Share Transfers Agreed/Cooling off period

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by The Sea-gull

Does any else see the following scenario unfolding:-

HOMFC are relegated but exit administration and start 2014/15 in the first division. Failing to learn lessons of the past, they over-spend whilst mounting a first division title challenge and compete with The Rangers (who are also spending at riddiculous levels to get out the 1st div, even more so as they are bricking it about finishing second to HOMFC) for the title. They and Rangers return to the Premier League for season 2015/16. They both spend the next season spending way outwith their means trying to give it the big I am in the top league. Eventually, maybe after a few seasons, both run into some sort of financial trouble again.

I just think the arrogant attitudes and delusions of grandeur that people associated with these two clubs will get the better of them. I don't think building things back up quietly, slowly but surely and most importantly for each clubs, sustainably, exists in their vocabularlies.

---

No chance of that happening as neither club has a line of credit.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SQHib

interesting wee snippet on FFOH twitter :

BIDCO will acquire 79% shareholding of HMFC

who owns the other 21 % - is Vlad's niece still holding shares ?

---

Maybe budgie is Vlads long lost neice after all and when the illusion is complete she will emerge Cruella Deville like and steal all their puppies, or is it poppies down gorgie way?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SQHib

interesting wee snippet on FFOH twitter :

BIDCO will acquire 79% shareholding of HMFC

who owns the other 21 % - is Vlad's niece still holding shares ?

---

Here's the report in the Evening News last year saying that she is thought to still control 15% of the shares through Quantum, in Switzerland.


If FoH are now stating they wil gain control of only 79% of the shares, that means Vlad will still own, directly or indirectly, part of their club :greengrin

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bostonhibby

Maybe budgie is Vlads long lost neice after all and when the illusion is complete she will emerge Cruella Deville like and steal all their puppies, or is it poppies down gorgie way?

---

Nope, you've got it all wrong, This is the true story of Vlad's Niece..........


Attachment 12011

So should we start calling them bidco? Like we call the rangers sevco?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by One Day Soon

God they are tiresome. I really couldn't care less what they get up to. I just wish it would stop eating media and football time, energy and coverage. Go bust, don't go bust - whatever, just get on with it.

The quicker they move to a stable new position the better because it is very clear that at that point they are going to have to deal with the reality of consistently living within their means for the first time in decades. And the bonus is that Banderson's guff should run its course pretty quickly after that.

---

Good post. I'm fed up with all the coverage too!

Personally I hope they get back on their feet and recover, not just for the sake of Edinburgh football but so that we can go about getting revenge for the 5-1. It's as simple as that.

We dont need revenge for that.they cheated. Relegating them would do though.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Waxy

So should we start calling them bidco? Like we call the rangers sevco?

---

No, its still perfectly acceptable to call them tax payer and charity robbing c***s.

I see the infighting has already started over on Kickback, which only serves as an Hors d'oeuvre as to the feast of squabbling that lies ahead.

That club is finished.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sergey

I see the infighting has already started over on Kickback, which only serves as an Hors d'oeuvre as to the feast of squabbling that lies ahead.

That club is finished.

---

Sergey, what are they saying

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Billy Whizz

Sergey, what are they saying

---

I would imagine the more intelligent supporters will be showing concern for the F.O.H. appearing to shift the goalposts regarding fan ownership.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Weststandwanab

The Company is BIDCO (1874) Ltd.

---

Found it on Companies House web site. One share owned by Ann Budge.

Agent of Company ..... 7Side Limited ...... I kid you not ! :greengrin They just love the number 7.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Billy Whizz

Sergey, what are they saying

---

It looks like Dexter is playing the totalitarian card and telling everyone to tow the party line or else they'll be punted from the forum.

Differing opinions aren't readily welcomed.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Weststandwanab

I would imagine the more intelligent supporters will be showing concern for the F.O.H. appearing to shift the goalposts regarding fan ownership.

---

Wonder if that was the reason for Mackie and Ford quitting last year ?

Brian Cormack seems to be the main man there now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Weststandwanab

I would imagine the more intelligent supporters will be showing concern for the F.O.H. appearing to shift the goalposts regarding fan ownership.

---

It's definitely a completely different picture to the one painted by FoH when they were asking for pledges.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Weststandwanab

I would imagine the more intelligent supporters will be showing concern for the F.O.H. appearing to shift the goalposts regarding fan ownership.

---

That's my thoughts.

Thinking this through, my original understanding was.

1. FOH buy the shares, and use Bidco's money to do so.

2. FOH therefore own the club.

3. Over time, FOH repay Bidco.

4. Over time, fans take control of FOH.

That's not what the common understanding is now.

Ozy, I apologise for shooting you down earlier. :greengrin

I find the quoted figures interesting.

As far as I can see the Diddies need to find the following:

Year 1 - £1m for immediate working capital and football debt
+ £1.4m additional working capital
Year 2 - £1.4m working capital
Year 3-5 £2.5m repayment of Bidco investment

That looks like £6.3m which exceeds the £6m given by FoH and EEN as required from fans. It also does not include any additional working capital in years 3-5. Do they expect to be fully self-sufficient or are they hoping for further investment from their new chairperson?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

That's my thoughts.

Thinking this through, my original understanding was.

