Share Transfers Agreed/Cooling off period

[steakbake]

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Does the information BDO publish on the Vote give any indication of who voted for and against ?

Or, am I going to have to do a FOI. request to find out which way our Council voted with our money due by HOMFC.

Where is Sidney these days?

[cabbageandribs1875]

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Where is Sidney these days?

maybe suffocated under a mountain of mail

[rcarter1]

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This thread is getting ridiculous now.

Thankfully I've figured out a way to tell whose talking nonsense. Anyone saying they are itk or have a source - talking nonsense.

Where does this leave certain posters who even last week were telling us their top level source said no chance of a cva?

People need to suck it up and move on instead of coming up with more zany reasons as to why they are doomed.

should point out this isn't including cwg who has done a good job, but imo didn't factor in the football club coefficient to hia calcultions.

This Im afraid. There's been a lot of bold assertions and 'I can categorically say XXX will happen', and as often as not its bunkum - or only partly true. I particularly agree that the fact its a football club makes a massive difference, if for no other reason than any alternative buyer of the land would be concerned that whatever they built instead might get vandalised/burned down by an irate mob.

If this all leads to Hearts surviving, having side stepped millions of debt, it makes my conversation with Jambos really easy.

4-0, 5-1 and virtually any scoreline in the last 10 (20?) years, means hee haw to me, because they basically robbed a country to achieve it. Clean slates all round, and looking forward to another 20 years of rivalry on a level playing field.

[leggeto]

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This Im afraid. There's been a lot of bold assertions and 'I can categorically say XXX will happen', and as often as not its bunkum - or only partly true. I particularly agree that the fact its a football club makes a massive difference, if for no other reason than any alternative buyer of the land would be concerned that whatever they built instead might get vandalised/burned down by an irate mob.

If this all leads to Hearts surviving, having side stepped millions of debt, it makes my conversation with Jambos really easy.

4-0, 5-1 and virtually any scoreline in the last 10 (20?) years, means hee haw to me, because they basically robbed a country to achieve it. Clean slates all round, and looking forward to another 20 years of rivalry on a level playing field.

that is pretty much they way its going to be

[SurferRosa]

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Where is Sidney these days?

Had his wee bit fun then scuttled back to 'sickbag' probably.

[Eyrie]

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I suggest we start a fund for TB if you have spare cash give it to hibs its time to forget about othrr clubs and concentrate on hibs.....imagine the boost Terry Butcher would get from a new fighting fund to get new players how much could be raised is this not the best way to improve over hearts or whoever help fund better players ...

Have you heard about Leith Links? Raises money for the club and helps kids to attend games.

[Kaiser1962]

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Given that the vast majority of the debt was owed to Ukio and UBIG, with UBIG abstaining and the CVA being passed by 87%, virtually all of those creditors must have voted against the CVA - i.e. voted to close HMFC down.

And that includes the charity run by David Southern that should never have been a creditor to start with. Not a lot of goodwill there.

We may need to know who all voted. If you exclude the UBIG debt then UKIO makes up over 76% of whats left. I am sure Milsson are a Vlad company and that Ensco 165 (also a LT company) are now dissolved. If you exclude these three companies debts then UKIO now carry 85% on their own.

I would suspect that a large number of smaller creditors would not have wasted their time even responding as the propaganda machine has been telling all and sundry that they would get 0p and should be thankful for that.

Another thing that I think is worth noting is the obvious discrepancies between the valuations of the land and what someone is apparently willing to pay. At Ibrox the properties had a book value of well over £100m prior to administration and was sold for £1.5m to be subsequently re valued weeks later at £40m. Hearts have Tynecastle on the books at around £14m (I know this is rebuild etc) and it looks like this will be sold for around £1m when the whole deal is broken down with players contracts, brand etc. Reports suggest the property was indepently valued recently around £5.5m.

As something is really only worth what someone else will pay the examples would suggest that there is something seriously amiss between the process used by the valuer or the sales procedures of the seller. As this does not seem to happen, certainly nowhere near as extreme, in everyday property deals then is there something else worth looking at?

[lapsedhibee]

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As something is really only worth what someone else will pay the examples would suggest that there is something seriously amiss between the process used by the valuer or the sales procedures of the seller. As this does not seem to happen, certainly nowhere near as extreme, in everyday property deals then is there something else worth looking at?

Not sure it needs looking at really. As was abundantly obvious during the the Huns fiasco, the governance of Scottish fitba is corrupt.

