Share Transfers Agreed/Cooling off period

[GlenrothesHibee]

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stv news, 19/06/2013.....Hearts fans quoted saying "every hearts home game will be sold out next season"

.....we shall see!! one would seriously doubt it!!!

They will need to sell more than 6500 season tickets then

[Hibernia Na Eir]

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I cant remember if this has been asked but if there is to be a list of creditors will that only be published if theres a CVA and more importantly will it include those who bought shares and season tickets?

Oh please say yes yes yes yes!

I think the creditors do get published and you will see one of three choices each make:- yes, no or abstain.
looking forward to seeing names myself ;)

[Andy74]

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They will need to sell more than 6500 season tickets then

You mean re-sell?

[SmashinGlass]

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No chance. Especially after a few heavy defeats early in the season. Even the diehards will stop turning up.

Could be right though, as they may have no games to sell, therefore they'll sell out on the basis that a sell out of no seats is nothing

[Dashing Bob S]

Don't expect much, outside of the usual crazy rumours, to happen soon. I think the admins will have long, hard, tough time just getting all the basic financial information they need, simply in order to get the whole assessment process underway. Hearts officials haven't been too forthcoming with this information in the past, and that isn't going to change. I suspect the financial records are pretty shambolic, and in some cases deliberately so, in order to protect various parties and smokescreen the shadier practices which have undoubtedly been undertaken. Not the easiest of tasks for administrators, I would have thought, and there's so much up in the air regarding the legal status of the Lithuanian money and the ongoing criminal investigations, all of which could muddy the waters further depending on how those monies are and have been historically accounted for.

This is much more complex than the Rangers case, which dragged on for long enough; it leaves Hearts with a mountain to climb to be in any shape to compete in any League next season. It's a race against time for Hearts, and they are up against administrators appointed by a parent company, whom it seems, have feet-dragging in their best interests.

There will be a lot of piss and wind over the next few weeks, as the media try to spin as much intrigue out of this situation as possible. The fact is that the internet (cemented by their showing in the Rangers case last year) has exposed those muppets in 'sports journalism' in Scotland as little more than sweetie wives and PR bozos. They won't have the same reverence for Hearts that they had for Rangers, and will repeat anything which gives hope to/crushes the spirits of Hearts fans. The fact is that this is a very bad, potentially perilous situation for Hearts to be in, and if Hibs were in their circumstances I would be bricking it. Not because I believe they could die permanently, but I do think they could have to shut down for at least a season, lose the stadium, and restart in the lower leagues.

[CallumLaidlaw]

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stv news, 19/06/2013.....Hearts fans quoted saying "every hearts home game will be sold out next season"

.....we shall see!! one would seriously doubt it!!!

If any average guy that is normally a walk up, has pledged £20+ to FOH, if anything comes of it, that could seriously affect people being able to afford going to matches.

[PapillonVert]

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This will be long and drawn out with many false dawns and saviours. Don't spend too long analysing every half baked rescue plan - has Kenedy expressed an interest yet? If RFC could muster a £5.6 million bid from another conman what chance the Jimbos. Liquidation and a ground share in West Lothian with a wee application under a newco to div 3. Enjoy the summer fellow Hibees!

Yes, I think so.

The final outcome is uncertain IMO - they could implode or they could somehow survive (unfairly).

At this moment, I think we should be restrained rather than triumphant.

Not that I am even triumphant being someone who has stood side by side on the terracing with Jambos who are friends and colleagues.

[PatHead]

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Don't expect much, outside of the usual crazy rumours, to happen soon. I think the admins will have long, hard, tough time just getting all the basic financial information they need, simply in order to get the whole assessment process underway. Hearts officials haven't been too forthcoming with this information in the past, and that isn't going to change. I suspect the financial records are pretty shambolic, and in some cases deliberately so, in order to protect various parties and smokescreen the shadier practices which have undoubtedly been undertaken. Not the easiest of tasks for administrators, I would have thought, and there's so much up in the air regarding the legal status of the Lithuanian money and the ongoing criminal investigations, all of which could muddy the waters further depending on how those monies are and have been historically accounted for.

This is much more complex than the Rangers case, which dragged on for long enough; it leaves Hearts with a mountain to climb to be in any shape to compete in any League next season. It's a race against time for Hearts, and they are up against administrators appointed by a parent company, whom it seems, have feet-dragging in their best interests.

