Official Site: CLUB UPDATE

[madhatter]

I can’t speak for everyone else, but I’m fully aware that there’s going to be a drop in income. IMO that’s when the owner needs to step in and make up the shortfall. If we went into next season with a similar budget to last season we would be very competitive. That in turn would lead to more prize money and us being able to steal a march on our rivals, that advantage could last for a good few years.

I agree with this in principle but we know from recent years that spending more money and having higher budget means nothing. We may be competitive on paper but that is pointless. Imagine he spent money and then we weren’t competitive and got relegated?

Any players we’ve signed have generally been approximately our league’s level, barring McGinn. We aren’t going to be getting Messi or Ronaldo.

Scott Allan has good stats from last season, in terms of assists and goals, but I genuinely thought he was average. Think that’s indicated by our final position. We were average and paid well for it.

[B.H.F.C]

I can’t speak for everyone else, but I’m fully aware that there’s going to be a drop in income. IMO that’s when the owner needs to step in and make up the shortfall. If we went into next season with a similar budget to last season we would be very competitive. That in turn would lead to more prize money and us being able to steal a march on our rivals, that advantage could last for a good few years.

You’re assuming that there is going to be major cuts to the first team though. What if the majority of the cuts are for other areas of the club which will have little to no activity throughout the season?

I’m not saying there won’t be cuts to the first team by the way. But I don’t think they’re going to be as major as what people think. I don’t think we’re going to sell anyone we can and not sign anyone for instance. And there is certainly nobody else, currently, in a stronger position than they were at the end of last season.

[Logie Green]

As a minor aside the decision to effectively ‘mothball’ the Development Team puts the Old Firm’s application to have Colts Teams in the League in a different light.

I assume other clubs will do the same with their teams below first team level which would reduce the OF’s options in Scotland at Development/Reserve level, hence their application.

[Gerard]

The cuts will be severe, Imho.

Last year's staff costs were £6.3m and represented 59% of turnover.

We're expecting turnover to fall by 50%. Already you can see that there's an issue before any other costs are considered.

As for the academy, I think the practicalities and costs of running anything other than the first team until we're out of the pandemic means it has to be shelved and picked up again when we're in a better position.

To play professional football the figures quoted for testing alone were around £4k per match, the rules don't change for under 20 football as far as I know so then you're looking at that cost again for every match at that level. Plus the complications of having more people in and around the training centre.

There's nothing nefarious going on, I think this is just the stark reality that unless we cut our cloth now, we're going to struggle.

Credit line could be an option, but unless you knew when this was going to be over and back to normal, would you be willing to secure the stadium against a loan?

I don't think we're Ron Gordon's only concern, maybe he can't afford to prop up all his businesses? I don't know. As the major shareholder, I would hope he contributes, and it's great that as a significant shareholder, HS are also able to contribute.

You raise an interesting point about the PSH's financial position.
If the club needs money it could have a new share issue that will raise money to help the club get through this position. The share issue could increase the shares in hibs by 10 percent. That would not challenge the PSH's control over the club.:wink:

[Ozyhibby]

You’re assuming that there is going to be major cuts to the first team though. What if the majority of the cuts are for other areas of the club which will have little to no activity throughout the season?

I’m not saying there won’t be cuts to the first team by the way. But I don’t think they’re going to be as major as what people think. I don’t think we’re going to sell anyone we can and not sign anyone for instance. And there is certainly nobody else, currently, in a stronger position than they were at the end of last season.

It looks like all the cuts are designed to protect the first team as much as possible.


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[matty_f]

You raise an interesting point about the PSH's financial position.
If the club needs money it could have a new share issue that will raise money to help the club get through this position. The share issue could increase the shares in hibs by 10 percent. That would not challenge the PSH's control over the club.:wink:

But it could further dilute HSL's holding.

[Gerard]

But it could further dilute HSL's holding.
it would depend how many share were offered to HS and the other share holders and how many of these shares were purchased by the various share holders.
In any case it would raise badly needed money.
My point is that the club needs the Hibernian family to help the club survive in this time of great financial strife.
:wink::flag::cb

[Baldy Foghorn]

If I were HS I would be asking if by donating a set amount, could they acquire more shares. I know this was quashed when take over happened, but a different scenario now

[Sammy7nil]

I can’t speak for everyone else, but I’m fully aware that there’s going to be a drop in income. IMO that’s when the owner needs to step in and make up the shortfall. If we went into next season with a similar budget to last season we would be very competitive. That in turn would lead to more prize money and us being able to steal a march on our rivals, that advantage could last for a good few years.

I think that was Hearts business plan and they finished 12th.

[lord bunberry]

You’re assuming that there is going to be major cuts to the first team though. What if the majority of the cuts are for other areas of the club which will have little to no activity throughout the season?

I’m not saying there won’t be cuts to the first team by the way. But I don’t think they’re going to be as major as what people think. I don’t think we’re going to sell anyone we can and not sign anyone for instance. And there is certainly nobody else, currently, in a stronger position than they were at the end of last season.
The things that are being cut were deemed essential before this happened. We’re not exactly a club that’s rolling in money.

[CropleyWasGod]

But it could further dilute HSL's holding.

That's a more likely scenario IMO.If there is to be a new Share Issue, it's because RG wants one and is able to fund one. Whether there is the appetite or ability for fans to buy into it.... I would doubt it just now.

[lord bunberry]

I agree with this in principle but we know from recent years that spending more money and having higher budget means nothing. We may be competitive on paper but that is pointless. Imagine he spent money and then we weren’t competitive and got relegated?

Any players we’ve signed have generally been approximately our league’s level, barring McGinn. We aren’t going to be getting Messi or Ronaldo.

Scott Allan has good stats from last season, in terms of assists and goals, but I genuinely thought he was average. Think that’s indicated by our final position. We were average and paid well for it.
Nothing is guaranteed but you can’t be afraid of failure.

[Gerard]

If I were HS I would be asking if by donating a set amount, could they acquire more shares. I know this was quashed when take over happened, but a different scenario now

That is a fair and reasonable question to be asked to Mr R Gordon. I am sure that it will be asked.:wink:

[B.H.F.C]

The things that are being cut were deemed essential before this happened. We’re not exactly a club that’s rolling in money.

Well maybe the fact they’re being cut shows they’re not essential? Things change.

[lord bunberry]

I think that was Hearts business plan and they finished 12th.
It’s not a fair comparison, hearts were run by a clueless owner who allowed Craig Levein to run the show and spend a fortune.

[lord bunberry]

Or maybe the fact they’re being cut shows they’re not essential? Things change.
Possibly.

[The 90+2]

I think that was Hearts business plan and they finished 12th.

They should in honesty be well ahead of the game if it wasn’t for Budge and Levein. They, for anyone looking in and laughing missed the biggest singular opportunity to build on something that should have taken them to another level and now await finding out when they can take their maroon pound to Arbroath.

[Sammy7nil]

It’s not a fair comparison, hearts were run by a clueless owner who allowed Craig Levein to run the show and spend a fortune.

Bigger budgets guarantee nothing, we finish bottom six more often than top six, ignore Hearts if you want ask Livvy Motherwell St Johnstone about big budgets.

[hibbyfraelibby]

Giving Mcgregor and Gray new four year contracts last year might not have been the best of ideas,

Actually it might have been a master stroke. If the coaching staff is being gutted and these two are still around and able occasionally to lace their boots?

[hibbyfraelibby]

BT Sport are reportedly in a £3m compensation battle with the SPFL. BBC Scotland also looking for money for radio & tv coverage they have missed out on.

The BBC can bolt...and take Tom English with them

[ancient hibee]

It’s not a fair comparison, hearts were run by a clueless owner who allowed Craig Levein to run the show and spend a fortune.

So clueless that she did exactly what you suggest,throwing away money to buy success.

[madhatter]

Nothing is guaranteed but you can’t be afraid of failure.

Afraid of failure? Sadly we are used to failure. In stature we are top 5 club at an absolute minimum and we regularly languish around mid-table and frequently in bottom six. We have flurries into top 3-4 and then just fall back to our normal position.

We are not afraid of failure, in many cases we share a bed with it.

[truehibernian]

Afraid of failure? Sadly we are used to failure. In stature we are top 5 club at an absolute minimum and we regularly languish around mid-table and frequently in bottom six. We have flurries into top 3-4 and then just fall back to our normal position.

We are not afraid of failure, in many cases we share a bed with it.

Not this decade :cb Scottish Cup win, Championship title, League Cup final, SC and LC semis, top 6 under Lennon, above our capital rivals last three years, numerous derby wins, European 'success'., Scottish Cup semi to look forward to.........I'll happily share a bed with that :aok: stay positive :agree:

[lord bunberry]

So clueless that she did exactly what you suggest,throwing away money to buy success.
So we shouldn’t show any ambition then?

[ancient hibee]

So we shouldn’t show any ambition then?

Throwing money away isn’t being ambitious it’s being extremely stupid.

[lord bunberry]

Afraid of failure? Sadly we are used to failure. In stature we are top 5 club at an absolute minimum and we regularly languish around mid-table and frequently in bottom six. We have flurries into top 3-4 and then just fall back to our normal position.

We are not afraid of failure, in many cases we share a bed with it.
Maybe now is the time to leave that behind us and push on. I’m not suggesting we go mental and spend ridiculous amounts of money, I’m only saying we should maintain last season’s budget.

[lord bunberry]

Throwing money away isn’t being ambitious it’s being extremely stupid.
Why would maintaining last seasons budget be throwing away money?

[ancient hibee]

Maybe now is the time to leave that behind us and push on. I’m not suggesting we go mental and spend ridiculous amounts of money, I’m only saying we should maintain last season’s budget.

Last year’s expenditure was more than £10M.Over £6M Of that was staff costs.

[lord bunberry]

Bigger budgets guarantee nothing, we finish bottom six more often than top six, ignore Hearts if you want ask Livvy Motherwell St Johnstone about big budgets.
We’re a well run club with a settled squad, we wouldn’t be throwing money about in desperation to get ourselves out of trouble. A bit of investment now could prove to be a master stroke.

[lord bunberry]

Last year’s expenditure was more than £10M.Over £6M Of that was staff costs.
We should be aiming to match that this season.

[Gerard]

That's a more likely scenario IMO.If there is to be a new Share Issue, it's because RG wants one and is able to fund one. Whether there is the appetite or ability for fans to buy into it.... I would doubt it just now.
We will never be sure if it is not offered to the Hibs share holders. IMO HS given the current circumstances could make a major contribution to any new shares offered to the share holders. At the momeent that option is not being offered by the PSH.:wink:However, that situation may change:wink: Have faith and confidence that things are going to get better:wink:

[Logie Green]

Not this decade :cb Scottish Cup win, Championship title, League Cup final, SC and LC semis, top 6 under Lennon, above our capital rivals last three years, numerous derby wins, European 'success'., Scottish Cup semi to look forward to.........I'll happily share a bed with that :aok: stay positive :agree:

Winning The Championship should not be regarded as a ‘major’ honour for a club like Hibernian.

[Brightside]

Actually it might have been a master stroke. If the coaching staff is being gutted and these two are still around and able occasionally to lace their boots?

Who are they going to coach?

[CropleyWasGod]

We will never be sure if it is not offered to the Hibs share holders. IMO HS given the current circumstances could make a major contribution to any new shares offered to the share holders. At the momeent that option is not being offered by the PSH.:wink:However, that situation may change:wink: Have faith and confidence that things are going to get better:wink:

Like I say, it will only happen if RG wants it. From your winks, are you suggesting that he does?

[CapitalGreen]

We should be aiming to match that this season.

On an income of £5m?

What happens if there is still restrictions in place the following season, run at another big deficit?
What if we are unable to complete 38 league games and have to refund fans again?

[truehibernian]

Winning The Championship should not be regarded as a ‘major’ honour for a club like Hibernian.

It was a joy when watching SJM, Dylan, Marvin, Daz and JC.......same as it was a joy when watching us win it with Latapy, Lovell, Mixu and Pat McGinley :aok:

You need to win it - and did you not enjoy/celebrate the last Championship win ? We had a great side, great football, full houses - to me, that said it mattered to a fair few :aok:

[Sergio sledge]

Maybe now is the time to leave that behind us and push on. I’m not suggesting we go mental and spend ridiculous amounts of money, I’m only saying we should maintain last season’s budget.

