Celtic goal

***superfurryhibby*** · 13-01-2021 03:24 PM

Originally Posted by B.H.F.C

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Still no seeing a McGinn touch. Turnbull turns in to trouble because of his first touch, he ends up about side on to goal, flicks the ball away and buys a foul.

We see what we want to see. I see McGinn clearly getting his boot on the ball and sending it in completely the opposite direction from where it was heading. No foul.

**B.H.F.C** · 13-01-2021 03:28 PM

Originally Posted by superfurryhibby

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We see what we want to see. I see McGinn clearly getting his boot on the ball and sending it in completely the opposite direction from where it was heading. No foul.

See what we want to see? I think you are, yes.

***bigwheel*** · 13-01-2021 03:29 PM

Whether he got a touch or not , it happened quickly and as he was stretching in to get the ball it’s quite easy to see how the ref would have seen a foul, like many did in first viewing ..always a risky tackle stretching a leg in like that

***danhibees1875*** · 13-01-2021 03:32 PM

Having looked at the replay now I think it was a foul. It's Turnbull that flicks the ball away.

**SCHAEDYSHORTS** · 13-01-2021 03:52 PM

Originally Posted by superfurryhibby

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Duffy made no difference to the free kick. He was behind the wall and stepped forward as it was struck. The ball wasn’t close to him and Hanlon’s jump was also irrelevant. He would have needed spring heels to make contact with it. It was a superbly executed free kick, it happens.

Yes Duffy steps forward but is in the wall well before the ball is struck. Games are won or lost on very fine margins, especially with the old firm. Where do you draw the line with these rules? Goalie steps of his line at a penalty, player steps in as a penalty is taken, ball bouncing unkindly up onto an arm, off side by an elbow or big toe? No disputing it was a cracking free kick but for me we either leave rules alone & simplify so players & officials are in full understanding or implement the laws as they are now.
Too much messing about with things that don’t improve the game or lead to grey areas.

***superfurryhibby*** · 13-01-2021 04:00 PM

Originally Posted by B.H.F.C

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See what we want to see? I think you are, yes.

Just watched it again in very slow motion. You're wrong. Turnbull has pretty much lost control of the ball, he touches it wide, McGinn puts a much firmer touch on it a nanosecond after that. It wasn't a foul, end of. There is no debate, most people who have commented agree it wasn't a foul. That's because it wasn't.

**B.H.F.C** · 13-01-2021 04:08 PM

Originally Posted by superfurryhibby

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Just watched it again in very slow motion. You're wrong. Turnbull has pretty much lost control of the ball, he touches it wide, McGinn puts a much firmer touch on it a nanosecond after that. It wasn't a foul, end of. There is no debate, most people who have commented agree it wasn't a foul. That's because it wasn't.

Seems to be quite a few folk saying it wasn’t a foul, unless you choose not to see them like. Could go on all day, I think it’s a foul and a foul was given.

**Alan62** · 13-01-2021 04:10 PM

Originally Posted by B.H.F.C

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It’s clearly just me but I think Turnbull kicks the ball away, not McGinn. He plays for the foul but it is a foul for me.

A picture paints 1000 words.

Screenshot 2021-01-13 at 16.57.14.jpg

**B.H.F.C** · 13-01-2021 04:11 PM

Originally Posted by Alan62

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A picture paints 1000 words.

Screenshot 2021-01-13 at 16.57.14.jpg

And the video says much more, to me.

**Alan62** · 13-01-2021 04:13 PM

I rest my case, m'Lud.

52879486-67cd-4426-bf8a-9bc4f34373df.jpg

***matty_f*** · 13-01-2021 04:16 PM

Originally Posted by SCHAEDYSHORTS

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Yes Duffy steps forward but is in the wall well before the ball is struck. Games are won or lost on very fine margins, especially with the old firm. Where do you draw the line with these rules? Goalie steps of his line at a penalty, player steps in as a penalty is taken, ball bouncing unkindly up onto an arm, off side by an elbow or big toe? No disputing it was a cracking free kick but for me we either leave rules alone & simplify so players & officials are in full understanding or implement the laws as they are now.
Too much messing about with things that don’t improve the game or lead to grey areas.

The rule doesn't say anything about not having an impact on what happened next, he's not allowed to be in or near the wall. Should have been disallowed.

