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Ach well beyond anything I know much detail about to be honest! I just remembered the above from something I had read.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozyhibby
I think the general gist was that from a VAT perspective the net effect would stay the same as current and as such there was no threat of 20% hikes.
But honestly beyond that I don’t really know so not gonna pretend other wise [emoji2957]
I’m surprised no one has posted or picked up on this yet. Members of Congress in the USA have stated publicly that they would look to sanction the UK in any post-Brexit trade deal with the US if it harmed the Good Friday agreement, which scrapping the backstop would.
While Congress is generally a two party affair, senators and congressmen and women from both parties and the independents caucus around many issues and the Friends of Ireland caucus has around ten per cent of all Congress members attached to it, which is a big and powerful lobby.
Perhaps more importantly, the chair of the Ways and Means Committee, which has a massive influence on setting and agreeing economic policy is one of the caucus leaders and is adamant that there should be no threat to Good Friday.
Yet another interesting twist to these curious times.
Sky news have apparently got hold of part of a UK Government discussion presentation from a reliable source.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...112dbb3fe3.jpg
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Aye but 350million per week.Quote:
Originally Posted by Just Alf
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I can only imagine the unionist reaction if the Scottish Government had a document suggesting a 25% drop in the value of a Scottish currency.
It was discussed on here a few days ago (can’t remember what thread) that Nancy Pelosi had said there could be no trade deal with the UK while the Good Friday agreement was under threat. Basically that border has to stay open or no trade deal is getting through Congress.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye
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Foreign power interfering in the UK's determination to enact the will of its people. Shirley Cummings's spokesdummies will be spouting about the "antidemocratic US Congress" any minute now?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozyhibby
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-49200636
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Pounds been over valued anyway. ApparentlyQuote:
Originally Posted by CloudSquall
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Ahem - previous page - https://www.hibs.net/showthread.php?...=1#post5858764Quote:
Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozyhibby
Yeah yeah yeah :greengrinQuote:
Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens
You are both right, but I was really referring to a report in the Guardian a few days ago that highlighted the chair of Ways and Means (and a caucus member), making it clear his opposition, not Pelosi.
The committee system in Congress is elaborate, labyrinthine and ultimately a real barrier if it wants to be, to anything really happening. I recently read Robert Caro’s magnificent biography of Lyndon Johnson and Caro spends a vast amount of time describing how the committee system works in Congress, or rather how it is dysfunctional and essentially a tool of power for those who ascend to the chairs.
It has not changed much since then. Ways and Means controls tax and tariffs, which means it influences everything, especially trade deals. Pelosi speaking out was a strong sentiment. Richard Neal speaking out is also so, and perhaps stronger.
You have to laugh at the Brexit Party .. put up a candidate that takes 3,000 votes off a pro-Brexit Tory to allow a remain candidate to win by just over 1,000 votes !!Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
Farage won’t care. Only a no deal Brexit is enough for him now. Anything else he can spin as a betrayal and will be enough to keep him relevant in uk politics going forward.Quote:
Originally Posted by StevieC
No matter what happens, this issue will be in uk politics for a long time.
We can avoid it by voting for independence.
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It will be like an asteroid just missing Scotland that will turn rUk into a wasteland.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozyhibby
Brexit Party MEP Jim McCawber's twitter account:
Nice one Linda. :greengrinQuote:
Jim,
You are an ignorant fool with no respect for the electorate who, for some reason, placed their faith in you.
The last two months as your secretary have been hell. Shove your job up your arse.
- Linda
P.s good luck in changing your password back, you cretinous technophobe
https://twitter.com/JMcCawberMEP/sta...79811705430017
Edit: boo, it's a parody account.
Just a wee reminder.
No-Deal Brexit = Hard Brexit
They simply altered the terminology when it became clear that's what the UK Government were planning all along.
