Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

[Keith_M]

Here's a wee possible scenario to cheer you all up.


King gets p1ssed off about the latest ruling, especially as he just doesn't have the required 11M+. He decides the most sensible thing to do is to leg it back to South Africa.

Problem is, he has a few million tied to T'Rangers in the shape of loans and wants that back pronto. The Clumpany, as most of us suspect, just don't have the money.

He instructs his lawyers to take all available action to retrieve the money... which results in Administration for RIFC.

[JeMeSouviens]

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There's no -5.

From the SPFL site:-

E1 Subject to Rule E5, where a Club suffers or is subject to an Insolvency Event that
Club shall be deducted 15 points in the League.
E2 Where an Insolvency Event occurs during a Season, the 15 points deduction shall be
applied immediately to take effect in the current Season.
E3 Where an Insolvency Event occurs during the Close Season the 15 points deduction
shall apply in respect of the immediately following Season, such that the relevant
Club starts that immediately following Season in the relevant Division on minus 15
points.
E4 Where an Insolvency Event or in the event that such Insolvency Event is part of an
Insolvency Process that process, continues and/or is subsisting during a second or
later Season then, for each such second or later Season, during the whole or part of
which such Insolvency Event or Insolvency Process is continuing and/or subsisting,
the Club concerned shall be deducted 15 points and shall start each such second or
later Season in the relevant Division on minus 15 points.
E5 Where a Club, whether owned and operated by the same or a different Member,
suffers or is subject to an Insolvency Event which results in a deduction of points in
terms of these Rules and within 5 years of the date of such Insolvency Event suffers
or is subject to a further Insolvency Event which is not part of the same Insolvency
Process as the Insolvency Event then suffered, the points deduction applicable in
terms of Rules E1 in respect of that second or further Insolvency Event, shall be 25
points with the 15 points in Rules E2 and E3 being 25 Points.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/32436839

Have they changed it again?

[CropleyWasGod]

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Ta, can’t see them wanting to start on -15, at the start of the 10 in the year row for Celtic

If they do it this season, the likelihood is no Europe next season.

[JeMeSouviens]

E1 Where a Club takes, suffers or is subject to a Deductible Insolvency Event that Club
shall, subject to Rule E4, be deducted 15 points and 5 points in the League in
consecutive Seasons in terms of Rule E2 or Rule E3.

E2 Where a Club takes, suffers or is subject to a Deductible Insolvency Event during a
Season the 15 points deduction shall be applied immediately to take effect in that
Season, with the 5 points deduction being applied in the immediately following
Season such that the relevant Club shall commence that immediately following
Season in the relevant Division on minus 5 points.

E3 Where a Club takes, suffers or is subject to a Deductible Insolvency Event during a
Close Season the 15 points deduction shall be applied in the immediately following
Season, such that the relevant Club shall commence that immediately following
Season in the relevant Division on minus 15 points, with the 5 points deduction
being applied in the Season next following the immediately following Season, such
that the relevant Club shall commence that next following Season in the relevant
Division on minus 5 points.

(My bold)

https://spfl.co.uk/docs/067_324__rul...1518083042.pdf

[Billy Whizz]

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If they do it this season, the likelihood is no Europe next season.

19 points ahead of 5th placed Hearts

If one of the current top 3 win the Cup, 4th would get a Euro spot

[southern hibby]

Right here’s a question that’s bugging me.

Can a team get into Europe under administration??

The rangers have 58 points at present IF they did go into admin and loose 15 points that would take them down to 43 points and into 4th place. Would they as previously asked get a place in Europe in admin if fourth place is good enough to get there? Or alternatively, can they get a place in Europe if after the season finishes they go into admin before European games start?

One last question how will it make the SFA look if they say they are financially sound ( the Rangers ) to the powers that be in Europe for them to then go into admin? Will the SFA actually take the chance on this happening??


GGTTH

[CropleyWasGod]

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(My bold)

https://spfl.co.uk/docs/067_324__rul...1518083042.pdf

Nice one :) Have they changed that?

I see yours are dated January 18. Can't see a date on mine.