There will be a lot of piss and wind over the next few weeks, as the media try to spin as much intrigue out of this situation as possible. The fact is that the internet (cemented by their showing in the Rangers case last year) has exposed those muppets in 'sports journalism' in Scotland as little more than sweetie wives and PR bozos. They won't have the same reverence for Hearts that they had for Rangers, and will repeat anything which gives hope to/crushes the spirits of Hearts fans. The fact is that this is a very bad, potentially perilous situation for Hearts to be in, and if Hibs were in their circumstances I would be bricking it. Not because I believe they could die permanently, but I do think they could have to shut down for at least a season, lose the stadium, and restart in the lower leagues.

The thing is that if they "die" and start at the bottom league a number of factions will try to fill the gap. The support will fragment and youngsters will support Man Utd/City or Chelsea or even Barcelona. I don't think they will ever recover.

[mutley]

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You mean re-sell?

If that is the case and the money raised from season tickets so far has gone without the punters getting anything for it , how many would ( or even could afford) to spend that much again?

If it was me and I shelled out £400 for a season ticket to be told that I would have to pay for it again , I would be telling them to ram it !

[Dashing Bob S]

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The thing is that if they "die" and start at the bottom league a number of factions will try to fill the gap. The support will fragment and youngsters will support Man Utd/City or Chelsea or even Barcelona. I don't think they will ever recover.

If they get a place in the new Lowland League they'll have to rename it the Lowlife League.

[07hibee]

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Another myth, perpetuated by the Jambo at the BBC .............

How many fans do Hearts have?

Last season their average attendance in the SPL was 13,163

Creative accountancy? Count all their season ticket holders as present, just like their big brothers in Glasgow?

Why do they do that though? Is it some sort of scam or tax dodge?

[SmashinGlass]

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If that is the case and the money raised from season tickets so far has gone without the punters getting anything for it , how many would ( or even could afford) to spend that much again?

If it was me and I shelled out £400 for a season ticket to be told that I would have to pay for it again , I would be telling them to ram it !

But, it was worth it for 5-1, no?

[Big Frank]

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Now be prepared for rumours of EVERYBODY being desperate to buy Hearts. We've already had; Skando consortium, the fans, JK Rowling, British consortium, American consortium, son of Wallet, son of Vlad...the estate of Jimmy Savile...

[fatbloke]

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Don't expect much, outside of the usual crazy rumours, to happen soon. I think the admins will have long, hard, tough time just getting all the basic financial information they need, simply in order to get the whole assessment process underway. Hearts officials haven't been too forthcoming with this information in the past, and that isn't going to change. I suspect the financial records are pretty shambolic, and in some cases deliberately so, in order to protect various parties and smokescreen the shadier practices which have undoubtedly been undertaken. Not the easiest of tasks for administrators, I would have thought, and there's so much up in the air regarding the legal status of the Lithuanian money and the ongoing criminal investigations, all of which could muddy the waters further depending on how those monies are and have been historically accounted for.

This is much more complex than the Rangers case, which dragged on for long enough; it leaves Hearts with a mountain to climb to be in any shape to compete in any League next season. It's a race against time for Hearts, and they are up against administrators appointed by a parent company, whom it seems, have feet-dragging in their best interests.

There will be a lot of piss and wind over the next few weeks, as the media try to spin as much intrigue out of this situation as possible. The fact is that the internet (cemented by their showing in the Rangers case last year) has exposed those muppets in 'sports journalism' in Scotland as little more than sweetie wives and PR bozos. They won't have the same reverence for Hearts that they had for Rangers, and will repeat anything which gives hope to/crushes the spirits of Hearts fans. The fact is that this is a very bad, potentially perilous situation for Hearts to be in, and if Hibs were in their circumstances I would be bricking it. Not because I believe they could die permanently, but I do think they could have to shut down for at least a season, lose the stadium, and restart in the lower leagues.

Best and most definitive post of the past week

[The Falcon]

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This will be long and drawn out with many false dawns and saviours. Don't spend too long analysing every half baked rescue plan - has Kenedy expressed an interest yet? If RFC could muster a £5.6 million bid from another conman what chance the Jimbos. Liquidation and a ground share in West Lothian with a wee application under a newco to div 3. Enjoy the summer fellow Hibees!