What is the legal status of the vote in January?Quote:
Originally Posted by Fife-Hibee
https://news.sky.com/story/tory-mps-much-more-open-to-supporting-pms-brexit-deal-11601782
Parliament can't legally stop no deal I think.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
The default legal position come 31st October is to leave with no deal. A hard Brexit
Quite how that would be democratic I'd need to ask Farage
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Luckily Giles and Sue have already road tested the food shortages for us:Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
https://youtu.be/gOE0VP0EZ0M
I’m almost certain now that we will leave without a deal. The government are doing as much as they can to piss off the EU while MPs are on holiday. It will only take one country in the EU to say enough is enough you either take the deal on offer or leave with no deal, no more extensions. Parliament can do whatever they want and vote on whatever they want, but if the EU don’t give another extension then there’s no chance of a deal.
It does seem more than likley we are heading for no deal
The politicians in the UK are really comically inept
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That’s the whole plan. They want everyone to think it’s now inevitable.Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
It’s still possible for parliament to stop it though, it’s whether the Labour Party will do what it has to do.
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the public get what they vote for as a whole.Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
we voted to stay in the UK and therefore accept UK wide decisions and the UK as an entity voted to leave the EU.
rightly or wrongly it could have all been stopped by voting to remain or for other political outcomes.
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Show me where people voted for a hard Brexit?Quote:
Originally Posted by Just Jimmy
Unless my memory is totally shot alot of the talk was Norway and easy deals etc
We are not getting what we voted for
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Th majority of Brexit voters don't care though - they voted to leave. Not hard, not soft, they didn't care. They just wanted to leave, and the fudging of the issue means that the winning side aren't getting what they wanted.Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
I'm by no means a Brexiteer but until I have a queue of unhappy Leave voters moaning, I don't really buy this argument.
We're in a really difficult position now - we commit economic suicide or piss off a huge chunk of the electorate.
A huge chunk of the electorate will be pissed off either wayQuote:
Originally Posted by Smartie
TBH I can't see an outcome that doesn't piss off practically everyone.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Grieves
It's utterly impossible for the "winning" side to get what they wanted. Because they all wanted different things out of this. The tories have hijacked the result to turn it into something that the vast vast majority of the British electorate would have rejected had it been laid out on the ballot paper.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smartie
I think we’re dripping out. I think it’ll be a disaster and Labour and the Tories will be tainted for a generation. Then we’ll be back in 10 years from now with a worse arrangement than we have now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smartie
If I’m wrong, everything will be OK anyway.
https://i.ibb.co/Qd4GRbh/joswin.png
But hold on Jo.... If both Labour and the Conservatives want Brexit. Then who are the Lib Dems going to work with to make up the numbers to stop it? :confused: Unless of course the Lib Dems have no intentions of trying anything to stop it and are simply riding an opportunistic wave which is about to come crashing to the shore.
Are you suggesting that Labour and Cons are united on Brexit even within their own parties?Quote:
Originally Posted by Fife-Hibee
Well she did say "Corbyn's Labour", inferring that the whole party under Corbyn wants Brexit.Quote:
Originally Posted by Colr
It's going to be no deal and the Eton boy and his Eton chums are going to tell Scotland they'll just have to deal with it because we said so so there.
Unfortunately it shows that the Tories can win the election if they deliver brexit and then infict years of austerity yet again. How gullible can folk be.Quote:
Originally Posted by StevieC
Parliament could vote to revoke. Or they could threaten to revoke to force a GEQuote:
Originally Posted by lord bunberry
they voted to leave. the terms weren't set out. soft or hard or no deal if we leave they'll have got what they voted for.Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
Scotland voted to stay and has to deal with the consequences. I never saw "remain unless 2 years from now something happens you don't fancy" on the paper.
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Brexit? On a par wi the idiocy of that clown trump, but worse, cos the us will survive while this unthought out halfwitted impossible to achieve foolishness will destroy what was known as the U.K.
That was in the subsequent election manifesto’s of the SNP and the Greens. They went on to win a majority in Parliament based on that manifesto and therefore can have another vote. So long as the Scottish people keep electing parties who want another vote then that’s what we will have. If the SNP have it in their next manifesto that they are going have monthly referendums and people vote for them then that’s what people want.Quote:
Originally Posted by Just Jimmy
Democracy did not end in 2014.
If you don’t want more referendums then you better hope that the Tories pick up in the polls in Scotland.
