St Johnstone to start giving Old Firm THREE stands at McDairmid

[jgl07]

Maybe the Scottish Premiership should be taken out and shot.

A new League could then be formed without Rangers or Sevco.

[The 90+2]

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Maybe the Scottish Premiership should be taken out and shot.

A new League could then be formed without Rangers or Sevco.

Can Celtic bolt to the loi too if that’s the case? I would be up for that. No point in having one of the bigots still hear wiping the floor of the rest since they’ve done since their foundation and almost killed our club 👍

[Booker5time]

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Terrible blinkered reply.

Maybe but what do some people expect Teams like St Johnstone, Hamilton, Livingston to do, when most of Scotland support only two teams and coming from small towns. It's only the city clubs who are able to draw 5 figures crowds. Only way theis clubs crowds are going to grow any bigger is if there towns where to double in size and even then I doubt they would get that much more.

End of the day Scotland only got 5 million people, Not all teams are going to have big home followings .

[stoneyburn hibs]

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Blinkered towards what?

Would I want it at Easter Road? God know, I wish their allocation got cut and we had enough fans to come out to make that happen.

Do I understand St Johnstone could get relegated this year and the difference could be a bunch of bigots in seats for season ticket holders, course I do.

St Johnstone have a hardcore support and not many others regarding their attendance at home. It's basically what you see is what you get. I'd wager that at least 90% of their home support are season ticket holders.
They won't want this sell out.

[KWJ]

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Everything wrong with Scottish football in a nutshell. Why even bother showing up?

Eeeeeeh, cos they can still win the match?

[The 90+2]

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St Johnstone have a hardcore support and not many others regarding their attendance at home. It's basically what you see is what you get. I'd wager that at least 90% of their home support are season ticket holders.
They won't want this sell out.

They’ve already told the season ticket holders over the last three years if things don’t improve attendance wise they will have to pander to them, financially they owe it to the whole club when they could go down at any time, like they looked like in October. I’m sure their hardcore supporters want to play top level instead of being dragged into a Falkirk or Raith situation, but unlike them, they’ve a board they should trust because they’ve done hundreds for them and the size of the club they are.

Should they go down gracefully with a minor support and a lot less money or should they give themselves every financial chance of getting up the league or get back up?

Then you’ve got the selling the game to Scottish football and unfortunately it looks better when trying to get the game a better deal in the future with full stands.

Then you will get complaints about the **** money we get from tv, you think companies want to pay for two men and their sheep?

[NAE NOOKIE]

You can't really blame them, their average home crowds are pitiful and like Hamilton, Livingstone and the like you sometimes wonder how the hell they manage to stay full time. Look at the wages we pay, probably around £2000 to £3000 at most per week and that's on average gates of 14 to 17 thousand ... how the hell do these clubs even manage to pay players £500 a week after costs on gates of 3 or 4 thousand?

But that's Scottish football's curse, as another poster alluded to. Half the football fans in this country follow Celtic and Rangers* and all but 5 of the remaining clubs come from towns with populations of less than 100,000 people ... it's nothing short of miraculous that we have the number of full time clubs we do.

* I would give my right arm to get a sneaky peek at their respective supporter data bases to see just what proportion of the postcodes actually contain the letter 'G' so we could all get a better idea of just how bad glory hunting is in this country. I'm willing to bet that even if you excluded the folk living outwith Glasgow but born there you could still easily shave a good 15,000 off both their average attendances.

[givescotlandfreedom]

Bit of a dig at their own ST holders who don't want to give up their seats. These guys are the lifeblood of the club, dangerous people to upset.

[Captain Trips]

I understand why St J will do it but the other side of it I will have to listen to the gloating of you need Sevco or Celtic to fill your grounds yadda yadda bore bore. You would all die without us etc etc.

[CB_NO3]

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Bit of a dig at their own ST holders who don't want to give up their seats. These guys are the lifeblood of the club, dangerous people to upset.

That's the problem. They are not the lifeblood of the club. The most they have managed at home this season is 2400. So it makes sense giving the old firm 8000 each as pathetic as it sounds. Having a minimum of 24k old firm fans a season will be the lifeblood of the club.

[Phil MaGlass]

What a great thread, calling them a tinpot club and wishing them to go down, its clubs like St.J we regularly struggle against, but our UBER fans think they are tinpot, fantastic, didnt we just get our erses handed to us by Livi and Ross County recently and have only actually beaten St.J 4 times in the last 15 games. They have won 5 .

[Yorkshire HFC]

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In the days before all seater stadiums and when most fans paid at the gate,these two Glasgow clubs vastly outnumbered most home supports.
Some clubs with average gates around say 5.000 would swell three or four times that against those 2 depending on stadium size.
Money talks

You're talking about Hibs - in the 70s and 80s we would generally get 4 - 5k at Easter Road for Dundee, Partick etc. and then 20k for Old Firm games.

[Onion]

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It's everything that's wrong with football in this country that our top level teams feel the need to do this.

Pitiful.

It's how teams like Livingston, brutal hammer-throwers with a rigged pitch, managed to survive and thrive. It's the OF, Hibs and Hearts that keep them in the top division.

[Ozyhibby]

The problem we have is Scotland is a small country. In the SPFL premier league we have two teams who have English premiership level crowds, three who have Championship level crowds, 4 who would be league 1, maybe 2 level and there who would be def league 2 level, maybe non league in England. And they all have to compete with each other weekly.


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[Pretty Boy]

St Johnstone just don't have that many fans. Outside the big cities no one does these days, even Dundee and Dundee Utd fall into that bracket. Ourselves, Hearts and Aberdeen are realistically the only 3 clubs outside of Glasgow who can pull in 10K+ fans every week. For some clubs even half or a 3rd of that number is fantasy land stuff.

