Vaccine Passports for Easter Road

[SQHib]

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This makes absolutely zero sense and there is no correlation between the two scenarios.

I would disagree - you asked what's the point of getting the vaccine if you have already had covid ? - the point is that you could get it again AND also put others at risk so you reduce the risk by taking the
vaccine .. or do you disagree that taking the vaccine reduces the risk of getting it again ?

[silverhibee]

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Elite athletes got all these exemptions during lockdown Would be interesting to hear why so many haven’t been vaccinated
Role Models for younger people
It’s an interesting one


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That will now have to change for footballers in SPFL, if they want to be in a stadium with more than 10’000 people they will now need to get vaccinated, can’t be one rule for the fans and another for the players and staff.

[Selkirkhibs]

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People aren't being forced to get vaccines just like folk aren't forced to learn to drive. If you want to drive you need to get a licence so you can protect other road users and yourself.

Just like a vaccine passport really. No ones forcing people to go to large events.

A vaccine passport does not state that the holder does not have covid. It merely confirms the holder would have had the vaccine as I have.

A driving license states that the holder has passed the required driving test and is safe to drive a vehicle on the road.

Two entirely different scenarios.

[wookie70]

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People aren't being forced to get vaccines just like folk aren't forced to learn to drive. If you want to drive you need to get a licence so you can protect other road users and yourself.
Just like a vaccine passport really. No ones forcing people to go to large events.

Do you have to carry your driving license in Scotland when you get in a car, news to me. I have been double vaxxed so comply with that but I don't want to carry medical details with me. You need to prove you have a licence if caught doing wrong. Just like wearing a mask it is done by trust between Govt and Citizen and then dealt with when the trust breaks down.

[mcohibs]

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What group do the vaccinated but not wishing to carry a passport fall under, or willing to support fellow citizens right to choose or indeed be exempt on medical grounds. Are we stupid too. So many insults flying around and saying people are selfish when the topic is about 10k gathering in one place which is potentially a selfish and unnecessary act which is far from essential.

I wonder if any of those in favour of the change have went to a supermarket when online buying was possible, met a mate when they could have called etc. There are millions of events taking place every day that means the virus will spread. The government need to make tough choices but I'm surprise the line has been drawn here. Is there evidence that large outdoor events are more dangerous than attending Uni or College for instance. What would students views be on having to provide a passport to attend a lecture.

Should being double vaxxed not be a requirement for every contact in society where you have no choice who you sit next to

Why don't you want to carry a vaccine passport? If it is on the grounds of 'I don't want my data being tracked', then yes, quite frankly that is stupid.

If not, then I'd be genuinely interested to hear the reasons why.

[silverhibee]

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The answer is I don't know but I would doubt if unvaccinated players will be banned from playing.

I suspect it will only apply to spectators.

How bizarre that fans will be asked to provide a passport to get in to a stadium to watch the majority of players who will be anti vaxxers, I just hope the folk who are saying people are being selfish for not getting vaccinated will be refusing to go to games to watch players who are refusing to get the jabs.

[silverhibee]

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Na you can just stay at home and do nout.

What’s your stance on going to watch players who won’t be vaccinated ?

[CentreLine]

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Do you have to carry your driving license in Scotland when you get in a car, news to me. I have been double vaxxed so comply with that but I don't want to carry medical details with me. You need to prove you have a licence if caught doing wrong. Just like wearing a mask it is done by trust between Govt and Citizen and then dealt with when the trust breaks down.

It is a legal requirement to carry your drivers licence, insurance certificate and test certificate (if relevant) with you in a vehicle. However, the law acknowledges that this is not always possible. As a result, the system where the police issue you with a form requiring you to produce these documents at an elected police station within seven days evolved. In actual fact all of these items can now be checked up on at the roadside by the police over computer records. Nonetheless, the legal requirement is still there and the police can stop any driver to require these documents, at any time, without any offence having been committed and without any other justification required to stop your vehicle.

[neil7908]

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A vaccine passport does not state that the holder does not have covid. It merely confirms the holder would have had the vaccine as I have.

A driving license states that the holder has passed the required driving test and is safe to drive a vehicle on the road.

Two entirely different scenarios.

They have passed a test - that doesn't mean they are safe to drive. My grandad was still driving at 90 and believe me, there is no way he would have passed his test again if he'd had to sit it.

A vaccine passport however will show you have put yourself in the best position to ensure you do not spread covid to others.

[neil7908]

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How bizarre that fans will be asked to provide a passport to get in to a stadium to watch the majority of players who will be anti vaxxers, I just hope the folk who are saying people are being selfish for not getting vaccinated will be refusing to go to games to watch players who are refusing to get the jabs.

The players won't be sitting next to me though. FWIW I think clubs should do more to push players but the issue is those in the ground infecting others - the players aren't going to be doing that so it doesn't really hold as an argument about restricting fan access.

