In season 2021/2022 what would disaster, average, excellence or glory look like?

Given the reaction to the Cup Final and the debate about Jack Ross I'm wondering what people feel the scenarios of disaster, average, excellence or glory would look like next season?

Perhaps something like:

Disaster:
Failure in Europe
Losing to Hearts
Playing 'meh' football
Bottom six form

Ross is out early in the season

Average:
Honourable failure in Europe (play well but don't make group)
Honours shared with Hearts
Entertaining football but inconsistent form
Top 6 form but heading outside of top 4

Ross stays but support still split

Excellent:
European group stage qualification
Dominating Hearts
Return to high tempo attacking football
Strong challenge for top 4

Support want Ron to give Ross bigger budget

Glory:
Competitive in European group stage and domestic cup win
Win all or most derbies
Goals aplenty, unearth new exciting prospects and fortress Easter Road
Top 3 finish

Ron can write his own contract

We finished 3rd this year, so that should be the target. 4th wouldn’t be the end of the world. 5th or 6th would be poor.

The absolute least we should expect next season is top 5 and at least a semi.


I think 3rd again and at 2 semi finals would be a successful season. Realistically 3rd is the best we can get barring a miracle and getting to a semi final puts you at 3rd/4th in the tournament. At the moment results come before performance for me as I'd like us to consistently finish at least 4th then we can work on our style of play from there

Should definitely be aiming for third again, fourth at the very least seeing as Hearts are rank and Aberdeen seem to have a rebuild on their hands. Can't see anyone else having the consistency to push for top four.

Most important thing for me is the style of football we play next year. Has to improve, especially with fans getting back.

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Originally Posted by One Day Soon

Given the reaction to the Cup Final and the debate about Jack Ross I'm wondering what people feel the scenarios of disaster, average, excellence or glory would look like next season?

Perhaps something like:

Disaster:
Failure in Europe
Losing to Hearts
Playing 'meh' football
Bottom six form

Ross is out early in the season

Average:
Honourable failure in Europe (play well but don't make group)
Honours shared with Hearts
Entertaining football but inconsistent form
Top 6 form but heading outside of top 4

Ross stays but support still split

Excellent:
European group stage qualification
Dominating Hearts
Return to high tempo attacking football
Strong challenge for top 4

Support want Ron to give Ross bigger budget

Glory:
Competitive in European group stage and domestic cup win
Win all or most derbies
Goals aplenty, unearth new exciting prospects and fortress Easter Road
Top 3 finish

Ron can write his own contract

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Apparently targets and expectations are determined once the season has finished not at the start.

Derbies are vital for Ross next year. He is already on dodgy ground in that respect, failure in them will truly have the knives out.

Disaster would be finishing behind the maroon relegation fodder and getting beat by them a few times. Finishing out of the top 4, papped out of Europe with a whimper and getting nowhere in the cups

I could see the return of the derby far enough to be honest. I haven't missed it one bit and even when we're winning them I hate all the baggage that goes with the fixture. However, there's not much I can do about that so what I would say is that it's imperative that we show we're up for those particular battles.

Top four in the league should most certainly be the target.

The cups? If we continue to reach the latter stages under Ross we're going to have to show we have more fire in our bellies. Nobody's going to fault him if we can see the team has given it their all.

Europe? Not expecting much there but a couple of ties where we peform creditably would be fine by me.

Establish third place, minimum semi finals in the cups.

Qualification for group stages of Europe would be a bonus.

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Originally Posted by matty_f

Establish third place, minimum semi finals in the cups.

Qualification for group stages of Europe would be a bonus.

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Wait, which category are you describing?

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Originally Posted by One Day Soon

Wait, which category are you describing?

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I’m leaving it vague so i can fit it to suit whatever point I’m trying to make this time next year. :greengrin

Ultimately, Aberdeen will still be, at best, in transition, assuming things don’t continue to be a bit of a mess under Glass and the incoming Brown. Hearts will presumably spend big again, not sure they’ll be all that great. St Johnstone could be good if they can keep their squad together.

Beyond that, everyone else looks no great shakes.

Therefore, third needs to be the expectation again.

Europe through our league position, and a good run in both cups.

The usual really.

