Lucy Letby guilty

[Aldo]

If and it’s a big if, the powers that be in that NHS Trust chose to ignore any comments/warnings of others about her they should also be dealt with accordingly.

sentencing is next week and you would hope she should never every see the light of day again. She should receive consecutive life sentences for each of her heinous crimes.

[Since90+2]

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If and it’s a big if, the powers that be in that NHS Trust chose to ignore any comments/warnings of others about her they should also be dealt with accordingly.

sentencing is next week and you would hope she should never every see the light of day again. She should receive consecutive life sentences for each of her heinous crimes.

100% she'll get a whole life sentence. She's literally one of, if not the most, evil person this country has ever seen.

[Aldo]

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100% she'll get a whole life sentence. She's literally one of, if not the most, evil person this country has ever seen.

You would hope she will. She’s definitely up there with other imho.

[GlesgaeHibby]

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If and it’s a big if, the powers that be in that NHS Trust chose to ignore any comments/warnings of others about her they should also be dealt with accordingly.

sentencing is next week and you would hope she should never every see the light of day again. She should receive consecutive life sentences for each of her heinous crimes.

There's talk of corporate manslaughter charges. If they've chose to try and bury this/protect reputation rather than do the right thing, they have to face the consequences.

Apparently Letby wasn't in court on Friday to hear the last of the guilty verdicts, and won't be in court on Monday for sentencing. How is that even allowed?

[Aldo]

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There's talk of corporate manslaughter charges. If they've chose to try and bury this/protect reputation rather than do the right thing, they have to face the consequences.

Apparently Letby wasn't in court on Friday to hear the last of the guilty verdicts, and won't be in court on Monday for sentencing. How is that even allowed?

Like I mentioned in my previous post, if they have ignored this and tried to sweep it under the carpet then go get them. They MUST be brought to justice.

As for her, this is her last chance to show some sort of power. She will find out 3rd hand that she is going to spend the rest of her living life behind bars. Tbh given her heinous crimes that’s too good for her imho!

[JimBHibees]

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Some combination of serious depression mixed with jealousy of others with better lives than her would be my guess. But it's hard to know for sure when you're assessing someone who has done things that no rational person would ever even consider.

Would assume that would at least be part of the explanation.

Bizarre that she eeems to be able to say she doesn't want to attend court to hear the sentence. How does she have the right to do that?

[Pretty Boy]

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Would assume that would at least be part of the explanation.

Bizarre that she eeems to be able to say she doesn't want to attend court to hear the sentence. How does she have the right to do that?

She was diagnosed with PTSD whilst on remand (as a result of the conspiracy against her and the trauma of her arrest according to her).I'm guessing she will be being excused on health grounds. Surely those on trial and especially those found guilty can't wilfully choose not to attend court because they don't fancy it? Hopefully the victim impact statements reach her.

[Keith_M]

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Psychiatrists and criminologists appear to be pretty unsure of the motive, other then power.
https://news.sky.com/story/lucy-letb...erers-12941902

Is it possibly another case of 'Munchausen-by-proxy' syndrome?


I remember a similar case years ago and the attention seeking motive just totally shocked me.

[Pretty Boy]

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Is it possibly another case of 'Munchausen-by-proxy' syndrome?


I remember a similar case years ago and the attention seeking motive just totally shocked me.

Beverley Allitt. She killed 4 in Lincolnshire using broadly similar methods. Incidentally she is now eligible for parole having served her minimum term of 30 years. I doubt she'll be released any time soon though.

There's also another 'killer nurse' Ben Green who is about to launch a further appeal against his convictions (2 murders, multiple GBH) on the grounds that the statistical analysis that played a big part in his conviction was and is inherently flawed.

The Letby case still has a wrong way to run yet. A potential retrial for the cases with no verdicts, sadly more potential victims and there will be multiple appeals. We'll be reading about her for years.

[Keith_M]

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Beverley Allitt. She killed 4 in Lincolnshire using broadly similar methods. Incidentally she is now eligible for parole having served her minimum term of 30 years. I doubt she'll be released any time soon though.

