#hibileaks/Hands On Hibs/BuyHibs (Merged)

[SaulGoodman]

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At least 100 activists, that's people who are actually prepared to go out and do doing something not sitting in their mums house on the internet.

Oh dear. Not really been paying attention to this whole saga but if this is the amount of professionalism that hoh/BuyHibs can muster It's no wonder it doesn't have much support.

[marti1875]

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What an absolute waste of space this shower are.

I was just reading that guy "Kano's" comments and just like a wee while back when one of BH "leaders" came on here i am just left shaking my head in disbelief...again!

You would think groups such as these would at least make an effort to have someone good at communicating to front things in this way on fans public forums.
Instead all we seem to get are people who clearly should not be anywhere near a forum as their comments just come accross as immature, childish and full of bitterness.
And as usual when it gets too hot they do a runner! Yet this is a group expecting fans to support them? my god, you really would need to only have the equivalent of 1 single functioning brain cell left to support this crowd with their unfounded allegations and constant avoidance of answering the questions aimed at them regarding just how Sir Tom is allepgedly ripping us of or whatever they claim.
They would all make great politicians the way they totally avoid answering the vital points!!

Put up or shut up i say...they should either come forward with their "evidence" make it public for all to see then we can all make up our minds....or they should just shut up as it rally is getting to the embarrassing stage for them as they are looking more and more silly with each day they make the same allegations and refuse to back-up anything they allege.

[Caversham Green]

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Who mentioned lies?
So the minutes are available. Where can we see them?

That's a good point. Hibs fans have a right to know what was said at that meeting and it might help hibileaks credibility a bit if they were to make those minutes public.

Unless they have something to hide of course.

[s.a.m]

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Is that rhyming slang?

My first thought too...

[Andy74]

BuHibs now want answers before the AGM. That's a bit rich considering they can't answer anything themselves.

They also seem to have clicked that Sir Tom might not actually want to sell...

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/footba...-agm-1-3636321

[Mikey]

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BuHibs now want answers before the AGM. That's a bit rich considering they can't answer anything themselves.

They also seem to have clicked that Sir Tom might not actually want to sell...

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/footba...-agm-1-3636321

I would like as much transparency as possible

[Benny Brazil]

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BuHibs now want answers before the AGM. That's a bit rich considering they can't answer anything themselves.

They also seem to have clicked that Sir Tom might not actually want to sell...

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/footba...-agm-1-3636321

Seems they are becoming HoH just in a different name.
Its sad to see a legend like Pat standing alongside this shower of charlatans.

[chippy]

Interesting to see the atracks questioning variously the grammatical, communication, professoonal, business, financial skills of the BH and HoH groups. You are seriously scrutinising those who are publicly criticising the current regime but what about the questions they raise? That is what is crucial - what happens to the ownership of the club, stadium et al. Sad to see the attacks on these well meaning Hibs fans.

[Andy74]

They are a bit obsessed with this running up debt line - how did they envisage a new stadium could be built without taking mortages out?

I've be interested to hear if they all have mortgages themselves and whether they consider they have mismanaged their finances if they didn't just build/buy their homes from their own pockets.

[Mikey]

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Interesting to see the atracks questioning variously the grammatical, communication, professoonal, business, financial skills of the BH and HoH groups. You are seriously scrutinising those who are publicly criticising the current regime but what about the questions they raise? That is what is crucial - what happens to the ownership of the club, stadium et al. Sad to see the attacks on these well meaning Hibs fans.

I think the biggest issue is that the group are telling us there are issues regarding ownership of the stadium and East Mains but when pressed on it they have no answers whatsoever.

[Peevemor]

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Interesting to see the atracks questioning variously the grammatical, communication, professoonal, business, financial skills of the BH and HoH groups. You are seriously scrutinising those who are publicly criticising the current regime but what about the questions they raise? That is what is crucial - what happens to the ownership of the club, stadium et al. Sad to see the attacks on these well meaning Hibs fans.

They've raised questions that will be answered in the fullness of time. They're trying to create a sense of urgency that simply doesn't exist.

On the other hand they're happy to throw around accusations without offering even the smallest amount of proof.

IMO both groups are now damaging Hibs, therefore neither deserve any respect - quite the opposite in fact.

[Oscar T Grouch]

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The board are not dancing to their own tune here. HOH aims are clear on their Facebook and Twitter accounts, have a look. It's also a bit more than a handful as you would've noticed if you attended the game on Saturday and witnessed the Foodbank collection.

Point of note here. I contributed to the food bank collection but I do not support BH or HoH. It would seem by this statement it was just a marketing ploy by these groups and nothing to do with the needy of Edinburgh. Makes me hate these groups even more.

