Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
totally agree :agree:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
totally agree :agree:
Quote:
Originally Posted by lapsedhibee
After being criticised for making a trans joke at a drunken party.
https://www.outsports.com/2022/3/30/...uk-transphobia
History is being made on the football pitch today. 👍
They are playing against men good on them, hope they winQuote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
I think they are playing the women's team. Dulwich hamlets team are semi professional and the TRUK team are playing their first ever game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
**** sake. The picture of the woman in the article, why would she want to be up against a girl. With east of Scotland team we played Scotland girls a few ages above. It was rubbish because none of us were going to tackle a girl hard. We were also just clearly faster it was pointlessQuote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
Sexist/chivalrous pig.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
https://www.pitchero.com/clubs/dulwichhamlet/news/dhfcw-take-on-trans-radio-at-champion-hill-2691311.htmlQuote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
More information on the game.
You need a certain anger or bite to be a good defender. Your just no right if you can use that against a female you're genetically stronger than. Some of them were better footballers than us, but strength and speed is too big a barrierQuote:
Originally Posted by lapsedhibee
My son plays youth footy and there is a girl his age who he has played against a number of times over the years. They both play centre mid so tend to be directly against each other. She is a fantastic footballer and regularly bested him over the years. However, the last time they played was at the beginning of u14 season and it was clear to see that they wouldn’t be playing again as he bullied her that day and she couldn’t get close to him. She has an excellent future ahead of her in the woman’s game and I’ll be surprised if she doesn’t end up playing for Scotland. My son won’t get anywhere near the professional ranks. The minute he hit puberty, he had huge advantages which were too much for her to overcome despite her being a superior player.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
https://youtu.be/stnesecG00s
Some of the difficulties and costs of transitioning.
Hardly a surprise.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-60947028.amp
Now relented a bit. But still no ban on CT for trans people.Quote:
Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod
Well done to him (possibly soon to be her) for going public. I read he was blackmailed by somebody about this matter not so long ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
He's married with two children. I can't imagine coming to terms with something like that; one can only wonder what's going through the mind of his children. Good luck to all of them, during their difficult journey.
It's also significant that the first trans MP should be a Tory. I have noticed lately that transgenderism was being used by the right as their new culture wars issue: asking Labour politicians to define a woman etc. The Tories thought they could exploit another minority group, whip up public hostility against them and thus entice some of the public into voting against their own best interests. It's the old divide and rule strategy. Entirely cynical on their part, but a convenient distraction from their many scandals. So, how will they play it now? Jamie Wallis has put a spanner in their works with his announcement, and how will his constituents react? Many Tory voters won't be happy with him.
Could they not just throw him out of the party? For being inconvenient, like Dominic Grieve etc. :dunno:Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
You sure about this? Conservatives were pretty quick with gay marriage etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
To suggest that Conservative voters won't be happy with this is pretty insulting.
If people have gender issues, they probably predate any political thoughts by years. Jamie Wallis probably wouldn't have joined the Conservative party if what you say is true.
I've nothing to back this up, but I'd imagine there are just as many trans people vote Conservative as vote Labour / SNP / Greens etc.
I really don't see the connection between who someone votes for and their gender / sexuality.
https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.ne...summary-01.pngQuote:
Originally Posted by WhileTheChief..
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics...sgender-rights
Going right back to prehistory and the 1967 bill which decriminalised homosexuality, and arguably kicked off all modern equality legislation, "Both the major parties permitted a conscience vote. Labour and Liberal members were mostly in favour, while Conservative members were mostly opposed." (Thatcher voted for the bill though.)Quote:
Originally Posted by WhileTheChief..
I’ve tried, but I don’t understand this.Quote:
Originally Posted by CapitalGreen
It suggests that there is a correlation between one's political beliefs and one's attitudes towards trans issues.Quote:
Originally Posted by WhileTheChief..
For example, those who identify as Tories disagree with almost every statement put to them.
