and not willfully exacerbating a situation and people actively choosing to attend or organise events to do the work of striking workers. The former is absolutely fine and indeed socially responsible, the latter I disagree with on every level.

If I'm out and about on a day to day basis I'll pick up litter as and when I see it. Particularly when I'm out running and see discarded Lucozade bottles or energy gel wrappers. It's a real peeve of mine that fellow runners who can carry these things full suddenly have an inability to continue carrying them when they are empty. No way would I attend any organised mass clean up though, that undermines the visual and practical impact of the strike.

[weecounty hibby]

Didn't the council only offer 3.5% though.
Councils offered 3.5% as it passed at COSLA due to Labour and Tories siding together to vote down the SNP motion of 5%. It’s only now been passed as the COSLA president (SNP) had a casting vote as again the better togethers voted against 3.5. The workers 100% deserve a decent pay rise but sadly I am seeing that the Labour and Tory parties are happy to see this happening as a way to have a pop at the SG. The SG has put 140m in for this rise and asked that councils find the rest. It means that spending plans and timescales will be revised, services might be cut back and jobs may go but as the SG can’t do much about it as Westminster won’t give any more. Perhaps if we didn’t have to spend 600m per year fighting the Tory austerity measures we could channel that towards pay rises for workers

[Iain G]

Wasn't me that was calling them scabs, although i agree people 100% shouldnt be organising mass clean ups. It was shared by the James connoly society and Kirsten Muat of gmb saying this isn't helping as they want the council to see what the city is without them.

Why shouldnt people be organising mass clean ups, the city is a bloody mess and it's hardly hygienic for people!?

[Stairway 2 7]

Why shouldnt people be organising mass clean ups, the city is a bloody mess and it's hardly hygienic for people!?

The same reason as people shouldnt cross pickets or agency workers shouldnt cover striking workers. The strikers only weapon is the state the city will get in if they don't work. Pay the workers properly and they will clean it, shows how much they do.

[Paul1642]

The same reason as people shouldnt cross pickets or agency workers shouldnt cover striking workers. The strikers only weapon is the state the city will get in if they don't work. Pay the workers properly and they will clean it, shows how much they do.

Nonsense. If someone doesn’t want their local community full of litter then that’s their decision to clean it. It the street that my kid was running about in was full of waste id be picking it up too.

[Iain G]

Nonsense. If someone doesn’t want their local community full of litter then that’s their decision to clean it. It the street that my kid was running about in was full of waste id be picking it up too.

Very much so, and its good that people are trying to keep their local areas tidy and safe :agree:

[Stairway 2 7]

Nonsense. If someone doesn’t want their local community full of litter then that’s their decision to clean it. It the street that my kid was running about in was full of waste id be picking it up too.

That's not a mass clean up that's you cleaning your bit. Mass organised cleans completely undermines the actions of the strikers. Would it be OK for mass organised delivery of letters when the royal mail are striking or digging coal to replace striking miners. Don't take away their only weapon, tory behaviour

[degenerated]

Councils offered 3.5% as it passed at COSLA due to Labour and Tories siding together to vote down the SNP motion of 5%. It’s only now been passed as the COSLA president (SNP) had a casting vote as again the better togethers voted against 3.5. The workers 100% deserve a decent pay rise but sadly I am seeing that the Labour and Tory parties are happy to see this happening as a way to have a pop at the SG. The SG has put 140m in for this rise and asked that councils find the rest. It means that spending plans and timescales will be revised, services might be cut back and jobs may go but as the SG can’t do much about it as Westminster won’t give any more. Perhaps if we didn’t have to spend 600m per year fighting the Tory austerity measures we could channel that towards pay rises for workersIf it had happened in April.....26141

[Hibrandenburg]

OK, by that logic I will empty my bags out all over the street, to to demonstrate my solidarity.
Real solidarity has nothing to do with performative pish like calling people scabs for picking up rubbish around their local area.

It's a bit like calling people scabs for taking the car to work because the trains are on strike. I'm a bit militant about the right for workers to carry out industrial action but calling people scabs for cleaning up their own local area is mad.

[Ozyhibby]

If it had happened in April.....26141

Sarwar does seem a little bit less concerned with overflowing bins now that Labour is in control? Or maybe he just doesn’t like Edinburgh?


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[Stairway 2 7]

It's a bit like calling people scabs for taking the car to work because the trains are on strike. I'm a bit militant about the right for workers to carry out industrial action but calling people scabs for cleaning up their own local area is mad.

It's not even similar to be honest, that is getting yourself to work. This was to clean up the royal mile where I doubt they all live. Mass events to do the jobs of strikers is rotten and undermining the strike, because to be honest the council will only be bothered about how up town looks they would hold of for weeks if it was wester hails or Craigmillar

[Stairway 2 7]

Sarwar does seem a little bit less concerned with overflowing bins now that Labour is in control? Or maybe he just doesn’t like Edinburgh?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

People are blaming the new council, I'm not sure who they will blame when the nationwide strike goes ahead.

[Ozyhibby]

People are blaming the new council, I'm not sure who they will blame when the nationwide strike goes ahead.

Wasn’t it Labour who blocked the original 5% offer that may have been accepted?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Stairway 2 7]

Wasn’t it Labour who blocked the original 5% offer that may have been accepted?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes the are morons propped up by the tories in Edinburgh, but the aren't in charge of every council and its a nation wide strike. 5% is a p take also and will be booted.

[Ozyhibby]

Yes the are morons propped up by the tories in Edinburgh, but the aren't in charge of every council and its a nation wide strike. 5% is a p take also and will be booted.