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I don’t think there’s a majority to revoke though. I think the EU will get so fed up of Johnson and his cohorts, they’ll give a final take it or leave it ultimatum as we approach the deadline.Quote:
Originally Posted by BroxburnHibee
I suspect you are right. Macron seemed resistant to the last extension and I get the feeling that they are sick of the UK......as am I!!Quote:
Originally Posted by lord bunberry
And that's the issue. Absolutely no chance the majority of leave voters thought they were voting for what it looks like they are now gettingQuote:
Originally Posted by Just Jimmy
My memory of 2016 was easy deals, all the benefits with no downsides, 350m p/w to nhs, Norway, Switzerland
None of that is what we are getting
You can't seriously think that if in 2016 we were told that our deal would be a hard Brexit then leave voters would say great, I'm in
The reason I say that with confidence as back then even the now hard Brexiteers never talked about it
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I think that’s the plan. That way they can blame the EU for no deal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Colr
of course not, but did anyone with a brain even really think we'd be able to walk away and keep all the good things?Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
it's in the interest of the EU to make it as bad as they can or else others say they'll leave too.
if you divorce, you don't keep everything. at best you compromise and get some of the good.
I'm whole heartily against leaving the EU. It's economic suicide and as bad as been forecast, I think it'll be a hell of a lot worse. my point however was the paper was a choice of stay or leave and the majority of those eligible, who voted, voted leave. if they wanted more concrete explanations before then they should have voted remain or pressed for them.
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democracy is not voting and voting each week until you get what you want.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozyhibby
I'm whole heartedly against brexit. I voted remain. however the majority of those that voted, voted for leave. this was never defined it was straight in or out.
Independence was sold as a once in a generation vote. regardless of how I voted at the time. Scotland knew it didn't often get a say in UK affairs and it voted to maintain that anyway. so why the outrage when a largely English decision impacts Scotland so much?
I'm firmly of the belief it will happen but to pretend brexit is bad but independence is all rosey is nieve at best. there's plenty of constitutional issues which remain unanswered and never were addressed properly.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Just Jimmy
As Disraeli said:
Quote:
'Finality is not the language of politics'.
The "once in a generation" thing was merely a quote. It serves no legal basis and there is no mention of it in the Edinburgh Agreement (which was breached by Better Together anyway).Quote:
Originally Posted by Just Jimmy
Just like their tosh about "equal family of nations", "best of both worlds", "devo max", "full federalism", "the vow", "northern powerhouses"..... etc. It all went flying out the window on the 18th of September 2014 because there was no legal requirement for them to follow through with any of it.
Hmmm, folk voting in the information provided to them - can't really blame the voters now can weQuote:
Originally Posted by Just Jimmy
What we should be doing is holding those in power to account
Regardless, MPs are there to look after our best interests
Anyone looking at the governments forecasts can plainly see any brexit, nevermind a hard Brexit is not in our interests at all
Shurugging shoulders and saying oh well that's what apparently folk voted for is a deriliction of duty
The fact that all this analysis was tried to be kept hidden tells you everything you need to know
This shouldnt be some party political points scoring exercise--this should have been from day 1, an open transparent cross party deal
The govt at every step has been sneaky, underhand and downright incompetent - none of these things exists if you are benefitting your population
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I'm well aware of what brexit mean. the initial point however was that people voted to leave and leave wasn't defined so any type of leave is delivering that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
that is completely at odds with how I actually feel about the whole situation but never the less if the choice is stay or go and go is the winning vote, with no defined perimeters then how can they say they didn't vote for that?
the reality is that some issues are too big to be trusted to the general public to be voted on.
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We'll see as the date gets closer peoples minds will start to change.Quote:
Originally Posted by lord bunberry
No deal would be a disaster.
Full disclosure, I voted "Yes" in 2014, but I'm not sure how I'd vote in another referendum. However, out of all the talk around Scottish independence, on both sides of the argument, the "once in a generation" line is the one that riles me the most. It's usually preceded, or followed, by a comment suggesting that anyone advocating for another referendum is not "respecting democracy".Quote:
Originally Posted by Just Jimmy
I can't think of anything less democratic than denying an electorate something which they have voted for on the basis of a campaigning slogan from a previous referendum. For what it's worth, I'm not saying the Scottish electorate has voted for another referendum, but the "once in a generation" position suggests that it would be irrelevant if they had.
