The generic Hearts thread

[munchar]

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It comes down to money.

If Hibs are saying "let's not rush this" then that is because we can afford to do that....

..but Hearts & Rangers cant afford to hold on.

They need to pay staff & overheads in May.


They dont have cash in the bank to make payment.
They *need* the SPFL cash in April.

So the 2 clubs with most to lose here, are the 2 clubs who cant afford the time to debate it.

It will be either Hearts, or Rangers, who will make the distressed phone call to the SPFL later this month saying "ok, ok, whatever it takes, just give us the money, please"

This is why so many fans, not just Hibs fans are angry. The 2 teams who went bust only 7 years ago by constantly trying to buy success, are almost bust again! Once can MAYBE be seen as mismanagement from last owners BUT TWICE. Blatant cheating of the highest order. Not only that, wanting leagues voided or reconstructed, but payment of prize money before doing so, & some on here wonder why we want them down! FFS, they’re putting THEMSELVES down. It shouldn’t even be open for debate. Remember, this is the club that tried to KILL us. I am amazed that ANY fan or board member with the clubs best interests at heart would help them in any way. It’s total nonsense that we need Hearts in any way. Yes, I’d miss the Derby’s, there special occasions. But if Hearts struggling makes it easier for Hibs to be successful, I’ll settle for that.

[The 90+2]

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What’s clear is that there hasn’t been enough (any) consultation with the clubs.

Looks like it’s a “Here’s two options for you to vote for. BTW, no.1 is a right **** storm.”

It may not pass for this reason. Doesn’t mean it won’t ultimately come to calling the league over, and relegating herts. Just not right now.

My reading is this is what LD is saying, that Hibs shouldn't get bounced into a decision without a better, more informed discussion.

It does look like a bit of a mess. For example, what happens if leagues 1&2 vote for early termination, but the Championship vote against?

Surely, the better, more informed discussion on the league ending will take place at a later date? This isn’t about the Prem ending, it’s the lower leagues for teams that desperately need money now.

[The 90+2]

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This is why so many fans, not just Hibs fans are angry. The 2 teams who went bust only 7 years ago by constantly trying to buy success, are almost bust again! Once can MAYBE be seen as mismanagement from last owners BUT TWICE. Blatant cheating of the highest order. Not only that, wanting leagues voided or reconstructed, but payment of prize money before doing so, & some on here wonder why we want them down! FFS, they’re putting THEMSELVES down. It shouldn’t even be open for debate. Remember, this is the club that tried to KILL us. I am amazed that ANY fan or board member with the clubs best interests at heart would help them in any way. It’s total nonsense that we need Hearts in any way. Yes, I’d miss the Derby’s, there special occasions. But if Hearts struggling makes it easier for Hibs to be successful, I’ll settle for that.

Spot on.

[Hibernianinc]

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Surely, the better, more informed discussion on the league ending will take place at a later date? This isn’t about the Prem ending, it’s the lower leagues for teams that desperately need money now.

Not if they vote for it.

If there are 9 'Yays' then the Prem ends, the minute UEFA rubber stamp it.

Then you have a chat about what next season looks like......

[CraigHibee]

hearts deserve to be relegated, they are bottom of the league for a reason

they are *****

[The 90+2]

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Not if they vote for it.

If there are 9 'Yays' then the Prem ends, the minute UEFA rubber stamp it.

Then you have a chat about what next season looks like......

Not if the clubs are against the season ending even if Uefa rubber stamp it. A lot of clubs in the top league have made it clear they prefer the season to be concluded. The SPFL is the clubs, so the clubs will decide this and not the SPFL board (where the huns have representation also).

[Spike Mandela]

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I can’t believe the amount of HIBS fans making threats against the club
We’ll vote what suits us, and not anyone else

For me it’s the drip, drip effect of Hibs as doormats in Scottish football. We pay our money then discover that for years Rangers were cheating, lying to the authorities and then the authorities are complicit in the whitewash. When the call comes for an independent inquiry into the SFA’s handling of the ebt scandal the compromised Petrie and Ms Dempster with unseemly haste decide it is time to move on. Hibs just accept it

Corrupt Romanov funds Hearts with a bloated squad on fantasy wages he was never going to pay. They ‘soldier’ on whils clearly insolvent with no interference from authorities. Beating us in a final with players bought on the never never. Hibs say nothing, we just accept it.