1. FOH buy the shares, and use Bidco's money to do so.

2. FOH therefore own the club.

3. Over time, FOH repay Bidco.

4. Over time, fans take control of FOH.

That's not what the common understanding is now.

Ozy, I apologise for shooting you down earlier. :greengrin

---

Will this new arrangement un-ravel the CVA ?

Clause 2. " The Foundation of Hearts ( FoH ) is to purchase the Club as a going concern for a total consideration of £ 2.5 million ...... etc "

Could it be back to the drawing board or can BDO just swop one purchaser for another ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by greenginger

Wonder if that was the reason for Mackie and Ford quitting last year ?

Brian Cormack seems to be the main man there now.

---

I would think there is no smoke without fire.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by matty_f

It's definitely a completely different picture to the one painted by FoH when they were asking for pledges.

---

Very different.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

That's my thoughts.

Thinking this through, my original understanding was.

1. FOH buy the shares, and use Bidco's money to do so.

2. FOH therefore own the club.

3. Over time, FOH repay Bidco.

4. Over time, fans take control of FOH.

That's not what the common understanding is now.

Ozy, I apologise for shooting you down earlier. :greengrin

---

CWG I would agree with your original understanding - I was the same but looking at the current proposal it is vastly different and poses more questions than provides answers. In the meantime remember the shares are still Frozen !

On a separate note I see Ian - call me a M.P.- Murray is now some sort of expert on common currencies !

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

That's my thoughts.

Thinking this through, my original understanding was.

1. FOH buy the shares, and use Bidco's money to do so.

2. FOH therefore own the club.

3. Over time, FOH repay Bidco.

4. Over time, fans take control of FOH.

That's not what the common understanding is now.

Ozy, I apologise for shooting you down earlier. :greengrin

---

It's clearly a different deal from what they all signed up for. No apology needed. I rarely know what I'm talking about and just got lucky. :-)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by greenginger

Will this new arrangement un-ravel the CVA ?

Clause 2. " The Foundation of Hearts ( FoH ) is to purchase the Club as a going concern for a total consideration of £ 2.5 million ...... etc "

Could it be back to the drawing board or can BDO just swop one purchaser for another ?

---

Duff and Phelps did with Sevco 5088 and Sevco Scotland.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

Duff and Phelps did with Sevco 5088 and Sevco Scotland.

---

You're on a roll, now.:greengrin

I'm hesitating to shoot you down again, but I think that was different. The 5088 deal was set up by D&P, but the transfer to Scotland was a deal between those two companies.

I think, he says, with one eye on Ozy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by greenginger

Will this new arrangement un-ravel the CVA ?

Clause 2. " The Foundation of Hearts ( FoH ) is to purchase the Club as a going concern for a total consideration of £ 2.5 million ...... etc "

Could it be back to the drawing board or can BDO just swop one purchaser for another ?

---

That's what I keep coming back to.

It's FOH, not Ann Budge or BIDCO or anyone else, who are committed to buying the shares in the CVA.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

That's what I keep coming back to.

It's FOH, not Ann Budge or BIDCO or anyone else, who are committed to buying the shares in the CVA.

---

So will it need to go to a new vote of creditors , another cooling off period etc etc.

Come on Robinp, your expertise is required by Hibs.net.

Have BDO said anything about this ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

You're on a roll, now.:greengrin

I'm hesitating to shoot you down again, but I think that was different. The 5088 deal was set up by D&P, but the transfer to Scotland was a deal between those two companies.

I think, he says, with one eye on Ozy.

---

My understanding is that 5088 are challenging (or threatening to) in court the deal because they had no part of it. The notes in new Rangers account made note of a potential claim from 5088 along these lines.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Geo_1875

I find the quoted figures interesting.

As far as I can see the Diddies need to find the following:

Year 1 - £1m for immediate working capital and football debt
+ £1.4m additional working capital
Year 2 - £1.4m working capital
Year 3-5 £2.5m repayment of Bidco investment

That looks like £6.3m which exceeds the £6m given by FoH and EEN as required from fans. It also does not include any additional working capital in years 3-5. Do they expect to be fully self-sufficient or are they hoping for further investment from their new chairperson?

---

Also doesn't say anything about stadium redevelopment, which is an issue that will have to be readdressed within 5 years.

I suspect AB will retain ownership of the land and stadium (which effectively she will get for nowt if/when the fans pay her back) and the fans will get shares in the football club that are tenants of the property (on a full repairing lease!). I can't see AB doing this out of the goodness of her heart (pardon the pun).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Weststandwanab

I would think there is no smoke without fire.

Very different.

CWG I would agree with your original understanding - I was the same but looking at the current proposal it is vastly different and poses more questions than provides answers. In the meantime remember the shares are still Frozen !

On a separate note I see Ian - call me a M.P.- Murray is now some sort of expert on common currencies !

---

The more i see him as a spokesman for the NO lot the more i am thinking of voting YES.

Is it possible that all this activity and disclosure is because there has been a change of plan with FoH?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

Duff and Phelps did with Sevco 5088 and Sevco Scotland.

---

That was the sale of assets after the CVA was rejected . What appears to be going to happen at Gorgie now, HOMFC will be sold to Bidco 1874 rather than FoH.