If they have, I don't remember them announcing it.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Here's a wee possible scenario to cheer you all up.


King gets p1ssed off about the latest ruling, especially as he just doesn't have the required 11M+. He decides the most sensible thing to do is to leg it back to South Africa.

Problem is, he has a few million tied to T'Rangers in the shape of loans and wants that back pronto. The Clumpany, as most of us suspect, just don't have the money.

He instructs his lawyers to take all available action to retrieve the money... which results in Administration for RIFC.

It would be a daft move IMO. He's got more chance of getting his money back if the company was able to continue trading. If it goes into admin, he will rank behind the secured creditors, including the pie racks.

[Hibs4185]

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It would be a daft move IMO. He's got more chance of getting his money back if the company was able to continue trading. If it goes into admin, he will rank behind the secured creditors, including the pie racks.

There is absolutely no chance of rangers going into admin before next season unfortunately. People have millions invested and the only way for them to get any return at all is to qualify for europe. I’m sure craig whyte went tits up when they didn’t qualify and that’s what caused the previous liquidation. If they don’t make Europe and the chance of millions then it will collapse. No way they will go through another year without the income generated by European football and they already borrowing from last resort lenders.

It’s all or bust I think depending on qualifying.

[BH Hibs]

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Right here’s a question that’s bugging me.

Can a team get into Europe under administration??

The rangers have 58 points at present IF they did go into admin and loose 15 points that would take them down to 43 points and into 4th place. Would they as previously asked get a place in Europe in admin if fourth place is good enough to get there? Or alternatively, can they get a place in Europe if after the season finishes they go into admin before European games start?

One last question how will it make the SFA look if they say they are financially sound ( the Rangers ) to the powers that be in Europe for them to then go into admin? Will the SFA actually take the chance on this happening??


GGTTH

They shouldn’t get a license however it’s Rangers and the SFA we are talking about and they got one before so history suggests they’ll be ok.

[Eyrie]

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Ta, can’t see them wanting to start on -15, at the start of the 10 in the year row for Celtic

Starting on -15 provides them with an excuse for failing to stop Celtc.

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If they do it this season, the likelihood is no Europe next season.

So they can use a summer administration to dodge their current debt but still keep the European income when it arrives?

[Jack]

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Here's a wee possible scenario to cheer you all up.


King gets p1ssed off about the latest ruling, especially as he just doesn't have the required 11M+. He decides the most sensible thing to do is to leg it back to South Africa.

Problem is, he has a few million tied to T'Rangers in the shape of loans and wants that back pronto. The Clumpany, as most of us suspect, just don't have the money.

He instructs his lawyers to take all available action to retrieve the money... which results in Administration for RIFC.

Has he actually lent any of his own money, or the family trust, into the running costs of the club?

[Bostonhibby]

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Has he actually lent any of his own money, or the family trust, into the running costs of the club?

Smoke and mirrors I suspect. If this enormously wealthy trust really was sinking it's "untold wealth" into sevco why would they be swimming with the sharks at Close Brothers and mortgaging of assets that are important to their odious culture?

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[jacomo]

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19 points ahead of 5th placed Hearts

If one of the current top 3 win the Cup, 4th would get a Euro spot

At best, finishing 4th means entry into an early qualifying round, and a whole host of tricky ties to reach the Europa League group stages.

You’d have to be either mad or glib and shameless to bet on that outcome.

[Seveno]

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It would be a daft move IMO. He's got more chance of getting his money back if the company was able to continue trading. If it goes into admin, he will rank behind the secured creditors, including the pie racks.

He might be a secured creditor.

[CropleyWasGod]

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He might be a secured creditor.

According to the accounts, none of the soft loans were secured at November.

Other than the Sports Council and Close Brothers, there are no other securities recorded.

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[jgl07]

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At best, finishing 4th means entry into an early qualifying round, and a whole host of tricky ties to reach the Europa League group stages.

You’d have to be either mad or glib and shameless to bet on that outcome.

Finishing fourth is no different from finishing second (or third). Either means entry at the First Qualifying Round of the Europa League. Winning the Scottish Cup means entry at Second Qualifying Round.