It is now but when it was originally proposed it may have been accepted and this could all have been avoided?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Hibrandenburg]

It's not even similar to be honest, that is getting yourself to work. This was to clean up the royal mile where I doubt they all live. Mass events to do the jobs of strikers is rotten and undermining the strike, because to be honest the council will only be bothered about how up town looks they would hold of for weeks if it was wester hails or Craigmillar

It's the same but different. People were "undermining" the rail strikes by organising car pools and even minibuses. A scab is not someone who gets organised with others to help their community, a scab is someone who crosses a picket line for finacial reward.

[Stairway 2 7]

It is now but when it was originally proposed it may have been accepted and this could all have been avoided?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It was proposed 2 weeks ago it was never getting accepted. It's nationwide from next week so scot gov will need to step in. Post office and the NHS still to strike. There will have to be tax rises in the higher bands

[Stairway 2 7]

It's the same but different. People were "undermining" the rail strikes by organising car pools and even minibuses. A scab is not someone who gets organised with others to help their community, a scab is someone who crosses a picket line for finacial reward.

We think differently and so do the unions. Getting a mass clean up of the royal mile blunts the strikes effects. Let the councilors step over the filth and give the workers a fair deal.

[Ozyhibby]

It was proposed 2 weeks ago it was never getting accepted. It's nationwide from next week so scot gov will need to step in. Post office and the NHS still to strike. There will have to be tax rises in the higher bands

I agree that if England continue to stonewall workers down there then we will be left with no choice but to raise taxes to pay for rises.
We don’t have the same options open to us that taxpayers in England have.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Paul1642]

We think differently and so do the unions. Getting a mass clean up of the royal mile blunts the strikes effects. Let the councilors step over the filth and give the workers a fair deal.

The the message is “we aren’t going to clean up the mess and neither can anyone else, enjoy living in filth? I took a bunch of bin bags to the East Lothian tip to avoid my daughter playing in a garden full of rotten waste. Bloody scab that I am.

[Paul1642]

Yes the are morons propped up by the tories in Edinburgh, but the aren't in charge of every council and its a nation wide strike. 5% is a p take also and will be booted.

Every council area is Scotland is striking over the next few weeks so I’m not sure it’s fair to blame only Edinburgh city council.

Tory and Labour supporters are shouting that they are the good guys and it’s all the SNPs fault. SNP supporters the opposite.

The truth of the matter is that most politicians don’t give a rats about any of us and those who tell themselves that the party they support are different to the rest are delusional. They all just want to be re-elected / elected and will each handle this situation in the way that they believe will make that happen without caring a jot about the garbage collectors or any other public sector worker.

[He's here!]

Drove through town this evening. Most of Princes St is a sorry enough state these days but the litter scattered everywhere makes it look twice as dismal.

[Iain G]

It's not even similar to be honest, that is getting yourself to work. This was to clean up the royal mile where I doubt they all live. Mass events to do the jobs of strikers is rotten and undermining the strike, because to be honest the council will only be bothered about how up town looks they would hold of for weeks if it was wester hails or Craigmillar

Good on them for doing so! If people withdraw their labour from an essential service you can hardly complain if people take matters into their own hands

[Ozyhibby]

Good on them for doing so! If people withdraw their labour from an essential service you can hardly complain if people take matters into their own hands

I don’t think they have to worry about people cleaning the streets. It’s only been a few days and the rubbish is piling up.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[hibsbollah]

We think differently and so do the unions. Getting a mass clean up of the royal mile blunts the strikes effects. Let the councilors step over the filth and give the workers a fair deal.

What do the unions think? Have you got a link to a statement? Because i cant see much anywhere about how Unite would feel if community groups got involved in clean ups. In fact, now i think about I cant remember seeing any link to this alleged 'festival actors warned off from scabbing' story.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Day by day the city looks significantly worse.

This is going to be absolute chaos if this goes on until the end of the month.

[Stairway 2 7]

What do the unions think? Have you got a link to a statement? Because i cant see much anywhere about how Unite would feel if community groups got involved in clean ups. In fact, now i think about I cant remember seeing any link to this alleged 'festival actors warned off from scabbing' story.

It was all over twitter at the weekend. Edinburgh art Festival took down their posts as they were filled with abuse. Someone took screenshot before it was deleted here, wed 23rd at St giles Catherine which I'm sure wouldn't be all their local area. Just getting it nice for the tourists and the city chambers.
https://mobile.twitter.com/our_edinburgh/status/1561041539576565763

Kirsten had it as her insta story and is just one person not the word of the union I agree

What I don't agree with is the boy from civerinos said he cleaned outside his shop and covered up the nearest bin. He's got a lot of abuse for it, which I disagree with as he's just looking after his shop. There was actually a couple of councillors that thanked him but I've just noticed they have deleted the tweets
https://mobile.twitter.com/Civerinos/status/1560602770260070400


@JimSlaven

“Whosoever enables the employer to continue his business without the striking workers is scabbing upon those workers.”
- #JamesConnolly.

#Edinburgh Don’t Scab.
Don’t pretend it’s community activism, art or hide behind technicalities.
Don’t cross a picket line & don’t scab

of the men who helped the scab to commit his act of treason?”
- #JamesConnolly

[hibsbollah]

It was all over twitter at the weekend. Edinburgh art Festival took down their posts as they were filled with abuse. Someone took screenshot before it was deleted here, wed 23rd at St giles Catherine which I'm sure wouldn't be all their local area. Just getting it nice for the tourists and the city chambers.
https://mobile.twitter.com/our_edinburgh/status/1561041539576565763

Kirsten had it as her insta story and is just one person not the word of the union I agree

What I don't agree with is the boy from civerinos said he cleaned outside his shop and covered up the nearest bin. He's got a lot of abuse for it, which I disagree with as he's just looking after his shop. There was actually a couple of councillors that thanked him but I've just noticed they have deleted the tweets
https://mobile.twitter.com/Civerinos/status/1560602770260070400


@JimSlaven

“Whosoever enables the employer to continue his business without the striking workers is scabbing upon those workers.”
- #JamesConnolly.