That is not what was proposed at the CVA vote , that is not what was reported to Court of Session, can it happen without a fresh vote ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by greenginger

That was the sale of assets after the CVA was rejected . What appears to be going to happen at Gorgie now, HOMFC will be sold to Bidco 1874 rather than FoH.

That is not what was proposed at the CVA vote , that is not what was reported to Court of Session, can it happen without a fresh vote ?

---

I am still reading yesterday's press release as confirming that FOH are buying the shares, funded by BIDCO.

"BIDCO
will provide the following support:

Fund the upfront capital £2.5m to enable the CVA to be completed and to see Hearts exit administration"


It's what happens immediately afterwards that is confusing me. Is it the case that there will be an immediate transfer of the shares from FOH to BIDCO? That would then mean that the rest of the press release makes sense.

This statement is the most telling for me, though:-

"BIDCO is unable to enter into public discussion regarding details of
the rescue package or future plans for the club"

It's nane of oor business.

@WelshIrvine: Is it just my interpretation of events or are Hearts supporters now being expected to buy their club for the ownership of a private company?

@WelshIrvine: If so, it sadly fits in perfectly with the ethos of our times. A 'Labour man' backing a 'fan movement' as a front for private ownership.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GloryGlory

Also doesn't say anything about stadium redevelopment, which is an issue that will have to be readdressed within 5 years.

I suspect AB will retain ownership of the land and stadium (which effectively she will get for nowt if/when the fans pay her back) and the fans will get shares in the football club that are tenants of the property (on a full repairing lease!). I can't see AB doing this out of the goodness of her heart (pardon the pun).

---

I think the F.O.H. stated position of we will stay at PBS for the foreseeable future covers that ! Now what Bidco (1874) Ltd's position is we will see of the shares are ever unfrozen.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by southsider

The more i see him as a spokesman for the NO lot the more i am thinking of voting YES.

---

Delighted to read that please see this ink

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&v ed=0CDEQqQIwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.heraldscotland .com%2Fpolitics%2Freferendum-news%2Fyes-does-not-mean-yes.23438016&ei=3PH9UsfEHInMhAeClYEI&usg=AFQjCNFOA jR5xm7tmlNbdqMwzwbvgNXZ3A&sig2=-sTnhoVdg3hx94vOXcMV5g&bvm=bv.61190604,d.d2k

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

Is it possible that all this activity and disclosure is because there has been a change of plan with FoH?

---

I think there may be merit in that thought.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

I am still reading yesterday's press release as confirming that FOH are buying the shares, funded by BIDCO.

"BIDCO
will provide the following support:

Fund the upfront capital £2.5m to enable the CVA to be completed and to see Hearts exit administration"


It's what happens immediately afterwards that is confusing me. Is it the case that there will be an immediate transfer of the shares from FOH to BIDCO? That would then mean that the rest of the press release makes sense.

This statement is the most telling for me, though:-

"BIDCO is unable to enter into public discussion regarding details of
the rescue package or future plans for the club"

It's nane of oor business.

---

The entire release could have been covered in a couple of sentences but they can't help patting each other on the back. What's confusing things is FoH don't know what is really going on until Bidco's lawyers tell them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jgl07

Did they actually spend one million on design fees or did they string along the Architect with promises of the commission once the stand received planning permission?

Either way, spending a million on the old stand would do little to solve the safety issues. A ball and chain is the only way to deal with that!

---

Did you see the number of boxes that "now that's what I call a planning application" filled?

The boxes alone must have cost well into 6 figures :agree:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

@WelshIrvine: Is it just my interpretation of events or are Hearts supporters now being expected to buy their club for the ownership of a private company?

@WelshIrvine: If so, it sadly fits in perfectly with the ethos of our times. A 'Labour man' backing a 'fan movement' as a front for private ownership.

---

He could well be right.

No matter the facts of the situation, perception is key here. If the "ordinary" Hearts fan (insert your own joke here) thinks he's getting shafted, then he'll back off.

I am sensing that Ms. Budge needs to clarify things.... for my sake if no-one else. :greengrin

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by the_ginger_hibee

Its not at odds with the FOH statement in my opinion. BIDCO owned & run exclusively by Budge buy the club. Only when the conditions of yesterdays FOH statement are met can BIDCO & FOH then enter negotiations to transfer the club. There is time constraints on this happening (3-5 years). All in the statement.

Any recent smoke from FOH and BDO has failed to mention BIDCO's prominence and instead spouted nonsense like 'Greatest Fan Movement Ever'...they have failed to even acknowledge a 3 year period in between where they will donate but have no control.

---

:agree:

This latest press release draws a clear distinction between BIDCO and FoH, describing them as separate entities.

Previously, the impression was that they were one and the same.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jacomoseven

:agree:

This latest press release draws a clear distinction between BIDCO and FoH, describing them as separate entities.

Previously, the impression was that they were one and the same.

---

Not mine. They have always been separate to me.

If anything, the latest release muddies things, compared to what they were.

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/footba...deal-1-3305696

Quote:

---

EDINBURGH businesswoman Ann Budge is poised to become the new majority shareholder of Hearts and oversee a transfer of control to fans group Foundation of Hearts (FoH), it has been confirmed.

---

I read FoH's description of BIDCO "providing the following support" as disingenuous. It seems more like the other way round... BIDCO is the buyer and FoH are going to tie themselves to a contract to pay her back.

