Is it time to get properly behind Johnson?

[matty_f]

Today wasn't pretty. The first half was up there as one of the worst halves of football we've seen - marginally better than the 90 minutes at Motherwell last week and 70 minutes of the St Mirren game the week before.

The second half was better, the introduction of Joe Newell turned the game in our favour and we deserved the win in the end, and as with Thursday night, it was job done.

A few of us on here had pegged this week - just as we had the home tie v Inter d'Escalades - as make or break for Johnson.

It *could* have been a disastrous week for LJ and the team, but instead it's been a successful one.

Is it time now for us as a support to lower the pressure on the team by not putting the manager's head on the block with each next result, accept that he's here for the foreseeable and focus on backing him and the team?

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

No 🙄😏

[Borderhibbie76]

Yes I'd say - he's got a big month ahead as we have to start picking up points in league regardless of what happens in 2 Villa matches - we've tough games in there too esp Aberdeen and Killie away and St Mirren in Cup

[H18 SFR]

It’s a real shame that some supporters don’t want to support. The man has the backing of my daughters and I at the games. Best we can do is support him and the team as he does his best along with the squad to give us as many highs as possible.

[NC1875]

Nope. Get him gone

[Borderhibbie76]

Here come the Johnson out brigade to infect another thread on here - is it no bad enough we have the Johnson out thread - some fans honestly. I'm nowhere near LJs biggest fan but can we give it a rest for now

[JohnM1875]

Job done today. Wasn't pretty or if I'm honest, largely enjoyable. But we're through and have a huge game on Wednesday to look forward to. Where again, LJ has done his job by guiding us through the previous round.

That's up there with as bored and uninterested I've been at ER for a competitive game though.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Yes.

[Onion]

Happy to get behind the team, but jury is still out on LJ.

[Paulie Walnuts]

If we can start getting results in the league then yes.

Beating a lower league team at home in the cup doesn’t gain him anywhere near enough credit to change my opinion on him. Wins and performances in the league (and Europe, but I suspect there won’t be anymore of them) will.

[Northernhibee]

At the games, goes without saying.

When it comes to discussions on a discussions board about Hibs, he needs to prove he can get a tune out of this team on a consistent basis. We won today which means in terms of mission objectives, a big tick. We were however quite poor for notable parts of the game.

If he can show in time that injuries and fatigue were a factor then the win will be all that counts but if not then there are an awful lot of question marks over his head.

He has some credit in the back, but not a huge amount.

[DH1875]

Its Raith Rovers for duck sake. Let's see how we go against Villa. No I don't expect us to win but I do expect as to run and fight like a pride of lions.

[JohnM1875]

Its Raith Rovers for duck sake. Let's see how we go against Villa. No I don't expect us to win but I do expect as to run and fight like a pride of lions.

To be honest it's probably fairer to judge him on how we do against Rovers than it is Villa! They're almost playing a different game with the level of finances available.

[Sheffhibee]

Absolutely Matty, give the bloke a chance, it's an absolute roller coaster with him but a lot more fun watching Hibs. I still shudder when I remember some of the Jack Ross / Maloney spells of turgid eye watering football we endured in recent years

[Eyrie]

I support Hibs, not our manager.

Right now I'm still minded to keep Johnson but I am aware that would change if we have a run of bad results which is the case with any manager that we appoint.

[007]

Nope. Get him gone

You'll need us to get more defeats to get your wish.

[DH1875]

To be honest it's probably fairer to judge him on how we do against Rovers than it is Villa! They're almost playing a different game with the level of finances available.

So not great then.

[Hibees1973]

I for one will not be here praising the things Johnson spouts out most of the time.

Johnson has been here long enough for us to know what he's like and I just don't like him. This rollercoaster of performances (more poor than good so far this season) is the way it's going to be with him in future.

The games against Villa and Luzern are a bit of a sideshow to be honest. Yes, he should get some credit for getting past Luzern but I think it's been more than nullified with our league performances and today. Yes, we squeezed through but it's likely that if we were up against any Premiership opposition today we would be out.

He won't be judged against Villa. We could lose by more than 7 or 8 on aggregate.

What he will be judged on is to move on the dross who do not contribute anything and get better players in the door before the transfer window ends. The squad put together has little chance of being third in the league.

If he gets better players, in my opinion I still feel he is not a good enough manager to get a level of consistency that will see us improve on last season.

[matty_f]

I for one will not be here praising the things Johnson spouts out most of the time.

Johnson has been here long enough for us to know what he's like and I just don't like him. This rollercoaster of performances (more poor than good so far this season) is the way it's going to be with him in future.

The games against Villa and Luzern are a bit of a sideshow to be honest. Yes, he should get some credit for getting past Luzern but I think it's been more than nullified with our league performances and today. Yes, we squeezed through but it's likely that if we were up against any Premiership opposition today we would be out.

He won't be judged against Villa. We could lose by more than 7 or 8 on aggregate.

What he will be judged on is to move on the dross who do not contribute anything and get better players in the door before the transfer window ends. The squad put together has little chance of being third in the league.

If he gets better players, in my opinion I still feel he is a good enough manager to get a level of consistency that will see us improve on last season.

The point isn't really to have folk come on and praise him, more to lay off the "if he doesn't win x,y, or z then he has to go" then when he gets through those games "well, he needs to win a, b and c instead".


That constant pushing the demand down the line when a (desired?) outcome isn't achieved.

[greenlex]

Probably …………in fact yes but it’ll end in tears. :agree:

[Pete70]

Yes it is

[The Modfather]

Today wasn't pretty. The first half was up there as one of the worst halves of football we've seen - marginally better than the 90 minutes at Motherwell last week and 70 minutes of the St Mirren game the week before.

The second half was better, the introduction of Joe Newell turned the game in our favour and we deserved the win in the end, and as with Thursday night, it was job done.

A few of us on here had pegged this week - just as we had the home tie v Inter d'Escalades - as make or break for Johnson.

It *could* have been a disastrous week for LJ and the team, but instead it's been a successful one.

Is it time now for us as a support to lower the pressure on the team by not putting the manager's head on the block with each next result, accept that he's here for the foreseeable and focus on backing him and the team?

Performances are more of a concern than results. It’s chicken and egg territory IMO. Begin to show consistency in the performances (regardless of results) and there’s something to get behind. Inconsistent performances (regardless of the results) after a year, and with the money spent, it’s not unreasonable to wonder if we’re building anything or just stumbling along a bit aimlessly.

[Hibees1973]

I heard one of the more sensible pundits on the radio say yesterday that the things Johnson says are puzzling. He is a bit of marmite character and divides opinion.

What irritates me is I wish we had a manager like McLeish, Stubbs, Lennon or Ross in charge at a time when no Hibs manager in my time watching them has had the financial backing he's had.

Yes, some people out there will pick faults out of some of the our previous managers I've listed, but I just feel they are all better than Johnson. I've no doubt we can do much better than Johnson.

I would have more hope and faith if Hibs had a better manager in place at a time when with the resources we have now we could have some success.

[Hibee Mac]

I agree, as a fan base we have got to stop the constant "this is a make or break game" stuff.

Ever since we sacked Maloney (rightly so), I have made a conscious decision to stop expecting managers to be sacked and start putting far more of my expectations on the players themselves.

By the point Maloney left, the same players had seen off a silly amount of managers with incredibly inconsistent performances and frequent let downs in big games.

With LJ, there are undoubtedly better managers out there, however I honestly think the impact of the manager is overstated in Scottish football. We need great players, great recruitment. To oversimplify things a little, all the manager has to do to make Hibs successful is keep the dressing room on his side and keep things ticking along.

If we have crap players we'll be crap, great players we'll be a good watch. Recruitment is key, and we've finally made a move to address that this season.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk

[Jones28]

I heard one of the more sensible pundits on the radio say yesterday that the things Johnson says are puzzling. He is a bit of marmite character and divides opinion.

What irritates me is I wish we had a manager like McLeish, Stubbs, Lennon or Ross in charge at a time when no Hibs manager in my time watching them has had the financial backing he's had.

Yes, some people out there will pick faults out of some of the our previous managers I've listed, but I just feel they are all better than Johnson. I've no doubt we can do much better than Johnson.

I would have more hope and faith if Hibs had a better manager in place at a time when with the resources we have now we could have some success.

Who was it, out of interest? The only pundit I used to think was genuinely sensible and subjective was mikey stewart but he’s turned in to one of them.

[Aldo]

The point isn't really to have folk come on and praise him, more to lay off the "if he doesn't win x,y, or z then he has to go" then when he gets through those games "well, he needs to win a, b and c instead".


That constant pushing the demand down the line when a (desired?) outcome isn't achieved.

Praise where praise is due at at the moment he has us in the QF of the league cup and a chance to progress in Europe.
I have no issue being beaten by a far better team but our league form so far is terrible.

I want us to win ever game but know we wont.

The team gets my support however if we are sitting bottom of the league after 4/5 games then something needs to change. Yes all if’s and-maybes or x,y,z but if that’s the case he goes for me.

[Lago]

:top marks
Here come the Johnson out brigade to infect another thread on here - is it no bad enough we have the Johnson out thread - some fans honestly. I'm nowhere near LJs biggest fan but can we give it a rest for now

[Brightside]

No. He should be judged like every other manager. Not sure why this guy has some hall pass. It’s really odd how some are acting about him. I really liked jack Ross. I didn’t complain about people debating his ability.

[Hibees1973]

Who was it, out of interest? The only pundit I used to think was genuinely sensible and subjective was mikey stewart but he’s turned in to one of them.

Tin hat, Rory Loy. He was the guy who provided the BBC analysis on our away game in Luzern. Think he did the co-commentary of our home game against Luzern.

Some on here may label him a slaver as well.....hate that word.

[degenerated]

Its Raith Rovers for duck sake. Let's see how we go against Villa. No I don't expect us to win but I do expect as to run and fight like a pride of lions.Sort of like we did against luzern?

[Aldo]

Here come the Johnson out brigade to infect another thread on here - is it no bad enough we have the Johnson out thread - some fans honestly. I'm nowhere near LJs biggest fan but can we give it a rest for now

Matty has asked the question so you have to expect a variety of views from others including those who want him gone.

[matty_f]

No. He should be judged like every other manager. Not sure why this guy has some hall pass. It’s really odd how some are acting about him. I really liked jack Ross. I didn’t complain about people debating his ability.

Debating ability and constantly calling for his head if x, y or z conditions aren't met are two different things, and I think we can still discuss how he's doing without always wanting him sacked after every defeat.

[Since452]

I'd prefer we got behind every manager. Especially after wins. The "get him out" thing really doesn't help anything at all, it just causes damage. If we're wanting the guy out after a monumental effort in Europe and cup progression then he's on a hiding to nothing really.

[degenerated]

Today wasn't pretty. The first half was up there as one of the worst halves of football we've seen - marginally better than the 90 minutes at Motherwell last week and 70 minutes of the St Mirren game the week before.

The second half was better, the introduction of Joe Newell turned the game in our favour and we deserved the win in the end, and as with Thursday night, it was job done.

A few of us on here had pegged this week - just as we had the home tie v Inter d'Escalades - as make or break for Johnson.

It *could* have been a disastrous week for LJ and the team, but instead it's been a successful one.

Is it time now for us as a support to lower the pressure on the team by not putting the manager's head on the block with each next result, accept that he's here for the foreseeable and focus on backing him and the team?Hope so, it's tedious as ****.

[Smartie]

No. He should be judged like every other manager. Not sure why this guy has some hall pass. It’s really odd how some are acting about him. I really liked jack Ross. I didn’t complain about people debating his ability.

That’s kind of where I am - firmly behind Johnson but I have no problem with those who disagree.

Hibs will have targets for each competition - so far I reckon we’ll have met / exceeded expectation in Europe, we’re on track to meet / exceed expectation in the league cup but our league start has been dreadful. The good thing about it being this way round is that he gets 30 odd games to rectify the league situation whereas 1 or 2 poor performances or results in the others see us knocked out.

If we find ourselves seriously floundering after the 1st round of fixtures (a la Hecky) then I think we can have a conversation about his future but until then I’m with him.

I think what is shaping up to be his 1st choice team is going to be worth watching.

[makaveli1875]

Yes it's time to get behind him . Every time we've lost a game in the 7 or so years iv been on here the hibs.net firing squad comes out in force wanting the manager fired .
We're never going to win every game , we're never going to play our best in every game . Johnsons had some good results and performances since he came in , he's had some stinkers too , just like every other hibs manager in.my lifetime

[WhileTheChief..]

Fully behind him at every game.

The Villa results won't sway me, it's all about the league.

Get us into the top 5 pronto, within a few points of 3rd, keep us challenging there, and I don't think he'll be under any pressure at all.

If we're soon 10 points or so adrift of Hearts / Aberdeen / whoever is 3rd, then the pressure will be back on.

Let's try leading from the front instead of playing catch up this season.

[Hiber-nation]

Last season was a bit of a rollercoaster. This season it's similar but the bad performances have been worse. He has to get a good quality midfielder in before the deadline otherwise he could be in real trouble. A home defeat v Livi and he might not get to the end of the month.

[Brightside]

Debating ability and constantly calling for his head if x, y or z conditions aren't met are two different things, and I think we can still discuss how he's doing without always wanting him sacked after every defeat.

It’s mainly the Johnson In posters that keep bringing it up tbh. I’ve already said he will be here long term. But this whole let’s not point out how rubbish a game was is daft. When it’s pish it’s pish. When it’s good it’s good.