[Andy74]

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Interesting to see the atracks questioning variously the grammatical, communication, professoonal, business, financial skills of the BH and HoH groups. You are seriously scrutinising those who are publicly criticising the current regime but what about the questions they raise? That is what is crucial - what happens to the ownership of the club, stadium et al. Sad to see the attacks on these well meaning Hibs fans.

The communication skills are just part of it. They have been given ample opportunity to answer questions relating to their plans but haven't been able to provide any.

Instead they have been throwing out allegations and suggestions of asset stripping and even theft.

The ownership and assets issues are somrthing they beleive we should be worried about but based on what?

I'm not so sure now they are well meaning at all, seems very agenda and personality led.

Their actions and behavious throughout this have been very poor and I hope they take the hint that they have very little support and disappear sometime soon.

[Caversham Green]

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I think the biggest issue is that the group are telling us there are issues regarding ownership of the stadium and East Mains but when pressed on it they have no answers whatsoever.

Indeed. The article say they're worried by speculation that the assets will be removed but as far as I can see all the speculation originates from their own comments.

I've tried hard to give them (Buyhibs, not Hands on Hibs who showed themselves up as liars and fools from the start) a fair hearing, but their recent activity has made my mind up - I'm out.

[schinkenotto]

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BuHibs now want answers before the AGM. That's a bit rich considering they can't answer anything themselves.

They also seem to have clicked that Sir Tom might not actually want to sell...

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/footba...-agm-1-3636321

According to the article they also can't make up their minds between demanding STF's "price",while saying that he doesn't deserve to get his loans back in full.This is getting more ridiculous by the minute.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Interesting to see the atracks questioning variously the grammatical, communication, professoonal, business, financial skills of the BH and HoH groups. You are seriously scrutinising those who are publicly criticising the current regime but what about the questions they raise? That is what is crucial - what happens to the ownership of the club, stadium et al. Sad to see the attacks on these well meaning Hibs fans.

Serious scrutiny is essential, IMO, of all potential major changes to the club. Had that been the way of things in other situations, the likes of Romanov, Whyte and Duff wouldn't have left first base.

For the avoidance of doubt, that scrutiny will extend to the club's own plans.

[BroxburnHibee]

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Interesting to see the atracks questioning variously the grammatical, communication, professoonal, business, financial skills of the BH and HoH groups. You are seriously scrutinising those who are publicly criticising the current regime but what about the questions they raise? That is what is crucial - what happens to the ownership of the club, stadium et al. Sad to see the attacks on these well meaning Hibs fans.

You say they are well meaning - i say they are both flinging unsubstantiated muck about in the hope it will be enough to line up enough support behind them.

Asked repeatedly by many on here to provide some proof and they ALL mysteriously go quiet.

Both campaigns have been farcical and have no hope of success

[marinello59]

Are they really demanding transparency from the club? You couldn't make this stuff up. It's looking more and more like BuyHibs and HoH are just part of the same campaign now and rather than promote a strategy that fans can unite behind they are creating divisions. I'm not so sure that isn't their intention given the bizarre interventions we are increasingly seeing here.

[s.a.m]

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BH were after our support for a proposal to buy out the club, and establish a new management structure. For those purposes, I would have thought the skills you mention are essential, and it would be dangerous and stupid for Hibs fans to offer support to any fan-based takeover without 'due diligence'. No[/I]?

You are seriously scrutinising those who are publicly criticising the current regime but what about the questions they raise?

Many people have attempted to answer their accusations of underhand dealings and fraud with reference to legal documents, in the public domain, specific to each case. We've not had any response to that, to persuade us why they might actually be right.
In terms of the future of the club, many here are also keen to hear what STF's plans are. I think what people are objecting to is the perceived need to start a revolution before we know what they are. I - and I suspect most others - would rather wait until after Christmas if that means a better deal can be hammered out, than a rushed and incomplete plan being presented now.Many, myself included, are turned off by the nasty, thuggish approach by some of those involved.
[/B]

That is what is crucial - what happens to the ownership of the club, stadium et al.Sad to see the attacks on these well meaning Hibs fans

I'm sure there is good intent in their somewhere. It seems to have been lost though amongst a stramash of personal agenda, childish spite and personal grievance. With a bit of daftness thrown in. I'm beginning to think that, like many other activist type activities, it's become a bit self-serving, and the issue (Hibs and it's future success and security) has become secondary to their needs and grievances.

I'm not opposed in principle to fan involvement in the club's future management and ownership structure, but I want this shower of charmers no-where near it.


[/B].

,,,

[brog]

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Serious scrutiny is essential, IMO, of all potential major changes to the club. Had that been the way of things in other situations, the likes of Romanov, Whyte and Duff wouldn't have left first base.

For the avoidance of doubt, that scrutiny will extend to the club's own plans.