Good deal for her - she gets to dabble at running a football club for a few years and then get her money back.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Weststandwanab

I would imagine the more intelligent supporters will be showing concern for the F.O.H. appearing to shift the goalposts regarding fan ownership.

---

I would imagine most yams will do what they're good at.... Stick there heads in the sand and ask hee haw... For a yam this must be like coming across an RTA, slowing down as they really want to know what's going on but scared as to what they might see.... :greengrin

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jacomoseven

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/footba...deal-1-3305696



I read FoH's description of BIDCO "providing the following support" as disingenuous. It seems more like the other way round... BIDCO is the buyer and FoH are going to tie themselves to a contract to pay her back.

Good deal for her - she gets to dabble at running a football club for a few years and then get her money back.

---

Will she be happy when the bills start rolling in and the Diddies can't cough up any more?

Another ambiguous statement in that press release:-

"On transfer of ownership of the majority shareholding to BIDCO, to transfer £1m to the club to
provide working capital"

Majority shareholding in whom?

1. if HMFC, that bears out my earlier guess that FOH buy the shares, then transfer them to BIDCO.

2. alternatively, does it mean that BIDCO will have a majority holding in FOH?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Geo_1875

Will she be happy when the bills start rolling in and the Diddies can't cough up any more?

---

Just wait for the terms of the legal agreement, which is yet to be drawn up. It might include a clause like this:

"In the case of FoH failing to cough up enough cash to BIDCO, BIDCO reserves the right to turf the club out of Tynecastle and flog the land for redevelopment, and FoH will accept full blame for the whole sorry mess."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Geo_1875

Will she be happy when the bills start rolling in and the Diddies can't cough up any more?

---

She could always follow that old yam tradition of not paying the bills...... :greengrin

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Another ambiguous statement in that press release:-

"On transfer of ownership of the majority shareholding to BIDCO, to transfer £1m to the club to
provide working capital"

Majority shareholding in whom?

1. if HMFC, that bears out my earlier guess that FOH buy the shares, then transfer them to BIDCO.

2. alternatively, does it mean that BIDCO will have a majority holding in FOH?

---

I read that as "On transfer of ownership of the majority shareholding in Hearts to BIDCO, FOH to transfer 1m to Hearts to provide working capital"

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Another ambiguous statement in that press release:-

"On transfer of ownership of the majority shareholding to BIDCO, to transfer £1m to the club to
provide working capital"

Majority shareholding in whom?

1. if HMFC, that bears out my earlier guess that FOH buy the shares, then transfer them to BIDCO.

2. alternatively, does it mean that BIDCO will have a majority holding in FOH?

---

I assume it means HMFC. I'm sticking to my guns here :wink: ... BIDCO is effectively the buyer (no matter if the shares technically pass through FoH's hands first), and is getting a £1m dowry from FoH.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eric

I read that as "On transfer of ownership of the majority shareholding in Hearts to BIDCO, FOH to transfer 1m to Hearts to provide working capital"

---

... which could only make sense if FOH buy the shares, and then transfer them immediately to BIDCO.

Can someone confirm that I'm picking all this up correctly.
The Lithuanians are going to sell the shares to bidco, bidco are then going to run the club for 3 years then hand it over to foh, foh will only gain control if bidco has been paid what they are owed.
During this 3 year period the fannies are still going to be paying the direct debits but will have absolutely no control over how the club is run, what's to stop them all just canceling their direct debits, their club will be out of administration so their won't be any need to keep paying up. Bidco would then put the club up for sale to get their money back.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jacomoseven

I assume it means HMFC. I'm sticking to my guns here :wink: ... BIDCO is effectively the buyer (no matter if the shares technically pass through FoH's hands first), and is getting a £1m dowry from FoH.

---

Yeah, it is, but that is what is different to what has been marketed before.

Unless we have misunderstood the previous trumpetings, the Diddies have signed up to something that has now been changed without their consent or knowledge.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lord bunberry

Can someone confirm that I'm picking all this up correctly.
The Lithuanians are going to sell the shares to bidco, bidco are then going to run the club for 3 years then hand it over to foh, foh will only gain control if bidco has been paid what they are owed.
During this 3 year period the fannies are still going to be paying the direct debits but will have absolutely no control over how the club is run, what's to stop them all just canceling their direct debits, their club will be out of administration so their won't be any need to keep paying up. Bidco would then put the club up for sale to get their money back.

---

The Lithuanians have a conditional agreement to sell to FOH, not Bidco. However, the latest thinking :greengrin has FOH transferring the shares to Bidco immediately after that.

The rest of your post is more or less correct. FOH will have representation on the HMFC Board, but how much power they will have is not clear.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Another ambiguous statement in that press release:-

"On transfer of ownership of the majority shareholding to BIDCO, to transfer £1m to the club to
provide working capital"

Majority shareholding in whom?

1. if HMFC, that bears out my earlier guess that FOH buy the shares, then transfer them to BIDCO.

2. alternatively, does it mean that BIDCO will have a majority holding in FOH?

---

From Ubig/Ukio to bidco? It looks to me that the Hearts fans won't get ownership till 2019.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by keekaboo

Here's the report in the Evening News last year saying that she is thought to still control 15% of the shares through Quantum, in Switzerland.