If turnover is halved like the club are predicting then RG would need to put in millions to maintain last year's budget. I'd much rather that much was invested sensibly in a well thought out growth plan than chucked at a single season gamble to be honest.

[MrSmith]

It was a joy when watching SJM, Dylan, Marvin, Daz and JC.......same as it was a joy when watching us win it with Latapy, Lovell, Mixu and Pat McGinley :aok:

You need to win it - and did you not enjoy/celebrate the last Championship win ? We had a great side, great football, full houses - to me, that said it mattered to a fair few :aok:

I agree, totally awesome 👏 we came back into the premier as a fired up club, revitalised and renewed given the hurt of relegation. Fantastic journey ❤️

[lord bunberry]

On an income of £5m?

What happens if there is still restrictions in place the following season, run at another big deficit?
What if we are unable to complete 38 league games and have to refund fans again?
Come on we can’t function on what ifs. The consensus is that fans will be back later this year and full stadiums early next year.

[Gerard]

Like I say, it will only happen if RG wants it. From your winks, are you suggesting that he does?

My winks are not suggesting anything
I happen to enjoy this emoji.
We are in a different situation from the AGM when he said no to a new share issue.

[lord bunberry]

If turnover is halved like the club are predicting then RG would need to put in millions to maintain last year's budget. I'd much rather that much was invested sensibly in a well thought out growth plan than chucked at a single season gamble to be honest.
I wouldn’t, I’d rather we took advantage of the situation that we find ourselves in. Every club will be looking at the model you describe.

[Eyrie]

Come on we can’t function on what ifs. The consensus is that fans will be back later this year and full stadiums early next year.

Those are both "what ifs" as neither is guaranteed.

What is guaranteed is that for the first part of the season there will be no crowds. The club has to budget based on that known fact.

[bingo70]

So we shouldn’t show any ambition then?

Not this summer, no, I don’t think we should.

If we can’t afford it we shouldn’t spend it.

[lord bunberry]

Not this summer, no, I don’t think we should.

If we can’t afford it we shouldn’t spend it.
If Ron Gordon puts the money in we can afford. The club should in normal circumstances be able to generate enough money to be self sufficient, but during times when that’s not possible we need Ron to step up to the mark.

[lord bunberry]

Those are both "what ifs" as neither is guaranteed.

What is guaranteed is that for the first part of the season there will be no crowds. The club has to budget based on that known fact.
I’m aware of that and that’s why I’m saying Ron Gordon needs to put his money where his mouth is. I’m not asking for reckless spending or putting the club into debt, I’m asking the guy who bought a football club to show us if he’s the real deal or if he’s just playing at the game. I don’t think that’s too much to ask.

[Andy74]

My winks are not suggesting anything
I happen to enjoy this emoji.
We are in a different situation from the AGM when he said no to a new share issue.

Yeah, he has now significantly overpaid and will be even less keen on diluting his ownership.

I don’t get the focus on shares. It’s the least of our worries.

The best thing we can do now is support financially without expectation of much more than getting through this.

[Eyrie]

I’m aware of that and that’s why I’m saying Ron Gordon needs to put his money where his mouth is. I’m not asking for reckless spending or putting the club into debt, I’m asking the guy who bought a football club to show us if he’s the real deal or if he’s just playing at the game. I don’t think that’s too much to ask.

If Gordon ponys up then the club will be in debt to him.

In my life I restrict my spending when my income goes down, instead of borrowing money that I'll need to repay. I have no problem with Hibs taking the same approach.

[Andy74]

I’m aware of that and that’s why I’m saying Ron Gordon needs to put his money where his mouth is. I’m not asking for reckless spending or putting the club into debt, I’m asking the guy who bought a football club to show us if he’s the real deal or if he’s just playing at the game. I don’t think that’s too much to ask.

I think this is ridiculous.

Why the aggressive language towards him?

He’s put money in, things have changed dramatically and his support and advice will be critical.

Expecting him to keep chucking millions of pounds of his own money isn’t fair.

[lord bunberry]

If Gordon ponys up then the club will be in debt to him.

In my life I restrict my spending when my income goes down, instead of borrowing money that I'll need to repay. I have no problem with Hibs taking the same approach.
He owns the club he should be supporting it financially, not loaning us money. We’ll learn a lot about his intentions in the next few months.

[Sammy7nil]

I agree, totally awesome 👏 we came back into the premier as a fired up club, revitalised and renewed given the hurt of relegation. Fantastic journey ❤️


It was a joy when watching SJM, Dylan, Marvin, Daz and JC.......same as it was a joy when watching us win it with Latapy, Lovell, Mixu and Pat McGinley :aok:

You need to win it - and did you not enjoy/celebrate the last Championship win ? We had a great side, great football, full houses - to me, that said it mattered to a fair few :aok:

It sounds so good perhaps we should swap places with Hearts and save Scottish football :confused: :wink: :greengrin

[Eyrie]

He owns the club he should be supporting it financially, not loaning us money. We’ll learn a lot about his intentions in the next few months.

He has supported us financially, by repaying the loan from Farmer and providing £1m of working capital.

[Sammy7nil]

He owns the club he should be supporting it financially, not loaning us money. We’ll learn a lot about his intentions in the next few months.

Very unfair Sir Tom did not throw his money about rightly praised for saving us but ran a very tight ship.

[lord bunberry]

I think this is ridiculous.

Why the aggressive language towards him?

He’s put money in, things have changed dramatically and his support and advice will be critical.

Expecting him to keep chucking millions of pounds of his own money isn’t fair.
It’s not aggressive. I think it’s perfectly legitimate to question whether he’s here to make us the club he set out when he arrived or if he’s just another rich guy who wants to say he owns a football club. I’m not coming down on any side on this, I’m only giving my opinion on what I think he should do and he may still do that.

[lord bunberry]

He has supported us financially, by repaying the loan from Farmer and providing £1m of working capital.
That was the price of buying the club.

[CB_NO3]

Some people getting themself a bit worked up. Cant believe people are slating the club as they make necessary changes to ensure we don't get into major debt.

The club are 100% doing the right thing and are preparing for a worst case scenario. It may be 18 months before fans are allowed into stadiums (unlikely I know). Rangers players have not had wages for 2 months. Hearts have slashed wages across the board by 30%. Celtic players have had substantial reductions to their salaries.

Some mentalists on here.

[lord bunberry]

Very unfair Sir Tom did not throw his money about rightly praised for saving us but ran a very tight ship.
I think it’s widely acknowledged that Farmer didn’t really want to be the owner of a football club, he came to our rescue when we needed him most and we should be eternally grateful for that. Ron has come in because he wanted to be here.

[Sammy7nil]

I think it’s widely acknowledged that Farmer didn’t really want to be the owner of a football club, he came to our rescue when we needed him most and we should be eternally grateful for that. Ron has come in because he wanted to be here.

You have backed yourself in to corner and it appears you want to defend every post that does not fit your narrative that Ron MUST splash the cash NOW. Perhaps you need to take step back and watch the events over the next few weeks and take a more informed stance. If not your fingers will be aching defending that stance.

[CapitalGreen]

He owns the club he should be supporting it financially, not loaning us money. We’ll learn a lot about his intentions in the next few months.

We won’t be able to cut our costs in half so he will likely need to support us financially.

[lord bunberry]

You have backed yourself in to corner and it appears you want to defend every post that does not fit your narrative that Ron MUST splash the cash NOW. Perhaps you need to take step back and watch the events over the next few weeks and take a more informed stance. If not your fingers will be aching defending that stance.
I’m not backing myself into any corner, I’m merely giving my opinion and responding to posters who have replied to my posts, just as I’m doing now. I can only give you my opinion of what I believe should happen, others might not agree with it which is fair enough.

[weecounty hibby]

Folk are being very naïve if they think that the answer to all of this is RG putting in some of his own money and we continue to employ and pay the same as before. I said on another thread that I work for a multi billion pound company and have already been told no pay rise and no bonus. We have also slashed budgets by eye watering amounts, I am talking hundreds of millions compared to last year's spend. All because consumers are not buying the product. Hibs are absolutely no different to any other business if consumer spend goes down, costs need to be cut or the business goes tits up. Our income is likely to be halved by all accounts so what should we do? Go massively into unmanageable debt, to banks or RG, or cut back. I think we are doing the right thing. It's great to see the uptake in HS but let's not forget that others have the same sort of thing and they are also in the shut. Aberdeen say they will have a £9m defecit and are loosing £1m per month. I still don't believe that RG has anything other than the best of intentions for Hibs but I also don't believe that he is going to chuck millions our way either

[lord bunberry]

We won’t be able to cut our costs in half so he will likely need to support us financially.
I hope he does so in a way that makes us all excited about the future.

[Sammy7nil]

I’m not backing myself into any corner, I’m merely giving my opinion and responding to posters who have replied to my posts, just as I’m doing now. I can only give you my opinion of what I believe should happen, others might not agree with it which is fair enough.

I will reply then too I don't agree :aok:

[lord bunberry]

Folk are being very naïve if they think that the answer to all of this is RG putting in some of his own money and we continue to employ and pay the same as before. I said on another thread that I work for a multi billion pound company and have already been told no pay rise and no bonus. We have also slashed budgets by eye watering amounts, I am talking hundreds of millions compared to last year's spend. All because consumers are not buying the product. Hibs are absolutely no different to any other business if consumer spend goes down, costs need to be cut or the business goes tits up. Our income is likely to be halved by all accounts so what should we do? Go massively into unmanageable debt, to banks or RG, or cut back. I think we are doing the right thing. It's great to see the uptake in HS but let's not forget that others have the same sort of thing and they are also in the shut. Aberdeen say they will have a £9m defecit and are loosing £1m per month. I still don't believe that RG has anything other than the best of intentions for Hibs but I also don't believe that he is going to chuck millions our way either
I’m sorry but hibs and football clubs are different from normal businesses. How many football club owners are in it to make money? Tell me the last person to have owned hibs and made money?

[lord bunberry]

I will reply then too I don't agree :aok:
I already knew that :greengrin

[Sammy7nil]

Folk are being very naïve if they think that the answer to all of this is RG putting in some of his own money and we continue to employ and pay the same as before. I said on another thread that I work for a multi billion pound company and have already been told no pay rise and no bonus. We have also slashed budgets by eye watering amounts, I am talking hundreds of millions compared to last year's spend. All because consumers are not buying the product. Hibs are absolutely no different to any other business if consumer spend goes down, costs need to be cut or the business goes tits up. Our income is likely to be halved by all accounts so what should we do? Go massively into unmanageable debt, to banks or RG, or cut back. I think we are doing the right thing. It's great to see the uptake in HS but let's not forget that others have the same sort of thing and they are also in the shut. Aberdeen say they will have a £9m defecit and are loosing £1m per month. I still don't believe that RG has anything other than the best of intentions for Hibs but I also don't believe that he is going to chuck millions our way either

:agree: :agree: :agree:

[Scotty Leither]

I've just been onto HSL website, with a view to donating a one-off amount, and when I click on the "donate" button, it takes me to the monthly d/ds to "acquire shares", so I clicked on the "single payment", which I'm still minded to do, but it strikes me that the website content is not only short in detail, it's also way out of date - with the last "news update" way back on the 4th of February that Stephen Dunn has stepped down from HSL Board.

If you're a brand new visitor to the site, you'd think the main purpose of HSL was still to purchase shares in the club.

If there's any HSL people reading this, I'm sorry to be so critical but the site and the whole "message" you're trying to put out needs a re-boot.

Someone posted a link to the AberDNA site on here, and it's like night and day compared to HSL; what you get for your donations, discounts on season tickets, etc, in short a snappy initiative, obviously ran in conjunction with the cooperation and involvement with Aberdeen FC - surely HSL and Hibs could produce something similar?

Lastly having read back the club announcement, it's the last line that strikes me as the most telling from Leeann Dempster: "We understand not everyone is able to help as they might in these difficult times, however if you can help, we thank you for it."