Britain and women surprisingly against quite a lot. No surprise everyone against trans women playing female sports and most against them using women's changing rooms
It's anecdotal of course, but if one is a conservative (lower case c) then by definition that person is less likely to support progressive change. The right wing media is certainly less welcoming of minority groups of all kinds, be they ethnic minorities, immigrants, LGBT etc. The Conservative Party has a history of appealing to people's fears and prejudices against minority groups. Just look at the current government's latest immigration and asylum Bill, led by asylum seeker Priti Patel! They scaremongered against gay men in the 1980s via the infamous 'Section 18' clause in an Education Act. They have demonised unmarried mothers and welfare claimants; then look at the ridiculous xenophobia during the Brexit referendum. There are so many historical examples of their appeals to the mob, and recently they have been angling against transgenders via their fixation upon defining a woman, in an attempt to demean a vulnerable group. They know it's a tactic that works.Quote:
Originally Posted by WhileTheChief..
Yeah, but take the very last statement as an example.Quote:
Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod
What’s your view if you’re a 70 year old Labour voter? :confused:
As a 50 year old Conservative who voted to leave, I agree with pretty much every statement in the list! Now I’m even more confused!
I think it's up to women if trans women should use changing rooms, if some don't want penises in their that should surely be respected
Not sure why you're confused. It's an opinion poll, canvassing the views of 1688 people. It's not going to accurately reflect the views of absolutely everybody in the country.Quote:
Originally Posted by WhileTheChief..
Also, the red crosses don't signify "everybody" in that category. They signify a majority.
So you are in the minority. 😉
I'm straying off topic here, but why do so many people from ethnic minorities vote Conservative?Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
Why are there Conservative MPs with ethnic backgrounds?
This just doesn't add up. I think you're vastly overstating things here or equating the 'right wing media' with the Conservative party.
Ruth Davidson, for example, was hugely popular. Her sexuality didn't do her any harm at all.
Like all you gov polls it's an average of people who actually go online and fill yougov polls.Quote:
Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod
I'm reminded of the John Stuart Mill quote that not all conservatives are stupid, but all stupid people are conservative :greengrin. Similarly, not all conservatives are reactionary (you aren't) but all reactionaries are conservative, hence the name of the party is 'Conservative', a word meaning defending the existing order. That inevitably means prejudice against those outside the mainstream will be more common on the right; when taken to extremes we arrive at the far right.Quote:
Originally Posted by WhileTheChief..
I wouldn't know why some minorities vote for a party that is at best ambivalent, and at worst hostile to them. Perhaps economic self-interest is a motivation? Those who believe in solidarity don't vote Tory, after all. It isn't a catch all - there are anomalies - but the Tories have a history of distracting voters away from their own wellbeing by scapegoating minority groups. I think they (some Tory politicians and their pals in the media) have been weaponising the trans issue recently, yet now one of their own MPs has announced he is transsexual, which will, hopefully, make them more sensitive in their tone. I think it might pull the rug from under the Tory right.
Yep - and that takes a certain type of person.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
Going by that poll it clearly takes all typesQuote:
Originally Posted by Mcbizz1998
A lot of the main players in the defending women's rights camp are left wing and also lesbian.Quote:
Originally Posted by WhileTheChief..
The discussion and debate around this has become a political football from those it suits to present it as such but the reality is there's cross party alignments involved regardless of viewpoint especially on the women's rights side.
This Tory MP has been reported as being involved in a lot of dodgy business related stuff including having the Ministry of Justice banning his company from taking clients. He was reported as being owner of a business called Sugar Daddy that pimped out young students to older men in business transactions to pay their student fees. He has also recently been charged with leaving the scene of an accident after his car was found wrapped round an inanimate object.
Acceptance without exception is a trans ally principle that up until this point seems to have been very much the case but its interesting to note some more notable campaigners are questioning Wallis' position and integrity including the likes of the very vocal LGBTQIA+ campaigner Peter Tatchell.
It's sad Wallis' family are forgotten in all of this - 2 daughters and a wife who must have had their world turned upside down.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhileTheChief..
I don't think it means that 100% of Conservative voters are against all the issues stated. Presumably it's a majority of those asked their views.
I think broadly most people will agree with more rights for trans people, but with caveats. It's clear people don't want trans women playing female sports. And most women or certainly a big percentage don't want them in changing rooms. Surely that's a good push forward compared to where we were 20 years ago.
We could push businesses to have a few unisex changing cubicles, like we did for needing disabled toilets in premises
Quote:
Originally Posted by LewysGot2
1 - I agree with this, but I think that, as usual, it's prominent right wingers, both inside and outside the political system who are trying to politicise it, as part of their perpetual 'culture wars' tactic of sowing division. They are trying to exploit it to win votes, just as they have in the past in relation to other minority groups.
