Housing

[Ozyhibby]

One thing you can always count on the UK govt to do with housing is to try re-inflate the bubble rather than actually fix the problem. The crash when it eventually comes will be mighty. In the mean time, we’ll all keep paying more and more of our income on housing.

https://www.theguardian.com/money/20...wn-generations

Now your going to inherit your parents debt.


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[Skol]

That is a minefield and not sure if it can be done unless the children are of legal age and can consent to such a thing.

My kids were two and less than one when I bought my current house, and only two years older when I remortgaged to fund home improvements. Thankfully it’s now paid off but no way I could have passed that on to them.

[Stairway 2 7]

You'd guess they would have the option to cash in the mortgage or keep it going. It will never happen though, more bluster from the tories. There is going to be a bubble bursting in the next decade and the horrors that go with it

[Skol]

If you have life cover to go wit( it though then that should cover the mortgage. I know not everyone has life cover and I know some people might start with that but cancel it as a saving along the way. It is so thing that should be compulsory.

That said ,as each generation goes by the position gets harder. I recall old people at my work complaining when I was first getting property and essentially saying they felt for the youth of the day and how would they afford property.

Looking back though, I did struggle but it was worth it but nowhere near as tough as it is for my own children today. You essentially need two people, good stable income and sav8ngs behind you.

I bought my first flat with 100% mortgage on my own and with not a single penny of savings.

[Keith_M]

This is utterly crazy.

People now have two options: take out ridiculously large mortgages or pay ridiculously over-priced rents.

The actual issue is the spiralling house prices and yet that seems to be welcomed by so many people, which confuses the hell out of me.

[Ozyhibby]

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This is utterly crazy.

People now have two options: take out ridiculously large mortgages or pay ridiculously over-priced rents.

The actual issue is the spiralling house prices and yet that seems to be welcomed by so many people, which confuses the hell out of me.

The only solution is to build more houses. Everything else just feeds demand. It’s supply that needs to increase.


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[Hibs Class]

Sounds like yet another gimmick, just like benefits for bricks a few weeks ago. Produce a soundbite and announce before even discussing with lenders, housing associations, etc.

[Smartie]

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The only solution is to build more houses. Everything else just feeds demand. It’s supply that needs to increase.


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We seem to be hell bent on doing just about anything other than the one thing that would work.

[McSwanky]

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The only solution is to build more houses. Everything else just feeds demand. It’s supply that needs to increase.


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Couldn't agree more.

[Hibrandenburg]

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The only solution is to build more houses. Everything else just feeds demand. It’s supply that needs to increase.


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But that would mean favouring the have nots over the already haves. Never going to happen under this government.

[Stairway 2 7]

My initial instinct is to think it will be nonsense as it's the telegraph. But I noticed an article yesterday on twitter, the amount of excess houses had risen alot in the last few decades they say

http://archive.today/Pxgd5

[Hibs4185]

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The only solution is to build more houses. Everything else just feeds demand. It’s supply that needs to increase.


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Try building new houses and you’ll see why the supply is so slow

[degenerated]

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Try building new houses and you’ll see why the supply is so slow

The increase in material costs are in excess of anything I have seen in nearly 30 years of working in procurement in the industry. Where once you would see annual increase of 5 or 6% on things, most rarely stuck. Now I've seen bricks going up in double digit increases about 4 times in the last year. Timber is around double the price it was a year or so back, Insulation has just gone up again from yesterday at around 40%, plasterboard has gone up around 25% in past couple of months alone. Every category is being similarly affected and lead times are stretched to ridiculous lengths.

That will have an impact on affordability of new builds.

[Eaststand]

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The increase in material costs are in excess of anything I have seen in nearly 30 years of working in procurement in the industry. Where once you would see annual increase of 5 or 6% on things, most rarely stuck. Now I've seen bricks going up in double digit increases about 4 times in the last year. Timber is around double the price it was a year or so back, Insulation has just gone up again from yesterday at around 40%, plasterboard has gone up around 25% in past couple of months alone. Every category is being similarly affected and lead times are stretched to ridiculous lengths.

That will have an impact on affordability of new builds.

Something I've always wondered.
I live fairly near to the Strand housing development just off Fishwives Causeway and I'm amazed at how many houses they're managing to build on that site.

What roughly is the profit margin for housebuilders like Persimmon, Wimpey etc for newly built houses.

Without giving away any detailed sensitive info would you be in a position to give a ballpark about the total costs for buying the land, building the houses, then the final finishing touches like plastering, painting etc against the selling price.

GGTTH

[degenerated]

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Something I've always wondered.
I live fairly near to the Strand housing development just off Fishwives Causeway and I'm amazed at how many houses they're managing to build on that site.

What roughly is the profit margin for housebuilders like Persimmon, Wimpey etc for newly built houses.

Without giving away any detailed sensitive info would you be in a position to give a ballpark about the total costs for buying the land, building the jouses, then the final finishing touches like plastering, painting etc against the selling price.

GGTTH

To be honest I wouldn't know, I'm in construction rather than housebuilding. Companies I've worked for have had big name housebuilding divisions but never really been party to that info. They generally tend to be incredibly profitable in comparison to the construction side of business as that's large vale/fairly low margin.

The model was always that construction delivered turnover and cash flow which funded housing, particularly land acquisitions, and the housing delivered the large profits and dividends for shareholders.

[Eaststand]

Ta for the reply.

As you'll know well, there's a lot of new builds going up in Edinburgh and the outskirts, and I've always been a bit curious about the big housebuilders costs v profits.

GGTTH

[Ozyhibby]

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To be honest I wouldn't know, I'm in construction rather than housebuilding. Companies I've worked for have had big name housebuilding divisions but never really been party to that info. They generally tend to be incredibly profitable in comparison to the construction side of business as that's large vale/fairly low margin.