The once in a generation comment was said once in one interview by Alex Salmond. It was his opinion. It was not in the Edinburgh agreement or anywhere else.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future17
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It's already building towards that. Tories now saying that the EU are refusing to have any discussionQuote:
Originally Posted by lord bunberry
Well that’s that then.Quote:
Originally Posted by Just Jimmy
J
As Disraeli said:Quote:
Originally Posted by Bristolhibby
'Finality is not the language of politics'.
I wonder what Johnson's plan is when everything goes to ****? Johnson has been telling folk there'll be minimal disruption if there is no deal, so how will he survive the chaos that no deal will bring? I'm really struggling to comprehend thisQuote:
Originally Posted by weecounty hibby
He will think he can survive because for most of us it won’t be daily chaos and many of those who vote Tory will be amongst the least likely to suffer any real financial hardship. He is banking on those of us who wish to remain in the EU overdoing the doomsday stuff so he can ask what all the fuss was about later. It’s a trap we shouldn’t fall in to.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Grieves
Plus it’s not like people believe Corbyn will sort it all out anyway. So long a Labour have Corbyn, Johnson will correctly bet that he can win a GE.Quote:
Originally Posted by marinello59
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What I'm wondering, politicians are elected to run the country for the 'best'.
It's always been assumed that they have more info than Joe public so can make informed decisions that benefit/protect the nation... My question is, if a group of politicians actually damage the country for ideological reasons is that treason?
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It won't matter one bit. There are still loads of Brexit voters who are only interested in keeping Johnny Foreign out and taking back control, whatever the **** that actually means and are happy to take the consequences. If there was a GE now he'd get in and I'm convinced that if/when he delivers a Brexit if any kind he will still get in if he waits to call GE.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Grieves
Scotland's brexit party MEP.
https://i.ibb.co/LZpQvpz/brexitmep.png
The Scottish electorate actually gave this halfwit a job. :rolleyes:
It’s an interesting question but I suppose the problem with ideologues is they genuinely believe what they are doing is the right thing for the right reasons! So they can’t see themselves as treasonous, they see themselves as patriotic or somehow acting in the greater good for all!Quote:
Originally Posted by Just Alf
The lack of a formal constitution probably doesn’t help but I don’t think the presence of one would have made a difference in this case.
Italy heading for an election which is likely to yield a government heavy to the right and extremely at odds with Brussels, likely to be right around the time of Brexit.
That’s ok, wait 6 months and they’ll have another one.[emoji3]Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudSquall
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Utter lies from gove. Buffoon Boris says they are still negotiating. The Tory tags are in overdrive with misinformation. The masters of fake news just like trump. They can't even get their fake news correct. I think it's beginning to dawn on Boris and his troop of clowns how bad it could get. Boris was only interested in power and is incapable of understanding how anything works. He all mouth and no action. His promises of money for various things are utterly garbage and the only reasoning I can come up with is that he hopes to con the public then hope it all turns out ok by some miracle. Never have I had such utter disdain for this horrible Tory party. Much as I don't like the behaviour of MPs plotting to bring down Boris it's only they who can stop the catastrophic no deal brexit. Democracy is reduced to Ken Clarke bringing down s Tory govt. Never thought I'd see that in my lifetime.Quote:
Originally Posted by weecounty hibby
How do people not see through this promise anything & everything charade just to be in power?Quote:
Originally Posted by mjhibby
:agree: You don't even need to be particularly cynical to recognise that most of everything that is coming out of Downing St at the moment is BS. The genius Cummings has decreed that his cabinet spokesdummies are not allowed to say 'backstop' without prefixing it 'undemocratic' or 'antidemocratic', so they do, ad nauseam. His latest pish is that 'politicians are not allowed to decide which votes they respect'. It was an advisory referendum, you cretin, not an election.Quote:
Originally Posted by majorhibs
Here we go. Downwards to Brexit
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49290926
I wonder if this will affect the timing of an election, another quarter of negative growth which is likely would see us in a recession..Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
Some more strength and security from the union.
