Official Site: CLUB UPDATE

[lord bunberry]

I’m guessing we won’t be signing any new players if we’re asking our current squad to take a pay cut.

[matty_f]

M guessing we won’t be signing any new players if we’re asking our current squad to take a pay cut.

Could be on a one in/one out basis.

[lord bunberry]

Could be on a one in/one out basis.
Possibly, but we haven’t got any out of contract players left. Other than Kamberi I can’t see many leaving.

[Heisenberg]

Possibly, but we haven’t got any out of contract players left. Other than Kamberi I can’t see many leaving.

We’ve already lost a few though and they’ll need replaced if we’re to remain competitive.

[B.H.F.C]

Possibly, but we haven’t got any out of contract players left. Other than Kamberi I can’t see many leaving.

Seven have already left. They’ll need replaced in some way, shape or form. I accept there probably won’t be seven coming in though.

[truehibernian]

Could be on a one in/one out basis.

If Villa are relegated then it's a stick on someone in the EPL will buy SJM matty.........that could be a real lifeline on the player recruitment (and retention) front.

As an aside, I think HSL is a fantastic route for supporters to give extra if they can - I completely understand there's lots more going on in the world, and in peoples own lives (including those behind HSL), that puts football and campaigns onto the back burner. But moving forward, it's a real opportunity to refresh and re-energise the campaign - to attract more payments from supporters that can afford to, and provide a focus and drive towards supporting Jack and his backroom team to get to where they want to be, and invest in the squad.

[greenpaper55]

Giving Mcgregor and Gray new four year contracts last year might not have been the best of ideas,

[BroxburnHibee]

Giving Mcgregor and Gray new four year contracts last year might not have been the best of ideas,

Hindsight is a wonderful thing eh.

This was universally applauded at the time.

As if they could see a pandemic coming.

[lord bunberry]

We’ve already lost a few though and they’ll need replaced if we’re to remain competitive.


Seven have already left. They’ll need replaced in some way, shape or form. I accept there probably won’t be seven coming in though.
I know players have left but if we’re saying we can’t afford to pay the players that are left their full wage it wouldn’t look good if we added to the wage bill. I can’t see the guys having to take a wage cut being happy that the club are spending more money on bringing new players. I’m quite happy to go with what we’ve got this season, our current squad will be pretty competitive if other teams are struggling for money. We might see a few loans brought in if there’s no cost the us.

[HendoDelivered]

Possibly, but we haven’t got any out of contract players left. Other than Kamberi I can’t see many leaving.

Hopefully Tom James leaves for a fee.

[lord bunberry]

Hopefully Tom James leaves for a fee.
I can’t see that happening, he might leave for nothing.

[madhatter]

Giving Mcgregor and Gray new four year contracts last year might not have been the best of ideas,

Think they will transition into coaching this year if able. Tough discussions may also include asking them to end their playing careers...

Doubt many clubs would have a place for either of them in a playing capacity at the moment - too great a risk with injury histories. Ultimately up to them if they want to remain as players though unless there is something in their contracts.

[Robbo6-2]

Hopefully Tom James leaves for a fee.

Id drive James down south for free

[The 90+2]

Might be that we have a rethink. Not sure which way I am on this myself but have said before that what we are doing now is not working. A lot of money has been spent on the academy over the last 6 years since May came in and we have had zero return on the investment.
Would now be a good time to look at a different model? I think so.


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Again I agree, the model we have had since Donald Park then John Park has been quite ***** to be frank. Was the golden generation fluked? Hamilton even have a better strike rate.

Gordon since he has came in has said nothing apart from community and that’s the reason for his investment. If he changes his plans now I agree but it would take some turnaround.

[The 90+2]

Id drive James down south for free

In the back with Kamberi?

[The 90+2]

Hopefully Tom James leaves for a fee.

No way he will get a better contract than he’s on just now.

[B.H.F.C]

I know players have left but if we’re saying we can’t afford to pay the players that are left their full wage it wouldn’t look good if we added to the wage bill. I can’t see the guys having to take a wage cut being happy that the club are spending more money on bringing new players. I’m quite happy to go with what we’ve got this season, our current squad will be pretty competitive if other teams are struggling for money. We might see a few loans brought in if there’s no cost the us.

So when do we ever recruit again? It’s the same in all industries. Folk having to drop money, folk being made redundant. But as we move out of this, recruitment will start again. I think the same will be true for Hibs and football in general.

[itslegaltender]

would we not expect to be able to sell access to live games when there is no fans on a game by game basis? With that, we theoretically could end up with bigger amounts of paying fans per each game. Granted the pie stalls wouldnt be there but were we not in a situation where we made nothing from sales, only rent of the kiosks? a home game against the infirm as example would potentially be a cash cow. Or will Sky seek to stop pay as you go live games via the clubs?

[Andy74]

Giving Mcgregor and Gray new four year contracts last year might not have been the best of ideas,

It was explained at the time that it wasn't 4 yr contracts as players or even coaches - we don't know the full details but I doubt we tied ourselves in too much financially.

[lord bunberry]

So when do we ever recruit again? It’s the same in all industries. Folk having to drop money, folk being made redundant. But as we move out of this, recruitment will start again. I think the same will be true for Hibs and football in general.
We recruit when we can afford to restore players to their original contracts or when a player leaves. Once next season is over and income streams are back to normal then normal recruitment can resume.

[Billy Whizz]

We recruit when we can afford to restore players to their original contracts or when a player leaves. Once next season is over and income streams are back to normal then normal recruitment can resume.

Have the players been told their cut is temporary or permanent

[Hibernianrus]

Giving Mcgregor and Gray new four year contracts last year might not have been the best of ideas,

I think the deals they signed were on reduced terms as they knew they wouldn’t be playing as much but starting out on the coaching side. They may take on some of the roles of the guys that have left.

[lord bunberry]

Have the players been told their cut is temporary or permanent
I’m not sure what the situation is. I only read the statement and that didn’t go into any detail.

[Hibernianrus]

I’m not sure what the situation is. I only read the statement and that didn’t go into any detail.
Think it’s permanent as the players that agree to the wage cut are free to renegotiate their contract . I’ve heard Scott Allan is really unhappy about it.

[B.H.F.C]

Think it’s permanent as the players that agree to the wage cut are free to renegotiate their contract . I’ve heard Scott Allan is really unhappy about it.

He’s nothing to be unhappy about. If he doesn’t want to renegotiate his contract, he doesn’t have to.

[Heisenberg]

He’s nothing to be unhappy about. If he doesn’t want to renegotiate his contract, he doesn’t have to.

Yeah that was my understanding. It’s not an Anne Budge “take this or leave” offer.

[madhatter]

Yeah that was my understanding. It’s not an Anne Budge “take this or leave” offer.

That could well be the offer eventually though. Especially when it comes to our highest earners. I'm glad we are taking a staged approach with this but time may not be on our side.

[Hibernianrus]

He’s nothing to be unhappy about. If he doesn’t want to renegotiate his contract, he doesn’t have to.
Spot on. At least we seem to be going about it in a dignified manner unlike our championship neighbours when they were using the enforcer tactics

[lord bunberry]

He’s nothing to be unhappy about. If he doesn’t want to renegotiate his contract, he doesn’t have to.
It has the potential to cause a split in the dressing room though.

[Ozyhibby]

Hindsight is a wonderful thing eh.

This was universally applauded at the time.

As if they could see a pandemic coming.

Not universally [emoji6]


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[B.H.F.C]

It has the potential to cause a split in the dressing room though.

In the circumstances, you’d like to think that the vast majority of them will be sensible enough to get on with things. It’s going to be their decision at the end of the day. They’re the lucky ones.

[Brightside]

Part of the community initiative sure is having age levels from 20s all the way down? (I’m not disagreeing with you btw).

The community aspect and the Pro-Club are clearly split. There has been nothing to say the community aspect has been cut as for one thing Ron doesn’t pay for that. I think when people says the boys teams are being dropped it will be the pro-youth element.

[greenpaper55]

Where are players going to go, at the level they are at all the leagues will be struggling financially, sometimes it's better the devil you know ?

[JimBHibees]

Think it’s permanent as the players that agree to the wage cut are free to renegotiate their contract . I’ve heard Scott Allan is really unhappy about it.

Sure you have.

[greenpaper55]

Think it’s permanent as the players that agree to the wage cut are free to renegotiate their contract . I’ve heard Scott Allan is really unhappy about it.

Oh Aye, right on the phone to you was he ?

[Lago]

It has the potential to cause a split in the dressing room though.
True, no one likes to loose money irrespective of the circumstances.

[Hibeesmad]

So who are going to be the first players to refuse a wage cut and ask to move on?

[B.H.F.C]

So who are going to be the first players to refuse a wage cut and ask to move on?

Can’t see many of them being able to move on and get better contracts elsewhere.

[McD]

Hold on a minute. I've never paid to use a forum. It's never crossed my mind. Like I stated above I don't even know how much it is and what you get for it so to speak. BUT if you enlighten me it's something I'll take under serious consideration, I've also not got an emotional attatchment to hibs.net and it's users! There's not many things more importaint to me than hibs. If you say the same about a football forum then it's a sad life your living.


what if people’s families, or home, or ability to have food is more important to them? Is it ok for them to take their refund and sleep ok at night?


you have no idea what a person’s reasons may be for taking their refund, and it’s extremely arrogant to pontificate about what’s important to you when you have no idea of their situation or what’s important to them.

[The 90+2]

Can’t see many of them being able to move on and get better contracts elsewhere.

Boyle Kamberi Marciano Mallan Jackson.

[B.H.F.C]

Boyle Kamberi Marciano Mallan Jackson.

Boyle and Kamberi, aye. The rest though? Are they going to get a better club, paying more than Hibs. When teams need to pay a fee as well.

[Hibeesmad]

Boyle and Kamberi, aye. The rest though? Are they going to get a better club, paying more than Hibs. When teams need to pay a fee as well.

I would guess Marciano will be back in Israel when he eventually leaves.

[Sammy7nil]

Boyle Kamberi Marciano Mallan Jackson.

Doidge? He is bound to attract interest his recent scoring record is very good.

[Sammy7nil]

I would guess Marciano will be back in Israel when he eventually leaves.

He was just in the paper saying he and his family love Edinburgh and choose to stay here during lockdown rather than going to Israel.

[The 90+2]

Doidge? He is bound to attract interest his recent scoring record is very good.

True.

[The 90+2]

Boyle and Kamberi, aye. The rest though? Are they going to get a better club, paying more than Hibs. When teams need to pay a fee as well.

Yeah I think on a free yes. Just imo.

[GonzoReturns]

Players and their advisors (not just at Hibs) need to be very careful. Clubs will be running smaller squads supply will outweigh demand.

[Stuart93]

We absolutely can’t afford to start a fire sale & sell off our star players. This would hinder the club as oppose to benefit them imo.

[ShetlandHibby]

I’m a bit worried that we are gonna end up losing some decent players. Even more worried that withdraw funding for our youth team. We’ve produced some amazing young players over the years. Imagine not having it anymore.

[Marco G]

Players and their advisors (not just at Hibs) need to be very careful. Clubs will be running smaller squads supply will outweigh demand.Sorry for players that are asked to take wage cut, it's a short career, but every part of society is going to be hammered over the next number of years. Best to keep a club that is our lifeblood in business first and foremost.

Sent from my SM-T713 using Tapatalk

[Ozyhibby]

I’m a bit worried that we are gonna end up losing some decent players. Even more worried that withdraw funding for our youth team. We’ve produced some amazing young players over the years. Imagine not having it anymore.

We haven’t produced players for a long time now.


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[Sammy7nil]

I’m a bit worried that we are gonna end up losing some decent players. Even more worried that withdraw funding for our youth team. We’ve produced some amazing young players over the years. Imagine not having it anymore.

Not many of any in the last 10 - 12 years ?

[Hibernianrus]

We absolutely can’t afford to start a fire sale & sell off our star players. This would hinder the club as oppose to benefit them imo.
Exactly , the danger we have is to take rock bottom offers and then find ourselves with a light squad . There may be players that become available from other clubs but will they be better than what we have . Some big decisions but until we get offers for any player then we can only hope they see their future here. I would hope that we see a bit loyalty from Boyle as we have supported him through his injuries and gave him the platform to get international football.

[04Sauzee]

Sky Sports

https://twitter.com/ScotlandSky/status/1273000321019756544?s=19

[Stuart93]

Sky Sports

https://twitter.com/ScotlandSky/status/1273000321019756544?s=19

I listened to that. Made me feel a bit better about it all. Puts it into perspective a bit & shows how much the media have sensationalised our statement.

[Hibeesmad]

BT Sport are reportedly in a £3m compensation battle with the SPFL. BBC Scotland also looking for money for radio & tv coverage they have missed out on.

[Hibernian Verse]

That makes you realise just how ****ed Hearts are if they lose this legal case.

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[Irish_Steve]

Oh Aye, right on the phone to you was he ?

Poster has six posts in six years - I`ll leave you to draw your own conclusions, I got into trouble the last time I did lol

[madhatter]

BT Sport are reportedly in a £3m compensation battle with the SPFL. BBC Scotland also looking for money for radio & tv coverage they have missed out on.

Guess this is why club need us. All clubs including Celtic and Rangers are going to take a hit. Maybe Hearts have another mysterious benefactor that can save the day no strings attached.

[Vault Boy]

I listened to that. Made me feel a bit better about it all. Puts it into perspective a bit & shows how much the media have sensationalised our statement.

Glad to hear that it helped a bit Stuart.

[The 90+2]

Sky Sports

https://twitter.com/ScotlandSky/status/1273000321019756544?s=19

Imagine the world when the bad guys won. **** the hearts and the huns.

[Eyrie]

BT Sport are reportedly in a £3m compensation battle with the SPFL. BBC Scotland also looking for money for radio & tv coverage they have missed out on.

I can understand BT Sport, given that their contract is now at an end.

But the BBC has a nerve given that the only thing more one sided than their anti-SPFL demands for restructuring was the vote to reject it.

[18Craig75]

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-transfer-news/hibs-face-selling-top-stars-22203431

It’s time for the club Twitter operator to log back in, the HibsTV guys to dig out their cameras and Communications Director Kenny Millar to start communicating because we’re being hammered in the press.