Now in the most difficult of circumstances clubs like Hearts are squirming desperately and blatantly to take advantage of the situation and save their own skin. I have a feeling Dempster will be complicit in this endeavour. Hibs yet again just accepting their ****

Some Hibs fans, perhaps tired and cynical like me, have maybe just had enough of this corrupt entity we call Scottish football. I have paid my season ticket already but if what I suspect comes to pass, I will have severe buyers regret.

[hibeerealist]

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This is my take on it:

It would be best for EVERYONE, not Hibs or Hearts etc, but the whole of Scottish football if we can finish the season. Then there’s no ifs & buts. Best team wins, worst relegated. Realistically, there seems to be no quick end to this pandemic. The only option may be to play behind closed doors? Clubs don’t want this because of lost income. Extend the season? Clubs will have players out of contract who they may not want or be able to afford to keep on, but leaves them short of numbers. Especially lower league clubs, who probably have targets already identified & agreed for next season. Clubs are also reliant on prize money which will be budgeted for. Even if it’s last prize. Again, this could be the difference of smaller clubs staying afloat or ultimately folding! It looks like the tv deal is in place, worth millions. Will this become null & void if we decide to change our structure? Or is there pressure being put on to keep all the bigger teams together for tv purposes? Logically, we should do our utmost to put next season on hold & finish this season whenever that may be. If we have to play 2/3 times weekly to catch up, so be it. They’re athletes. As said previously though, MOST clubs NEED their prize money to survive. Release some players to cut the wage bill, plan for next season. None of this can happen with the uncertainty. If we can’t start back by July/August, it should be unanimously agreed that there is no alternative but to finish as it stands. In the meantime, I’m sure we can pay all the clubs the minimum payment of last place to keep ticking over. Reconstruction etc is a disgrace, as it’s never been mentioned until now. You can’t award titles to the current best teams but not relegate the current worst teams? Play offs are different. These teams only might have a chance of success. Partick I’d feel sorry for, as they have a game in hand for safety, but the tables don’t lie. It’s not 8 games into the season where it’s a false table, but 8 to go, where nothing much is likely to change. Rangers, Hearts, Patrick, Falkirk etc are unfortunate, but all have had roughly 30 games to put themselves in a better position. Unfair they may say, but the world is unfair just now.

The Sky TV deal for next season was agreed and it did not have any conditions such as Hertz must be in the SPL, so lets NOT put that deal in any way "at risk" trying to save/accommodate Hertz!!

We have done our bit for them in any event, 50% of their total wins in the SPL were against us AND both at ER. Of the other 11 clubs in the SPL Hibs have helped them much more than any other, so do not even consider a vote for reconstruction.

Agree with you re Partick, Falkirk NO they can GTF.

The Huns & their wee cousins are trying to rock the boat (for different reasons and are best ignored.

There will be NO games in June the league must finish now and we prepare for next season.

[Onion]

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Hearts getting relegated just isn’t going to happen. The media campaign for reconstruction literally started the second the league was suspended. The media pressure from Rangers and Hearts media supporters and apologists will put pressure on the authorities to do their bidding as usual and the other clubs will buckle. Dempster. is already softening up the Hibs fans for such a scenario.

Their ‘fairness’ towards Hearts will lead to a 14 team league which will of course completely ignore the ‘unfairness’ to the 3rd anf 4th teams in the Championship play off positions. THAT is Scottish football.

And it will be called the Scottish Premiership - a brand new league competition, with new TV deal - and deny Celtic the opportunity to win their coveted 10 in a Row

[Hibernianinc]

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Not if the clubs are against the season ending even if Uefa rubber stamp it. A lot of clubs in the top league have made it clear they prefer the season to be concluded. The SPFL is the clubs, so the clubs will decide this and not the SPFL board (where the huns have representation also).

We're agreeing.

It's over if the clubs vote for it. It's not if they don't.

This is a call for the clubs. What LD is saying is 'Do we have to decide now?"

The Board have linked payments to the decision, which may be contractual. This may force the hand of some....

[Billy Whizz]

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For me it’s the drip, drip effect of Hibs as doormats in Scottish football. We pay our money then discover that for years Rangers were cheating, lying to the authorities and then the authorities are complicit in the whitewash. When the call comes for an independent inquiry into the SFA’s handling of the ebt scandal the compromised Petrie and Ms Dempster with unseemly haste decide it is time to move on. Hibs just accept it

Corrupt Romanov funds Hearts with a bloated squad on fantasy wages he was never going to pay. They ‘soldier’ on whils clearly insolvent with no interference from authorities. Beating us in a final with players bought on the never never. Hibs say nothing, we just accept it.