The days of people supporting their local club have gone. Celtic and Rangers are a huge vacuum that sucks in support from all over Scotland. I'd wager there are as almost as many Celtic fans in Dundee as there are supporters of the local clubs. Swap Celtic for Rangers and it's probably not far off being the same in Aberdeen. There's almost certainly more buses heading for Celtic and Rangers games from Edinburgh every week than there is heading to watch whatever one of Hibs and Hearts are away.

St Johnstone giving Celtic and Rangers 3 stands is a symptom of the problem not a cause of it. There is no solution to it. Two teams who have been dominant for most of their histories and a complete duopoly for the best part of 40 years in the league as well as easy access to football on TV has killed the idea of supporting your local team.

[jacomo]

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Bit of a dig at their own ST holders who don't want to give up their seats. These guys are the lifeblood of the club, dangerous people to upset.

I think they are imploring ST holders to see the bigger picture.

[neil7908]

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That's the problem. They are not the lifeblood of the club. The most they have managed at home this season is 2400. So it makes sense giving the old firm 8000 each as pathetic as it sounds. Having a minimum of 24k old firm fans a season will be the lifeblood of the club.

Problem is that it becomes a vicious cycle. This will likely drive more Saints fans away as effectively they are making this a Sevco/Celtic home game in Perth.

I'd be raging if Hibs did this and no chance I'd be coughing up £28. Your also handing the opposition a huge advantage. Football is about winning games and Saints are handing the opposition a huge boost before a ball is even kicked.

I understand on a short term basis why this happens but that's Scottish football in a nutshell - no thought for the medium, let alone long term.

The rest of Scottish football needs to understand that they hold the power. What would the OF do without the other 10 teams in the SPL - play each other 36 times a year? England doesn't want them, they have no where else to go.

In reality this is an appalling, anti sporting gesture that has sadly become normalised up here and is symptomatic of everything wrong with our game. Unfortunately I think things will have to get a lot worse before they get better.

[NORTHERNHIBBY]

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I think they are imploring ST holders to see the bigger picture.

Perhaps they are getting to see what the implications are if they don't do this. As much as it sounds unpalatable, it has to be seen from their perspective not hours.

[danhibees1875]

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Eeeeeeh, cos they can still win the match?

Exactly.

Livi hand over that to the OF. They're also outnumbered by hearts, Aberdeen, and us every home game.

That money has allowed them to attract and retain a better quality of player and their home record recently suggests they don't suffer much from there being more away fans.

[Brightside]

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It's everything that's wrong with football in this country that our top level teams feel the need to do this.

Pitiful.

They need the income. The problem is far too many teams in Scotland. And people in Perth supporting teams outside Perth.

[Keith_M]

I'm not sure if I imagined this (it was a long time ago) but didn't they used to have crowds of 4-5,000 when they first moved to McDiarmid Park, even in Division One?

Where did they all go?

[Smartie]

Saints are a well run club who have never been in financial trouble.

They don't need to do this, they are choosing to.

St Johnstone have always managed to cut their cloth accordingly, even when many clubs around them were unable or unwilling to.

If you were a kid in Perth, why would you choose your local Quisling FC rather than follow the OF?

This is a vicious kick in the teeth to St Johnstone's own, most loyal fans.

[hibs#1]

Part of the problem was forcing clubs into having 10000 all seater stadiums in the first place.

I understand the pros and cons for clubs giving out extra tickets to the old firm, as others have said the draw of rangers and Celtic in Scotland is huge. I live in Stirling and there are several buses running from here every week for both clubs plus on top of that the armchair fans must 90% of the population at least.

[One Day]

It would be interesting to find out exactly how much more profit they will make each game

[Sir David Gray]

Looking at a St Johnstone forum, the feelings seem to be generally in favour of this move so just let them get on with it.

One thing that doesn't seem to be getting mentioned is there must be an increase in police and steward costs as a result of this move so any increase in ticket sales will be negated somewhat with these costs.

[Billy Whizz]

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It would be interesting to find out exactly how much more profit they will make each game

Around £50k per game

[Keith_M]

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Part of the problem was forcing clubs into having 10000 all seater stadiums in the first place.

That's especially highlighted at grounds like Livingston's, where the stands behind the goals (North and South) were added purely for the numbers, with no thought to the Fans.

There are literally no turnstyles, snack bars, toilets or dedicated exits... and everybody has to use the facilities at the nearest corner of the previously existing East Stand.

[Pretty Boy]

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Around £50k per game

So 4 visits from Rangers and Celtic in a good year could be worth 3-4 players for a season. No brainer when put like that and you think with your head rather than your heart.

[Brightside]

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Saints are a well run club who have never been in financial trouble.

They don't need to do this, they are choosing to.

St Johnstone have always managed to cut their cloth accordingly, even when many clubs around them were unable or unwilling to.

If you were a kid in Perth, why would you choose your local Quisling FC rather than follow the OF?

This is a vicious kick in the teeth to St Johnstone's own, most loyal fans.

I find anyone supporting the old firm outside of Glasgow weird tbh. There is no reason for it all unless it’s a family thing, and even then it’s weird. Support your local team from grassroots to top level.

[.Sean.]

What is it with every town and city in the country being filled with gloryhunting bigots? Down south cities like Newcastle or Leeds or Nottingham etc all support their local teams. What are these glue bags missing in their sad wee lives that they cling onto bigoted coat tails from a place they’re no even from. Sad as ****