#Edinburgh Don’t Scab.
Don’t pretend it’s community activism, art or hide behind technicalities.
Don’t cross a picket line & don’t scab

of the men who helped the scab to commit his act of treason?”
- #JamesConnolly

So some folk abusing people on Twitter. There is no subject that doesn’t have people being abusive to others on Twitter. And the James Connolly Society Twitter account doesn’t represent the views of James Connolly or those who might know what he might have thought of this he was alive. Nothing from the union involved.

So it’s just a lot of ill informed wind and pish, probably from people that aren’t even involved in the dispute, seemingly.

[ronaldo7]

It was all over twitter at the weekend. Edinburgh art Festival took down their posts as they were filled with abuse. Someone took screenshot before it was deleted here, wed 23rd at St giles Catherine which I'm sure wouldn't be all their local area. Just getting it nice for the tourists and the city chambers.
https://mobile.twitter.com/our_edinburgh/status/1561041539576565763

Kirsten had it as her insta story and is just one person not the word of the union I agree

What I don't agree with is the boy from civerinos said he cleaned outside his shop and covered up the nearest bin. He's got a lot of abuse for it, which I disagree with as he's just looking after his shop. There was actually a couple of councillors that thanked him but I've just noticed they have deleted the tweets
https://mobile.twitter.com/Civerinos/status/1560602770260070400


@JimSlaven

“Whosoever enables the employer to continue his business without the striking workers is scabbing upon those workers.”
- #JamesConnolly.

#Edinburgh Don’t Scab.
Don’t pretend it’s community activism, art or hide behind technicalities.
Don’t cross a picket line & don’t scab

of the men who helped the scab to commit his act of treason?”
- #JamesConnolly

The guy from civerinos was cleaning the beach area in front of his shop 3 weeks ago, well before the strike. It's something he decided to do, lifting glass, and other rubbish, to make it safe for children visiting the following day.

[Stairway 2 7]

So some folk abusing people on Twitter. There is no subject that doesn’t have people being abusive to others on Twitter. And the James Connolly Society Twitter account doesn’t represent the views of James Connolly or those who might know what he might have thought of this he was alive. Nothing from the union involved.

So it’s just a lot of ill informed wind and pish, probably from people that aren’t even involved in the dispute, seemingly.

They advertised it then deleted all the posts about it because of that wind and pish. Good. I'm sure they were well meaning but an organised event to clean up the old town is pish. Same as Edinburgh fringe bringing in scab workers. Although none of it is helping it seems by the streets. From the writing of Connolly its obvious what side he would be on.

Would you be happy to go to an organised clean up

[Stairway 2 7]

The guy from civerinos was cleaning the beach area in front of his shop 3 weeks ago, well before the strike. It's something he decided to do, lifting glass, and other rubbish, to make it safe for children visiting the following day.

To be fair he's took it well. He's shared loads of things supporting the strikers

[Pretty Boy]

One of the things I can't get my head around, and I've read and heard it a lot, is people stating they support the strikers but also want the council to put 'contingency plans' in place.

What are these contingency plans? If it's a desire for temp workers or private companies to cross a picket line and empty bins and clean the streets then that is scabbing by any measure. That means the statement from these people that they support the strikers is bollocks.

I notice the CWU are distributing posters for people to stick on their windows and doors on the days the posties are striking this month and next. These state the occupant wishes to receive no mail on these days as it will be delivered by managers who have chosen to cross a picket line. I wonder how many people who state they support these strikes will get involved or how many will express their support but still take their mail as their support only lasts if it means no real inconvenience to them.

[hibsbollah]

They advertised it then deleted all the posts about it because of that wind and pish. Good. I'm sure they were well meaning but an organised event to clean up the old town is pish. Same as Edinburgh fringe bringing in scab workers. Although none of it is helping it seems by the streets. From the writing of Connolly its obvious what side he would be on.

Would you be happy to go to an organised clean up

I think James Connolly would know what a scab was, yes. I also suspect he would be flabbergasted by some of the total nonsense masquerading as ‘news’ on modern social media. And how some people seem to rely on hearsay to educate themselves.

You said a few posts ago the Union involved had a position on this, and that Hibrandenburg was at odds with that. It now appears there’s no actual evidence of that at all.

[Pretty Boy]

Incidentally I see the Greens, or the youth wing and a local councillor at any rate, have withdrawn from an organised litter pick at Portobello Beach on Sunday and will be joining a picket at the Seafield tip instead.

[Stairway 2 7]

I think James Connolly would know what a scab was, yes. I also suspect he would be flabbergasted by some of the total nonsense masquerading as ‘news’ on modern social media. And how some people seem to rely on hearsay to educate themselves.

You said a few posts ago the Union involved had a position on this, and that Hibrandenburg was at odds with that. It now appears there’s no actual evidence of that at all.

Come off it your talking to me about believing stuff we had a big back and forth a few times because you were doubtful the bucha massacre happened, even when I linked you eye witnesses and satellite surveillance.

Connoly said Whosoever enables the employer to continue his business without the striking workers is scabbing upon those workers.”
They are helping the Edinburgh Council waste department run

Would you go to an organised clean up

[Stairway 2 7]

Incidentally I see the Greens, or the youth wing and a local councillor at any rate, have withdrawn from an organised litter pick at Portobello Beach on Sunday and will be joining a picket at the Seafield tip instead.

Good on them. My 3 mates are on the picket line down Seafield where they work. They don't want to be striking, but things are at breaking point

[hibsbollah]

Come off it your talking to me about believing stuff we had a big back and forth a few times because you were doubtful the bucha massacre happened, even when I linked you eye witnesses and satellite surveillance.

