Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

[greenginger]

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If a NEWCO was formed it does not bear the debts of the oldco-after all that's the whole point.Therefore the idea that somehow a NEWCO would take on the sanctions earned by the oldco is unsustainable and would obviously lead to legal challenge which it will win.There is absolutely no way that a court will allow a NEWCO to be financially punished for something it has not done-apart from anything else there is the human rights position.Of course this could be part of the SPL plan to pretend that they are punishing Rangers when they will be doing nothing of the kind.

It could be part of the conditions governing the transfer of the SPL share from Old-Hun to New-CO Hun. They must also accept the sanctions that go with the share transfer.

On second thoughts its all to complicated, just relegate the bassa's down to the Sunday Church's 7 a-side league.

[Andy74]

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If a NEWCO was formed it does not bear the debts of the oldco-after all that's the whole point.Therefore the idea that somehow a NEWCO would take on the sanctions earned by the oldco is unsustainable and would obviously lead to legal challenge which it will win.There is absolutely no way that a court will allow a NEWCO to be financially punished for something it has not done-apart from anything else there is the human rights position.Of course this could be part of the SPL plan to pretend that they are punishing Rangers when they will be doing nothing of the kind.

In which case the other teams wouldn't vote them back in. There's nothing automatic about it.

I'm actually surprised that most people as seeing this as a negative, unless of course most had talked themsleves into the fact that Rangers would not be readmitted in any way.

The rest can still say no to voting them back if they like, even if they vote this stuff in for future.

[Caversham Green]

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In which case the other teams wouldn't vote them back in. There's nothing automatic about it.

I'm actually surprised that most people as seeing this as a negative, unless of course most had talked themsleves into the fact that Rangers would not be readmitted in any way.

The rest can still say no to voting them back if they like, even if they vote this stuff in for future.

It's all about trust Andy. The points you've been making are all valid, but this comes after a lengthy campaign of misinformation involving both the chairman and chief executive of the SPL as well as the press and Rangers FC.

We've had the CE claiming that the vote to reinstate RFC was down to the six-man board, one of whom has made it clear that finance overrules integrity in his view.

We've had the chairman trying to persuade the vast majority of clubs not to pursue the changes they proposed with the implication that their actions were damaging the commercial prospects of the league. It seems very convenient for him that these proposals are issued just as the 'rebels' were about to meet.

We've had Duff & Phelps and various others claiming that a CVA was a likely outcome when any sober analysis would view it as a remote possibility.

Duff & Phelps also claimed to be about to announce the preferred bidders when these proposals were issued. Is it convenient or inconvenient for them to claim that the goalposts have now moved? You'l have to make your own mind up but to me the timing stinks.

As you've been saying the mechanism is already in place for the removal of a liquidated Rangers from the SPL - indeed it's what would happen unless 11 clubs voted otherwise - that makes these proposals superfluous for the current circumstances unless they are specifically intended to save RFC's SPL status.

In short the SPL no longer has any credibility for the majority of non-OF supporters and that is why these proposals are viewed with suspicion.

[Seveno]

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I've supported Hibs for years and fully expected to die a Hibs fan, but when common sense, sporting integrity and fair-play are no longer relevant - and the rules can so clearly be "bought" by the OF & Sky TV - then time to draw a line. Why would ANYONE want to be associated with a corrupt sport ? Its one thing to suspect it, quite another for it to be laid out bare for all to see.

It appears that Vlad was right after all.

Have you written to the Board to express your view. We need to stop this before it happens, not go off in the sulk afterwards.

For what it is worth, I think that if there is one club that will vote against then it is Hibs. Let's give RP some ammunition though.

[blindsummit]

Apologies for posting this if it's already been done, but spotted this link on rangerstaxcase.com and it brilliantly sums up the situation IMHO.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...cottish-soccer

[Viva_Palmeiras]

What Churchill meant to say (not the dog kids...)
Neva in the field of football conflict
Has so much been written by so many regarding so few.

[andrew70]

Anyone watching this Mark Dingwall on Sky just now...a complete idiot of the highest order. Totally embarrassing and yet again the Huns are so ignorant to the cheating that they've overseen. Hope they rot in hell!

[greenginger]

I spoke to a local Jurno last week ( Stuart Bathgate ) about the interpretation of the SPL rules in relation to a New-Co being allowed back into the SPL by approval of the SPL Board. He was a bit unsure himself and said he would speak to Doncaster and call me back .
He called back the next day with Doncaster's interpretation of the SPL Rules and the reasoning why the Full SPL do not get a say in the New Rangers staying in the SPL.

The idea is Rangers 1872 can transfer their SPL share to the New Rangers even 5 minutes before actually being liquidised and that transfer can be approved by the SPL Board alone under Article 11.

This is obviously subverting the actual meaning of the Rules and I think the new proposals are meant to fall somewhere between Clause 11 with the Board's majority approving Ranger's SPL place and Clause 14 which required 10 Spl members to re-admit der Hun.