[Hibrandenburg]

Today wasn't pretty. The first half was up there as one of the worst halves of football we've seen - marginally better than the 90 minutes at Motherwell last week and 70 minutes of the St Mirren game the week before.

The second half was better, the introduction of Joe Newell turned the game in our favour and we deserved the win in the end, and as with Thursday night, it was job done.

A few of us on here had pegged this week - just as we had the home tie v Inter d'Escalades - as make or break for Johnson.

It *could* have been a disastrous week for LJ and the team, but instead it's been a successful one.

Is it time now for us as a support to lower the pressure on the team by not putting the manager's head on the block with each next result, accept that he's here for the foreseeable and focus on backing him and the team?

In my 57 years on this planet I've come to realise that many Hibs fans just go to watch Hibs to moan and only support the team when they're winning, even then some still bump their gums about every mistake no matter how small that some players make.

Some of the negative comments are laughable and ridiculous and I genuinely ask myself if there are fans of other clubs up to skulduggery amongst the moaners. Being a Hibs fan is always going to be a roller coaster ride, either enjoy the ups and downs or find another team or hobby because the chances are high that the next management team can only piss with the cock they have too.

[A Hi-Bee]

Been sitting on the fence for a few weeks or so, in fact getting splinters in ma arse but what I say will not effect LJ in the slightest.
I reserve the right to slag him off later, when results are crap.

[sauzeelegod]

No.
We’re far too inconsistent and so far this season we are a hoofball team.

[Keepthefaith]

Whilst I don't think we need another thread repeating the same points, I do think it's a more balanced approach than simply Johnson out.

My frustrations centre on the following with him and stop me getting completely behind him:
1. Low tempo/ press in games when this is his stated identity
2. Lack of evidence of youth being given a chance, again something he's said he's committed to (today was ideal IMO to try a young player in Newell's absence, someone like Rudi or Reuben who are forward playing)
3. Lack of creativity in midfield so we play too long, too often
4. Marshall... surely he's got to tell him to play it out quicker and Hanlon as Captain has to give him responsibility on the pitch to demand more.

For all youan has come up with valuable strikes it's also apparent that Newell is potentially saving Johnson just now.

Manager sets the standard, look at what Howe has done at Newcastle, even when he initially came in and avoided relegation. The manager should also be open to critique from his coaching team, I do wonder what the hell they're saying to as they're all culpable for implementing the style and the values

[Dmas]

Whilst I don't think we need another thread repeating the same points, I do think it's a more balanced approach than simply Johnson out.

My frustrations centre on the following with him and stop me getting completely behind him:
1. Low tempo/ press in games when this is his stated identity
2. Lack of evidence of youth being given a chance, again something he's said he's committed to (today was ideal IMO to try a young player in Newell's absence, someone like Rudi or Reuben who are forward playing)
3. Lack of creativity in midfield so we play too long, too often
4. Marshall... surely he's got to tell him to play it out quicker and Hanlon as Captain has to give him responsibility on the pitch to demand more.

For all youan has come up with valuable strikes it's also apparent that Newell is potentially saving Johnson just now.

Manager sets the standard, look at what Howe has done at Newcastle, even when he initially came in and avoided relegation. The manager should also be open to critique from his coaching team, I do wonder what the hell they're saying to as they're all culpable for implementing the style and the values


it was claimed last weeks win against a much more fancied side than us at ER was masterminded by Adam Owen as to not give praise to LJ and now he's not open to his coaching team

[B.H.F.C]

Suppose it depends how you define getting behind him.

For me, I show support by attending pretty much every game. I don’t really look at passing comment on what I watch or my opinion on individuals as being a lack of support. I just want Hibs to be the best they can be and I think the manager is critical in us being able to be that. Commenting on abilities, decisions or performances of individuals doesn’t mean I’m not backing them to do well.

What happens against Villa happens. If we somehow managed to progress it would obviously be a huge positive for Johnson (and everyone else). Even a heavy defeat won’t be particularly worthy of criticism.

Big 10 days ahead in the transfer market which will be critical for Johnson though. If we don’t address some longstanding issues then I fear for him as I think we will continue to see indifferent performances.

[Gatecrasher]

I'm willing to be win over, the issue is that he's not done much to convince me that he's the guy to take us where I think we should be. We need to be playing at a much better level than we are now. I think if results and performances don't improve after our european adventure then he's in real trouble imo.

[hibsforeurope]

Some Folk like him, some folk tolerate him and others don't like him at all.

That’s fine and always the case but results and results alone should determine if he stays or goes.

If he wins the games we should win and compete in the others he’ll get support.

[Unseen work]

Happy to get behind the team, but jury is still out on LJ.

Have you not seen some of the mistakes the players have made? Nothing to do with set up, coaching etc.

Just really poor individual errors.

Obviously Johnson has his faults, but so do the players so many show blind faith to

[A Hi-Bee]

it was claimed last weeks win against a much more fancied side than us at ER was masterminded by Adam Owen as to not give praise to LJ and now he's not open to his coaching team

Who was it speaking to the press after the game?

[scoopyboy]

If we can start getting results in the league then yes.

Beating a lower league team at home in the cup doesn’t gain him anywhere near enough credit to change my opinion on him. Wins and performances in the league (and Europe, but I suspect there won’t be anymore of them) will.

Agreed but if we had lost the drums would have been banging again to get him out.

Im pretty meh about LJ but he's getting it in the neck no matter what he does.

Hibs were on a hiding to nothing today, some were suggesting putting out a glorified development team whilst others were wanting a strong team as the League Cup is one of two realistic chances of a trophy. We ended up getting something in between and we got through, wasn't pretty but it was never going to be.

[Keepthefaith]

it was claimed last weeks win against a much more fancied side than us at ER was masterminded by Adam Owen as to not give praise to LJ and now he's not open to his coaching team

I don't buy that either, think the Euro games have shown his strengths. Also just to point out I'm not someone who's been in the Johnson out camp...but do want us to be better than were showing in the league. I'll never get those 90 minutes back from Motherwell away 😬

[Skol]

It wasn’t pretty today, especially the first half. However the key thing is we progressed. He noted one of the issues in midfield and changed that at half time and that was a big part of the difference

Mega and harbourless had solid games and I particularly like the arm round mega when he came off and a chat about things. I don’t know what was said, but it looked good man management to me.

Theirs is still a lot that needs improved though, but we need to get off his back and allow him time.

[Brightside]

it was claimed last weeks win against a much more fancied side than us at ER was masterminded by Adam Owen as to not give praise to LJ and now he's not open to his coaching team

One person said that I think.

[TrumpIsAPeado]

Let's get real here. Fans are fickle and we're not collectively going to be behind the manager unless the team is punching above it's weight in all departments. He'll mostly get a pass when results go our way and he'll mostly be hounded when they don't. It'll swing back and forth, such is the nature of the game.

[147lothian]

Lets back LJ. Nothing good comes out of chopping and changing with managerial merry go rounds.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Agreed but if we had lost the drums would have been banging again to get him out.

Im pretty meh about LJ but he's getting it in the neck no matter what he does.

Hibs were on a hiding to nothing today, some were suggesting putting out a glorified development team whilst others were wanting a strong team as the League Cup is one of two realistic chances of a trophy. We ended up getting something in between and we got through, wasn't pretty but it was never going to be.

They would have been, but that’s just the nature of being the manager of one of the biggest teams in the country with financial backing that most teams in Scotland could only dream of. The truth of the matter is that games like todays are pretty much no-win situations.

In my opinion he was coming into this season with no credit in the bank, in fact he was in a slight debit. The performances in Andorra, St Mirren and Motherwell plus the results created a larger debit whilst the wins against the Swiss gained him some credit.

Imo he’s still in debit though. If he can get us a few wins in the league then he’ll maybe have some credit in the bank but if we start to fall 6 or 7 behind Hearts and Aberdeen then it will be time to go for me.

With regards to support though, whilst he’s been heavily criticised online, he can have no complaints about the support he’s received at games really. The fans have backed him and the team brilliantly.

[jeffers]

A thread that’s intended to support the manager (well I’m assuming that was the point) starts off with the first half being one of the worst we’ve seen then goes on to suggest we should support him 🤔 Am I missing the joke ?

When he starts to put together some form of consistency and I’m not even talking about results then he will get some breathing space. Until then…

Asides from anything else my venting about him is restricted to this place. I’m struggling to see what my “support” of him on here will actually matter.

[Key West]

Thread started with the best of intentions but once again hijacked by folk that no more than the professionals.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Thread started with the best of intentions but once again hijacked by folk that no more than the professionals.

It’s people responding to the question asked in the title, which I’d suggest was the fairly clear intention of the thread.

Just cause you don’t agree with some peoples opinions it doesn’t mean anything’s been hijacked.

[jeffers]

Thread started with the best of intentions but once again hijacked by folk that no more than the professionals.

Have you actually read the title of the OP ? He asked a question. Huge shock, he’s had some replies.

[Unseen work]

Whilst I don't think we need another thread repeating the same points, I do think it's a more balanced approach than simply Johnson out.

My frustrations centre on the following with him and stop me getting completely behind him:
1. Low tempo/ press in games when this is his stated identity
2. Lack of evidence of youth being given a chance, again something he's said he's committed to (today was ideal IMO to try a young player in Newell's absence, someone like Rudi or Reuben who are forward playing)
3. Lack of creativity in midfield so we play too long, too often
4. Marshall... surely he's got to tell him to play it out quicker and Hanlon as Captain has to give him responsibility on the pitch to demand more.

For all youan has come up with valuable strikes it's also apparent that Newell is potentially saving Johnson just now.

Manager sets the standard, look at what Howe has done at Newcastle, even when he initially came in and avoided relegation. The manager should also be open to critique from his coaching team, I do wonder what the hell they're saying to as they're all culpable for implementing the style and the values

Surely you can’t criticise him for the second one today when he gave Megwa his debut and also started Harbottle who is still young and inexperienced himself.

I think the team was just about bang on today with the blend - although I’d have liked to see the two mentioned come on at some point for minutes today.

Unfortunately even if they were I doubt they would have got on as the game wasn’t ever comfortable/won

[Crunchie]

Today wasn't pretty. The first half was up there as one of the worst halves of football we've seen - marginally better than the 90 minutes at Motherwell last week and 70 minutes of the St Mirren game the week before.

The second half was better, the introduction of Joe Newell turned the game in our favour and we deserved the win in the end, and as with Thursday night, it was job done.

A few of us on here had pegged this week - just as we had the home tie v Inter d'Escalades - as make or break for Johnson.

It *could* have been a disastrous week for LJ and the team, but instead it's been a successful one.

Is it time now for us as a support to lower the pressure on the team by not putting the manager's head on the block with each next result, accept that he's here for the foreseeable and focus on backing him and the team?
yes.

[JimBHibees]

Today wasn't pretty. The first half was up there as one of the worst halves of football we've seen - marginally better than the 90 minutes at Motherwell last week and 70 minutes of the St Mirren game the week before.

The second half was better, the introduction of Joe Newell turned the game in our favour and we deserved the win in the end, and as with Thursday night, it was job done.

A few of us on here had pegged this week - just as we had the home tie v Inter d'Escalades - as make or break for Johnson.

It *could* have been a disastrous week for LJ and the team, but instead it's been a successful one.

Is it time now for us as a support to lower the pressure on the team by not putting the manager's head on the block with each next result, accept that he's here for the foreseeable and focus on backing him and the team?

Yes it is. Should be supported and see where we are nearer Christmas. This permanent gagging for him to be sacked doesn't help at all imo.

[JammyDoidger]

The issue for me is you just do not know which Hibs are going to turn up, it's impossible to predict if we will win or not regardless if we are playing Celtic or Livi, your never confident going into any game, even today's. We still have massive weak links in this team and that's on the manager, his selections are baffling 3 transfer windows in, still hasn't a clue what his best 11 is, sticks with it till we lose then changes again, it's no wonder we are inconsistent, he's going nowhere though that's obvious, so we've no option but to listen to his nonsense and get behind the team. Fwiw though once things settle down after Europe, I think we will be fine this season and challenging for 3rd and 4th again, we have too much quality not to be. He needs to read the room better in interviews and understand us more as a support and stop embarrasing us with the crap he comes out with, that will help him a fair bit.

[Cat Stanton]

Here come the Johnson out brigade to infect another thread on here - is it no bad enough we have the Johnson out thread - some fans honestly. I'm nowhere near LJs biggest fan but can we give it a rest for now

Well in fairness, it's a thread asking about Johnson. I don't think you can accuse people of "infecting" a thread when they have in effect been asked their opinion...??!!

[AgentDaleCooper]

Probably …………in fact yes but it’ll end in tears. :agree:

Correct answer :aok:

[B.H.F.C]

Surely you can’t criticise him for the second one today when he gave Megwa his debut and also started Harbottle who is still young and inexperienced himself.

I think the team was just about bang on today with the blend - although I’d have liked to see the two mentioned come on at some point for minutes today.

Unfortunately even if they were I doubt they would have got on as the game wasn’t ever comfortable/won

I didn’t have an issue with the team he picked today. I thought it was pretty sensible from what we have. Folk were wanting Youan and Boyle left out which we just can’t do. If we did we’d have next to no threat.

The issue I do have is that we are so reliant on them to create and that we still have so little creativity elsewhere. Middle of the park still not properly addressed and I worry for us that if it’s not, we’ll continue to struggle.

[Cat Stanton]

No.
We’re far too inconsistent and so far this season we are a hoofball team.

