Tories are lying *******s (warning may contain traces of Tory)

[Moulin Yarns]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

But your wrong in my opinion, Scotland as a nation would likely be bankrupt if we followed Sturgeon. Only a £30BN budget gap from the White Paper and our first Prime Minister potentially facing jail time for serious sexual offences.

How would that gap have been funded?

Robert Walpole is facing jail time for serious sexual offences??? Wow, just wow!!!!

[Fife-Hibee]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

You said that the vast majority of people who voted against Independence get their jollies from racism. You really need to back up a slur like that.
I do agree with you that you share a bed with Boris when it comes to objectionable nationalistic views though. See, we can agree.

You want me to take back what you refer to as a "slur", despite there being no evidence to suggest that i'm even wrong. Don't see why the burden of proof should be on me anymore than on yourself.

[weecounty hibby]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

You want me to take back what you refer to as a "slur", despite there being no evidence to suggest that i'm even wrong. Don't see why the burden of proof should be on me anymore than on yourself.

I know a few no voters, none of which are racists. All the evidence I need. I think they were wrong in the way they voted but none, not a single one of them is a racist

[Fife-Hibee]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I know a few no voters, none of which are racists. All the evidence I need. I think they were wrong in the way they voted but none, not a single one of them is a racist

I know a few who aren't racists either. I never said they all were.

[marinello59]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

You want me to take back what you refer to as a "slur", despite there being no evidence to suggest that i'm even wrong. Don't see why the burden of proof should be on me anymore than on yourself.

Ypu made the statement so the burden of proof is on you.
Happy to be proved wrong if you have something to back up your comments. Remember your allegation is that the vast majority of No voters get their jollies from racism. Please don’t run away from another thread.

[weecounty hibby]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I know a few who aren't racists either. I never said they all were.

So do you know any who are racists?

[marinello59]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I know a few who aren't racists either. I never said they all were.

You said the vast majority were.

[Fife-Hibee]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

You said the vast majority were.

I'm sorry. I never realized vast majority meant all.

[Fife-Hibee]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

So do you know any who are racists?

The vast majority.

[marinello59]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I'm sorry. I never realized vast majority meant all.

So what does that mean and how has it been measured?

[weecounty hibby]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

The vast majority.

Really? I don't believe you. There is no point debating this with you. We are on the same side but you go about it in a way that will stop people voting yes. I know that the way I go about it definitely, 100% had friends and acquaintances of mine change their minds and vote yes.

[The Modfather]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

How quickly is 'quickly'? We would need our own currency and that could take years. The 6 tests that have been set out for us to adopt our own currency could take 20 years or longer to meet.

I’m not going to pretend I have any answers, whatever side of the fence we’re debating none of us can speak in absolutes. I believe Scotland would quite easily get back into the EU, and that can only be a good thing for the mid and long term for the country.

As I say, whatever path chosen is fraught with risks. Staying in a UK out of the EU, probably without a deal, is not a good place to be. Who knows what will happen to the pound, who we will trade with and on what terms etc etc. Just as there are questions about Scottish Currency and what kind of country we want to be.

[James310]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I’m not going to pretend I have any answers, whatever side of the fence we’re debating none of us can speak in absolutes. I believe Scotland would quite easily get back into the EU, and that can only be a good thing for the mid and long term for the country.

As I say, whatever path chosen is fraught with risks. Staying in a UK out of the EU, probably without a deal, is not a good place to be. Who knows what will happen to the pound, who we will trade with and on what terms etc etc. Just as there are questions about Scottish Currency and what kind of country we want to be.

Fair enough, but if you feel Scotland will get back into the EU 'quickly' as you put it then you need to realise the reality is somewhat different. We would need our own currency, to get our own currency we would need to pass the 6 tests in the Growth Commission report, they could take decades to meet, may never actually be ever met.

Scotland would get into the EU if it meets the criteria, just like any other country would. But let's not pretend it's a simple thing that will happen in a few years, it could be decades.

[Future17]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I know a few who aren't racists either. I never said they all were.

Are you saying the vast majority of the ones you know are racist?

Out of interest, how do you know them?

[Just Alf]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Fair enough, but if you feel Scotland will get back into the EU 'quickly' as you put it then you need to realise the reality is somewhat different. We would need our own currency, to get our own currency we would need to pass the 6 tests in the Growth Commission report, they could take decades to meet, may never actually be ever met.

Scotland would get into the EU if it meets the criteria, just like any other country would. But let's not pretend it's a simple thing that will happen in a few years, it could be decades.

Regarding joining the EU, Finland took less than 3 years and that was with no historical legislative alignment, Scotland is already 100% aligned, what makes you belive Scotland would take much longer?

And for clarity, the treaty specifies a stable economy, there's no specific requirement to have our own currency from the 'get go' .

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

[James310]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Regarding joining the EU, Finland took less than 3 years and that was with no historical legislative alignment, Scotland is already 100% aligned, what makes you belive Scotland would take much longer?

And for clarity, the treaty specifies a stable economy, there's no specific requirement to have our own currency from the 'get go' .

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

You can not join the EU using the currency of a country outside the EU, using a central bank of a country outside the EU.

If we get our own currency and meet all the other criteria then yes we can join, just like everyone else.

Just need to pass those 6 tests.