Top 4. Semi in at least one cup. next round in Europe

It's very hard to define when you look across all 4 platforms we'll compete in I think. 20/21 on paper would have been good but ultimately felt a little disappointing at the end due to the missed opportunities.


No idea how many of our key players we'll still have going into the season but I imagine we'll be going in with a budget that's 5th biggest in the league - higher than 5th and we've done well.

Cups throw a spanner in the works though, avoid relegation and win a cup? That's good too.

Realistically for Europe we're probably looking at falling at the last or penultimate hurdle before group stages - preferably to a team that we'd expect to beat us rather than to an "upset".

The league will be harder for us next year. The mere inclusion of Hearts, whether they are pish or not, will add to the challenge for us to maintain our third place.

Everyone is in transition, including Hibs. We might well lose half our regular starting line up. Who can really say how replacing them will go?

For me the target should be third place in the League and decent runs in the cup.

Qualifying that decent runs in the cup part , depends on what happens in the respective tournaments. If we reach semi finals/finals and play a lower league side or one that sits well below below us in the League, I would hope we win. If we play one of the Old Firm, those expectations are naturally curbed.

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Originally Posted by He's here!

I could see the return of the derby far enough to be honest. I haven't missed it one bit and even when we're winning them I hate all the baggage that goes with the fixture. However, there's not much I can do about that so what I would say is that it's imperative that we show we're up for those particular battles.

Top four in the league should most certainly be the target.

The cups? If we continue to reach the latter stages under Ross we're going to have to show we have more fire in our bellies. Nobody's going to fault him if we can see the team has given it their all.

Europe? Not expecting much there but a couple of ties where we peform creditably would be fine by me.

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I'd taking winning the derbies over league position ( barring relegation ) how you can dismiss the biggest games in our season is baffling.

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Originally Posted by superfurryhibby

The league will be harder for us next year. The mere inclusion of Hearts, whether they are pish or not, will add to the challenge for us to maintain our third place.

Everyone is in transition, including Hibs. We might well lose half our regular starting line up. Who can really predict say how replacing them will go?

For me the target should be third place in the League and decent runs in the cup.

Qualifying that decent runs in the cup part , depends on what happens in the respective tournaments. If we reach semi finals/finals and play a lower league side or one that sits well below below us in the League, I would hope we win. If we play one of the Old Firm, those expectations are naturally curbed.

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This.

Throw in Europe and getting as far as possible without being put out by some absolute diddies.

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Originally Posted by danhibees1875

It's very hard to define when you look across all 4 platforms we'll compete in I think. 20/21 on paper would have been good but ultimately felt a little disappointing at the end due to the missed opportunities.


No idea how many of our key players we'll still have going into the season but I imagine we'll be going in with a budget that's 5th biggest in the league - higher than 5th and we've done well.

Cups throw a spanner in the works though, avoid relegation and win a cup? That's good too.

Realistically for Europe we're probably looking at falling at the last or penultimate hurdle before group stages - preferably to a team that we'd expect to beat us rather than to an "upset".

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I’m sure Budge said recently that Hearts will have to massively reign in their spending. Whether that happens remains to be seen but I’m not sure our budget will be lower than theirs.

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Originally Posted by calumhibee1

I’m sure Budge said recently that Hearts will have to massively reign in their spending. Whether that happens remains to be seen but I’m not sure our budget will be lower than theirs.

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Possibly, I'll work on the assumption that they won't though. They'll find a benefactor or 2 to plug the gaps and throw money at players to try to top us now that they're back.

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Originally Posted by Crunchie

I'd taking winning the derbies over league position ( barring relegation ) how you can dismiss the biggest games in our season is baffling.

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I understand the point because there's not much sweeter than a derby win, but don't think that would be a long term view of mine.

Lose derbies and finish 3rd Vs win derbies and finish 7th? I'd probably take the former.

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Originally Posted by danhibees1875

Possibly, I'll work on the assumption that they won't though. They'll find a benefactor or 2 to plug the gaps and throw money at players to try to top us now that they're back.



I understand the point because there's not much sweeter than a derby win, but don't think that would be a long term view of mine.

Lose derbies and finish 3rd Vs win derbies and finish 7th? I'd probably take the former.

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Given the 12 points at stake over the course of a season whilst playing Hearts and the possibility that they will be competing within the top six, coming out with at least six points from those games will probably go hand in hand with aspirations to finish third.

