Official Site: AGM DATE CONFIRMED

[Ozyhibby]

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Shaw, Porteous, Murray and Mackie have 157 appearances between them so far. With the exception of Shaw the other 3 still have the opportunity to add to their totals. Gullan has only recently appeared at 1st team level and currently has 6 appearances so far which he'll hopefully also add to in the coming months. Over 160 appearances between them and counting isn't too bad.

If you include the likes of Callum Booth (46), Sam Stanton (70), Alex Harris (60), Danny Handling (65), Jordan Forster (79) and Jason Cummings (150) who all made appearances in the past 6 years, I don't think our return has been poor.

How many appearances does a player have to make before they're deemed to be a "regular"?

Booth, Handling, Harris and Forster all broke through before Eddie May arrived. Cummings also broke through before Eddie May arrived but was a product of Heart set up.
Shaw hasn’t made it. Murray and Gullan still have a chance and Mackie came from Raith Rovers. Porteous is it. The one and only first team regular in 6 years.


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[CapitalGreen]

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Booth, Handling, Harris and Forster all broke through before Eddie May arrived. Cummings also broke through before Eddie May arrived but was a product of Heart set up.
Shaw hasn’t made it. Murray and Gullan still have a chance and Mackie came from Raith Rovers. Porteous is it. The one and only first team regular in 6 years.

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Mackie spent considerably more time within Hibs academy than at Raith Rovers. Unless you expect us to sign players straight out the womb, they are going to train with other clubs.

I also think basing it on 6 years is not fair, how much impact do you think any coaching or structural changes would have had on players who were 16-18 at the time Eddie May arrived, I’d say none. Even Porteous was 15 when May arrived. I’d say the proof will be in the pudding for players who have been recruited and through the academy system since May joined so talking about players who were 11-12 in Summer 2014 and who should be breaking through in the next few years.

[Robbo6-2]

The young players are there. Just look at our results at youth level against everyone else.

The problem is our managers are under so much pressure they are scared to play them

[Caversham Green]

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Mad that we are still nearly £5m short of Aberdeen in turnover, £15.415m they last posted

Their 2019 accounts are up now and their turnover is £15.928m. However they spent £20.943m to achieve that, resulting in a £5.015m loss. Not a business model I'd like to see Hibs following.

[overdrive]

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Booth, Handling, Harris and Forster all broke through before Eddie May arrived. Cummings also broke through before Eddie May arrived but was a product of Heart set up.
Shaw hasn’t made it. Murray and Gullan still have a chance and Mackie came from Raith Rovers. Porteous is it. The one and only first team regular in 6 years.


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Mackie was at Hibs before he went to Raith Rovers. We released him then resigned him when he started to do well with Raith, so he probably could be classed as a product of our academy.

[The Modfather]

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The young players are there. Just look at our results at youth level against everyone else.

The problem is our managers are under so much pressure they are scared to play them

I think there’s an argument not to put too much stock in youth results as the team with the best youngsters may be the poorest side as they are all in the first team squad. As was the case with our youth team during the golden generation.

Our managers will always be under pressure if we are to regularly compete at the top end of the league. We need to either find a way to actually blood youngsters while not impacting too much on the short term competitiveness otherwise we might as well just do away with our youth set up,

[The Modfather]

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Their 2019 accounts are up now and their turnover is £15.928m. However they spent £20.943m to achieve that, resulting in a £5.015m loss. Not a business model I'd like to see Hibs following.

What was the make up of the 5million loss? Any of it down to the new stadium and/or training centre? Even with an owner putting his own money in that can’t be sustainable and surely a one off year with mitigation.

[Caversham Green]

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What was the make up of the 5million loss? Any of it down to the new stadium and/or training centre? Even with an owner putting his own money in that can’t be sustainable and surely a one off year with mitigation.

Yes, it is a one-off - there's an impairment to Pittodrie of £4.25m, which is just a book entry in anticipation of the sale (I assume). Their operating loss was £1.029m, they had a gain on player sales of £308k and paid interest of £44k. After taking the impairment and player sales out of the equation their bottom line was still a fair bit worse than ours.

The stadium (£900k) and training centre (£7.402m) are balance sheet items and aren't included in those figures.

[Ozyhibby]

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Mackie spent considerably more time within Hibs academy than at Raith Rovers. Unless you expect us to sign players straight out the womb, they are going to train with other clubs.

I also think basing it on 6 years is not fair, how much impact do you think any coaching or structural changes would have had on players who were 16-18 at the time Eddie May arrived, I’d say none. Even Porteous was 15 when May arrived. I’d say the proof will be in the pudding for players who have been recruited and through the academy system since May joined so talking about players who were 11-12 in Summer 2014 and who should be breaking through in the next few years.

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Mackie was at Hibs before he went to Raith Rovers. We released him then resigned him when he started to do well with Raith, so he probably could be classed as a product of our academy.

Either way Mackie hasn’t made it at Hibs yet. A youth set up should be producing more than one player every 6 years.


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[blackpoolhibs]

How do we compare with the rest, when looking at players that have come through and are regulars in their first teams?

[DarlingtonHibee]

Guess a lot of it, is what resources you have, celtic obviously put a lot of time and money in.

[CapitalGreen]

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Either way Mackie hasn’t made it at Hibs yet. A youth set up should be producing more than one player every 6 years.


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Agreed but I don’t think the lack of youth products for the period 2014-2018 can be attributable to Eddie May.

[Ozyhibby]

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Agreed but I don’t think the lack of youth products for the period 2014-2018 can be attributable to Eddie May.

He’s in charge of the youth set up over that period. I doubt he said in his interview in 2014 that he expects us to produce only one player over the next 6 years so I think it’s fair to ask what’s going wrong. Not sure what the youth section costs a year but I’m sure it’s not cheap. A good youth set up pays for itself by selling players. Ours is not managing that.