Now in the most difficult of circumstances clubs like Hearts are squirming desperately and blatantly to take advantage of the situation and save their own skin. I have a feeling Dempster will be complicit in this endeavour. Hibs yet again just accepting their ****

Some Hibs fans, perhaps tired and cynical like me, have maybe just had enough of this corrupt entity we call Scottish football. I have paid my season ticket already but if what I suspect comes to pass, I will have severe buyers regret.

Good post Spike

[sean04]

Reconstruction won’t happen. Sky have signed a deal for 4 old firm games a season. Tv deal is everything to the premier league. Sky don’t want to show Inverness against Ross county

[Ozyhibby]

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For me it’s the drip, drip effect of Hibs as doormats in Scottish football. We pay our money then discover that for years Rangers were cheating, lying to the authorities and then the authorities are complicit in the whitewash. When the call comes for an independent inquiry into the SFA’s handling of the ebt scandal the compromised Petrie and Ms Dempster with unseemly haste decide it is time to move on. Hibs just accept it

Corrupt Romanov funds Hearts with a bloated squad on fantasy wages he was never going to pay. They ‘soldier’ on whils clearly insolvent with no interference from authorities. Beating us in a final with players bought on the never never. Hibs say nothing, we just accept it.

Now in the most difficult of circumstances clubs like Hearts are squirming desperately and blatantly to take advantage of the situation and save their own skin. I have a feeling Dempster will be complicit in this endeavour. Hibs yet again just accepting their ****

Some Hibs fans, perhaps tired and cynical like me, have maybe just had enough of this corrupt entity we call Scottish football. I have paid my season ticket already but if what I suspect comes to pass, I will have severe buyers regret.

Summed up perfectly.


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[Skol]

I would love it if after all this fuss we agreed to finish the season whenever we can and after that Hearts get relegated anyway.

[hibeerealist]

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Difference between 7th and 4th is £400k
7th and 5th is £200k, could be the difference in paying some of the deferred payments, without it coming out of next years budget

We just to think about us

We have had our chance to catch Livi/Aberdeen and ****ed it up just as the Hertz had their chances to catch teams above them!

The season is done, no "behind closed doors" games, or further delays to decisions will help resolve/change this!

[munchar]

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Not if the clubs are against the season ending even if Uefa rubber stamp it. A lot of clubs in the top league have made it clear they prefer the season to be concluded. The SPFL is the clubs, so the clubs will decide this and not the SPFL board (where the huns have representation also).

So it’s all about Hearts & The Rangers, not Scottish football as a whole. They 2 want to continue, even though the majority of clubs in Scotland can’t survive financially? Why don’t the powers that be release a statement saying both they clubs have a massive fan base, no bank debt, so no need to be in this financial position. When your signing £7million players, or giving wages of 8k & 6k on long term deals, did you not realise you couldn’t sustain it without success? ***** them both! Take your medicine like the rest of us have had to do in the past.

[MikeyS]

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Hearts getting relegated just isn’t going to happen. The media campaign for reconstruction literally started the second the league was suspended. The media pressure from Rangers and Hearts media supporters and apologists will put pressure on the authorities to do their bidding as usual and the other clubs will buckle. Dempster. is already softening up the Hibs fans for such a scenario.

Their ‘fairness’ towards Hearts will lead to a 14 team league which will of course completely ignore the ‘unfairness’ to the 3rd anf 4th teams in the Championship play off positions. THAT is Scottish football.

I really cant see reconstruction being an option the majority will vote for. Livi, Hamilton, RC, Killie, Mwell all need 3 or 4 OF games a season to survive and probably more inportantly the TV companies aren't going to be keen on limited OF games.

[The 90+2]

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We're agreeing.

It's over if the clubs vote for it. It's not if they don't.

This is a call for the clubs. What LD is saying is 'Do we have to decide now?"

The Board have linked payments to the decision, which may be contractual. This may force the hand of some....

It’s not over for the Prem’ if the clubs vote this going through tomorrow. I believe that will go to a separate vote or at the very least when there’s medical and scientific evidence that the league won’t be concluded by July. We need to start the new season as close to Aug as possible for the Sky deal. They aren’t just going to say “aye just play the remaining games from last year in aug, BT can show them lads”

[Barney McGrew]

Another thought.