Spot on, & to give some credit to BH, ( a tough act I know! ) I don't think it's coincidence we're now seeing movement re the way forward for our club. However for BH to retain any credibility I believe the 2 ( apparent ) principals, Andrew Sibley & Neil Wheelan need to break cover & support their allegations of land theft, financial skullduggery etc with hard facts. If they're as expert as they proclaim themselves to be on their website this should not be too difficult a task. I appreciate their frustration with what has happened to our Club & I applaud their effort in trying to do something positive but it really is time to put up or shut up.

[jacomo]

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They are a bit obsessed with this running up debt line - how did they envisage a new stadium could be built without taking mortages out?

I've be interested to hear if they all have mortgages themselves and whether they consider they have mismanaged their finances if they didn't just build/buy their homes from their own pockets.

Pretty sure they are not referring to any mortgages, but to trading losses made in recent years. These, you could argue, have been accrued through mismanagement of the club.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Pretty sure they are not referring to any mortgages, but to trading losses made in recent years. These, you could argue, have been accrued through mismanagement of the club.

... but the profits, of which there have been 7 in recent years, are down to luck.

[jacomo]

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BuHibs now want answers before the AGM. That's a bit rich considering they can't answer anything themselves.

They also seem to have clicked that Sir Tom might not actually want to sell...

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/footba...-agm-1-3636321

This isn't quite right either. They are asking that any proposals be made public before the AGM, so the other shareholders have a chance to consider them ahead of the meeting.

It's not unreasonable, is it? In fact, it's good practice to make all relevant papers available ahead of an AGM.

[jacomo]

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... but the profits, of which there have been 7 in recent years, are down to luck.

No, not at all. But it's the relative size of the losses vs profits, is it not?

We are all expecting last years accounts to be a horror show, and apparently the same again this year.

Petrie got plenty of credit when he was presenting year after year of 'rock solid' results.

[Peevemor]

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Pretty sure they are not referring to any mortgages, but to trading losses made in recent years. These, you could argue, have been accrued through mismanagement of the club.

Yeah, because we're the only club to have lost money from time to time.

[CropleyWasGod]

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This isn't quite right either. They are asking that any proposals be made public before the AGM, so the other shareholders have a chance to consider them ahead of the meeting.

It's not unreasonable, is it? In fact, it's good practice to make all relevant papers available ahead of an AGM.

I'm not so sure that the shareholders will be asked to vote on the proposals. It's not really a shareholder matter. However, even if they were, their vote would be immaterial.

For me, it's more appropriate to have a wider discussion amongst supporters as a whole, rather than just shareholders. That is why I asked the Kano guy last night if the Board's proposals were to be presented as a fait accompli, or a consultation document. He didn't know.

[Andy74]

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This isn't quite right either. They are asking that any proposals be made public before the AGM, so the other shareholders have a chance to consider them ahead of the meeting.

It's not unreasonable, is it? In fact, it's good practice to make all relevant papers available ahead of an AGM.

There will be a notice of AGM which will detail the resolutions to be voted on.

I don't think anyone has suggested that there will be any proposals that will be voted on at the AGM - only that they will be presenting on their strategy for the future of the club.

If they wanted a 'heads up' on anything they could have met with the board when offered.

The reality is also that we have a current owner and a board and they are entitled to carry on with the business of restructuring the finances or ther assets as they see best for the future of the club. If there is anything coming out of the AGM for us to have a view on I'm sure there will be opportunity.

The way BuyHibs have carried on, they aren't really presenting themselves as a group with a mandate to be consulted on by the club over anything.

[jacomo]

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Yeah, because we're the only club to have lost money from time to time.

You are really tiresome. Happy to accuse me of 'getting at you' when I disagree with you, then you post dismissive and belittling rubbish like this.

I am trying to engage in a conversation about our club. Why don't you grow up?

[jacomo]

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There will be a notice of AGM which will detail the resolutions to be voted on.

I don't think anyone has suggested that there will be any proposals that will be voted on at the AGM - only that they will be presenting on their strategy for the future of the club.

If they wanted a 'heads up' on anything they could have met with the board when offered.

The reality is also that we have a current owner and a board and they are entitled to carry on with the business of restructuring the finances or ther assets as they see best for the future of the club. If there is anything coming out of the AGM for us to have a view on I'm sure there will be opportunity.

The way BuyHibs have carried on, they aren't really presenting themselves as a group with a mandate to be consulted on by the club over anything.

Thanks, but this goes beyond Buy Hibs. We are being led to believe that the club is proposing major changes in some form or another. I think, therefore, that it is only right that details are made public for all fans ahead of the AGM. It's good PR for the club too.

Of course, votes at the AGM are symbolic only because STF has near-total control. But symbolic votes still carry some weight.

[Peevemor]

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You are really tiresome. Happy to accuse me of 'getting at you' when I disagree with you, then you post dismissive and belittling rubbish like this.

I am trying to engage in a conversation about our club. Why don't you grow up?

Stick me on ignore then - I don't give a toss!