Connoly said Whosoever enables the employer to continue his business without the striking workers is scabbing upon those workers.”
They are helping the Edinburgh Council waste department run

Would you go to an organised clean up



Yes, I’m off down the Royal Mile right now with my marigold gloves and disinfectant :aok:

[Lendo]

I was out trying to tidy up a bit of my street in Abbeyhill earlier where rubbish was overflowing. Pointless exercise I suspect but I hate saying it like that. Hopefully I’m not going to get a doing for crossing the picket line.

[Moulin Yarns]

It was proposed 2 weeks ago it was never getting accepted. It's nationwide from next week so scot gov will need to step in. Post office and the NHS still to strike. There will have to be tax rises in the higher bands

When do you expect the council tax to rise? How will a rise in council tax benefit the striking bin men just now?

[Stairway 2 7]

When do you expect the council tax to rise? How will a rise in council tax benefit the striking bin men just now?

Well it obviously doesn't now. But its been frozen for many years it should have rose in line to increase wages by inflation

[Stairway 2 7]

Well done the young greens, Unite show there support to it

@LYGreens
UPDATE: Due to the ongoing bin strike in Edinburgh, both LYG and Cllr Mumford feel it is inappropriate for us to carry out a beach clean, as we fully support the strike. We planned the event far in advance of the strike, so we will go ahead with the social aspect
Instead of picking up litter, we are planning to make s’mores, followed by joining the picket line at Seafield Recycling Centre from 7-8pm. We have updated the time to 5pm and will now meet on King’s Place near the Boathouse Pub


Unite CEC Branch
@UniteCECbranch
·
2h
Replying to
@LYGreens
Appreciate this ✊ see you on the picket line

[grunt]

@JimSlaven

“Whosoever enables the employer to continue his business without the striking workers is scabbing upon those workers.”
- #JamesConnolly.



Jim Slaven! You can certainly pick them!

[Stairway 2 7]

Jim Slaven! You can certainly pick them!

It was a connoly quote I was more after I certainly pick him, good hibby

[Stairway 2 7]

https://mobile.twitter.com/UniteCECbranch/status/1561685497101049858

@UniteCECbranch
·
9h
Bankhead Depot on day 5 #edinburghbinstrikes with a clear message on the latest 5% offer.

#3 Fifty-five percent of local government workers are paid less than £25K a year. Between 72% and 78% are paid less than the UK average wage


Seafield Depot on day 5 of #edinburghbinstrikes.

#2 It's on the Scottish Government to resolve this, not a single local council. It is a national dispute. Scot Gov must fund COSLA to provide a fair pay offer

Points to clarify today: #1 The dispute is over ALL council worker pay in Scotland. Our strikers are fighting for care workers, social workers, cleaners, janitors, librarians, parks workers, pupil support assistants..

[Moulin Yarns]

Well done the young greens, Unite show there support to it

@LYGreens
UPDATE: Due to the ongoing bin strike in Edinburgh, both LYG and Cllr Mumford feel it is inappropriate for us to carry out a beach clean, as we fully support the strike. We planned the event far in advance of the strike, so we will go ahead with the social aspect
Instead of picking up litter, we are planning to make s’mores, followed by joining the picket line at Seafield Recycling Centre from 7-8pm. We have updated the time to 5pm and will now meet on King’s Place near the Boathouse Pub


Unite CEC Branch
@UniteCECbranch
·
2h
Replying to
@LYGreens
Appreciate this ✊ see you on the picket line

So the beach clean was something planned before any strike. But because of the strike it is cancelled. Just makes it worse.

[Stairway 2 7]

So the beach clean was something planned before any strike. But because of the strike it is cancelled. Just makes it worse.

Don't want to undermine the strike good on them, they will be welcome on the picket

[tamig]

I didn't suggest it shouldn't be dingied. I was more curious as to why when the council were given finding to offer 5% they appear to have offered less.

Maybe so they could waste the spare cash on ludicrous schemes such as Spaces for People?

[Iain G]

I feel like I have time travelled to the 1970's on this thread, and not in a fun way! Budget-Maggie is only weeks away now so expecting the unions and her to kill off the UK as a nice place to live by Christmas time...

[Iain G]

Don't want to undermine the strike good on them, they will be welcome on the picket

Should the striking bin men be cleaning the beach in the first place? If not then this is just a political stunt by the greens by pulling out of the beach clean that has been organised weeks before that has nothing to do with binmen and strikes and all to do with protection of wildlife and humans... 🤷🏻

[degenerated]

Councils offered 3.5% as it passed at COSLA due to Labour and Tories siding together to vote down the SNP motion of 5%. It’s only now been passed as the COSLA president (SNP) had a casting vote as again the better togethers voted against 3.5. The workers 100% deserve a decent pay rise but sadly I am seeing that the Labour and Tory parties are happy to see this happening as a way to have a pop at the SG. The SG has put 140m in for this rise and asked that councils find the rest. It means that spending plans and timescales will be revised, services might be cut back and jobs may go but as the SG can’t do much about it as Westminster won’t give any more. Perhaps if we didn’t have to spend 600m per year fighting the Tory austerity measures we could channel that towards pay rises for workers

Labour had tabled an amendment during this vote for any offer to be delayed. This also failed to pass despite support from their better together pals.

[Moulin Yarns]

Should the striking bin men be cleaning the beach in the first place? If not then this is just a political stunt by the greens by pulling out of the beach clean that has been organised weeks before that has nothing to do with binmen and strikes and all to do with protection of wildlife and humans... 🤷🏻

Aye, the council would not be doing a litter pick of the beech, they will always be community led.