2 - I have no idea but these things, but it's separate from his transgenderism. He might well be a terrible person (he's a Tory MP after all :wink:) but it isn't relevant to his recent announcement.
3 - That's exactly what I said above. His family must be in turmoil just now, trying to come to terms with it all.
There's been a few items (from commentators on the left) suggesting that the announcement might well be linked to him potentially being in enough bother to get the jail. It wouldn't be the first time a Tory MP made one headline gaining announcement or leak to take the heat off something else. I'm not saying this is absolutely the case here but it's not completely unthinkable.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
He's not changing his presentation, he's not starting any treatment and he's keeping his pronouns as he/him. Which was why I mentioned the trans rights allies usual belief of acceptance without exceptions is being tested at present. Some very vocal trans allies on the left aren't buying it.
That’s a sweeping generalisation of the very crudest kind.Quote:
Originally Posted by LewysGot2
Quote:
Originally Posted by superfurryhibby
TBF, he/she/they said 'A lot...', not 'most' or 'all'.
Is it?Quote:
Originally Posted by superfurryhibby
I'm saying that a number of the key people on the "women's rights" end of the debate are not Conservative and some are LGBT. Like Joanna Cherry and Allison Bailey. And others.
Allison Bailey is suing Stonewall just now. She's (from her own biography) worked in the Mission District, in San Francisco, California; the epicentre of gay and radical left political activism, respectively, at the height of the AIDS epidemic.
She did voluntary work as a left wing Black British woman working with African-American women on a local level to provide advocacy, community support and friendship to other black women, straight and LGB, facing social, health and income inequality in the San Francisco Bay Area. She's no right winger.
My comment wasn't intended as a generalisation and simply a counter to the right wing v left wing assertions. I'm saying that there is cross party, cross politics at play in this single issue. Its not Trans Rights Left, Women's rights, erm, right.
In effect challenging the generalisations...
Indeed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith_M
That's why JK Rowling is such a straight bat in all this. Somebody of no fixed political persuasion, prepared to take politicians of all colours to task - as well as being so successful as to be untouchable by the cancel culture heidbangers.Quote:
Originally Posted by LewysGot2
She's pretty much the only one who cuts to the chase on this issue (unlike the tongue-tied efforts if Starmer & co last week) ie just because you happen to believe that biology can't be ignored doesn't make you a bigot.
No fixed political persuasion? J.K. Rowling? [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]Quote:
Originally Posted by He's here!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
A good friend of Gordon Brown sure and (I think) a donator to the Labour Party in the past, but scathing lately about Starmer and as anti-Corbyn as she is the Tories. Anti-independence, but then so are (at least) half the Scottish population. What I mean is you can't really pin her down as wedded unflinchingly to one particular political brand.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozyhibby
Equality and human rights commission issues update on single sex spaces:
https://www.theguardian.com/society/...able-says-ehrc
Johnson getting another kicking.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-60988210
The overturning over the conversion therapy ban is exactly the kind of thing I was referring to about the Tories. What purpose does that serve, other than exploiting the issue to win favour with social conservatives and reactionaries? It isn't based upon science, it's a political stunt for right wing populism.Quote:
Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod
One of their own kicking them now. Their own LGBT "Business Champion" resigns over the CT stuff.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/ent...b0e44de9c717f6
And fair play to him. He clearly sees the U-turn for the political stunt it is, throwing another vulnerable group under the bus, in order to appease the core Tory vote when the government is experiencing one crisis after another. It's a gimmick, designed to appeal to the Daily Mail and Express readers in middle England. After the lockdown party scandal, they even named the tactic "Operation Save Big Dog" i.e. throwing red meat to the Tory base. This is one example; other victims will include refugees and welfare recipients, as new Bills designed to make their lives even more unpleasant are going through parliament.Quote:
Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod
'The EHRC has had the bottle to point out that women and transwomen are not the same':
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/...3b1727b793e590
https://www.personneltoday.com/hr/eh...-unlawfulness/
Amazing how different interpretation is possible.
The conference has been cancelled.Quote:
Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod
The Government may not be that disappointed 😏
Sky News
@SkyNews
PM says 'biological males' should not compete in female sport and venues should have women only spaces
The majority of britians in that poll agreed, so probably not that controversial
Venues should definitely have women only spaces whenever Bozo is around!Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
I'd probably be inclined to agree about female sports being for females(as born) only. I'm not too fussed for a rule the other way around, hypocrite or pragmatic?Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
Woman only spaces is fine, but that doesn't sound like it answers the question that is presumably at the heart of the issue i.e. when can a man start to count as, or declare themselves as, a woman.
From context being next to the sports answer I assume it's the same answer and I'm not as ready to agree with that outright (although I understand the reasons), where does a trans-woman go to change/bathroom if there's only 2 options and that's the rule? :dunno:
I think unisex changing cubicles should be a legal thing like needing disabled toilets. I know trans people aren't happy with that as they feel they shouldn't be singled out and should go into the changing area of their choice. But if some biological women are unhappy with people with penises are in there women only areas, then their rights should be respected. Same for women's only crisis homes ectQuote:
Originally Posted by danhibees1875
Anyone ever been in a place with unisex toilets? I've only experienced it once (a bar) and must admit I felt very self-conscious going in, taking a quick look around to ensure I didn't spot any women around before I entered a cubicle.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
Quite a few places and have them in my work. Some have just the toilet in the cubicle and shared sinks ect which is weird. The better ones have toilets sinks and dryer in each one, do what you need in and out. The only downside is urinals are even faster I supposeQuote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
The Queen's Hall has them. Some University buildings too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
It is a cultural thing; as you say, we can get self-conscious about them. Like all cultural changes, though, they take time and will soon become second nature.
Nobody seems to be able to look at the issue of female to male transgender people, it's always about how do women feel about their space being infiltrated by 'people with a *****'.
It's because with sports it's the clear physical advantage. No one would mind if there wasn't an advantage so wouldn't mind if female to male competed. The same with changing rooms as I doubt many men would feel physically threatened by a female to male being in the changing room.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
:agree:Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
If either were as big a topic then they would get discussed accordingly.
https://www.healthline.com/health/fi...letes-to-watch
Worth a read as it looks at trans sports people.
https://www.aclu.org/news/lgbtq-righ...etes-debunked/
An American perspective on the 'harm' to cis women in sports.
What a one-sided and absolute nonsense piece the second one is. Trans athletes technically aren't always better than women is the argument. Genetic differences sometimes doesn't make up for form pish. There an obvious physical advantage and people shouldn't act stupid about it. The fact most trans athletes go from being mediocre males to top women tells its own story. If you think trans women should be able to fight in boxing and mma against biological women I'd go further and say you were sick.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
Both poor articles, the second one borderline propagandistic in it's presentation.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
Why then have I seen on this thread the argument that boys outperform Olympic female athletes?Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
I'm lost? They do it was a fact from the US boys final. Even by 17 and 18 a boy can outperform the best women, it's just physical difference. Muscle shape, bone density, skeletal shapeQuote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
Absolutely. Trans men and trans women both compete in female sport. That says something in itself. Trans women are allowed testosterone levels which, if female competitors were to have, they would be banned. That said, it’s about way more than testosterone levels as women are not just small men with lower testosterone levels. It’s muscle bulk potential, bone density, lung capacity and hip width - male swimmers are more streamlined because they have narrower hips. Then there’s the impact of menstrual cycles, pregnancy and childbirth on careers, ability to train properly every week of the year and having to make choices between children and competing. Martin Boyle and his wife face very different challenges through their careers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
There’s lots of campaigning for Female category and an Open category. As it stands the open category is actually the female one and the Male category is not.
Equal opportunities mean we need to have categories to encourage equal access to fair competition and to encourage participation in under represented groups. Having situations where 40 something old trans women qualify for the Olympics in the female category isn’t going to achieve that. And it's never going to be an issue the other way round
The toilets thing is a different issue and recently has seen some places' toilets becoming effectively unisex and male including the new Costa at the top of Easter Road until there was uproar about it. Biological women are disadvantaged toilet wise in the sense that urinals allow a greater number of biological males to use their mens facilities quicker and in a different manner via urinals. Note the queues always at concerts, sports events etc for the ladies v the gents. There’s going to be a decrease in capacity for venues if everything had to be cubicles and unisex. Imagine Easter Road with gender neutral loos. Consider who is going to be impacted…kids, women are going to feel less able to use the loos given the nature of how the gents loos are used at football. And so likely wiould many males. Not that long ago Easter Road only had one female loo in a portacabin at the back of the East. Even then it was invaded by males pissing in sinks. My daughter was delighted when we finally got proper facilities for females and finally felt actually able to safely use the loos at the football when the ground was redeveloped . I used to feel really bad for her prior to that.
I’m not really sure what point you are trying to make? Male to female can have a huge physical advantage over females in a way that does not apply the other direction?Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
Also females are more likely to be weary of men than the other way around and should be able to use changing rooms and toilets with only those born female if they so wish.
Why should it always be about sports?Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul1642
What proportion of transsexuals are sports persons?
That's just a distraction from the needs of the genuine trans people in this country and the world generally.
Lia Thomas was a mediocre swimmer ranked 462 in the male category. Lia Thomas then transitions enters the female category and smashes the 200m and 500m free style disciplines, beating three American silver medalists. It has to be the end of female sport if a person with bollocks can identify as a female and enter into female sport.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
I have a live and let live attitude, I believe that trans rights should be protected. I would agree totally with an open category that trans people can enter, but female sport should be a protected category for biological females only, a person who goes through puberty as a male should not be allowed to enter the female category, I can see sporty females thinking what is the point of trying to be the best I can be if a mediocre male can identify as woman and smash female records.
Just an honest question here: has anyone on here ever met, or does anyone know, a transgender person? I haven't. This issue seems to get attention that far outweighs its influence in society.
Does anyone know how many transgender people there are in the UK?
I know quite a few, through work and personally. I have almost certainly met others, without knowing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
I suspect that the latter will be true for most people.
It could be I've met some without realising it, true. I am suspicious of those in the media who keep hammering away at this issue. The focus upon it seems out of proportion to the number of people affected, which I fear leaves a small and vulnerable group wide open to being mis-represented and suffering public prejudice, like other very small groups, such as travellers. All public debates on the issue I have heard have been dominated by cynical ignorance and 'common sense' i.e. the lowest common denominator.Quote:
Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod
Sports probably comes up a lot because that’s the only area of life where some people don’t think they can have the same rights. Every other area of life I’m all for trans people doing what ever makes them happy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yes, one of my friend's kids is transgender. It's been interesting to witness their journey. I also worked with an older transgender woman years ago, before the issue became the hot potato is has now. Charming colleague who, incidentally, would never have tried to argue that biological sex is irrelevant.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
I don't agree that the issue's influence on society is minimal, but it IS a minimal number of people who have blown things way out of proportion by trying to merge the rights of women and trans people together. All it has done is spark an increasingly toxic debate and unnecessarily fuel suspicion of trans people. Claims at the weekend by Lorna Slater of the Greens (Harvie's sidekick) that those expressing concerns for women's rights are somehow 'racist' certainly don't help, but then I always feel she comes across as a bit glaikit.
As has been said a few times, there are so many echoes of the LGB "debates" of the 70's and 80's, but this time ramped up by social media. The latter, for me, fuels so much of the toxicity that HH mentioned.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
Kudos to Emily Thornberry, exactly my point: stop trying to exploit these people for personal gain and personal agendas.
https://youtu.be/s0AHTdmis-Q
"Born in the wrong body"Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
That's leaning towards the idea of a soul, and that sort of pseudo religious patter is when I start to get upset. I don't want prayer in schools and I certainly don't want legislation based on the idea that we exist beyond the our physical bodies, because that's really dangerous. We could extend that to the idea that unborn children have souls, and therefore we have another garbage arguement about abortion.
It's also a sound bite, the type of which doesn't help a complicated,emotive and nuanced debate.Quote:
Originally Posted by 500miles
She isn't a clinician nor a psychologist, and perhaps "born in the wrong body" is a poor description (I don't know) but it's an issue many people, myself included, have little to no expertise on. It's difficult to understand the idea of feeling one is the wrong gender. As I said previously, it's certainly beyond my understanding, and I would guess many people feel the same. Emily Thornberry makes a very good point that some sections of the media and politics are taking advantage of public fear surrounding an unusual issue for their own benefit, playing upon ignorance. Transgender people are the latest pawns in the 'culture wars' agenda, and Emily is asking for compassion and the avoidance of lashing out at something a lot of folk might find frightening. It's the humane approach.Quote:
Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod
Many people feel like they can talk to God through prayer - we don't take that literally, nor do we enshrine it legally.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
You're right of course when it comes to the culture war. This is low hanging fruit for the far right when they want to appear "reasonable". That's why I wish the left weren't so entrenched in slogans and soundbites like Thornberry's or "Trans Women are Women." All it takes is an acknowledgement of nuance or to clarify that nobody is seeking to blur the lines between sex and gender, and a that "reasonable" position loses power.
Yes, my cousin’s offspring has gone down the full surgical route. She is now he/him.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
How long was the process in total? How did the family react initially?Quote:
Originally Posted by superfurryhibby
Will be interesting to see if the proposed custodial sentence being spoken about in court today is imposed where this individual is going to be housed - judge seemingly ow looking into a suspended sentence
https://metro.co.uk/2022/04/12/ex-soldier-exposed-her-*****-and-used-wheelie-bin-as-sex-toy-in-public-16454386/amp/
Filters for the site here is causing the link not to work. The word asterisked out is a male organ.
I tend to agree with this, I would imagine that for most transgender people if there is no such thing as biological sex there is no such thing as transgender. I would imagine that most transgender woman know that they are not biological woman they are men who choose to identify as woman. For me there is a big difference between transgender people who just want to get on with their lives and the gender extremists who argue that trans woman should be included in the female lesbian dating pool, and that a lesbian who refuses to date a transwoman is a TERF, a transphobe and a racist etc etcQuote:
Originally Posted by He's here!
For me the reason the gender extremists get so nasty towards feminists is because they know that their arguments don't stand up to scrutiny this is why they resort to closing down debate and name calling.
The logical end point of the slogan transwoman are woman are summed up in this article where a man who identifies as a woman and is attracted to women goes for a shower and exposes his ***** in the female changing room, this is what progress looks like.
https://www.independentsentinel.com/...he-locker-room
😆 lesbian sex can have consequences these days 👶
https://www.google.com/amp/s/nypost....er-inmate/amp/
Two inmates serving time in New Jersey’s only state prison for women became pregnant after they had sex with a transgender inmate, according to a report Wednesday.
Well he is in his 20’s and I think people just supported a person they love.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
Quote:
Originally Posted by He's here!
Good post.
The path this takes us down is alarming to me. Thought police, hate crime, wokeism, control. The enemies of freedom of speech.
That's great to hear, it must be an enormous shock initially. It must make all the difference when family are supportive.Quote:
Originally Posted by superfurryhibby
Interesting and considered article in the New York Times which, although is considering things from a US perspective where things are different to Western Europe in many ways, not least religion and its influence on politics, it is worth a read. The potential for life long medicalisation of young people does need considered as part of the bigger picture.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/04/13/o...?smid=tw-share
Joanna Cherry QC
@joannaccherry
🧵In the past week both Lorna Slater and Patrick Harvie have displayed an extraordinary insouciance towards human rights and equality law by seeking to brand women who question legislative proposals based on gender identity theory
as “transphobes”” & akin to “racists” and “anti-Semites”. Ms Slater wants us banned from the airwaves & Mr Harvie wants us disciplined by our political parties. They really need to acquaint themselves with Articles 9 & 10 ECHR which protect freedom of belief
& freedom of speech in this country. They could also do with reading & understanding the Equality Act & the decision of the Employment Appeal Tribunal in case of Maya Forstater v CGD Europe which established that discrimination, harassment, and victimisation
against persons of gender critical belief is unlawful under the Equality Act. While this was an employment law case the prohibition of this sort of discrimination applies to membership organisations, including political parties, in respect of their members
The Green Party of England & Wales is currently being sued by a former leadership candidate for such discrimination. No doubt thats why sensible political parties in Scotland are not pursuing complaints against women merely for holding & expressing such views
in the way that Mr Harvie seems to want. Both MSPs would also do well to take a look at the Public Sector Equality Duty which obliges those in government to have due regard to the need to eliminate discrimination, advance equality of opportunity
and to foster good relations between different protected characteristics. ENDS
https://www.heraldscotland.com/polit...ty/?ref=twtrec
Green minister Patrick Harvie accuses SNP of allowing transphobia to 'fester' in the party
GREEN minister Patrick Harvie has accused his SNP partners in government of failing to tackle transphobia by “a significant number of high-profile people” in the party.