That's the thing for me. The miserable, miserable, quality (ha ha) of the football. Goalkeeper to centre-back, centre-back to other centre-back, and then hoof... 60 yard aimless pass over and over again. Is that what he tells them to do?

It's dire. And to think we used to slag off hearts for this kind of "football". Desperate stuff.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Yes it is. Should be supported and see where we are nearer Christmas. This permanent gagging for him to be sacked doesn't help at all imo.

Surely the thing that isn’t helping the most is the results and performances?

The gagging for him to be sacked isn’t going away because the bad results and performances aren’t going away.

Put simply, if he starts getting performances and results regularly then the gagging for him to be sacked will stop. Until he does that it won’t. Lee Johnson is the one in control of that, not the fans.

[Keepthefaith]

Surely you can’t criticise him for the second one today when he gave Megwa his debut and also started Harbottle who is still young and inexperienced himself.

I think the team was just about bang on today with the blend - although I’d have liked to see the two mentioned come on at some point for minutes today.

Unfortunately even if they were I doubt they would have got on as the game wasn’t ever comfortable/won

But that's exactly it, you don't just play young prospects when the game is done, if you say you're giving youth a chance and the players have had some experience ( which they have) AND the game is needing an injection of creativity then yeah I would question why one of them wasn't given a chance.

[TrumpIsAPeado]

That's the thing for me. The miserable, miserable, quality (ha ha) of the football. Goalkeeper to centre-back, centre-back to other centre-back, and then hoof... 60 yard aimless pass over and over again. Is that what he tells them to do?

It's dire. And to think we used to slag off hearts for this kind of "football". Desperate stuff.

I doubt he's telling them to do that. It's more likely that teams have realized that our defence is prone to panicking when high pressed. Resulting in rushed clearance punts up the field, rather than building from the back. Lee Johnson is probably more frustrated about this than anybody else. But at the end of the day, it's his job to organize the squad and instil confidence into the players and he appears to be struggling in this regard.

[Pretty Boy]

How does getting behind the manager actually work? If it's not genuine then does it just mean not sharing how you actually feel about him?

I attend every home game, a few away games and rarely, if ever, vent any anger at the manager or indeed the players during a game. I'll pass comment after games, praise the manager when I feel it is merited and criticise likewise (if anyone really wants to check that then it's easily verifiable).

I can't do much more than that. For now I don't think Johnson's job is in imminent danger and I'm not calling for him to go but I still haven't seen enough progress to convince me he is a long term answer. What happens against Villa will happen, if we don't improve in the league though then my position against him will harden, pretending otherwise is just lying to myself and putting on an act for no real reason. Ultimately my opinion counts for nothing so it's as well to be an honest one.

[Hibernian Verse]

Tin hat, Rory Loy. He was the guy who provided the BBC analysis on our away game in Luzern. Think he did the co-commentary of our home game against Luzern.

Some on here may label him a slaver as well.....hate that word.

I think you need to go and listen again. You’ve heard what you wanted to hear. What Loy actually said was that he enjoys the way Johnson speaks, although he admitted it wasn’t for everyone.

[jeffers]

How does getting behind the manager actually work? If it's not genuine then does it just mean not sharing how you actually feel about him?

I attend every home game, a few away games and rarely, if ever, vent any anger at the manager or indeed the players during a game. I'll pass comment after games, praise the manager when I feel it is merited and criticise likewise (if anyone really wants to check that then it's easily verifiable).

I can't do much more than that. For now I don't think Johnson's job is in imminent danger and I'm not calling for him to go but I still haven't seen enough progress to convince me he is a long term answer. What happens against Villa will happen, if we don't improve in the league though then my position against him will harden, pretending otherwise is just lying to myself and putting on an act for no real reason. Ultimately my opinion counts for nothing so it's as well to be an honest one.

:agree: I’m sure Matty’s OP was well intended, but I genuinely don’t think what’s posted in here really matters one way or another (although some will disagree) I’ve said it before but when the crowd really turns on him at games his time will be up. For now it’s just a message board chat where his pros and cons are being discussed.

[WhileTheChief..]

Thread started with the best of intentions but once again hijacked by folk that no more than the professionals.

Hijacked?? Folk are responding to the OP.

Would you rather just read 20 or so replies of people saying "yeah, it's time to back LJ, great post"?

There's absolutely nothing stopping people from posting their own positive take on things. You could even do so yourself instead of the dig at others.

[Paulie Walnuts]

How does getting behind the manager actually work? If it's not genuine then does it just mean not sharing how you actually feel about him?

I attend every home game, a few away games and rarely, if ever, vent any anger at the manager or indeed the players during a game. I'll pass comment after games, praise the manager when I feel it is merited and criticise likewise (if anyone really wants to check that then it's easily verifiable).

I can't do much more than that. For now I don't think Johnson's job is in imminent danger and I'm not calling for him to go but I still haven't seen enough progress to convince me he is a long term answer. What happens against Villa will happen, if we don't improve in the league though then my position against him will harden, pretending otherwise is just lying to myself and putting on an act for no real reason. Ultimately my opinion counts for nothing so it's as well to be an honest one.

:agree:

Great post.

[scoopyboy]

General question.

Do you think our messageboards have turned against LJ quicker and for less reason than other managers?

I thought Neil Lennon got away with a far easier time of it when he had clearly chucked it, similarly with Yogi.

We have established that the people who aren't impressed with him keep it on here and don't (as yet:greengrin) show it at games which is fine.

Interested to hear folk's views.

[matty_f]

A thread that’s intended to support the manager (well I’m assuming that was the point) starts off with the first half being one of the worst we’ve seen then goes on to suggest we should support him 🤔 Am I missing the joke ?

When he starts to put together some form of consistency and I’m not even talking about results then he will get some breathing space. Until then…

Asides from anything else my venting about him is restricted to this place. I’m struggling to see what my “support” of him on here will actually matter.
Not missing the joke, more the point.

[Ozyhibby]

If he wins games and the team improve he’ll get to stay and if he doesn’t, he’ll be gone. Right now we are bottom of the league. Until he sorts that then he’s going to be criticised.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Paulie Walnuts]

General question.

Do you think our messageboards have turned against LJ quicker and for less reason than other managers?

I thought Neil Lennon got away with a far easier time of it when he had clearly chucked it, similarly with Yogi.

We have established that the people who aren't impressed with him keep it on here and don't (as yet:greengrin) show it at games which is fine.

Interested to hear folk's views.

LJ at one point had a poorer record than Maloney having managed more games. The almost universal opinion on Maloney was he had to go so in that regard I’d say LJ has had more leeway than Maloney did.

Heckingbottom probably got turned on quicker as well.

[scoopyboy]

LJ at one point had a poorer record than Maloney having managed more games. The almost universal opinion on Maloney was he had to go so in that regard I’d say LJ has had more leeway than Maloney did.

Heckingbottom probably got turned on quicker as well.

And in hindsight possibly too quick?

[Paulie Walnuts]

And in hindsight possibly too quick?

Without knowing what would have happened had he stayed it’s impossible to say.

I actually remember watching us at the start of the 19/20 season and wondering how we were getting beat a lot of the time. I backed him longer than most but by the end there was no sign of things changing though.

[matty_f]

How does getting behind the manager actually work? If it's not genuine then does it just mean not sharing how you actually feel about him?

I attend every home game, a few away games and rarely, if ever, vent any anger at the manager or indeed the players during a game. I'll pass comment after games, praise the manager when I feel it is merited and criticise likewise (if anyone really wants to check that then it's easily verifiable).

I can't do much more than that. For now I don't think Johnson's job is in imminent danger and I'm not calling for him to go but I still haven't seen enough progress to convince me he is a long term answer. What happens against Villa will happen, if we don't improve in the league though then my position against him will harden, pretending otherwise is just lying to myself and putting on an act for no real reason. Ultimately my opinion counts for nothing so it's as well to be an honest one.

It's not making every upcoming game a "he needs to win or he's out" discussion irrespective of the games that preceded it.

It's not constantly putting arbitrary conditions on either the result out the performance to engineer situations where folk can demand he's sacked

It's not about refusing to say whether i or not you think he's a good manager of not being able to share an opinion.

Specifically, when I'm talking about backing him in the context of this thread and the question asked, I mean is it time to stop demanding he's sacked after each negative result even if there are some good ones in there as well.

We're a few weeks into the season, we've beat a poor Andorran team 7-3 on aggregate, a good Swiss team 5-3 on aggregate, an average Championship side 2-1 to progress in the cup after a tough European game a few days earlier, and we've narrowly lost two league games to a top 6 side and the seventh placed team from last season.

It's not a complete cluster**** and while it's not perfect, and the performances have left a lot to be desired, in that period ever had "he should go if he doesn't beat Inter", "if it's a bad loss to Lozern he needs to go", "if he throws array that lead and gets knocked out..." "If we don't beat Raith" and "if we lost to Livi is 0 from 9" (and I'm paraphrasing there before someone tries to go "nobody is saying that").

Each time he's passed one of these arbitrary tests, the ultimatum has just been moved on.

Backing him, in this context, means easing up on the ultimatums. Nothing about not expressing opinions.

[matty_f]

:agree: I’m sure Matty’s OP was well intended, but I genuinely don’t think what’s posted in here really matters one way or another (although some will disagree) I’ve said it before but when the crowd really turns on him at games his time will be up. For now it’s just a message board chat where his pros and cons are being discussed.

Not so much thinking just about LJ (although I am to a point) and more for the general enjoyment of reading this forum.

[scoopyboy]

Without knowing what would have happened had he stayed it’s impossible to say.

I actually remember watching us at the start of the 19/20 season and wondering how we were getting beat a lot of the time. I backed him longer than most but by the end there was no sign of things changing though.

I wasn't disappointed when he went but he's done well with Sheffield Utd. To be honest I don't know if giving him extra time would have helped or not

[B.H.F.C]

And in hindsight possibly too quick?

Na, he was on a run of 1 win in 11 in the league, 1 win in 16 when you include the last 5 games of the previous season, at the point he was sacked.

He’s obviously went on to do well for himself since but it wasn’t happening for him here and I thought there it started to become apparent he was struggling quite quickly.

[Pretty Boy]

It's not making every upcoming game a "he needs to win or he's out" discussion irrespective of the games that preceded it.

It's not constantly putting arbitrary conditions on either the result out the performance to engineer situations where folk can demand he's sacked

It's not about refusing to say whether i or not you think he's a good manager of not being able to share an opinion.

Specifically, when I'm talking about backing him in the context of this thread and the question asked, I mean is it time to stop demanding he's sacked after each negative result even if there are some good ones in there as well.

We're a few weeks into the season, we've beat a poor Andorran team 7-3 on aggregate, a good Swiss team 5-3 on aggregate, an average Championship side 2-1 to progress in the cup after a tough European game a few days earlier, and we've narrowly lost two league games to a top 6 side and the seventh placed team from last season.

It's not a complete cluster**** and while it's not perfect, and the performances have left a lot to be desired, in that period ever had "he should go if he doesn't beat Inter", "if it's a bad loss to Lozern he needs to go", "if he throws array that lead and gets knocked out..." "If we don't beat Raith" and "if we lost to Livi is 0 from 9" (and I'm paraphrasing there before someone tries to go "nobody is saying that").

Each time he's passed one of these arbitrary tests, the ultimatum has just been moved on.

Backing him, in this context, means easing up on the ultimatums. Nothing about not expressing opinions.

There's always arbitrary conditions on a manager.

If it's not 'he has to win X, Y or Z game' then it's moderately longer term along the lines of 'we have to be in this or that position by then'. Ultimately we are all judging to our own standards.

Johnson is under continuing pressure because he has largely failed to show any consistency and any evidence of sustained progress under him is debatable. It's going to take a bit more than what he has shown in the last 3 weeks or so to put him in a position of not being under a pretty intense level of scrutiny.

[ScottB]

I’m not sure, ultimately we’ve had 7 very winnable games to start the season and we’ve won 3 of them, putting in some horrendous performances along the way.

I think the pressure will ease off if the wins start to seem less like flukes, they happen more consistently and performances across the board improve, rather than being a lottery each game.

[matty_f]

There's always arbitrary conditions on a manager.

If it's not 'he has to win X, Y or Z game' then it's moderately longer term along the lines of 'we have to be in this or that position by then'. Ultimately we are all judging to our own standards.

Johnson is under continuing pressure because he has largely failed to show any consistency and any evidence of sustained progress under him is debatable. It's going to take a bit more than what he has shown in the last 3 weeks or so to put him in a position of not being under a pretty intense level of scrutiny.

And the longer term thinking is absolutely fine. We could yet finish third this season, but folk don't want to give him the chance.

It's exactly that short-termism that I'm asking about - is it helpful? Is it time to stop it?

We were fifth last season, qualified for Europe with that. Was it a success? No. Was it an unmitigated disaster? Also, no.

You could argue that it was a mitigated success - injuries and the well-discussed recruitment when he joined are significant factors.

In which case, it does bring it to the last few weeks and even then you could argue that we've done well save for the two league games.

[Pretty Boy]

And the longer term thinking is absolutely fine. We could yet finish third this season, but folk don't want to give him the chance.

It's exactly that short-termism that I'm asking about - is it helpful? Is it time to stop it?

We were fifth last season, qualified for Europe with that. Was it a success? No. Was it an unmitigated disaster? Also, no.

You could argue that it was a mitigated success - injuries and the well-discussed recruitment when he joined are significant factors.

