Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

**PaulC** · 07-06-2012 05:01 PM

Interesting comments in this court case from the HMRC and Sheriff

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...tland-18352528

However, Sheriff Kenneth Robb said he did not agree that nobody had been harmed by the offence.
He said that in an age of financial constraints, £635,000 was a lot of money which could have helped the public purse.
He told Maxwell: "You have enjoyed the fruits of your labour and the tax that you should have paid.
"The tree may be bare, but you used the fruits over many years."

David Odd, HMRC's assistant director of criminal investigation in Scotland, said: "This was a case of deliberate and systematic fraud.

**Gus Fring** · 07-06-2012 05:09 PM

Originally Posted by Seveno

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I can't post a link at present but go to scotslawthoughts for the latest bombshell. It explains why D&P were initially so bullish about a quich CVA.

Heres the link http://scotslawthoughts.wordpress.com/2012/06/07/revealed-craig-whytes-master-plan-he-came-up-with-the-incubator-company/

***greenginger*** · 07-06-2012 05:30 PM

Originally Posted by joe breezy

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BDO have been appointed as the liquidators and are on standby according to posts on Kerrydale Street

I'm sure ages ago someone here reported that an all staff email had gone round BDO asking if anyone had a conflict of interest??

BDO Address -- 55 Baker Street, London.

I think I'll dig out that old Gerry Rafferty classic for e few plays in the coming weeks.

***grunt*** · 07-06-2012 05:50 PM

alex thomson‏@alextomoRangers: time to make HMRC explain the delay in verdict on Big Tax Case. Onto them tomorrow.

***CropleyWasGod*** · 07-06-2012 06:02 PM

Originally Posted by Bajillions

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Is Dave King still active at Rangers? Or was he one of those that left after Whyte took over? If he is still actuve its very interesting that he would feel compelled to make these comments rather than just keeping schtum

He is the second largest shareholder .

IIRC he threatened legal action earlier in the process , for the same sum; and on the same basis, but against SDM rather than the club . I am curious as to why the change

***CropleyWasGod*** · 07-06-2012 06:06 PM

Originally Posted by jgl07

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What are the implications of this claim for a CVA?

One for CG or CWG I suspect?

I thought that legal actions against a club in admin weren't allowed . I must be wrong on that.

However , he has missed the deadline fir lodging a claim in the administration . . Maybe that's why he wants the CVA rejected ?

**ancient hibee** · 07-06-2012 06:10 PM

King,who has somehow stayed out of a South African jail is going to sue for fraud?

**Zondervan** · 07-06-2012 06:18 PM

The suggestion seems to be that BDO are the favoured liquidator of HMRC, therefore does this allude to HMRC not accepting the CVA?

Or in the words of China Crisis, is that just Wishful Thinking on my part?

***blackpoolhibs*** · 07-06-2012 06:21 PM

Originally Posted by Zondervan

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The suggestion seems to be that BDO are the favoured liquidator of HMRC, therefore does this allude to HMRC not accepting the CVA?

Or in the words of China Crisis, is that just Wishful Thinking on my part?

Thats what i was thinking too, we can only hope so?

**~~hibs0666~~** · 07-06-2012 06:29 PM

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

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I thought that legal actions against a club in admin weren't allowed . I must be wrong on that.

However , he has missed the deadline fir lodging a claim in the administration . . Maybe that's why he wants the CVA rejected ?

Think he was one of the 47 TBC's in the document.

**Onion** · 07-06-2012 06:48 PM

Originally Posted by Zondervan

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The suggestion seems to be that BDO are the favoured liquidator of HMRC, therefore does this allude to HMRC not accepting the CVA?

Or in the words of China Crisis, is that just Wishful Thinking on my part?

Looks like they're lining up their chess pieces. Understand they've insisted that BDO act as observers to the liquidation process which speaks volumes about their faith in D&P. Expect if D&P try anything sly like selling off the assets cheaply to their Rangers buddies, the tax man will hammer em

***Caversham Green*** · 07-06-2012 06:52 PM

Originally Posted by jgl07

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What are the implications of this claim for a CVA?

One for CG or CWG I suspect?

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

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He is the second largest shareholder .

IIRC he threatened legal action earlier in the process , for the same sum; and on the same basis, but against SDM rather than the club . I am curious as to why the change

My first reaction on seeing this news was to call stitch-up. Hows this for a conspiracy theory.

King's claim, if accepted, reduces HMRC's share of the debt to below the magic 25% (actually I don't think it does, but anyhow...). King has a Damascene moment and realises that Green is a good egg after all and votes through the CVA, getting £200k for every penny in the pound of dividend. Green gets his free football club and they all live happily ever after. The reason he's warning against huns buying ST's is that before the CVA the money could be claimed for part of the settlement, but after the CVA it all goes to the newly rich club. It's a gamble, but maybe it's the last throw of the dice and King doesn't really have a reputation to worry about anyway.

Seeing the strength of his comments this now seems unlikely, but who knows?

**joe breezy** · 07-06-2012 06:56 PM

For the legal eagles and accountants

Surely if they liquidise they have to sell the lot?
Yet from what I've heard the hun media are thinking Ipox stays and Govan Dodgers play there in red white and blue, no change really?

Which is correct? Any info appreciated

**jgl07** · 07-06-2012 07:02 PM

Originally Posted by joe breezy

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For the legal eagles and accountants

Surely if they liquidise they have to sell the lot?
Yet from what I've heard the hun media are thinking Ipox stays and Govan Dodgers play there in red white and blue, no change really?

