To be fair, I think the SNP were 1/7 favourites at one stage. Labour were way out at something like 10/1.This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
Pretty much nobody expected a Labour win and the only consistent prediction that came pass was that, as you say, Reform did well. Swinney consistently banged on about it being a two-horse race between the SNP and Reform which made him look a bit daft.
Definitely a major shock compared to the Westminster by-election in roughly the same constituency when constituents had already turfed out Margaret Ferrier.
View Poll Results: Should Scotland be an independent country?
- Voters
- 662. You may not vote on this poll
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Yes
458 69.18% -
No
175 26.44% -
Undecided
29 4.38%
Results 26,461 to 26,490 of 26549
Thread: Scottish Independence
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01-07-2025 04:48 PM #26461
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01-07-2025 04:54 PM #26462
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What's a massive favorite if not 1/7? 😂
I said it's really easy to say one thing in a poll but totally different when it comes to actual voting, we saw that in 2024 when support for Indy parties was about 35% I think? I think if we had a referendum tomorrow it would be about 60/40 for No.
I have heard for years Indy is just around the corner now and X is going to drive support for Indy yet it never happens. I am super worried about the UN though, Craig Murray is such a great figure head to build the case for Independence (he was even rejected by Alba 😂 as a candidate)
I could look back at posts from 2019 etc and it would be the same thing posted where people were waking up to Indy and it was just around the corner.
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01-07-2025 05:11 PM #26463This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
Why would support for Indy be growing right now? What has fundamentally changed, to change anybody's opinion? Who, arguing the case for Indy, is putting forward a new, interesting and unarguable case for independence?
In my opinion, for support for independence to grow, the SNP need to be out of power for a while. The pressure needs to be on Labour, Reform, and the Tories, whoever is in power, to make the union and (for now) devolution work for the people of Scotland to make their lives better.
The SNP need new faces, new ideas, to be in opposition and for new opportunities to present themselves.
It's not a great time to be any sort of incumbent and I don't think the SNP or the cause of independence is furthered by them trying to be a competent government in a constitutional set up with which they fundamentally disagree.
The cause of independence is, imo, going nowhere right now. There's no amount of arguing from "the converted" that will convince me otherwise.
I don't really want to be a source of misery and negativity whilst Hibs are playing such an absolute blinder day by day but I've lost faith in Scotland and it's ability to change and be better. My full focus is on dealing with the daily **** in order for my kids to be in a position to leave and move somewhere else, somewhere better. I don't see a future of happiness, prosperity and peace here, only bleakness. They need to get what sort of an education they can, gather some valuable skills and get the hell out.
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01-07-2025 08:01 PM #26464This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
This latest poll is interesting in the fact that SNP drop from 34% in the constituency to 26% in the list with The Greens gaining 5% from 2021 up to 15% and 1 point behind Reform, maybe people are waking up to the pitfalls of SNP 1 and 2.
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01-07-2025 08:05 PM #26465
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02-07-2025 09:01 AM #26466
Latest ipsos poll shows independence at 17th in the list of voter priorities these days:
https://www.ipsos.com/sites/default/...1_PUBLIC_1.pdf
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02-07-2025 09:19 AM #26467
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02-07-2025 10:20 AM #26468
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Independence isn't a current topic of much interest to the wider public - apart from on here! There is no imminent need for the public to consider it.
I'm surprised it made the list at all.Space to let
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02-07-2025 10:24 AM #26469This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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02-07-2025 11:17 AM #26470This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
It dominated everything for at least a decade or so and has since quietened down.
I think Westminster's fairly definitive "no, ye cannae" has pretty much put it to bed in a lot of people's eyes for a while.
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02-07-2025 11:26 AM #26471This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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02-07-2025 12:09 PM #26472This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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02-07-2025 12:26 PM #26473
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I would disagree on your first statement, if there was an Indy Ref tomorrow I reckon No would win by a bigger margin than last time. It's very very easy to say Yes in an online poll or survey, the last poll from a few days ago when you took away Dont Know was Yes on 46%, that's using the same question as last time which there is no guarantee that would happen.
There is still so many unanswered questions and no resemblance of a plan.
I am often reminded of this sketch and I think this is quite true.
https://youtu.be/wihaFybOrKw?si=K9kfqD-GAxGB-WE1&utm_source=MTQxZ
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02-07-2025 12:43 PM #26474This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
Firstly you do you I'll do me, I firmly believe it's an English Government in everything but name only and I have strong legal opinion on my side to back that up, if you want to remain gaslit that's a shame but entirely up to you,
The table you posted was from the Ipsos poll yeh? Those very same people were asked "If a referendum were held tomorrow about Scotland’s constitutional future, how would you vote in response to the following question: Should Scotland be an independent country?" So they literally were asked about a referendum tomorrow and a 52% majority said they'd vote yes. That's evidence and not just wishful thinking by yourself.