In which case, it does bring it to the last few weeks and even then you could argue that we've done well save for the two league games.

The longer term is a culmination of the short term though, if we pick up on a consistent basis in the league then any ultimatums on Johnson will look silly.

As it is the bipolar nature of our performances (and results) and the streaky runs (because as bad as the streaky Lee patter may be there is merit in it) means the pressure never really gets a chance to ease. Ultimately it's in everyone's interest that Johnson is a success and we don't have to go through the upheaval of a new manager but that is only achieved through short term improvement which is the building blocks for something longer term.

[heretoday]

He'll last till we get a beating from Hearts.

[Hibbyradge]

The issue for me is you just do not know which Hibs are going to turn up, it's impossible to predict if we will win or not regardless if we are playing Celtic or Livi, your never confident going into any game, even today's. We still have massive weak links in this team and that's on the manager, his selections are baffling 3 transfer windows in, still hasn't a clue what his best 11 is, sticks with it till we lose then changes again, it's no wonder we are inconsistent, he's going nowhere though that's obvious, so we've no option but to listen to his nonsense and get behind the team. Fwiw though once things settle down after Europe, I think we will be fine this season and challenging for 3rd and 4th again, we have too much quality not to be. He needs to read the room better in interviews and understand us more as a support and stop embarrasing us with the crap he comes out with, that will help him a fair bit.

When have you been able to predict that Hibs would win or not? Maybe in the 70s but certainly not since.

[jeffers]

Not missing the joke, more the point.

And the point is what exactly ?

[matty_f]

The longer term is a culmination of the short term though, if we pick up on a consistent basis in the league then any ultimatums on Johnson will look silly.

As it is the bipolar nature of our performances (and results) and the streaky runs (because as bad as the streaky Lee patter may be there is merit in it) means the pressure never really gets a chance to ease. Ultimately it's in everyone's interest that Johnson is a success and we don't have to go through the upheaval of a new manager but that is only achieved through short term improvement which is the building blocks for something longer term.

"any ultimatums on Johnson will look silly" - isn't that the very point I'm asking?

Those ultimatums are the epitome of short term thinking in the way that they're being discussed at the moment - going game by game - sometimes stopping when we win but also sometimes leading straight to "well fair enough, he didn't lose there, but..." is the behaviour in question. And as soon as there's a defeat, they start again. That isn't a long term view and considers nothing other than the results that suit that person's viewpoint (I'll ignore the win, I want him sacked so he has to win the next one).

There's no chance of the long term with those ultimatums, it's only short terms. By your own point there, you are recognising why constantly putting short term arbitrary targets in place is unhelpful.

[matty_f]

And the point is what exactly ?

Really? :confused:

[kentao]

Lee Johnson (Appointed 19/05/2022)
P
W
D
L
Points Total


Kilmarnock
4
3
0
1
9


St Mirren
5
3
0
2
9


Aberdeen
4
2
1
1
7


Livingston
3
2
0
1
6


Motherwell
4
2
0
2
6


Hearts
5
1
2
2
5


Ross County
3
1
1
1
4


St Johnstone
3
1
1
1
4


Celtic
4
1
0
3
3


Rangers
4
0
1
3
1


Dundee United
3
0
1
2
1



LJ Points total since taking over till now.

He has a decent record against Killie, St Mirren, Aberdeen, Livingston and Motherwell, gaining the points total that I think is achievable.

Results against Ross County, St Johnstone and Dundee United should`ve been better.

His total against Hearts is how i would expect it, The games are normally 50/50 but the 3-0 games were tough and we should have done better in the 1-1 game against 10 men.

Celtic and Rangers you are hoping to get at least 1 win against each but that really is best case scenario.

I cant say I enjoy the way Hibs are playing under LJ but he had us within touching distance of 4th last season and that should be the target this season. We`ve had a bad start to the league campaign so far losing out to top 6 opposition with the team being well off it in both games.

Personally I feel he should get the 1st run of fixtures and re-evaluate then. He managed to get 17 points last season but with the added distraction of Europe this year he really needs to have at least 12 points on the board to be given more time and we can hope to have a stronger 2 run.

[jeffers]

"any ultimatums on Johnson will look silly" - isn't that the very point I'm asking?

Those ultimatums are the epitome of short term thinking in the way that they're being discussed at the moment - going game by game - sometimes stopping when we win but also sometimes leading straight to "well fair enough, he didn't lose there, but..." is the behaviour in question. And as soon as there's a defeat, they start again. That isn't a long term view and considers nothing other than the results that suit that person's viewpoint (I'll ignore the win, I want him sacked so he has to win the next one).

There's no chance of the long term with those ultimatums, it's only short terms. By your own point there, you are recognising why constantly putting short term arbitrary targets in place is unhelpful.

But we aren’t setting any targets that matter. That’s down to the board.

And the conversation goes round and round in circles. He’s proved he can get good results. He’s also proved he can get some absolute shockers. What he hasn’t proved is he can get any level of consistency. When he manages that the majority will then support him.

[jeffers]

Really? :confused:

Aye really. Read your second sentence again in the start of this thread. His team and it his team continually produce performances like the first half today, but we’ve all to get behind him ? I don’t think he’s the man to take us forward. He’s had a year now, but we are no closer to seeing what a Lee Johnson Hibs look like on a consistent basis. It’s up to him to sort that and convince those who doubt him that he can sustain something.

[matty_f]

But we aren’t setting any targets that matter. That’s down to the board.

And the conversation goes round and round in circles. He’s proved he can get good results. He’s also proved he can get some absolute shockers. What he hasn’t proved is he can get any level of consistency. When he manages that the majority will then support him.

Clearly, it's what the board thinks that counts, but supporter opinion does inform their opinion as well so while it might not be *the* significant factor, or even *a* significant factor, it will be a consideration.

It also impacts people's enjoyment of this forum, as is clear on the JOHNSON OUT thread. What do you think would happen to the "goes round in circles" if the calls for him to be sacked after each defeat stopped?

Johnson has proved he can be consistent - it's to what extent that consistency goes that might be in question. The nickname 'streaky Lee' is formed because he goes on runs of being consistently good and runs of being consistently bad. If he was inconsistently one or the other (as he has been at the start of this season, for example) then the streaky Lee nickname wouldn't have stuck.

[sauzeelegod]

Agreed but if we had lost the drums would have been banging again to get him out.

Im pretty meh about LJ but he's getting it in the neck no matter what he does.

Hibs were on a hiding to nothing today, some were suggesting putting out a glorified development team whilst others were wanting a strong team as the League Cup is one of two realistic chances of a trophy. We ended up getting something in between and we got through, wasn't pretty but it was never going to be.

Why was it never gonna be pretty?
Why can’t we play attractive football?

[jeffers]

Clearly, it's what the board thinks that counts, but supporter opinion does inform their opinion as well so while it might not be *the* significant factor, or even *a* significant factor, it will be a consideration.

It also impacts people's enjoyment of this forum, as is clear on the JOHNSON OUT thread. What do you think would happen to the "goes round in circles" if the calls for him to be sacked after each defeat stopped?

Johnson has proved he can be consistent - it's to what extent that consistency goes that might be in question. The nickname 'streaky Lee' is formed because he goes on runs of being consistently good and runs of being consistently bad. If he was inconsistently one or the other (as he has been at the start of this season, for example) then the streaky Lee nickname wouldn't have stuck.

I keep being told I’m in the minority on here, if that’s the case then the majority still back him and his position is safe. The board aren’t going to take any action based on a minority viewpoint.

So what you are effectively saying is those of us who don’t support him should just say nothing then ‘cos it upsets the guys that do ? It impacts my enjoyment of this forum with the posts that blindly back him but I’d never suggest those posters keep their opinions to themselves. Other than satisfying those who don’t want to hear any criticism of him nothing would happen if the calls for him to be sacked after each defeat stopped. What next ? We don’t criticise players when they play badly ? Turn the forum into something where only positive posts are allowed ?

I’ve been watching Hibs for 50 years. In that time I can’t think of a manager who flips between such extremes of performances. Nothing he’s done suggests to me that’s ever going to change. Hibs fans didn’t give him that nickname it’s clearly who he is. Some are happy with that. I’m not. And if it continues, with the backing he’s had eventually the board won’t be either.

[scoopyboy]

Why was it never gonna be pretty?
Why can’t we play attractive football?

I was referring to today's game.

It was always going to be a team that had never played together as an eleven before and will never play as an eleven again.

We have players out injured, players returning from injury and not 100% and players making their debuts. Not to mention tryiong to give some players a wee break before Wednesday.

And you're asking me how it wasn't going to be pretty:confused:

[matty_f]

I keep being told I’m in the minority on here, if that’s the case then the majority still back him and his position is safe. The board aren’t going to take any action based on a minority viewpoint.

So what you are effectively saying is those of us who don’t support him should just say nothing then ‘cos it upsets the guys that do ? It impacts my enjoyment of this forum with the posts that blindly back him but I’d never suggest those posters keep their opinions to themselves. Other than satisfying those who don’t want to hear any criticism of him nothing would happen if the calls for him to be sacked after each defeat stopped. What next ? We don’t criticise players when they play badly ? Turn the forum into something where only positive posts are allowed ?

I’ve been watching Hibs for 50 years. In that time I can’t think of a manager who flips between such extremes of performances. Nothing he’s done suggests to me that’s ever going to change. Hibs fans didn’t give him that nickname it’s clearly who he is. Some are happy with that. I’m not. And if it continues, with the backing he’s had eventually the board won’t be either.

I don't mean to be rude, but I've said on a number of replies on this very thread that I'm specifically not saying that people who don't support him should just say nothing. That very idea is absurd.

You may well be in the minority and the club may well look at that and think it's just a small number, but they might also clock how very repetitive that minority are with their opinion (as is their right) and that can give the impression that the view is held by more than may be the case. The board sacked Ross on a minority viewpoint.

If you can find any post where I've said or suggested only positive things are said then we can discuss that point, but I haven't, and I wouldn't because that would be absurd.

[jeffers]

I don't mean to be rude, but I've said on a number of replies on this very thread that I'm specifically not saying that people who don't support him should just say nothing. That very idea is absurd.

You may well be in the minority and the club may well look at that and think it's just a small number, but they might also clock how very repetitive that minority are with their opinion (as is their right) and that can give the impression that the view is held by more than may be the case.

If you can find any post where I've said or suggested only positive things are said then we can discuss that point, but I haven't, and I wouldn't because that would be absurd.

Then I’m unclear what you were suggesting when you talked about people’s enjoyment of this forum based on the Johnson Out thread, cos it read to me that we shouldn’t post those view points.

I’ve no idea if the board pay any attention to Hibs.net, and I’m referring solely to this ‘cos it’s the only place I express my opinion, but I can only repeat that action if any, will only occur when the crowd turns on him at games.

[JimBHibees]

I heard one of the more sensible pundits on the radio say yesterday that the things Johnson says are puzzling. He is a bit of marmite character and divides opinion.

What irritates me is I wish we had a manager like McLeish, Stubbs, Lennon or Ross in charge at a time when no Hibs manager in my time watching them has had the financial backing he's had.

Yes, some people out there will pick faults out of some of the our previous managers I've listed, but I just feel they are all better than Johnson. I've no doubt we can do much better than Johnson.

I would have more hope and faith if Hibs had a better manager in place at a time when with the resources we have now we could have some success.

Who was considered one of the more sensible pundits?

[JimBHibees]

I'd prefer we got behind every manager. Especially after wins. The "get him out" thing really doesn't help anything at all, it just causes damage. If we're wanting the guy out after a monumental effort in Europe and cup progression then he's on a hiding to nothing really.

Totally agree

[JimBHibees]

It's not making every upcoming game a "he needs to win or he's out" discussion irrespective of the games that preceded it.

It's not constantly putting arbitrary conditions on either the result out the performance to engineer situations where folk can demand he's sacked

It's not about refusing to say whether i or not you think he's a good manager of not being able to share an opinion.

Specifically, when I'm talking about backing him in the context of this thread and the question asked, I mean is it time to stop demanding he's sacked after each negative result even if there are some good ones in there as well.

We're a few weeks into the season, we've beat a poor Andorran team 7-3 on aggregate, a good Swiss team 5-3 on aggregate, an average Championship side 2-1 to progress in the cup after a tough European game a few days earlier, and we've narrowly lost two league games to a top 6 side and the seventh placed team from last season.

It's not a complete cluster**** and while it's not perfect, and the performances have left a lot to be desired, in that period ever had "he should go if he doesn't beat Inter", "if it's a bad loss to Lozern he needs to go", "if he throws array that lead and gets knocked out..." "If we don't beat Raith" and "if we lost to Livi is 0 from 9" (and I'm paraphrasing there before someone tries to go "nobody is saying that").

Each time he's passed one of these arbitrary tests, the ultimatum has just been moved on.

Backing him, in this context, means easing up on the ultimatums. Nothing about not expressing opinions.

Brilliant post

[lyonhibs]

Happy to get behind the team, but jury is still out on LJ.

This is spades. When the team tries a leg, so do the fans.

LJ hasn't got a long lifespan here IMO but as long as he's not getting mass abuse from the stands, the support is behind his team

[lucky]

He's a bit of a slaver at times, but most managers are. His record is not that bad. We achieved European football last season by finishing 5th. We got the glamour tie against Villa to look forward to and made the 1/4 finals of the league cup with a home draw in the last week. We all know the performances have been up and down. But getting to Hampden every year and challenging for third is about as good as it gets most seasons for every club bar the Old Firm. Let's give him time. That said this place will be in meltdown if we get hammered at home on Wednesday by an embarrassing scoreline

[GRA]

Course it is time to give LJ our full support. Starting Wednesday. Constant negativity is just draining and does nothing positive for the club.