Unless you are perhaps suggesting that Scottish insolvency practitioners might also be suspect?

[Bostonhibby]

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Where is Sidney these days?

Now that the seasons started he has been very busy training and putting a team on the pitch at tiny.

[Kaiser1962]

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Not sure it needs looking at really. As was abundantly obvious during the the Huns fiasco, the governance of Scottish fitba is corrupt.

Unless you are perhaps suggesting that Scottish insolvency practitioners might also be suspect?

Merely pointing out the discrepancy between valuation price as opposed to market price achieved. What is interesting about the Oldhun scenario is that the properties were revalued at over 25 times their sale price within weeks of the sale going through, having achieved slightly over 1% of the value placed on them by the previous company at sale.

[cwilliamson85]

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/footb...or-Hearts-fans

Someone better call Bob Geldof and get him to re-release "do they know it's Christmas" with all proceeds going to Hearts.

Imagine the conversation on Christmas morning with your son / daughter. Sorry there is no presents this year due to all our spare income going towards players and staff who are earning more than us and are not putting any of their own wages back into the club. It's ok though as we won 1-5 and Rudi might be coming back.

[lapsedhibee]

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Merely pointing out the discrepancy between valuation price as opposed to market price achieved. What is interesting about the Oldhun scenario is that the properties were revalued at over 25 times their sale price within weeks of the sale going through, having achieved slightly over 1% of the value placed on them by the previous company at sale.

A cynic writes:
A few of us have waited, so far in vain, for Duff & Duffer's role to be the subject of proper scrutiny by the authorities. I don't suppose it's in the interests of the accounting professions to point out that some of their number habitually play fast and loose with principles of honesty, integrity, etc.

[Weststandwanab]

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This Im afraid. There's been a lot of bold assertions and 'I can categorically say XXX will happen', and as often as not its bunkum - or only partly true. I particularly agree that the fact its a football club makes a massive difference, if for no other reason than any alternative buyer of the land would be concerned that whatever they built instead might get vandalised/burned down by an irate mob.

If this all leads to Hearts surviving, having side stepped millions of debt, it makes my conversation with Jambos really easy.

4-0, 5-1 and virtually any scoreline in the last 10 (20?) years, means hee haw to me, because they basically robbed a country to achieve it. Clean slates all round, and looking forward to another 20 years of rivalry on a level playing field.

Me too.

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Not sure it needs looking at really. As was abundantly obvious during the the Huns fiasco, the governance of Scottish fitba is corrupt.

Unless you are perhaps suggesting that Scottish insolvency practitioners might also be suspect?

Careful with that sort of statement.

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Merely pointing out the discrepancy between valuation price as opposed to market price achieved. What is interesting about the Oldhun scenario is that the properties were revalued at over 25 times their sale price within weeks of the sale going through, having achieved slightly over 1% of the value placed on them by the previous company at sale.

It was not a valuation it was merely a bit of creative accountancy to bolster the balance sheet to compensate (on paper) for the on going losses incurred.

[lapsedhibee]

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It was not a valuation it was merely a bit of creative accountancy to bolster the balance sheet to compensate (on paper) for the on going losses incurred.

'nuff said. Paraphrasing, creative accounting is perfectly acceptable practice.

[Gus Fring]

If people are going to ignore those of us in the know then that's just fine. But I assume they'll stop reading this thread and the newspapers and other media as well because up to today not a single outlet has managed 100% accuracy in their reporting.

I trust my source and the people on this board a lot more than I trust the likes of Brian Mclauchlin and Barry Anderson.

[TowerHibs]

I have experience in working with businesses who going down the swanny, Hearts could come out of all this debt free tomorrow and would still be completely struggling for years. Baring a miracle (or Killie admin) they will be relagated this year and will struggle in a very competitive league, that stadium takes up a hell of a lot of cash just to keep it open and they have a core support that wrongly demand that they should be no lower than 3rd in the league. All this will put stresses on whoever picks up this mess and may cause them to spiral into another admin.

What should be our mentality is, yes Hearts will survive this. Hibs and the clubs fans must make it our duty, to absolutely destroy this team on the park. This will kill them more than any financial situation.Huge opportuntiy for us to do this in the next 5/10 years

[lapsedhibee]

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I trust my source and the people on this board a lot more than I trust the likes of Brian Mclauchlin and Barry Anderson.