Oh I do hope so!

I do have reservations. I have seen some strange things happen, rules waived and laws circumvented when people with money start wishing it so.

[poolman]

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Why do that, why not just sit tight and stay quiet and let them sweat it out a little longer, wondering what's happening with your money?

Of course if they email you again asking why you've not paid up simply say you've had problems with cash flow and that you'll donate as soon as it's all resolved.

I have a few other e-mail addresses :-)

[JoeTortolanoFanClub]

This http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/...-premier/table is going to be as good as it gets for the Yams over the next few weeks. Indeed, I would not be surprised if they did not start the season in the SPL at all - nor perhaps in any league for that matter ! GGTTH

[Andy74]

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If that is the case and the money raised from season tickets so far has gone without the punters getting anything for it , how many would ( or even could afford) to spend that much again?

If it was me and I shelled out £400 for a season ticket to be told that I would have to pay for it again , I would be telling them to ram it !

Season tickets, shares, monthly pledges. No chance yer average punter will be able to pay all those never mind twice for a season ticket. But the money is all gone and next year's costs still have to be met.

[Caversham Green]

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Don't expect much, outside of the usual crazy rumours, to happen soon. I think the admins will have long, hard, tough time just getting all the basic financial information they need, simply in order to get the whole assessment process underway. Hearts officials haven't been too forthcoming with this information in the past, and that isn't going to change. I suspect the financial records are pretty shambolic, and in some cases deliberately so, in order to protect various parties and smokescreen the shadier practices which have undoubtedly been undertaken. Not the easiest of tasks for administrators, I would have thought, and there's so much up in the air regarding the legal status of the Lithuanian money and the ongoing criminal investigations, all of which could muddy the waters further depending on how those monies are and have been historically accounted for.

This is much more complex than the Rangers case, which dragged on for long enough; it leaves Hearts with a mountain to climb to be in any shape to compete in any League next season. It's a race against time for Hearts, and they are up against administrators appointed by a parent company, whom it seems, have feet-dragging in their best interests.

There will be a lot of piss and wind over the next few weeks, as the media try to spin as much intrigue out of this situation as possible. The fact is that the internet (cemented by their showing in the Rangers case last year) has exposed those muppets in 'sports journalism' in Scotland as little more than sweetie wives and PR bozos. They won't have the same reverence for Hearts that they had for Rangers, and will repeat anything which gives hope to/crushes the spirits of Hearts fans. The fact is that this is a very bad, potentially perilous situation for Hearts to be in, and if Hibs were in their circumstances I would be bricking it. Not because I believe they could die permanently, but I do think they could have to shut down for at least a season, lose the stadium, and restart in the lower leagues.

Spot on with all of that Bob. You can get a measure of a company's accounting standards by the amount of the auditor's fees, and HoMFC's were nearly 10 times as much as Hibernian's. I believe the main accounting function was carried out by UBIG and they're now insolvent with no directors, so getting information from them will be a nightmare. It took Duff & Phelps three weeks to get their initial letter to the creditors out and a further month for their report - that timescale would take us into the new season, so there is no way they'll start the season out of administration and there is a fair possibility that they won't be able to start it at all. They're highly unlikely to be able to sign any players in this window, and if they start the season at all they'll be 15 points adrift at the foot of the table before a ball is kicked.

#allisbarry.

[poolman]

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stv news, 19/06/2013.....Hearts fans quoted saying "every hearts home game will be sold out next season"

.....we shall see!! one would seriously doubt it!!!

Aye,especially when they get horsed in the first few games.especially the second :-)

[ballengeich]

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If that is the case and the money raised from season tickets so far has gone without the punters getting anything for it , how many would ( or even could afford) to spend that much again?

If it was me and I shelled out £400 for a season ticket to be told that I would have to pay for it again , I would be telling them to ram it !

The ones who've paid by credit card may be able to get the money refunded under consumer protection laws. They can purchase again under new owners, but I reckon there'll be a number who've forked out for nothing.

[mutley]

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Season tickets, shares, monthly pledges. No chance yer average punter will be able to pay all those never mind twice for a season ticket. But the money is all gone and next year's costs still have to be met.