Accept we're going to have shockers like we did in Andorra. That happened during the McLeish/Mowbray/Lennon eras and happens to every football club on the planet. If it is 3 months of consecutive performances of those standard then calls for him to go are justified.

But realise we're going to have decent games as well. Biggest ever win v Aberdeen, first (well deserved) victories over Hearts & Celtic this decade, progression in Europe against decent opposition.

[jacomo]

Course it is time to give LJ our full support. Starting Wednesday. Constant negativity is just draining and does nothing positive for the club.

Accept we're going to have shockers like we did in Andorra. That happened during the McLeish/Mowbray/Lennon eras and happens to every football club on the planet. If it is 3 months of consecutive performances of those standard then calls for him to go are justified.

But realise we're going to have decent games as well. Biggest ever win v Aberdeen, first (well deserved) victories over Hearts & Celtic this decade, progression in Europe against decent opposition.


:agree:

[Donegal Hibby]

Today wasn't pretty. The first half was up there as one of the worst halves of football we've seen - marginally better than the 90 minutes at Motherwell last week and 70 minutes of the St Mirren game the week before.

The second half was better, the introduction of Joe Newell turned the game in our favour and we deserved the win in the end, and as with Thursday night, it was job done.

A few of us on here had pegged this week - just as we had the home tie v Inter d'Escalades - as make or break for Johnson.

It *could* have been a disastrous week for LJ and the team, but instead it's been a successful one.

Is it time now for us as a support to lower the pressure on the team by not putting the manager's head on the block with each next result, accept that he's here for the foreseeable and focus on backing him and the team?

I'd say yes though it's not going to happen as some folk seem to be just waiting for any opportunity they can get to have a go at the manager. It doesn't even have to be a bad result either . After the Luzern away result which I was delighted about I came onto the Hibs .net expecting folk to be happy and positive yet one of the first posts I read was " GOOD RESULT BUT JOHNSON CAN STILL GTF " .

The constant calls for the manager to be sacked and rumours like LJ throws his players under the bus which was a load of brown stuff aren't doing any good at all and it's just a barge of negativity that's going on and on and on , it's quite draining really!.

[heretoday]

It's definitely time to get behind LJ. The team that played so well in Europe will surely replicate that in the league before too long. It's early days.

[ScottB]

For me certainly, it’s not a case of wanting him out after every defeat, for example, say we lose 2-1 on Wednesday, my pitch fork will stay in the cupboard.

Losing at Inter, terrible performances against St Mirren or Motherwell however are when the cupboard door starts to open. We’re always going to lose games, but as long as those are games where we put in a shift, and it’s not a bunch of Andorran plumbers beating us, then that’s fine.

What I’d like to see from Lee is consistency of performance. We’re always going to have, across a season, fairly inconsistent results, because so does every other team that aren’t the Old Firm. I think that would go a long way to us ‘getting behind’ Lee, because it will feel like we’re developing, being consistent, improving.

Us swinging wildly, even within a game, never mind between games, brings the pressure, it creates that feeling of dread as to which version of the team is going to turn up, and the wondering as to whether the bad performances are aberrations or are the good performances flukes.

For the record, I hope he sorts it, we get more good showings than bad and we have a good season, as we should all root for. Progressing in both cups definitely eases short term pressure, but he really needs to grab this opportunity to stop it immediately coming back.

[WhileTheChief..]

I don't mean to be rude, but I've said on a number of replies on this very thread that I'm specifically not saying that people who don't support him should just say nothing. That very idea is absurd.

You may well be in the minority and the club may well look at that and think it's just a small number, but they might also clock how very repetitive that minority are with their opinion (as is their right) and that can give the impression that the view is held by more than may be the case. The board sacked Ross on a minority viewpoint.

If you can find any post where I've said or suggested only positive things are said then we can discuss that point, but I haven't, and I wouldn't because that would be absurd.

What are you saying then?!!

It certainly appears that you think it’s time for us all to get behind LJ as if we don’t, it causes problems and makes this forum a poorer place.

Pretty Boy summed it up well. What’s the point in us posting positive stuff if it’s not how we feel?

What is it you’re trying to achieve with this thread that wasn’t being discussed in the Johnston out one?

On your podcast, the vibe I get is the same as on here. Win and he deserves more time, lose and there will be calls for change.

Same as it’s always been at Hibs and every other club in the land.

[WhileTheChief..]

Course it is time to give LJ our full support. Starting Wednesday. Constant negativity is just draining and does nothing positive for the club.

Accept we're going to have shockers like we did in Andorra. That happened during the McLeish/Mowbray/Lennon eras and happens to every football club on the planet. If it is 3 months of consecutive performances of those standard then calls for him to go are justified.

But realise we're going to have decent games as well. Biggest ever win v Aberdeen, first (well deserved) victories over Hearts & Celtic this decade, progression in Europe against decent opposition.

Why 3 months? Some folk think he’s had enough time already, others feel he should get until Xmas!

If he loses the next 4 or 5 league games on the bounce he absolutely should be replaced as our season would be ruined.

No point sticking with him if results are crap.

[matty_f]

What are you saying then?!!

It certainly appears that you think it’s time for us all to get behind LJ as if we don’t, it causes problems and makes this forum a poorer place.

Pretty Boy summed it up well. What’s the point in us posting positive stuff if it’s not how we feel?

What is it you’re trying to achieve with this thread that wasn’t being discussed in the Johnston out one?

On your podcast, the vibe I get is the same as on here. Win and he deserves more time, lose and there will be calls for change.

Same as it’s always been at Hibs and every other club in the land.
I’m saying that it might be worth considering not calling for him to be sacked after every defeat and setting games up as “he should go if he doesn’t win this one” even if he’s just pulled a result out the bag.

I’ve just seen on another thread someone basically saying Villa doesn’t matter but he’ll be judged on Livingston on Saturday instead.

What if we’re brilliant against Villa, like we were against Luzern in the first leg? How’s it helpful to discount that just to put up another condition to support him - which, even if it’s met, gets ignored and another one set?

[Paulie Walnuts]

I’m saying that it might be worth considering not calling for him to be sacked after every defeat and setting games up as “he should go if he doesn’t win this one” even if he’s just pulled a result out the bag.

I’ve just seen on another thread someone basically saying Villa doesn’t matter but he’ll be judged on Livingston on Saturday instead.

What if we’re brilliant against Villa, like we were against Luzern in the first leg? How’s it helpful to discount that just to put up another condition to support him - which, even if it’s met, gets ignored and another one set?

If we get a result against Villa he’ll get credit for it. He’ll get praised to the high heavens for it. I’d hazard a guess the poster is working on the presumption that we’re going to get beat, so in essence, their thought process is actually doing LJ a favour.

Unless it’s a post I haven’t seen, but I’ve certainly not seen any posts where people have said a good result against Villa won’t matter.

[Centre Hawf]

We still haven't won a league game yet this season. I'll support him every time we get to match day. But ultimately we've won one tie against a similarly sized club to us (maybe slightly bigger but nowhere near Celtic or Rangers level) and laboured through a league cup tie against Raith Rovers.

Forgive me if I'm still dubious of him.

[jeffers]

I’m saying that it might be worth considering not calling for him to be sacked after every defeat and setting games up as “he should go if he doesn’t win this one” even if he’s just pulled a result out the bag.

I’ve just seen on another thread someone basically saying Villa doesn’t matter but he’ll be judged on Livingston on Saturday instead.

What if we’re brilliant against Villa, like we were against Luzern in the first leg? How’s it helpful to discount that just to put up another condition to support him - which, even if it’s met, gets ignored and another one set?

Yeah that was me as you know, though I didn’t say Villa did not matter, I said unless he does something nuts selection/formation wise he shouldn’t be judged unfairly. If we lose against Livingston we’ll be bottom of the league after three relatively easy games, a start that the general consensus was was very favourable. Shouldn’t that be judged or is there always an excuse to be made ?

The other point I made on the PM board was this idea about not judging him on the back of a poor result needs to be conveyed to the board then ‘cos I absolutely believe had we went out on Thursday he’d have been away.

[Brightside]

I’m saying that it might be worth considering not calling for him to be sacked after every defeat and setting games up as “he should go if he doesn’t win this one” even if he’s just pulled a result out the bag.

I’ve just seen on another thread someone basically saying Villa doesn’t matter but he’ll be judged on Livingston on Saturday instead.

What if we’re brilliant against Villa, like we were against Luzern in the first leg? How’s it helpful to discount that just to put up another condition to support him - which, even if it’s met, gets ignored and another one set?

If we are brilliant v Villa then pish against Livi it would be very odd if everyone just said - ah well but we were great on Wednesday so lets get behind the guy with no points after 3 easy first games.

[Hibrandenburg]

If we are brilliant v Villa then pish against Livi it would be very odd if everyone just said - ah well but we were great on Wednesday so lets get behind the guy with no points after 3 easy first games.

"3 easy first games" That crosses the line between high expectations and entitlement in my book. None of the teams in the Scottish top league are a pushover.

[matty_f]

If we are brilliant v Villa then pish against Livi it would be very odd if everyone just said - ah well but we were great on Wednesday so lets get behind the guy with no points after 3 easy first games.

You might find folk think that a big performance on Wednesday might make that easy game on Saturday a bit more difficult and make some allowances for it. Wouldn’t be the oddest thing in the world to happen.

It would be more odd if people went “we were brilliant on Wednesday but he still has to win on Saturday or I want him out”.

[Brightside]

"3 easy first games" That crosses the line between high expectations and entitlement in my book. None of the teams in the Scottish top league are a pushover.

Im basing that on this forum in general being delighted with our first few fixtures when they were announced. If we have 0 points from the first 3 I'm going to assume most fans will be very unhappy. As a team we really only need to beat the bottom 6 teams and we will end up 3rd.

[Trinity Hibee]

"3 easy first games" That crosses the line between high expectations and entitlement in my book. None of the teams in the Scottish top league are a pushover.

Losing first 3 games of the season to st Mirren, Motherwell and Livingston if it happens (2 of which at home) would lead to alarm bells ringing. As a top 5 club in Scotland we should be beating these teams. That isn’t really entitlement to me. If a rangers/Celtic manager lost their first 3 games of the season they would be under huge pressure.

I think most agreed we had a very favourable start to the season to make some headway and unfortunately that hasn’t happened.

[Heisenberg]

Think it’s pretty straightforward. Win games and he’ll get plenty support. The reason he’s never had the whole support on his side is the wild inconsistency in performance and end result. I’ve certainly never felt confident going to watch a Lee Johnson Hibs team.

[JimBHibees]

Losing first 3 games of the season to st Mirren, Motherwell and Livingston if it happens (2 of which at home) would lead to alarm bells ringing. As a top 5 club in Scotland we should be beating these teams. That isn’t really entitlement to me. If a rangers/Celtic manager lost their first 3 games of the season they would be under huge pressure.

I think most agreed we had a very favourable start to the season to make some headway and unfortunately that hasn’t happened.

We are not Celtic or Rangers

[JimBHibees]

Im basing that on this forum in general being delighted with our first few fixtures when they were announced. If we have 0 points from the first 3 I'm going to assume most fans will be very unhappy. As a team we really only need to beat the bottom 6 teams and we will end up 3rd.

How does that work?

[Heisenberg]

We are not Celtic or Rangers

But we do have a much bigger budget than those three teams. Beat Livingston and we’ve nothing to worry about, points finally on the board and we move forward. Surely isn’t a massive ask of the manager and his players?

[Trinity Hibee]

We are not Celtic or Rangers

The point is any club losing the first 3 games of the season to clubs with less resources than them is going to be under pressure. It’s a fact of football.

[Brightside]

How does that work?

3 * 6 * 3 =54. Assume we pick up a few points from elsewhere then we are 3rd. BUT we all know that we don't actually have a consistent record against bottom 6 teams. Its a simplistic vision be if we want to be top3 its what needs to happen.

[Donegal Hibby]

But we do have a much bigger budget than those three teams. Beat Livingston and we’ve nothing to worry about, points finally on the board and we move forward. Surely isn’t a massive ask of the manager and his players?

Yeah our budget would be bigger . Hopefully we will beat Livingston though again don't think it's a easy game tbh . Think we have had something like 7 competitive games now in 24 days or so which imo would effect our players , we have also ones playing with minor injuries or are just back from serious ones.

We are in the cup quarter finals and are possible further in Europe than we normally be with a really great game to look forward too . A lot to be happy and positive about imo . I don't think we are that much worse of point wise from the same time last year either.

I'm sure once we get over what's been a hectic schedule we will come good in the League too 👍.

[WhileTheChief..]

We are not Celtic or Rangers

Aye but you see the point he’s making surely. I don’t think anyone need to point out that we aren’t the old firm, that’s just a ridiculous thing to say.

Before the season started everyone was saying we had a favourable start to the league.

We’ve screwed up big time so far no matter how anyone tries to put it.

Even LJ knows it and knows we should be doing better.

It’s amazing how low our standard have fallen for some of you when we’re saying home games against Livi aren’t easy.

They damn well should be, and we’re right to expect 3 points.

[JimBHibees]

Aye but you see the point he’s making surely. I don’t think anyone need to point out that we aren’t the old firm, that’s just a ridiculous thing to say.

Before the season started everyone was saying we had a favourable start to the league.

