The Dreaded Coeficient Thread

[Keith_M]

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Another blip in the 60s - Hertz, Dundee, Kilmarnock.

The golden era was obviously the near two decades after the second world war (up to Kilmarnock's win in 1965), when a number of other teams won the league title.

Even during that halcyon era (46-47 to 64-65), Rangers won the league 10 times in 19 seasons.

In fact, between Third Lanark's league win in 1904 and Hibs winning the league in 1948, all but one title went to one or other of the old firm (35 out of 36).


Makes you wonder why we bother...

[Paul1642]

With the way that money works in today’s game long term dominance is pretty near impossible to over turn. The only big league that is remotely competitive is The English prem and that’s only because there are more teams that are loaded.

[Smartie]

I think it’s impossible to challenge consistently but I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect that maybe once or twice every 20 years a team could come together capable of punching above it’s weight and getting in about the top 2.

We should also be trying to qualify for Europe more regularly ourselves and progressing more there. That should generate a bit more cash and help us keep up with the big 2. There are clubs who do much better in that arena with less resource than the OF and similar to us. There’s an opportunity to do better there over the next few years imo.

[WhileTheChief..]

I’ve not paid any attention to the new Euro conference thing.

Article here explains why finishing 3rd could be so important if you’re like me and missed it before.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/56166942

[CMurdoch]

It's that time again with Scotland starting the evening little more than a draw ahead of the Ukraine.

Shakhtar kicked off at 6pm tonight and at half time it's 0-0. All Shakhtar but no goals.
3-0 down to Roma from the 1st leg so the tie looks over.
However, they can still win coefficient points tonight for the Ukraine if they win or draw and that would impact on Scotland.
I would settle for a draw which would see Scotland still the thickness of a piece of paper ahead of the Ukraine.

Rangers and Kiev will kick of their matches at 8pm

Update - 1-0 Roma after 48 mins

[SJNB Hibby]

Not much scoring in the early games today, Molde putting up a fight, but no sign of S Donetsk going through, although a win would help Ukraines coefficient---A Roma win would be welcome.

[SJNB Hibby]

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It's that time again with Scotland starting the evening little more than a draw ahead of the Ukraine.

Shakhtar kicked off at 6pm tonight and at half time it's 0-0. All Shakhtar but no goals.
3-0 down to Roma from the 1st leg so the tie looks over.
However, they can still win coefficient points tonight for the Ukraine if they win or draw and that would impact on Scotland.
I would settle for a draw which would see Scotland still the thickness of a piece of paper ahead of the Ukraine.

Rangers and Kiev will kick of their matches at 8pm

Update - 1-0 Roma after 48 mins

Villareal goal early on would be nice CM--kill that tie off---that way a Rangers loss keeps us ahead of those pesky Ukrainians

[CMurdoch]

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Not much scoring in the early games today, Molde putting up a fight, but no sign of S Donetsk going through, although a win would help Ukraines coefficient---A Roma win would be welcome.

1-1 after an hour

Pedro missed a sitter for Roma between the 2 goals

[CMurdoch]

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Villareal goal early on would be nice CM--kill that tie off---that way a Rangers loss keeps us ahead of those pesky Ukrainians

I watched Kiev against Brugge in the last round and they were rotten so can't see them coming back in Spain.

Shakhtar are a much better team than Kiev.
Typically they have come back to life since they scored and Roma have started passing to the opposition.

[SJNB Hibby]

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1-1 after an hour

Pedro missed a sitter for Roma between the 2 goals

Does a draw move Ukraine above us?

[CMurdoch]

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Does a draw move Ukraine above us?

No, but would be less than a draw ahead.

2-1 Roma

80 mins and Shakhter should have had a penalty. Idiot defender grabbed the attackers shoulder.

[JohnMcM]

I don’t understand all this stuff. Probably why I hated algebra all those years ago.

[SJNB Hibby]

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I don’t understand all this stuff. Probably why I hated algebra all those years ago.

Its easy--"Yay Scotland...Boo Ukraine"

[SJNB Hibby]

Oooh---Spurs/Jose in trouble

[CMurdoch]

Game over 2-1 Roma

Zero coefficient points for Shakhtar.

If Rangers get a draw tonight Ukraine can't head Scotland unless Dynamo Kiev get through tonight which I can't see happening

[SJNB Hibby]

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Game over 2-1 Roma

Zero coefficient points for Shakhtar.