How about for every £ supporters are being asked to put in, then Ron Gordon matches it, Leeann?

[weecounty hibby]

I’m sorry but hibs and football clubs are different from normal businesses. How many football club owners are in it to make money? Tell me the last person to have owned hibs and made money?

And the it is with the naivety. Hibs are absolutely no different to any other business. Money coming in needs to balance as much as possible to money going out. If not, massive debt and financial trouble ahead. Twice in my life I've seen Hibs in that state, early 90s and early 00s. Don't want to go back there again

[lord bunberry]

And the it is with the naivety. Hibs are absolutely no different to any other business. Money coming in needs to balance as much as possible to money going out. If not, massive debt and financial trouble ahead. Twice in my life I've seen Hibs in that state, early 90s and early 00s. Don't want to go back there again
I agree and I haven’t suggested we do. I’m suggesting our owner puts some of his money in to cover the temporary shortfall. The guy at Dundee Utd seems to be doing that.

[Andy74]

I’m sorry but hibs and football clubs are different from normal businesses. How many football club owners are in it to make money? Tell me the last person to have owned hibs and made money?

We aren’t different in the sense that money in needs to at least equal money out or someone has to foot the bill.

For our level of owner he wants to add value to sustainably grow the club and I’m sure in normal circumstances he would have done.

I’ve no expectation that any Hibs owner is going to be comfortable losing multiple millions of pounds.

[weecounty hibby]

I agree and I haven’t suggested we do. I’m suggesting our owner puts some of his money in to cover the temporary shortfall. The guy at Dundee Utd seems to be doing that.

So we would be in debt to RG. Just as we were in debt to STF. STF sold up as he got a decent return eventually but that as after Hibs paying him for a number of years. Debt is debt. Dundee Utd will find themselves in the **** at some point if they don't reduce their salary to turnover ratio. 135% of turnover to wages is unsustainable for a club with a support no bigger than 7/8000. No owners, unless mega rich like Abramovich, are going to chuck money away. I hope none of that sounds like a criticism of Sir Tom.

[lord bunberry]

We aren’t different in the sense that money in needs to at least equal money out or someone has to foot the bill.

For our level of owner he wants to add value to sustainably grow the club and I’m sure in normal circumstances he would have done.

I’ve no expectation that any Hibs owner is going to be comfortable losing multiple millions of pounds.
I agree most of that, but I hope your last point isn’t true. I have an expectation that he will be prepared to put some money in.

[weecounty hibby]

I agree most of that, but I hope your last point isn’t true. I have an expectation that he will be prepared to put some money in.

He already has!!!

[Scouse Hibee]

I’m sorry but hibs and football clubs are different from normal businesses. How many football club owners are in it to make money? Tell me the last person to have owned hibs and made money?

They are in the sense that they both have to be financially managed to try and secure their long term future. Hibs are taking steps to try and ensure that, anything else would be totally irresponsible and see us go under.

[lord bunberry]

So we would be in debt to RG. Just as we were in debt to STF. STF sold up as he got a decent return eventually but that as after Hibs paying him for a number of years. Debt is debt. Dundee Utd will find themselves in the **** at some point if they don't reduce their salary to turnover ratio. 135% of turnover to wages is unsustainable for a club with a support no bigger than 7/8000. No owners, unless mega rich like Abramovich, are going to chuck money away. I hope none of that sounds like a criticism of Sir Tom.
Dundee Utd spent money to get out of the championship, their salary to turnover will be much healthier in the premiership. Even with the current circumstances they’ve bid £250k for Nisbet so their owner is obviously quite happy to put his money down.

[Logie Green]

It was a joy when watching SJM, Dylan, Marvin, Daz and JC.......same as it was a joy when watching us win it with Latapy, Lovell, Mixu and Pat McGinley :aok:

You need to win it - and did you not enjoy/celebrate the last Championship win ? We had a great side, great football, full houses - to me, that said it mattered to a fair few :aok:

I didn’t celebrate either second tier title but I applauded more out of relief at getting out of a division we should never be in.

[lord bunberry]

He already has!!!
I know but he got a football club for his money. Now he has it he needs to back it.

[weecounty hibby]

Dundee Utd spent money to get out of the championship, their salary to turnover will be much healthier in the premiership. Even with the current circumstances they’ve bid £250k for Nisbet so their owner is obviously quite happy to put his money down.
And is on record I believe saying that he expects to make a profit. Oh aye, how the **** is he going to do that with Dundee Utd? Only celtic manage to turn any kind of real profit in Scotland. I firmly believe that Utd will find themselves in the **** at some point in the future

[weecounty hibby]

I know but he got a football club for his money. Now he has it he needs to back it.
How much do you suggest he spends? 1m, 2m, 10m? Or should Hibs do the sensible financially prudent things that they already are

[lord bunberry]

And is on record I believe saying that he expects to make a profit. Oh aye, how the **** is he going to do that with Dundee Utd? Only celtic manage to turn any kind of real profit in Scotland. I firmly believe that Utd will find themselves in the **** at some point in the future
You might be right, but time will tell. He bought a championship club and has taken them up to the premiership. They must be worth more than he paid.

[lord bunberry]

How much do you suggest he spends? 1m, 2m, 10m? Or should Hibs do the sensible financially prudent things that they already are
The sensible prudent things have seen us underachieve for 50 years. We need an owner to show some ambition without being reckless.

[Mick O'Rourke]

I’m sorry but hibs and football clubs are different from normal businesses. How many football club owners are in it to make money? Tell me the last person to have owned hibs and made money?


Tom Farmer

[CropleyWasGod]

Dundee Utd spent money to get out of the championship, their salary to turnover will be much healthier in the premiership. Even with the current circumstances they’ve bid £250k for Nisbet so their owner is obviously quite happy to put his money down.

Give the money or lend it?

[lord bunberry]

Give the money or lend it?
I don’t know tbh.

[Jim44]

And the it is with the naivety. Hibs are absolutely no different to any other business. Money coming in needs to balance as much as possible to money going out. If not, massive debt and financial trouble ahead. Twice in my life I've seen Hibs in that state, early 90s and early 00s. Don't want to go back there again

I agree you’ve got to balance the books as best you can, but I think you’ve got to try to make sure you don’t cut back so far that you can’t maintain a standard which will enable you to function successfully when things start to improve. I don’t think RG should look at our outgoings and income from a purely arithmetical viewpoint, and he should be prepared to bolster our ability to operate in the market to a reasonable extent but which doesn’t put us into unsustainable debt. In simple terms I would hope he was prepared to give us a hand up when we’re slipping too far out of the saddle.

[Scotty Leither]

Dundee Utd spent money to get out of the championship, their salary to turnover will be much healthier in the premiership. Even with the current circumstances they’ve bid £250k for Nisbet so their owner is obviously quite happy to put his money down.

STF put up money to finance the Murdo Macleod deal.

If there's no movement in the transfer market, and Dundee United join Aberdeen in beating us to the punch for players, then questions will be asked why that is (pandemic or not), because it'll send out the signal that we're in for a season of treading water (or a "write-off season") as some on here have described it as.

There's a lot to play for this year in the shape of a semi-final against that lot, who'll be stoked even more than they usually are for that game and the club needs to build some sort of momentum.

We're not unique in having to make the best of an awful situation, I just hope the club don't revert to type and retreat into ourselves like we did on occasion under the previous regime; the club need to think long and hard over what message they're trying to convey here.

[lord bunberry]

Tom Farmer
I seriously doubt that. He wrote of debts and gave the club money over the years, especially when we were rebuilding the stadium.

[bigwheel]

Give the money or lend it?

He could provide an interest free loan..payments starting in 18 months or so....give us a bit of operational cash to weather some of the storm and stay competitive....


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[lord bunberry]

STF put up money to finance the Murdo Macleod deal.

If there's no movement in the transfer market, and Dundee United join Aberdeen in beating us to the punch for players, then questions will be asked why that is (pandemic or not), because it'll send out the signal that we're in for a season of treading water (or a "write-off season") as some on here have described it as.

There's a lot to play for this year in the shape of a semi-final against that lot, who'll be stoked even more than they usually are for that game and the club needs to build some sort of momentum.

We're not unique in having to make the best of an awful situation, I just hope the club don't revert to type and retreat into ourselves like we did on occasion under the previous regime; the club need to think long and hard over what message they're trying to convey here.
:top marksI couldn’t agree more.

[CropleyWasGod]

He could provide an interest free loan..payments starting in 18 months or so....give us a bit of operational cash to weather some of the storm and stay competitive....


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

He could, but that's not what LB is suggesting

I'm sure that it will be on the list of possibilities.

[madhatter]

There is validity to both sides of what Ron Gordon should/shouldn't be doing.

Why should fans give money via HSL on top of ST renewals? due to love of club and desire for club to survive...

Why should owner put more money in? His company and an interest to see it flourish either for future sale or legacy...

Both are entitled to do what they want with their money but it’s probably going to take a collaborative effort to get club through this on best footing.

We’ll need to wait to hear more details from club which I suspect will come out at some point next week and continue beyond that.

[lord bunberry]

I agree you’ve got to balance the books as best you can, but I think you’ve got to try to make sure you don’t cut back so far that you can’t maintain a standard which will enable you to function successfully when things start to improve. I don’t think RG should look at our outgoings and income from a purely arithmetical viewpoint, and he should be prepared to bolster our ability to operate in the market to a reasonable extent but which doesn’t put us into unsustainable debt. In simple terms I would hope he was prepared to give us a hand up when we’re slipping too far out of the saddle.
I don’t think that’s too much to ask.

[B.H.F.C]

Kieran’s comment about the media has been a wee bit overlooked in amongst all of this. Found it interesting and very similar to what he posted last week when the media started pushing the idea that teams may be open to reconstruction (which was obviously pretty far from the truth).

[weecounty hibby]

The sensible prudent things have seen us underachieve for 50 years. We need an owner to show some ambition without being reckless.
We have had owners with ambition in my lifetime. Tom Hart managed a League Cup and a relegation, Kenny Waugh had ambition but got us nowhere, Duff and Gray FFS, all had ambition and tried to subsidise Hibs in different ways. Hibs slid in the late 70s as Hart tried to recoup some of his cash, I think Kenny Waugh lost a bit of cash too. No matter how much we love Hibs and what we think if them they are a money pit and only the mega richest most fanatical if fans would chuck away millions on the club. Sadly RG is none of these things.

[Scotty Leither]

He could provide an interest free loan..payments starting in 18 months or so....give us a bit of operational cash to weather some of the storm and stay competitive....


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I'd venture also that if we did make a couple of signings that capture the fans' imagination (like Nisbet) we might shift a few more season tickets and defray the cost of the deals?

Just a thought...

[Iggy Pope]

I didn’t celebrate either second tier title but I applauded more out of relief at getting out of a division we should never be in.

I got absolutely wrecked on purpose after the Tier 2 title celebrations v Raith Rovers in 1981. Feature game on Sportscene that night too!
I got slowly but surely wrecked taking all night coming back from Firhill v Hamilton in 1999 after spending too long in a pub that had something to do with Roughie.
I got accidentally wrecked when I should’ve gone home after a long night in a mobbed Tamsons after QOS in 2017. Neil Lennon turned up.

It really was good at the time and very hard not to celebrate.

[lord bunberry]

We have had owners with ambition in my lifetime. Tom Hart managed a League Cup and a relegation, Kenny Waugh had ambition but got us nowhere, Duff and Gray FFS, all had ambition and tried to subsidise Hibs in different ways. Hibs slid in the late 70s as Hart tried to recoup some of his cash, I think Kenny Waugh lost a bit of cash too. No matter how much we love Hibs and what we think if them they are a money pit and only the mega richest most fanatical if fans would chuck away millions on the club. Sadly RG is none of these things.
I don’t want him to chuck millions away. I really liked what he’s said up till now and I believe he has a good and exciting vision for our club. All I’m asking is that he puts money in now to see us through this crisis.

[weecounty hibby]

He could provide an interest free loan..payments starting in 18 months or so....give us a bit of operational cash to weather some of the storm and stay competitive....


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Hasn't the SFA secured a deal with close brothers to extend the opportunity to get loans if up to £5m. Wonder why all clubs are not grasping that with both hands if it's so easy.

[madhatter]

I'd venture also that if we did make a couple of signings that capture the fans' imagination (like Nisbet) we might shift a few more season tickets and defray the cost of the deals?

Just a thought...

You don’t think some of our support are simply thinking “Not sure I can afford a ST and with us not being able to go to the games I don’t think I can justify that outlay”?

Honestly can’t see Nisbet signing causing a massive surge in ST sales.

People know that jobs are being lost, right? Nisbet signing doesn’t fix that.

[lord bunberry]

You don’t think some of our support are simply thinking “Not sure I can afford a ST and with us not being able to go to the games I don’t think I can justify that outlay”?

Honestly can’t see Nisbet signing causing a massive surge in ST sales.

People know that jobs are being lost, right? Nisbet signing doesn’t fix that.
Griffiths would :greengrin

[weecounty hibby]

I don’t want him to chuck millions away. I really liked what he’s said up till now and I believe he has a good and exciting vision for our club. All I’m asking is that he puts money in now to see us through this crisis.

Again, how do you know he isn't doing or going to do that already. He can out money in and try to streamline the costs at the same time

[CropleyWasGod]

Hasn't the SFA secured a deal with close brothers to extend the opportunity to get loans if up to £5m. Wonder why all clubs are not grasping that with both hands if it's so easy.

The Government-backed Bounceback loans are probably more attractive. CB will probably want your family as security.

[weecounty hibby]

The Government-backed Bounceback loans are probably more attractive. CB will probably want your family as security.
To be honest after this lockdown they could have my family for a small advance!!!

[lord bunberry]

Again, how do you know he isn't doing or going to do that already. He can out money in and try to streamline the costs at the same time
I don’t and I haven’t said he won’t. I’m only stating what I want him to do.

[CropleyWasGod]

To be honest after this lockdown they could have my family for a small advance!!!

😂

[Scotty Leither]

You don’t think some of our support are simply thinking “Not sure I can afford a ST and with us not being able to go to the games I don’t think I can justify that outlay”?

Honestly can’t see Nisbet signing causing a massive surge in ST sales.

People know that jobs are being lost, right? Nisbet signing doesn’t fix that.

Yes, i'm well aware of that. What I also know that is fans will compare our transfer activity (or lack of) favourably/unfavourably with other clubs.

We're still a functioning football club with a responsibility to try and compete under the same straitened circumstances as everyone else,while still having a healthy season ticket base that knocks Dun United and Aberdeen's into a cocked hat.

[weecounty hibby]

I don’t and I haven’t said he won’t. I’m only stating what I want him to do.

I would love him to pump in £10m every year but I just don't see that ever happening to Hibs

[lord bunberry]

I would love him to pump in £10m every year but I just don't see that ever happening to Hibs
Neither do I, a wee £5m this year would be nice though. :greengrin

[Eyrie]

Neither do I, a wee £5m this year would be nice though. :greengrin

But you said we only need £150k :na na:


Griffiths would :greengrin

[Heisenberg]

Wage cuts for up to a year being proposed apparently.

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/5713578/hibs-players-wage-cut-year-financial-difficulties/?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1592429708

[660]

Wage cuts for up to a year being proposed apparently.

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/5713578/hibs-players-wage-cut-year-financial-difficulties/?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1592429708

The same story for the third night in a row. Great. My cock is up to 12 inches long too.

[Jim44]

Wage cuts for up to a year being proposed apparently.

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/5713578/hibs-players-wage-cut-year-financial-difficulties/?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1592429708

Pattullo :

He added: “Hearts are in an extremely difficult position and, in a sense, they have nothing to lose other than spending a couple of thousand pounds on legal fees.”

Well, for a start, integrity, mutual respect for fellow members, credibility and, potentially, membership of the association.

[wallpaperman]

Pattullo :

He added: “Hearts are in an extremely difficult position and, in a sense, they have nothing to lose other than spending a couple of thousand pounds on legal fees.”

Well, for a start, integrity, mutual respect for fellow members, credibility and, potentially, membership of the association.

If they somehow managed to get an injunction to delay the season, then subsequently lost the case, could they not be liable for crippling counter claims from every team that lost money through their delaying actions?

[MWHIBBIES]

The sensible prudent things have seen us underachieve for 50 years. We need an owner to show some ambition without being reckless.

This is not about achieving things. I don't doubt Ron was doing good things before this and his plans would've been very positive long term. I don't want his investment to buy players to win us things. Its about surviving this period and backing from him would help that.

[dp00]

While I think we all knew that when we purchased our season ticket it was unlikely we would see any games live any time soon..... however does anyone else think it’s strange that the club haven’t addressed the 8000 folk who essentially atm have
paid £400 to see our games online ? The online system is good but can’t help but think those households that have more than one season ticket in them are getting short changed as they would have only needed one season ticket for them all to be able to see the game ?

Think it would be good to hear what they plan on doing with season ticket holders ? I’ve noticed some clubs have guaranteed a set amount of live games even if it went into following season. Be good to hear what hibs are thinking on this front. It might even entice more season tickets to be sold


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Sir David Gray]

While I think we all knew that when we purchased our season ticket it was unlikely we would see any games live any time soon..... however does anyone else think it’s strange that the club haven’t addressed the 8000 folk who essentially atm have
paid £400 to see our games online ? The online system is good but can’t help but think those households that have more than one season ticket in them are getting short changed as they would have only needed one season ticket for them all to be able to see the game ?

Think it would be good to hear what they plan on doing with season ticket holders ? I’ve noticed some clubs have guaranteed a set amount of live games even if it went into following season. Be good to hear what hibs are thinking on this front. It might even entice more season tickets to be sold


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah agree with that.

I'm sure we'll hear something in due course.

[davhibby]

I’m willing to give Ron the benefit of the doubt on this so far, and the more I think about it this seems like the most sensible action to take. Hopefully it can all be agreed amicably with the players soon. Surely by trying to keep the loses down this year, we can try and get back on track with the AGM plans at some point rather than spending years paying off debts because we spent loads of money we didn’t have this summer

[Brightside]

Pattullo :

He added: “Hearts are in an extremely difficult position and, in a sense, they have nothing to lose other than spending a couple of thousand pounds on legal fees.”

Well, for a start, integrity, mutual respect for fellow members, credibility and, potentially, membership of the association.

A couple of thousand? That’s about half an hour with the QC.

[Davy Mac]

Sometimes you need to keep stum for the greater good in my opinion.

I admire Ron's honesty but the timing and transparency within a viper pit that's Scottish fitba, it will just encourage doubt, hesitancy and negativity.

[Antifa Hibs]

Yes, i'm well aware of that. What I also know that is fans will compare our transfer activity (or lack of) favourably/unfavourably with other clubs.

We're still a functioning football club with a responsibility to try and compete under the same straitened circumstances as everyone else,while still having a healthy season ticket base that knocks Dun United and Aberdeen's into a cocked hat.

Why do you keep mentioning Dundee Utd? Maybe they need to sign Nesbit cos they need a striker? Maybe we don't need to sign Nesbit cos we don't need a striker and already have one?

The way people go on about Shankland you'd think he's the next Pele FFS. He's been scoring for fun in a league where have the teams are part-time. The same with Nesbit. If us, Hertz or Aberdeen wanted them two before Utd they would have IMO. But they didn't.

Regarding Aberdeen they are miles ahead of us. That's what 3 seasons in the championship does v 3 seasons of finishing runners-up, Europa league and countless Hampden trips does. If Hibs and Aberdeen are both after a player 99% of the time the dons will beat us to him currently.

[Smartie]

Sorry to go back to the "numbers don't add up" bit.

If what I'm led to believe is correct, the players took a wage deferral to fall within the furlough limit. That means the government will have been paying their wages at 80% since this began, mid- late March. The vast majority of the club's staff have been furloughed, only operating a skeleton staff.

That is a quite substantial saving of money, about a 6th -a quarter of a year's wages falling within this period. Presumably there are other staff who will remain furloughed as long as we don't have fans within the ground.

Presumably the players are either already unfurloughed or are about to be unfurloughed as they return to training.

Still a decent wedge of cash on a major outgoing saved, especially as you'll effectively have had 85% of your season ticket income paid in advance the previous year (with only 15% of people having wanted a refund).

[MrSmith]

This is not about achieving things. I don't doubt Ron was doing good things before this and his plans would've been very positive long term. I don't want his investment to buy players to win us things. Its about surviving this period and backing from him would help that.

Agree entirely hence buying my lad an ST and signing up to HSL. I don’t care that my son nor I will see a game, the survival of our club is much more important to us.

[Sammy7nil]

Sorry to go back to the "numbers don't add up" bit.

If what I'm led to believe is correct, the players took a wage deferral to fall within the furlough limit. That means the government will have been paying their wages at 80% since this began, mid- late March. The vast majority of the club's staff have been furloughed, only operating a skeleton staff.

That is a quite substantial saving of money, about a 6th -a quarter of a year's wages falling within this period. Presumably there are other staff who will remain furloughed as long as we don't have fans within the ground.

Presumably the players are either already unfurloughed or are about to be unfurloughed as they return to training.

Still a decent wedge of cash on a major outgoing saved, especially as you'll effectively have had 85% of your season ticket income paid in advance the previous year (with only 15% of people having wanted a refund).

What if players are on way more than £2,500 furlough max ?

[Scouse Hibee]

Sorry to go back to the "numbers don't add up" bit.

If what I'm led to believe is correct, the players took a wage deferral to fall within the furlough limit. That means the government will have been paying their wages at 80% since this began, mid- late March. The vast majority of the club's staff have been furloughed, only operating a skeleton staff.

That is a quite substantial saving of money, about a 6th -a quarter of a year's wages falling within this period. Presumably there are other staff who will remain furloughed as long as we don't have fans within the ground.

Presumably the players are either already unfurloughed or are about to be unfurloughed as they return to training.

Still a decent wedge of cash on a major outgoing saved, especially as you'll effectively have had 85% of your season ticket income paid in advance the previous year (with only 15% of people having wanted a refund).

Not sure I understand, the furlough wage payment was already capped at £2500 so them taking a deferral makes no difference to being allowed to claim furlough.

[Ozyhibby]

Sorry to go back to the "numbers don't add up" bit.

If what I'm led to believe is correct, the players took a wage deferral to fall within the furlough limit. That means the government will have been paying their wages at 80% since this began, mid- late March. The vast majority of the club's staff have been furloughed, only operating a skeleton staff.

That is a quite substantial saving of money, about a 6th -a quarter of a year's wages falling within this period. Presumably there are other staff who will remain furloughed as long as we don't have fans within the ground.

Presumably the players are either already unfurloughed or are about to be unfurloughed as they return to training.

Still a decent wedge of cash on a major outgoing saved, especially as you'll effectively have had 85% of your season ticket income paid in advance the previous year (with only 15% of people having wanted a refund).

The deferral was to save the club cash flow and had nothing to do with furlough. Furlough happened anyway and the club has been topping up the players wages to the agreed amount.
So if Scott Allan earns £10k a month and agreed a 20% wage deferral then the situation is :-
Furlough pays £2500
Hibs pay £5500
Scott is owed by Hibs £2000

Hibs saving on Scott’s wage in cash flow terms is £4500 but long term the saving is only the £2500 furlough payment.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Smartie]

What if players are on way more than £2,500 furlough max ?

Which I would expect them to be.

I seem to recall at the time this started that ALL the players were being furloughed (which was a surprise to me, for the size of wage reason) and presumed that with the deferral Hibs had somehow found a loophole around it.

Remember the chat about the players not even being allowed to train due to furlough rules?

If they have been able to do this for the vast majority of club staff then we may well have got our staff costs down to a negligible amount for almost a quarter of the year.

[bingo70]

The deferral was to save the club cash flow and had nothing to do with furlough. Furlough happened anyway and the club has been topping up the players wages to the agreed amount.
So if Scott Allan earns £10k a month and agreed a 20% wage deferral then the situation is :-
Furlough pays £2500
Hibs pay £5500
Scott is owed by Hibs £2000

Hibs saving on Scott’s wage in cash flow terms is £4500 but long term the saving is only the £2500 furlough payment.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think Hibs were a bit generous in doing that. Everybody else in the working world has had to just accept a reduced salary while this is going on if they weren’t able to work.

I don’t see the point of going through all that and then reducing their wage when they’re having to actually work.

I don’t agree with the wage cuts being offered to the players now as they are going to be doing the jobs they are contracted to do. Over the last few months it should have been implemented the same way most of the rest of the country has.

[Smartie]

The deferral was to save the club cash flow and had nothing to do with furlough. Furlough happened anyway and the club has been topping up the players wages to the agreed amount.
So if Scott Allan earns £10k a month and agreed a 20% wage deferral then the situation is :-
Furlough pays £2500
Hibs pay £5500
Scott is owed by Hibs £2000

Hibs saving on Scott’s wage in cash flow terms is £4500 but long term the saving is only the £2500 furlough payment.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Ok, think I get it (I don't have any furloughed employees who earn more than £2500 so didn't know exactly how it worked).

Still a pretty substantial saving for us though, no?

Even if a bit more has to be paid later.

[Ozyhibby]

I think Hibs were a bit generous in doing that. Everybody else in the working world has had to just accept a reduced salary while this is going on if they weren’t able to work.

I don’t see the point of going through all that and then reducing their wage when they’re having to actually work.

I don’t agree with the wage cuts being offered to the players now as they are going to be doing the jobs they are contracted to do. Over the last few months it should have been implemented the same way most of the rest of the country has.

We have to agree everything with the players. Football contracts are not normal employment contracts. You can’t get out of them easily. Fifa are very strict in imposing sanctions on teams not paying players.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[A Hi-Bee]

Agree entirely hence buying my lad an ST and signing up to HSL. I don’t care that my son nor I will see a game, the survival of our club is much more important to us.

Well done Mr Smith

Agree 100% this is not the time for point scoring or anything else, it is a time for doing. Best we can do as supporters is to try and give a bit of extra cash if we can afford it to the club we support and help it through these crazy times.

To many times I hear the old ah but what if, **** the what ifs, that can be sorted when we survive and come out the other side of this emergency.
The time is now, great to see so many supporters now backing this, imagine what we can achieve if we had 5,000 backing the cause with a wee bit extra each month as long as we could afford it.
GGTTH

[Peevemor]

Somebody on Facebook saying Eddie May is away too.

[04Sauzee]

Somebody of Facebook saying Eddie May is away too.

Could be true however I read that the Earth was flat on Facebook.

Hopefully hear more soon

[CapitalGreen]

Ok, think I get it (I don't have any furloughed employees who earn more than £2500 so didn't know exactly how it worked).

Still a pretty substantial saving for us though, no?

Even if a bit more has to be paid later.

It will be a saving yes which will have helped with the impact on our income for season 2019/20 which included:

4 missed home games, including ties v Aberdeen, Rangers and Celtic (20,000+ tickets x £20 = £400k at least)

Postponed Scottish Cup Semi (1/5th share of gate money, 90,000 x £20 = £360k)

Refunds for season tickets (15% of 13,000 = 1950 tickets. ~£100k if refund of £50)

Lost prize money for dropping to 7th - £125k

+ missed other matchday revenue
+ cancelled Player of the Year awards dinner
+ our contribution to BT Sports and BBC refund

So our lost income for 2019/2020 will be somewhere north of £1m

Our staff costs are 60% of turnover so ~£6.5m.
We have furloughed staff for about 2 months (1/6th of the year) so we have made a % saving on staff costs of just over £1m ( £6.5m/6 )

Our cost savings by furloughing staff will be somewhere south of £1m

Deferring the wages hasn’t been a cost saving, it has just kicked the can down the road.

[B.H.F.C]

Ok, think I get it (I don't have any furloughed employees who earn more than £2500 so didn't know exactly how it worked).

Still a pretty substantial saving for us though, no?

Even if a bit more has to be paid later.

It is a substantial saving during those months. But to put it in to context, The Rangers players and management were taking deferrals of up to 50%. Celtic players took what was described as a significant deferral. What we’re doing isn’t unusual.

[matty_f]

Ok, think I get it (I don't have any furloughed employees who earn more than £2500 so didn't know exactly how it worked).

Still a pretty substantial saving for us though, no?

Even if a bit more has to be paid later.

Last year, the wage bill for the club was £6.3m.

That £6.3m represented 59% of our turnover for that year.

The turnover is expected to half - therefore we're already at a deficit before you consider any other costs.

There's no swindle or mis-management of funds here, the money hasn't 'gone' anywhere, but unless significant cuts are made we're going to have a huge gap in our finances unless that income is found somewhere else.

We're not talking small amounts - season ticket sales won't reach last season's levels (IMHO), and while shirt sales are up, the club don't make the full RRP on each shirt, and while it'll provide good income initially, that's not ongoing.

We have no away fans for the foreseeable future, so not a penny in income from Rangers, Celtc, Aberdeen or anyone else that might bring a good crowd.

There are no Category A games available to get a ticket for, so walk-up income is gone, income we'd rely on every matchday.

The foot-fall to the shop is wiped out as there are no fans, so income from impulse sales is gone.

There's no commercial event revenue from the use of Easter Road through the week or at weekends.

There's no hospitality income while there are no crowds at matches.

So until the government eases restrictions to the point where we're allowed back in stadiums, what the club has now is effectively all we have to live on for the next year, at least.

The situation is dire unless the club make drastic cuts and strip things right back.

There is only cost at the club at the moment (save for whenever the regular prize money payments are made).

It's awful that people will lose their jobs, nobody wants to see that happen.

And even the question about Ron Gordon funding the gap - well turnover last year was around £11-11.5m, so we're asking him to stick his hand in his pocket for £5.5m just to see us stand still.

We could take that as a loan, but we'd be repaying it for years.

I think we need to realistic about the figures involved here and understand that nobody's dipping the till here. It costs a lot to run a club our size, and if we don't have the money to do that then it has to be scaled back.

[Iain G]

It will be a saving yes which will have helped with the impact on our income for season 2019/20 which included:

4 missed home games, including ties v Aberdeen, Rangers and Celtic (20,000+ tickets x £20 = £400k at least)

Postponed Scottish Cup Semi (1/5th share of gate money, 90,000 x £20 = £360k)

Refunds for season tickets (15% of 13,000 = 1950 tickets. ~£100k if refund of £50)

+ missed other matchday revenue
+ cancelled Player of the Year
+ our contribution to BT Sports and BBC refund

So our lost income for 2019/2020 will be somewhere north of £1m

Our staff costs are 60% of turnover so ~£6.5m.
We have furloughed staff for about 2 months (1/6th of the year) so we have made a % saving on staff costs of just over £1m

Our cost savings by furloughing staff will be somewhere south of £1m

Deferring the wages hasn’t been a cost saving, it has just kicked the can down the road.

If we had a first team pool of 20 players all earning enough to qualify for the full furlough payment that would be 20 x £2500 = saving of £50k per month to the club on wages.

Assuming we have a number of younger and youth players not earning as much as that and the admin and coaching staff I would suspect our savings on salary paid out due to furloughing would be circa £100-150k per month, depending on staff numbers furloughed etc etc.

[BegbieHSC]

Whoever is leaking needs the sack. If it’s a player, regardless of who, terminate their contract.
Shambles how the S*n seem to have an exclusive every night. Does us no good, and will no doubt be a troubling time for club employees, who deserve much better than tabloid hyperbole.

[hibbyfraelibby]

Who are they going to coach?

The remaining players maybes?😉

[CapitalGreen]

If we had a first team pool of 20 players all earning enough to qualify for the full furlough payment that would be 20 x £2500 = saving of £50k per month to the club on wages.

Assuming we have a number of younger and youth players not earning as much as that and the admin and coaching staff I would suspect our savings on salary paid out due to furloughing would be circa £100-150k per month, depending on staff numbers furloughed etc etc.

Exactly, any savings through the furlough scheme are a fraction of what what we have lost in income from the season ending early.

[Peevemor]

Whoever is leaking needs the sack. If it’s a player, regardless of who, terminate their contract.
Shambles how the S*n seem to have an exclusive every night. Does us no good, and will no doubt be a troubling time for club employees, who deserve much better than tabloid hyperbole.

They may already be away but stll in touch with people at the club.

Once other clubs start going through the same process, the press will be less interested in what's going on at ER/EM.

[Smartie]

It will be a saving yes which will have helped with the impact on our income for season 2019/20 which included:

4 missed home games, including ties v Aberdeen, Rangers and Celtic (20,000+ tickets x £20 = £400k at least)

Postponed Scottish Cup Semi (1/5th share of gate money, 90,000 x £20 = £360k)

Refunds for season tickets (15% of 13,000 = 1950 tickets. ~£100k if refund of £50)

Lost prize money for dropping to 7th - £125k

+ missed other matchday revenue
+ cancelled Player of the Year awards dinner
+ our contribution to BT Sports and BBC refund

So our lost income for 2019/2020 will be somewhere north of £1m

Our staff costs are 60% of turnover so ~£6.5m.
We have furloughed staff for about 2 months (1/6th of the year) so we have made a % saving on staff costs of just over £1m

Our cost savings by furloughing staff will be somewhere south of £1m

Deferring the wages hasn’t been a cost saving, it has just kicked the can down the road.

It will be a saving yes which will have helped with the impact on our income for season 2019/20 which included:

4 missed home games, including ties v Aberdeen, Rangers and Celtic (20,000+ tickets x £20 = £400k at least) Much of these attendances would still have been from ST holders though. How much greater than our 13000 season ticket holders would the attendances have been? I accept that we miss out on a couple of good away supports there, but the walk up home fan numbers would imo be negligible.

Postponed Scottish Cup Semi (1/5th share of gate money, 90,000 x £20 = £360k) Do Hibs budget for reaching semi finals? I accept though that this is potentially a huge loss compared to what we would have reasonably expected, especially if it led to a final or even a cup win.

Refunds for season tickets (15% of 13,000 = 1950 tickets. ~£100k if refund of £50). Do we count this under the first section or here? One or other, not both. 85% of our fans were happy not to claim a refund on their season tickets.

Lost prize money for dropping to 7th - £125k. Ok.

+ missed other matchday revenue Yes, but we'll have missed out on costs too. How much actual profit do we make on this?
+ cancelled Player of the Year awards dinner OK
+ our contribution to BT Sports and BBC refund Has it been clarified anywhere how much this is, when it is due or if indeed it is going to actually happen?

So our lost income for 2019/2020 will be somewhere north of £1m. Hmm. There or thereabouts. I'd say it's a wee bit short of that.

Our staff costs are 60% of turnover so ~£6.5m.
We have furloughed staff for about 2 months (1/6th of the year) so we have made a % saving on staff costs of just over £1m Ok

Our cost savings by furloughing staff will be somewhere south of £1m Ok

Deferring the wages hasn’t been a cost saving, it has just kicked the can down the road. Yep


Point taken. But I guess what I'm saying is - these aren't financial armageddon figures. The furlough scheme was very welcome and will have helped us to mitigate a lot of our problems so far. With cash in the bank, record shirt sales, decent ST sales so far it's interesting that we've taken such an early step to go to the players and request a wage cut. Not saying it's wrong, but if I were the players (and agents) these are probably the points I'd be making.

[Barney McGrew]

Our turnover for the year last year was £10.8m, with staff costs of £6.3m and we made a loss of £700k. Our staff cost this year (before furlough payments) will have gone up and our turnover will have gone down, so we will have a much bigger loss for the FY to July 2020.

In the year ahead from that, the club think we may see turnover cut by 50%. We’ve already seen that season tickets are unlikely to get to pervious levels, and were not gong to be allowed to have people in the ground to the usual numbers.

If that is the case, we’ll be over turnover alone with staff cost before you take into account every other cost we have.

I genuinely don’t understand how some people think we’re going to balance the books without some kind of drastic action. Magic beans?