Disaster: Anything not listed below
Bare minimum: 5th place, at least one semi final, equal record against Hearts
Good: 4th place, at least semi final in both cups (and no defeats in the cup to a team other than the OF/Aberdeen/Hearts), winning record against Hearts
Great: 3rd place, at least one final (and no defeats in the cup to a team other than the OF/Aberdeen/Hearts), unbeaten against Hearts

Why is reaching the semi finals of a cup a target for some people? In a cup competition, the target should be to win them. We had what some would call "a good run in the cups" this season, but it wasn't a success at all? It was a disgrace what Hibs produced at Hampden.

Top 4 and winning a cup would be great.
Top 4 and no cup is what we should at LEAST expect (although Ross should be going all out in the cups to make up for this season)

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Originally Posted by Steve20

Why is reaching the semi finals of a cup a target for some people? In a cup competition, the target should be to win them. We had what some would call "a good run in the cups" this season, but it wasn't a success at all? It was a disgrace what Hibs produced at Hampden.

Top 4 and winning a cup would be great.
Top 4 and no cup is what we should at LEAST expect (although Ross should be going all out in the cups to make up for this season)

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It’s something tangible I suppose but it’s a fair point.

Top 4 and Winning a Cup

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Originally Posted by Steve20

Why is reaching the semi finals of a cup a target for some people? In a cup competition, the target should be to win them. We had what some would call "a good run in the cups" this season, but it wasn't a success at all? It was a disgrace what Hibs produced at Hampden.

Top 4 and winning a cup would be great.
Top 4 and no cup is what we should at LEAST expect (although Ross should be going all out in the cups to make up for this season)

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We are at Hampden virtually every season now.

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Originally Posted by Steve20

Why is reaching the semi finals of a cup a target for some people? In a cup competition, the target should be to win them. We had what some would call "a good run in the cups" this season, but it wasn't a success at all? It was a disgrace what Hibs produced at Hampden.

Top 4 and winning a cup would be great.
Top 4 and no cup is what we should at LEAST expect (although Ross should be going all out in the cups to make up for this season)

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I think setting targets for cup competitions is a bit iffy to be honest. We could be drawn against Celtic in R4, Rangers in R5 or we could be drawn against teams like e.g. Brora in R4 and Alloa in R5. We could theoretically win the thing never playing a Premiership team, or we could get pumped out at first time of asking by an Old Firm team at the top of their game.

The League remains the best way of showing where we are at. Like it or not, luck has a big bearing on how we do in the cups.

I'd be disappointed if we're not at the very least challenging for 3rd place again. I can't see any reason why we shouldn't finish 3rd, there's nobody good enough or consistent enough by this years' showings to trouble us greatly.

Europe: If we get a tie against someone decent and are allowed some fans in the stadium, I think that's success enough for me. I don't expect us to get to the group stages of EL or ECL, to do so would be a major achievement now.

As for the cups? A bonus. Replicating this season's record of 2 x semi finals and a final would be quite an achievement!! :greengrin

3rd would be great & keep knocking at the door with the cups. In Europe give a good display of ourselves, really depends on the draw for that. If we can continue to do as planned improving the squad Ive no reason to think we will have another successful season.

Folk keep mentioning Hearts coming up...So what? I think they will do well do make top 6.

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Originally Posted by Steve20

Why is reaching the semi finals of a cup a target for some people? In a cup competition, the target should be to win them. We had what some would call "a good run in the cups" this season, but it wasn't a success at all? It was a disgrace what Hibs produced at Hampden.

Top 4 and winning a cup would be great.
Top 4 and no cup is what we should at LEAST expect (although Ross should be going all out in the cups to make up for this season)

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Think you need to think about the difference between a minimum target and a stretch target/target.

Hibs will aim for minimum semi-final but that doesn’t change the fact that the target is to win the competition.

Only one team per competition can win it, appreciating that there’s significantly more chance of not winning it than winning it, giving yourself a minimum expectation keeps the goal achievable and realistic.

We want to win the league at the start of the season, but you know that’s unlikely so you set a minimum that would be considered acceptable.


Otherwise we’d be raging that we haven’t won the league, Europa Conference, Scottish Cup, League Cup etc.

The targets need to be grounded in some form of reality, it’s not saying “let’s consider it job done if we reach the semi”, but it’s saying we would expect to get at least that far.