And I trust your source more than Brian McLauchlin, Barry Anderson and Bryan Jackson. (Assuming your source isn't Bryan Jackson.)

[brog]

A few associated thoughts from the BJ interview. I thought he was almost relieved by the end in that he had started to tell it like it is at last. Key points for me were; a) its not over, b) its not over etc!!
Seriously there were 3 major negatives for Yams
1. Will be in Admin until at least March/April
2. Prospect of signing anyone is laughable
3. May have to get the begging bowl out again.

The thing that really intrigued me though was his hope that UBIG would hand over the shares because essentially they're worthless!!! Well they're anything but! If UBIG don't sell them to F of H the ba's burst! Therefore for Yams to avoid liquidation they have to make it worthwhile to UBIG to sell, I don't think F of H saying thanks will suffice!
Finally, Sergey & others don't need defending but for those piling in to criticise these guys who did their best to keep us informed, remember BJ stated " the situation is extremely fluent (sic)". Its quite possible that a week or so ago UBIG were going to oppose the CVA & were persuaded instead to abstain for now. That decision actually gives all the leverage now to UBIG.
To repeat, its not over!

[hibs0666]

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This thread is getting ridiculous now.

Thankfully I've figured out a way to tell whose talking nonsense. Anyone saying they are itk or have a source - talking nonsense.

Where does this leave certain posters who even last week were telling us their top level source said no chance of a cva?

People need to suck it up and move on instead of coming up with more zany reasons as to why they are doomed.

should point out this isn't including cwg who has done a good job, but imo didn't factor in the football club coefficient to hia calcultions.

There is no CVA agreed. I'm not sure what your beef is to be honest, or why you feel the need to have a pop.

[leggeto]

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A few associated thoughts from the BJ interview. I thought he was almost relieved by the end in that he had started to tell it like it is at last. Key points for me were; a) its not over, b) its not over etc!!
Seriously there were 3 major negatives for Yams
1. Will be in Admin until at least March/April
2. Prospect of signing anyone is laughable
3. May have to get the begging bowl out again.

The thing that really intrigued me though was his hope that UBIG would hand over the shares because essentially they're worthless!!! Well they're anything but! If UBIG don't sell them to F of H the ba's burst! Therefore for Yams to avoid liquidation they have to make it worthwhile to UBIG to sell, I don't think F of H saying thanks will suffice!
Finally, Sergey & others don't need defending but for those piling in to criticise these guys who did their best to keep us informed, remember BJ stated " the situation is extremely fluent (sic)". Its quite possible that a week or so ago UBIG were going to oppose the CVA & were persuaded instead to abstain for now. That decision actually gives all the leverage now to UBIG.
To repeat, its not over!

tick tock tick tock

[KdyHby]

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Have you heard about Leith Links? Raises money for the club and helps kids to attend games.

Agreed! Repeatably people suggest such a fund on the Hibs forums. When it's highlighted that there is one that benefits both Hibs and children (hopefully next generation Hibs fans), there does not appear to be a significant upturn in contributions to LL. to FranckSuzy for setting up the fund, and ensuring that it's well publicised and is growing!

[jacomo]

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Season Tickets will be on sale in February, that'll get them through to the end of the season.

Possibly. But that will simply mean that they will run out of cash the following season too. Do they then start selling season tickets for 2015/16 next Christmas?

[Dashing Bob S]

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This thread is getting ridiculous now.

Thankfully I've figured out a way to tell whose talking nonsense. Anyone saying they are itk or have a source - talking nonsense.

Where does this leave certain posters who even last week were telling us their top level source said no chance of a cva?

People need to suck it up and move on instead of coming up with more zany reasons as to why they are doomed.

should point out this isn't including cwg who has done a good job, but imo didn't factor in the football club coefficient to hia calcultions.

People like yourself have been just as at fault by continually touting a fantasy best case scenario for Hearts at every turn. If some of the more outlandish posts were to be believed, they would be preparing for a champions league campaign next season. I don't doubt the integrity of Bajilions or Sergey and their sources. They have shared information they have received, that's all, and generally not confused their own speculations with this. If this thread is so ridiculous to you, I suggest you leave it and rely on the likes of McLaughlin, Anderson and FOH spokespersons, for your info on this matter.

[CropleyWasGod]

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This thread is getting ridiculous now.

Thankfully I've figured out a way to tell whose talking nonsense. Anyone saying they are itk or have a source - talking nonsense.

