Vaccine Passports for Easter Road

[Eyrie]

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Yes I have a fear that by me saying what I did that I am coming across as siding with people who have chosen not to get vaccinated. I am not and I agree with vaccination being required in order to enter certain settings, if anything I think it should be extended to places like pubs and restaurants as well.

All I was saying was that when people bought their season tickets 4 or 5 months ago there was no such rule which stated vaccination would be a requirement for entry into the stadium. In fact the First Minister was actually quite open about how she wasn't keen on the idea.

Even if I don't agree with their decision not to get vaccinated, those people now find themselves in a situation where, even if they wanted to now get vaccinated in order to comply with this new law, it will take them 8 weeks to get fully vaccinated and the law comes into effect in 3 weeks.

Over the next 8 weeks, Hibs have 4 home matches so I think if we're going to use this as a real incentive for people to now go and get vaccinated, rather just using it as a punishment for not going to get vaccinated up until now then if there's not going to be a blanket refund in place for everyone affected then I do think that at least for those people who decide that they will now get vaccinated there should be the offer of a refund for the cost of the next 4 games that they'll miss and we'll see them at the Dundee game on 20th November.

It's an interesting suggestion, but why should someone get a refund for only now doing what they could have done weeks ago? Isn't that unfair on everyone who has already had both vaccinations?

[green day]

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It's an interesting suggestion, but why should someone get a refund for only now doing what they could have done weeks ago? Isn't that unfair on everyone who has already had both vaccinations?

Of course it is. And if Hibs support is reflective of wider society (and why wouldn't it be?) then the vast majority of our ST holders are already double vaxxed, or are in the path toward it and have no issue at all with this.

ETA - 85% of over 18s have had 2 doses. 85%.......

There are Muppets everywhere, including in our support.

But they are a small number and won't be pandered to by Hibs or anyone else.

[Sir David Gray]

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It's an interesting suggestion, but why should someone get a refund for only now doing what they could have done weeks ago? Isn't that unfair on everyone who has already had both vaccinations?

I think it's a decent suggestion if this new law is going to be used in a way that I think it's supposed to be intended, which is being an effective means of incentivising people to go and get vaccinated.

It's no different to other suggestions I've seen about offering people free pizzas etc in exchange for getting vaccinated.

[Eyrie]

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I think it's a decent suggestion if this new law is going to be used in a way that I think it's supposed to be intended, which is being an effective means of incentivising people to go and get vaccinated.

It's no different to other suggestions I've seen about offering people free pizzas etc in exchange for getting vaccinated.

Surely the incentive in this case is being able to attend matches once vaccinated?

[Glory Lurker]

Hibs won't be refusing entry through choice. Can't see why they should have to refund anyone.

[Block]

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Surely the incentive in this case is being able to attend matches once vaccinated?

Which in fairness is all well and good when we have a good team to watch which we do now presently. We want to go and watch Hibernian as we are entertaining and top of the league currently. Imagine we were pretty mediocre? Vaccine passports might well be the final nail in the coffin if we were tom tit. These passports are a bit of a nonsense imo.

[Sir David Gray]

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We were told last season that we were getting all the games live on Hibs TV until we were allowed back into ER. I think it was a similar message when the STs went on sale for this season. Given that's the case then I'd imagine any T&Cs would cover that scenario. The vaccine passport situation effectively puts the unvaccinated back into that situation where they'll have to watch on Hibs TV until they have a passport (if they decide to get the vaccine). Potentially the T&Cs might have be worded in such a way that they cover this. I'd be very surprised if Hibs are on the hook for refunds when it is the government who have introduced the vaccine passport.

I've just read the season ticket Ts and Cs and point 5 says;

This season ticket is valid for virtual access to view such of the Hibernian FC first team SPFL League closed-door home matches as are streamed online either as part of the SPFL’s deal with Sky Sports or via Hibs TV at https://hibstv.hibernianfc.co.uk/ (for such time as those are available) and, once the Club is able to open and operate Easter Road Stadium in full, entry to Easter Road Stadium for such of the Hibernian FC first team SPFL League home matches as are played at Easter Road Stadium in
the 2020/2021 season. For the avoidance of doubt, your season ticket does not include any SPFL Play-Off Matches, European matches, friendlies or domestic cup matches at Easter Road Stadium.

I don't see anything there which says your season ticket is intended to be used for watching games on Hibs TV except for when it's behind closed doors.

PS - I realise it says season 20/21 but it is definitely the Ts and Cs for season 21/22.

https://d3tepru76oevpi.cloudfront.ne...s-Home-STs.pdf

[LaMotta]

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For what it's worth, the requirement for Covid passports in France is meant to run until the middle of November. Whether that will be extended remains to be seen.

I think I heard on the radio that the Covid Passport had done it's job in France ie - led to millions of unvaccinated people getting both jabs. Obviously it would be impossible to get everyone to get the jab but there is a clear rationale for doing it if it is going to increase vax numbers.

Do you know if this is right or did I mishear?