I'm about to move up north, so I'd like 2x wins at Ross County to be a kpi, please. :aok:

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Originally Posted by Steve20

Why is reaching the semi finals of a cup a target for some people? In a cup competition, the target should be to win them. We had what some would call "a good run in the cups" this season, but it wasn't a success at all? It was a disgrace what Hibs produced at Hampden.

Top 4 and winning a cup would be great.
Top 4 and no cup is what we should at LEAST expect (although Ross should be going all out in the cups to make up for this season)

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Whether it's the club or the fans, the target going into the group stages of the league cup will be to qualify as well as possible and the target going into any knockout cup tie is always going to be to win it. By extension, the target every time we enter a cup competition is to win it and sort of goes without saying

However, people obviously know that we won't win every cup competition we enter and will view getting to the semis as decent.

I’d reckon anything less than we achieved this season would be regression (obviously) so we’ve got a tough act to follow

If we can somehow find our way to the group stages of the conference league then I’m happy to accept top 4/5 in the league as Thursday and Sunday would be hard going for us into December.

In terms of cup competitions it really depends who we draw. If you get to a semi final and faced with the same scenario as this season, a cup win is an absolute must. Doubtful neither of the old firm won’t be involved this time round though.

This summer could either see a big turnover of players depending on who’s sold or 3 or 4 signings on top of what we already have. Massive summer for us.

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Originally Posted by ScottB;6580375[B

]Ultimately, Aberdeen will still be, at best, in transition[/B], assuming things don’t continue to be a bit of a mess under Glass and the incoming Brown. Hearts will presumably spend big again, not sure they’ll be all that great. St Johnstone could be good if they can keep their squad together.

Beyond that, everyone else looks no great shakes.

Therefore, third needs to be the expectation again.

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That applies pretty much to Hibs as well, depending on how many wannabees leave us.

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Originally Posted by Dalianwanda

3rd would be great & keep knocking at the door with the cups. In Europe give a good display of ourselves, really depends on the draw for that. If we can continue to do as planned improving the squad Ive no reason to think we will have another successful season.

Folk keep mentioning Hearts coming up...So what? I think they will do well do make top 6.

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Yes, but the fact is that we seem to drop points to them no matter how gash they are. That in my view makes the league more of a challenge for us next season in itself?

Disaster - bottom six
Average -4th/5th
Excellent - 3rd and a cup

Hearts are an irrelevance and will finish below Hibs regardless

Win the league and both cups combined with at least the quarters in Europe would be a disappointment.

Have to be in at least the semis.

Sign a few sexy and crazy Yugoslavian players and some 4-4 draws with Dundee

To be honest. Top 4 in the leagues and challenging in the cups should be seen as a success, remembering where we have come from.

This year just feels bad because at one point, we were the favourites in both cups and let it slip

As things stand i would confidently predict that we would finish 3rd in the league with progress in the cups and Europe dictated by the luck of the draw almost as much as performances. However, as we all know it is impossible to make a measured prediction until transfer ins and out are all but done for both us and our main rivals. Aberdeen have begun a significant rebuild but have a way to go to match us and as ever in recent years we don't know what Hearts are up to but as things stand they will continue to pay £50k a month to Naysmith & Damour for little return and like Aberdeen their manager seems no great shakes.

We need another striker and a centre half minimum with other quality players required if we sell current starters.
Irvine is the only current players out of contract that we want to keep with Marciano already replaced by Macey and Stephen McGinn's contract at an end and not being renewed.
Accordingly what happens with all other current Hibs players is in the clubs gift to do as they see fit with the possible exception of Boyle if there is, as we think, a buy out clause in the region of £500k.

As ever support the team, enjoy the journey as best you can and let's see where we end up.

Couldn't really care less about Hearts compared to making the group stages and finishing 3rd again.

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Originally Posted by lyonhibs

Couldn't really care less about Hearts compared to making the group stages and finishing 3rd again.

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snap

Surely cup runs are determined to a degree on the draw you get? People saying at least a semi final, yet if we were to get the same run as this year, ultimately it would be another failure just getting to a semi or beat in the final. Yet if we were to get either of the OF away in the first round, although we could beat them, I’d take a lot more comfort going out at that stage than having to go through the gutless performance of last weekend again.