If it was leaked before the staff being let go knew then that’s really poor form. It might not be true but when there’s silence people make up their own ‘truths’. I posted a couple of weeks ago that communication seemed to have dropped off a cliff. We should be getting excited about the players returning to training and the start of a new season, albeit under strange circumstances, instead the club has shut up shop.

[04Sauzee]

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-transfer-news/hibs-face-selling-top-stars-22203431

It’s time for the club Twitter operator to log back in, the HibsTV guys to dig out their cameras and Communications Director Kenny Millar to start communicating because we’re being hammered in the press.

If it was leaked before the staff being let go knew then that’s really poor form. It might not be true but when there’s silence people make up their own ‘truths’. I posted a couple of weeks ago that communication seemed to have dropped off a cliff. We should be getting excited about the players returning to training and the start of a new season, albeit under strange circumstances, instead the club has shut up shop.

Lot's of ifs, coulds and maybes in there?

[SteveHFC]

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-transfer-news/hibs-face-selling-top-stars-22203431

It’s time for the club Twitter operator to log back in, the HibsTV guys to dig out their cameras and Communications Director Kenny Millar to start communicating because we’re being hammered in the press.

If it was leaked before the staff being let go knew then that’s really poor form. It might not be true but when there’s silence people make up their own ‘truths’. I posted a couple of weeks ago that communication seemed to have dropped off a cliff. We should be getting excited about the players returning to training and the start of a new season, albeit under strange circumstances, instead the club has shut up shop.

“A lot of the players also feel with US owner Gordon’s wealth that he could help more to get the club through its current predicament.”

Interesting.

[Hibeesmad]

"A lot of their top players are unhappy with the way the situation has been handled and the fact it was leaked to the media and then put out via club channels before they were told."

"A major issue for a lot of the players is that they believe the club is still looking at targets in the transfer window and would be unwilling to take reductions if it means freeing up money for new signings."

"A lot of the players also feel with US owner Gordon’s wealth that he could help more to get the club through its current predicament."

No idea if this is the journalist jumping to conclusions or whether this information has been taken from a source but it is something I find believable.

[hibee_girl]

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-transfer-news/hibs-face-selling-top-stars-22203431

It’s time for the club Twitter operator to log back in, the HibsTV guys to dig out their cameras and Communications Director Kenny Millar to start communicating because we’re being hammered in the press.

If it was leaked before the staff being let go knew then that’s really poor form. It might not be true but when there’s silence people make up their own ‘truths’. I posted a couple of weeks ago that communication seemed to have dropped off a cliff. We should be getting excited about the players returning to training and the start of a new season, albeit under strange circumstances, instead the club has shut up shop.

I’m sure we’ll hear from them all in due course. We don’t know if they’ve been affected by the cuts too.

In the meantime it’s probably not helpful to post things that ‘might not be true’

[SMAXXA]

I’m sure we’ll hear from them all in due course. We don’t know if they’ve been affected by the cuts too.

In the meantime it’s probably not helpful to post things that ‘might not be true’

I think the poster has a fair point to be honest and I’m not getting your last point what isn’t helpful to post, what’s maybe not true?

In my experience of message boards you don’t need concrete evidence to post an opinion unfortunately that would be dull 😂

[weecounty hibby]

Hibs need to get the PR team on the front foot. We are going to be the main targets for all of the press as we will be seen as the main rivals and therefore main drivers to non reconstruction. We are already seeing no positive messages even though we have done loads during the crisis. Now being criticized it seems, for doing something that hearts FORCED their players to do

[The 90+2]

I’m sure we’ll hear from them all in due course. We don’t know if they’ve been affected by the cuts too.

In the meantime it’s probably not helpful to post things that ‘might not be true’

There’s not time for due course in all respect HG.

The club need to be doing more then just a statement yesterday. Look at all the suggestions since then. Ron doesn’t want to or can’t put the money in then the club has to be 100% proactive in this.

[bingo70]

Lot's of ifs, coulds and maybes in there?

Not really relevant to the content of the article but the overuse of the word ‘also’ really annoyed me there.

Article seemed full of guesswork, assumptions and contradictions to me.

[hibee_girl]

I think the poster has a fair point to be honest and I’m not getting your last point what isn’t helpful to post, what’s maybe not true?

In my experience of message boards you don’t need concrete evidence to post an opinion unfortunately that would be dull 😂

I just meant that article is purely guesswork so no point getting everyone riled up by it.

It’s late, I knew what I meant :greengrin

[SMAXXA]

I just meant that article is purely guesswork so no point getting everyone riled up by it.

It’s late, I knew what I meant :greengrin

😉 yeah I have to agree reading that article there was a lot of ifs buts and maybes 👍

[madhatter]

“A lot of the players also feel with US owner Gordon’s wealth that he could help more to get the club through its current predicament.”

Interesting.

Interesting way to create a Ponzi scheme narrative again (“we cannot trust the owner”). We don’t know the truth behind this but if you wanted to dig away at Hibs and trip up any donations drive this is the first place I’d hit - build mistrust between fan base and club. Get fans thinking why isn’t Ron doing anything?

Being honest, I’m questioning what Ron is doing. If we fundraise to a large extent I would be pleased to see him mirror that or do something to show commitment. One positive thing regarding this all is we will see the true face of Ron Gordon very shortly. The WeAreAllHibs mask will either fall or it won’t be a mask at all.

Either way, fans need to stick together.

[weecounty hibby]

😉 yeah I have to agree reading that article there was a lot of ifs buts and maybes 👍

To me it doesn't matter if it's made up bull**** or not, the fact of the matter is that we are being portrayed in a bad light again while the tarts are being seen as this wonderful club who have been wronged and are trying to save Scottish football

[green day]

DR article could have sourced all of that from the conjecture on here today.

Players asked to cut salaries won't necessarily be delighted.......but I spoke to one f2f a few weeks ago and he told me they all appreciate that they even have a job and a salary at all just now......and that so many fans have bought STs.

[Lago]

Not really relevant to the content of the article but the overuse of the word ‘also’ really annoyed me there.

Article seemed full of guesswork, assumptions and contradictions to me.
Perhaps, but it's bad press for Hibs just before training restart.

[The 90+2]

To me it doesn't matter if it's made up bull**** or not, the fact of the matter is that we are being portrayed in a bad light again while the tarts are being seen as this wonderful club who have been wronged and are trying to save Scottish football

They aren’t tho and when they done the same months ago they got ripped.

Let’s forget hearts for a second. People apart from Tom English see right though them, we are ****ed, again despite record season ticket sales before. Anyone want to mention not having a proper sponsor for two years? Why are we in this position of looking to sell everyone regardless of this when we have just been bought over? Is Ron Gordon struggling?

Can’t we all come together, Ron Gordon if he can’t invest anymore open the shares again to HSL? If not, why? Surely as many of us have now our money to help Hibernian through this Avenue because of impact that’s hit Gordon, open his shares up again? He bought us for the community afterall and the community is being ripped apart youth level now.

[bingo70]

Perhaps, but it's bad press for Hibs just before training restart.

Agreed.

I’ve been saying for a bit I think our communications have regressed a lot recently, I appreciated the honesty yesterday and I’d like to see more of that. I think we need to make sure the tabloids aren’t setting the narrative here, if we dont say anything, the papers will so I’d like to see us on the front foot tomorrow.

Dempster and or Gordon need to get back in front of the camera again.

[weecounty hibby]

They aren’t tho and when they done the same months ago they got ripped.

Let’s forget hearts for a second. People apart from Tom English see right though them, we are ****ed, again despite record season ticket sales before. Anyone want to mention not having a proper sponsor for two years? Why are we in this position of looking to sell everyone regardless of this when we have just been bought over? Is Ron Gordon struggling?

Can’t we all come together, Ron Gordon if he can’t invest anymore open the shares again to HSL? If not, why? Surely as many of us have now our money to help Hibernian through this Avenue because of impact that’s hit Gordon, open his shares up again? He bought us for the community afterall and the community is being ripped apart youth level now.

We're ****ed again!! Honestly mate you need to go and take a break. That is complete nonsense. And I don't see hearts being criticized anywhere. Not for being bottom of the league, not for wasting millions, not for having an unfinished over budget stand, not for having a management structure that the keystone cops would laugh at, not for paying 6/8k per week for average players, not even for threatening the very existence of other clubs by taking court action just because they have spat the dummy.

[jacomo]

Is it really that surprising? People will have been furloughed which adds to expense as you are not at work so burning through electricity, food and the rest. That's the best case scenario, other people will have lost their income entirely. Football club is very important for us all but if it is a choice between putting food on the table or a football club then it's an obvious choice.


:agree:

Hibs are looking to next season knowing that many supporters are having real financial difficulties, so consequently income is likely to take a massive hit.

[steviehibsleith]

What stars are unhappy and where do they think they are going ?

The only teams in Scotland paying more than us are Aberdeen Rangers and Celtic and the first two are suffering more than us financially if Aberdeen are saying they are9 million short.

Think footballers and agents need to wake up The uk and world probably are entering a huge recession. Furlough is hiding the true effects once that stops there will be more cutbacks.

There will be plenty footballers desperate for contracts and a job. Look for a player in Scotland whose contract has expired as been offered a new one. Hearts accepted there wage cuts think you will find that all there advisors agents sensibly advised them.

If we are asking that I would hope we are not looking at new signings as sad as that sounds. Asking staff to take pay cuts to bring others in doesn’t sit well.

[lord bunberry]

"A lot of their top players are unhappy with the way the situation has been handled and the fact it was leaked to the media and then put out via club channels before they were told."

"A major issue for a lot of the players is that they believe the club is still looking at targets in the transfer window and would be unwilling to take reductions if it means freeing up money for new signings."

"A lot of the players also feel with US owner Gordon’s wealth that he could help more to get the club through its current predicament."

No idea if this is the journalist jumping to conclusions or whether this information has been taken from a source but it is something I find believable.
I can fully understand if the players are pissed off at having to take a wage cut to help bring in new players. Everyone criticised hearts when they were doing it and now it looks like we’re doing the same. The players all agreed to defer their wages to help out the club and now they’re being asked to take a pay cut. Ron Gordon needs to be putting his hands in his pockets and provide the club with some financial backing.

[poolman]

We're ****ed again!! Honestly mate you need to go and take a break. That is complete nonsense. And I don't see hearts being criticized anywhere. Not for being bottom of the league, not for wasting millions, not for having an unfinished over budget stand, not for having a management structure that the keystone cops would laugh at, not for paying 6/8k per week for average players, not even for threatening the very existence of other clubs by taking court action just because they have spat the dummy.


Guys a tool, there really isn't much point in even reading his posts

[bingo70]

I can fully understand if the players are pissed off at having to take a wage cut to help bring in new players. Everyone criticised hearts when they were doing it and now it looks like we’re doing the same. The players all agreed to defer their wages to help out the club and now they’re being asked to take a pay cut. Ron Gordon needs to be putting his hands in his pockets and envied the club with some financial backing.

I’m going to be a bit contradictory here, I sympathise with the players as why should they take a pay cut when we have committed to a contract for them. If we can’t afford their wages we certainly shouldn’t be adding to the wage bill elsewhere.

On the flip side to that though, by deferring their wages they weren’t really doing us some big favour. They’ve not been working, everybody else in that situation has lost 20% of their wage. Many people have lost a lot more than that.

I think, with the benefit of hindsight and seeing the apparent bother we are in now, we shouldn’t have deferred their wages, a pay cut should have been agreed then, not just when we are about to return to training.

[Heisenberg]

I can fully understand if the players are pissed off at having to take a wage cut to help bring in new players. Everyone criticised hearts when they were doing it and now it looks like we’re doing the same. The players all agreed to defer their wages to help out the club and now they’re being asked to take a pay cut. Ron Gordon needs to be putting his hands in his pockets and provide the club with some financial backing.

I’m not sure they’re having to take a wage cut, they’ve been asked if they can help out. If not then I don’t see us threatening to terminate their contracts. It’ll be interesting to see how it plays out, I suspect if the players have been told we need to save this money to sign new players then the uptake will be very low.

The club is going to take a battering in the press for this either way. It’s not a good look for Ron Gordon. I fully understand that we need to cut costs but it appears we’ve handled this badly.

[green day]

Let's not forget, other clubs will be in the same boat.

Aberdeen, burning £1m per month.

I guarantee that our story won't be the last.

[Andy74]

I can fully understand if the players are pissed off at having to take a wage cut to help bring in new players. Everyone criticised hearts when they were doing it and now it looks like we’re doing the same. The players all agreed to defer their wages to help out the club and now they’re being asked to take a pay cut. Ron Gordon needs to be putting his hands in his pockets and provide the club with some financial backing.

Hearts were criticised for doing it about 4 days in when no one had a clue how this was going to play out.

We now know our income will drop by half at least.

There are going to be footballers out there available and if we are forcing a correction with the current squad then so be it.

[lord bunberry]

I’m going to be a bit contradictory here, I sympathise with the players as why should they take a pay cut when we have committed to a contract for them. If we can’t afford their wages we certainly shouldn’t be adding to the wage bill elsewhere.

On the flip side to that though, by deferring their wages they weren’t really doing us some big favour. They’ve not been working, everybody else in that situation has lost 20% of their wage. Many people have lost a lot more than that.

I think, with the benefit of hindsight and seeing the apparent bother we are in now, we shouldn’t have deferred their wages, a pay cut should have been agreed then, not just when we are about to return to training.
I think on the deferral point they have taken a big hit even though it’s temporary. If a player is on £3k a week the drop to £2.5k a month is a pretty dramatic drop. There appeared to be a lot of goodwill from the players at that time, that now in danger of disappearing.

[lord bunberry]

I’m not sure they’re having to take a wage cut, they’ve been asked if they can help out. If not then I don’t see us threatening to terminate their contracts. It’ll be interesting to see how it plays out, I suspect if the players have been told we need to save this money to sign new players then the uptake will be very low.

The club is going to take a battering in the press for this either way. It’s not a good look for Ron Gordon. I fully understand that we need to cut costs but it appears we’ve handled this badly.
We don’t know the full details yet so hopefully it can all be done amicably.