[Jim44]

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Apologies for posting this if it's already been done, but spotted this link on rangerstaxcase.com and it brilliantly sums up the situation IMHO.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...cottish-soccer

A great mug's guide to the Rangers' fiasco.

[thebakerboy]

The other thing I find strange RANGERS are against this as well (I reckon they thought they could just walk back in with no punishment) so it will only take one other SPL Club to vote against it (Celtic?) for it to be dumped. Got to think that the chairman at St. Johnstone and the guy at Dundee Utd. would not be up for this so maybe there is nothing to worry about. Wait a minute I also forgot but Mad Vlad and his rants , he will think this has proved him correct so maybe they might vote against it as well.

[Jim44]

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The other thing I find strange RANGERS are against this as well (I reckon they thought they could just walk back in with no punishment) so it will only take one other SPL Club to vote against it (Celtic?) for it to be dumped. Got to think that the chairman at St. Johnstone and the guy at Dundee Utd. would not be up for this so maybe there is nothing to worry about. Wait a minute I also forgot but Mad Vlad and his rants , he will think this has proved him correct so maybe they might vote against it as well.

.............................. God knows how Vlad would react to the proposals. For example, he might take personal umbrage at the bit about non-payment of players.

[Part/Time Supporter]

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Have you written to the Board to express your view. We need to stop this before it happens, not go off in the sulk afterwards.

For what it is worth, I think that if there is one club that will vote against then it is Hibs. Let's give RP some ammunition though.

Judging by their response to my email, they're already signed up to this cheat's charter.

[greenlex]

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What Churchill meant to say (not the dog kids...)
Neva in the field of football conflict
Has so much been written by so many regarding so few.

Oh Yes

[Ozyhibby]

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Judging by their response to my email, they're already signed up to this cheat's charter.

You willing to share?

[Part/Time Supporter]

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You willing to share?

I'd rather not quote directly, but the gist of it was basically that we should ignore the Rangers situation and back Hibs regardless. I hadn't even suggested that anyone should stop giving money to Hibs.

My problem really is that any endorsement of the newco concept is in complete contradiction of the values that Hibs have been adhering to for the last 10 years or so. All this prudence talk and using some of the transfer (and car park) income to pay down the debt level will have been a complete waste of time. Hibs should have spent >100% of their income on player wages, spent the transfer and car park income on transfer fees and achieved greater success on the pitch. Then whenever the **** hit the fan they could have formed a newco, and let HMRC and whoever else sing for the debts ran up by the old company.

[Hibs Class]

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I'd rather not quote directly, but the gist of it was basically that we should ignore the Rangers situation and back Hibs regardless. I hadn't even suggested that anyone should stop giving money to Hibs.

My problem really is that any endorsement of the newco concept is in complete contradiction of the values that Hibs have been adhering to for the last 10 years or so. All this prudence talk and using some of the transfer (and car park) income to pay down the debt level will have been a complete waste of time. Hibs should have spent >100% of their income on player wages, spent the transfer and car park income on transfer fees and achieved greater success on the pitch. Then whenever the **** hit the fan they could have formed a newco, and let HMRC and whoever else sing for the debts ran up by the old company.

I received something very similar - not attending matches and not renewing STs hurts only Hibs, but doesn't hurt Rangers, their supporters or any other club. Also tried to reassure that all SPL clubs want to do the right thing for the whole of Scottish football.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

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There are so many moral, legal and sporting imperatives that would be run roughshod over if they get back in it beggars belief.

This is why so many people would be willing to turn their backs on Scottish football methinks.

[PatHead]

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The other thing I find strange RANGERS are against this as well (I reckon they thought they could just walk back in with no punishment) so it will only take one other SPL Club to vote against it (Celtic?) for it to be dumped. Got to think that the chairman at St. Johnstone and the guy at Dundee Utd. would not be up for this so maybe there is nothing to worry about. Wait a minute I also forgot but Mad Vlad and his rants , he will think this has proved him correct so maybe they might vote against it as well.

The new chairman at ST J is in favour of the new proposals judging by St J fan's net site, so are their fans

[MrSmith]

Loved this from the Bleacher report:

"Rangers FC is in serious danger of being liquidated because they have lived beyond their means for far too long, in the process distorting the market in Scotland. It has abused the tax system to give itself an unfair sporting advantage over the rest of the clubs in the SPL. It has bought players from other clubs it could not afford to pay for and had no intention of ever paying for. And the Scottish sporting establishment, governing bodies and media, want everything possible to be done to facilitate Rangers, who have destroyed the sporting integrity of the Scottish game, escaping the consequences of their self-inflicted troubles."

[Cheshire Hibee]

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Have you written to the Board to express your view. We need to stop this before it happens, not go off in the sulk afterwards.

For what it is worth, I think that if there is one club that will vote against then it is Hibs. Let's give RP some ammunition though.

If we keep getting the response we have had so far to the site www.splsurvey.co.uk the idea is to send the results to all clubs so they can get a feel of what we the fans are thinking.