There's also another 'killer nurse' Ben Green who is about to launch a further appeal against his convictions (2 murders, multiple GBH) on the grounds that the statistical analysis that played a big part in his conviction was and is inherently flawed.

The Letby case still has a wrong way to run yet. A potential retrial for the cases with no verdicts, sadly more potential victims and there will be multiple appeals. We'll be reading about her for years.

Yeah, Beverley Allitt, that's the one.

[Jim44]

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If and it’s a big if, the powers that be in that NHS Trust chose to ignore any comments/warnings of others about her they should also be dealt with accordingly.

sentencing is next week and you would hope she should never every see the light of day again. She should receive consecutive life sentences for each of her heinous crimes.

She has refused to go to the sentencing.

[Pretty Boy]

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She has refused to go to the sentencing.

I genuinely can't comprehend how that is legally permitted if it's not on health grounds or whatever. I initially thought that might be the case but the judge seems to have confirmed it's not and rather she just doesn't want to go and he can't make her.

I would almost argue it should be more permissible for someone not to be present during their trial in the sense that the legal principle is innocent until proven guilty. Once a guilty verdict has been delivered there should be an obligation to attend and hear the victim impact statements and the judges remarks.

[Pretty Boy]

Prosecution push for a whole life sentence, defence offer no mitigation.

[Pretty Boy]

Whole life order given for both the murders and attempted murders.

[Keith_M]

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Whole life order given for both the murders and attempted murders.

I don't think there could be any other decision.

This is just so sad and I'll never be able to get my head round why anybody would do this.

[Pretty Boy]

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I don't think there could be any other decision.

This is just so sad and I'll never be able to get my head round why anybody would do this.

The impact statements from the families were horrendous. There are so many victims in a case like this. The impact on the treatment of other children, marriages destroyed, people turning to alcohol, suicidal thoughts, distrust of medical professionals, teachers etc etc.

For me it's not just the why but the how. I feel bad if I shout at my own kids, I get up to check them about 10 times a night if they are ill. I'll never understand how anyone can inflict pain on a child and ignore their struggling, crying and other indicators of distress and pain, she must have a lack of empathy bordering on psychopathic.

[Kato]

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The impact statements from the families were horrendous. There are so many victims in a case like this. The impact on the treatment of other children, marriages destroyed, people turning to alcohol, suicidal thoughts, distrust of medical professionals, teachers etc etc.

For me it's not just the why but the how. I feel bad if I shout at my own kids, I get up to check them about 10 times a night if they are ill. I'll never understand how anyone can inflict pain on a child and ignore their struggling, crying and other indicators of distress and pain, she must have a lack of empathy bordering on psychopathic.

Is one of the "must have" elements of a psychopathic diagnosis a complete lack of empathy? The cooler headed psychopath observes emotions in others and learns how to manipulate people (ie sociopathy) depending their emotional state. Others just get off on observing.

The shrinks have some job on their hands, on all sides.

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[Keith_M]

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The impact statements from the families were horrendous. There are so many victims in a case like this. The impact on the treatment of other children, marriages destroyed, people turning to alcohol, suicidal thoughts, distrust of medical professionals, teachers etc etc.

For me it's not just the why but the how. I feel bad if I shout at my own kids, I get up to check them about 10 times a night if they are ill. I'll never understand how anyone can inflict pain on a child and ignore their struggling, crying and other indicators of distress and pain, she must have a lack of empathy bordering on psychopathic.

I'm with you on that one, PB. My kids are all grown up now but that pretty much describes my relationship with my kids when they were young.

I'm now a soppy old guy that just loves kids, especially my many nieces and nephews, so I'll never understand either.

[Ozyhibby]

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Is one of the "must have" elements of a psychopathic diagnosis a complete lack of empathy? The cooler headed psychopath observes emotions in others and learns how to manipulate people (ie sociopathy) depending their emotional state. Others just get off on observing.

The shrinks have some job on their hands, on all sides.