[Block]

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Hibs won't be refusing entry through choice. Can't see why they should have to refund anyone.

I posted a good few days ago that I hoped no Hibs fan would attempt for a refund as its not Hibs fault that they might have to refuse entry to unvaccinated patrons. However, if they were to persist and go down the legal route it could be that Hibs themselves might want to challenge the Scottish Government on loss of earnings due to the change in law. Changes in law can always create problematic secondary outcomes. It might never come to that crossing of bridges though. Hopefully not.

[Sir David Gray]

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Surely the incentive in this case is being able to attend matches once vaccinated?

The point I'm making is even if you have been motivated to now go and get vaccinated as a result of this new law (which I do think is the point of it all) you won't be eligible to attend any of the next 4 home league games.

[green day]

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The point I'm making is even if you have been motivated to now go and get vaccinated as a result of this new law (which I do think is the point of it all) you won't be eligible to attend any of the next 4 home league games.

If you drop in tomorrow, then 8 weeks after for 2nd, you only miss Celtic and Dundee Utd.

Storm in a teacup.

[007]

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Yes I have a fear that by me saying what I did that I am coming across as siding with people who have chosen not to get vaccinated. I am not and I agree with vaccination being required in order to enter certain settings, if anything I think it should be extended to places like pubs and restaurants as well.

All I was saying was that when people bought their season tickets 4 or 5 months ago there was no such rule which stated vaccination would be a requirement for entry into the stadium. In fact the First Minister was actually quite open about how she wasn't keen on the idea.

Even if I don't agree with their decision not to get vaccinated, those people now find themselves in a situation where, even if they wanted to now get vaccinated in order to comply with this new law, it will take them 8 weeks to get fully vaccinated and the law comes into effect in 3 weeks.

Over the next 8 weeks, Hibs have 4 home matches so I think if we're going to use this as a real incentive for people to now go and get vaccinated, rather just using it as a punishment for not going to get vaccinated up until now then if there's not going to be a blanket refund in place for everyone affected then I do think that at least for those people who decide that they will now get vaccinated there should be the offer of a refund for the cost of the next 4 games that they'll miss and we'll see them at the Dundee game on 20th November.

Hibs shouldn't need to refund anyone as this situation is not of their making. If anyone wants money back they should be asking the government for it. I've had a look at the ST T&Cs and I'd say Hibs are covered because they specifically say they can change the Terms to reflect changes in relevant laws and regulations and guidance.

"The Club may change these Terms from time to time (for example, to reflect changes in relevant laws and regulations and guidance), and any changes will be published on the website at http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/pages/termsofuse and will be binding on the holder."

[Rocky]

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If you drop in tomorrow, then 8 weeks after for 2nd, you only miss Celtic and Dundee Utd.

Storm in a teacup.

Agree it's a storm in a teacup and a classic of the genre of fretting over a problem that hasn't even happened yet, but just to point out that it's 10 weeks as you're not classed as fully vaxxed till 2 weeks after second jag.

[Eyrie]

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The point I'm making is even if you have been motivated to now go and get vaccinated as a result of this new law (which I do think is the point of it all) you won't be eligible to attend any of the next 4 home league games.

But you'd still be able to attend games after that, which you wouldn't be able to do if you continued to choose not to be vaccinated.

[660]

Mandate vaccines asap

[wookie70]

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I think I heard on the radio that the Covid Passport had done it's job in France ie - led to millions of unvaccinated people getting both jabs. Obviously it would be impossible to get everyone to get the jab but there is a clear rationale for doing it if it is going to increase vax numbers.

Do you know if this is right or did I mishear?

France has 68.70% of the population with a second dose as of yesterday so coercion isn't exactly a winning formula there(no idea if that is down to availabity or logistics though) The French tend to stick up for themselves more than us and care about Liberty more perhaps. We are a nation of folks that listen to our establishment. I'd expect more compliance here and asking may be better than telling to get it in arms. We will find out as this will be ongoing for a long time and we will all likely have to have boosters

[wookie70]

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Agree it's a storm in a teacup and a classic of the genre of fretting over a problem that hasn't even happened yet, but just to point out that it's 10 weeks as you're not classed as fully vaxxed till 2 weeks after second jag.

and assuming you only go to home games

[green day]

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Agree it's a storm in a teacup and a classic of the genre of fretting over a problem that hasn't even happened yet, but just to point out that it's 10 weeks as you're not classed as fully vaxxed till 2 weeks after second jag.

You only need to show double vaccination, it's not about efficacy.....

[Sir David Gray]

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Hibs shouldn't need to refund anyone as this situation is not of their making. If anyone wants money back they should be asking the government for it. I've had a look at the ST T&Cs and I'd say Hibs are covered because they specifically say they can change the Terms to reflect changes in relevant laws and regulations and guidance.

"The Club may change these Terms from time to time (for example, to reflect changes in relevant laws and regulations and guidance), and any changes will be published on the website at http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/pages/termsofuse and will be binding on the holder."

I'm sure their lawyers will be all over it to ensure no refunds are given.