We’ve screwed up big time so far no matter how anyone tries to put it.

Even LJ knows it and knows we should be doing better.

It’s amazing how low our standard have fallen for some of you when we’re saying home games against Livi aren’t easy.

They damn well should be, and we’re right to expect 3 points.

Not ridiculous when they were used as an example

[Trinity Hibee]

Not ridiculous when they were used as an example

Come on Jim, the point is a team losing 3 opening games to teams with less budget. It will be a concern to anyone that no matter the size of the club.

FWIW, I fluctuate between wanting him gone and him staying. He’s had a good 4-5 days so let’s hope that continues at the weekend. Constant manager upheaval isn’t good for anyone but results are patchy at best. Think everyone agrees all we want to see is a successful Hibs side no matter who the manager is.

[JimBHibees]

Come on Jim, the point is a team losing 3 opening games to teams with less budget. It will be a concern to anyone that no matter the size of the club.

FWIW, I fluctuate between wanting him gone and him staying. He’s had a good 4-5 days so let’s hope that continues at the weekend. Constant manager upheaval isn’t good for anyone but results are patchy at best. Think everyone agrees all we want to see is a successful Hibs side no matter who the manager is.

No doubt will be a concern however some context needs to be allowed for while in no way excusing two very poor performances

[Steve20]

It's time the mentality at the club was we should be beating the likes of St Mirren, Motherwell and Livingston. Not this "we have no right to beat them and it's ok if we beat them sometimes". Are we serious about challenging for 3rd, or just happy to plod along with another 5th place finish at best?

Nothing about Lee Johnson's time at the club suggest he's capable of being the person to lead us to 3rd place.

Get behind him while he's still here, but let's be honest, he shouldn't still be here.

[Since452]

I think we'll probably lose to Livingston. Just being honest. I still don't want him out. Europe is really hurting us but it's what everyone wanted. Aberdeen will feel this pain soon enough as well and thankfully they're only a point ahead of us without midweek games yet. Hearts beat a stinking St Johnstone without having just played in Europe. They struggled at home against Kilmarnock after doing so. Their form will suffer this weekend and next. We'll be in the mix for 3rd come May just like we were last season.

[Donegal Hibby]

It's time the mentality at the club was we should be beating the likes of St Mirren, Motherwell and Livingston. Not this "we have no right to beat them and it's ok if we beat them sometimes". Are we serious about challenging for 3rd, or just happy to plod along with another 5th place finish at best?

Nothing about Lee Johnson's time at the club suggest he's capable of being the person to lead us to 3rd place.

Get behind him while he's still here, but let's be honest, he shouldn't still be here.

The year before he came we were 16 points of 3rd and with everything that went on last year injuries , bad decisions and poor recruitment we ended the season 5 points off 3rd spot . You only have to look at the games after the split to realise that the clubs mentality was good in beating St Mirren , Celtic and drawing away to Aberdeen and hertz which we were the better team in both . So I really don't see were your coming from in there's nothing to suggest he can't get 3rd or that he shouldn't be here . :confused:

[chrisski33]

Ill get behind the team not LJ. Im not confident about beating livi nor Aberdeen but no doubt we will put a good fight against Villa where folk will say back LJ.

[Key West]

No doubt will be a concern however some context needs to be allowed for while in no way excusing two very poor performances

Folk are not interested in context they just want to create a crisis as soon as they can.

[Donegal Hibby]

Ill get behind the team not LJ. Im not confident about beating livi nor Aberdeen but no doubt we will put a good fight against Villa where folk will say back LJ.

That's bonkers btw . If your getting behind the team then you are getting behind LJ who is the manager of the team. I see we are now moving onto the Aberdeen game to have a go at the manager now !

[Hibrandenburg]

It's time the mentality at the club was we should be beating the likes of St Mirren, Motherwell and Livingston. Not this "we have no right to beat them and it's ok if we beat them sometimes". Are we serious about challenging for 3rd, or just happy to plod along with another 5th place finish at best?

Nothing about Lee Johnson's time at the club suggest he's capable of being the person to lead us to 3rd place.

Get behind him while he's still here, but let's be honest, he shouldn't still be here.

We should be beating teams like St Mirren, Livingston and Motherwell but we have no god given right to do so. If results were purely based on fan base or finance, then why bother even kicking a ball?

The sense of entitlement that some Hibs fans have is reminiscent of the Odd Firm.

[matty_f]

Aye but you see the point he’s making surely. I don’t think anyone need to point out that we aren’t the old firm, that’s just a ridiculous thing to say.

Before the season started everyone was saying we had a favourable start to the league.

We’ve screwed up big time so far no matter how anyone tries to put it.

Even LJ knows it and knows we should be doing better.

It’s amazing how low our standard have fallen for some of you when we’re saying home games against Livi aren’t easy.

They damn well should be, and we’re right to expect 3 points.


I think it's getting lost a bit that while the start hasn't been good - it's only two games, and both in the context of having European games preceding them.

We followed up a good Euro result with a positive result yesterday, and there's a good chance for us to do the same against Livi on Saturday. I don't think we've screwed anything up big time yet.

[Trinity Hibee]

Folk are not interested in context they just want to create a crisis as soon as they can.

Hahaha that is a fantastic take that one

[A Hi-Bee]

Folk are not interested in context they just want to create a crisis as soon as they can.

Crisis what Crisis?
:greengrin

[WhileTheChief..]

I think it's getting lost a bit that while the start hasn't been good - it's only two games, and both in the context of having European games preceding them.

We followed up a good Euro result with a positive result yesterday, and there's a good chance for us to do the same against Livi on Saturday. I don't think we've screwed anything up big time yet.

Fair enough.

I'm not that bothered about the first two league games either really, plenty of time to make up the points.

Having the Villa games to look froward to is brilliant and getting past Raith was really a business as usual kinda result.

So overall, you could argue it's been an ok start to the season. But it's also been a crap start to the league however we look at it.

[Iain G]

I think it's getting lost a bit that while the start hasn't been good - it's only two games, and both in the context of having European games preceding them.

We followed up a good Euro result with a positive result yesterday, and there's a good chance for us to do the same against Livi on Saturday. I don't think we've screwed anything up big time yet.

Just wait til we get to the group stages Matty and then we can't win any domestic games but continue to do well in Europe! 😁

[matty_f]

Just wait til we get to the group stages Matty and then we can't win any domestic games but continue to do well in Europe! 😁

It’s inevitable. :greengrin

[Iain G]

It’s inevitable. :greengrin

The gap between agony and ecstasy on here will be like nothing we have seen before!

[007]

The gap between agony and ecstasy on here will be like nothing we have seen before!

The perineum. 🤔

[JimBHibees]

If we are brilliant v Villa then pish against Livi it would be very odd if everyone just said - ah well but we were great on Wednesday so lets get behind the guy with no points after 3 easy first games.

None of them were easy even more so a number of players struggling a bit with fitness and playing high energy European games a few days before.

[Joe6-2]

The perineum. 🤔

😳

[Iain G]

The perineum. 🤔

Isn't that a Robbie Williams song?

[Daily Hibs]

No, he's been here long enough now to know expectations and how a Hibernian manager should carry themselves.

League form has been dreadful under him and he keeps playing the same players that have seen previous managers shown the door.

Get McInnes in I say! The club should have appointed him in the first place, absolute no brainer.

[Donegal Hibby]

No, he's been here long enough now to know expectations and how a Hibernian manager should carry themselves.

League form has been dreadful under him and he keeps playing the same players that have seen previous managers shown the door.

Get McInnes in I say! The club should have appointed him in the first place, absolute no brainer.

Comedy gold :top marks. :faf:

[Iain G]

No, he's been here long enough now to know expectations and how a Hibernian manager should carry themselves.

League form has been dreadful under him and he keeps playing the same players that have seen previous managers shown the door.

Get McInnes in I say! The club should have appointed him in the first place, absolute no brainer.

It does take time to change the squad from the previous regime(s). Even Erik ten Haag is having to play players that got previous managers shown the door.

And McInnes is just Jack Ross in a Santa beard 😁

[Skol]

I don’t think McInnes would be the man and would fall fall of the same doubters.

[WestStandWillie]

Today wasn't pretty. The first half was up there as one of the worst halves of football we've seen - marginally better than the 90 minutes at Motherwell last week and 70 minutes of the St Mirren game the week before.

The second half was better, the introduction of Joe Newell turned the game in our favour and we deserved the win in the end, and as with Thursday night, it was job done.

A few of us on here had pegged this week - just as we had the home tie v Inter d'Escalades - as make or break for Johnson.

It *could* have been a disastrous week for LJ and the team, but instead it's been a successful one.

Is it time now for us as a support to lower the pressure on the team by not putting the manager's head on the block with each next result, accept that he's here for the foreseeable and focus on backing him and the team?

I've never known us to have such a "marmite" manager. Guy seems brand new and will always make time for the fans/Hibs Kids but then he opens his mouth and starts spouting half baked Eric Cantona style pish.

He bangs on about the same weaknesses in the squad but seems to be ignoring the fact that our back line is soft as ****

I want to see him actually get tough like he hinted at last season and make those difficult calls.

I'm not going to boo him or call for his head but i'm also not gonna sit there and blindly clap him.

[Centre Hawf]

None of them were easy even more so a number of players struggling a bit with fitness and playing high energy European games a few days before.

There are no easy games in this league, but you can't say that we weren't gifted an easier set of fixtures to start with than we've probably seen for a number of years. If we fail to take a single point from the first available 9 or 12 it is nothing but criminal.

[Greenworld]

Adam Owen seems to getting more involved of late [emoji848] I actually like his recent interview he has some cv on him I wonder if a replacement manager is already with us .

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[Hibbyradge]

I think it's getting lost a bit that while the start hasn't been good - it's only two games, and both in the context of having European games preceding them.

We followed up a good Euro result with a positive result yesterday, and there's a good chance for us to do the same against Livi on Saturday. I don't think we've screwed anything up big time yet.

I've posted this before, but it's interesting to note that in 1986, our neighbours only won 2 of their first 9 games, losing 5. They went on to win the double that year, I think.

Last year Man United lost their first 4 games, but finished third.

[Hibbyradge]

The perineum. 🤔

:applause:

I haven't heard that one before. Excellent.

[One Day Soon]

There's a reason why he's been called streaky.

You need a degree of consistency to win anything and I don't think he can deliver that. With the resources at our disposal we should by now have a much tighter defence and a more dangerous midfield. That we don't is in no small measure due to the signings he has made and failed to make.

A better manager gets more out of the existing squad, signs better players to strengthen our weaknesses and has us playing a much more consistent style of football with clear incremental improvement.

I hope he gets better but I don't think he will.

[Daily Hibs]

I remember thinking this was a strange thread given we had just scraped past Raith Rovers.

I think its fair to say that the feeling from the fans is that LJ doesnt have the support of the fans. This season we have lost to Andorran amatuers, St Mirren at Home, Motherwell away and scraped past Raith Rovers; whilst the same untouchable players are making the same mistakes each week.

I really hope the club are looking in and seeing the feeling towards LJ, Marshall, Hanlon and Stevenson. We need more ambition and we need a new backbone of a side with a manager who will properly take the club forward.

Enough with the sentimentality and lets be ambitious as a club.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Get him to ****.

[Chorley Hibee]

In answer to the question...

Only if it's to push him out the door.

[JohnM1875]

The club have absolutely been behind Johnson, more so than any manager I can remember. I think it's time to move on from Johnson though.

[Danderhall Hibs]

So is Livi a must win then? And if we win that what’s the next obstacle?

[matty_f]

I remember thinking this was a strange thread given we had just scraped past Raith Rovers.

I think its fair to say that the feeling from the fans is that LJ doesnt have the support of the fans. This season we have lost to Andorran amatuers, St Mirren at Home, Motherwell away and scraped past Raith Rovers; whilst the same untouchable players are making the same mistakes each week.

I really hope the club are looking in and seeing the feeling towards LJ, Marshall, Hanlon and Stevenson. We need more ambition and we need a new backbone of a side with a manager who will properly take the club forward.

Enough with the sentimentality and lets be ambitious as a club.

We didn’t scrape past Raith. We beat them in normal time while resting a few players after a great result in midweek.

It wasn’t a strange time to post it, it was on the back of Johnson coming through two “if we get knocked out he needs to go” ties with positive results and was about asking whether, having already come through an “if he doesn’t beat the Andorrans he needs to go” tie that it might be time to stop demanding he’s sacked if he doesn’t win the next game.

[Mango Man]

I remember thinking this was a strange thread given we had just scraped past Raith Rovers.

I think its fair to say that the feeling from the fans is that LJ doesnt have the support of the fans. This season we have lost to Andorran amatuers, St Mirren at Home, Motherwell away and scraped past Raith Rovers; whilst the same untouchable players are making the same mistakes each week.

I really hope the club are looking in and seeing the feeling towards LJ, Marshall, Hanlon and Stevenson. We need more ambition and we need a new backbone of a side with a manager who will properly take the club forward.

Enough with the sentimentality and lets be ambitious as a club.

Agreed.

Love Lewis and Paul, but their best years are behind them, they have pretty much been mainstays in our defence for about 16 years, don't see many other teams do that, need to build a new defence for the future.

I have lost all faith in Marshall, very unfortunate the new goalie we signed got injured.

[JohnM1875]

We didn’t scrape past Raith. We beat them in normal time while resting a few players after a great result in midweek.