[danhibees1875]

I don't think a few organised clean ups around the city will undermine the strike all that much. I get that every litter helps from the strikers perspective though but other people have their interests to look out for also, as well as trying to limit the health hazards that could come to city through attracting vermin. It's clearly happening to a degree between good samaritan/scabs and private companies as various streets fluctuate each day as to how much a mess they are - Hunters square looked better today than it did on Thursday, but still a mess and not befitting of a world heritage site.
Residents aren't going to have their bins picked up over the period which means rota pick ups are every 4 weeks rather than 2 - that's going to be noticed regardless and anyone who didn't appreciate the work that bin men and street cleaners do (which were few and far between I'd say) will still see it plainly in front of them as their lives are impacted by the strike.

The Fringe and art festivals that have been referenced here are once a year events that were decimated the last 2 years due to Covid. A clean and friendly Edinburgh helps ensure people are encouraged to visit, and revisit each year, bringing in loads to the economy as well as ensuring these world class festivals stay on our doorstep. The choice to strike during August was a calculated one to maximise impact of the strike without regard to the festivals and the impact on them and all the other businesses that take August as their chance to maximise income. I don't think anyone should be hounded or abused for subsequently organising to try to do a little bit to mitigate that impact on themselves and their community.
I love Edinburgh, and I especially love it during August. I want it to be as perfect as possible for visitors at this time so they can see it in all it's glory - not in its current state.

I don't know what the magic % increase is that brings everything back to normality but getting there sooner rather than later would be best for everyone so fingers crossed that's what happens and the bin men et al get the pay reward they need and see they've got the respect they deserve from the city residents.

[Stairway 2 7]

Scottish Council funding has dropped 4.2% in real terms since NS took power. Both the snp and the tory propped up Labour Council have fault

https://archive.ph/lfQkw

[Stairway 2 7]

The NHS strike could make the bin strikes look miniscule. More and more agency staff being used

https://mobile.twitter.com/AlexRowleyFife/status/1561719572067241986

[grunt]

Was in the High Street last night. The place is a disgusting mess. Needs sorted pronto.

[ronaldo7]

Scottish Council funding has dropped 4.2% in real terms since NS took power. Both the snp and the tory propped up Labour Council have fault

https://archive.ph/lfQkw

The Scottish Government’s resource funding fell by 6% between 2010–11 and 2017–18, driven by cuts to block grant funding from the UK government. Funding has since increased, largely driven by increases in the block grant, with ‘core’ resource funding set to be 3% higher in the coming financial year, 2021–22, than in 2010–11. However, this still represents a reduction of 2% per person over this 11-year period.

Funding for the last couple of years will be skewed by Covid cash.

[Smartie]

The Scottish Government’s resource funding fell by 6% between 2010–11 and 2017–18, driven by cuts to block grant funding from the UK government. Funding has since increased, largely driven by increases in the block grant, with ‘core’ resource funding set to be 3% higher in the coming financial year, 2021–22, than in 2010–11. However, this still represents a reduction of 2% per person over this 11-year period.

Funding for the last couple of years will be skewed by Covid cash.

Is the block grant not affected in some way by the oil price?

So, we got less for a few years towards the end of the last decade (to the great joy of those who liked to laugh at the oil component of the 2014 independence white paper) but will it not likely rise a bit in the near future as a result of prices being where they have been over the past few months?

Meaning that with more coming in, there should be the possibility to accommodate some pay demands?

[Paul1642]

The NHS strike could make the bin strikes look miniscule. More and more agency staff being used

https://mobile.twitter.com/AlexRowleyFife/status/1561719572067241986

What would an NHS strike look like on the front line. Surely a&e, ambulances and other front line services cant strike?

Would something along the lines of the Police Scotland work to rule action seen last month would be more appropriate. Hit the organisation and give the bosses a giant headache without taking essential help away from the public.

[ronaldo7]

Is the block grant not affected in some way by the oil price?

So, we got less for a few years towards the end of the last decade (to the great joy of those who liked to laugh at the oil component of the 2014 independence white paper) but will it not likely rise a bit in the near future as a result of prices being where they have been over the past few months?

Meaning that with more coming in, there should be the possibility to accommodate some pay demands?

Taken from Scot gov finance section.

The block grant includes money the UK gov has raised through fuel duty, oil and gas receipts, income tax, national insurance, corporation tax, APD, VAT, tax on alcohol and cigarettes, inheritance tax, and capital gains tax.

The amount each year is calculated as a population share of changes in spending on public services devolved to Scotland.

For all taxes set, raised or assigned in Scotland, the block grant is reduced.

[Stairway 2 7]

What would an NHS strike look like on the front line. Surely a&e, ambulances and other front line services cant strike?

Would something along the lines of the Police Scotland work to rule action seen last month would be more appropriate. Hit the organisation and give the bosses a giant headache without taking essential help away from the public.

It's mixed. A large number can strike as well as support services ect. But front line nurses cannot, they can work contracted hours which would be a huge drop in overall hours worked.

I can't see the snp wanting to go head to head with the NHS, not very good optics

[Bridge hibs]

What would an NHS strike look like on the front line. Surely a&e, ambulances and other front line services cant strike?

Would something along the lines of the Police Scotland work to rule action seen last month would be more appropriate. Hit the organisation and give the bosses a giant headache without taking essential help away from the public.

STRIKE action could hit Fife’s hospitals and health centres with NHS staff across the country being asked to walk out over pay.

Unison said that members should reject the Scottish Government’s offer of a five per cent rise, arguing it’s not enough with inflation nearer 10 per cent.

Those being balloted over potential industrial action include nurses, cleaners, NHS24 staff and ambulance crews.

Wilma Brown, chair of the Unison Scotland health committee, said: “A five per cent pay increase across the board just doesn’t cut it and the Scottish Government need to understand how angry we are.