If FoH are now stating they wil gain control of only 79% of the shares, that means Vlad will still own, directly or indirectly, part of their club :greengrin

---

Has anyone mentioned to them that the shares are still frozen :dunno:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mikey

Has anyone mentioned to them that the shares are still frozen :dunno:

---

See you, Mikey, you can be so freaking negative at times.

:aok:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lord bunberry

Can someone confirm that I'm picking all this up correctly.
The Lithuanians are going to sell the shares to bidco, bidco are then going to run the club for 3 years then hand it over to foh, foh will only gain control if bidco has been paid what they are owed.
During this 3 year period the fannies are still going to be paying the direct debits but will have absolutely no control over how the club is run, what's to stop them all just canceling their direct debits, their club will be out of administration so their won't be any need to keep paying up. Bidco would then put the club up for sale to get their money back.

---

Nothing. And I would imagine this will be the Bidco fallback position if the diddies don't keep the fannies solvent.

Interesting that they appear to be budgeting for 2 years in Div1 with a £1.4M shortfall x 2. That's almost sensible and will surely never catch on in Yamland.

It's still a very ambitious stretch for them to keep up over £1M of donations every year for the next 5 on top of the usual STs etc. And after all that they are still only at the position of living within their means and with their dump of a stadium to rebuild.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Yeah, it is, but that is what is different to what has been marketed before.

Unless we have misunderstood the previous trumpetings, the Diddies have signed up to something that has now been changed without their consent or knowledge.

---

No argument from me here!

I assumed that FoH would be in control and running the club from the day they exit administration. This is categorically not the case.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sergey

It looks like Dexter is playing the totalitarian card and telling everyone to tow the party line or else they'll be punted from the forum.

Differing opinions aren't readily welcomed.

---

This is about you Sergey :greengrin


He clearly doesn't recognise the difference between infighting and adult discussion.


Adult discussion on yakbak :confused:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Yeah, it is, but that is what is different to what has been marketed before.

Unless we have misunderstood the previous trumpetings, the Diddies have signed up to something that has now been changed without their consent or knowledge.

---

What? Like the share issue you mean? You know, the one where all the money raised was to go to Youth Development.

David Southern will be heavily involved :wink:

EEN now reporting that Budgie has been getting advice from Potter. That's them totally screwed then.

She's also been asking for detailed job descriptions from all staff including players (I don't think that means asking Stevenson WTF do you do). If she runs her club the same way she ran her company there will be players selling programmes and cleaners playing sweeper. They're in for a shock.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens

Nothing. And I would imagine this will be the Bidco fallback position if the diddies don't keep the fannies solvent.

Interesting that they appear to be budgeting for 2 years in Div1 with a £1.4M shortfall x 2. That's almost sensible and will surely never catch on in Yamland.

It's still a very ambitious stretch for them to keep up over £1M of donations every year for the next 5 on top of the usual STs etc. And after all that they are still only at the position of living within their means and with their dump of a stadium to rebuild.

---

I doubt many will continue stumping up their cash once the club is saved, they'll know the club is out of any immediate danger, bidco will then put the club up for sale.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

The Lithuanians have a conditional agreement to sell to FOH, not Bidco. However, the latest thinking :greengrin has FOH transferring the shares to Bidco immediately after that.

The rest of your post is more or less correct. FOH will have representation on the HMFC Board, but how much power they will have is not clear.

---

At the risk of kicking off "Cropley Confusion" again...it looks to me like FOH are a nice front for BIDCO. You send a chubby clown in to deal with the Liths (who clearly doesn't know what he's talking about) and they take so much pity on him they more or less hand the Asbestos Wongadome to FOH on a plate. Post deal, evil BIDCO move in, tear the deeds from his little chubby hands and stand on his foot until he also hands over several million pounds. 'Fan control' my fan, eh? #Letsmakesomeonerich(er)

Whenever I pose the question "so who is actually gonna have control of hearts??" My brain just keeps answering "Searg?" No..... "Rosemary, the telephone operator??" No.... "Henry, the mild mannered janitor??" COULD BE!!!!! I'm ****ing confused I tell ya!!! Confused!!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mikey

Has anyone mentioned to them that the shares are still frozen :dunno:

---

The penny might have dropped with Banderson...

Quote:

---

Budge is expected to be installed as Hearts’ new chairwoman before the end of April, provided the club emerge from administration and their majority shareholding is transfered from Lithuanian companies Ukio Bankas and Ukio Bankas Investment Group (UBIG).

---

Still no mention of a court date in Lithuania, nor the creditors meetings at both institutions, but that doesn't really matter to #allisbarry.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyisGod

At the risk of kicking off "Cropley Confusion" again...it looks to me like FOH are a nice front for BIDCO. You send a chubby clown in to deal with the Liths (who clearly doesn't know what he's talking about) and they take so much pity on him they more or less hand the Asbestos Wongadome to FOH on a plate. Post deal, evil BIDCO move in, tear the deeds from his little chubby hands and stand on his foot until he also hands over several million pounds. 'Fan control' my fan, eh? #Letsmakesomeonerich(er)

---

Staying on my Hong Kong Phooey theme........ "It's fanarific!!!" Hey, that could be FOH wee slogan!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Not mine. They have always been separate to me.

If anything, the latest release muddies things, compared to what they were.