[lord bunberry]

Hearts were criticised for doing it about 4 days in when no one had a clue how this was going to play out.

We now know our income will drop by half at least.

There are going to be footballers out there available and if we are forcing a correction with the current squad then so be it.
It looks like they were right to do it though. On your second point, we can’t replace the whole squad and that could mean a number of disgruntled players. We simply can’t ask players to take a wage cut then go and sign more players, it’s completely wrong.

[tamig]

I think on the deferral point they have taken a big hit even though it’s temporary. If a player is on £3k a week the drop to £2.5k a month is a pretty dramatic drop. There appeared to be a lot of goodwill from the players at that time, that now in danger of disappearing.

I think your numbers are wide of the mark there. The players deferrals were only a relatively small percentage - they’ve been receiving the bulk of their wage. They’ve not been getting the govt furlough cap and nothing else.

[lord bunberry]

I think your numbers are wide of the mark there. The players deferrals were only a relatively small percentage - they’ve been receiving the bulk of their wage. They’ve not been getting the govt furlough cap and nothing else.
Apologies I just read that they’d been furloughed and presumed it was only the government money they were receiving.

[Ozyhibby]

Apologies I just read that they’d been furloughed and presumed it was only the government money they were receiving.

Pretty sure the deferral was 15%. They have been getting the rest. Govt has been helping out with the furlough though.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Hibs90]

What was the bank balance as of the AGM?

[Peevemor]

What was the bank balance as of the AGM?

We don't know, only that there was £5m or whatever in the bank last summer.

[GreenCastle]

I had a feeling this might come to bite us in the arse.

The timing also..just before training resumes and on the day announced reconstruction failed.

I mentioned on another thread that looking for new players while trying to renegotiate with current players isn’t right.

We have been hit by a few situations..obviously initial season ending. The deferral plan means we still owe money until next year. Reconstruction taking ages to sort out. Then games behind closed doors.

Other clubs will be similar but I believe some also used Furlough from the start. Due to our wage bill we couldn’t do that for all.

Would be useful to know who at the club was put on furlough. I assume ticket office staff / club store staff?

Like many it’s a bit crap we have gone from selling all these season tickets knowing we won’t see games in the flesh / buying the strip etc and talk about stadium improvements. I bought a ticket for the team / support club but an improved ER was also something exciting to look forward to. The stadium needs maintenance so I hope that isn’t being ignored completely.

Now we at the complete opposite end of that !!

I’m just glad we aren’t in the championship as that would have been a complete disaster.

Would also be useful to know what’s the plans for the youth set up? Are we scrapping age groups or having less staff as a potential development league won’t run? This will affect lots of clubs.

[Peevemor]

I had a feeling this might come to bite us in the arse.

The timing also..just before training resumes and on the day announced reconstruction failed.

I mentioned on another thread that looking for new players while trying to renegotiate with current players isn’t right.

We have been hit by a few situations..obviously initial season ending. The deferral plan means we still owe money until next year. Reconstruction taking ages to sort out. Then games behind closed doors.

Other keeps will be similar but I believe some also used Furlough from the start. Due to our wage bill we couldn’t do that for all.

Would be useful to know who at the club was put on furlough. I assume ticket office staff / club store staff?

Like many it’s a bit crap we have gone from selling all these season tickets knowing we won’t see games in the flesh / buying the strip etc and talk about stadium improvements. I bought a ticket for the team / support club but an improved ER was also something exciting to look forward to. The stadium needs maintenance so I hope that isn’t being ignored completely.

Now we at the complete opposite end of that !!

I’m just glad we aren’t in the championship as that would have been a complete disaster.

Would also be useful to know what’s the plans for the youth set up? Are we scrapping age groups or having less staff as a potential development league won’t run? This will affect lots of clubs.

Hindsight's a great thing.

Why would it "be useful to know" who's on furlough? What difference does it make whether we know?

We'll never have even half the information required to make a balanced judgement on how the club have coped up until now and what we should be doing for the immediate future.

We can discuss & speculate, but "I told you so" criticism's a bit easy is it not?

[blackpoolhibs]

Footballers are no different to the rest of us, if the company we work for is struggling, then redundancies and maybe even reduced wages may be the only option to keep that company alive.

We then have the choice of getting work elsewhere, or accepting that wage cut and getting on with it until hopefully things get better and our wages go back up.

Footballers are no different, and while i may be struggling with bills and the likes, i'm sure as hell not going to put more in and help them keep their lifestyle up while mine takes a dip for god knows how long.

And if that means we suffer as a football team, and dont win the league or qualify for Europe, guess what, this happens almost every season as a Hibs fan, will i even notice the difference?

[Heisenberg]

Footballers are no different to the rest of us, if the company we work for is struggling, then redundancies and maybe even reduced wages may be the only option to keep that company alive.

We then have the choice of getting work elsewhere, or accepting that wage cut and getting on with it until hopefully things get better and our wages go back up.

Footballers are no different, and while i may be struggling with bills and the likes, i'm sure as hell not going to put more in and help them keep their lifestyle up while mine takes a dip for god knows how long.

And if that means we suffer as a football team, and dont win the league or qualify for Europe, guess what, this happens almost every season as a Hibs fan, will i even notice the difference?

It’s a difficult one to balance, we could end up in serious trouble on the park if we upset the squad too much or sell too many key players without replacing them adequately. Our situation is bad enough without throwing a relegation battle into the mix, which is what could be on the cards. It’s a grim situation.

[GreenCastle]

Hindsight's a great thing.

Why would it "be useful to know" who's on furlough? What difference does it make whether we know?

We'll never have even half the information required to make a balanced judgement on how the club have coped up until now and what we should be doing for the immediate future.

We can discuss & speculate, but "I told you so" criticism's a bit easy is it not?

It wasn’t a told you so post - but I think fans did have their heads in the sand expecting new players to be brought in when they weren’t even paying current players full wages.

Oddly it seemed to be leaked to papers before the zoom call the other day which wouldn’t have gone down well. So obviously someone leaked it.

[GreenCastle]

It’s a difficult one to balance, we could end up in serious trouble on the park if we upset the squad too much or sell too many key players without replacing them adequately. Our situation is bad enough without throwing a relegation battle into the mix, which is what could be on the cards. It’s a grim situation.

We were in a relegation battle last season until we changed manager.

We brought in a few players but still finished 7th.

Loan players away and others possibly leaving doesn’t look too positive which is very frustrating considering this is an ideal time to get back into the 3rd place mix.

[green&left]

It’s a difficult one to balance, we could end up in serious trouble on the park if we upset the squad too much or sell too many key players without replacing them adequately. Our situation is bad enough without throwing a relegation battle into the mix, which is what could be on the cards. It’s a grim situation.

This place is getting more and more like kickback.

We're asking some players to take paycuts and now all of a sudden we're in a relegation battle? As if Hibs are the only club in the league having to make cuts during this world wide pandemic that has pretty much ****ed the entire world economy...

[Peevemor]

It wasn’t a told you so post - but I think fans did have their heads in the sand expecting new players to be brought in when they weren’t even paying current players full wages.

The club was clear on this from the outset.


Oddly it seemed to be leaked to papers before the zoom call the other day which wouldn’t have gone down well. So obviously someone leaked it.

There are always leaks - some innocent and some malicious - some from the club itself.

[Heisenberg]

This place is getting more and more like kickback.

We're asking some players to take paycuts and now all of a sudden we're in a relegation battle? As if Hibs are the only club in the league having to make cuts during this world wide pandemic that has pretty much ****ed the world economy...

Reports of squad unrest and potentially selling our best players is a recipe for a relegation battle. Better hope our recruitment is spot on.

[Peevemor]

Reports of squad unrest and potentially selling our best players is a recipe for a relegation battle. Better hope our recruitment is spot on.

What reports?

Are you not confusing "reports" with speculation on here?

Someone with 4 posts in 7 years (or something) saying that Scott Allan's not happy isn't going to make me panic.

[Heisenberg]

What reports?

Are you not confusing "reports" with speculation on here?

Reports from the press. Scott Burns, who although he works for the sun, has been known to be spot on a lot of the time.

[mjhibby]

Let's not forget, other clubs will be in the same boat.

Aberdeen, burning £1m per month.

I guarantee that our story won't be the last.

Exactly. Every club will have the same drop in income. Maybe some don’t want to admit what they will inevitably have to do get new signings in. With no hospitality etc and crowds down by thousands every club will need to cut their cloth accordingly. Now we have broached the subject many others will do likewise, unless of course they have benny factors with very deep pockets.

[brog]

"A lot of their top players are unhappy with the way the situation has been handled and the fact it was leaked to the media and then put out via club channels before they were told."

"A major issue for a lot of the players is that they believe the club is still looking at targets in the transfer window and would be unwilling to take reductions if it means freeing up money for new signings."

"A lot of the players also feel with US owner Gordon’s wealth that he could help more to get the club through its current predicament."

No idea if this is the journalist jumping to conclusions or whether this information has been taken from a source but it is something I find believable.

Its definitely come from a source, Hibs Net! That's pretty much a summary of comments on here!

[Vault Boy]

It's probably worth mentioning that the whole media team are furloughed at the moment. There won't be much on Hibs' social media channels until the staff are back.

Not ideal for fans who are understandably keen for updates, but clearly a sensible financial decision.

[mjhibby]

Footballers are no different to the rest of us, if the company we work for is struggling, then redundancies and maybe even reduced wages may be the only option to keep that company alive.

We then have the choice of getting work elsewhere, or accepting that wage cut and getting on with it until hopefully things get better and our wages go back up.

Footballers are no different, and while i may be struggling with bills and the likes, i'm sure as hell not going to put more in and help them keep their lifestyle up while mine takes a dip for god knows how long.

And if that means we suffer as a football team, and dont win the league or qualify for Europe, guess what, this happens almost every season as a Hibs fan, will i even notice the difference?

It’s as if only we are doing this. Every club is in the same situation and hundreds of out of contract players will either go part time or face 12 to 18 months out of the game till this pandemic is over. This will be a season like no other hence the reason the gorgie mob have to sue the SPFL to try and claw back millions of lost revenue due to the pandemic and of course due to relegation. Players at every club will be facing what we are doing. It is totally disingenuous for the papers to be going about loads of transfers happening. The market will be drastically down as will the wages for the foreseeable future.

[MacGruber]

Finances taking a massive hit due to the global pandemic, I'm not going to recoil in shock.

There are other teams signing players, Dundee Utd, Motheewell etc but these clubs a) don't have the staff costs we do (playing and non playing staff) and b) don't have the overheads we do.

All teams are going to struggle.

This sentiment we have only missed 4 home games etc - it's not about that, it is about the impact of the future projected income streams, I'm sure we all get that.

There is going to be redundancies and cost cutting - par for the course.

In terms of our team being competitive and not in a relegation fight to end up in the pee wee leagues like Alloa, Arbroath, Hearts etc I'm pretty comfortable about it.

The players we have take a pay cut and stay - great. No need for big recruitment

The players we have don't take a pay cut and go, including Boyle, Allan, Doidge, Marciano - so be it. Then we recruit. Simple.

Point is If you say to the players we can't afford the salaries you are on just now and we can only pay X amount then some stay on X amount and some go. For the ones that go we bring players in that will play for X amount - there will be loads to choose from

[Keith_M]

Wow, one negative article in a newspaper and this place goes into meltdown.

Incredible.

[we are hibs]

Wow, one negative article in a newspaper and this place goes into meltdown.

Incredible.

Thats quite an overreaction. I havent seen anyone having a meltdown. Just people discussing the story.

[SMAXXA]

Wow, one negative article in a newspaper and this place goes into meltdown.

Incredible.

It’s certainly not 1 there multiple even this morning the sun go with a story that Ross wasn’t first choice Kennedy was, I mean what’s the relevance and convenient timing?

Media now want to focus on putting the boot into us now the Hearts saga is likely to slow down till court action. Pathetic media in this country

[green&left]

Reports of squad unrest and potentially selling our best players is a recipe for a relegation battle. Better hope our recruitment is spot on.

From who? The sun and daily record? :rolleyes:

[JimBHibees]

It’s certainly not 1 there multiple even this morning the sun go with a story that Ross wasn’t first choice Kennedy was, I mean what’s the relevance and convenient timing?

Media now want to focus on putting the boot into us now the Hearts saga is likely to slow down till court action. Pathetic media in this country

Yes yam friendly media and there seems to be loads will pile in as they will be too scared to criticise either of the old firm like they would us. The announcement by the club will always generate some bandwidth just got to hope the club continue to put out their own side now and again to counter obvious misinformation.

[B.H.F.C]

I had a feeling this might come to bite us in the arse.

The timing also..just before training resumes and on the day announced reconstruction failed.

I mentioned on another thread that looking for new players while trying to renegotiate with current players isn’t right.

We have been hit by a few situations..obviously initial season ending. The deferral plan means we still owe money until next year. Reconstruction taking ages to sort out. Then games behind closed doors.

Other clubs will be similar but I believe some also used Furlough from the start. Due to our wage bill we couldn’t do that for all.

Would be useful to know who at the club was put on furlough. I assume ticket office staff / club store staff?

Like many it’s a bit crap we have gone from selling all these season tickets knowing we won’t see games in the flesh / buying the strip etc and talk about stadium improvements. I bought a ticket for the team / support club but an improved ER was also something exciting to look forward to. The stadium needs maintenance so I hope that isn’t being ignored completely.

Now we at the complete opposite end of that !!

I’m just glad we aren’t in the championship as that would have been a complete disaster.

Would also be useful to know what’s the plans for the youth set up? Are we scrapping age groups or having less staff as a potential development league won’t run? This will affect lots of clubs.

With the exception of a skeleton staff, everybody at the club has been furloughed. That includes the players and Jack Ross and he spoke about it previously. The wage bill doesn’t prevent you from furloughing and you can top up over the 2.5k a month.

[Keith_M]

Think it’s permanent as the players that agree to the wage cut are free to renegotiate their contract . I’ve heard Scott Allan is really unhappy about it.


Really? Who from?

Somebody on the bus? An Uber driver? Your Mum?

[green day]

It’s as if only we are doing this. Every club is in the same situation and hundreds of out of contract players will either go part time or face 12 to 18 months out of the game till this pandemic is over. This will be a season like no other hence the reason the gorgie mob have to sue the SPFL to try and claw back millions of lost revenue due to the pandemic and of course due to relegation. Players at every club will be facing what we are doing. It is totally disingenuous for the papers to be going about loads of transfers happening. The market will be drastically down as will the wages for the foreseeable future.

Yes, I agree.

This isnt exactly ideal - but our income has halved and our outgoings are almost all salaries - the largest of these are player and CEO salaries, so its not exactly difficult to see where cuts must lie.

It is happening all over the wider economy and football will be no different. Celtic will be fine, Rangers will just borrow untold millions more - and Hearts of course have FoH and Anderson (although less cash as they are in the Champ)

Every other Prem and Champ club is in exactly the same situation as Hibs - some still have players on furlough, so it hasnt quite hit them yet, but it will.

We need to hunker down, deal with it and get through the next year - that Hibs are still here at this time next year is all that actually matters.

[lucky]

Players are bound to be unhappy with wage cuts, who wouldn’t be, but footballers are on a higher wage than most (Even in the Scottish Premiership) and even they will be able to figure out that no club has its core income coming in at this stage. If players don’t want to agree a wage cut then Hibs will try and move them on either by selling them or releasing them. No player is bigger than the club. Hibs have probably 5 players who might attract a transfer fee in today’s market but as there is going to thousands of footballers available every player might want to think twice before deciding to become a free agent.

[jeffers]

It would be good to hear our millionaire owner is putting some money into the club at a time when our finances are obviously being hit badly, or like all his great plans for the club would he prefer other people to do it instead. Obviously I don’t know, but if STF had still been our owner I wonder if he would have put money into the club, even just an interest free loan to help at these difficult times.

[Sammy7nil]

Players are bound to be unhappy with wage cuts, who wouldn’t be, but footballers are on a higher wage than most (Even in the Scottish Premiership) and even they will be able to figure out that no club has its core income coming in at this stage. If players don’t want to agree a wage cut then Hibs will try and move them on either by selling them or releasing them. No player is bigger than the club. Hibs have probably 5 players who might attract a transfer fee in today’s market but as there is going to thousands of footballers available every player might want to think twice before deciding to become a free agent.

The problem is most people's outgoings are based on income. For example large mortgage, car, I don't think many people would cope well with a 50% pay cut, it will cause worry and a lot of upheaval

[.Sean.]

It would be good to hear our millionaire owner is putting some money into the club at a time when our finances are obviously being hit badly, or like all his great plans for the club would he prefer other people to do it instead. Obviously I don’t know, but if STF had still been our owner I wonder if he would have put money into the club, even just an interest free loan to help at these difficult times.
Yep. Must be a bit of a kick in the teeth for office staff etc on salaries circa 20K being offered redundancies while the man that’s running the show sits on millions

[Sammy7nil]

It would be good to hear our millionaire owner is putting some money into the club at a time when our finances are obviously being hit badly, or like all his great plans for the club would he prefer other people to do it instead. Obviously I don’t know, but if STF had still been our owner I wonder if he would have put money into the club, even just an interest free loan to help at these difficult times.

I am not sure how many millions he has but I would be very surprised if he is not taking a big financial hit at this time.

[Peevemor]

It would be good to hear our millionaire owner is putting some money into the club at a time when our finances are obviously being hit badly, or like all his great plans for the club would he prefer other people to do it instead. Obviously I don’t know, but if STF had still been our owner I wonder if he would have put money into the club, even just an interest free loan to help at these difficult times.

Or maybe he should hold on to his money until such time that his investment is going to count for something?

[CapitalGreen]

The problem is most people's outgoings are based on income. For example large mortgage, car, I don't think many people would cope well with a 50% pay cut, it will cause worry and a lot of upheaval

Who is being asked to take a 50% wage cut? 😂😂

[bingo70]

Yep. Must be a bit of a kick in the teeth for office staff etc on salaries circa 20K being offered redundancies while the man that’s running the show sits on millions

Sorry, I don’t agree.

That’s the way of the world, office staff will have a lot less than the company owner. If people are being made redundant it’s because the job they are doing is redundant and unfortunately there is no need for them at the company. I know it’s harsh and terrible for people losing their jobs but if we’re not selling tickets for matches we don’t need staff to sell those tickets, same across the board for all back office roles that aren’t going to be needed for the foreseeable.

I’d love us to keep everyone on but we’re not a charity and if no money is coming in then we can’t adn we need to prioritise the most important part of the club, the first team. The amount of money the owner has is irrelevant imo.

[lucky]

The problem is most people's outgoings are based on income. For example large mortgage, car, I don't think many people would cope well with a 50% pay cut, it will cause worry and a lot of upheaval

I’ve not seen anywhere that players are being asked to take a 50% cut in salary. If they are then Hibs are in a very bad way.

[Peevemor]

Yep. Must be a bit of a kick in the teeth for office staff etc on salaries circa 20K being offered redundancies while the man that’s running the show sits on millions

What? Should he pay them from his own pocket? Why should he?

As someone else said, Ron will probably have taken a huge financial hit. His bank specialises in working with the US hispanic community - one of the hardest hit by Covid-19. Maybe he has bigger problems to deal with.

[jeffers]

Or maybe he should hold on to his money until such time that his investment is going to count for something?

You don’t think putting money into the club now would count for something ? Or for Ron Gordon is it ultimately all about what he can make out of the club in the long term ?

[.Sean.]

What? Should he pay them from his own pocket? Why should he?

As someone else said, Ron will probably have taken a huge financial hit. His bank specialises in working with the US hispanic community - one of the hardest hit by Covid-19. Maybe he has bigger problems to deal with.
But the thousands of supporters, every one of them far less off than the owner, can still find the spare cash for a season ticket for instance? I don’t think asking him to step up to the plate is that unreasonable.

[bingo70]

You don’t think putting money into the club now would count for something ? Or for Ron Gordon is it ultimately all about what he can make out of the club in the long term ?

If it’s to keep back office staff in jobs we don’t need them no, it wouldn’t count for anything.

If he’s having to put his hands in his pocket, and I don’t doubt he will, then it needs to be for the right things.

We don’t need a back office or admin function for the foreseeable future, same potentially applies to the academy if we can’t have youth teams playing for the foreseeable future we don’t need to be paying full time coaches to do that.

Even when we do return to normal, things will likely need scaled back a lot so making cut backs is sensible.

[weecounty hibby]

You don’t think putting money into the club now would count for something ? Or for Ron Gordon is it ultimately all about what he can make out of the club in the long term ?
Where would we be if he hadnt invested? Still paying 509k per year mortgages, he also out money in as working capital. I think he has already done a fair bit that will have helped us. Could he do more? Don't know. I would think that like everyone else in the world he may be having to look at reducing his outgoings

[Peevemor]

You don’t think putting money into the club now would count for something ?

Do you know for sure that he isn't?


Or for Ron Gordon is it ultimately all about what he can make out of the club in the long term ?

Ron has lans for the club and money he wants to invest. What's the harm in him keeping that money until such time that he proceeds with his plans?

Hibs paying audience is down 50% - surely the players realise that that has to affect their wages?

Hibs were the first club to make cuts 16/17 years ago when the Sky TV deal was lost. Players and management were asked to take wage cuts while teams like Dundee, Livi & Dunfermline carried on spending and were offering players wages that we couldn't.

Look what happened to them.

[Peevemor]

But the thousands of supporters, every one of them far less off than the owner, can still find the spare cash for a season ticket for instance? I don’t think asking him to step up to the plate is that unreasonable.

Maybe he has? I'm not going to criticise anyone without knowing the facts.

[we are hibs]

He may have already put money into the club to ease the strain over the last few months. And/or he may be planning on doing so now. It would be nice to hear from Gordon/Dempster at some point on this and other issues (a general update of sorts) but its unlikely we will until this is resolved and if the BBC are right, the consultation period could last between 4-6 weeks.

[GreenCastle]

Surely the ticket office aren’t on furlough as they have been replying to emails and sorting STs.

[MWHIBBIES]

Surely the ticket office aren’t on furlough as they have been replying to emails and sorting STs.

Yes, them working is a sign they aren't on furlough.

[Billy Whizz]

Yes, them working is a sign they aren't on furlough.

Might only be one of them though

[Scouse Hibee]

Yes, them working is a sign they aren't on furlough.

Some companies are alternating staff on/off furlough so alternate staff work every couple of weeks.

[jeffers]

Do you know for sure that he isn't?



Ron has lans for the club and money he wants to invest. What's the harm in him keeping that money until such time that he proceeds with his plans?

Hibs paying audience is down 50% - surely the players realise that that has to affect their wages?

Hibs were the first club to make cuts 16/17 years ago when the Sky TV deal was lost. Players and management were asked to take wage cuts while teams like Dundee, Livi & Dunfermline carried on spending and were offering players wages that we couldn't.

Look what happened to them.

You are spot on I don’t know if he has, but can’t help feel we would have heard about it if he has. I must have missed the bit about the money he wants to invest, I took from the AGM that he wasn’t going to be putting any additional money into the club, all has great plans were to be funded by fans and sponsorship. I’m not disagreeing with the club making cuts, it makes total sense to do so, but coupled with news that our owner is making some contribution at this time would IMO be good to hear.

[hibee_girl]

Surely the ticket office aren’t on furlough as they have been replying to emails and sorting STs.

It'll only be one or two of them I'd imagine. The rest will be on furlough.

[Sammy7nil]

Who is being asked to take a 50% wage cut? 😂😂

Sorry for my ignorance i was under the impression some players took a 50% deferred wage cut. Who knows when that will now be paid? I would assume as finances have got worse rather than better that may still be the case. I assume with your laughter you know the details and can enlighten me ?

[Keith_M]

Sorry for my ignorance i was under the impression some players took a 50% deferred wage cut. Who knows when that will now be paid? I would assume as finances have got worse rather than better that may still be the case. I assume with your laughter you know the details and can enlighten me ?


Deferring wages and taking a wage cut are two different things, though.

Hibs deferred players wages, meaning they will have to be paid the money owed to them at some point. I have no idea when that is, though.

I was honestly surprised that Hibs went with the wage deferral instead of asking if the players would consider reductions, especially since it's been reported that some of the players approached the club to offer to have their wages reduced.

[Sammy7nil]

Deferring wages and taking a wage cut are two different things, though.

Hibs deferred players wages, meaning they will have to be paid the money owed to them at some point. I have no idea when that is, though.

I was honestly surprised that Hibs went with the wage deferral instead of asking if the players would consider reductions, especially since it's been reported that some of the players approached the club to offer to have their wages reduced.

I don't disagree however as things stand some players are likely to be on 50% wages with no idea when those will be paid in full. They are now being asked to discuss a permanent wage reduction i assume none of us know the details of? However we can all assume as finances have now got worse it is likely the offer will not be great.

[CropleyWasGod]

You are spot on I don’t know if he has, but can’t help feel we would have heard about it if he has. I must have missed the bit about the money he wants to invest, I took from the AGM that he wasn’t going to be putting any additional money into the club, all has great plans were to be funded by fans and sponsorship. I’m not disagreeing with the club making cuts, it makes total sense to do so, but coupled with news that our owner is making some contribution at this time would IMO be good to hear.

As an executive director, he is likely to be on a salary.

As I read the Club's statement, all those on salaries are having their situations reviewed. If RG is receiving a salary, that will include him.

[Brightside]

Yes, them working is a sign they aren't on furlough.

Skeleton staff throughout the company.

[jeffers]

As an executive director, he is likely to be on a salary.

As I read the Club's statement, all those on salaries are having their situations reviewed. If RG is receiving a salary, that will include him.

Shows how little I know CWG, I didn’t even realise he was taking a salary out of the club.

[bigwheel]

Shows how little I know CWG, I didn’t even realise he was taking a salary out of the club.

Would be very poor if he was taking a salary for his role ...

[CropleyWasGod]

Shows how little I know CWG, I didn’t even realise he was taking a salary out of the club.

I don't know for sure that he is.

I just remember being struck by an early statement that he was an "executive" chair, rather than "Non-exec", as Rod was. That might simply mean that he is taking more of a hands-on role than Rod did in latter years, and there may be no payment. But Hibs have had a policy in recent years that execs get paid, non-execs don't.

[hibeerealist]

Hearts were criticised for doing it about 4 days in when no one had a clue how this was going to play out.

We now know our income will drop by half at least.

There are going to be footballers out there available and if we are forcing a correction with the current squad then so be it.

At that time, very early in this whole scenario, Budgie went for wage cuts we went for deferrals - it was fairly well accepted that there would be no football until August/Sept maybe even 2021.

So Ron goes for deferrals and what has changed that he now needs cuts? Football likely to start August BCD but back when we implemented deferrals there was no likelihood of fans at matches for the foreseeable!

We have sold nearly 9,000 Season tickets (that has to be more than expected, or is it)?

I admit to being a little confused, not about wage cuts just the timing as it could and maybe should have been done previously.

We cannot lock ourselves into NO players in as a football club will not prosper on the park under that policy, IF we need a ball winning midfielder then we need him and the rest of the squad can see the team needs it so there should be no argument.

Lastly, the timing of our statement - Monday 15th June - was very poor as same day it was confirmed that Hertz would in fact be playing in the lower league with Alloa & Arbroath and we did not even get 24 hours to enjoy that. Do any of us think if the situation was reversed they would make the same statement on the same day???!!

Said it before wise up Hibs FFS!!

[malcolm]

Would be very poor if he was taking a salary for his role ...

He buys a wad of shares, pays off our debts and works to revamp to club with a vision received with mostly great acclaim and anticipation. Along comes a pandemic and he is rewarded by gripes that he is not putting his own hand in his own pocket. So dissatisfaction on him possibly being paid for doing a paid role that benefits the club is aligned with that :wink:

I’m not convinced by the idea that he bought Hibs to make money and some of the perceptions on his obligations are really unrealistic. I’d rather the club did not have to take up the line of credit we know he had already made available as it would mean we come through this experience well.

[jeffers]

I don't know for sure that he is.

I just remember being struck by an early statement that he was an "executive" chair, rather than "Non-exec", as Rod was. That might simply mean that he is taking more of a hands-on role than Rod did in latter years, and there may be no payment. But Hibs have had a policy in recent years that execs get paid, non-execs don't.

Hopefully he isn’t.

[bigwheel]

He buys a wad of shares, pays off our debts and works to revamp to club with a vision received with mostly great acclaim and anticipation. Along comes a pandemic and he is rewarded by gripes that he is not putting his own hand in his own pocket. So dissatisfaction on him possibly being paid for doing a paid role that benefits the club is aligned with that :wink:

I’m not convinced by the idea that he bought Hibs to make money and some of the perceptions on his obligations are really unrealistic. I’d rather the club did not have to take up the line of credit we know he had already made available as it would mean we come through this experience well.

I don’t think wealthy owners should be paid for a chairman’s role ..not in the spirit of getting involved ..neither do I think we should be taking on a lot of debt to get out of this either ....

[Ozyhibby]

He buys a wad of shares, pays off our debts and works to revamp to club with a vision received with mostly great acclaim and anticipation. Along comes a pandemic and he is rewarded by gripes that he is not putting his own hand in his own pocket. So dissatisfaction on him possibly being paid for doing a paid role that benefits the club is aligned with that :wink:

I’m not convinced by the idea that he bought Hibs to make money and some of the perceptions on his obligations are really unrealistic. I’d rather the club did not have to take up the line of credit we know he had already made available as it would mean we come through this experience well.

I’m convinced he did buy us to make money and that’s a good thing if it involves growing the club and selling for a profit.


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[Pagan Hibernia]

I’m convinced he did buy us to make money and that’s a good thing if it involves growing the club and selling for a profit.


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he might end up very disappointed

[jeffers]

He buys a wad of shares, pays off our debts and works to revamp to club with a vision received with mostly great acclaim and anticipation. Along comes a pandemic and he is rewarded by gripes that he is not putting his own hand in his own pocket. So dissatisfaction on him possibly being paid for doing a paid role that benefits the club is aligned with that :wink:

I’m not convinced by the idea that he bought Hibs to make money and some of the perceptions on his obligations are really unrealistic. I’d rather the club did not have to take up the line of credit we know he had already made available as it would mean we come through this experience well.

I’ve had the same reservations about his motives prior to the pandemic. Maybe I’m overly cynical, but out of interest why do you think he bought the club ? He has no emotional ties to Hibs like we all do and with the best will in the world we are unlikely to ever finish higher than 3rd in the league.

[Lago]

I’ve had the same reservations about his motives prior to the pandemic. Maybe I’m overly cynical, but out of interest why do you think he bought the club ? He has no emotional ties to Hibs like we all do and with the best will in the world we are unlikely to ever finish higher than 3rd in the league.
I've always thought he saw it as a business opportunity, not sure how that would work but that was always at the back of my mind.

[Ozyhibby]

he might end up very disappointed

I’m not so sure. There will be plenty opportunities to grow Hibs over the next few years and he has now managed to massively cut our overheads at HTC. We should come out of this a much sleeker operation.


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[Up The Bracket]

What? Should he pay them from his own pocket? Why should he?

As someone else said, Ron will probably have taken a huge financial hit. His bank specialises in working with the US hispanic community - one of the hardest hit by Covid-19. Maybe he has bigger problems to deal with.

Everyone is being hit in the pocket, the fans are coughing up, 8500 of us, it’s about time him and Dempster (who is taking £20k a month off of us) lead by example, if they already are doing so I apologise but they haven’t said they are so are open to criticism.

Was totally shot down in one of the first posts in this thread, I just really don’t understand how we can be so different to other clubs out making offers for players and spending money when we have more season ticket holders and £4.5m in the bank according to the last AGM.

[Barney McGrew]

Everyone is being hit in the pocket, the fans are coughing up, 8500 of us, it’s about time him and Dempster (who is taking £20k a month off of us) lead by example, if they already are doing so I apologise but they haven’t said they are so are open to criticism.

Was totally shot down in one of the first posts in this thread, I just really don’t understand how we can be so different to other clubs out making offers for players and spending money when we have more season ticket holders and £4.5m in the bank according to the last AGM.

We had £4.5m in the bank on the 31st July last year.

[GreenPJ]

Some companies are alternating staff on/off furlough so alternate staff work every couple of weeks.

Thought Furlough had to be minimum of 3 weeks?

[CapitalGreen]

Everyone is being hit in the pocket, the fans are coughing up, 8500 of us, it’s about time him and Dempster (who is taking £20k a month off of us) lead by example, if they already are doing so I apologise but they haven’t said they are so are open to criticism.

Was totally shot down in one of the first posts in this thread, I just really don’t understand how we can be so different to other clubs out making offers for players and spending money when we have more season ticket holders and £4.5m in the bank according to the last AGM.

We are different from other clubs because we have higher attendances than them. Therefore, when fans aren’t able to attend games it has a larger impact on our income.

The £4.5m was the balance as at 2nd July 2019, that money is spent throughout the season and would typically be replenished the following summer by season ticket sales. We are currently 3500 season tickets down on this time last year.

[Heisenberg]

Some further update/clarification from Ron/Leeann would be welcome but probably won’t come until after the consultation period is over. We’re just going to have to watch this play out via the DR and whoever is leaking this info to them.

[CropleyWasGod]

Some further update/clarification from Ron/Leeann would be welcome but probably won’t come until after the consultation period is over. We’re just going to have to watch this play out via the DR and whoever is leaking this info to them.

Indeed.

And I'm fairly confident that that consultation process will include LD's own costs and, if applicable, those of the other executive directors.

[steviehibsleith]

Thought Furlough had to be minimum of 3 weeks?

Correct I am currently on my second three week furlough.

[Scouse Hibee]

Thought Furlough had to be minimum of 3 weeks?

It does I should have said that rather than a couple.

[GonzoReturns]

Indeed.

And I'm fairly confident that that consultation process will include LD's own costs and, if applicable, those of the other executive directors.

Would expect all paid senior managements positions will be reviewed and depending on which areas of the club will be ‘mothballed’ a number of roles will either be made redundant or merged into a new wider role. This will cut right across the whole club. The press will focus on the players but we will lose non-football good folk behind the scenes as well.

[matty_f]

Everyone is being hit in the pocket, the fans are coughing up, 8500 of us, it’s about time him and Dempster (who is taking £20k a month off of us) lead by example, if they already are doing so I apologise but they haven’t said they are so are open to criticism.

Was totally shot down in one of the first posts in this thread, I just really don’t understand how we can be so different to other clubs out making offers for players and spending money when we have more season ticket holders and £4.5m in the bank according to the last AGM.

With respect, the argument here is nonsense. Without our regular matchday income (including ticket sales, hospitality, shop sales and all that comes with it) that £4.5m becomes our budget for the season.

Now, consider that figure was from the year before (IIRC) and we had healthier season ticket sales than we currently have, how much do you think is in there now?

Then, consider that money has to last until next year, covering wages, and all other costs.

There's not enough - we're very lucky that we don't have debt and we own (unmortgaged) East Mains and Easter Road. They're not under threat.

But we have to get our budget down to at least around the cash figure we've got just now.

The money hasn't 'gone' anywhere, but it is accounted for.

[ancient hibee]

In the financial year to 2019 the expenditure, before depreciation,figure was £10.6 million-that's where the money goes and will clearly have to come down now.

[Keith_M]

Everyone is being hit in the pocket, the fans are coughing up, 8500 of us, it’s about time him and Dempster (who is taking £20k a month off of us) lead by example, if they already are doing so I apologise but they haven’t said they are so are open to criticism..


I'd imagine her salary will also be under review.



Was totally shot down in one of the first posts in this thread, I just really don’t understand how we can be so different to other clubs out making offers for players and spending money when we have more season ticket holders and £4.5m in the bank according to the last AGM.


I'm not sure how many times this needs repeated, as this is about the fifth time I've wrote this, but that money will mostly be from 2019-20 Season Tickets, which is used for normal expenses (like player salaries, transfer fees, etc) throughout the season and will obviously reduce every month.

In addition, it would have dropped even more when we unexpectedly missed out on the income from the last four home games. That would have realistically brought an extra 5-6,000 punters through the gate, mostly at Cat-A prices.

Those four games alone would have cost us about half a million quid in missed ticket sales.

[Ozyhibby]

Anyone know how much the academy costs to run each year?


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[Baldy Foghorn]

Lets cut to the chase. At AGM accounts had £4.5m in bank. £2m+ for season ticket sales. Record shirt sales. Prize money for league placings. Is it all but gone?

Is our millionaire owner not putting in? Why did he buy us? Concerning, wish he'd managed to buy Dundee Utd first.

[CropleyWasGod]

Lets cut to the chase. At AGM accounts had £4.5m in bank. £2m+ for season ticket sales. Record shirt sales. Prize money for league placings. Is it all but gone?

Is our millionaire owner not putting in? Why did he buy us? Concerning, wish he'd managed to buy Dundee Utd first.

The money in the bank (5.5m IIRC) was 6 months prior to the AGM, as were the ST and shirt sales. In other words,almost a year ago.

We've had a year of outlay since then, and made a loss according to the club. Not surprising TBF, given that some expected income didn't materialise.

[The 90+2]

Lets cut to the chase. At AGM accounts had £4.5m in bank. £2m+ for season ticket sales. Record shirt sales. Prize money for league placings. Is it all but gone?

Is our millionaire owner not putting in? Why did he buy us? Concerning, wish he'd managed to buy Dundee Utd first.

A post from the heart (pardon the pun). I feel similar at this time.

Some more explanation from the club would be very helpful.

[Baldy Foghorn]

The money in the bank (5.5m IIRC) was 6 months prior to the AGM, as were the ST and shirt sales. In other words,almost a year ago.

We've had a year of outlay since then, and made a loss according to the club. Not surprising TBF, given that some expected income didn't materialise.


The season ticket money is for the coming season as were the strip sales. These were both sold during the pandemic and after the AGM took place.

[lord bunberry]

Lets cut to the chase. At AGM accounts had £4.5m in bank. £2m+ for season ticket sales. Record shirt sales. Prize money for league placings. Is it all but gone?

Is our millionaire owner not putting in? Why did he buy us? Concerning, wish he'd managed to buy Dundee Utd first.
I agree he should be putting money in. The fans are doing everything they can, I’m not sure Gordon is doing the same. What I will say is that we don’t know any details and it’s possible he is putting some money into the club.

[Smartie]

Lets cut to the chase. At AGM accounts had £4.5m in bank. £2m+ for season ticket sales. Record shirt sales. Prize money for league placings. Is it all but gone?

Is our millionaire owner not putting in? Why did he buy us? Concerning, wish he'd managed to buy Dundee Utd first.

There's something not quite right.

And players aren't daft - they'll know all of the above and they've been reasonable enough to accept that their wages be deferred.

If players are being asked to take a wage cut that is anything like substantial (a big if) then even taking into consideration lost revenue due to the coronavirus I can understand why they are pissed off.

What income are we actually missing? Scottish cup semi and (poss) final - surely Hibs don't budget for that, this would be a bonus. No walk-ups, no hospitality from our remaining fixtures of last season. Nae pie sales etc. Less than 15% of punters demanded a refund.

People are already buying decent numbers of season tickets for next season, money in the bank. We might miss out on walk-ups (depending on what sort of PPV TV deal they come up with) and we'll possibly miss out on a few away supports (again, depends on what PPV deals they might come up with).

We're forgone a shirt sponsor again, a move we all backed and surely a move that only made sense if we were in a financial position to do so?

There are unknowns about next season for sure, but I can't see how we could possibly have got through all that money in such a short space of time. No fans in grounds until 2021, squabbles over PPV, Hearts get the start of the season stopped, we'd only sold 2000-3000 season tickets - I could understand the situation - but to be in bother now doesn't add up.

It's strange.

[Baldy Foghorn]

A post from the heart (pardon the pun). I feel similar at this time.

Some more explanation from the club would be very helpful.

It looks like HS is the vehicle for cash at present. It would be helpful to know if the money raised is being matched by the owner.

[Baldy Foghorn]

There's something not quite right.

And players aren't daft - they'll know all of the above and they've been reasonable enough to accept that their wages be deferred.

If players are being asked to take a wage cut that is anything like substantial (a big if) then even taking into consideration lost revenue due to the coronavirus I can understand why they are pissed off.

What income are we actually missing? Scottish cup semi and (poss) final - surely Hibs don't budget for that, this would be a bonus. No walk-ups, no hospitality from our remaining fixtures of last season. Nae pie sales etc. Less than 15% of punters demanded a refund.

People are already buying decent numbers of season tickets for next season, money in the bank. We might miss out on walk-ups (depending on what sort of PPV TV deal they come up with) and we'll possibly miss out on a few away supports (again, depends on what PPV deals they might come up with).

We're forgone a shirt sponsor again, a move we all backed and surely a move that only made sense if we were in a financial position to do so?

There are unknowns about next season for sure, but I can't see how we could possibly have got through all that money in such a short space of time. No fans in grounds until 2021, squabbles over PPV, Hearts get the start of the season stopped, we'd only sold 2000-3000 season tickets - I could understand the situation - but to be in bother now doesn't add up.

It's strange.

Good post Smartie

[CropleyWasGod]

The season ticket money is for the coming season as were the strip sales. These were both sold during the pandemic.

Apologies. I misread your post.

The ST money is well down on last year, so the budget has to reflect that. Normally, that would be the main source of income for the playing budget, of course. It's not a case of "has it all gone?", more a case of "this has to see us through the season"... which, of course, it won't

[The 90+2]

I agree he should be putting money in. The fans are doing everything they can, I’m not sure Gordon is doing the same. What I will say is that we don’t know any details and it’s possible he is putting some money into the club.

If he’s not willing to pony up he should at least be opening shares up to the HSL.

[Billy Whizz]

Anyone know how much the academy costs to run each year?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Probably less than £1/2 Million I’d guess, but remember the 1st team use the facilities too

[The 90+2]

It looks like HS is the vehicle for cash at present. It would be helpful to know if the money raised is being matched by the owner.

It would be a very good incentive for sure. Like I said at the very least shares should be available so we are not just chucking good money after bad.

Perhaps there isn’t a issue and we are just cutting our cloth before it does become a concern. I don’t believe that’s the case though.

[Billy Whizz]

There's something not quite right.

And players aren't daft - they'll know all of the above and they've been reasonable enough to accept that their wages be deferred.

If players are being asked to take a wage cut that is anything like substantial (a big if) then even taking into consideration lost revenue due to the coronavirus I can understand why they are pissed off.

What income are we actually missing? Scottish cup semi and (poss) final - surely Hibs don't budget for that, this would be a bonus. No walk-ups, no hospitality from our remaining fixtures of last season. Nae pie sales etc. Less than 15% of punters demanded a refund.

People are already buying decent numbers of season tickets for next season, money in the bank. We might miss out on walk-ups (depending on what sort of PPV TV deal they come up with) and we'll possibly miss out on a few away supports (again, depends on what PPV deals they might come up with).

We're forgone a shirt sponsor again, a move we all backed and surely a move that only made sense if we were in a financial position to do so?

There are unknowns about next season for sure, but I can't see how we could possibly have got through all that money in such a short space of time. No fans in grounds until 2021, squabbles over PPV, Hearts get the start of the season stopped, we'd only sold 2000-3000 season tickets - I could understand the situation - but to be in bother now doesn't add up.

It's strange.

Smartie the concern in my opinion is for the coming season, we have a massive shortfall as it stands

[CropleyWasGod]

There's something not quite right.

And players aren't daft - they'll know all of the above and they've been reasonable enough to accept that their wages be deferred.

If players are being asked to take a wage cut that is anything like substantial (a big if) then even taking into consideration lost revenue due to the coronavirus I can understand why they are pissed off.

What income are we actually missing? Scottish cup semi and (poss) final - surely Hibs don't budget for that, this would be a bonus. No walk-ups, no hospitality from our remaining fixtures of last season. Nae pie sales etc. Less than 15% of punters demanded a refund.

People are already buying decent numbers of season tickets for next season, money in the bank. We might miss out on walk-ups (depending on what sort of PPV TV deal they come up with) and we'll possibly miss out on a few away supports (again, depends on what PPV deals they might come up with).

We're forgone a shirt sponsor again, a move we all backed and surely a move that only made sense if we were in a financial position to do so?

There are unknowns about next season for sure, but I can't see how we could possibly have got through all that money in such a short space of time. No fans in grounds until 2021, squabbles over PPV, Hearts get the start of the season stopped, we'd only sold 2000-3000 season tickets - I could understand the situation - but to be in bother now doesn't add up.

It's strange.

The Club are budgeting on this season's income being half of what it has been. Presumably, they are assuming no walk-ups, no commercial income and a fall in ST sales.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Apologies. I misread your post.

The ST money is well down on last year, so the budget has to reflect that. Normally, that would be the main source of income for the playing budget, of course. It's not a case of "has it all gone?", more a case of "this has to see us through the season"... which, of course, it won't

Yes I understand it won't last long, but we seem to be the only club coming out with this at the moment (Apart from Aberdeen). Is it really that bleak?

[lord bunberry]

If he’s not willing to pony up he should at least be opening shares up to the HSL.
Agreed. He needs to do his bit like the rest of us. I’m certainly not awash with money right now but I’ve restarted my £18.75 a month to HSL, I do it because like the rest of us on here I love the club. He needs to show the same commitment because if he doesn’t do it now when it’s really needed, you have to question his commitment further down the line.

[CropleyWasGod]

Yes I understand it won't last long, but we seem to be the only club coming out with this at the moment (Apart from Aberdeen). Is it really that bleak?

"At the moment" 😉

[The 90+2]

Apologies. I misread your post.

The ST money is well down on last year, so the budget has to reflect that. Normally, that would be the main source of income for the playing budget, of course. It's not a case of "has it all gone?", more a case of "this has to see us through the season"... which, of course, it won't

Of course the budget is going to be lower but also match day costs will be non existent, we’ve some big players already off our books, asking now for wage cuts throughout the squad and mass layoffs for the academy guys and other staff when we’ve got a brand new owner who should really be assisting us in taking full advantage of the situation across the board instead of comparing what Motherwell have done.

[The 90+2]

Agreed. He needs to do his bit like the rest of us. I’m certainly not awash with money right now but I’ve restarted my £18.75 a month to HSL, I do it because like the rest of us on here I love the club. He needs to show the same commitment because if he doesn’t do it now when it’s really needed, you have to question his commitment further down the line.

👍

[Billy Whizz]

Yes I understand it won't last long, but we seem to be the only club coming out with this at the moment (Apart from Aberdeen). Is it really that bleak?

Probably because we have more contacted players than a lot of the other teams in our area of the league, and like Aberdeen we pay decent wages

Our friends across the city will be working on something similar, and their gap will be miles higher than Hibs

[04Sauzee]

Probably less than £1/2 Million I’d guess, but remember the 1st team use the facilities too

Wonder if any sports minded philanthropist would like to sponsor it for a couple of seasons, we could name it after a charity of his choice say for example Save The Children, could of course do charity events out of there as well 🤔

[Smartie]

Apologies. I misread your post.

The ST money is well down on last year, so the budget has to reflect that. Normally, that would be the main source of income for the playing budget, of course. It's not a case of "has it all gone?", more a case of "this has to see us through the season"... which, of course, it won't

Is it down that much on this time last year though? It's only mid-June. There will be reasons why folk won't have renewed and there will, sadly, be folk who for financial reasons probably won't be able to do so. I expect numbers to be down next season but not by much.

But how many really?

We've shed a few player wages. Slivka won't have come here to be on buttons. If we get shot of Flo's wage (which was by all accounts higher than Docherty's) and even scrape a bit of money in for him (and if we managed to get money for Shaw and F.Murray then I'd expect us to be able to get something for Flo, even if not much) then that would free up some more cash.

[matty_f]

Lets cut to the chase. At AGM accounts had £4.5m in bank. £2m+ for season ticket sales. Record shirt sales. Prize money for league placings. Is it all but gone?

Is our millionaire owner not putting in? Why did he buy us? Concerning, wish he'd managed to buy Dundee Utd first.

Where do you think it's gone and what do you think has happened?

The club has/had x amount of cash in the bank, it's going to have y amount of projected income through the season.

Y will be hugely lower than it would have been in previous seasons - around half is what's being quoted.

Our wages to turnover was at around 60% as per the last accounts, IIRC - so if turnover is halved, immediately you can see the issue unless cuts are made.

The money isn't "gone" but it is accounted for.

Like when you get your wages at the end of the month, you know it's got to cover your mortgage, your food shopping, your council tax etc.

[Keith_M]

Lets cut to the chase. At AGM accounts had £4.5m in bank. £2m+ for season ticket sales. Record shirt sales. Prize money for league placings. Is it all but gone?

Is our millionaire owner not putting in? Why did he buy us? Concerning, wish he'd managed to buy Dundee Utd first.


What was in the bank this time last season would have been used to pay last season's bills, including during the spell when we had no income because of cancelled games (once again, costing the club at least 500k). We also switched manager part way through the season, presumably with a large pay-off involved.

What's in the bank just now, which is anything left over from last season plus Season Ticket sales for 2020/21 (currently 5,000 down on last season's numbers) will be used to pay the bills for the duration of the 2020/21.

We'll also have reduced income because of games behind closed doors (no walk-ups)... and then probably limited crowds (also no walk-ups) when we do eventually get back inside the stadium.

Any sensible business would have to take steps to survive that.



Or it could just be that he's fooling us all and ripping us off at every turn.


(I'll let everyone choose which of those scenarios they prefer to believe)

[CropleyWasGod]

Is it down that much on this time last year though? It's only mid-June. There will be reasons why folk won't have renewed and there will, sadly, be folk who for financial reasons probably won't be able to do so. I expect numbers to be down next season but not by much.

But how many really?

We've shed a few player wages. Slivka won't have come here to be on buttons. If we get shot of Flo's wage (which was by all accounts higher than Docherty's) and even scrape a bit of money in for him (and if we managed to get money for Shaw and F.Murray then I'd expect us to be able to get something for Flo, even if not much) then that would free up some more cash.

It's not so much about "now" as "The next 9 months".If there are no walk-ups or commercial income expected, that has to be factored in.

We can't rely on transfer fees, because the market will be horrible.

[The 90+2]

What was in the bank this time last season would have been used to pay last season's bills, including during the spell when we had no income because of cancelled games (once again, costing the club at least 500k). We also switched manager part way through the season, presumably with a large pay-off involved.

What's in the bank just now, which is anything left over from last season plus Season Ticket sales for 2020/21 (currently 5,000 down on last season's numbers) will be used to pay the bills for the duration of the 2020/21.

We'll also have reduced income because of games behind closed doors (no walk-ups)... and then probably limited crowds (also no walk-ups) when we do eventually get back inside the stadium.

Any sensible business would have to take steps to survive that.



Or it could just be that he's fooling us all and ripping us off at every turn.

Can he not put his own money into the club to stop the majority of what is happening going ahead? Or like suggested even match the support if he’s unwilling to open up shares for some reason?

[B.H.F.C]

There's something not quite right.

And players aren't daft - they'll know all of the above and they've been reasonable enough to accept that their wages be deferred.

If players are being asked to take a wage cut that is anything like substantial (a big if) then even taking into consideration lost revenue due to the coronavirus I can understand why they are pissed off.

What income are we actually missing? Scottish cup semi and (poss) final - surely Hibs don't budget for that, this would be a bonus. No walk-ups, no hospitality from our remaining fixtures of last season. Nae pie sales etc. Less than 15% of punters demanded a refund.

People are already buying decent numbers of season tickets for next season, money in the bank. We might miss out on walk-ups (depending on what sort of PPV TV deal they come up with) and we'll possibly miss out on a few away supports (again, depends on what PPV deals they might come up with).

We're forgone a shirt sponsor again, a move we all backed and surely a move that only made sense if we were in a financial position to do so?

There are unknowns about next season for sure, but I can't see how we could possibly have got through all that money in such a short space of time. No fans in grounds until 2021, squabbles over PPV, Hearts get the start of the season stopped, we'd only sold 2000-3000 season tickets - I could understand the situation - but to be in bother now doesn't add up.

It's strange.

I’m not sure what “isn’t quite right” apart from the obvious to be honest.

I don’t think there isn’t any money there at the moment. It’s just a case that with all the current costs we wouldn’t have anywhere near enough to get through the season.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Where do you think it's gone and what do you think has happened?

The club has/had x amount of cash in the bank, it's going to have y amount of projected income through the season.

Y will be hugely lower than it would have been in previous seasons - around half is what's being quoted.

Our wages to turnover was at around 60% as per the last accounts, IIRC - so if turnover is halved, immediately you can see the issue unless cuts are made.

The money isn't "gone" but it is accounted for.

Like when you get your wages at the end of the month, you know it's got to cover your mortgage, your food shopping, your council tax etc.

I get that M, looks like a lot of cost cutting will happen, marketing probably, as nothing to market on match days.

What I'm getting at is HS seems to be the main vehicle for money coming in, Mr Gordon is a millionaire, is he doing all he can? I remember something at AGM about line of credit.

[Keith_M]

Can he not put his own money into the club to stop the majority of what is happening going ahead? Or like suggested even match the support if he’s unwilling to open up shares for some reason?


I answered the guy's post about what was most likely to have happened to the money in the bank last season and why we're likely to have to tighten our belts this season.



You'd have to speak to Ron Gordon about whether he's willing to invest more money.

[Hibernianinc]

Can he not put his own money into the club to stop the majority of what is happening going ahead? Or like suggested even match the support if he’s unwilling to open up shares for some reason?

Did he not put £1m in at outset, after buying out the debt obligations at purchase too?

Not saying he may not have scope to do more, but I didn’t get his various pitches to fans as “I’m here to spraff my fortune for as long as it lasts”.

[Stuart93]

I answered the guy's post about what was most likely to have happened to the money in the bank last season and why we're likely to have to tighten our belts this season.


You'd have to speak to Ron Gordon for anything else.

Unless RG’s cash is all tied up in other business’ or investments and he doesn’t have the spare cash floating about to give to us.

[Baldy Foghorn]

What was in the bank this time last season would have been used to pay last season's bills, including during the spell when we had no income because of cancelled games (once again, costing the club at least 500k). We also switched manager part way through the season, presumably with a large pay-off involved.

What's in the bank just now, which is anything left over from last season plus Season Ticket sales for 2020/21 (currently 5,000 down on last season's numbers) will be used to pay the bills for the duration of the 2020/21.

We'll also have reduced income because of games behind closed doors (no walk-ups)... and then probably limited crowds (also no walk-ups) when we do eventually get back inside the stadium.

Any sensible business would have to take steps to survive that.



Or it could just be that he's fooling us all and ripping us off at every turn.


(I'll let everyone choose which of those scenarios they prefer to believe)

We seem to be going down route of getting rid of Academy coaches, fine. But the owner wanted us to be the best of the rest, now it's up **** creek without a paddle? Your last sentence was petty. The questions need asking.

[HendoDelivered]

I think the sad thing is, and possibly stating the obvious, it’s probably going to get worse before it gets better.

[Smartie]

I’m not sure what “isn’t quite right” apart from the obvious to be honest.

I don’t think there isn’t any money there at the moment. It’s just a case that with all the current costs we wouldn’t have anywhere near enough to get through the season.

I think I accept the cash having to last the season argument, and I think it is probably prudent of the club to work on a "worst case scenario" basis.

It's just a bit harder for me to accept that we're all that strapped for income when we've sold this number of season tickets by mid-June. Between that and TV income, those are surely our biggest revenue streams.

One of my points yesterday was that arguably we're not getting much value in a footballing sense from our current squad and it might well be that that situation is more acute than any of us might have realised.

[CropleyWasGod]

I get that M, looks like a lot of cost cutting will happen, marketing probably, as nothing to market on match days.

What I'm getting at is HS seems to be the main vehicle for money coming in, Mr Gordon is a millionaire, is he doing all he can? I remember something at AGM about line of credit.

There seems to be an assumption that he isn't putting anything in. None of us know whether that's fair or not.