[CapitalGreen]

It will be a saving yes which will have helped with the impact on our income for season 2019/20 which included:

4 missed home games, including ties v Aberdeen, Rangers and Celtic (20,000+ tickets x £20 = £400k at least) Much of these attendances would still have been from ST holders though. How much greater than our 13000 season ticket holders would the attendances have been? I accept that we miss out on a couple of good away supports there, but the walk up home fan numbers would imo be negligible.

Postponed Scottish Cup Semi (1/5th share of gate money, 90,000 x £20 = £360k) Do Hibs budget for reaching semi finals? I accept though that this is potentially a huge loss compared to what we would have reasonably expected, especially if it led to a final or even a cup win.

Refunds for season tickets (15% of 13,000 = 1950 tickets. ~£100k if refund of £50). Do we count this under the first section or here? One or other, not both. 85% of our fans were happy not to claim a refund on their season tickets.

Lost prize money for dropping to 7th - £125k. Ok.

+ missed other matchday revenue Yes, but we'll have missed out on costs too. How much actual profit do we make on this?
+ cancelled Player of the Year awards dinner OK
+ our contribution to BT Sports and BBC refund Has it been clarified anywhere how much this is, when it is due or if indeed it is going to actually happen?

So our lost income for 2019/2020 will be somewhere north of £1m. Hmm. There or thereabouts. I'd say it's a wee bit short of that.

Our staff costs are 60% of turnover so ~£6.5m.
We have furloughed staff for about 2 months (1/6th of the year) so we have made a % saving on staff costs of just over £1m Ok

Our cost savings by furloughing staff will be somewhere south of £1m Ok

Deferring the wages hasn’t been a cost saving, it has just kicked the can down the road. Yep


Point taken. But I guess what I'm saying is - these aren't financial armageddon figures. The furlough scheme was very welcome and will have helped us to mitigate a lot of our problems so far. With cash in the bank, record shirt sales, decent ST sales so far it's interesting that we've taken such an early step to go to the players and request a wage cut. Not saying it's wrong, but if I were the players (and agents) these are probably the points I'd be making.

The 20,000 figure I used in the first point about missed home games was the cumulative total of walk ups we would have expected across the 4 games and was a conservative estimate. Our av attendance is over 16k, season ticket holders 13k.
Old Firm - 7,000 each
Aberdeen - 4,000
Saints - 2,000


The season ticket refunds is separate from my first point on missed home games as the missed home games amount was only referring to walk ups, not season tickets.

The figures I presented are not Armageddon figures on their own but they are just for 2 months. We are looking at another 12 months of suppressed income on top of this as well.

[Keith_M]

Our turnover for the year last year was £10.8m, with staff costs of £6.3m and we made a loss of £700k. Our staff cost this year (before furlough payments) will have gone up and our turnover will have gone down, so we will have a much bigger loss for the FY to July 2020.

In the year ahead from that, the club think we may see turnover cut by 50%. We’ve already seen that season tickets are unlikely to get to pervious levels, and were not gong to be allowed to have people in the ground to the usual numbers.

If that is the case, we’ll be over turnover alone with staff cost before you take into account every other cost we have.

I genuinely don’t understand how some people think we’re going to balance the books without some kind of drastic action. Magic beans?



Can you put this on a thread of its own then make it a sticky?



Maybe remove the part about Magic Beans though.

:wink:

[matty_f]

It will be a saving yes which will have helped with the impact on our income for season 2019/20 which included:

4 missed home games, including ties v Aberdeen, Rangers and Celtic (20,000+ tickets x £20 = £400k at least) Much of these attendances would still have been from ST holders though. How much greater than our 13000 season ticket holders would the attendances have been? I accept that we miss out on a couple of good away supports there, but the walk up home fan numbers would imo be negligible.

Postponed Scottish Cup Semi (1/5th share of gate money, 90,000 x £20 = £360k) Do Hibs budget for reaching semi finals? I accept though that this is potentially a huge loss compared to what we would have reasonably expected, especially if it led to a final or even a cup win.

Refunds for season tickets (15% of 13,000 = 1950 tickets. ~£100k if refund of £50). Do we count this under the first section or here? One or other, not both. 85% of our fans were happy not to claim a refund on their season tickets.

Lost prize money for dropping to 7th - £125k. Ok.

+ missed other matchday revenue Yes, but we'll have missed out on costs too. How much actual profit do we make on this?
+ cancelled Player of the Year awards dinner OK
+ our contribution to BT Sports and BBC refund Has it been clarified anywhere how much this is, when it is due or if indeed it is going to actually happen?

So our lost income for 2019/2020 will be somewhere north of £1m. Hmm. There or thereabouts. I'd say it's a wee bit short of that.

Our staff costs are 60% of turnover so ~£6.5m.
We have furloughed staff for about 2 months (1/6th of the year) so we have made a % saving on staff costs of just over £1m Ok

Our cost savings by furloughing staff will be somewhere south of £1m Ok

Deferring the wages hasn’t been a cost saving, it has just kicked the can down the road. Yep


Point taken. But I guess what I'm saying is - these aren't financial armageddon figures. The furlough scheme was very welcome and will have helped us to mitigate a lot of our problems so far. With cash in the bank, record shirt sales, decent ST sales so far it's interesting that we've taken such an early step to go to the players and request a wage cut. Not saying it's wrong, but if I were the players (and agents) these are probably the points I'd be making.

If your staff costs are 59% of turnover, and you expect to lose 50% of your turnover, immediately you have a huge problem unless cuts are made.

From them missed games of this season we lose out on all walk up income (home and away) and around 15% of the season ticket income (for those who needed a refund).

We also lose all commercial revenue for those games, so not even thinking about tickets, we miss out on program sales, shop transactions, Happy Hibee sales, hospitality, advertising etc - so only considering ticket sales is selling the missed income well short.

I don't see how it can reasonably be argued that massive and urgent cuts are required.

I go back to that point - if your staff costs are £6.3m and your projected turnover is around £5.5 - £6m, you need to do something about it.

[matty_f]

Our turnover for the year last year was £10.8m, with staff costs of £6.3m and we made a loss of £700k. Our staff cost this year (before furlough payments) will have gone up and our turnover will have gone down, so we will have a much bigger loss for the FY to July 2020.

In the year ahead from that, the club think we may see turnover cut by 50%. We’ve already seen that season tickets are unlikely to get to pervious levels, and were not gong to be allowed to have people in the ground to the usual numbers.

If that is the case, we’ll be over turnover alone with staff cost before you take into account every other cost we have.

I genuinely don’t understand how some people think we’re going to balance the books without some kind of drastic action. Magic beans?

:agree: It is that simple.

[Keith_M]

While I think we all knew that when we purchased our season ticket it was unlikely we would see any games live any time soon..... however does anyone else think it’s strange that the club haven’t addressed the 8000 folk who essentially atm have
paid £400 to see our games online ? The online system is good but can’t help but think those households that have more than one season ticket in them are getting short changed as they would have only needed one season ticket for them all to be able to see the game ?





I paid for Season Tickets to support the club through a financial crisis. My main motivation was to do my bit to ensure we'd even have a club to support when we finally get out of this situation.

I honestly couldn't give a toss if I only get to watch the game online for half a season, or whatever it turns out to be... or about any perceived unfairness about having paid for multiple Season Tickets despite only needing to have bought one to qualify for watching it online.


I can't 100% guarantee it's the case but I'd imagine a lot of the people that bought Season Tickets had the same motivation as me, and share a similar viewpoint.

[JimBHibees]

I paid for Season Tickets to support the club through a financial crisis. My main motivation was to do my bit to ensure we'd even have a club to support when we finally get out of this situation.

I honestly couldn't give a toss if I only get to watch the game online for half a season, or whatever it turns out to be... or about any perceived unfairness about having paid for multiple Season Tickets despite only needing to have bought one to qualify for watching it online.


I can't 100% guarantee it's the case but I'd imagine a lot of the people that bought Season Tickets had the same motivation as me, and share a similar viewpoint.

Same motivation as me to support the club in a difficult time, simple as that.

[B.H.F.C]

Just said on Sky Sports News that they understand there has been initial pushback from the players, which isn’t really surprising.

[Barney McGrew]

Just said on Sky Sports News that they understand there has been initial pushback from the players, which isn’t really surprising.

If that’s the case, it’s not going to end well

[Stuart93]

If that’s the case, it’s not going to end well

Na it’s not, as a fan you’d hope the players would have a bit sympathy but at the same time it’s their livelihoods

[Keith_M]

Just said on Sky Sports News that they understand there has been initial pushback from the players, which isn’t really surprising.


They're perfectly entitled to say no. Hibs can't force a wage reduction on them. I have a feeling that talks between the two will continue, though.

I'd imagine the thought of them taking a wage reduction while Hibs attempt to bring in new players would irk them a bit. However, if we're short of players, I don't really see that the club has any other choice.

[04Sauzee]

Just said on Sky Sports News that they understand there has been initial pushback from the players, which isn’t really surprising.

The press are reporting that no actual figures have been discussed regarding pay cuts and its jusy a proposal in principle. Sky sports understands that there is some pushback? Does that mean players are saying no are asking the question how much are they to reduce their salaries by?

[Barney McGrew]

They're perfectly entitled to say no. Hibs can't force a wage reduction on them. I have a feeling that talks between the two will continue, though

There’s obviously at least one player that’s disgruntled enough that they’re leaking the info to the media.

Thats probably not a great sign.

[bingo70]

Na it’s not, as a fan you’d hope the players would have a bit sympathy but at the same time it’s their livelihoods

At the same time though we offered them a wage deferral at a time other clubs were being told they had to take wage cuts. Players can see we have done our best for them, obviously we don’t know the finer details so don’t want to hang the players out to dry but would be nice if they were willing to work with us when we need them.

[Ozyhibby]

There are only 4 or 5 players at the club who have any transfer value at all. If any wish to take their chances in the market, I’m sure the club will accommodate them. Or they can sit tight, do nothing and we will honour the contract. It’s likely both parties would find that to be unsatisfactory.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Keith_M]

There’s obviously at least one player that’s disgruntled enough that they’re leaking the info to the media.

Thats probably not a great sign.


Florian Kamberi.


Need to get rid.










:wink:

[Stuart93]

There are only 4 or 5 players at the club who have any transfer value at all. If any wish to take their chances in the market, I’m sure the club will accommodate them. Or they can sit tight, do nothing and we will honour the contract. It’s likely both parties would find that to be unsatisfactory.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

This is where I’m at. There’s about 4 or 5 players I genuinely want us to keep outwith that im not sure I’d be fussed to see them stay or go.

It’s cut throat time unfortunately

[matty_f]

I paid for Season Tickets to support the club through a financial crisis. My main motivation was to do my bit to ensure we'd even have a club to support when we finally get out of this situation.

I honestly couldn't give a toss if I only get to watch the game online for half a season, or whatever it turns out to be... or about any perceived unfairness about having paid for multiple Season Tickets despite only needing to have bought one to qualify for watching it online.


I can't 100% guarantee it's the case but I'd imagine a lot of the people that bought Season Tickets had the same motivation as me, and share a similar viewpoint.

Same here - support the club, keep our seats for when the time comes that we can use them again.

I'm honestly not looking for anything else from Hibs for it, despite buying a couple of tickets. Being able to see the games will do me.

[tamig]

I paid for Season Tickets to support the club through a financial crisis. My main motivation was to do my bit to ensure we'd even have a club to support when we finally get out of this situation.

I honestly couldn't give a toss if I only get to watch the game online for half a season, or whatever it turns out to be... or about any perceived unfairness about having paid for multiple Season Tickets despite only needing to have bought one to qualify for watching it online.


I can't 100% guarantee it's the case but I'd imagine a lot of the people that bought Season Tickets had the same motivation as me, and share a similar viewpoint.
Absolutely 100%. Most important thing in all of this is that there is a Hibs for us all to care about.

[Smartie]

This is where I’m at. There’s about 4 or 5 players I genuinely want us to keep outwith that im not sure I’d be fussed to see them stay or go.

It’s cut throat time unfortunately

Unfortunately I think the 4 or 5 we'd want to keep will be the 4 or 5 that somebody might actually want to take off our hands though.