---

Separate legally.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Geo_1875

Will she be happy when the bills start rolling in and the Diddies can't cough up any more?

---

Yes as she will just threaten to sell the PBS and the will start paying again.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lord bunberry

Can someone confirm that I'm picking all this up correctly.
The Lithuanians are going to sell the shares to bidco, bidco are then going to run the club for 3 years then hand it over to foh, foh will only gain control if bidco has been paid what they are owed.
During this 3 year period the fannies are still going to be paying the direct debits but will have absolutely no control over how the club is run, what's to stop them all just canceling their direct debits, their club will be out of administration so their won't be any need to keep paying up. Bidco would then put the club up for sale to get their money back.

---

Pretty much.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mikey

Has anyone mentioned to them that the shares are still frozen :dunno:

---

Stop spoiling the diddies fun.

It's all coming out now...

http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.co...club-1-3305689

Quote:

---

THE Foundation of Hearts have revealed that £6 million will need to be raised over the next five years in order to save the club.

The figure was released as part of a statement setting out more detail of what will happen under the proposals to move the club out of administration and into fan ownership.

And it also revealed that Ann Budge, 65, would become executive chairman of Hearts on a “no fee” basis as she is currently the sole director of BIDCO 1874, the company that has struck a £2.5m deal with administrator BDO to enable the club to exit administration.

The deal would see BIDCO a controlling 78.98% of shares from UBIG, the bankrupt Lithuanian institution. Under a legally binding agreement to be drawn up those shares would be transferred to the fan-led Foundation of Hearts within five years.

The Foundation would agree to transfer £1m to the club to provide working capital once ownership is transferred to BIDCO, and would agree to provide working capital of £1.4m per annum for at least two years.

In total fans and supporters of the Foundation would be expected to raise £6m - although the statement said that if the current level of monthly contributions continued that figure would be met.

Hearts season-ticket holder Budge netted £40 million in 2005 when she sold her IT company Newell’s & Budge to French group Sopra 20 years after she founded it.

---

I am an MP might have some explaining to do. Weren't FoH named preferred bidder?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jacomoseven

It's all coming out now...

http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.co...club-1-3305689



I am an MP might have some explaining to do. Weren't FoH named preferred bidder?

---

So the biggest fan movement football has ever seen will take 5 years to kick in?? Am I right in saying that??

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mikey09

So the biggest fan movement football has ever seen will take 5 years to kick in?? Am I right in saying that??

---

Roll on 2019

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mikey09

So the biggest fan movement football has ever seen will take 5 years to kick in?? Am I right in saying that??

---

Do keep up. It's called a "supporter revolution" these days. But yes, it appears you are absolutely right about the rest. :greengrin

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

Roll on 2019

---

:faf::faf::faf::faf::faf::faf::faf:

You couldn't make it up!!! And wait till the yams paying direct debits see the calibre of player that will come in to play for the famous?? " Am no payin awe that money for us to watch that *****!!"

Aye... Happy days..... :greengrin

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

@The_FoH: [BIDCO]: BIDCO can and must ONLY sell to #FOH with a binding contract in place. This will take 3-5 years.

@The_FoH: [BIDCO]: BIDCO as majority shareholder of Hearts will control the board. Ann will put that in place in due course. #FOH will be fully rep.

I'm confused as usual. :-)

---

The first tweet is not accurate - as usual they're selective with the facts. "BIDCO can and must only sell to FOH........if FOH meet the terms of the contract and meet the agreed repayment schedule"....would be be more accurate.

If they don't then BIDCO can do what they please.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jacomoseven

Do keep up. It's called a "supporter revolution" these days. But yes, it appears you are absolutely right about the rest. :greengrin

---

Sorry... Supporter revolution!!! Even funnier!!! :faf::faf::faf::faf::faf::faf::faf:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sergey

The penny might have dropped with Banderson...



Still no mention of a court date in Lithuania, nor the creditors meetings at both institutions, but that doesn't really matter to #allisbarry.

---

I think there may be a reason for that :greengrin

:I'm waiti

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Actually, that has confused me now. It's at odds with yesterday' s press release and the previous statements.
I'll get back to you :-)

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk

---

I thought it was very clear that BIDCO - aka Budgie - will initially control and own the club. FOH will only own it once BIDCO have been repaid in full. And Budgie will be running the show in that interim period.

And at the end of it all they'll still be shi@t@

so when they talk about fan ownership , 7801 pay in but it will be literally 1 fan owning them :lolyam:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jacomoseven

It's all coming out now...

http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.co...club-1-3305689



I am an MP might have some explaining to do. Weren't FoH named preferred bidder?

---

That article is just nonsense on that score.

FOH have a conditional agreement to complete the CVA. No-one else has.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by PacoLuna

so when they talk about fan ownership , 7801 pay in but it will be literally 1 fan owning them :lolyam:

---

Does that mean, technically, they are fan owned??! :wink:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tamig

I thought it was very clear that BIDCO - aka Budgie - will initially control and own the club. FOH will only own it once BIDCO have been repaid in full. And Budgie will be running the show in that interim period.

---

... which is not how they sold the package in the first place.

Quality comment from over the road.......