[Bridge hibs]

Scottish NHS Doctors could also strike

Now Scottish doctors threaten to strike over NHS pay row: 80% say they are prepared to take industrial action unless 4.5% offer is upped

[Stairway 2 7]

The bishop of Durham was saying: ‘I identify with the issues, but I don’t think strikes are the answer,’” Lynch says. “But what is the answer? Do we pray or play tiddlywinks? What is there for working people to do if they’re not organised?”'https://theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/aug/23/mick-lynch-rmt-work-dignity-union-power
@zoesqwilliams

[Iain G]

The bishop of Durham was saying: ‘I identify with the issues, but I don’t think strikes are the answer,’” Lynch says. “But what is the answer? Do we pray or play tiddlywinks? What is there for working people to do if they’re not organised?”'https://theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/aug/23/mick-lynch-rmt-work-dignity-union-power
@zoesqwilliams

Find a job in the private sector maybe? 😈😉

[Stairway 2 7]

Find a job in the private sector maybe? 😈

Be great if everyone did that eh, then the population would be dying in huge numbers and our streets would be a tip. Yet more tory chat hurrah

[Ozyhibby]

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/opinion/columnists/edinburgh-councils-labour-leadership-and-their-tory-and-lib-dem-friends-are-to-blame-for-rubbish-piling-up-in-streets-angus-robertson-msp-3815259

Spot on.[emoji106]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[hibsbollah]

I’m in town now, it’s surely going to take weeks rather than days to clear up the backlog of rubbish that’s built up. It’s really got me thinking about single use plastics. Small firms really need to be incentivized to do something about packaging.

[Sylar]

I’m in town now, it’s surely going to take weeks rather than days to clear up the backlog of rubbish that’s built up. It’s really got me thinking about single use plastics. Small firms really need to be incentivized to do something about packaging.

I also thought about the sense in promoters continuing to hand out flyers for various events in light of the announcement of the strikes - the majority of waste I seen were either discarded alcohol vessels or flyers!

[Stairway 2 7]

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/opinion/columnists/edinburgh-councils-labour-leadership-and-their-tory-and-lib-dem-friends-are-to-blame-for-rubbish-piling-up-in-streets-angus-robertson-msp-3815259

Spot on.[emoji106]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Who's he going to blame tomorrow when they strike all over Scotland and in snp council areas, or what about when the NHS strike ect ect. 5% isn't enough

[Stairway 2 7]

I also thought about the sense in promoters continuing to hand out flyers for various events in light of the announcement of the strikes - the majority of waste I seen were either discarded alcohol vessels or flyers!

I think it'll generally be the performers themselves that are giving them out. They will have paid for them so will be wanting them given out unfortunately

[hibsbollah]

I also thought about the sense in promoters continuing to hand out flyers for various events in light of the announcement of the strikes - the majority of waste I seen were either discarded alcohol vessels or flyers!

Some individuals are behaving like dicks regardless of solutions, well dressed young festival goer just balancing her half empty coffee cup on top of what used to be a bin covered with bin bags...You may as well just chuck it over the pavement because that's where it's going to be in about thirty seconds ,#rage

[Sylar]

I think it'll generally be the performers themselves that are giving them out. They will have paid for them so will be wanting them given out unfortunately

I understand, and I don't intend my post to pass blame in any way - these folks need to make a living afterall. It's just unfortunate that it's adding to an already dire situation.

[Stairway 2 7]

I understand, and I don't intend my post to pass blame in any way - these folks need to make a living afterall. It's just unfortunate that it's adding to an already dire situation.

Oh no I agree, it's probably the people's fault that take them if they aren't going to keep them but just throw on the ground

[grunt]

Who's he going to blame tomorrow when they strike all over Scotland and in snp council areas, or what about when the NHS strike ect ect. 5% isn't enough
It's all very well saying "5% isn't enough", but what do you suggest? Who is going to magic up some money to pay them more?

[Moulin Yarns]

I also thought about the sense in promoters continuing to hand out flyers for various events in light of the announcement of the strikes - the majority of waste I seen were either discarded alcohol vessels or flyers!

And some fringe shows were going to help clean the flyers from the High Street, but were being called scabs. Surely all they were going to do was clear the mess they created.

[Scouse Hibee]

Some smart erse has taken to dumping their black bags of rubbish outside our shop, probably thinking we will get our waste contractor to remove them 😡

[Just Alf]

And some fringe shows were going to help clean the flyers from the High Street, but were being called scabs. Surely all they were going to do was clear the mess they created.Yup, a company was hired specifically to clean up the flyers every night.

[Stairway 2 7]

It's all very well saying "5% isn't enough", but what do you suggest? Who is going to magic up some money to pay them more?

Don't freeze council tax for decade's, put up the highest tax band like they said they would.

[grunt]

Don't freeze council tax for decade's, put up the highest tax band like they said they would.No, what would you do now?

Otherwise you're just saying, "well I wouldn't start from here", which as we all know is a huge cop out.

[Stairway 2 7]

And some fringe shows were going to help clean the flyers from the High Street, but were being called scabs. Surely all they were going to do was clear the mess they created.

A company that usually was hired to just collect flyers kerr cleaning, was told to increase their numbers and clean litter too. Scab workforce to undermine the striking workers. Which side are you on boys

[Stairway 2 7]

No, what would you do now?

Otherwise you're just saying, "well I wouldn't start from here", which as we all know is a huge cop out.

What so they aren't going to take responsibility for the mess that has been created by slashing Council budgets for over a decade. They councils are in an unenviable position now where they have to try and find it.

The government could end this tomorrow if they give COSLA more money. The money will have to come from cuts elsewhere as workers pay should take precedent. The councils can recoup some now that at last they can increase council tax. The government can recoup it by increasing the highest tax band

[grunt]

The government could end this tomorrow if they give COSLA more money. The money will have to come from cuts elsewhere as workers pay should take precedent. The councils can recoup some now that at last they can increase council tax. The government can recoup it by increasing the highest tax band
Ok. So what would you cut? Close some hospitals? Or some schools? Remove funding from Mental Health care? Cancel child poverty action plans?