If we do string it out and then vote for reconstruction, then we’ll probably be sharing Tv and sponsorship money with 13 other teams rather than 11. That won’t benefit any of the other Premiership teams other than a ‘saved’ Hertz, who would still get more than they would in the Championship.

That may well play into several clubs thinking, especially those with a much lower budget like St Mirren or Hamilton.

[Chorley Hibee]

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This is why so many fans, not just Hibs fans are angry. The 2 teams who went bust only 7 years ago by constantly trying to buy success, are almost bust again! Once can MAYBE be seen as mismanagement from last owners BUT TWICE. Blatant cheating of the highest order. Not only that, wanting leagues voided or reconstructed, but payment of prize money before doing so, & some on here wonder why we want them down! FFS, they’re putting THEMSELVES down. It shouldn’t even be open for debate. Remember, this is the club that tried to KILL us. I am amazed that ANY fan or board member with the clubs best interests at heart would help them in any way. It’s total nonsense that we need Hearts in any way. Yes, I’d miss the Derby’s, there special occasions. But if Hearts struggling makes it easier for Hibs to be successful, I’ll settle for that.

Couldn't have put it better myself.

Let them off the hook and they resume cheating once again.

The cheating that will then have a detrimental effect upon Hibs, due to missing out on players, lower league position, poorer results - as previous occasions have shown.

A weaker Hearts/Huns equal more chance of success.

[The 90+2]

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So it’s all about Hearts & The Rangers, not Scottish football as a whole. They 2 want to continue, even though the majority of clubs in Scotland can’t survive financially? Why don’t the powers that be release a statement saying both they clubs have a massive fan base, no bank debt, so no need to be in this financial position. When your signing £7million players, or giving wages of 8k & 6k on long term deals, did you not realise you couldn’t sustain it without success? ***** them both! Take your medicine like the rest of us have had to do in the past.

The majority of the Prem would like to conclude the season. I think the lower leagues need the cash now that’s why the vote is for the lower leagues only.

The rest, when it is decided and declared the season won’t be able to continue at a later date, I completely agree with. Hearts and huns want the league to continue but want cash now. They as usual want best of both worlds and spout **** the loudest.

[Since452]

Both big huns and wee huns can go and fling ***** at themselves

[Bostonhibby]

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For me it’s the drip, drip effect of Hibs as doormats in Scottish football. We pay our money then discover that for years Rangers were cheating, lying to the authorities and then the authorities are complicit in the whitewash. When the call comes for an independent inquiry into the SFA’s handling of the ebt scandal the compromised Petrie and Ms Dempster with unseemly haste decide it is time to move on. Hibs just accept it

Corrupt Romanov funds Hearts with a bloated squad on fantasy wages he was never going to pay. They ‘soldier’ on whils clearly insolvent with no interference from authorities. Beating us in a final with players bought on the never never. Hibs say nothing, we just accept it.

Now in the most difficult of circumstances clubs like Hearts are squirming desperately and blatantly to take advantage of the situation and save their own skin. I have a feeling Dempster will be complicit in this endeavour. Hibs yet again just accepting their ****

Some Hibs fans, perhaps tired and cynical like me, have maybe just had enough of this corrupt entity we call Scottish football. I have paid my season ticket already but if what I suspect comes to pass, I will have severe buyers regret.

Really good post.

Sadly I think this is very close to where we'll end up, it chips away at my enjoyment of the league the club I love play in.



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[percy veer]

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From the Guardian. Lovely stuff;

"The Scottish Professional Football League aims to crown Celtic as champions and relegate Heart of Midlothian after 23 April, the earliest date Uefa is willing to accept for the abandonment of top divisions.A meeting between the league’s board and clubs on Wednesday resulted in the recommendation of a resolution for a vote in each of the four divisions on whether to end their season as it stands, with places allocated on an average points-per-game basis.

Nine of the 12 Premiership clubs would need to vote in favour, and the SPFL, having canvassed opinion, is understood to be fully confident of it passing. Votes will be collated before the start of next week.

A subsequent delay in abandoning the top-flight campaign would then be expected in order to follow Uefa guidance. The European game’s governing body has warned of possible restrictions to Champions League and Europa League entry if member associations abandon seasons prematurely. The SPFL does not regard that as a serious risk but is anxious not to antagonise Uefa.