It wasn’t a strange time to post it, it was on the back of Johnson coming through two “if we get knocked out he needs to go” ties with positive results and was about asking whether, having already come through an “if he doesn’t beat the Andorrans he needs to go” tie that it might be time to stop demanding he’s sacked if he doesn’t win the next game.

Come on, Matty! We absolutely scraped by Raith.

With a wee bit composite they could easily have scored a few more goals. We were brutal.

[Donegal Hibby]

So is Livi a must win then? And if we win that what’s the next obstacle?

The Livvy game is according to some . We win that and the next obstacle is the next game in if he doesn't win that " he has to go again" wins that and it moves on to the next and so it goes on and on ! . All last season and now this one with a relentless agenda against the manager .

[matty_f]

Come on, Matty! We absolutely scraped by Raith.

With a wee bit composite they could easily have scored a few more goals. We were brutal.

I thought Raith had a couple of chances but second half we deserved to win. And we did it with resting a few players so while we never blew them away, we did the job comfortably enough in the end.

[The Modfather]

The Livvy game is according to some . We win that and the next obstacle is the next game in if he doesn't win that " he has to go again" wins that and it moves on to the next and so it goes on and on ! . All last season and now this one with a relentless agenda against the manager .

He needs a performance against Livi more than the result. We can’t keep playing as poorly, as disjointedly and with as many untouchable underperforming players as we have been. Another poor performance against Livi (whatever the result) and we can’t just keep saying, yes we were poor but Europe. Once the Villa game is over it won’t be the silver bullet that fixes all the deficiencies we’ve seen this season and last.

Why sign Obita and be reluctant to use him at LB, particularly when a struggling Stevenson is the only alternative?

What’s our midfield? Levitt, Newell and draw a 3rd midfielder out of a hat who will likely have to be replaced early game anyway. What does it say for the signing of Jeggo when we play Stevenson ahead of him against Villa?

What’s our game plan? It appears to be to not to do anything to negate our defensive weakness on the wings and at crosses, then either one dimensionally play it out wide to Youan & Boyle and hope they do something, or hoofball.

As someone all in on Johnson. What is it you see him building? If he left tomorrow what foundations would he leave for the next man that are an improvement on what he inherited himself?

[big gogs]

Adam Owen seems to getting more involved of late [emoji848] I actually like his recent interview he has some cv on him I wonder if a replacement manager is already with us .

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If the manager is sacked,so must all the back room staff,all the coaching is failing big time .no time for sentiment now.we expected to lose last night,but to concede like we did was unacceptable.Lennon not for me .

[Gatecrasher]

I find it strange that hibs have invested so heavily in the team but seem content to persevere with LJ who has shown us very little in return. I have always been of the belief that a manager is as, if not more important than the players in getting the club to reach our potential, bit I feel its never an area that the club seem to want to invest properly in. There has been to many occasions in recent history where the club have clearly made the wrong choice in manager and it's costing us more in the long run. LJ is just another example of this.

[Paulie Walnuts]

The Livvy game is according to some . We win that and the next obstacle is the next game in if he doesn't win that " he has to go again" wins that and it moves on to the next and so it goes on and on ! . All last season and now this one with a relentless agenda against the manager .

:faf:

Of course Livi is must win. We can’t start the season with no wins from St Mirren and Livi at home and Motherwell away. It’s ridiculous to suggest it’s not.

[Brightside]

:faf:

Of course Livi is must win. We can’t start the season with no wins from St Mirren and Livi at home and Motherwell away. It’s ridiculous to suggest it’s not.

Well we can and we probably will.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Well we can and we probably will.

Well, yes, but we can’t let it happen and allow LJ to carry on as manager.

[The Baldmans Comb]

It's close, very close and if its not the Livi match then it will be the one after that or sometime the following month.

Johnson is finished and last night watching him hide in the dugout for the last 20 minutes summed up the arrogance of an English wide boy who slavers absolute and complete drivel and who won't be looking down on Scottish football for very much longer.

All that money from the Doig, Porto and Nissy transfers totally wasted as the defensive and midfield problems inherited from the previous managers havent been remotely addressed.

Johnson is a "deid man walking" and it's now a question of When not If.

[One Day Soon]

It's close, very close and if its not the Livi match then it will be the one after that or sometime the following month.

Johnson is finished and last night watching him hide in the dugout for the last 20 minutes summed up the arrogance of an English wide boy who slavers absolute and complete drivel and who won't be looking down on Scottish football for very much longer.

All that money from the Doig, Porto and Nissy transfers totally wasted as the defensive and midfield problems inherited from the previous managers havent been remotely addressed.

Johnson is a "deid man walking" and it's now a question of When not If.

Not sure what English has to do with it. I'd love a Tony Mowbray or Alan Stubbs right now.

[Iain G]

It's close, very close and if its not the Livi match then it will be the one after that or sometime the following month.

Johnson is finished and last night watching him hide in the dugout for the last 20 minutes summed up the arrogance of an English wide boy who slavers absolute and complete drivel and who won't be looking down on Scottish football for very much longer.

All that money from the Doig, Porto and Nissy transfers totally wasted as the defensive and midfield problems inherited from the previous managers havent been remotely addressed.

Johnson is a "deid man walking" and it's now a question of When not If.

You can't say all that money was totally wasted, its paid for Elie and Vente who are very good players for us.

[WhileTheChief..]

Vente? Tad early to be saying he's a success no?

Early signs are promising but that's about as far as we can go.

If we're not allowed to judge LJ after two games, the same must apply to the players too!

Let's see how many games he plays and how many goals he gets over the next few months before declaring him a success.

[JimBHibees]

Well, yes, but we can’t let it happen and allow LJ to carry on as manager.

So it isn't a must win we should just sack him now?

[Since90+2]

Vente? Tad early to be saying he's a success no?

Early signs are promising but that's about as far as we can go.

If we're not allowed to judge LJ after two games, the same must apply to the players too!

Let's see how many games he plays and how many goals he gets over the next few months before declaring him a success.

LJ has had more than 2 games. What are you going in about?

[HibsGW]

So it isn't a must win we should just sack him now?

Not sure I follow. If we lose all 3 against st mirren motherwell and livi then have tougher games coming up there’s a real likelihood we’d be bottom on 0 points after 4 games. We’d then probably be 9 points behind Aberdeen or Hearts already

[Paulie Walnuts]

So it isn't a must win we should just sack him now?

What?

Livi is a must win. Sacking him now sounds ideal though.

[Basildon Hibs]

So it isn't a must win we should just sack him now?

Yes. Sack him today.

😁👍

[Cod Boy]

Be gone during international break

[Hermit Crab]

Its highly likely we could be going into the international break with only 0 points. If we don't pick up anything other than a win on Saturday he will back under pressure, take nothing at Aberdeen the following week and he wont be in the dug out for the next game away to high flying killy.

[tonyrougier123]

Its highly likely we could be going into the international break with only 0 points. If we don't pick up anything other than a win on Saturday he will back under pressure, take nothing at Aberdeen the following week and he wont be in the dug out for the next game away to high flying killy.

And the week leading upto killie will be rife with which dugout will mcinness be in.

[A Hi-Bee]

This guy and his backroom team are going to take us nowhere, not just based on last night, which although expecting to get beat was a poor performance, poor set up and with no plan b, i am getting off the fence, he has to go.
He is just not a good fit for Hibs.

[Brightside]

"At the same time, it will be interesting to see if we can play with a little bit more football arrogance, and a little bit more belief now that the pressure is off. I'm used to Villa Park, but I want to see if and how the boys cope because it's another test in our journey, and it's a big journey."

Chiili put this up earlier. Its from the Herald today. This is getting into Terry Butcher world isn't it?

[Is It On....]

"Is it time to get properly behind Johnson?"

Yes - as you escort him from the premises and lock the door.

[Is It On....]

"At the same time, it will be interesting to see if we can play with a little bit more football arrogance, and a little bit more belief now that the pressure is off. I'm used to Villa Park, but I want to see if and how the boys cope because it's another test in our journey, and it's a big journey."

Chiili put this up earlier. Its from the Herald today. This is getting into Terry Butcher world isn't it?

"I'm used to Villa Park" = look at how successful and important I am. Absolutely shocking thing to say in private, far less in public.

[ScottB]

There’s no evidence in his career that he can be any better than what we’ve seen, he continues to prattle on after the latest defeat without taking any of the blame. Football arrogance? Not matched by the arrogance of that interview after being utterly hammered.

He’s a failure that thinks he’s the next Guardiola. He should never have got the job, was lucky not to lose it during the World Cup break and so far this season has struggled to mastermind victories over part timers and lower league opposition. Again.

[JamesHFC]

Lose to Livi & Aberdeen he will probably be gone during the international break.

From our next 6 domestic games though I think we will win all homes games, including the St Mirren cup game and at least a point from Killie or Aberdeen away.

That should see us in at least the top 5 going into the Hearts game.

[Onion]

Lose to Livi & Aberdeen he will probably be gone during the international break.

From our next 6 domestic games though I think we will win all homes games, including the St Mirren cup game and at least a point from Killie or Aberdeen away.

That should see us in at least the top 5 going into the Hearts game.

We can only hope and pray that Hibs Board are on the case, working up a candidate list now, and have a clear plan of succession post LJ. With Hibs, the problem has never been sacking a manager. It's their inability to bring in a decent replacement. The question must be, what will they be doing differently next time to ensure they get the right man ?

[Heisenberg]

"At the same time, it will be interesting to see if we can play with a little bit more football arrogance, and a little bit more belief now that the pressure is off. I'm used to Villa Park, but I want to see if and how the boys cope because it's another test in our journey, and it's a big journey."

Chiili put this up earlier. Its from the Herald today. This is getting into Terry Butcher world isn't it?

The guys a massive ****

Also the bit about it being a big journey = I need more time

[Pretty Boy]

"At the same time, it will be interesting to see if we can play with a little bit more football arrogance, and a little bit more belief now that the pressure is off. I'm used to Villa Park, but I want to see if and how the boys cope because it's another test in our journey, and it's a big journey."

Chiili put this up earlier. Its from the Herald today. This is getting into Terry Butcher world isn't it?

:faf:

To use a well worn hibs.net cliche. Deary me.

You can just imagine players laughing and doing impressions of him as soon as he walks out a room. We've all had a boss like that.

[B.H.F.C]

:faf:

To use a well worn hibs.net cliche. Deary me.

You can just imagine players laughing and doing impressions of him as soon as he walks out a room. We've all had a boss like that.

For all the talk about players not liking him etc, I’ve absolutely no idea how true it is. But you read comments like that from him and, you’re right, have a laugh.

I just can’t see how the garbage he comes out with motivates them. In fact, it’s pretty clear most of the time that it doesn’t.

[hibsforeurope]

:faf:

To use a well worn hibs.net cliche. Deary me.

You can just imagine players laughing and doing impressions of him as soon as he walks out a room. We've all had a boss like that.

Sounds like he's telling them He's been places and done things!

[WhileTheChief..]

There’s no evidence in his career that he can be any better than what we’ve seen, he continues to prattle on after the latest defeat without taking any of the blame. Football arrogance? Not matched by the arrogance of that interview after being utterly hammered.

He’s a failure that thinks he’s the next Guardiola. He should never have got the job, was lucky not to lose it during the World Cup break and so far this season has struggled to mastermind victories over part timers and lower league opposition. Again.

Agree with every word.

Only hope is that eventually the club come to see it too.

Some members of the board must be thinking it’s time to make the change by now. I can’t believe for a second that they are sitting around chuffed at how things are going.

Assuming they do care, they need to act.

If we wait another few months the season will be wasted. Make the change now and give the new guy a fighting chance.

[WhileTheChief..]

:faf:

To use a well worn hibs.net cliche. Deary me.

You can just imagine players laughing and doing impressions of him as soon as he walks out a room. We've all had a boss like that.

Wait until he shows them his 6-pack. That will get them motivated to run away from the lions. Or was it tigers?

[Pretty Boy]

Sounds like he's telling them He's been places and done things!

We're strugglin', strugglin', strugglin'.

[Basildon Hibs]

Lose to Livi & Aberdeen he will probably be gone during the international break.

From our next 6 domestic games though I think we will win all homes games, including the St Mirren cup game and at least a point from Killie or Aberdeen away.

That should see us in at least the top 5 going into the Hearts game.


I hope your post was 'tongue in cheek'..😁

[One Day Soon]

"At the same time, it will be interesting to see if we can play with a little bit more football arrogance, and a little bit more belief now that the pressure is off. I'm used to Villa Park, but I want to see if and how the boys cope because it's another test in our journey, and it's a big journey."

Chiili put this up earlier. Its from the Herald today. This is getting into Terry Butcher world isn't it?


Jesus Christ, what an absolute cock. Firstly, what a ludicrous Brent-ism to come out with. Secondly, in what sense is he used to Villa Park?

[Is It On....]

Jesus Christ, what an absolute cock. Firstly, what a ludicrous Brent-ism to come out with. Secondly, in what sense is he used to Villa Park?

The best description I have heard of Mr Johnson is from my gooner friend who described him as a " lower league journey manager who probably can't believe his luck he is at a club like Hibs"...

[Onion]

The guys a massive ****

Also the bit about it being a big journey = I need more time

Could be talking about any of the last 5 Hibs managers. Problem is not LJ, what he does, says or thinks. Strangely, IMO he is not crap, stupid or deluded on purpose. It is the people who think he was and still is the man for the job ie the same folk who'll choose the next manager :panic:

[JamesHFC]

We can only hope and pray that Hibs Board are on the case, working up a candidate list now, and have a clear plan of succession post LJ. With Hibs, the problem has never been sacking a manager. It's their inability to bring in a decent replacement. The question must be, what will they be doing differently next time to ensure they get the right man ?

