Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

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Could be.

Actually, I always maintained that David Murray HAD to have known about the Ticketus deal as well. If he didn't, then he didn't do his due diligence very well.

Jeez, I feel I've just regressed into 2011.....

Talking of regressing, did you ever find out how the jambo admins got their fee CWG? ;-)

[CropleyWasGod]

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Talking of regressing, did you ever find out how the jambo admins got their fee CWG? ;-)

In poppies, I believe.

[ballengeich]

An update from the liquidators :-

http://www.bdo.co.uk/__data/assets/p...ember-2014.pdf

It looks like they've got a payment from Collyer Bristow which will add substantially to eventual payouts to the creditors. They also seem to think the BTC will stay largely in Rangers' favour after further appeals.

[greenginger]

Clause 5 in the report states that costs of the EBT appeal have so far been met by a Third Party , but going on to the next stage the third party wants Rangers ( in Liquidation ) to contribute.

Any ideas who the third party is ? maybe someone with an even bigger EBT bill.

[Keith_M]

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Clause 5 in the report states that costs of the EBT appeal have so far been met by a Third Party , but going on to the next stage the third party wants Rangers ( in Liquidation ) to contribute.

Any ideas who the third party is ? maybe someone with an even bigger EBT bill.

DM perhaps?


(not Danger Mouse, though you never know)

[CropleyWasGod]

This stuck out for me:-

The Joint Liquidators have requested, from the former Joint Administrators, detailed
explanations regarding certain aspects of the strategy implemented by them during the
Administration. There remains on-going correspondence in this regard.


I like it.

[CropleyWasGod]

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An update from the liquidators :-

http://www.bdo.co.uk/__data/assets/p...ember-2014.pdf

It looks like they've got a payment from Collyer Bristow which will add substantially to eventual payouts to the creditors. They also seem to think the BTC will stay largely in Rangers' favour after further appeals.

£24m. That's quite a result.

Is there any connection between CB's willingness to settle in full, and Gary Withey's arrest?

[s.a.m]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...-west-30084830

Four men in court over alleged fraud after Rangers sale in 2011(Clockwise from top left) Gary Withey, David Grier, Paul Clark and David Whitehouse (Clockwise from top left) Gary Withey, David Grier, Paul Clark and David Whitehouse
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Craig Whyte arrest warrant issued

Four men have appeared in court charged with fraudulent activity following a probe into the sale of Rangers in 2011.

David Grier, Paul Clark and David Whitehouse worked for Duff and Phelps, who were Rangers' administrators.

Gary Withey worked for law firm Collier Bristow, which represented Craig Whyte before he bought Rangers from Sir David Murray for £1 in 2011.

All four made no plea or declaration at Glasgow Sheriff Court and were granted bail ahead of a future hearing.

Mr Grier, Mr Clark and Mr Whitehouse were also charged with attempting to pervert the course of justice.

[jacomo]

Where is Craig Whyte? On the run from the law?

I am imagining him and Charles Green organising a hurried bonfire of various papers before fleeing Green's castle in haste, en route to Monaco in the gardener's battered 2CV (the Bentley attracts too much attention), arguing the entire way about who's fault it is that they've been rumbled.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Where is Craig Whyte? On the run from the law?

I am imagining him and Charles Green organising a hurried bonfire of various papers before fleeing Green's castle in haste, en route to Monaco in the gardener's battered 2CV (the Bentley attracts too much attention), arguing the entire way about who's fault it is that they've been rumbled.

Nah.

They're using Chucky's horses. They have scarves over their mouths, tricorn hats and a bag that says "le Swag".

[Keith_M]

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An update from the liquidators :-

http://www.bdo.co.uk/__data/assets/p...ember-2014.pdf

It looks like they've got a payment from Collyer Bristow which will add substantially to eventual payouts to the creditors. They also seem to think the BTC will stay largely in Rangers' favour after further appeals.

February to September 2014 and BDO have taken just over 500k in fees (after taking off the 'outlay' mentioned in the report)


Nice work if you can get it.

[greenginger]

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February to September 2014 and BDO have taken just over 500k in fees (after taking off the 'outlay' mentioned in the report)


Nice work if you can get it.

Makes up for the discount job they did for the Yams.

[greenginger]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...-west-30084838

And a further twist, BDO who were appointed by HMRC to investigate and liquidate Old Co Rangers, are going to use some of the proceeds they have won for the creditors to fund a defence of Old Co against EBT claims appeals by HMRC.

Bizarre !

[AndyM_1875]

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...-west-30084838

And a further twist, BDO who were appointed by HMRC to investigate and liquidate Old Co Rangers, are going to use some of the proceeds they have won for the creditors to fund a defence of Old Co against EBT claims appeals by HMRC.

Bizarre !

Totally. It's a cast of characters and no mistake. Crooks, fraudsters and shysters.

If as suspected the EBT case will come down largely on the side of Oldco Rangers, (having already been judged in their favour twice) what HMRC will be left with the legal bill. What an absolute mess.
Surely someone at HMRC will surely be held accountable for this shambles? Or do they just walk away from the mess scot free as well?

[CropleyWasGod]

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Totally. It's a cast of characters and no mistake. Crooks, fraudsters and shysters.

If as suspected the EBT case will come down largely on the side of Oldco Rangers, (having already been judged in their favour twice) what HMRC will be left with the legal bill. What an absolute mess.
Surely someone at HMRC will surely be held accountable for this shambles? Or do they just walk away from the mess scot free as well?