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02-07-2025 01:00 PM #26475
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Independence Polling – Ballot Box Scotland https://share.google/BECJKZJqWhEWAOLmw
There is no such thing as an English Government, the opinion of a single Lawyer who is a Scottish Nationalist counts for nothing at all. I will continue to not be gaslight but live in reality. The English Parliament that has 57 Scottish based MPs....we will just have to agree to disagree on this point but mine is based on the law and reality.Last edited by jamie_1875; 02-07-2025 at 01:05 PM.
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02-07-2025 01:04 PM #26476
Why are some people always surprised that an SNP government will regularly push independence when that was it's sole aim when it was started.
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02-07-2025 01:11 PM #26477This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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02-07-2025 01:15 PM #26478This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
GGTTH
GGTTH
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02-07-2025 01:22 PM #26479
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02-07-2025 04:44 PM #26480
The UK is a Conservative country that occasionally votes Labour. The next Tory/Reform government is just around the corner and with it an increased desire for independence. It's only a matter of time.
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02-07-2025 05:26 PM #26481This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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02-07-2025 05:38 PM #26482This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
Unanswered questions and no plan I'm quite comfortable with though.
I agree with the idea of independence based on a bigger picture view. I want Scotland to be part of the EU (whether that is part of the UK or not) very badly. Going forward, the EU is going to be the leader of the free world, it is the future. I don't really have any great love for the idea of the UK being "Airstrip one", or Scotland being a nation badly in need of sorting our terrible demographic issues but having its immigration policy largely determined by the "we want are country back" morons who are perpetually pandered to down South.
Scotland's ability and satisfaction to do so little with so much is a constant frustration of mine. I'm sick of envying Denmark, Norway, Sweden. Even ******* Ireland is leaving us in the dust. We're in a state of decay and decline it is infuriating.
Except, of course, unless you're one of "the 5%". There's a quality of life on offer, a quality of education and health services here that are of a very high standard to those who can afford them. I fall just out of that and it is infuriating to see it, to know it exists, to think that it should really be available for everyone but for us to settle for our grimly, brutally, disgustingly unequal society.
Yes, we can bicker about using the pound but for me that misses the point. We could happily bicker about my EU point (the main one) but again that misses the point.
Necessity is the mother of invention and I believe Scots to have always had a knack for invention. We'd work it out. We just need to have to.
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02-07-2025 06:48 PM #26483This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
As someone who has gone from having an element of the respect for the SNP's political savvy under Salmond to loathing them, I'd be quite happy if they remain in government from an independence perspective as that ain't ever happening under such a bunch of duds. They have no idea how to move the dial there.
From the perspective of wanting to see Scotland better governed I'd like to see them disappear from view. And the irony is, the demise of the SNP would be the best thing for the independence movement. It's hard to imagine that a replacement vehicle for independence could be any less competent.
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02-07-2025 06:59 PM #26484
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02-07-2025 07:02 PM #26485
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Are you arguing that there is an “English Government”?
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02-07-2025 07:24 PM #26486This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
When you get time watch these films Smartie. Once you watch one you'll struggle not to watch more. They give you an idea of what's possible when you're in charge of your own decisions. They're absolutely eye opening especially when it comes to education and social justice. Where money is the deciding factor over here it's provided by the state in these countries, yes they pay more tax but they also earn more or have a more thoughtful welfare state. The Estonian tax system and how they picked their Government, the Norwegian Summer houses along with Sweden whereby normal members of the population own a cabin on the Fjords they use for Summer breaks, the Danish education system where they send kids at 15 to a school away from home for a year to promote team building, state subsidised, Finland with the best education system in the world which doesn't test kids at all until 15yr old and also has the least teacher intervention of any system. All of them with infrastructures you wouldn't believe. Councils for every town who concentrate on their own areas not councils the size of Belgium like we have here. This aint a "Fantasyland" it's happening just next door to us in countries with less going for them.
Gaining Independence is the easy part, it's creating something great with it that's the difficult part and without being disrespectful to the SNP I don't think they're capable of that hence their shouldn't be an SNP plan that's down to a constitutional convention.
https://lesleyriddoch.com/films
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02-07-2025 07:28 PM #26487This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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02-07-2025 07:49 PM #26488
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Lesley Ridiculous as she is known is like me posting videos from Alex Massie or Stephen Daisley saying look at these and you will support the Union.
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02-07-2025 07:55 PM #26489This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
There you go again, trying to belittle the person involved rather than the content itself, you obviously didn't watch any of it you just came straight on here trying to character assassinate.
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02-07-2025 08:03 PM #26490
I suppose we must be better in the Union, where poor people are vilified and ghettoised, the national conversation constantly veers between outrage and triviality, patriotism is someone else's profit, refugees are othered to the point where people want to burn down the buildings in which they are kettled and the only social contract is in favour of the already rich.
I'm pretty ambivalent about independence but in a country that is organised and set-up for the extremely well off and every aspect is commodified towards cost rather than value, no-one is going to be happy and I can empathise with those who want out.
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