[HibsGW]

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The players won't be sitting next to me though. FWIW I think clubs should do more to push players but the issue is those in the ground infecting others - the players aren't going to be doing that so it doesn't really hold as an argument about restricting fan access.

Out of interest, where are people actually getting that the players are anti vaxxers from? Is there anywhere that actually shows this? I’ve seen photos of Newell, Gray, McGregor and Murphy getting their vaccines, I’m not expecting to see a photo of all of them or something like that?

[calumhibee1]

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What’s your stance on going to watch players who won’t be vaccinated ?

Those same players aren’t in close enough contact with the 15000 there to watch them to cause a mass outbreak.

It’s not ideal, but it’s a totally different situation. To add to that, most of the players have had it from what I’ve heard.

[CentreLine]

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How bizarre that fans will be asked to provide a passport to get in to a stadium to watch the majority of players who will be anti vaxxers, I just hope the folk who are saying people are being selfish for not getting vaccinated will be refusing to go to games to watch players who are refusing to get the jabs.

On what evidence can we suggests thy “the majority of players” or any players, for that matter, refuse to be vaccinated?
Whether they are or not is a matter for themselves and for that very reason it is impossible to suggest players, per se, are against vaccination.

The rules will decided whether or not they have to prove it in the future but not to you and me. The information will, correctly, stay confidential

[Selkirkhibs]

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They have passed a test - that doesn't mean they are safe to drive. My grandad was still driving at 90 and believe me, there is no way he would have passed his test again if he'd had to sit it.

A vaccine passport however will show you have put yourself in the best position to ensure you do not spread covid to others.

Despite my having having had two jabs I believe I can still catch covid and pass it on to those without jabs and those with jabs. I think what the jabs do is put 'yourself' in the 'best position' of not falling severely ill or being hospitalised if catching it.

I've had the jabs but find it a bit nonsensical that I have to show a 'passport' to demonstrate to strangers that I have if I want to attend events despite my being able to pass it on similarly to folk who decided for their own personal reason that they don't want to be jabbed.

All imo of course.

[calumhibee1]

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Despite my having having had two jabs I believe I can still catch covid and pass it on to those without jabs and those with jabs. I think what the jabs do is put 'yourself' in the 'best position' of not falling severely ill or being hospitalised if catching it.

I've had the jabs but find it a bit nonsensical that I have to show a 'passport' to demonstrate to strangers that I have if I want to attend events despite my being able to pass it on similarly to folk who decided for their own personal reason that they don't want to be jabbed.

All imo of course.

The vaccine passport is more about showing that you’re much less dangerous to the other 9999 people in the 10000 crowd. Not that you are safe personally.

It’s more about showing you’re doing your bit to protect others than yourself.

[andudare2]

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Do you have to carry your driving license in Scotland when you get in a car, news to me. I have been double vaxxed so comply with that but I don't want to carry medical details with me. You need to prove you have a licence if caught doing wrong. Just like wearing a mask it is done by trust between Govt and Citizen and then dealt with when the trust breaks down.

There are quite a few medical conditions that you are better carrying details of,i have cards in wallet at all times in regards to taking warfarin, having Asthma and C.O.P.D,so given you say you dont want to carry medical records with you then i assume that you wouldn't carry those i mention either?

[MWHIBBIES]

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A vaccine passport does not state that the holder does not have covid. It merely confirms the holder would have had the vaccine as I have.

A driving license states that the holder has passed the required driving test and is safe to drive a vehicle on the road.

Two entirely different scenarios.

Surely almost 100% of car accidents are caused by people with licences? It shows you've passed a test. Many people are still unsafe drivers.

[Selkirkhibs]

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Surely almost 100% of car accidents are caused by people with licences? It shows you've passed a test. Many people are still unsafe drivers.

What has this got to do with vaccine passports?

[neil7908]

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The vaccine passport is more about showing that you’re much less dangerous to the other 9999 people in the 10000 crowd. Not that you are safe personally.

It’s more about showing you’re doing your bit to protect others than yourself.

👍

This is what it keeps coming back to time and time again. Personal freedom versus responsibility to others. As I've said in an earlier post, your freedom ends the moment in infringes on someone else. And whilst we all know you can still pass on Covid whilst vaccinated, the chances are much lower.

[Selkirkhibs]

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The vaccine passport is more about showing that you’re much less dangerous to the other 9999 people in the 10000 crowd. Not that you are safe personally.

It’s more about showing you’re doing your bit to protect others than yourself.

Reasonable opinion.

[MWHIBBIES]

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What has this got to do with vaccine passports?

Read the post I've quoted.

[Moulin Yarns]

The one thing that confuses me is the group of people who, on medical grounds, are unable to get vaccinated. Are they not also likely to be the ones that are most at risk of catching covid? In which case are they also not be the same group of people least likely to want to be in a large crowd, like at a football match?

Same with the people who are claiming they can't wear masks, should they be going into crowded supermarkets? Surely they should get someone else to help them by doing the shopping.

I suppose what I'm saying is that people who genuinely can't get vaccinated are unlikely to be going to the football.