You would like to think that but we took a while to appoint Maloney & Johnson. Can't remember the last time we appointed someone within days of sacking someone.

If/when LJ does go I think it will be between Robinson & Brown.

[Wilson]

The best description I have heard of Mr Johnson is from my gooner friend who described him as a " lower league journey manager who probably can't believe his luck he is at a club like Hibs"...

Your mate sounds like a knob.

[Iain G]

The best description I have heard of Mr Johnson is from my gooner friend who described him as a " lower league journey manager who probably can't believe his luck he is at a club like Hibs"...

What's this Mr Johnston thing? He isn't at the jambos you know!

[JimBHibees]

You would like to think that but we took a while to appoint Maloney & Johnson. Can't remember the last time we appointed someone within days of sacking someone.

If/when LJ does go I think it will be between Robinson & Brown.

Scott Brown ? Can see him getting it. Wouldn't want Robinson personally. Personal preference would be Mcinnes however would no doubt get his Rangers previous thrown at him by our hard of thinking fans.

[JimBHibees]

"At the same time, it will be interesting to see if we can play with a little bit more football arrogance, and a little bit more belief now that the pressure is off. I'm used to Villa Park, but I want to see if and how the boys cope because it's another test in our journey, and it's a big journey."

Chiili put this up earlier. Its from the Herald today. This is getting into Terry Butcher world isn't it?

Your pretty relentless I will give you that. Still not going to judge him on the villa game.

[JimBHibees]

What?

Livi is a must win. Sacking him now sounds ideal though.

Must win says who.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Must win says who.

Ok, you don’t think it’s a must win, we get it.

[Hiber-nation]

Must win says who.

Every Hibs fan I know. Last season's LJ would somehow turn it around and go on a good run. I just can't see that happening given our form so far.

[Nicho87]

Not winning on Saturday and I think the fans would be letting the board know all is not too rosy in the garden.

If they’re sticking with him they need to invest the money into another midfielder and winger pronto

Campbell, JDH, Jeggo until Xmas gives me the fear

Poor newell

[JimBHibees]

Every Hibs fan I know.

And what if we don't get angry or really angry. Many teams have recovered from poor league starts. Seems a relentless determination to get him out the door what 6 or 7 games into the season which imo is too early though appreciate others don't think so.

[JimBHibees]

Every Hibs fan I know. Last season's LJ would somehow turn it around and go on a good run. I just can't see that happening given our form so far.

Even based on both Luzern performances

[JimBHibees]

Ok, you don’t think it’s a must win, we get it.

Must win on the third game of a 38 game campaign. Laughable really

[Paulie Walnuts]

Must win on the third game of a 38 game campaign. Laughable really

Must win game on the 10th game of the season after an average at best season last season and a start littered with terrible results this season.

Laughable that you think it’s all ok.

[Jones28]

I don’t think any single game is a must win, but the culmination of what has been a **** start to the season domestically, the defeat away in Andorra and a poor performance against Raith in the cup has to be taken in to account.

There’s a tipping point and we are getting closer and closer to it.

[jeffers]

And what if we don't get angry or really angry. Many teams have recovered from poor league starts. Seems a relentless determination to get him out the door what 6 or 7 games into the season which imo is too early though appreciate others don't think so.

C’mon Jim, it’s not based on the start of this season alone. It’s because it’s a repeat of much of what we saw last season. Good performances, then absolute hopeless ones with bizarre tactics and selections and nothing in between. That’s been him throughout his managerial career. There is nothing to suggest that will ever change.

[Trinity Hibee]

Must win on the third game of a 38 game campaign. Laughable really

Jim this is really head in the sand stuff from you. Any Hibs manager (infact any manager) who has lost their first 3-4 games of a league season at a club who are aiming for top 4 is likely to be gone.

Can I ask why you think he should stay if he was to lose at the weekend? We are losing games to teams with significantly less budget than us which is the comfort blanket when we lose games to teams with bigger budgets than us.

The proof is in the results here. Add to that performance have generally been poor.

[The Modfather]

Must win on the third game of a 38 game campaign. Laughable really

Another season of saying we’re only x points off 3rd/4th every week and if we do this or other teams do that we’ll be 3rd. We played catch up all of last season and never caught Hearts or Aberdeen and never really threatened 3rd.

We can’t afford to fall much further behind, 3rd game of the season or not.

[superfurryhibby]

C’mon Jim, it’s not based on the start of this season alone. It’s because it’s a repeat of much of what we saw last season. Good performances, then absolute hopeless ones with bizarre tactics and selections and nothing in between. That’s been him throughout his managerial career. There is nothing to suggest that will ever change.

That’s hardly an accurate summary of Johnson’s managerial career. People just repeating cliched nonsense now.

He ‘s had a good career as a manager, improved every side he’s been at and had some notable successes. The Sunderland failure was an opportunity missed, but his Chairman was very culpable in that.

If we lose on Saturday, he will probably be sacked, few would argue with it.

[The Harp Awakes]

Could be talking about any of the last 5 Hibs managers. Problem is not LJ, what he does, says or thinks. Strangely, IMO he is not crap, stupid or deluded on purpose. It is the people who think he was and still is the man for the job ie the same folk who'll choose the next manager :panic:

I agree it's a big worry that the current board and Kensell are clueless about selecting the next Manager. What you've got to hope is that McDermott plays a big part in the next managerial selection and that he's savvy enough to identify someone decent v a candidate who talks a good game.

LJ's 'game day minus one' p1sh during his interviews before the Euro games was the final straw for me. Haven't listened to his interviews since then.

[Heisenberg]

I agree it's a big worry that the current board and Kensell are clueless about selecting the next Manager. What you've got to hope is that McDermott plays a big part in the next managerial selection and that he's savvy enough to identify someone decent v a candidate who talks a good game.

LJ's 'game day minus one' p1sh during his interviews before the Euro games was the final straw for me. Haven't listened to his interviews since then.

Jack Ross used to use the same sort of chat. It’s modern football manager speak.

[Hermit Crab]

If we had lost Luzern and then Raith (who we were expected to beat), he'd be gone already. The only credit in the bank he has is the Euro tie and that wont last long. Fail to win on Saturday and the pressure is on. Take doing at Aberdeen the following week and he's a goner for sure. We need points on the board pronto.

[Billy Whizz]

You would like to think that but we took a while to appoint Maloney & Johnson. Can't remember the last time we appointed someone within days of sacking someone.

If/when LJ does go I think it will be between Robinson & Brown.

Brown, surely not

[Hiber-nation]

Even based on both Luzern performances

Yes. I was still behind LJ then but the Motherwell game was the last straw for me. We're regressing and that's inexcusable.

[Gus]

Who comes in if/when LJ gets emptied

Scott Brown? Behave, ridic option imo at this early stage of his managerial career.

Robinson would be a good shout but he may look at our managers record and think twice............

Let's be honest, this isn't a new thing for Hibs, somethings are just a poisoned chalice. Club imo needs a reset from top to bottom. Recruitment has been pretty poor as a whole.

I personally would give him to the international break and then see

[Callum_62]

LJ's 'game day minus one' p1sh during his interviews before the Euro games was the final straw for me. Haven't listened to his interviews since then.

[emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]. What a final straw that is


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[Since452]

I agree it's a big worry that the current board and Kensell are clueless about selecting the next Manager. What you've got to hope is that McDermott plays a big part in the next managerial selection and that he's savvy enough to identify someone decent v a candidate who talks a good game.

LJ's 'game day minus one' p1sh during his interviews before the Euro games was the final straw for me. Haven't listened to his interviews since then.

If we start winning games he can recite the Hearts song in his interviews for all i care.

[jeffers]

Who comes in if/when LJ gets emptied

Scott Brown? Behave, ridic option imo at this early stage of his managerial career.

Robinson would be a good shout but he may look at our managers record and think twice............

Let's be honest, this isn't a new thing for Hibs, somethings are just a poisoned chalice. Club imo needs a reset from top to bottom. Recruitment has been pretty poor as a whole.

I personally would give him to the international break and then see

Not saying we should go for Brown, but we are not going to get someone who hasn’t failed elsewhere unless we go for someone who hasn’t previously managed or is just at the start of their managerial career.

[Dashing Bob S]

Failure to win on Saturday puts undoubted pressure on Johnson, hopefully more from the board who want to see a return on their investment. Forget Villa, Zero points from 9 in the first three games against St Mirren, Motherwell and Livi is not why they bought Ventre, Levitt, Youan etc and it becomes a test for their ambitions. All Johnson’s David Brent platitudes won’t help him (and shouldn’t) if we lose on Saturday.

[Gus]

Not saying we should go for Brown, but we are not going to get someone who hasn’t failed elsewhere unless we go for someone who hasn’t previously managed or is just at the start of their managerial career.

Totally but we shouldn't then be shocked if they fail with us. We change things awfully quick imo.

I think the whole infrastructure needs looked at personally.

It's always a subject that will have torn the support, all be it on this occasion it appears the majority want him gone now. I hope I am wrong but can see this messageboard being exactly the same in 6 months

Are fans expectations too high for where we should be? 2 cups in 20 years, countless opportunities missed in finals that on paper we should have won

[matty_f]

Totally but we shouldn't then be shocked if they fail with us. We change things awfully quick imo.

I think the whole infrastructure needs looked at personally.

It's always a subject that will have torn the support, all be it on this occasion it appears the majority want him gone now. I hope I am wrong but can see this messageboard being exactly the same in 6 months

Are fans expectations too high for where we should be? 2 cups in 20 years, countless opportunities missed in finals that on paper we should have won

It's the same pattern as we saw with Ross getting sacked, a divided support until he was booted, then Maloney, and history is repeating itself with Johnson.

[Skol]

It is far too early in the season for any game to be must win IMO.

Johnson was under pressure a few times last season but on both occasions turned things around. However as is their right some people remain unconvinced. Johnson though did enough to remain in post and has been backed in the transfer market and as such will be given time. To use the Villa game as a reason is madness to me. It was always going to be tough, very tough and has no bearing on whats happened before or happens in the future. I think most people went into the game hoping we might nick a draw or just a barrow defeat but deep down knew that a heavy defeat was likely.

A defeat on Saturday will not result in Johnson's sacking, but it would mean that the same questions we had last season resurface and rightly so. It would still be a few more games though before any decision would be made.

I think we will win on Saturday which will give us a temporary reprieve from the current bickering over in/out and if we do we need to hope that its the start of an upturn in results. If this seasons good/bad result cycle continues its going to be a helluva season

[Hibbyradge]

Jim this is really head in the sand stuff from you. Any Hibs manager (infact any manager) who has lost their first 3-4 games of a league season at a club who are aiming for top 4 is likely to be gone.

Can I ask why you think he should stay if he was to lose at the weekend? We are losing games to teams with significantly less budget than us which is the comfort blanket when we lose games to teams with bigger budgets than us.

The proof is in the results here. Add to that performance have generally been poor.

Man U lost the first 4 league games last season and finished 3rd.

I've mentioned hertz in 1986 too, only 2 wins in the first 9 with 5 losses.

I don't think Saturday is a must win if we want third, but it's nearly a must win for LJ. If lose, I think he'll get one further game to put things right. Lose again and he'll be gone.

[Key West]

It's the same pattern as we saw with Ross getting sacked, a divided support until he was booted, then Maloney, and history is repeating itself with Johnson.

Unfortunately that is the case, it's disheartening, discouraging and boring.

[jeffers]

When it gets to the stage that they were going to sack him had we lost the Luzern tie it’s only going to end one way. I don’t see what the point is in prolonging things.

[Skol]

When it gets to the stage that they were going to sack him had we lost the Luzern tie it’s only going to end one way. I don’t see what the point is in prolonging things.

Who said they were going to sack him if we didn’t beat luzern?

[jeffers]

Who said they were going to sack him if we didn’t beat luzern?

Our CEO.

[Iain G]

Our CEO.

Before or after he gave out the team?

[jeffers]

Before or after he gave out the team?

Probably at the same time.

[Smartie]

It is far too early in the season for any game to be must win IMO.

Johnson was under pressure a few times last season but on both occasions turned things around. However as is their right some people remain unconvinced. Johnson though did enough to remain in post and has been backed in the transfer market and as such will be given time. To use the Villa game as a reason is madness to me. It was always going to be tough, very tough and has no bearing on whats happened before or happens in the future. I think most people went into the game hoping we might nick a draw or just a barrow defeat but deep down knew that a heavy defeat was likely.

A defeat on Saturday will not result in Johnson's sacking, but it would mean that the same questions we had last season resurface and rightly so. It would still be a few more games though before any decision would be made.

I think we will win on Saturday which will give us a temporary reprieve from the current bickering over in/out and if we do we need to hope that its the start of an upturn in results. If this seasons good/bad result cycle continues its going to be a helluva season

Until he gets more consistency from his team and puts an unequivocally good performance in over maybe 20 games, the knives will come out after every defeat.

Not saying that's right (in fact I really think it's not) but it's the way it is. He's got a long way to go to win a lot of folk over and that's just a statement of fact.

[Silky]

Unfortunately that is the case, it's disheartening, discouraging and boring.

And inevitable whoever is in the chair. Whoever is next is only one derby defeat away from being a charlatan, an imposter, whatever and, slowly, edging ever closer to the door.