The model was always that construction delivered turnover and cash flow which funded housing, particularly land acquisitions, and the housing delivered the large profits and dividends for shareholders.

The big 6 house builder control the uk house building market. They deliberately slow the release of properties to maximise their profits. Small volume builders are a thing of the past.
The planning system does the rest. There is about £150k of planning costs in each new home.


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[Ozyhibby]

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Ta for the reply.

As you'll know well, there's a lot of new builds going up in Edinburgh and the outskirts, and I've always been a bit curious about the big housebuilders costs v profits.

GGTTH

Scottish govt are trying to speed up housebuilding. Not enough for me but they are trying. I think we are building at a quicker rate than England are managing.


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[Moulin Yarns]

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The big 6 house builder control the uk house building market. They deliberately slow the release of properties to maximise their profits. Small volume builders are a thing of the past.
The planning system does the rest. There is about £150k of planning costs in each new home.


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No idea where you are getting £150k.

https://www.checkatrade.com/blog/cost-guides/planning-permission-cost/

[lapsedhibee]

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No idea where you are getting £150k.

https://www.checkatrade.com/blog/cos...rmission-cost/

Contributions to local infrastructure?

[Colr]

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One thing you can always count on the UK govt to do with housing is to try re-inflate the bubble rather than actually fix the problem. The crash when it eventually comes will be mighty. In the mean time, we’ll all keep paying more and more of our income on housing.

https://www.theguardian.com/money/20...wn-generations

Now your going to inherit your parents debt.


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I work in housing and regen and this country hasn’t had a housing policy worthy of the name in 20 years.

Judging from the succession of nobodies Labour have been putting in a shadows, they don’t seem to think its worthy of their attention either. Despite having an expert in John Healey amongst their ranks!

[Paul1642]

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The only solution is to build more houses. Everything else just feeds demand. It’s supply that needs to increase.


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Everywhere you look in East Lothian there are recently built estates and new ones being built, increasing the population of some of the smaller towns by a huge %. Not sure if it’s quite the same elsewhere but surely an equally large problem is the Number of second homes, holiday homes, air b&b’s ext.

[Just_Jimmy]

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Everywhere you look in East Lothian there are recently built estates and new ones being built, increasing the population of some of the smaller towns by a huge %. Not sure if it’s quite the same elsewhere but surely an equally large problem is the Number of second homes, holiday homes, air b&b’s ext.

Yes, and it means people living further and further out to work in the cities. Any city...

It means travelling longer and commuting longer. It means the towns don't have the infrastructure and road networks to support. Do the schools have places or the local GP? Can you get an NHS dentist?

The housing crisis in the country causes so many more problems than just putting a roof over someone's head at an affordable price.

I would love to see a proper study of the hidden issues

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[Colr]

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Scottish govt are trying to speed up housebuilding. Not enough for me but they are trying. I think we are building at a quicker rate than England are managing.


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UK target is 300k a year. We do well if we deliver half that. Meanwhile the French build 400,000 a year.

Politicians are afraid of the old Nimbies impact on their vote. I’m afraid the young need to get organised and active - and maybe turn out to vote

[Andy Bee]

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No idea where you are getting £150k.

https://www.checkatrade.com/blog/cos...rmission-cost/

Not sure where Ozzy is getting the £150k but I'm guessing the additional infrastructure big house builders have to implement or it's the estimated price to build each house.

As you'll know there's more to it than just the council planning costs, you've got architects and structural engineers if you can get one as they're cherry picking jobs at the moment because of the volume of work available. I just paid over £6k for all the warrants and permissions needed for an existing dormer extension and bifold doors, I was initially quoted £3k. The original quote (before lockdown) for the structural engineer alone ended up triple the cost and don't get me started on the price of Kingspan.

[SChibs]

I wonder what would happen to the housing market in Edinburgh if we banned Airbnb. Its ridiculous how many there are in the city and its definitely contributing to the shortage in Edinburgh

[Just Alf]

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I wonder what would happen to the housing market in Edinburgh if we banned Airbnb. Its ridiculous how many there are in the city and its definitely contributing to the shortage in Edinburgh

This 100%..... its a disgrace and needs regulation.
The owners also seem to think its OK to stick up lock boxes everywhere, more often than not on communally owned door entrances etc where they don't actually have legal right without permission from the other owners.

[Ozyhibby]

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Not sure where Ozzy is getting the £150k but I'm guessing the additional infrastructure big house builders have to implement or it's the estimated price to build each house.

As you'll know there's more to it than just the council planning costs, you've got architects and structural engineers if you can get one as they're cherry picking jobs at the moment because of the volume of work available. I just paid over £6k for all the warrants and permissions needed for an existing dormer extension and bifold doors, I was initially quoted £3k. The original quote (before lockdown) for the structural engineer alone ended up triple the cost and don't get me started on the price of Kingspan.

That’s about the difference in value of an empty field the size of an average plot between not having and then getting planning permission.


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[Paul1642]

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UK target is 300k a year. We do well if we deliver half that. Meanwhile the French build 400,000 a year.

Politicians are afraid of the old Nimbies impact on their vote. I’m afraid the young need to get organised and active - and maybe turn out to vote

France has more than double the land mass of the Uk. It’s a bit easier for them without trashing there green spaces and removing agricultural land meaning even more reliance on imports.

[Keith_M]

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The only solution is to build more houses. Everything else just feeds demand. It’s supply that needs to increase.

I realise it's complete sacrilege but...

we need tens of thousands of decent quality Council Houses, for the many decent people that struggle to pay ever increasing mortgages or ridiculously high rents for sub-standard housing.