**Alan62** · 13-01-2021 04:22 PM

Originally Posted by B.H.F.C

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And the video says much more, to me.

To be fair, in real-time, the incident is all over in a matter of seconds. Both players are moving at pace. What the stop-frame analysis does is it allows us to unpick the sequence of what actually physically happened. For me, both players are entitled to go for the ball and neither is in full control of it. What this picture shows absolutely clearly and without any shadow of doubt is that McGinn plays the ball at a point in time when Turnbull's momentum is both behind the ball and behind McGinn's leg. Although contact, at that point, is inevitable it's within the rules of the game. That's the nature of a tackle. It's a difficult call for the referee but there's no question that the actual physical sequence of events shouldn't have led to a foul.

***superfurryhibby*** · 13-01-2021 04:35 PM

Originally Posted by B.H.F.C

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And the video says much more, to me.

Yep, that’s McGinn knocking the ball away from Turnbull with a touch immediately after Turnbull tries to flick the ball wide of him.

Tbf it’s tight as and it’s given, so it just shows how marginal some key decisions can be.

Shall we debate the Porteous penalty incident now

?

**B.H.F.C** · 13-01-2021 04:37 PM

Originally Posted by superfurryhibby

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Yep, that’s McGinn knocking the ball away from Turnbull with a touch immediately after Turnbull tries to flick the ball wide of him.

Tbf it’s tight as and it’s given, so it just shows how tight key decisions can be.

Shall we debate the Porteous penalty incident now

?

If you want, that one wasn’t a foul.

***superfurryhibby*** · 13-01-2021 04:42 PM

Originally Posted by Alan62

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To be fair, in real-time, the incident is all over in a matter of seconds. Both players are moving at pace. What the stop-frame analysis does is it allows us to unpick the sequence of what actually physically happened. For me, both players are entitled to go for the ball and neither is in full control of it. What this picture shows absolutely clearly and without any shadow of doubt is that McGinn plays the ball at a point in time when Turnbull's momentum is both behind the ball and behind McGinn's leg. Although contact, at that point, is inevitable it's within the rules of the game. That's the nature of a tackle. It's a difficult call for the referee but there's no question that the actual physical sequence of events shouldn't have led to a foul.

Correct.

Turnbull’s touch is fractionally before McGinn’s. It’s the merest flick. McGinn gets a firmer contact to push it away. He inevitably then connects with Turnbull but by then the ball is played.

***superfurryhibby*** · 13-01-2021 04:44 PM

Originally Posted by B.H.F.C

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If you want, that one wasn’t a foul.

Even though Porteous does stand on the guys toe, I concur

.

***Stonewall*** · 13-01-2021 04:58 PM

Originally Posted by BlackSheep

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The officials in Scotland are years behind the top officials in standards and knowledge... the fact they are not professionals means they don't give a toss, in my opinion.

If we think EPL and the likes are working out all the kinks of VAR then we are mistaken, if, and thats a big IF, we get VAR then i can tell you know our officials will bumble their way through that as well.

I mean when was the last time you saw an official telling a player to leave by the nearest byline? There's no fans in now so no excuse about player safety?

Inconsistent enforcement and use of the newer offside regulations about letting play go on til the play finishes....

Handball in the box still applied inconsistently.

Sending off hedges and giving a penalty in the Dons v Huns game... incorrectly applied rules.

I could go on... and i implore anyone to add to this list.....!

As far as I can see the officials down south constantly get it wrong, even after Consulting VAR. it stems from not drawing the lessons from other sports who have used it for years and and also an undocumented change in intention from dealing with obvious errors to drawing lines to see if someone’s left nipple is in an offside position. IMO if you have to draw a line to tell it’s onside.

You’re 100% right our officials would make a complete James Hunt of VAR if they were let loose with it and it would little to address bias IMO. VAR is an abomination and should have no place in football. I’d rather put up with the odd bad decision and preserve the continuous and free flowing nature of the game and have no interest in waiting five minutes to see whether it’s worth cheering for a goal,

***lord bunberry*** · 13-01-2021 05:35 PM

Originally Posted by B.H.F.C

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It’s clearly just me but I think Turnbull kicks the ball away, not McGinn. He plays for the foul but it is a foul for me.

The ball goes back the way, the two players almost kick the ball at the same time. I’ve got a photo, but I it always comes out tiny when I post from my iPad. If I could work out how to do it I’d post the picture.