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[The Modfather]

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How do we compare with the rest, when looking at players that have come through and are regulars in their first teams?

The closest article I could find

https://www.modernfitba.com/blogs/20...-young-players

I'm sure there will be flaws in the logic used to collate these numbers, but on the face of it the two graphs in the link below don't make good reading for our youth set up and pathway to the first team.

https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/c...g?format=1500w

https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/c...g?format=1500w

[CapitalGreen]

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He’s in charge of the youth set up over that period. I doubt he said in his interview in 2014 that he expects us to produce only one player over the next 6 years so I think it’s fair to ask what’s going wrong. Not sure what the youth section costs a year but I’m sure it’s not cheap. A good youth set up pays for itself by selling players. Ours is not managing that.

If you consider a players youth development process at the club to take 6/7 years from pro-youth to professional, then Eddie May should be judged against players coming through now and going forward rather than against players who were already in the under 20s and signing their first professional contracts when he arrived.

You are judging May against the like of Shaw and Stirling, guys who were 16 at the time he arrived. How much impact would changes to the structure of the academy have on the players he inherited such as these if they weren’t likely to make it in the first place.

[Ozyhibby]

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The closest article I could find

https://www.modernfitba.com/blogs/20...-young-players

I'm sure there will be flaws in the logic used to collate these numbers, but on the face of it the two graphs in the link below don't make good reading for our youth set up and pathway to the first team.

https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/c...g?format=1500w

https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/c...g?format=1500w

Makes for pretty grim reading for those involved with youth development at Hibs. And I think it’s fair that fans ask questions about why it’s going so wrong.


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[Mikey]

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If you consider a players youth development process at the club to take 6/7 years from pro-youth to professional, then Eddie May should be judged against players coming through now and going forward rather than against players who were already in the under 20s and signing their first professional contracts when he arrived.

You are judging May against the like of Shaw and Stirling, guys who were 16 at the time he arrived. How much impact would changes to the structure of the academy have on the players he inherited such as these if they weren’t likely to make it in the first place.

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Makes for pretty grim reading for those involved with youth development at Hibs. And I think it’s fair that fans ask questions about why it’s going so wrong.


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Yeah, but you're completely ignoring the point made above. Again.

[Ozyhibby]

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If you consider a players youth development process at the club to take 6/7 years from pro-youth to professional, then Eddie May should be judged against players coming through now and going forward rather than against players who were already in the under 20s and signing their first professional contracts when he arrived.

You are judging May against the like of Shaw and Stirling, guys who were 16 at the time he arrived. How much impact would changes to the structure of the academy have on the players he inherited such as these if they weren’t likely to make it in the first place.

And where are all the 20 year olds that should be banging down the door?


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[HendoDelivered]

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Grasp of reality, zero.

Delusion at max.

Agree. But tbh, it’s quite weird that people are going out their way to go on their forum to see what they are saying about us. **** them.

[green day]

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And where are all the 20 year olds that should be banging down the door?


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This is a reasonable question.

There is obviously a sizeable cost to running a youth operation, and just being able to say you are part of Project Brave is not the tangible reward that Hibs need.

This issue - lack of talent flowing into the first team - has to be one of the areas under the microscope now, or we might as well go the Falkirk route and ditch it entirely.

[WhileTheChief..]

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we might as well go the Falkirk route and ditch it entirely.

We should seriously consider it.

Use the money that we spend on our youth set up to poach the best youngsters from other clubs in a similar vein to how we got John McGinn.

Sucks morally but we'd probably get a better return on our money.

It's nice to say we develop our own players but in reality we don't. We develop them for some lower league teams in the future.

[Ozyhibby]

I don’t want us to go that way to be honest. I think it’s good for a club to bring through local youngsters.
We just need to ask why it’s failing just now.


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[CapitalGreen]

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And where are all the 20 year olds that should be banging down the door?


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Two featured on Wednesday night and another (regular starter who has been called up to the national team) is out injured.

[Kato]

It's not just down to Eddie May. The hardest part is having a manager with the talent to help the youth take the step up, imbue them with confidence and carry on their career without making 1st team football seem a scary prospect. Previous managers in the time scale have to carry some of the can too if we are falling short.

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[Ozyhibby]

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Two featured on Wednesday night and another (regular starter who has been called up to the national team) is out injured.

Murray is not exactly banging down the door. He’s been in and out the first team squad for a while now without making any kind of impact.
Gullan, it’s still early days yet. Hopefully he can make the break through.


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[CapitalGreen]

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Murray is not exactly banging down the door. He’s been in and out the first team squad for a while now without making any kind of impact.
Gullan, it’s still early days yet. Hopefully he can make the break through.

Depends how narrowly you wish to define “banging the door down” I suppose. We can only start 11 players each match and field a total of 14 including subs. Murray has been in those 14 players the last 2 games while playing understudy this season to our star summer signing who we have effectively built the team around.

[Spike Mandela]

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Mad that we are still nearly £5m short of Aberdeen in turnover, £15.415m they last posted

Wondering if this has anything to do with Aberdeen being a one club city whilst Edinburgh is a two club city and commercial streams are divided.

[Ozyhibby]

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Wondering if this has anything to do with Aberdeen being a one club city whilst Edinburgh is a two club city and commercial streams are divided.

Our city is twice as big.


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[SetonClapper]

Do you have to be a shareholder to attend the AGM ? Can I take a guest ?

[Sergio sledge]

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Our city is twice as big.


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But we also have significantly more competition for the likes of corporate hospitality and sponsorship in Edinburgh. Aberdeen FC is the only show in town up there.