3075 responses so far in 7 hours plus a mention Reporting Scotland earlier tonight about the site and the fans response so if you know anyone on rival fans borads and can share the link then hopefully we can get more momentum.

[jgl07]

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I received something very similar - not attending matches and not renewing STs hurts only Hibs, but doesn't hurt Rangers, their supporters or any other club. Also tried to reassure that all SPL clubs want to do the right thing for the whole of Scottish football.

They miss the point.

The idea behind a (threatened) boycott is not to hurt Rangers but to send out a warning to Hibs that if they vote to readmit the cheating bassas they must bear the consequences.

This will take Scottish Football to a new low and discourage anyone from taking the SPL seriously. This will set a process in motion that will result in the effective demise of the league.

The SPL need to think long term and not chase every penny that they can extract from the bigot brothers in the short term.

If Rangers are liquidated; for the sake of the integrity of the SFL and the SPL they must start at the bottom.

[...WentToMowAnSPL]

My vote is to bin the SPL and go back to the SFA, the SPL have shown themselves to be commercially incopetent and unable to preserve sporting integrity. No way should the SPL allow themselves different rules to the rest of the SFA in my view - what's happened to Gretna should go for everyone

[GreenPJ]

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I'd rather not quote directly, but the gist of it was basically that we should ignore the Rangers situation and back Hibs regardless. I hadn't even suggested that anyone should stop giving money to Hibs.

My problem really is that any endorsement of the newco concept is in complete contradiction of the values that Hibs have been adhering to for the last 10 years or so. All this prudence talk and using some of the transfer (and car park) income to pay down the debt level will have been a complete waste of time. Hibs should have spent >100% of their income on player wages, spent the transfer and car parkp income on transfer fees and achieved greater success on the pitch. Then whenever the **** hit the fan they could have formed a newco, and let HMRC and whoever else sing for the debts ran up by the old company.

Two wrongs and all that.

[yeezus.]

Can't wait to see Rangers in Division 3 like they should be next season. Maybe then Stair Park will get some people turning up.

[Ozyhibby]

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I received something very similar - not attending matches and not renewing STs hurts only Hibs, but doesn't hurt Rangers, their supporters or any other club. Also tried to reassure that all SPL clubs want to do the right thing for the whole of Scottish football.

If that's the case the they can gtf as far as I'm concerned.

[grunt]

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I received something very similar - not attending matches and not renewing STs hurts only Hibs, but doesn't hurt Rangers, their supporters or any other club. Also tried to reassure that all SPL clubs want to do the right thing for the whole of Scottish football.

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If that's the case the they can gtf as far as I'm concerned.

The response from Hibs seems perfectly reasonable to me. They are saying that our fans should focus on and continue to support Hibs. What else would you expect them to say?

[grunt]

Unbelievable statement from Rangers Supporters Trust last night. A boycott - that'll certainly help their team get back on its feet! And what a poor show from the SPL in "reducing the stature of Scottish football as a whole". It's not like their own club would do anything like that.

"The board of the Rangers Supporters Trust, like other fans of the club, are not in the least surprised by the actions and timing of the SPL decision to vote on rule changes which has now further delayed a future takeover of Rangers. Given the severity of the possible sanctions, and their impact on any club who may also fall on hard times through mismanagement, it leaves us little option but to give serious consideration of calling for a boycott of away fixtures by Rangers fans next season; specifically targeting those clubs who have rushed through the proposals to punish our club with these excessive and draconian penalties.“We will discuss this in the near future with our sister organisations, the Rangers Supporters Association and Assembly, to maximise impact and collate ideas on how a boycott could be facilitated if deemed necessary.
“It may also be important to consider how these severe penalties, currently aimed at one club in particular, will impact future league and club sponsorship and have a secondary impact on all clubs, reducing the stature of Scottish football as a whole"

[StevieC]

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Unbelievable statement from Rangers Supporters Trust last night. A boycott - that'll certainly help their team get back on its feet! And what a poor show from the SPL in "reducing the stature of Scottish football as a whole". It's not like their own club would do anything like that.

A boycott would actually suit some of these guys, due to the stadia capacity and ticket availability in the 3rd division. Makes sense for the (slightly) more intelligent Trust guys to try and get the steal on tickets from the knuckle-draggers.

[ancienthibby]

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A boycott would actually suit some of these guys, due to the stadia capacity and ticket availability in the 3rd division. Makes sense for the (slightly) more intelligent Trust guys to try and get the steal on tickets from the knuckle-draggers.

Traynor

Been off in Ozland for his holidogs.

He's apparently seen the light!!

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/footbal...6908-23823231/

[JoeTortolanoFanClub]

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Unbelievable statement from Rangers Supporters Trust last night. A boycott - that'll certainly help their team get back on its feet! And what a poor show from the SPL in "reducing the stature of Scottish football as a whole". It's not like their own club would do anything like that.

Excellent. Just think of the money clubs will save on policing Rangers fans.