[grunt]

What so they aren't going to take responsibility for the mess that has been created by slashing Council budgets for over a decade. They councils are in an unenviable position now where they have to try and find it.
I'm pretty sure we agreed earlier in this thread that the reduction in Council budgets was due to reduction in the block grant from Uk Gov? So perhaps it is they who should "take responsibility for the mess"? Chance and a fine thing.

[Stairway 2 7]

Ok. So what would you cut? Close some hospitals? Or some schools? Remove funding from Mental Health care? Cancel child poverty action plans?

That is the job of the government to make a budget that works best for its people. You listing the extremes isn't sensible. There is going to always be a sliding scale of importance and the lowest paid state workers should be near the top

[Stairway 2 7]

I'm pretty sure we agreed earlier in this thread that the reduction in Council budgets was due to reduction in the block grant from Uk Gov? So perhaps it is they who should "take responsibility for the mess"? Chance and a fine thing.

So we sit back and watch council budgets drop or do we raise tax in line with the cuts. We can't just keep increasing the surplus and borrowing even if we are independent. More tax money is needed

[grunt]

That is the job of the government to make a budget that works best for its people. You listing the extremes isn't sensible. There is going to always be a sliding scale of importance and the lowest paid state workers should be near the topNo idea then?

[grunt]

More tax money is neededI agree. But both the Tory leadership hopefuls - who will be in a position to decide on this - are both arguing for tax cuts?

[Stairway 2 7]

I agree. But both the Tory leadership hopefuls - who will be in a position to decide on this - are both arguing for tax cuts?

Scotland can increase its highest tax band

[Stairway 2 7]

No idea then?

What your wanting me to put out a budget on my phone 😆. So when the NHS go on strike they will just say we can pay more because that is less elsewhere full stop. If they can't work a budget they shouldn't be in charge to be honest

[Paul1642]

Don't freeze council tax for decade's, put up the highest tax band like they said they would.

Depends on where they draw the line. I’m paying £240 a month in a band E property which was bought for, and is till worth much less than many band D property’s. I certainly can’t afford a rise right now. Their was a recent grant, I think covid related, which they only gave to band A-D so they presumably be believe band E to be high.

If they are going to consider that then they need to modernise the banding system which is not going to happen any time soon.

[Ozyhibby]

That is the job of the government to make a budget that works best for its people. You listing the extremes isn't sensible. There is going to always be a sliding scale of importance and the lowest paid state workers should be near the top

The SG made money available, the Labour/Tory council decided not to offer it to them. Now there is bad blood and we are in a worse situation.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Stairway 2 7]

The SG made money available, the Labour/Tory council decided not to offer it to them. Now there is bad blood and we are in a worse situation.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

They made money for a 5% increase last Friday when the debate has been going for months. Workers from all over Scotland will be striking tomorrow, even in snp run councils as it wasn't enough

[Stairway 2 7]

Depends on where they draw the line. I’m paying £240 a month in a band E property which was bought for, and is till worth much less than many band D property’s. I certainly can’t afford a rise right now. Their was a recent grant, I think covid related, which they only gave to band A-D so they presumably be believe band E to be high.

If they are going to consider that then they need to modernise the banding system which is not going to happen any time soon.

They have been talking about modernisation for 10 years but zilch has happened and it needs to

[grunt]

... it wasn't enough

I've got deja vu all over again!

[Paul1642]

They have been talking about modernisation for 10 years but zilch has happened and it needs to

Political minefield which politicians of all parties would rather play its safe to avoid backlash rather than sort a long outdated system.

Just like everything, it’s about doing what wins votes rather than doing what’s for the best.

[Pretty Boy]

They have been talking about modernisation for 10 years but zilch has happened and it needs to

Council tax reform was one of the big SNP promises when they came to power over a decade ago, same as land reform. Neither seem to be particularly pressing though. In the case of the former it's probably because it's a bit of a political nightmare that could cost votes and no political party wants that, even one that has supporters who insist they don't play politics.

I'm not really sure what the point in the powers to raise income tax is either. A lot of tinkering in the middle bands but with a top rate only 1% above that in England it seems something of a wasted opportunity.

It's hardly an SNP exclusive problem though. Peter Hain was calling for a 'super tax' on the rich 20 years ago and was promptly slapped down by Blair and Brown. Tax rises are rarely popular even when they would be directly or indirectly beneficial to a lot of the people who oppose them as a point of principle.

[weecounty hibby]

The places where tax rises are a must are the super rich. More billionaires in this country now than there was pre covid. I'm sure I read that there are 200ish people in the UK who have a combined wealth of 700ish billions. ****ing immoral. Big tax hits on the utilities companies. They are paying billions in dividends to shareholders while pumping ***** onto beaches and people can't afford heating. Workers deserve decent pay deals but we can't then hit them with tax increases at the same time.

[Pretty Boy]

Loosely related to this if you want to see a company behaving despicably look no further than Royal Mail.

Currently offering management a bonus in their October pay but only if they have a 100% attendance between now and 31st October. So essentially offering financial incentives for members of their staff to cross picket lines whilst also penalising those who may have family emergencies or illness. ****bags.

[weecounty hibby]

Loosely related to this if you want to see a company behaving despicably look no further than Royal Mail.

Currently offering management a bonus in their October pay but only if they have a 100% attendance between now and 31st October. So essentially offering financial incentives for members of their staff to cross picket lines whilst also penalising those who may have family emergencies or illness. ****bags.

Another privatised company. These companies should never have been sold off. They needed to be modernised and made more efficient but selling them off was like pawning all the family silver for a quick buck and never being able to go back and collect it again

[Paul1642]

The places where tax rises are a must are the super rich. More billionaires in this country now than there was pre covid. I'm sure I read that there are 200ish people in the UK who have a combined wealth of 700ish billions. ****ing immoral. Big tax hits on the utilities companies. They are paying billions in dividends to shareholders while pumping ***** onto beaches and people can't afford heating. Workers deserve decent pay deals but we can't then hit them with tax increases at the same time.