[Gerard]

All we hear is speculation about players not being happy to take a pay cut. The situation is one that Hibs have to cut costs. The major costs at the club are salaries. The amount of the proposed salary cuts are unknown to us at present so it is very difficult to say if the players who are said to be unhappy will accept the paycut. One alternative for these players is to find another club or risk being made redundant. Everyday the news is full of people losing jobs and having to accept that there will probably be no bonus es paid this year to them or perhaps accepting a lesser wage to avoid being laid off.

[Keith_M]

All we hear is speculation about players not being happy to take a pay cut. The situation is one that Hibs have to cut costs. The major costs at the club are salaries. The amount of the proposed salary cuts are unknown to us at present so it is very difficult to say if the players who are said to be unhappy will accept the paycut. One alternative for these players is to find another club or risk being made redundant. Everyday the news is full of people losing jobs and having to accept that there will probably be no bonus es paid this year to them or perhaps accepting a lesser wage to avoid being laid off.


Except we can't just make players redundant, as we'd be legally obliged to keep paying their salary, or at the very least arrange a pay-off.

Given the current situation regarding the number of available players out there, I can't see many voluntarily risking losing a wage and then not being able to find a new club.

[tamig]

Except we can't just make players redundant, as we'd be legally obliged to keep paying their salary, or at the very least arrange a pay-off.

Given the current situation regarding the number of available players out there, I can't see many voluntarily risking losing a wage and then not being able to find a new club.
And looking at employment law I think you’d find it hard to bring any new players in if you’ve made some redundant. We could be toiling to get a team on the pitch.

[superfurryhibby]

I'm not understanding how some teams with less income and resources than ourselves are in a position to sign players?

Personally, I think the fans are doing their bit. If wee Ron can't afford to run the club through this crisis then fan cash donated should be getting turned into a stake holding. I've given enough to Hibs in recent years, can't give any more.

[CapitalGreen]

I'm not understanding how some teams with less income and resources than ourselves are in a position to sign players?

Personally, I think the fans are doing their bit. If wee Ron can't afford to run the club through this crisis then fan cash donated should be getting turned into a stake holding. I've given enough to Hibs in recent years, can't give any more.

Who said we aren’t going to sign any players?

[ElginHibbie]

Aberdeen now doing similar

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53091726

[Keith_M]

Who said we aren’t going to sign any players?


Nobody. Some folk just love speculation.

For instance, is Ron Gordon definitely not putting a single penny into the club at the moment? Well, that may be true, it may be false... but the speculation is that he's definitely not... ergo it's a fact.



Where are people sourcing their current 'information' from?

Gossip in the DR/Sun, rumours on Kickback, somebody's Hearts supporting mate sent them a text...

[Keith_M]

Aberdeen now doing similar

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53091726




:faf:

[Scouse Hibee]

Aberdeen now doing similar

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53091726

Of course they are as will the rest be doing, I can’t understand the fuss over Hibs doing something to protect the future of the club.

Some of the alarmist posts on this subject have been ridiculous.

[ElginHibbie]

:faf:


AND they are apparently about to sign Jonny Hayes, madness a club could somehow do both

[04Sauzee]

Aberdeen now doing similar

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53091726

Tick Tock

[Borderhibbie76]

If the players are playing hard ball over this then let them take their chances in the real world and try and find a new club. I have very little sympathy to be honest, the global economy is in meltdown, millions are losing their jobs and we are pretty much all on reduced salaries and suffering from loss of income just now bar a select and fortunate few. Why on earth should footballers be any different??

We are facing possibly no Gate receipts till 2021 that is 10 months loss of revenue, they need to get a grip on reality I'm afraid.

[Vault Boy]

Surely no, Hibs are the only ones who are 'cash strapped'?!

Hopefully this reinforces the point that the Hibs statement will be par for the course in Scottish football. Unavoidable.

[ElginHibbie]

Of course they are as will the rest be doing, I can’t understand the fuss over Hibs doing something to protect the future of the club.

Some of the alarmist posts on this subject have been ridiculous.

We have sensible people running the club so I am not surprised we were the first to announce something like this, just meant some people jumped to a conclusion too quickly

[davhibby]

The tone of the articles about Aberdeen in comparison to us is quite startling. Shows how much being a media darling the way Cormack has managed since he came in makes a big difference.

However hopefully now folk will calm down and accept the realities of where all clubs are at the moment

[Drewster]

I'm not understanding how some teams with less income and resources than ourselves are in a position to sign players?

Personally, I think the fans are doing their bit. If wee Ron can't afford to run the club through this crisis then fan cash donated should be getting turned into a stake holding. I've given enough to Hibs in recent years, can't give any more.


I completely agree - If Ron needs the fans support he should allow HSL the opportunity to get to the 25.1% share mark.

[Heisenberg]

The tone of the articles about Aberdeen in comparison to us is quite startling. Shows how much being a media darling the way Cormack has managed since he came in makes a big difference.

However hopefully now folk will calm down and accept the realities of where all clubs are at the moment

I thought the same. Completely different.

[04Sauzee]

The tone of the articles about Aberdeen in comparison to us is quite startling. Shows how much being a media darling the way Cormack has managed since he came in makes a big difference.

However hopefully now folk will calm down and accept the realities of where all clubs are at the moment

Sounds slightly different as they are reducing salaries and not looking to reduce their head count in anyway?

[AugustaHibs]

SSN saying that we are planning to disband the youth academy.

[Leitherhibs]

Of course they are as will the rest be doing, I can’t understand the fuss over Hibs doing something to protect the future of the club.

Some of the alarmist posts on this subject have been ridiculous.

The fuss is because the club are being open and honest with the fans, if they weren't communicating about it, the same set of fans would be screaming blue murder at the club for not being transparent - There are some people in life that will just never be pleased.

[The 90+2]

Surely no, Hibs are the only ones who are 'cash strapped'?!

Hopefully this reinforces the point that the Hibs statement will be par for the course in Scottish football. Unavoidable.

Should have done it similar to hearts in all honestly. I knew they would benefit from their actions months ago. Saying that if most staff are furloughed I’m not sure what difference it would have made.

[The 90+2]

SSN saying that we are planning to disband the youth academy.

It would be nice for some clarity and if it’s permanently or just a temp’ measure.

[G B Young]

SSN saying that we are planning to disband the youth academy.

Hard to imagine we would simply disband it. SSN also reporting that the proposed wage cuts are for up to a year so I imagine the youth set-up will probably be put on hold for a similar amount of time. Not great, but not hard to understand either.

[Since452]

Aberdeen asking players and staff to take pay cuts now as well. Not just us that's in bother. Every club will be the same

[Ozyhibby]

Hard to imagine we would simply disband it. SSN also reporting that the proposed wage cuts are for up to a year so I imagine the youth set-up will probably be put on hold for a similar amount of time. Not great, but not hard to understand either.

It’s been failing pretty badly to be honest. Won’t have been as hard a decision as it should have been had it produced some players.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[04Sauzee]

Hearts now putting their account number and sort code in a statement on their website pleading for cash

[The 90+2]

Aberdeen asking players and staff to take pay cuts now as well. Not just us that's in bother. Every club will be the same

Every club will start to act now the training is beginning again I would guess.

[The 90+2]

Hearts now putting their account number and sort code in a statement on their website pleading for cash

I wonder why they are wanting directly and not through the supporters group?

[Keith_M]

Hearts now putting their account number and sort code in a statement on their website pleading for cash


Seriously?

[04Sauzee]

Seriously?

I jest you not

[04Sauzee]

I wonder why they are wanting directly and not through the supporters group?

Quicker to go straight into your own account?

[marinello59]

I wonder why they are wanting directly and not through the supporters group?

Exactly.

[The 90+2]

Quicker to go straight into your own account?

Sheer desperation it seems.

[The 90+2]

Exactly.

👍 :greengrin

[Andy74]

I completely agree - If Ron needs the fans support he should allow HSL the opportunity to get to the 25.1% share mark.

Things like this just don’t matter. There are also other fans that have shareholdings.

[lyonhibs]

I jest you not

https://www.heartsfc.co.uk/news/article/supporter-update-1

I'm tempted to have a chortle and make a bake sale comment but I wonder if something similar will become necessary for us at some point in the next month or 2.

[Iain G]

https://www.heartsfc.co.uk/news/article/supporter-update-1

I'm tempted to have a chortle and make a bake sale comment but I wonder if something similar will become necessary for us at some point in the next month or 2.

That cannot be real! That's just plain begging now!

[The 90+2]

That cannot be real! That's just plain begging now!

Has this been picked up by any media/gunts as said?

[nonshinyfinish]

I don't pretend to understand the Jambo mind – is there a faction of them that wouldn't contribute through FoH for some reason?

[green day]

Has this been picked up by any media/gunts as said?

Too busy putting up things like 2012 cup final on BBC to bother with things like that.

[Billy Whizz]

If you can’t beat them, join them

[Heisenberg]

http://bit.ly/2Z1hfFV

“ However, it’s understood the request hasn’t been well received by Jack Ross' squad.”

Well no, I wouldn’t imagine the team will be ecstatic at being asked to take wage cuts. I’m sure most will also realise the current situation and an agreement will be reached after some negotiation. The signing of new players is a massive issue, especially if we are going to lose some key players.

[Billy Whizz]

http://bit.ly/2Z1hfFV

“ However, it’s understood the request hasn’t been well received by Jack Ross' squad.”

Well no, I wouldn’t imagine the team will be ecstatic at being asked to take wage cuts. I’m sure most will also realise the current situation and an agreement will be reached after some negotiation. The signing of new players is a massive issue, especially if we are going to lose some key players.

The fans are digging deep with season tickets and HSL, the players need to do their bit

[The 90+2]

Too busy putting up things like 2012 cup final on BBC to bother with things like that.

True.

[Heisenberg]

The fans are digging deep with season tickets and HSL, the players need to do their bit

This is my thinking Billy, didn’t want to say it as it might sound a bit harsh on them. They have contracts and may expect these to be honoured. It’s not a normal situation and times will be tough, hopefully a compromise can be reached.

[Peevemor]

http://bit.ly/2Z1hfFV

“ However, it’s understood the request hasn’t been well received by Jack Ross' squad.”

Well no, I wouldn’t imagine the team will be ecstatic at being asked to take wage cuts. I’m sure most will also realise the current situation and an agreement will be reached after some negotiation. The signing of new players is a massive issue, especially if we are going to lose some key players.

We don't know if we are though.

[JimBHibees]

https://www.heartsfc.co.uk/news/article/supporter-update-1

I'm tempted to have a chortle and make a bake sale comment but I wonder if something similar will become necessary for us at some point in the next month or 2.

Wonder if that means some sort of rift between FOH and Budgie. Very odd though least it gives a hacker a decent starting point. :greengrin

[Billy Whizz]

This is my thinking Billy, didn’t want to say it as it might sound a bit harsh on them. They have contracts and may expect these to be honoured. It’s not a normal situation and times will be tough, hopefully a compromise can be reached.

I’ve had an HSL DD set up from the beginning. I’ll raise my DD amount when the players do their bit

[marinello59]

Wonder if that means some sort of rift between FOH and Budgie. Very odd though least it gives a hacker a decent starting point. :greengrin

Maybe the money just isn't coming in quickly enough from there.

[Lago]

Aberdeen now doing similar

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53091726
That should take a bit of the heat off Hibs & reduce the sniping.

[04Sauzee]

Wonder if that means some sort of rift between FOH and Budgie. Very odd though least it gives a hacker a decent starting point. :greengrin

Hearts website hacked apparently, That's Ron's account details 😂

[SaulGoodman]

I hope the staff at Tynecastle enjoy opening their new monthly Ann Summers mystery box I’ve signed them up to.

[04Sauzee]

I hope the staff at Tynecastle enjoy opening their new monthly Ann Summers mystery box I’ve signed them up to.

😂

[660]

https://www.heartsfc.co.uk/news/article/supporter-update-1

I'm tempted to have a chortle and make a bake sale comment but I wonder if something similar will become necessary for us at some point in the next month or 2.