That was kinda my point , they have payed out all that cash from there savings/kids piggy bank/ bake sale and yet those deluded muppets think that they will sell out every home game? Say they have sold 7000 ST, and 50% are stupid enough and are able to re purchase again, that's 3500, plus walk ups, even with basic maths that wouldn't even make a dent in the every day running costs/ wages etc

If we can all see it, the administrators surely see it and with all the other stuff they are bound to dig up, I just can't see any way forward other than liquidation .

[AndyM_1875]

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The thing is that if they "die" and start at the bottom league a number of factions will try to fill the gap. The support will fragment and youngsters will support Man Utd/City or Chelsea or even Barcelona. I don't think they will ever recover.

That's already happening Pat with or without Hertz. Kids in my neighbourhood and also my mums in Edinburgh run about in City/United/Barcelona/Chelsea shirts. I'd hazard a guess not one of them has ever attended a game. Football is something they watch on TV.

Regarding Bob's point he's spot on. Hearts will still be in Administration when the season starts and will have a small inexperienced squad, devoid of morale. But as I've said all along its not our problem.

We are scheduled to go to Tynecastle on August 10. We must go and do a job and get the 3 points in front of a large passionate Hibs support. That's really all that matters

[ballengeich]

One of the elements of Fedotovas' statement on the reasons for admin was that they'd had unexpected expenditure on the stadium. I'm assuming this means that the main stand's safety certificate was in doubt.

Does anyone know the current position on the main stand? Does it have a certificate for next season or is there work needed? There might be an unpleasant surprise awaiting a prospective purchaser during due diligence.

[PatHead]

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That was kinda my point , they have payed out all that cash from there savings/kids piggy bank/ bake sale and yet those deluded muppets think that they will sell out every home game? Say they have sold 7000 ST, and 50% are stupid enough and are able to re purchase again, that's 3500, plus walk ups, even with basic maths that wouldn't even make a dent in the every day running costs/ wages etc

If we can all see it, the administrators surely see it and with all the other stuff they are bound to dig up, I just can't see any way forward other than liquidation .

Don't forget the money spent on missing kits that are currently being used as sails by pirates in the South China Sea.

[Saorsa]

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One of the elements of Fedotovas' statement on the reasons for admin was that they'd had unexpected expenditure on the stadium. I'm assuming this means that the main stand's safety certificate was in doubt.

Does anyone know the current position on the main stand? Does it have a certificate for next season or is there work needed? There might be an unpleasant surprise awaiting a prospective purchaser during due diligence.

was that no the step painting?

[jacomo]

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That was kinda my point , they have payed out all that cash from there savings/kids piggy bank/ bake sale and yet those deluded muppets think that they will sell out every home game? Say they have sold 7000 ST, and 50% are stupid enough and are able to re purchase again, that's 3500, plus walk ups, even with basic maths that wouldn't even make a dent in the every day running costs/ wages etc

If we can all see it, the administrators surely see it and with all the other stuff they are bound to dig up, I just can't see any way forward other than liquidation .

It's alright, I'm sure that kid who voluntarily went without a Christmas pressie last year so the money could go towards Hearts will happily do so again.

[Bostonhibby]

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Once the administrator is in place and examining the books, the true financial picture should hopefully become clearer. Then the "bidders" can also do their own due diligence and reach a conclusion about the true value of the business. A lot of people think they can pick up bargains from administrators, only to see the finances are much worse than they originally thought, enough to blow a big hole in any business plan they may have in mind. For example, even if Hearts keep the SavileDome, the main stand must be close to being refused a safety certificate and condemned. How will they finance the costs of that?

What about the season ticket cash - where has that gone? If they have to honour season tickets - and as "Hearts-minded" folk, surely they will - the cashflow next season could be dire. Or maybe His Lordship Pishybreeks will use his allowances to help them out?

Nae chance, here's where the allowances go

[ballengeich]

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was that no the step painting?

Of course! That's the expense that tipped them over the edge. No worries now about the health and safety gadgies closing the stadium on August 10.

[Springbank]

I see there was a song from 1991 that was:

If you really love me (let me go) by Danny Wilson

Think I might listen to that on spotify to wind up a few jambos