[Ronniekirk]

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Mandate vaccines asap

Goverment s have already said they dont want to adopt that policy as it alienated certain factions in society and would make them less likely to comply


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[green day]

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and assuming you only go to home games

The point being answered was referring to home games.

[Rocky]

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You only need to show double vaccination, it's not about efficacy.....

From today's published proposal:

"The scheme will require a person seeking entry to certain venues and settings to show that they have been fully vaccinated. Fully vaccinated means vaccinated with a MHRA recognised vaccine in line with the MHRA recommended number of doses for the vaccine used and two weeks has passed for the vaccine to take effect"

[Eyrie]

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Mandate vaccines asap

That would be a step too far for me, but I don't see the problem with requiring vaccinations or negative tests for attending a non-essential event with a large number of people.

The example of not being allowed to drive without a driving licence has been used in this thread and it's a good comparison. Anyone can live their life without a driving licence, but if you want to be behind the wheel then a driving licence is mandated.

[greenginger]

Sturgeon said vaccine passports would only be introduced once there’s been a grown-up , mature debate on the issue and once it been shown to have public support.

https://www.thenational.scot/news/19...ical-concerns/

Has all this happened ? I’ve been away for a while.

[007]

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I've just read the season ticket Ts and Cs and point 5 says;

This season ticket is valid for virtual access to view such of the Hibernian FC first team SPFL League closed-door home matches as are streamed online either as part of the SPFL’s deal with Sky Sports or via Hibs TV at https://hibstv.hibernianfc.co.uk/ (for such time as those are available) and, once the Club is able to open and operate Easter Road Stadium in full, entry to Easter Road Stadium for such of the Hibernian FC first team SPFL League home matches as are played at Easter Road Stadium in
the 2020/2021 season. For the avoidance of doubt, your season ticket does not include any SPFL Play-Off Matches, European matches, friendlies or domestic cup matches at Easter Road Stadium.

I don't see anything there which says your season ticket is intended to be used for watching games on Hibs TV except for when it's behind closed doors.

PS - I realise it says season 20/21 but it is definitely the Ts and Cs for season 21/22.

https://d3tepru76oevpi.cloudfront.ne...s-Home-STs.pdf

Have been looking at the T&Cs too and replied to one of your other posts before seeing your above reply. You're right it doesn't specify anything around Hibs TV as I thought it might but I think the bit in my other post might cover it.

I noticed the error with the years too.

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I'm sure their lawyers will be all over it to ensure no refunds are given.

Yes, they probably will be.

[660]

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Sturgeon said vaccine passports would only be introduced once there’s been a grown-up , mature debate on the issue and once it been shown to have public support.

https://www.thenational.scot/news/19...ical-concerns/

Has all this happened ? I’ve been away for a while.

All the grown ups agreed to get vaccinated. What’s the issue?

[El Gubbz]

It seems to be forgotten in the argument that there are some people who despite wanting the vaccine at the earliest opportunity still aren’t double vaccinated.

Drop in vaccines didn’t really start until July and even then many under 30s were still waiting for their letter which didn’t come until later in the month.

I understand that the October date is based on 8 weeks after the end of July, the earliest that the gov had offered the first dose to everyone, but unfortunately if you caught covid when you were due your 2nd vaccine (which I did :-) ) you need to wait a further 4 weeks until you can get your second dose so for me that’s the end of September at the very earliest and from what I understand you may have to wait 2 weeks from the vaccination before your 2nd vaccine is valid?

It might sound like a unique position but it’s mainly folk in my age range that didn’t get offered the vaccine until July and are catching covid while we have record positive cases but despite bursting with anti bodies having suffered the virus we may be locked out of the football etc through no real fault of our own

[Block]

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That would be a step too far for me, but I don't see the problem with requiring vaccinations or negative tests for attending a non-essential event with a large number of people.

The example of not being allowed to drive without a driving licence has been used in this thread and it's a good comparison. Anyone can live their life without a driving licence, but if you want to be behind the wheel then a driving licence is mandated.

Its a terrible comparison.

We fans are paying to watch professional footballers compete in an outdoor stadium. We are not paying for a license to play at ER.

Vaccinated can pass on covid to others just as unvaccinated can. Let's have a bit truth about the matter please instead of outlandish comparisons.

Imo

[wookie70]

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Because they're the only people who will be legally unable to attend.

It is about proof of vaccination not being vaccinated. Being vaccinated doesn't gain you entry just like being filled with Covid wouldn't stop you attending assuming you had a passport. I am double jagged and do not agree with passports. I may choose not to carry one and will not be allowed entry. I will legally be unable to attend too surely.

[007]

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Sturgeon said vaccine passports would only be introduced once there’s been a grown-up , mature debate on the issue and once it been shown to have public support.

https://www.thenational.scot/news/19...ical-concerns/

Has all this happened ? I’ve been away for a while.

She decided from the 1st 20 pages of this thread that there was enough public support to crack on. I'm still trying to work out what name she posts under.