On paper, last season was probably the 4th best season out of 50 that I experienced as a Hibs supporter (excluding the 3 seasons we won a cup).

If someone offered the chance to match this next season with 3rd place, 1 semi, 1 final, you’d have to take it.

In reality, a top 5 finish should be the least we expect. Top 4 is a good season. Top 3 is a fantastic season again.

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Originally Posted by lyonhibs

Couldn't really care less about Hearts compared to making the group stages and finishing 3rd again.

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Let's see how much you care when the derby comes around.
What's the obsession with finishing 3rd? it gets you some extra cash to maybe finish 3rd again?
Finishing 3rd wins you nothing, nor does making the group stages of a competition we've as much chance of winning as flying to the moon on a milky way wrapper.
Give me wins in the derby and a cup win and I'll take finishing bottom 6 every season ( as long as they're in the bottom 6 with us :greengrin )

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Originally Posted by lyonhibs

Couldn't really care less about Hearts compared to making the group stages and finishing 3rd again.

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Ditto. I’ll take them beating us in a derby if we can finish 3rd again. I find it very weird that some people would happily be mid table as long as we can beat one team. It’s just a weird obsession and as a team we should be above that. Let them base their whole existence around one team.

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Originally Posted by Brightside

Ditto. I’ll take them beating us in a derby if we can finish 3rd again. I find it very weird that some people would happily be mid table as long as we can beat one team. It’s just a weird obsession and as a team we should be above that. Let them base their whole existence around one team.

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As opposed to your whole existence around one player? :na na:. Ask the Aberdeen fans if finishing third is all it's cracked up to be, they've done it often enough. I'd love to be 1st, no one remembers who was 2nd 3rd or 8th for that matter.
As for your weird, I don't base my existence around any football team, including Hibs. It's a lighthearted fans forum about opinions. Mine is I'd rather win the derbies than finish 3rd.

Finishing 3rd would be considered a realistic best of the rest, 4th or 5th would be considered acceptable, 6th or worse would be very disappointing. The cup runs are a lottery and in both cases consistently decent results and performances would revitalise the club all round after the potentially damaging failures of the two lost semi finals and a final.
We also need a few inspirational players notably a leader, a creative midfielder and a solid and experienced centre back. There has to be a better balance to the team and a less one dimensional style of play and a rethink on going through the season with a streamlined squad which at times incorporated a decimated bench with few options in the way of changing games.

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Originally Posted by Crunchie

As opposed to your whole existence around one player? :na na:. Ask the Aberdeen fans if finishing third is all it's cracked up to be, they've done it often enough. I'd love to be 1st, no one remembers who was 2nd 3rd or 8th for that matter.
As for your weird, I don't base my existence around any football team, including Hibs. It's a lighthearted fans forum about opinions. Mine is I'd rather win the derbies than finish 3rd.

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That kind of attitude hasn’t really worked for hearts all that well since they’ve been on a level playing field financially

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Originally Posted by Crunchie

As opposed to your whole existence around one player? :na na:. Ask the Aberdeen fans if finishing third is all it's cracked up to be, they've done it often enough. I'd love to be 1st, no one remembers who was 2nd 3rd or 8th for that matter.
As for your weird, I don't base my existence around any football team, including Hibs. It's a lighthearted fans forum about opinions. Mine is I'd rather win the derbies than finish 3rd.

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To the extent that you'd rather finish 10th and win 2 or 3 derbies a season? That feels to me like the kind of mentality that got Hearts relegated.

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Originally Posted by Jones28

To the extent that you'd rather finish 10th and win 2 or 3 derbies a season? That feels to me like the kind of mentality that got Hearts relegated.

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What was the kind of attitude that got us relegated then? The ambition to finish 3rd? I want us to finish as high as possible and win all derbies, what Hibs fan doesn't? Will you be wearing a we finished 3rd t-shirt in the summer? I doubt it.

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Originally Posted by Crunchie

What was the kind of attitude that got us relegated then? The ambition to finish 3rd? I want us to finish as high as possible and win all derbies, what Hibs fan doesn't? Will you be wearing a we finished 3rd t-shirt in the summer? I doubt it.

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It was pure incompetence and shockingly poor man-management that got us relegated.