[wookie70]

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It is a legal requirement to carry your drivers licence, insurance certificate and test certificate (if relevant) with you in a vehicle. However, the law acknowledges that this is not always possible. As a result, the system where the police issue you with a form requiring you to produce these documents at an elected police station within seven days evolved. In actual fact all of these items can now be checked up on at the roadside by the police over computer records. Nonetheless, the legal requirement is still there and the police can stop any driver to require these documents, at any time, without any offence having been committed and without any other justification required to stop your vehicle.

Learn something new every day. My understanding is that it is a recommendation not a requirement. Very different and gives the element of choice I want

[Selkirkhibs]

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Read the post I've quoted.

What about it?

[Casey1875]

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I would disagree - you asked what's the point of getting the vaccine if you have already had covid ? - the point is that you could get it again AND also put others at risk so you reduce the risk by taking the
vaccine .. or do you disagree that taking the vaccine reduces the risk of getting it again ?

Does having a seatbelt on possibly reduce the chance of getting into an accident? Is there a chance that having been in an accident without a seatbelt may provide you with the same safety net of a seatbelt the next time?

As I said earlier I'm doing the antibody trial just now if that shows a drop I might get it, if I'm showing as having them then I'm certainly less likely to get it.

[CentreLine]

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Learn something new every day. My understanding is that it is a recommendation not a requirement. Very different and gives the element of choice I want

No. Written in to the Road Traffic Act and carries a penalty for non compliance. Every driver is aware of that when they sit their test but we all forget stuff. Common practice is not to carry these things in the car but it is a legal requirement.

[overdrive]

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The one thing that confuses me is the group of people who, on medical grounds, are unable to get vaccinated. Are they not also likely to be the ones that are most at risk of catching covid? In which case are they also not be the same group of people least likely to want to be in a large crowd, like at a football match?

Same with the people who are claiming they can't wear masks, should they be going into crowded supermarkets? Surely they should get someone else to help them by doing the shopping.

I suppose what I'm saying is that people who genuinely can't get vaccinated are unlikely to be going to the football.

I agree about the mask wearing but I guess there will be people with allergies to ingredients within the vaccines that wouldn’t necessarily be at any more risk if they caught covid but would from the vaccine.

As harsh as it sounds, I wouldn't be giving such people an exemption from these rules as they are a risk to everyone else.

[007]

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Do you have to carry your driving license in Scotland when you get in a car, news to me. I have been double vaxxed so comply with that but I don't want to carry medical details with me. You need to prove you have a licence if caught doing wrong. Just like wearing a mask it is done by trust between Govt and Citizen and then dealt with when the trust breaks down.

So you are okay with crowds over 10k having to be double vaccinated but you just don't want us to have to carry the evidence of it.

[wookie70]

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Does having a seatbelt on possibly reduce the chance of getting into an accident? Is there a chance that having been in an accident without a seatbelt may provide you with the same safety net of a seatbelt the next time?

As I said earlier I'm doing the antibody trial just now if that shows a drop I might get it, if I'm showing as having them then I'm certainly less likely to get it.

It seems many are quite content to have the accident and hope the seatbelt saves them but seem unwilling to allow others who don't wear a seatbelt, can't wear a seatbelt or refuse to prove they have wore one to also take part for fear of making the accident more dangerous. They will all then presumably stop entering into contact with any other drivers for 10 days after the organised accident for fear of a mass pile up as they are not selfish of course and are all thinking about the wider societal implications. Meanwhile those under the age of being allowed to drive can walk out in front of all the cars as that is apparently not a problem as can those who can't wear a seatbelt for medical reasons.

The big question of course is, are the new rules about making people get vaccines or stopping the spread. I suspect a bit of both but the former is the driving force as you would simply stop attendance at the events if you were than bothered about the virus spreading.

[silverhibee]

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On what evidence can we suggests thy “the majority of players” or any players, for that matter, refuse to be vaccinated?
Whether they are or not is a matter for themselves and for that very reason it is impossible to suggest players, per se, are against vaccination.

The rules will decided whether or not they have to prove it in the future but not to you and me. The information will, correctly, stay confidential

We had been hoping that this would have changed under the new restrictions but unfortunately not. With many players in Scotland still awaiting vaccination, or their second dose, the JRG have advised that Red Zones need to continue to exist until the football department are double dosed and a Test to Release programme is made live by Government.

That was posted by the fans rep about 10 days a go, what’s holding players back from getting vaccinated, they have had plenty time to get it, if they haven’t had by now then they have obviously decided not to get it, the best time would have been over the summer break to get it, a number of managers have also spoken out about in England that players are refusing to get vaccinated, can’t be one rule for us and another with players, we should all be in this together, I have said this before, Government’s have bent over backwards to let football go ahead during this pandemic, they should be leaning on Football Association’s to do more to help people to get vaccinated, good on Hibs showing us McGregor Murphy Gray getting it, may encourage more people to get it, but “Role Model” players could be doing more.