Where does this leave certain posters who even last week were telling us their top level source said no chance of a cva?

People need to suck it up and move on instead of coming up with more zany reasons as to why they are doomed.

should point out this isn't including cwg who has done a good job, but imo didn't factor in the football club coefficient to hia calcultions.

What calculations were these? And what is the "football club coefficient"?

[Mikey]

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People like yourself have been just as at fault by continually touting a fantasy best case scenario for Hearts at every turn. If some of the more outlandish posts were to be believed, they would be preparing for a champions league campaign next season. I don't doubt the integrity of Bajilions or Sergey and their sources. They have shared information they have received, that's all, and generally not confused their own speculations with this. If this thread is so ridiculous to you, I suggest you leave it and rely on the likes of McLaughlin, Anderson and FOH spokespersons, for your info on this matter.

There's no point arguing with the folk who repeatedly tell themselves that Santa won't be coming this year, so they're happy when all they get is a satsuma

[lapsedhibee]

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The thing that really intrigued me though was his hope that UBIG would hand over the shares because essentially they're worthless!!! Well they're anything but! If UBIG don't sell them to F of H the ba's burst!

Jackson must have known this as he spoke. How does he think it's acceptable to stand in front of a camera and suggest otherwise? Why is there no Vince Lunny-equivalent having a word in his ear? Where is the dividing line between spinning and lying and has he crossed it?

[Dashing Bob S]

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Season Tickets will be on sale in February, that'll get them through to the end of the season.

I'm not sure what the take-up will be then. FOH are still asking for cash, if it's likely that they don't know whether they will be buying for the premiership or championship, people might be inclined to hold off. If they don't, and Hearts rely on this cash, they could be in huge problems next season.

[Weststandwanab]

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'nuff said. Paraphrasing, creative accounting is perfectly acceptable practice.

May not be acceptable but is permitted under Company Law. It only states . On paper it has an inflated value try selling it for that.

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I have experience in working with businesses who going down the swanny, Hearts could come out of all this debt free tomorrow and would still be completely struggling for years. Baring a miracle (or Killie admin) they will be relagated this year and will struggle in a very competitive league, that stadium takes up a hell of a lot of cash just to keep it open and they have a core support that wrongly demand that they should be no lower than 3rd in the league. All this will put stresses on whoever picks up this mess and may cause them to spiral into another admin.

What should be our mentality is, yes Hearts will survive this. Hibs and the clubs fans must make it our duty, to absolutely destroy this team on the park. This will kill them more than any financial situation.Huge opportuntiy for us to do this in the next 5/10 years

Spot on.

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A few associated thoughts from the BJ interview. I thought he was almost relieved by the end in that he had started to tell it like it is at last. Key points for me were; a) its not over, b) its not over etc!!
Seriously there were 3 major negatives for Yams
1. Will be in Admin until at least March/April
2. Prospect of signing anyone is laughable
3. May have to get the begging bowl out again.

The thing that really intrigued me though was his hope that UBIG would hand over the shares because essentially they're worthless!!! Well they're anything but! If UBIG don't sell them to F of H the ba's burst! Therefore for Yams to avoid liquidation they have to make it worthwhile to UBIG to sell, I don't think F of H saying thanks will suffice!
Finally, Sergey & others don't need defending but for those piling in to criticise these guys who did their best to keep us informed, remember BJ stated " the situation is extremely fluent (sic)". Its quite possible that a week or so ago UBIG were going to oppose the CVA & were persuaded instead to abstain for now. That decision actually gives all the leverage now to UBIG.
To repeat, its not over!

The end game has only just started.

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Possibly. But that will simply mean that they will run out of cash the following season too. Do they then start selling season tickets for 2015/16 next Christmas?

Only if they still exist next Christmas !

[Treadstone]

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If people are going to ignore those of us in the know then that's just fine. But I assume they'll stop reading this thread and the newspapers and other media as well because up to today not a single outlet has managed 100% accuracy in their reporting.

I lost count the number of times they could not even get the points deduction right. That was just simple arithmetic if they had consulted the readily available resource, which they did not.

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

Just read the EEN, what a load of guff they print in this paper about what's going on, I simply refuse to believe that no one in the media doesn't know the full story of their lying and cheating, beggars belief at times just how naive they really are, and as for the maroon morons saying that Ian Murray is a "saviour" well OK if you say so then.

They just don't get it do they?, the arrogance is breathtaking at times.

Tick Tock....