Complete agree with this. They just need to make sure that who they identify as the rich is correct. Not that I’m lucky enough to be in this category but someone who just makes it into the 41% band is probably not “rich” unless they are childless.

[Jack]

It's mixed. A large number can strike as well as support services ect. But front line nurses cannot, they can work contracted hours which would be a huge drop in overall hours worked.

I can't see the snp wanting to go head to head with the NHS, not very good optics

Where does it say front line nurses can't strike?

[hibsbollah]

Where does it say front line nurses can't strike?

The nurses were on strike in the late 80s :dunno: Don’t know where some of these ‘facts’ come from. Twitter probably.

[grunt]

Complete agree with this. They just need to make sure that who they identify as the rich is correct. Not that I’m lucky enough to be in this category but someone who just makes it into the 41% band is probably not “rich” unless they are childless.
Are you saying that childless people should be taxed more than those with children?

[Stairway 2 7]

Where does it say front line nurses can't strike?

I thought they couldn't because my sister has pretty much told she won't be able to as that would go again the code. But read and that's wrong. I assume they obviously can't and won't all completely all go off

[Stairway 2 7]

The nurses were on strike in the late 80s :dunno: Don’t know where some of these ‘facts’ come from. Twitter probably.

Better than not believing facts when you are proven wrong. You believe Bucha happened yet or do you still reckon probably not? Because that would be going against a mountain of facts

[Pretty Boy]

I thought they couldn't because my sister has pretty much told she won't be able to as that would go again the code. But read and that's wrong. I assume they obviously can't and won't all completely all go off

There's an agreement between the RCN and the government that nurses won't strike in situations where it will be detrimental to patients well being.

My sister works is a nurse in an A&E department and is likely to be involved in action but because of the nature of her job it may be action short of a full on strike.

[Iain G]

Complete agree with this. They just need to make sure that who they identify as the rich is correct. Not that I’m lucky enough to be in this category but someone who just makes it into the 41% band is probably not “rich” unless they are childless.

Christ that's a sweeping generalisation! Penalise those who choose not to burden the planet with even more mouths to feed? You are Chairman Mao and I claim my ten Won! 🤣

[Iain G]

Are you saying that childless people should be taxed more than those with children?

Should be the other way around, tax breaks for not having kids 😁

[Jack]

I thought they couldn't because my sister has pretty much told she won't be able to as that would go again the code. But read and that's wrong. I assume they obviously can't and won't all completely all go off

Nurses can go on strike and there's nothing to stop them all going out on strike at the same time.

There are a number of unions covering nurses. There's one, can't remember which, has a no strike policy. It doesn't mean their members cannot strike (in sympathy for their colleagues in other unions for example).

And I'll be brutally honest here. Many nurses are so dedicated to their vocation they wouldn't dream of withdrawing their labour and employers are only too willing to use that against them.

[Stairway 2 7]

Christ that's a sweeping generalisation! Penalise those who choose not to burden the planet with even more mouths to feed? You are Chairman Mao and I claim my ten Won! 🤣

Scotland certainly needs more children were a badly aging population. That's why immigration is needed here they are on average younger and have children. China should have cancelled the one child policy well before they did. Their population will go from 1.4 billion to 700 million people in the next 80 years.

Not that I'm saying childless should be taxed more

[Pretty Boy]

Are you saying that childless people should be taxed more than those with children?


Christ that's a sweeping generalisation! Penalise those who choose not to burden the planet with even more mouths to feed? You are Chairman Mao and I claim my ten Won! 🤣


Should be the other way around, tax breaks for not having kids 😁

Surely no one seriously read that post as meaning those with children should be taxed less than those without?

Maybe I'm the one misreading it but I took it to mean that any tax hike for higher earners should sit at some point above the current £43K lower limit for the 41% bracket. The reasoning being that those at the lower end of the scale hardly fall into the category of the super rich and that is arguably even more true of those with dependents rather than those only feeding and clothing 1 or 2 people rather 3, 4 or 5. I can't see any suggestion that the upper tax brackets should be split based on choosing to reproduce or otherwise.

[ronaldo7]

Council tax reform was one of the big SNP promises when they came to power over a decade ago, same as land reform. Neither seem to be particularly pressing though. In the case of the former it's probably because it's a bit of a political nightmare that could cost votes and no political party wants that, even one that has supporters who insist they don't play politics.

I'm not really sure what the point in the powers to raise income tax is either. A lot of tinkering in the middle bands but with a top rate only 1% above that in England it seems something of a wasted opportunity.

It's hardly an SNP exclusive problem though. Peter Hain was calling for a 'super tax' on the rich 20 years ago and was promptly slapped down by Blair and Brown. Tax rises are rarely popular even when they would be directly or indirectly beneficial to a lot of the people who oppose them as a point of principle.

Trying to get consensus in parliament on the way forward for council tax has been too difficult. Even Kezia Dugdale forgot which way to vote.

[grunt]

Surely no one seriously read that post as meaning those with children should be taxed less than those without?

Maybe I'm the one misreading it but I took it to mean that any tax hike for higher earners should sit at some point above the current £43K lower limit for the 41% bracket. The reasoning being that those at the lower end of the scale hardly fall into the category of the super rich and that is arguably even more true of those with dependents rather than those only feeding and clothing 1 or 2 people rather 3, 4 or 5. I can't see any suggestion that the upper tax brackets should be split based on choosing to reproduce or otherwise.
Sorry but that's exactly how I read it. Maybe I'm wrong, wouldn't be the first time. He was talking about making sure we carefully define "rich" and then he said that being childless would be an exception to those people he deemed not "rich"?