I remember Jeremy Clarkson posted his bank details in a column after a data leak to prove they couldn’t be used maliciously then someone used them to make a donation to charity.

[matty_f]

Aberdeen asking players and staff to take pay cuts now as well. Not just us that's in bother. Every club will be the same

Virtually impossible to be immune from the impact - will be interesting to see what the Glasgow clubs do to cope, their costs must be massive.

[The 90+2]

Virtually impossible to be immune from the impact - will be interesting to see what the Glasgow clubs do to cope, their costs must be massive.

Have they started selling season tickets yet mate? Can’t recall hearing a peep from them in that regard.

[The 90+2]

I remember Jeremy Clarkson posted his bank details in a column after a data leak to prove they couldn’t be used maliciously then someone used them to make a donation to charity.

Direct debits all around to the companies and charities they bumped in 2013?

[04Sauzee]

Virtually impossible to be immune from the impact - will be interesting to see what the Glasgow clubs do to cope, their costs must be massive.

Aberdeen fans seem to think the players have been asked to forgo appearance money and win bonuses? If

[Big_Franck]

I remember Jeremy Clarkson posted his bank details in a column after a data leak to prove they couldn’t be used maliciously then someone used them to make a donation to charity.

Maybe Hearts' bank details could be used to pay back some of their creditors.

[PH91]

I'd venture also that if we did make a couple of signings that capture the fans' imagination (like Nisbet) we might shift a few more season tickets and defray the cost of the deals?

Just a thought...

Even if that was the case, how do you think players will react to Hibs spending money on a transfer fee when the staff they work with are getting paid off and they are being asked to take wage cuts?

It is key that the players are treated with respect and kept on side because having a squad of disgruntled players in a market where it is difficult to move players on would not be a good position to be in.

I'm hoping the fact that Hibs didn't go gung ho with cuts and at least tried to defer wages until the landscape became clearer will help the situation.

[G B Young]

That cannot be real! That's just plain begging now!

How far should a football fan be expected to go with this sort of thing? As far as I can see, since the first begging letter went out as the Romanov regime started to collapse around them the Hearts fans have been continually stumping up for season tickets and FOH donations for six or seven years now. And all for what? To enable them to keep watching a consistently poor team? If they were to step back from this and ask whether it's worth throwing yet more of their cash at the club to bail out the incompetents in charge they might think there are actually more worthwhile things in life to invest in. They could probably have formed their own, better run, football club with the money they've wasted on Hearts.

[BoomtownHibees]

I hope HSL appreciate the £1000 a month direct debit being paid from some Championship club’s account number I found on the internet earlier

[The 90+2]

How far should a football fan be expected to go with this sort of thing? As far as I can see, since the first begging letter went out as the Romanov regime started to collapse around them the Hearts fans have been continually stumping up for season tickets and FOH donations for six or seven years now. And all for what? To enable them to keep watching a consistently poor team? If they were to step back from this and ask whether it's worth throwing yet more of their cash at the club to bail out the incompetents in charge they might think there are actually more worthwhile things in life to invest in. They could probably have formed their own, better run, football club with the money they've wasted on Hearts.

One word.

Lemmings.

[Logie Green]

Hearts now putting their account number and sort code in a statement on their website pleading for cash

Nice that their bank account number has 6-2 and 7-0 in it.....

Wonder who’ll be first to get the photo of Budge sitting on the plaza with her dug begging for spare change?

It’s no wonder the Jambos are not at all there. Every time they go near Tynecastle they get tipped upside down to empty their pockets.

[Keith_M]

Hearts website hacked apparently, That's Ron's account details 😂


Don't tell everybody, it took me ages to set that up!!!!

:na na:

[The Count]

Scottish Media called Ann Budge wise and new tough times were head when she tried to force 50% wage reduction.Hibs make cuts and it that what happens when you have an American owner.Once again Hibs get worse medua treatment than Hearts.

[Beefster]

The tone of the articles about Aberdeen in comparison to us is quite startling. Shows how much being a media darling the way Cormack has managed since he came in makes a big difference.

However hopefully now folk will calm down and accept the realities of where all clubs are at the moment

It sounds like they’re asking players to take pay cuts so that they can protect other staff and community projects. If so, quite a bit different from what we seem to be doing.


Hearts now putting their account number and sort code in a statement on their website pleading for cash

I love to point out when those tits and their fans do something stupid but I don’t see much of an issue with this. They need cash, they’re asking for it.

[davhibby]

It sounds like they’re asking players to take pay cuts so that they can protect other staff and community projects. If so, quite a bit different from what we seem to be doing.



That’s the way it’s being portrayed in the media, however both clubs statements are very similar.

[Unseen work]

Aberdeen fans are of the opinion the players basic wage will remain the same and it will only be a case of no bonuses for appearances, wins, goals etc.

Suppose you don’t know how big/little that is till you see their contracts.

[Keith_M]

It sounds like they’re asking players to take pay cuts so that they can protect other staff and community projects. If so, quite a bit different from what we seem to be doing.



Aberdeen have a budget vastly larger than ours.




I love to point out when those tits and their fans do something stupid but I don’t see much of an issue with this. They need cash, they’re asking for it.

There's nothing wrong with pointing out the irony of them suddenly begging for cash when their supporters have been relishing other clubs being desperate.

Hibs announced they need to cut back financially, so in their eyes we were going bust.

Suddenly it's not so funny any more.

[Beefster]

That’s the way it’s being portrayed in the media, however both clubs statements are very similar.

I’ve just read theirs and re-read ours. I’m not sure that the media is misreporting Aberdeen’s statement (or ours for that).

[Beefster]

Aberdeen have a budget vastly larger than ours.

Depends on how their income is made up. I suppose with bigger turnover and less supporters, it might mean that their turnover drops less as a proportion of the budget compared to ours.



There's nothing wrong with pointing out the irony of them suddenly begging for cash when their supporters have been relishing other clubs being desperate.

Hibs announced they need to cut back financially, so in their eyes we were going bust.

Suddenly it's not so funny any more.

Agreed but I didn’t say that. I’m talking about Hearts begging for donations and posting their bank account details.

[mjhibby]

Aberdeen fans are of the opinion the players basic wage will remain the same and it will only be a case of no bonuses for appearances, wins, goals etc.

Suppose you don’t know how big/little that is till you see their contracts.

Doubt it. Their wage bill is much higher than ours so they will have to save millions. All clubs will be doing this. Unless they have a sugar daddy clubs are still paying out wages agreed before the pandemic and have no incomes coming in. Plus even when the season starts monies coming in will be down by 40 to 50%. Clubs who are staying silent are hoping to make cuts with no publicity. But let’s bash hibs as usual. Tragic but so predictable.

[Unseen work]

I think the difference is that Hibs have maybe been too honest about how difficult it will be where as Aberdeen have been a bit more vague and said there will be cuts but as a whole has a far more positive feel to it.

Easy for press to read the Hibs one with concern and Aberdeens as a slight bump the way both are written imo.

[Onion]

I think the difference is that Hibs have maybe been too honest about how difficult it will be where as Aberdeen have been a bit more vague and said there will be cuts but as a whole has a far more positive feel to it.

Easy for press to read the Hibs one with concern and Aberdeens as a slight bump the way both are written imo.

Media presenting Hibs as having a fire sale. Kamberi for pennies, Marciano and now Boyler all being linked with moves away to keep Hibs afloat. True or not, it's not a good look at the moment when they've had so many fans committing money towards season tickets with no promise of games etc. Quality going down and less games while prices go up. That's not a business model that has any future.

[green day]

I think we are too quick to assume that anyone outside of Hibs and our fans care how these stories "look" in the newspapers or websites.

Its obvious that almost every club in the Premiership will have similar problems (Celtic are fairly immune due to their bank balance).

It is no surprise that Aberdeen and Hibs have opened up first, our costs and hence cuts, are larger than most clubs - I would be worried if we were not doing something radical.

I post on P&B and the Dons fans there are not surprised - and think they shouldnt be signing new players if they cant afford to pay current ones..............much the same as is stated here. A club losing £1m a month cant stay quiet for long and it would be a major shock if Cormack underwrote that all by himself.

Anyone that thinks Motherwell, St Johnstone, Kilmarnock, Dundee Utd etc can weather this based on tv money only and no fans is deeply mistaken.

These stories will become weekly as the new season starts and they have little ST income and nothing through the gates.

[Since452]

Aberdeen have a far bigger wage budget than us with far smaller crowds. They'll be in every bit as much hardship as us if not more. I'm actually very surprised Rangers haven't hit the panic button yet. I'm sure they were sailing close to the wind before the pandemic hit

[Since90+2]

I think we are too quick to assume that anyone outside of Hibs and our fans care how these stories "look" in the newspapers or websites.

Its obvious that almost every club in the Premiership will have similar problems (Celtic are fairly immune due to their bank balance).

It is no surprise that Aberdeen and Hibs have opened up first, our costs and hence cuts, are larger than most clubs - I would be worried if we were not doing something radical.

I post on P&B and the Dons fans there are not surprised - and think they shouldnt be signing new players if they cant afford to pay current ones..............much the same as is stated here. A club losing £1m a month cant stay quiet for long and it would be a major shock if Cormack underwrote that all by himself.

Anyone that thinks Motherwell, St Johnstone, Kilmarnock, Dundee Utd etc can weather this based on tv money only and no fans is deeply mistaken.

These stories will become weekly as the new season starts and they have little ST income and nothing through the gates.

I don't think Celtic are immune either. There annual wage bill is apparently £59 million.

[Hibeesmad]

Aberdeen have a far bigger wage budget than us with far smaller crowds. They'll be in every bit as much hardship as us if not more. I'm actually very surprised Rangers haven't hit the panic button yet. I'm sure they were sailing close to the wind before the pandemic hit

They have no option but to keep punting money if they want to finish above Celtic. They will go on spending outwith their means until they get called up on it then they will sell Morelos and make everything seem okay.

[green day]

I don't think Celtic are immune either. There annual wage bill is apparently £59 million.

Wow, had no idea it was that big !

However, they also have about £60m in the bank................so they are more comfortable than most unless this goes on for longer than one season.

As to the poster above referencing Rangers - there is always some dodgy bank or donor on hand to bail them out. We keep hearing that they are "on the brink" and they never fall in.

[bingo70]

Wow, had no idea it was that big !

However, they also have about £60m in the bank................so they are more comfortable than most unless this goes on for longer than one season.

As to the poster above referencing Rangers - there is always some dodgy bank or donor on hand to bail them out. We keep hearing that they are "on the brink" and they never fall in.

Apart from when they folded and had to start again in the third division?

[Ozyhibby]

Apart from when they folded and had to start again in the third division?

Amazing that people keep needing reminded.[emoji23]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[skankomcphee]

Hearts now putting their account number and sort code in a statement on their website pleading for cash

Tempted to send them £0.07 😁

[Bostonhibby]

Amazing that people keep needing reminded.[emoji23]


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkLiquidated themselves the debt was so high they couldn't pay it. Proper walking away by the now defunct Glasgow rangers.

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[skankomcphee]

That cannot be real! That's just plain begging now!

Let's just be careful here. Stones and glass houses come to mind in this climate.

[green day]

Apart from when they folded and had to start again in the third division?

Of course I havent forgotten that - but as I said, there have been people (on here and elsewhere) telling us that they only had £X to last until the end of last season and had to pay back some loan or other................and yet they are still around.

I would find it amusing if it happened again but dont see it.

[Since452]

Tempted to send them £0.07 😁

They won't get a single green penny from me 😉

[Keith_M]

Let's just be careful here. Stones and glass houses come to mind in this climate.


Sorry, but when did Hibs put a begging letter with bank account details on their website?

:confused:

[Bristolhibby]

Apart from when they folded and had to start again in the third division?

Was about to say that.

Short memories. TBF they act like nothing had happened so who am I to criticise those who don’t realise how ****** they were and lucky they were allowed to reform straight back into the 3rd Division.

J

[Jones28]

Sorry, but when did Hibs put a begging letter with bank account details on their website?

:confused:

They haven’t, not yet. But we don’t know what’s over the hill.