http://www.businessinsider.fr/us/michael-gove-discussed-closing-banks-the-day-after-no-deal-brexit-2019-8
Why stop at closing the banks? Shirley if the shops were closed as well, that would lessen the impact of there being no fresh food on shelves. I think Govey's on to something :agree: .Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudSquall
It's going to be an extra "Bank Holiday", a nice day off for everyone, what's to worry about:greengrinQuote:
Originally Posted by lapsedhibee
That sounds great. This government certainly knows how to make us Britons feel good about ourselves again. Next, get India back :agree: .Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudSquall
More likely to see an Indian takeover of the UK!!Quote:
Originally Posted by lapsedhibee
I think that's more likely to be an Indian takeaway of the UK.Quote:
Originally Posted by weecounty hibby
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/0...mpression=true
Some hope that remain are getting their act together.
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I see England and Wales were running rehearsals for a no deal Brexit yesterday. Who switched the lights off.
Things seems to have gone quiet i.e. no deal looks a certainty. Bozo and his loonies are already setting the narrative that the EU won't negotiate. Of course he doesn't mention that negotiations took months and produced a 600 page withdrawal agreement, only for parliamaent to reject it three times. We had a bespoke withdrawal agreement in which we managed to get the best terms possible, hence there is nothing more than the EU can give, without breaking its own rules on the single market and customs union.
There just isn't time to open up this can of worms again before Halloween.
Imagine that had happened here? The Hibs.net unionists would have been all over it as clear proof that Scotland is incapable of managing its own affairs.Quote:
Originally Posted by ronaldo7
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According to the beeb fishing rights and protecting the fishing grounds not looking like the walk in the park it was meant to be.
I hope the fishers get exactly what they're demanding. Perhaps then they'll feel that bullet in their foot.Quote:
Originally Posted by weecounty hibby
Made all the more complicated as, I understand, almost half the UK licences were sold to overseas companies.Quote:
Originally Posted by weecounty hibby
Thay have a point... Why did we not get to practice as well? :grrQuote:
Originally Posted by Ozyhibby
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49314840
I can only imagine the reaction if Boris Johnson suggested an all-male cabinet.
I thought Caroline Lucas was supposed to be above this sort of stunt.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future17
I’m currently in Slovenia, combining a holiday with watching Hibs Ladies in the Champions League. Whenever I’m asked where I come from, I get the same bewildered response and disbelief that the UK wants to leave the EU. There’s a road junction just a few hundred metres from where I’m sitting, not a motorway, just a road in town. Hungary is straight ahead, Croatia to the right and Austria to the left. And people and goods pass freely between all four countries. It’s no surprise that they all think we’re mad.
If you mean stopping Brexit, then that is part of her job.Quote:
Originally Posted by heretoday
If comments like that were made the other way around there would be mock outrage galore until someone was sacked and grovelling for forgiveness in the media.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future17
It's the sort of nonsense that puts me right off voting Green.
It's ok; it's a different party in Scotland (presuming that's where you live).Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudSquall
This is the point we've now reached: the brave new world of limitless possibilities we were promised were waiting for us outside the EU has shrunk to 'British Bulldog spirit'.
https://youtu.be/2p52sAEUcNA
Such a gloomster, James O'Brien, what with his logic and his rational thought processes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
Hey we* survived 2 world wars you know!Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba
* give or take a million or so.
We had Hong Kong before we joined the EU, and now look at it.Quote:
Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/f...3_VT5w.twitter
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Good read, thanks for sharing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozyhibby
For those with Netflix, ‘The Great Hack’ is an interesting watch.
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https://amp.theguardian.com/politics...mpression=true
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So the British government couldn't be arsed claiming the money they were entitled to from individual EU countries but now find it worthwhile to claim from individual people after Brexit. A non story but a vote winner amongst the Gammons. Strap yourself in, there's an election on the way.
https://www.businessinsider.com/nhs-...19-8?r=US&IR=T
I watched it the other week. Carol Cadwalladr is very enlightening.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozyhibby
Cambridge analytica, had their paws all over Brexit.
Brittany Kaiser's part in the whole affair is extremely worrying.
What's next.
Collaborators everywhere. Shouldn't she be getting her head shaved?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozyhibby
UK must accept USA food standards for any trade deals, says Zippy.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49353220