[Stonewall]

Now that King has lost his court case re the TOP ruling It would seem likely that we can expect a concerted media campaign pushing the line that the shares are worth more than 20p and that anyone selling would be a mug.

Would the media outlets responsible be considered as giving financial advice or are there ways of dressing it up to avoid this. E.g. Quotes from individuals etc.

[Carheenlea]

[snooky]

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Why don't they say "because it's our club"?

[lapsedhibee]

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"We can't forget the past"

[Ozyhibby]

https://mobile.twitter.com/gibbygibb...576320/video/1




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[Is It On....]

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The accounts don't show Directors' Loans separately, but in November "investor loans" were £15.9m.

Thanks. So he has to put another £11m in escrow for a formal bid to the minority shareholders (which itself will cost about £500k). Best case is nobody tenders any shares so can then go ahead with an "emergency" rights issue so any money raised will only go to pay off the loans. The first part works for him but his shareholding is massively diluted.

So I would say that his power is massively diluted and The Rangers still don't have any money to invest and will also still be loss making. I can't see how they get out of this mess unless they are able to transfer a player for a huge sum of money which will paper over the problems for another season.

[Tynie01011973]

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Thanks. So he has to put another £11m in escrow for a formal bid to the minority shareholders (which itself will cost about £500k). Best case is nobody tenders any shares so can then go ahead with an "emergency" rights issue so any money raised will only go to pay off the loans. The first part works for him but his shareholding is massively diluted.

So I would say that his power is massively diluted and The Rangers still don't have any money to invest and will also still be loss making. I can't see how they get out of this mess unless they are able to transfer a player for a huge sum of money which will paper over the problems for another season.

Pity they turned down£11m for Morelos then 🤣

[Is It On....]

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Pity they turned down£11m for Morelos then 🤣

Unless there is something that nobody yet knows about, they really need to be massively lucky and make a fortune in Europe next year. This again is just papering over the monetary advantage that their Glasgow cousins have by virtue of the revenue 10,000 extra fans bring at every home game.

I like your name.. according to my dad (who was actually there) he said it was before segregation and that they were in a mixed group. He said he had to calm down one of his Hibs friends who was getting "a bit carried away" 😂😂

[hibees 7062]

[snooky]

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Unless there is something that nobody yet knows about, they really need to be massively lucky and make a fortune in Europe next year. This again is just papering over the monetary advantage that their Glasgow cousins have by virtue of the revenue 10,000 extra fans bring at every home game.

I like your name.. according to my dad (who was actually there) he said it was before segregation and that they were in a mixed group. He said he had to calm down one of his Hibs friends who was getting "a bit carried away" ����

I was too. There were loads of fans couldn't get in as the turnstyles were mobbed. A Jambo relative of mine was still trying to get in when the word got outside it was 5-0 to Hibs. He didn't bother waiting at the turnstyles and just turned and went home. We were behind the north goals (where the two 2nd half goals were scored). TBH, I can't recall if it was a mixed support around us or not. I remember feeling totally unthreatened so there must have been a lot of Hibbies nearby.
Happy day.

[lapsedhibee]

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I was too. There were loads of fans couldn't get in as the turnstyles were mobbed. A Jambo relative of mine was still trying to get in when the word got outside it was 5-0 to Hibs. He didn't bother waiting at the turnstyles and just turned and went home. We were behind the north goals (where the two 2nd half goals were scored). TBH, I can't recall if it was a mixed support around us or not. I remember feeling totally unthreatened so there must have been a lot of Hibbies nearby.
Happy day.

Never felt any worries in a Hibs-Hearts crowd in those days, surrounded or not. Huns and Celtc a different matter.

[Billy Whizz]

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Never felt any worries in a Hibs-Hearts crowd in those days, surrounded or not. Huns and Celtc a different matter.

Never been to a Rangers v Celtic Derby, and no intention of ever going

[lapsedhibee]

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Never been to a Rangers v Celtic Derby, and no intention of ever going

Meant at Hibs-Huns and Hibs-Celtc. Don't recall any bad feeling of any sort between Hibs and Hearts fans at that time. Huns were always poisonous. Always.