If Rangers get a draw tonight Ukraine can't head Scotland unless Dynamo Kiev get through tonight which I can't see happening

And what the heck---lets go for a 4-0 Young Boys win

[SJNB Hibby]

Commentator blaming McGregor for that goal---thats a bit harsh

[SJNB Hibby]

Aaach well, Kiev losing

[CMurdoch]

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Commentator blaming McGregor for that goal---thats a bit harsh

I have Dutch commentators so don't know what they said.
I thought he should have saved it as well.
He was in the right position but slow in getting down.
Lots of pace on the header but should have stopped it from his starting position.
Past it!

[CMurdoch]

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Aaach well, Kiev losing

Looking like no points for Scotland and no points for Ukraine tonight.
That ensures Scotland finish in 11th this season.

One more goal from Slavia and Rangers need 3 which ain't happening.
Slavia holding all the aces at this point.

Morelos more interested in being an idiot tonight rather than getting on with it.

[jgl07]

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Side issue/ what’s happening with the 2020 Scottish Cup winners? Are they going to get a Euro place or will there be no reward?

Err No!

The Scottish Cup winners slot would have gone to a team based on League positions.

Since Celtic won the League for 2019-20 and the 2020 Cup it makes no difference.

[Magpie]

Get the huns out.

[CMurdoch]

Over and out

[SJNB Hibby]

Holy crap...even for a Hun that was brutal----whats he complaining about?

[CMurdoch]

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Holy crap...even for a Hun that was brutal----whats he complaining about?

Have struggled to make chances 11 v 11.
No chance 10 v 11

Roofe sold the jerseys

[Col2]

Looks like Scotland will still get that automatic CL group place. Shakers have lost and Dynamo K are losing by 2 goals with only 10 mins left.

As I understand it that guarantees it if Dynamo don’t come back.

[jgl07]

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With the way that money works in today’s game long term dominance is pretty near impossible to over turn. The only big league that is remotely competitive is The English prem and that’s only because there are more teams that are loaded.

That certainly has been the case for Scotland since Rangers brought in Souness and started throwing money about. It was not the case before that. Otherwise how would Aberdeen, Dundee United, Dundee, Hearts, Kilmarnock, Hibs, etc have been able to win titles from the late 1940s to the mid-1980s?

In England, money only really started to count when the Premier League came in in the early 1990s. The likes of Portsmouth, Wolves, Burnley, Ipswich, Everton, Manchester City, Nottingham Forest, Aston Villa, Leeds United, and Derby County all won post-war titles, as well as the usual suspects (Arsenal, Manchester United, Spurs, Chelsea, Liverpool).

OK money has certainly mattered since then. Leicester did win the title despite that a few years back.

[CMurdoch]

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I don’t understand all this stuff. Probably why I hated algebra all those years ago.

It's not that complicated.
After the qualifying rounds you get 2 points for a win and 1 point for a draw. Scotland had 4 teams in Europe this season so if a Scottish team win a match the 2 points is divided by 4, so in essence a win is worth half a point and a draw is worth a quarter of a point.

Next season Scotland will have 5 teams in Europe so any points our teams get will be divided by 5 so a win will be worth 0.4 of a point and a draw 0.2 of a point.

Other stuff - Points gained in qualifying matches are only worth half the normal amount and extra points are given for qualifying for the next group stage etc.

[CMurdoch]

All Scottish teams are now out of Europe and Scotland will finish this season in 11th place capping 3 seasons of progress from a lowly 26th.

Scotland will start next season in 9th position a fraction of a point behind Russia after Rangers were unable to get even a draw tonight but we should overhaul them before next season is out. Hopefully Hibs can make a good fist of things and contribute points to the Scottish total

Once Scotland hit 8th position they should hold on to it for a few seasons directly behind Holland and all the big leagues. Suspect that is as good as it can get.

[hibbysam]

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All Scottish teams are now out of Europe and Scotland will finish this season in 11th place capping 3 seasons of progress from a lowly 26th.

Scotland will start next season in 9th position a fraction of a point behind Russia after Rangers were unable to get even a draw tonight but we should overhaul them before next season is out. Hopefully Hibs can make a good fist of things and contribute points to the Scottish total

Once Scotland hit 8th position they should hold on to it for a few seasons directly behind Holland and all the big leagues. Suspect that is as good as it can get.

It’s an outstanding achievement. On a side note, is it 90 minutes the coefficient works off? For example Rangers last night, if they had equalised then there was a winner in extra time, does coefficient work from the 90 or 120 minute mark? Guessing 90 but just curious.

We really need all teams to at least win a couple of games and the big two to go fairly deep regularly.