[lord bunberry]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

The latter at the moment, Boris is bad news, but no point jumping from the frying pan into the fire. I think he will be limited in the damage he can do if he becomes PM but the damage that Sturgeon and Co would do will be like nothing we have never seen before.

Also he will move on, he will maybe last a few years but the damage Sturgeon and her cronies would do to the economy would last for generations to come.

That clear enough for you?

****in he’ll. I really used to have a lot of respect for you and your opinions even though they are clearly opposed to mine, but that post has left me wondering if I’ve been wrong all this time. If that’s really what you believe then I genuinely despair for this country.

[James310]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

****in he’ll. I really used to have a lot of respect for you and your opinions even though they are clearly opposed to mine, but that post has left me wondering if I’ve been wrong all this time. If that’s really what you believe then I genuinely despair for this country.

I don't like Boris, but what do you think he will do? No matter what Tory was in power he or she would be the devil to many. Do you think he will advocate exterminating Scottish people like the poem he published?

Anything he wants to do has to get through Parliament, just like anything any PM wants to do. A few years of bluster and soundbytes is what will probably happen and then he will be gone.

I could be completely wrong, time will tell.

[lord bunberry]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Just a general thought on independence, not even necessarily Scottish. But has there ever been a nation that gained independence, say for example from Great Britain, that has wanted to reverse that decision? Maybe, Australia? What about New Zealand? India, yes of course they must have wanted to be ruled by England, you know the Jewell in the crown of the empire? Maybe some of the smaller countries? Some in the Caribbean maybe? What about some of the African countries? I know what about a country right on our doorstep, Ireland? Really, none of them? But surely they are bankrupt and need to be bailed out by the greats of Westminster? How can they manage without being told what to do, when to do it and how much money they can have to do it? Maybe I'm just a wee bit confused and unable to work any of that out for myself. I'm sure there will be someone along soon to put me right and explain how lucky I am

You are lucky my friend, you’re lucky that you see this unequal union for what it is. There isn’t one country that has left the empire that has wanted to return. The arguments for remaining are utterly pathetic and revolve around issues like currency and sovereignty. The fact is that Scotland is a wealthy country that is rich in natural resources and woukd thrive on its own.

[lord bunberry]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I don't like Boris, but what do you think he will do? No matter what Tory was in power he or she would be the devil to many. Do you think he will advocate exterminating Scottish people like the poem he published?

Anything he wants to do has to get through Parliament, just like anything any PM wants to do. A few years of bluster and soundbytes is what will probably happen and then he will be gone.

I could be completely wrong, time will tell.

Boris is our Trump. Unlike many people I think he will win a general election, he is unbelievably seen as a man of the people and he’s very popular amongst the working classes. What I think he’ll do is aligne us with America and drag us into a war with Iran. I don’t want to be part of a war that’s designed by arms dealers in America because they need somewhere to shoot there new weapons.

[James310]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Boris is our Trump. Unlike many people I think he will win a general election, he is unbelievably seen as a man of the people and he’s very popular amongst the working classes. What I think he’ll do is aligne us with America and drag us into a war with Iran. I don’t want to be part of a war that’s designed by arms dealers in America because they need somewhere to shoot there new weapons.

Well Parliament would have to vote to go to war if that's what he wanted. Personally don't see that happening.

[marinello59]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Well Parliament would have to vote to go to war if that's what he wanted. Personally don't see that happening.

You don’t see Tory politicians desperate to advance their own careers backing their leader?

[James310]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

You don’t see Tory politicians desperate to advance their own careers backing their leader?

I think after the Iraq scenario then I don't see politicians backing a war against Iran for no other reason than because the US wanted one.

[Hibrandenburg]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I think after the Iraq scenario then I don't see politicians backing a war against Iran for no other reason than because the US wanted one.

Same was said after Gulf War 1, Afghanistan and countless wars before that. What makes you so sure this one is different? With the UK leaving the EU, they need to suck up deep with Uncle Sam.

[James310]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

****in he’ll. I really used to have a lot of respect for you and your opinions even though they are clearly opposed to mine, but that post has left me wondering if I’ve been wrong all this time. If that’s really what you believe then I genuinely despair for this country.

Also..I am not going to change my position on Independence overnight on the basis of what one man, who is not even confirmed as the PM, might do. Would you flip from pro Indy to being against Indy on the basis of what one person might do, what might happen? I doubt you would, so why are you so shocked that I don't.

[James310]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Same was said after Gulf War 1, Afghanistan and countless wars before that. What makes you so sure this one is different? With the UK leaving the EU, they need to suck up deep with Uncle Sam.

You might be right, don't see it myself though.

[Hibrandenburg]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

You might be right, don't see it myself though.

That's an incredibly optimistic view considering recent History, our current government, need for trading partners, political climate and likely Prime Minister.

[lapsedhibee]

Bojoke's dad on the radiobox just now defending his son. Spaffing Latin phrases around. TF is the matter with these peeps?

[marinello59]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Bojoke's dad on the radiobox just now defending his son. Spaffing Latin phrases around. TF is the matter with these peeps?

They seem to believe that throwing random Latin phrases about in a posh voice makes up for a lack of substance.

[Sylar]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

That's an incredibly optimistic view considering recent History, our current government, need for trading partners, political climate and likely Prime Minister.

While I don't disagree more generally with your argument, I'd just like to add a caveat that our most recent vote on military action in the Commons was to reject intervention in Syria to support the US after Assad's use of chemical weapons.