Why would HMRC be held accountable?

They are pursuing the EBT case for a number of reasons. The most important is to establish a precedent to enable them to pursue others; that is secondary to the question of whether they will recover any money from RFC(IL).

To do otherwise would be wrong, IMO.

[AndyM_1875]

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Why would HMRC be held accountable?

They are pursuing the EBT case for a number of reasons. The most important is to establish a precedent to enable them to pursue others; that is secondary to the question of whether they will recover any money from RFC(IL).

To do otherwise would be wrong, IMO.

As an Unsecured Creditor will they get anything?

I understand about the precedent but that's been lost twice already in the Tribunals and legal opinion appears to suggest strongly that it won't be won in respect of RFC Oldco.
In short, throwing more good money after bad.

Having had my own issues with HMRC I know what a useless, incompetent shower of an organization they are.

[CropleyWasGod]

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As an Unsecured Creditor will they get anything?

I understand about the precedent but that's been lost twice already in the Tribunals and legal opinion appears to suggest strongly that it won't be won in respect of RFC Oldco.
In short, throwing more good money after bad.

Having had my own issues with HMRC I know what a useless, incompetent shower of an organization they are.

BDO's legal opinion says that. HMRC's obviously says different.

HMRC will get a return from the liquidation, no matter what.

[ancient hibee]

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Nah.

They're using Chucky's horses. They have scarves over their mouths, tricorn hats and a bag that says "le Swag".

Surely it's the mystery masked man-The Lone(or loan)(A)Ranger.

[saltandsauce]

I see they have started making redundancies

[AndyM_1875]

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I see they have started making redundancies

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30109897
Administrative staff?

The more obvious targets of players earning 7k a week who aren't actually playing (e.g. Shiels, Miller) seems to be getting missed.
Two players at that level out the door and they could save 3/4 of a million a year

[dangermouse]

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DM perhaps?


(not Danger Mouse, though you never know)

I'm giving them nothing

[CropleyWasGod]

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30109897
Administrative staff?

The more obvious targets of players earning 7k a week who aren't actually playing (e.g. Shiels, Miller) seems to be getting missed.
Two players at that level out the door and they could save 3/4 of a million a year

The problem with the players is that, as they are on fixed-term contracts, those contracts will probably be payable in full. Thus not really a saving. In fact, it's worse as the money would be payable now rather than over the life of the contract.

[AndyM_1875]

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The problem with the players is that, as they are on fixed-term contracts, those contracts will probably be payable in full. Thus not really a saving. In fact, it's worse as the money would be payable now rather than over the life of the contract.

Sorry, my bad. Meant to say tell them to find new clubs in January. Get the prep work done now with their Agents and they can sign for their new clubs as soon as Transfer Window opens.

That of course assumes anyone wants them which is another discussion altogether.

[ballengeich]

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30109897
Administrative staff?

The more obvious targets of players earning 7k a week who aren't actually playing (e.g. Shiels, Miller) seems to be getting missed.
Two players at that level out the door and they could save 3/4 of a million a year

In addition to the point made by CWG, when a company makes people redundant there's a time period has to elapse before they can recruit new employees to do the same work. I don't know how long the time is, but making footballers redundant now might mean they couldn't bring in new signings next summer.

Transfers and loan deals in the January window will be a better way to save on the playing budget, even if Sevco have to keep paying part of the leavers' wages, as few of them will get the same anywhere else.

[Keith_M]

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Sorry, my bad. Meant to say tell them to find new clubs in January. Get the prep work done now with their Agents and they can sign for their new clubs as soon as Transfer Window opens.

That of course assumes anyone wants them which is another discussion altogether.

That would be the sensible thing to do but would they get offered nearly as much elsewhere? I think it's unlikely they would and even less likely they would be willing to move for less money.

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I'm giving them nothing

Pleased to hear it

[jacomo]

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Sorry, my bad. Meant to say tell them to find new clubs in January. Get the prep work done now with their Agents and they can sign for their new clubs as soon as Transfer Window opens.

That of course assumes anyone wants them which is another discussion altogether.

If you are Dean Shiels are you really going to move on?. He'll never earn money like it elsewhere.

[PatHead]

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If you are Dean Shiels are you really going to move on?. He'll never earn money like it elsewhere.

Surely a loan deal with someone paying a percentage is better than paying it all yourself. The benefit to Shields is that he could be putting himself in the window rather than rotting in U20s or bounce games

[jonty]

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The problem with the players is that, as they are on fixed-term contracts, those contracts will probably be payable in full. Thus not really a saving. In fact, it's worse as the money would be payable now rather than over the life of the contract.

Clearly The Rangers weren't very forward thinking when it came to giving them contracts if there were no clauses in which they could be released, particularly given their funding issues at the time.

In order words, you reap what you sow. You have to feel sorry for those being made redundant. Its crap at the best of times, let alone just before Christmas

[jonty]

A second arrest warrant issued for he who has 'off the radar' wealth. And I was told tonight that the IPO is being torn apart next, which could cause issues with the current setup as the training facilities and ground were something to do with it?

[CropleyWasGod]

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A second arrest warrant issued for he who has 'off the radar' wealth. And I was told tonight that the IPO is being torn apart next, which could cause issues with the current setup as the training facilities and ground were something to do with it?

If that's the case, Chucky is next for the felt collar.