***erin go bragh*** · 13-01-2021 05:46 PM

I didn’t think it was a foul at the time but when Tam McManus and his co commentator both said it was clearly a foul. I just put my initial thought ,down to my Hibs tinted vision.
But when slowed down, I was bloody spot on 🤨
But I’d still never vote for VAR, which is killing the game imo .

**B.H.F.C** · 13-01-2021 05:49 PM

Originally Posted by lord bunberry

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The ball goes back the way, the two players almost kick the ball at the same time. I’ve got a photo, but I it always comes out tiny when I post from my iPad. If I could work out how to do it I’d post the picture.

I’ve seen the stills where you can see his foot near the ball. But when I watch the video I don’t see the touch from McGinn to divert it that people are on about. The ball obviously changes direction but so does Turnbull, he was going away from goal by the time the challenge comes in and I still think it’s him that toes it away. As I said, could go round in circles with it!

***lord bunberry*** · 13-01-2021 06:21 PM

Originally Posted by B.H.F.C

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I’ve seen the stills where you can see his foot near the ball. But when I watch the video I don’t see the touch from McGinn to divert it that people are on about. The ball obviously changes direction but so does Turnbull, he was going away from goal by the time the challenge comes in and I still think it’s him that toes it away. As I said, could go round in circles with it!

I think if there was an angle from behind the goal it would clear it up.

**B.H.F.C** · 13-01-2021 06:23 PM

Originally Posted by lord bunberry

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I think if there was an angle from behind the goal it would clear it up.

I saw that very angle the other night and that’s why I’m so convinced. No quite behind the goal but the other side of McGinn.

***superfurryhibby*** · 13-01-2021 08:14 PM

Originally Posted by erin go bragh

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I didn’t think it was a foul at the time but when Tam McManus and his co commentator both said it was clearly a foul. I just put my initial thought ,down to my Hibs tinted vision.
But when slowed down, I was bloody spot on 🤨
But I’d still never vote for VAR, which is killing the game imo .

In real time it looks like a foul, so that really was your Hibs tinted vision. It’s only the close up and very slowed down view that shows McGinn took the ball after Turnbull’s very slight sideways touch.

Agree in some respects about Var. the McGinn free kick wouldn’t be given, but on the other hand Porteous does make contact with the Celtic players foot in the debated penalty incident. The wee prick then took a dive, but fact is that Porteous stands on the guy’s foot. That could easily have been given.

**1875Sean** · 13-01-2021 08:22 PM

I can’t believe there is so much debate about if McGinn touched the ball, its a clear free kick

**Andy74** · 13-01-2021 08:23 PM

Originally Posted by Edinburgh_Lad

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I can’t believe there is so much debate about if McGinn touched the ball, its a clear free kick

It’s not really.

**1875Sean** · 13-01-2021 08:31 PM

Originally Posted by Andy74

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It’s not really.

Pretty sure it’s Turnbull that takes the ball away then plays for the freekick think what you want but why so many Hibs fans on here say it’s a free kick if you clearly think it’s not?

***wookie70*** · 13-01-2021 08:41 PM

Never a free kick and shocking refereeing not noticing that Duffy was in the wall. He is looking right at it so the assumption has to be he doesn't know the rules. Referees should be dropped down a league for mistakes like not noticing the position of Duffy. Apart from that that he seemed to have two separate free kick rules for either team and the free kick that led to the foul was never a free kick with the direction the ball took a big clue

***superfurryhibby*** · 13-01-2021 10:22 PM

Originally Posted by Edinburgh_Lad

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Pretty sure it’s Turnbull that takes the ball away then plays for the freekick think what you want but why so many Hibs fans on here say it’s a free kick if you clearly think it’s not?

You obviously haven't really followed this thread? Lots know It wasn’t a foul because they slowed the footage down and saw that McGinn played the ball cleanly a split second after Turnbull’s touch. Go back, watch it in slow motion and you will comprehend.

**1875Sean** · 13-01-2021 10:37 PM

Originally Posted by superfurryhibby

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You obviously haven't really followed this thread? Lots know It wasn’t a foul because they slowed the footage down and saw that McGinn played the ball cleanly a split second after Turnbull’s touch. Go back, watch it in slow motion and you will comprehend.

Think you should go and view the thread, still people saying after the YouTube link they can’t see it, for me turnbull hits the ball and McGinn is late