Mr Harvie said the issue should have led to disciplinary action by the SNP, but instead it had been “allowed to fester” and people got away with “promoting transphobia
The transgender movement has became Orwellian with the slogan transwomen are women, it's like a religious cult who believe that if they say it often enough it will become true, but it won't no matter how many times it's said, transwomen are not women, they are men who identify as women.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
There is something deeply misogynistic about the way the transgender movement call feminist lesbians who want to date biological females TERFS, transphobes and racists, this article is a good example of why it is not a good idea to allow men who identify as women into female spaces such as domestic violence shelters, female changing rooms or female prisons.
Does this also apply to transsexual women?Quote:
Originally Posted by 147lothian
Again, echoes with LGB history.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
A generation or two ago, families struggled with the idea of their kids being gay. Stonewall Youth was full of people who had been rejected by their families.
Nowadays, society is easier with those situations. But the issues are replicated in families where a kid has gender issues.
My mate's CIS-daughter was in the lucky position, when they were struggling, of having a supportive family who managed to help them through it. Sadly, that's not always the case. My mate now finds himself counselling other parents who are having problems coming to terms with similar situations.
As for his trans-son, he's a man. He's a man to the important people in his life...his mates, his family, his girlfriend, his employer, but most of all to himself.
https://nypost.com/2022/04/14/edna-m...gender-inmate/
This story has now been verified
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/two-fe...gnant-26720357
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/22563262/
Some interesting research papers that lend themselves to the fear some in the LGB community have that gender reassignment can be situations where the person who is struggling with their identity is actually struggling with their sexuality.
I agree with much of what you say. However, I disagree with this part. If you have undergone gender reassignment.Quote:
Originally Posted by 147lothian
It's not just feminist lesbians who want to date females who get called transphobic and the likes. You have people like the male head of the Edinburgh Rape Crisis Centre castigating opposition and objection to his recruitment with attempts to close down the discussion and silence women.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/r...ents-2b9kdvc75
"Mridul Wadhwa, 43, a trans woman and former SNP parliamentary candidate who was appointed chief executive of Edinburgh Rape Crisis in May, made the controversial remarks while speaking on a podcast. While discussing trans-inclusion, discrimination and sexual violence on The Guilty Feminist she said: “Sexual violence happens to bigoted people as well. But these spaces are also for you.
“But if you bring unacceptable beliefs that are discriminatory in nature, we will begin to work with you on your journey of recovery from trauma. But please also expect to be challenged"
Read those words and ponder. An anti feminist, biological male, (could also be described as misogynistic and self entitled), talking about challenging women victims of sexual harm who want a biological female staff member to support them.
Utter madness.
Even with surgery, which stats say is the minority of those in the trans umbrella you remain biologically the sex you were assessed as being from conception. It's one of the issues where recording of biological sex is important as the vulnerability to certain health conditions depends on your sex. Every cell in the body contains genetic material directly as a consequence of your sex.Quote:
Originally Posted by superfurryhibby
Puberty blockers and other medicalisation can affect the long term health outcomes for people - vulnerability to conditions like osteoporosis are linked to sex hormones and the normal hormonal cycles in sexed bodies. You build up your bone density especially during puberty. It's one of the reasons the male trans identifying athletes who go through male puberty retain physical advantage. However, if you delay or block puberty that process is undermined and there's increased risk of bone fractures. There's a 15 year old in Australia who was put on puberty blockers at 12 who is currently looking to take legal action for the consequences of that decision being endorsed and facilitated by adults. The teenager is on crutches because of the impact of the puberty blockers on their bones.
You have to wonder at whether this kind of thing will impact on the apparent willingness to affirm dysphoria in the case of gender in a way it doesn't happen with other mental health situations like body dysphoria and eating disorders. Nobody ever tells the underweight anorexic that the body they perceive is okay, for example.
This issue is so wide ranging and complex it needs a considered and careful approach that takes into account the age, understanding, underlying health etc of individuals. It really also needs greater clarity over what trans means because there is a difference between someone who has a paraphilia and gets aroused by dressing up as the opposite sex in gender stereotypical manner and some of the young girls on the spectrum where the biggest increase in the requests for surgery has happened in the last decade and then everything in between. And public attitudes to it does appear to be linked to what they perceive trans to mean.
What do you think of Mridul Wadha and his statement about women who want biologically female support following rape or sexual assault? Are they appropriate for someone who is head of a rape crisis centre?Quote:
Originally Posted by LewysGot2