The Hearts owner, Ann Budge, has spoken of legal action should the league demote her club, who are four points adrift with eight games to play. Rangers have publicly spoken out against any early finish to the campaign and did so again on Wednesday afternoon.







“It is abhorrent that certain clubs could be unfairly relegated if the current SPFL proposals were implemented,” read an Ibrox statement, which added: “The consequences of forcing through change without due care and attention will have severe consequences for the Scottish game.”
Rangers insist “the 2019-20 season is only complete when all 38 games have been played to a finish”.

Under the average-points plan, only Hibernian and St Johnstone – currently sixth and seventh respectively – would change places.
Dundee United will be promoted to Scotland’s top division if Championship clubs pass their element of the resolution. That element may hold the key to the SPFL’s plans, with several clubs considering their options. It also irked Championship boards that the league issued a statement as their occasionally feisty round of talks were ongoing.

The bottom two divisions are expected to back an immediate end to their seasons, with 15 from 20 needing to agree in a combined vote. Brechin City, otherwise consigned to a play-off to save their spot in League Two, would be saved.

One glimmer of hope for Hearts - and Partick Thistle, who would be relegated from the Championship - came in an SPFL statement. “If the resolution is approved, the SPFL has also committed to consulting with clubs over the possibility of league restructuring ahead of season 2020-21,” it read. That prospect, primarily of a 14-team Premiership as mooted by Budge on Wednesday, is currently viewed by insiders as remote.
Numerous clubs across Scotland have been keen for the season to be defined so as to release prize money, issued on the basis of placings.
Neil Doncaster, the league’s chief executive, said: “We are keen to work with Uefa and remain in discussion with them over the situation in Scotland. The quicker we reach a final position the better.”

Clubs were informed of a necessity to start the 2020-21 Premiership season on the first Saturday in August, as part of Sky Sports’ new and exclusive live television deal. That campaign has therefore been granted priority, even though there is no guarantee of football in early August.
The Scottish FA hopes to complete the 2019-20 Scottish Cup, currently at the semi-final phase, possibly as the opening games of “next” season.

Aberdeen, fourth in the Premiership, would have a possible route to the Europa League only via the cup but it is understood they could instead be put forward by the Scottish FA on the basis of league position"

So their hopes rest on US voting against, due to finishing 7th not 6th what would those mutants say......PLEASING.

[FilipinoHibs]

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Spot on.

Yup relegate the thieves and cheats.

[greenpaper55]

How can we finish this season when players have not kicked a ball in earnest for nearly four weeks ? there have been warnings that players will be injured as they would need a pre season to get up to full fitness again, this would be after the lock down is finished whenever that is and you must have every player tested on the day of the game that they are not carrying the virus ! Let's face it it's not going to happen anytime soon and to try and extend the season means you upset the new SKY deal that is due to start next August with a twelve team league.

[The 90+2]

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How can we finish this season when players have not kicked a ball in earnest for nearly four weeks ? there have been warnings that players will be injured as they would need a pre season to get up to full fitness again, this would be after the lock down is finished whenever that is and you must have every player tested on the day of the game that they are not carrying the virus ! Let's face it it's not going to happen anytime soon and to try and extend the season means you upset the new SKY deal that is due to start next August with a twelve team league.

All true and logical. But let’s vote against ending the lower leagues right away in case it might scupper a miracle in the season being played out in the next couple of months with unfit players and depleted squads.

[Hibernianinc]

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It’s not over for the Prem’ if the clubs vote this going through tomorrow. I believe that will go to a separate vote or at the very least when there’s medical and scientific evidence that the league won’t be concluded by July. We need to start the new season as close to Aug as possible for the Sky deal. They aren’t just going to say “aye just play the remaining games from last year in aug, BT can show them lads”

Again, agree re the 2nd bit.

But, if the clubs votes 'yes' tomorrow I can't see how they'd re-run the vote, unless UEFA influence.

[AltheHibby]

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Both big huns and wee huns can go and fling ***** at themselves

That made me laugh more than it should!!

[The 90+2]

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Again, agree re the 2nd bit.

But, if the clubs votes 'yes' tomorrow I can't see how they'd re-run the vote, unless UEFA influence.

I think it would be the fairest way when it’s confirmed the season couldn’t reach any kind of natural conclusion. The SPFL board aren’t going to upset the majority of the league who want it concluded without any kind of vote or at least evidence it can’t be concluded by Aug.