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Some Yam Twat

we are currently running at a profit

---

Yet BDO have told them that they'll run out of money at the end of March. How does that work then :dunno:

I'm hoping now that the shares get unfrozen and the CVA proceeds. This looks the best potential for a Jambo civil war. The fans pay for five years of cost cutting 'tight ship' mediocrity on the tightest of budgets, why shelling out an extra million a year to get 'fan ownership' in five years time. If they succeed, they then have to finance the club on an ongoing basis. If they fail, and default, they've presumably bought the club for a private individual who can sell on the assets to recoup her outlay.

UNFREEZE THOSE BLASTED SHARES NOW!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mikey

Quality comment from over the road.......



Yet BDO have told them that they'll run out of money at the end of March. How does that work then :dunno:

---

Yamamomics still alive and well. 'We only owe it to ourselves.'

Have read and re-read the press statements re Mrs Budge's " takeover " and my " considered opinion " (:greengrin) is that it raises more question than supplying answers . :confused:
There appear to be more " If's, but's ,perhaps's, maybe's etc." than there has been previously !!

Anyone else agree or perhaps sees things differently ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dashing Bob S

I'm hoping now that the shares get unfrozen and the CVA proceeds. This looks the best potential for a Jambo civil war. The fans pay for five years of cost cutting 'tight ship' mediocrity on the tightest of budgets, why shelling out an extra million a year to get 'fan ownership' in five years time. If they succeed, they then have to finance the club on an ongoing basis. If they fail, and default, they've presumably bought the club for a private individual who can sell on the assets to recoup her outlay.

UNFREEZE THOSE BLASTED SHARES NOW!

---

Yes , think you have got that as near right as is possible without knowing all the facts.
Dangerous path to go down methinks . But then again what is the alternative ? Even the most ardent Jambo's I know were/are concerned as to how the club can maintain a stable existence in the next 5/6 years.

:cb

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mikey

Yet BDO have told them that they'll run out of money at the end of March. How does that work then :dunno:

---

Profit and cash flow are different measures. You can be profitable but have poor cashflow and vice versa.

I have tried to explain it to a Hearts fan in the office, like so...

The sums that FOH have to raise, according to what I’ve seen

£1million immediately
£1.4million each of the next 2 seasons
£2.5million to pay her back in 3-5 years time

That is £6.3 million,(NOT £6MILLION IN THE PRESS) to be raised over 5 years, just to see present commitments covered, not including the actual running of Hearts and the upkeep of the piggery. FOH have 7600 people paying by direct debit. That is about £830 from each and every one of them, would you want to throw that money away knowing you have nothing at the end of the day? And then there is the upkeep on the piggery. AND THE SHARES ARE FROZEN DUE TO INVESTIGATION INTO CRIMINAL ACTIVITY. And a main stand that was considered to be on the verge of losing its safety certificate 10 years ago (As were Hibs who replaced the main stand at the time).

I understand (sound like Chic Young) that there is an annual cost of £350k to ‘maintain’ the piggery, and that doesn’t include the estimated £6million to replace the main stand, or the upkeep of the 3 newer stands (that had a designed lifespan of 20 years)

IF they survive, and manage to pay their way, they are quickly going to be back in (deeper) debt trying to keep the piggery going.

Can you tell that I don’t actually believe they will get out of this easily?


I also sent her 2 valentines...

Roses are red
Cabbage is Green
Hibs are the best team
I've ever seen

Roses are red
Hearts are maroon
Endo of this season
They're going doon

Once Budgie has bought the lot, what is to prevent
the direct debitors from cancelling their commitment?
As the club is in "safe" hands, would the FOH still be
obliged to rise the finance to buy her out?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jdships

Have read and re-read the press statements re Mrs Budge's " takeover " and my " considered opinion " (:greengrin) is that it raises more question than supplying answers . :confused:
There appear to be more " If's, but's ,perhaps's, maybe's etc." than there has been previously !!

Anyone else agree or perhaps sees things differently ?

---

Pretty simple really:

1. the Budge bint is acquiring ownership and control of the Yams/the PBS at well under market value;

2. and getting the muppets to pay for it out of their families' clothing and food money instead of risking any of her own £40 million fortune;

3. all while being accclaimed as a hero and saviour.

She's not daft.

Is this £2.5m AB is lending interest free?

Or is AB taking her cut out of the Working Capital?

Or is she just asking for £1M pa salary instead?

:confused:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bighoose

Is this £2.5m AB is lending interest free?

Or is AB taking her cut out of the Working Capital?

Or is she just asking for £1M pa salary instead?

:confused:

---

According to the press release, she's taking no salary.

That's them imitating the Wee Team again.

I feel sorry for those of you that think it's hilarious that the yams will not achieve fan ownership until 2019.

Don't you people realise that they will be far to busy celebrating their glorious achievements in WW1 all the way through to the centenary in 2018 ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

According to the press release, she's taking no salary.

That's them imitating the Wee Team again.

---

I seem to recollect that the "loan" was being provided at a competitive rate of interest by the individuals, so unless that has changed, interest would be due on top of the capital.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by PatHead

I seem to recollect that the "loan" was being provided at a competitive rate of interest by the individuals, so unless that has changed, interest would be due on top of the capital.

---

There have been a few things changed, Pat, so who knows?

Budge is no fool, so I'm sure she will have that sorted.