I'm fairly confident that input from him will be considered, but how much of a priority that is can only be speculated on. The line of credit is probably there, but I'm not very comfortable with the securities that have already been pledged.

[truehibernian]

It looks like HS is the vehicle for cash at present. It would be helpful to know if the money raised is being matched by the owner.

It's why, in my opinion, Leeann should be reaching out to HSL and forming a strategic alliance, sharing the club's expertise at bringing everyone together.

Ron Gordon might add money into the pot - who knows - it's in his interests to do so. He's been the owner for a year and plans have been thwarted by an unforeseen pandemic that's hit every industry hard, especially those that rely on crowds and socialising closely.

Like you BF, I've supported the club a lot longer than Gordon has been here, and previous owners and chairmen/women. Above any owner, the supporters are the club.

There was/is nothing better, for those that can, to hit that 'donate' button on HSL - only if it's affordable however. But as the players and LD said during the cup parade, can you imagine if one tenth of those that came out to celebrate made a contribution - whether that's buying a mug from the shop, a season ticket, a strip, a lottery ticket.........knowing you are making some small contribution to the effort to overcome this is a fantastic feeling :agree:

Many (I think) have had their vision clouded by what's going on over the road, and Anderson spending millions (on them, and on football of late). The latter, a great gesture as it may be, still has a tinge of 'trying to influence'. And Hearts, like others, have announced cut backs, wage cuts, and losses.

But can you imagine, with momentum and support, the reach HSL could have.......to the ordinary hard working fan, to the more wealthy amongst our worldwide support (and there are many).

Seems to me Hibs are getting a plan in place to get through the most traumatic experience we have all had to deal with in decades. And being transparent and honest.

We had over 11,000 season ticket holders - and crowds of over 14-18000 at home games. Can you imagine where HSL could get to, if not only some of the ST holders gave extra to HSL, but those that can't afford a season ticket but are a 'walk up' for many games, decide to pay that way instead (knowing crowds may not be allowed until next year).

We'd be in a very good place. That's why I want HSL to set and announce milestones. Aberdeen do it with their DNA scheme. We could learn from that and really get a strong Hibs/HSL alliance going :aok:

[Keith_M]

We seem to be going down route of getting rid of Academy coaches, fine. But the owner wanted us to be the best of the rest, now it's up **** creek without a paddle? Your last sentence was petty. The questions need asking.


Probably... but so are some of the comments from people insinuating that we have missing millions and demanding to know where it's all gone.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Probably... but so are some of the comments from people insinuating that we have missing millions and demanding to know where it's all gone.

These are fair questions to ask, especially when HS are asking for supporter's to donate. It would be helpful to know if we have budgeted for the worst possible scenario, before we contribute further funding. We went from being relatively sound to panic mode in a short space of time

[Keith_M]

These are fair questions to ask, especially when HS are asking for supporter's to donate. It would be helpful to know if we have budgeted for the worst possible scenario, before we contribute further funding. We went from being relatively sound to panic mode in a short space of time


I know, and I agree that it's good to be informed of what's going on. I just think some people's comments have been a bit over the top.

For what it's worth, I'm not convinced we're exactly in panic mode. We are facing an unprecedented situation though.

[Baldy Foghorn]

I know, and I agree that it's good to be informed of what's going on. I just think some people's comments have been a bit over the top.

For what it's worth, I'm not convinced we're exactly in panic mode. We are facing an unprecedented situation though.

Of course, it's all new and all a bit concerning. I would say losing most of academy coaches is panic mode. Are we to assume there will be no academy teams next season then?

P.S. I'm not sparring for arguments, just looking for reasoned debate on what we all think

[truehibernian]

These are fair questions to ask, especially when HS are asking for supporter's to donate. It would be helpful to know if we have budgeted for the worst possible scenario, before we contribute further funding. We went from being relatively sound to panic mode in a short space of time

We're not in panic mode though BF - we are on a 'war footing' mapping out a sensible, viable financial route out of a global pandemic affecting industries across the spectrum.

And I tell you what, when you look at where we were in 2013, when LD came in to absolute cluster**** of a club, the turnaround was awesome. I'm glad, personally, we have her at the helm - a crisis calls for calm heads and responsible decision making. I've the utmost faith in RG and LD to lead us through this bud :aok: but we can still do as much as we can to help, those that have the time, passion, energy and inclination. It's not even about money either - there'll be those that can't donate money due to personal circumstances, but they'll have valuable skills (and ideas) that could be tapped into as well.

[Keith_M]

Of course, it's all new and all a bit concerning. I would say losing most of academy coaches is panic mode. Are we to assume there will be no academy teams next season then?

P.S. I'm not sparring for arguments, just looking for reasoned debate on what we all think


:aok:

[B.H.F.C]

I think I accept the cash having to last the season argument, and I think it is probably prudent of the club to work on a "worst case scenario" basis.

It's just a bit harder for me to accept that we're all that strapped for income when we've sold this number of season tickets by mid-June. Between that and TV income, those are surely our biggest revenue streams.

One of my points yesterday was that arguably we're not getting much value in a footballing sense from our current squad and it might well be that that situation is more acute than any of us might have realised.

Season tickets will be our biggest revenue stream but based on what we’ve sold so far what’s that, less than £3m? Normally our revenues would be £10m plus I think?

I’m totally of the opinion that if fans, a lot of who will be skint, are sticking extra cash in the owner will has to do something by the way. Because of the cost cutting there seems to be an assumption he’s not. I’ve seen some suggestions that he could put money in and stop it, but maybe he doesn’t want to in certain scenarios. Not sure if that’s what you’re alluding to in your last point.

[lord bunberry]

I think I accept the cash having to last the season argument, and I think it is probably prudent of the club to work on a "worst case scenario" basis.

It's just a bit harder for me to accept that we're all that strapped for income when we've sold this number of season tickets by mid-June. Between that and TV income, those are surely our biggest revenue streams.

One of my points yesterday was that arguably we're not getting much value in a footballing sense from our current squad and it might well be that that situation is more acute than any of us might have realised.
On the point of TV money has there not been a significant increase on that from last season?

[ancient hibee]

When staff costs are over £6M and other operating expenses over £4M it shouldn’t take too much imagination to know where the money goes.

[Smartie]

Season tickets will be our biggest revenue stream but based on what we’ve sold so far what’s that, less than £3m? Normally our revenues would be £10m plus I think?

I’m totally of the opinion that if fans, a lot of who will be skint, are sticking extra cash in the owner will has to do something by the way. Because of the cost cutting there seems to be an assumption he’s not. I’ve seen some suggestions that he could put money in and stop it, but maybe he doesn’t want to in certain scenarios. Not sure if that’s what you’re alluding to in your last point.

My last point is mainly beating the club up for past misdemeanours. I'm miffed that we've ended up here - from winning the cup, to winning promotion, to having an excellent first season back up we shouldn't really be in this position. I'm more annoyed at the past couple of years than anything that's happening now.

I'm just surprised that our problems are as acute as they seem. We were all quite happy with what was presented at the AGM and you would have expected us to be in a better position to weather any sort of crisis than most clubs.

FWIW I think it's entirely up to Ron Gordon what he does or doesn't put in and I'd always rather have a club that stands on its own two feet than one that exists on handouts from a millionaire (although the odd handout when times are tough would be nice).

I'm just surprised that we're in a position where we are ALLEGEDLY pissing off our best players, asking them to take cuts because people elsewhere haven't been able to put an adequate squad together for the past 2 seasons. I thought we were in a strong enough position, even taking into consideration covid 19, to avoid feeling the need to do that. Asking for the wage deferral was reasonable, asking for cuts probably not. Devil will be in the detail though, toys not the pram for a 5% cut is maybe different to expecting players who have done the business for us to expect cuts of up to 30%.

[Billy Whizz]

On the point of TV money has there not been a significant increase on that from last season?

Think it’s going up from around £18m to £30m per season.
Think it’s paid in trunches and final league placings

[Onion]

Season tickets will be our biggest revenue stream but based on what we’ve sold so far what’s that, less than £3m? Normally our revenues would be £10m plus I think?

I’m totally of the opinion that if fans, a lot of who will be skint, are sticking extra cash in the owner will has to do something by the way. Because of the cost cutting there seems to be an assumption he’s not. I’ve seen some suggestions that he could put money in and stop it, but maybe he doesn’t want to in certain scenarios. Not sure if that’s what you’re alluding to in your last point.

RG must put cash into the business or find a way of raising capital to see us through this. It cannot all be about downsizing the business to meet the fan revenue available. The business assumption must be that Covid will be overcome at some point within next 12-18 months otherwise football as we know it is dead.

[Spike Mandela]

Yes I understand it won't last long, but we seem to be the only club coming out with this at the moment (Apart from Aberdeen). Is it really that bleak?

Surely it’s just sensible planning, painful but the proper thing to do. We are “cutting our cloth to suit” something Hearts and others seem incapable of doing at anytime under any circumstances.

[Smartie]

On the point of TV money has there not been a significant increase on that from last season?

That's what I thought.

Is there not also scope for there to be more, if we ended up with some sort of PPV for away fans instead of having them as walk-ups?

(Accepting that away support figures will be zero until we have fans in grounds).

[CapitalGreen]

I think some people are truly naive to the financial impacts of what is currently happening. Including the chairman of other clubs.

Current income we are not getting and uncertainties:

Season tickets: currently sold 3,500 less than this point last year
No Walk ups/away fans for foreseeable: We average 4-5000 walk up/away fans per league match.
No matchday income from League cup if it is cancelled
No other matchday income such as Hospitality, food, stadium tours, mascot packages, matchday sponsorship, happy hibee draw
No Player of the Year awards night
No use of stadium for functions, conferences, x-mas parties etc

We don’t know when limited crowds will be allowed back in stadia
We don’t know when full crowds will be allowed back in stadia
We don’t know with certainty if a full 38 game season will be completed

Is Murrayfield a solution to get fans back? What will that cost?

Potential loss of prize money to repay BT sports and BBC
Potential loss of prize money to pay Hearts & Partick

Will a deep recession impact season ticket numbers further in future seasons?

[B.H.F.C]

On the point of TV money has there not been a significant increase on that from last season?

Don’t know if it significant. And you don’t know how much you are getting until you know where they have finished so imagine that’s something else where the budget for the minimum amount.

[Smartie]

Surely it’s just sensible planning, painful but the proper thing to do. We are “cutting our cloth to suit” something Hearts and others seem incapable of doing ay anytime under any circumstances.

In all fairness, Hibs have a good track record lately of being able to do this, often ahead of the game, albeit under a different regime.

[ancient hibee]

I think some people are truly naive to the financial impacts of what is currently happening. Including the chairman of other clubs.

Current income we are not getting and uncertainties:

Season tickets: currently sold 3,500 less than this point last year
No Walk ups/away fans for foreseeable: We average 4-5000 walk up/away fans per league match.
No matchday income from League cup if it is cancelled
No other matchday income such as Hospitality, food, stadium tours, mascot packages, matchday sponsorship, happy hibee draw
No Player of the Year awards night
No use of stadium for functions, conferences, x-mas parties etc

We don’t know when limited crowds will be allowed back in stadia
We don’t know when full crowds will be allowed back in stadia
We don’t know with certainty if a full 38 game season will be completed

Is Murrayfield a solution to get fans back? What will that cost?

Potential loss of prize money to repay BT sports and BBC
Potential loss of prize money to pay Hearts & Partick

Will a deep recession impact season ticket numbers further in future seasons?

:top marks

[Chorley Hibee]

There's something not quite right.

And players aren't daft - they'll know all of the above and they've been reasonable enough to accept that their wages be deferred.

If players are being asked to take a wage cut that is anything like substantial (a big if) then even taking into consideration lost revenue due to the coronavirus I can understand why they are pissed off.

What income are we actually missing? Scottish cup semi and (poss) final - surely Hibs don't budget for that, this would be a bonus. No walk-ups, no hospitality from our remaining fixtures of last season. Nae pie sales etc. Less than 15% of punters demanded a refund.

People are already buying decent numbers of season tickets for next season, money in the bank. We might miss out on walk-ups (depending on what sort of PPV TV deal they come up with) and we'll possibly miss out on a few away supports (again, depends on what PPV deals they might come up with).

We're forgone a shirt sponsor again, a move we all backed and surely a move that only made sense if we were in a financial position to do so?

There are unknowns about next season for sure, but I can't see how we could possibly have got through all that money in such a short space of time. No fans in grounds until 2021, squabbles over PPV, Hearts get the start of the season stopped, we'd only sold 2000-3000 season tickets - I could understand the situation - but to be in bother now doesn't add up.

It's strange.

I think that's a very fair appraisal of where I see things presently.

I'm not sure it all adds up either.

[04Sauzee]

I think some people are truly naive to the financial impacts of what is currently happening. Including the chairman of other clubs.

Current income we are not getting and uncertainties:

Season tickets: currently sold 3,500 less than this point last year
No Walk ups/away fans for foreseeable: We average 4-5000 walk up/away fans per league match.
No matchday income from League cup if it is cancelled
No other matchday income such as Hospitality, food, stadium tours, mascot packages, matchday sponsorship, happy hibee draw
No Player of the Year awards night
No use of stadium for functions, conferences, x-mas parties etc

We don’t know when limited crowds will be allowed back in stadia
We don’t know when full crowds will be allowed back in stadia
We don’t know with certainty if a full 38 game season will be completed

Is Murrayfield a solution to get fans back? What will that cost?

Potential loss of prize money to repay BT sports and BBC
Potential loss of prize money to pay Hearts & Partick

Will a deep recession impact season ticket numbers further in future seasons?
Spot on all the things I'd like to have articulated but couldn't

[lord bunberry]

Think it’s going up from around £18m to £30m per season.
Think it’s paid in trunches and final league placings
Cheers Billy.

[matty_f]

I think that's a very fair appraisal of where I see things presently.

I'm not sure it all adds up either.

Read the posts explaining it above. Of course it adds up.

[CapitalGreen]

I think that's a very fair appraisal of where I see things presently.

I'm not sure it all adds up either.

Have you tried adding it up?

Season ticket numbers staying static would be a reduction in income of about £1.5m (4500 not sold x £300)
No walk ups or away fans about £2m (5000 x £20 x 19 home games)
No league cup income, last season income about £500k

Then add all the associated matchday income I’ve listed in my previous post.

[lord bunberry]

Don’t know if it significant. And you don’t know how much you are getting until you know where they have finished so imagine that’s something else where the budget for the minimum amount.
Apparently it’s up from £18m to £30m even worse case scenario it’s going to be a big increase.

[Chorley Hibee]

Read the posts explaining it above. Of course it adds up.

Don't be so condescending, I've read the posts - it doesn't mean I necessarily agree with them.

[04Sauzee]

Don't be so condescending, I've read the posts - it doesn't mean I necessarily agree with them.

You could tell us the bits you don't agree with? If just a thought.

[matty_f]

I get that M, looks like a lot of cost cutting will happen, marketing probably, as nothing to market on match days.

What I'm getting at is HS seems to be the main vehicle for money coming in, Mr Gordon is a millionaire, is he doing all he can? I remember something at AGM about line of credit.

The cuts will be severe, Imho.

Last year's staff costs were £6.3m and represented 59% of turnover.

We're expecting turnover to fall by 50%. Already you can see that there's an issue before any other costs are considered.

As for the academy, I think the practicalities and costs of running anything other than the first team until we're out of the pandemic means it has to be shelved and picked up again when we're in a better position.

To play professional football the figures quoted for testing alone were around £4k per match, the rules don't change for under 20 football as far as I know so then you're looking at that cost again for every match at that level. Plus the complications of having more people in and around the training centre.

There's nothing nefarious going on, I think this is just the stark reality that unless we cut our cloth now, we're going to struggle.

Credit line could be an option, but unless you knew when this was going to be over and back to normal, would you be willing to secure the stadium against a loan?

I don't think we're Ron Gordon's only concern, maybe he can't afford to prop up all his businesses? I don't know. As the major shareholder, I would hope he contributes, and it's great that as a significant shareholder, HS are also able to contribute.

[matty_f]

Don't be so condescending, I've read the posts - it doesn't mean I necessarily agree with them.

Sorry, I didn't mean to be as condescending as I was. Apologies.

What don't you agree with?

[B.H.F.C]

Apparently it’s up from £18m to £30m even worse case scenario it’s going to be a big increase.

Aye but the increase in TV money, which we won’t have for another year, will be nowhere near offsetting the losses we have elsewhere.

Deal is £160m over 5 years. That includes the cup competitions. Don’t even know if Betfred will be happening. League deal is worth £26m a season.

[Chorley Hibee]

Sorry, I didn't mean to be as condescending as I was. Apologies.

What don't you agree with?

No problem.

With the greatest of respect, the figures provided are estimates and nothing more - it's also a very worst case scenario (no further season tickets sold, no games with fans for the whole season etc) and doesn't take account of the money that has been brought in via record shirt sales, TV money too.

I'm also struggling to understand how we've forgone a sponsor, for yet another season, given the circumstances just announced.

[Sergio sledge]

Perhaps there isn’t a issue and we are just cutting our cloth before it does become a concern. I don’t believe that’s the case though.

Isn't that exactly what Hibs have said though?

"We forecast that our revenues will be halved in 2020-21...That is the reality we face, and the continued uncertainty and restrictions mean our current cost structure is not sustainable."

Essentially they expect that because of covid-19 our income will be half what we were forecasting this season, so somewhere round £5-6m. They can't continue to run with the same costs in outgoings when they expect income to be halved. They are taking this action because of what they see in the future and not because there's an immediate serious issue IMHO.

They've paused a lot of the plans Ron had for the club in the coming season and are focussing all they can on the first team. As they should, whilst the community aspect is vital we are a football club first and foremost.

I suspect we still will have cash in the bank at this stage as we've sold 2/3 of the season tickets we had last season and have done well on strip sales, but this is reducing all the time at an unsustainable rate because of the lack of normal income so there will come a point when it will be gone if we don't do something to reduce costs.

Obviously not good for a lot of the non-playing staff who will suffer most probably, but it's the reality of the pandemic and we aren't and won't be alone. The bit I'd be annoyed about if I was staff or a player is it leaking in the press before they were informed.

What it does do is give the current under 20's and fringe players like Murray, Gullan and Mackie a massive opportunity to get themselves into the team. The squad size will be very slim this season so they need to step up to the plate. With a bit of luck we could get some youth players grabbing the opportunity and giving us excitement like the last time we had to implement significant cuts to the playing budget under Bobby Williamson. That laid the foundations for Mowbray's team.

[Hibernianrus]

[QUOTE=Keith_M;6207785]Really? Who from?

Somebody on the bus? An Uber driver? Your Mum?[

im friendly with the father in law of one of the coaches who’s job is in jeopardy. May be true , may not but that’s what I’ve been told. The media have also got wind of the unrest as you may have read in the red top rags. If you look at when I posted it this was a good bit before anything came out in the papers .

[Ozyhibby]

I think some people are truly naive to the financial impacts of what is currently happening. Including the chairman of other clubs.

Current income we are not getting and uncertainties:

Season tickets: currently sold 3,500 less than this point last year
No Walk ups/away fans for foreseeable: We average 4-5000 walk up/away fans per league match.
No matchday income from League cup if it is cancelled
No other matchday income such as Hospitality, food, stadium tours, mascot packages, matchday sponsorship, happy hibee draw
No Player of the Year awards night
No use of stadium for functions, conferences, x-mas parties etc

We don’t know when limited crowds will be allowed back in stadia
We don’t know when full crowds will be allowed back in stadia
We don’t know with certainty if a full 38 game season will be completed

Is Murrayfield a solution to get fans back? What will that cost?

Potential loss of prize money to repay BT sports and BBC
Potential loss of prize money to pay Hearts & Partick

Will a deep recession impact season ticket numbers further in future seasons?

Can’t believe folk need it spelt out to them. [emoji122]
I’m in danger of defending the club here which is uncomfortable for me but when you are facing a catastrophic hit to your income, you need to cut cost right back to the bone. Running the first team and making it competitive is the only thing we need staff for right now because they are the only one who are allowed to work.
Everything else is just wasting money. Every penny needs to go towards the first team.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Smartie]

Have you tried adding it up?

Season ticket numbers staying static would be a reduction in income of about £1.5m (4500 not sold x £300)
No walk ups or away fans about £2m (5000 x £20 x 19 home games)
No league cup income, last season income about £500k

Then add all the associated matchday income I’ve listed in my previous post.

Season ticket numbers staying static would be a huge shock though, surely? It's 17th June. How much of a push to sell more have we had? How many wee nudges? I'd have thought that a couple of "unprecedented situation, your club needs you more than ever" pushes would happen before the club accepts that we're sitting on under 9000 season tickets for the season (and tbh they might well have shot themselves in the foot by way of selling more tickets by deciding and publicising that we're in crisis mode.)

No walk ups or away fans. Ok. Can we not possibly work on selling "virtual away tickets" so folk can watch games at home? They're not going to be affecting the attendances at other Saturday afternoon games by doing so. Is there not even a chance that they could earn MORE by selling away tickets in this way? Would I be more likely to stick Aberdeen £20 to watch a game at Pittodrie if I didn't have to pay to get there plus give up hours doing so? Of course I would and certainly under the unusual circumstances this season is going to throw up I'd be surprised if I was alone in wanting to watch every Hibs kick of a ball from my armchair if I could.

Scottish football should be doing everything in its power to work together to increase revenue in ways like this.

No league cup income, granted.

By not hosting matches there will be costs that can automatically be cut as well, it is not all profit.

[Sergio sledge]

No problem.

With the greatest of respect, the figures provided are estimates and nothing more - it's also a very worst case scenario (no further season tickets sold, no games with fans for the whole season etc) and doesn't take account of the money that has been brought in via record shirt sales, TV money too.

I'm also struggling to understand how we've forgone a sponsor, for yet another season, given the circumstances just announced.

They are estimates but this is exactly the exercise the club will have had to go through, albeit with a lot more knowledge to base it on. No-one knows when crowds will be back and a massive part of our income is matchday income, so that's a big issue.

There's also the unknown amounts the SPFL will have to pay back to BT sport, BBC, overseas rights holders and sponsors for the curtailment of the current season. It's not unreasonable to expect this to be in the multiple £m's (BT is reported to be £2.5m on their own.) This might be spread over a few seasons but it still reduces this season's prize fund.

In regards to the sponsor, it's not unreasonable to assume the club were unable to find a sponsor due to the pandemic and the uncertainties regarding advertising opportunities. Sponsors rely on exposure to get a return for their investment and no-one knew 4 months ago if there was even going to be a 20/21 season. I think the record shirt sales will have compensated some way to this, but probably not enough.

[Power]

I think some people are truly naive to the financial impacts of what is currently happening. Including the chairman of other clubs.

Current income we are not getting and uncertainties:

Season tickets: currently sold 3,500 less than this point last year
No Walk ups/away fans for foreseeable: We average 4-5000 walk up/away fans per league match.
No matchday income from League cup if it is cancelled
No other matchday income such as Hospitality, food, stadium tours, mascot packages, matchday sponsorship, happy hibee draw
No Player of the Year awards night
No use of stadium for functions, conferences, x-mas parties etc

We don’t know when limited crowds will be allowed back in stadia
We don’t know when full crowds will be allowed back in stadia
We don’t know with certainty if a full 38 game season will be completed

Is Murrayfield a solution to get fans back? What will that cost?

Potential loss of prize money to repay BT sports and BBC
Potential loss of prize money to pay Hearts & Partick

Will a deep recession impact season ticket numbers further in future seasons?

I think this is a well positioned post - there is so many ways to explain the situation (less income - now and for next 10-11months - resulting in remodelling/lowering your expenditure - We all do it in our day to day lives). There is still so much uncertain on the path to normal it’s sensible to plan to be sustainable now and strong for the future.

There is a lot of conversations, discussions and consultations taking place in the club and they’ll do that in an honest, compassionate and supportive way - once the dust settles they’ll speak with supporters.

I’ve mentioned before about the media. They don’t report the news, they’re making the news 🗞 🗑

The pandemic has created a difficult situation and the club is creating breathing space and pressing pause on parts before resuming when safe to do so.

[Sammy7nil]

Can’t believe folk need it spelt out to them. [emoji122]
I’m in danger of defending the club here which is uncomfortable for me but when you are facing a catastrophic hit to your income, you need to cut cost right back to the bone. Running the first team and making it competitive is the only thing we need staff for right now because they are the only one who are allowed to work.
Everything else is just wasting money. Every penny needs to go towards the first team.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Why is the bit in bold uncomfortable? Just asking.

[Dalianwanda]

No problem.

With the greatest of respect, the figures provided are estimates and nothing more - it's also a very worst case scenario (no further season tickets sold, no games with fans for the whole season etc) and doesn't take account of the money that has been brought in via record shirt sales, TV money too.

I'm also struggling to understand how we've forgone a sponsor, for yet another season, given the circumstances just announced.

I thought there had been some Hibs fans who chipped in to allow the NHS thing to happen. Might have been worth more than we could get from a traditional sponsor for the year in the current environment?

[matty_f]

No problem.

With the greatest of respect, the figures provided are estimates and nothing more - it's also a very worst case scenario (no further season tickets sold, no games with fans for the whole season etc) and doesn't take account of the money that has been brought in via record shirt sales, TV money too.

I'm also struggling to understand how we've forgone a sponsor, for yet another season, given the circumstances just announced.

Not all estimates and even the figures quoted won't be far from reality. From the AGM the wages: turnover ratio was quoted at 59% with a cost of £6.3m - that's fact rather than estimate.

The estimate is turnover will be down by 50% but even if that was wildly out, and it was 30%, we're still in bother when you consider we're have other costs to cover unless we cut back.

We know for a fact that season tickets are lower than last year and that we won't have any matchday income for the foreseeable future. Other non-matchday revenue is virtually wiped out (no access to the stadium)

As for the sponsor, that decision was funded by some supporters si that impact to the cub was minimal.

[Sergio sledge]

Season ticket numbers staying static would be a huge shock though, surely? It's 17th June. How much of a push to sell more have we had? How many wee nudges? I'd have thought that a couple of "unprecedented situation, your club needs you more than ever" pushes would happen before the club accepts that we're sitting on under 9000 season tickets for the season (and tbh they might well have shot themselves in the foot by way of selling more tickets by deciding and publicising that we're in crisis mode.)

No walk ups or away fans. Ok. Can we not possibly work on selling "virtual away tickets" so folk can watch games at home? They're not going to be affecting the attendances at other Saturday afternoon games by doing so. Is there not even a chance that they could earn MORE by selling away tickets in this way? Would I be more likely to stick Aberdeen £20 to watch a game at Pittodrie if I didn't have to pay to get there plus give up hours doing so? Of course I would and certainly under the unusual circumstances this season is going to throw up I'd be surprised if I was alone in wanting to watch every Hibs kick of a ball from my armchair if I could.

Scottish football should be doing everything in its power to work together to increase revenue in ways like this.

No league cup income, granted.

By not hosting matches there will be costs that can automatically be cut as well, it is not all profit.

Maybe I interpreted the club statement differently to you, but I didn't get the impression that we were anywhere near crisis mode (or panic mode as someone else said earlier in the thread) I took it as starting the consultations because they can see issues down the line if cost are left at current level. Crisis mode would suggest to me that we're in immediate danger i.e. not able to make wages this month if something isn't done. I didn't get that impression at all from the statement.

[lord bunberry]

Can’t believe folk need it spelt out to them. [emoji122]
I’m in danger of defending the club here which is uncomfortable for me but when you are facing a catastrophic hit to your income, you need to cut cost right back to the bone. Running the first team and making it competitive is the only thing we need staff for right now because they are the only one who are allowed to work.
Everything else is just wasting money. Every penny needs to go towards the first team.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I can’t speak for everyone else, but I’m fully aware that there’s going to be a drop in income. IMO that’s when the owner needs to step in and make up the shortfall. If we went into next season with a similar budget to last season we would be very competitive. That in turn would lead to more prize money and us being able to steal a march on our rivals, that advantage could last for a good few years.