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Which is why her missing the victim impact statements is not that big a deal. They would make no difference to her. She would not be able to understand what was being said.


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[Kato]

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Which is why her missing the victim impact statements is not that big a deal. They would make no difference to her. She would not be able to understand what was being said.


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I've not read that much but the notes she left seemed to be all about her. Would speak volumes.

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[cabbageandribs1875]

doubt they will ever find out just how many died that she had a part in

[JimBHibees]

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I genuinely can't comprehend how that is legally permitted if it's not on health grounds or whatever. I initially thought that might be the case but the judge seems to have confirmed it's not and rather she just doesn't want to go and he can't make her.

I would almost argue it should be more permissible for someone not to be present during their trial in the sense that the legal principle is innocent until proven guilty. Once a guilty verdict has been delivered there should be an obligation to attend and hear the victim impact statements and the judges remarks.

Amazed there isn't an obligation to attend

[grunt]

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I genuinely can't comprehend how that is legally permitted if it's not on health grounds or whatever. I initially thought that might be the case but the judge seems to have confirmed it's not and rather she just doesn't want to go and he can't make her.

I would almost argue it should be more permissible for someone not to be present during their trial in the sense that the legal principle is innocent until proven guilty. Once a guilty verdict has been delivered there should be an obligation to attend and hear the victim impact statements and the judges remarks.

There's a big old discussion about this in the bit of Twitter that I look at. Here's one view against forcing them to attend.

https://inews.co.uk/opinion/lucy-let...turing-2560911

[JimBHibees]

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There's a big old discussion about this in the bit of Twitter that I look at. Here's one view against forcing them to attend.

https://inews.co.uk/opinion/lucy-let...turing-2560911

Makes a lot of good points to be fair he had an interview with the James O'brien podcast full disclosure which was very interesting

[KeithTheHibby]

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I genuinely can't comprehend how that is legally permitted if it's not on health grounds or whatever. I initially thought that might be the case but the judge seems to have confirmed it's not and rather she just doesn't want to go and he can't make her.

I would almost argue it should be more permissible for someone not to be present during their trial in the sense that the legal principle is innocent until proven guilty. Once a guilty verdict has been delivered there should be an obligation to attend and hear the victim impact statements and the judges remarks.

It’s incredible really.

[Aldo]

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Amazed there isn't an obligation to attend

It happens more often than you think.

[Pretty Boy]

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There's a big old discussion about this in the bit of Twitter that I look at. Here's one view against forcing them to attend.

https://inews.co.uk/opinion/lucy-let...turing-2560911

Aye I saw something on the BBC about that, might have been the same guy. Hadn't really considered that and it does make sense.

You'd like to think if she gets given copies of the statements and judges sentencing remarks that she'll read them at some point over the next 50 odd years.

[wookie70]

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Amazed there isn't an obligation to attend

I can see it both ways. What is the guilty Party mocks the victim during the statement and starts to make some sort of protest. Not really anything to lose when they are never getting out. I think I would leave it to the Judges myself. I listened to a really good podcast about ex prisoners and the contributions they made when they talked about apologising to families were really interesting and helped both parties. I doubt that will ever be teh case here but I'm not sure compulsory attendance would make things better

[Paulie Walnuts]

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I can see it both ways. What is the guilty Party mocks the victim during the statement and starts to make some sort of protest. Not really anything to lose when they are never getting out. I think I would leave it to the Judges myself. I listened to a really good podcast about ex prisoners and the contributions they made when they talked about apologising to families were really interesting and helped both parties. I doubt that will ever be teh case here but I'm not sure compulsory attendance would make things better

Pretty much how I see it. Little to gain, lots to lose by her being there.

[BroxburnHibee]

Only just recently discovered the podcast on this that ran throughout the trial produced by 2 Daily Mail journalists.

Its incredible listening but even though I'm only 15 episodes in you can already start to understand the struggles the jury had with this.

First episode.....
https://open.spotify.com/episode/7vj...838f692ddb4f53