A side issue. Like you, I was led to believe that there were a few people involved. The focus now seems to be on her alone, which is another siginificant shift.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by PatHead

I seem to recollect that the "loan" was being provided at a competitive rate of interest by the individuals, so unless that has changed, interest would be due on top of the capital.

---

Competitive with who? Wonga?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Geo_1875

I find the quoted figures interesting.

As far as I can see the Diddies need to find the following:

Year 1 - £1m for immediate working capital and football debt
+ £1.4m additional working capital
Year 2 - £1.4m working capital
Year 3-5 £2.5m repayment of Bidco investment

That looks like £6.3m which exceeds the £6m given by FoH and EEN as required from fans. It also does not include any additional working capital in years 3-5. Do they expect to be fully self-sufficient or are they hoping for further investment from their new chairperson?

---

Years 1-5 £1.2m expense tab for Murray and Foulkes

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Golden Fleece

I also sent her 2 valentines...

Roses are red
Cabbage is Green
Hibs are the best team
I've ever seen

Roses are red
Hearts are maroon
Endo of this season
They're going doon

---

I sent her another two poems..

Bears love Honey
Budgies love Trill
I love the Game
We won Seven Nil

You now have Five Points
You might end up with a Dozen
You can Dream all you want
But the shares are still Frozen

Budge's brother is a hibby,he is always in famous five stand bar before the games (if its the same woman, maiden name brydon)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

@WelshIrvine: Is it just my interpretation of events or are Hearts supporters now being expected to buy their club for the ownership of a private company?

@WelshIrvine: If so, it sadly fits in perfectly with the ethos of our times. A 'Labour man' backing a 'fan movement' as a front for private ownership.

---

Extorting charity and imposing austerity on the yams at the same time, but then they do like to "create history".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

That article is just nonsense on that score.

FOH have a conditional agreement to complete the CVA. No-one else has.

---

Apologies for being like a dog with a bone on this own CWG. I don't doubt your analysis of the ongoing situation based on the available info at all, and you have added immeasurably to this thread, but...

http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.co...taff-1-3306157

Quote:

---

Budge will appoint her own board upon taking control and the Foundation will be represented on it.

---

EEN are close to FoH and these reports are not being challenged as far as I know. Whatever has been said in the public domain up until this point, and whatever the exact arrangements of the transfer of shares, FoH are not taking control of this football club. Down the line, maybe, but not in the short term.

I don't know how FoH have presented themselves in negotiations with BDO but there is now a clear line of separation between them and Ann Budge. She is not even described as a member of FoH anymore.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jacomoseven

Apologies for being like a dog with a bone on this own CWG. I don't doubt your analysis of the ongoing situation based on the available info at all, and you have added immeasurably to this thread, but...

http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.co...taff-1-3306157



EEN are close to FoH and these reports are not being challenged as far as I know. Whatever has been said in the public domain up until this point, and whatever the exact arrangements of the transfer of shares, FoH are not taking control of this football club. Down the line, maybe, but not in the short term.

I don't know how FoH have presented themselves in negotiations with BDO but there is now a clear line of separation between them and Ann Budge. She is not even described as a member of FoH anymore.

---

No apologies needed. I am still getting my head around this.

What is, I think, without challenge is the fact that there has been a conditional agreement made between FOH and the HMFC creditors that FOH will buy the controlling shareholding in HMFC. That has been published by BDO and lodged with Companies House. I think it also has to be lodged with the Court.

What is emerging (and, remember the lack of media nous in these things) is that Ann Budge/BIDCO "will" own the club.

So, those two "facts" are clearly incompatible. Unless, as I say, FOH give/sell/transfer their shares to BIDCO as soon as they get them. The more I think about it, the more sense it makes to AB to have that control. It also, IMO, is in HMFC's interest to have AB (with all her experience) in control rather than Ian Murray et al.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jacomoseven

Apologies for being like a dog with a bone on this own CWG. I don't doubt your analysis of the ongoing situation based on the available info at all, and you have added immeasurably to this thread, but...

http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.co...taff-1-3306157



EEN are close to FoH and these reports are not being challenged as far as I know. Whatever has been said in the public domain up until this point, and whatever the exact arrangements of the transfer of shares, FoH are not taking control of this football club. Down the line, maybe, but not in the short term.

I don't know how FoH have presented themselves in negotiations with BDO but there is now a clear line of separation between them and Ann Budge. She is not even described as a member of FoH anymore.

---

I'm sure the FoH flyer said they were getting the shares from Lithuania and handing them straight over to Budgie.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

No apologies needed. I am still getting my head around this.

What is, I think, without challenge is the fact that there has been a conditional agreement made between FOH and the HMFC creditors that FOH will buy the controlling shareholding in HMFC. That has been published by BDO and lodged with Companies House. I think it also has to be lodged with the Court.

What is emerging (and, remember the lack of media nous in these things) is that Ann Budge/BIDCO "will" own the club.

So, those two "facts" are clearly incompatible. Unless, as I say, FOH give/sell/transfer their shares to BIDCO as soon as they get them. The more I think about it, the more sense it makes to AB to have that control. It also, IMO, is in HMFC's interest to have AB (with all her experience) in control rather than Ian Murray et al.

---

If you're toiling to understand all this CWG I'm ****ed!!! So I will read your posts with interest and in the meantime rip the piss out the yams...... :thumbsup: