SNP are lying b******s as well !

[Just Alf]

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Not at all. I respect your opinion and your right to question mine. It's just that on this particular question I don't really see further mileage in it. You asked if my primary basis for opposing independence was because I retain a strong British identity and I confirmed that was the case.

I guess that having spent a sizeable chunk of my life in various parts of the UK has shaped that identity, but I certainly feel that the melting pot of culture, geography, history, sport...you name it...forms a collective nation I'd be very sorry to no longer be part of. Politics runs a poor second in that respect and it depresses me the way things have polarised over the last decade. I wouldn't describe myself as a 'British nationalist', a 'Unionist' or indeed 'Tory' but because I have no interest in seeing the UK broken up it seems now to follow that I must be labelled as one or all of these things.

That's a good explanation and makes a lot of sense, I've family with that view.

I'm actually interested in how you view Scots that think along the same lines that want to vote for independence as a result... often they get the braveheart thing thrown at them.

[Ozyhibby]

I’m comfy with people saying that they feel British and that’s why they don’t want Indy. What I find a little strange is that they don’t fight harder for more devolution of the economic levers that could help Scotland match the like of Denmark, Ireland, Norway, Iceland etc etc.
The current offer is stay British even though you will be a bit poorer than you could be, it’s worth it. I’m not sure how strong a case that is in the long run, especially as the next generation already feels less British.


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[WhileTheChief..]

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I certainly feel that the melting pot of culture, geography, history, sport...you name it...forms a collective nation I'd be very sorry to no longer be part of. Politics runs a poor second in that respect and it depresses me the way things have polarised over the last decade. I wouldn't describe myself as a 'British nationalist', a 'Unionist' or indeed 'Tory' but because I have no interest in seeing the UK broken up it seems now to follow that I must be labelled as one or all of these things.

Agree with all of this.

[greenginger]

Another SNP lying B*****d.

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.c...on-msp-3610894

Robertson claim Britain refused to take Jewish refugees in the 30’s before the Second World War.

Britain actually took 40,000 adults plus another 10,000 children on the kinder transport scheme.

That is a large proportion of the Jews who left mainland Europe, others going to US , South America , and Jordan.

[degenerated]

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Another SNP lying B*****d.

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.c...on-msp-3610894

Robertson claim Britain refused to take Jewish refugees in the 30’s before the Second World War.

Britain actually took 40,000 adults plus another 10,000 children on the kinder transport scheme.

That is a large proportion of the Jews who left mainland Europe, others going to US , South America , and Jordan.

He doesn't say that at all, he says they were largely refused.

Whilst Britain did take the numbers of refugees you state around 10 times that number were refused entry.

[Kato]

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Another SNP lying B*****d.

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.c...on-msp-3610894

Robertson claim Britain refused to take Jewish refugees in the 30’s before the Second World War.

Britain actually took 40,000 adults plus another 10,000 children on the kinder transport scheme.

That is a large proportion of the Jews who left mainland Europe, others going to US , South America , and Jordan.

Thousands were refused entry. Every child who came to the UK required a sponsor and a £50 payment to HM Govt. Three and half grand in today's money. Drop the charge and thousands who were turned away could have been saved.

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[degenerated]

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Thousands were refused entry. Every child who came to the UK required a sponsor and a £50 payment to HM Govt. Three and half grand in today's money. Drop the charge and thousands who were turned away could have been saved.

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After Germany annexed Austria the British government actually tightened the immigration laws to make it more difficult for them to gain entry.

I seem to remember reading that there were over half a million case files held by British Jewish associations on those that had been refused entry.

[Stairway 2 7]

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Thousands were refused entry. Every child who came to the UK required a sponsor and a £50 payment to HM Govt. Three and half grand in today's money. Drop the charge and thousands who were turned away could have been saved.

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Bit like Ukraine. Refugee response slow but military response superb. If it wasn't for the allies there wouldn't be a Jewish race in central Europe and the *******s wouldn't stop at the jews

[Kato]

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After Germany annexed Austria the British government actually tightened the immigration laws to make it more difficult for them to gain entry.

Probably a policy led by the fascist traitors in Parliament and the racist press.

Being Anti anti-Semitic was a fashion among the upper classes only once the atrocities of the holocaust were revealed post-war.



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[greenginger]

Y

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Thousands were refused entry. Every child who came to the UK required a sponsor and a £50 payment to HM Govt. Three and half grand in today's money. Drop the charge and thousands who were turned away could have been saved.

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https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/...ndertransport/

The only children requiring a £ 50 payment were the small proportion who didn’t ha a UK guarantor.

The £ 50 was required cover returning home costs and was paid for by charities.

But just keep banging on with your made up stories.

[Mcbizz1998]

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Another SNP lying B*****d.

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.c...on-msp-3610894

Robertson claim Britain refused to take Jewish refugees in the 30’s before the Second World War.

Britain actually took 40,000 adults plus another 10,000 children on the kinder transport scheme.

That is a large proportion of the Jews who left mainland Europe, others going to US , South America , and Jordan.

The SNP should keep quiet about that particular war. You know, considering their plan at that time….

https://www.scotsman.com/news/mi5-fi...an-2512735?amp

[Stairway 2 7]

King's college says 80,000 Jewish refugees came to Britain in the 1930s. It wasn't as easy as it is now to travel great distances and people were much poorer in general


During the early 1930s, it was easiest for the wealthy to leave Germany and travel to Britain as these individuals had private means and good international contacts while those without these benefits found it more difficult to leave Europe. Britain, like the rest of the western hemisphere, was still recovering from the effects of the Great Depression and was reluctant to encourage immigrants who might challenge the British workforce for employment

Under these methods, by the end of 1938, approximately 30,000 refugees had entered Britain

In response to this surge of violence (in 1938) it became clear to the British government that anyone to whom they offered visas would likely remain in the country. The British Jewish community quickly pushed for further assistance to help Jewish refugees escape from Nazi oppression and many rescue operations were launched with the Kindertransport and Kitchener Camp rescues being the largest.

In total, nearly 10,000 children travelled to Britain as part of the Kindertransport scheme

Altogether, the lives of some 4,000 refugees were saved by the Kitchener Camp rescue.

It is impossible to know the exact numbers who found refuge in Britain even if only temporarily while en route to another nation but somewhere in the vicinity of 80,000 refugees arrived in Britain during the 1930s

[grunt]

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The SNP should keep quiet about that particular war. You know, considering their plan at that time….

That's pathetic.

[weecounty hibby]

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The SNP should keep quiet about that particular war. You know, considering their plan at that time….

https://www.scotsman.com/news/mi5-fi...an-2512735?amp

I don't even need to open that to know you will be talking about Arthur Donaldson. A man who never faced any charges whatsoever from the British state. It is a story largely made up and wholly debunked many times over. But it is a good one to keep the Brits warm and cosy while ignoring the Russian assets currently in government. Actually part of the government!! Get your head round that one. Also if its Nazi sympathisers your looking for you can start at tye very top of Engkish society with the Royal family

[Mcbizz1998]

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I don't even need to open that to know you will be talking about Arthur Donaldson. A man who never faced any charges whatsoever from the British state. It is a story largely made up and wholly debunked many times over. But it is a good one to keep the Brits warm and cosy while ignoring the Russian assets currently in government. Actually part of the government!! Get your head round that one. Also if its Nazi sympathisers your looking for you can start at tye very top of Engkish society with the Royal family

Go on then, debunk it.

“The Brits”

Edit: just realised you are maybe Irish given the username.

[Mcbizz1998]

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That's pathetic.

Is it aye? Why’s that?

[CropleyWasGod]

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Go on then, debunk it.

“The Brits”

In that article that you linked:-

"The fact that even Tom Johnston, the secretary of state at the time, dismissed the story and released Mr Donaldson from internment speaks volumes for the veracity of this far-fetched tale,"

[Mcbizz1998]

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In that article that you linked:-

"The fact that even Tom Johnston, the secretary of state at the time, dismissed the story and released Mr Donaldson from internment speaks volumes for the veracity of this far-fetched tale,"

That’s not debunking it. I could start linking lots
of other articles.

[CropleyWasGod]

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That’s not debunking it. I could start linking lots
of other articles.

So the Secretary of State dismissing the story is not enough?

[weecounty hibby]

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Go on then, debunk it.

“The Brits” …. you are one mate!

No evidence has ever been produced to substantiate the claims against Donaldson and he was NEVER charged with any offence. I'm fact he was interred on the word of one man with no corroborating statements from anyone.

I actually read the link you posted and this is the last paragraph.
"The fact that even Tom Johnston, the secretary of state at the time, dismissed the story and released Mr Donaldson from internment speaks volumes for the veracity of this far-fetched tale."

The report you linked also said this
"His internment was widely believed to be a result of his pacifist policies, and he was released without charge after six weeks in Barlinnie prison"
So hardly the smoking gun or the definitive case for him being a Nazi sympathisers you think it is

Oh, by the way what about that English Royal family though?

[WeeRussell]

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That’s not debunking it. I could start linking lots
of other articles.

Actual ones that prove your point? I don’t think you could, as I reckon you would have already done so if that was the case.

[Mcbizz1998]

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So the Secretary of State dismissing the story is not enough?

It’s evidence that maybe it didn’t happen but it’s not debunking anything.

Donaldson set up the Scottish Neutrality League… he was at least happy for Scotland to avoid fighting the Nazis. His pal Hugh McDiarmid, the nationalist hero, said he thought the axis powers invading would be good for Scotland.

[Stairway 2 7]

Linking people's politics of the 30s to 80 years later is daft, whether that's to shame snp, uk government or the royals

[CropleyWasGod]

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It’s evidence that maybe it didn’t happen but it’s not debunking anything.

.

So the senior politician in Scotland says it didn't happen, and you say that's "not debunking anything."

2 questions:-

1. what would be enough for you to believe that it didn't happen?

2. do you have proof that it did?

[weecounty hibby]

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Linking people's politics of the 30s to 80 years later is daft, whether that's to shame snp, uk government or the royals

I am not for one second suggesting that the Royal family of today would indulge in anything like that. But I was trying to show that what the unionists try to do with Donaldson, with absolutely no proof can be done with the highest of the English classes but there is actual evidence. I have seen the Donaldson story many many times from anti SNP sorts to try to show some sort of right wing Nazism but there is no corroborated proof.

[Mcbizz1998]

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No evidence has ever been produced to substantiate the claims against Donaldson and he was NEVER charged with any offence. I'm fact he was interred on the word of one man with no corroborating statements from anyone.

I actually read the link you posted and this is the last paragraph.
"The fact that even Tom Johnston, the secretary of state at the time, dismissed the story and released Mr Donaldson from internment speaks volumes for the veracity of this far-fetched tale."

The report you linked also said this
"His internment was widely believed to be a result of his pacifist policies, and he was released without charge after six weeks in Barlinnie prison"
So hardly the smoking gun or the definitive case for him being a Nazi sympathisers you think it is

Oh, by the way what about that English Royal family though?

He wasn’t charged, doesn’t mean it never happened. He set up the Scottish neutrality league, that in itself tells you his feelings towards the war and what Scotlands role should be. The SNP have a sketchy record around that time, no doubt about that - that was my only point.

What about the Royals? This is an SNP thread and I’m not a supporters of the royal family. I don’t know why you have come to that conclusion?!

[Mcbizz1998]

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So the senior politician in Scotland says it didn't happen, and you say that's "not debunking anything."

2 questions:-

1. what would be enough for you to believe that it didn't happen?

2. do you have proof that it did?

1. Don’t know
2. I never said it did and no I don’t have proof. I, on balance, believe it probably did. That’s all.

Cheers.

[Stairway 2 7]

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I am not for one second suggesting that the Royal family of today would indulge in anything like that. But I was trying to show that what the unionists try to do with Donaldson, with absolutely no proof can be done with the highest of the English classes but there is actual evidence. I have seen the Donaldson story many many times from anti SNP sorts to try to show some sort of right wing Nazism but there is no corroborated proof.

It's not worth the effort it's bizarre to link the shame if there was any, to the current snp.

It's like saying Donald Trump and the Republicans should be loved by African Americans now, because Lincoln a Republican done so much for the slaves

[Mcbizz1998]

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It's not worth the effort it's bizarre to link the shame if there was any, to the current snp.

It's like saying Donald Trump and the Republicans should be loved by African Americans now, because Lincoln a Republican done so much for the slaves

Yeah well, that was actually my point in the first place. The SNP accusing Britain of not taking in enough Jewish refugees, 80 years ago, is pathetic and unfounded.

So I brought up something that is also unfounded (although I suspect may well be true) about the SNP.

[Stairway 2 7]

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Yeah well, that was actually my point in the first place. The SNP accusing Britain of not taking in enough Jewish refugees, 80 years ago, is pathetic and unfounded.

So I brought up something that is also unfounded (although I suspect may well be true) about the SNP.

Agree the Robertson article was pish in using the horror of the war to hit the current tory gov