Which is correct? Any info appreciated

Duff and Phelps seem to have done a sweetheart deal to sell the assets of Rangers Oldco to Sir Charles and the Green Knights for a knockdown price in the event that the CVA fails.

So when it comes to liquidation of the Oldco there will be nothing of value left.

***Bostonhibby*** · 07-06-2012 07:30 PM

Originally Posted by jgl07

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Are you kidding.

There are masonic organizations throughout the world.

They were traditionally quite strong in Switzerland especially in Protestant cantons.

The French revoution was largely organized by masonic organizations especially the Girondins (from Bordeaux) and the Jacobins.

Sorry, missed the smiley off, was being sarcy!

***McSwanky*** · 07-06-2012 08:06 PM

Insouciance. There's a word that'll have Chick Young and Jim Traynor scrambling for their dictionaries...

***GordonHFC*** · 07-06-2012 08:42 PM

Originally Posted by jgl07

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Duff and Phelps seem to have done a sweetheart deal to sell the assets of Rangers Oldco to Sir Charles and the Green Knights for a knockdown price in the event that the CVA fails.

So when it comes to liquidation of the Oldco there will be nothing of value left.

But surely it is down to the liquidators (BDO?) as to what happens to the assets and not D&P ?

***CropleyWasGod*** · 07-06-2012 08:48 PM

Originally Posted by hibs0666

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Think he was one of the 47 TBC's in the document.

Ah okay, ta.

The TBC probably means that D & P are still "adjudicating" his claim.

***CropleyWasGod*** · 07-06-2012 08:54 PM

Originally Posted by Caversham Green

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My first reaction on seeing this news was to call stitch-up. Hows this for a conspiracy theory.

King's claim, if accepted, reduces HMRC's share of the debt to below the magic 25% (actually I don't think it does, but anyhow...). King has a Damascene moment and realises that Green is a good egg after all and votes through the CVA, getting £200k for every penny in the pound of dividend. Green gets his free football club and they all live happily ever after. The reason he's warning against huns buying ST's is that before the CVA the money could be claimed for part of the settlement, but after the CVA it all goes to the newly rich club. It's a gamble, but maybe it's the last throw of the dice and King doesn't really have a reputation to worry about anyway.

Seeing the strength of his comments this now seems unlikely, but who knows?

Who knows, indeed. That's as likely a scenario as any for me, just now.

King's motives (and integrity) are really suspect for me. Why did he change the target of his action from SDM to RFC? If he really feels he has been "duped", SDM would be the correct target, no?

***CropleyWasGod*** · 07-06-2012 08:57 PM

Originally Posted by GordonHFC

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But surely it is down to the liquidators (BDO?) as to what happens to the assets and not D&P ?

If BDO are in as liquidators, it probably makes it more likely that any knock-down sale would be challenged.

**jgl07** · 08-06-2012 10:56 AM

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

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Who knows, indeed. That's as likely a scenario as any for me, just now.

King's motives (and integrity) are really suspect for me. Why did he change the target of his action from SDM to RFC? If he really feels he has been "duped", SDM would be the correct target, no?

King is not only calling for the CVA to be rejected but for Rangers fans to boycott season ticket sales.

He is arguing that the Green Knights sale will prove to be a rerun of the Craig Whyte takeover. There is no capital being injected into the club as the purchase price is in the form of a repayable loan at 8% interest. Hence any working capital will have to come from season ticket sales.

**Paisley Hibby** · 08-06-2012 11:18 AM

Originally Posted by jgl07

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King is not only calling for the CVA to be rejected but for Rangers fans to boycott season ticket sales.

He is arguing that the Green Knights sale will prove to be a rerun of the Craig Whyte takeover. There is no capital being injected into the club as the purchase price is in the form of a repayable loan at 8% interest. Hence any working capital will have to come from season ticket sales.

But if they pull it off that will give them a lot more working capital than any other Scottish Club (bar Sellik).

**JeMeSouviens** · 08-06-2012 11:26 AM

Encouraging ...

Jim Spence ‏@bbcjimspence

United chairman also says Scottish football can survive without Rangers and that he is in talks about a new deal for manager Peter Houston

Jim Spence ‏@bbcjimspence

Dundee United chairman Stephen Thompson believes clubs would not vote a Rangers Newco into SPL as things stand at present.

***Leithenhibby*** · 08-06-2012 11:30 AM

Originally Posted by jgl07

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King is not only calling for the CVA to be rejected but for Rangers fans to boycott season ticket sales.

He is arguing that the Green Knights sale will prove to be a rerun of the Craig Whyte takeover. There is no capital being injected into the club as the purchase price is in the form of a repayable loan at 8% interest. Hence any working capital will have to come from season ticket sales.

According to this headline he is - http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18360427

The next two weeks are going to be very tasty indeed.

**ancient hibee** · 08-06-2012 11:44 AM

King wants to sue Rangers-he is the second biggest shareholder so in effect he will be on both sides in any court case-makes sense.

**jgl07** · 08-06-2012 11:53 AM

Originally Posted by Paisley Hibby

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But if they pull it off that will give them a lot more working capital than any other Scottish Club (bar Sellik).

What after putting the cash into the CVA pot?

**Paisley Hibby** · 08-06-2012 12:12 PM

Originally Posted by jgl07

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What after putting the cash into the CVA pot?

I think so because the CVA cash is coming from a long term loan from Green's mob. It will then be manageable debt repaid over a long period at 8%? In other words, they would be in a much better financial position than most other Scottish clubs. But they need the creditors to bend over and take it first.