I won't be wearing football shirts this summer, I'll be sporting lots of deep cut vests with short shorts, as I'm a prick.

You said you would rather win derbies than finish 3rd, I'm saying that the results Hearts had 2 seasons ago would suggest that was the kind of mentality they had that saw them go down. I would take a 3rd place finish over a 100% derby record every day of the week.

It's a bit of a moot point because we will more than likely finish above hearts and win 1 or 2, lose 1 or 2.

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Originally Posted by lyonhibs

Couldn't really care less about Hearts compared to making the group stages and finishing 3rd again.

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Yup. Hearts get themselves relegated so often because they only care about Hibs. Will be the same next season. Rather we concentrated on the bigger picture than that wee yoyo club.

A lot of folk have set the bar as being one of our most successful seasons ever. People need to realise where we have been past 20 years.

A top 4 finish should be our goal again, with third a great result and a cup an utterly magnificent result.

Finishing 3rd is our equivalent of winning the league.
The 2 teams above purchase their places in advance.

The other 10 teams ignore them and scrap it out all season for the title.
This season our team have won it. Hopefully we can fight of our rivals again next season and win our league for the 2nd season in a row which would be the 1st time since I don't know when.
The teams who take part should produce a trophy to present to the winner in a grand ceremony as an annual two finger salute to the old firm.

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Originally Posted by Since452

Disaster - bottom six
Average -4th/5th
Excellent - 3rd and a cup

Hearts are an irrelevance and will finish below Hibs regardless

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I agree Hearts will finish below us but I'm afraid that hasn't stopped them beating us in the past.

Next season we need to kick on imo. Many fans were saying after 2016 that the monkey was off our back and we'd be seeing a new dawn at Hibs. Ron has talked very well about the opportunities and expectations. I'd truly love to see that become more than talk.

Apart from the OF, no other club in Scotland is in a better place than us going into next season.

I'd like to see us put on a good show in Europe and the cups. What I mean by that is if/when we go out, ensure its to a quality team and that we have given our all.

We should be using the turmoil at Aberdeen and Hearts to cement out position in 3rd, with 4th also a good placing.

Above this, I want to see us playing good football consistently. We've had patches but more often I've found us tough to watch this year.

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Originally Posted by neil7908

I agree Hearts will finish below us but I'm afraid that hasn't stopped them beating us in the past.

Next season we need to kick on imo. Many fans were saying after 2016 that the monkey was off our back and we'd be seeing a new dawn at Hibs. Ron has talked very well about the opportunities and expectations. I'd truly love to see that become more than talk.

Apart from the OF, no other club in Scotland is in a better place than us going into next season.

I'd like to see us put on a good show in Europe and the cups. What I mean by that is if/when we go out, ensure its to a quality team and that we have given our all.

We should be using the turmoil at Aberdeen and Hearts to cement out position in 3rd, with 4th also a good placing.

Above this, I want to see us playing good football consistently. We've had patches but more often I've found us tough to watch this year.

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Fully expect them to beat us 2 or 3 times next season but nowhere near us in the league. They'd be happy with that.

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Originally Posted by CMurdoch

Finishing 3rd is our equivalent of winning the league.
The 2 teams above purchase their places in advance.

The other 10 teams ignore them and scrap it out all season for the title.
This season our team have won it. Hopefully we can fight of our rivals again next season and win our league for the 2nd season in a row which would be the 1st time since I don't know when.
The teams who take part should produce a trophy to present to the winner in a grand ceremony as an annual two finger salute to the old firm.

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We won the square root of nothing, finishing second would be considered a fantastic season but it still wins you nothing. Finishing 3rd? that would be great too but let's not kid ourselves it wins you anything. what a bizarre post, and that's coming from someone famous for them :greengrin

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Originally Posted by Since452

Fully expect them to beat us 2 or 3 times next season but nowhere near us in the league. They'd be happy with that.

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They might be but I wouldn’t.

If we lost two or three times to them, that would be a big spanner in the works in terms of a high league finish.

How many points did we take from mid table sides , like Livi, Dundee Utd or St Johnstone....:wink: It would be interesting to see a breakdown of the points gained from all teams last season. Hibs will have surely taken more points than they lost against all teams , apart from Rangers, Celtic and St Johnstone. IIRC, we shared the spoils with the Sheep.

In order to finish third again, we would need to repeat that consistency level in terms of taking points. Surrendering a hypothetical 6-9 points to Hearts will not really assist a strong league campaign. Surely our manager will be able to find a strategy for ensuring the team perform against our key rivals?

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Originally Posted by Crunchie

We won the square root of nothing, finishing second would be considered a fantastic season but it still wins you nothing. Finishing 3rd? that would be great too but let's not kid ourselves it wins you anything. what a bizarre post, and that's coming from someone famous for them :greengrin

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It wins you a place in Europe? Gives you the chance to compete in a European competition. Find yourself having a good run in that and reaching group stage stuff can guarantee you up to £3m that’s already been discussed

Give me that over 2/3 wins vs hearts and a mid table finish.

That doesn’t mean I’m happy with them beating us every game but there’s no reason we can’t do both.

A bizarre take that you aren’t fussed about us finishing 3rd because it “wins you nothing”. What does beating hearts win you in the grand scheme of things? Bragging rights? Meh, give me European football over bragging rights.

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Originally Posted by Brightside

Ditto. I’ll take them beating us in a derby if we can finish 3rd again. I find it very weird that some people would happily be mid table as long as we can beat one team. It’s just a weird obsession and as a team we should be above that. Let them base their whole existence around one team.

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they’ve never been mutually exclusive.

beating them 3 or 4 times, as well as being incredibly satisfying and enjoyable, will go a long way towards getting us the league position we all want. Let’s just f***ing do them this time!

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Originally Posted by Pagan Hibernia

they’ve never been mutually exclusive.

beating them 3 or 4 times, as well as being incredibly satisfying and enjoyable, will go a long way towards getting us the league position we all want. Let’s just f***ing do them this time!

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For the purposes of the hypothetical question being asked they are mutually exclusive.

Of course it increases our chances of third if we also beat them 3/4 times, but it's not really a good question: "do you want to beat hearts and finish high up the league, or lose and finish lower?". :greengrin

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Originally Posted by danhibees1875

For the purposes of the hypothetical question being asked they are mutually exclusive.

Of course it increases our chances of third if we also beat them 3/4 times, but it's not really a good question: "do you want to beat hearts and finish high up the league, or lose and finish lower?". :greengrin

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:agree: I know mate but I was just making the point that I am obsessed with beating them and I don’t find anything at all “weird” about that. As well as wanting us to finish top 3 obviously.

they’ve had a laugh at our expense far far far too often and I want to properly rub their noses in it while they are pish.

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Originally Posted by Pagan Hibernia

they’ve never been mutually exclusive.

beating them 3 or 4 times, as well as being incredibly satisfying and enjoyable, will go a long way towards getting us the league position we all want. Let’s just f***ing do them this time!

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But being happy to be in the bottom half of the league as long as we beat Hearts in the Derby is very weird behavior. Thats a really **** season for us.

Disaster = avoiding relegation, being knocked out of a cup or Europe by a team with a fraction of our budget.

Average = finishing 5th to 7th, the semi of one cup and quarters of the other, two/three rounds in Europe.

Excellence = 3rd or 4th (qualifying for Europe), a semi and a final for the domestic cups, reach the European group stages.

Glory = finishing second (ahead of a big spending ugly Sister), winning a cup final, reach the European knock out stages.

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Originally Posted by Pagan Hibernia

:agree: I know mate but I was just making the point that I am obsessed with beating them and I don’t find anything at all “weird” about that. As well as wanting us to finish top 3 obviously.

they’ve had a laugh at our expense far far far too often and I want to properly rub their noses in it while they are pish.

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I agree, I think calling it weird is weird :greengrin

Think it’s going to be difficult to be 3rd get to a semi final and final of the cups next season. You never know but the cup draws would need to be kind to us. Other than the money it doesn’t matter if you are 3rd or 4th although 3rd would be nice. For me minimum semi finals and hopefully win one of the cups every 3 or 4 years would be realistic.

Top 4, a decent cup run and decent European performances will always be deemed to be a decent season based on our most recent history, throw in a cup every few years and the vast majority of the hibs support would be kept happy. We had a very unique set of circumstances this year which clearly upgraded all our targets for the year, Jack will probably now be wishing we got put out in the early stages and he’d be dining out on an excellent 3rd place finish in the league.