SNP are lying b******s as well !

[Ozyhibby]

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Surely trying to change the rules to make it markedly harder to change the leadership should be highlighted? This is the type of thing that caused all the division previously with Sturgeon.

It’s not like it’s hard to change SNP leadership. We’ve had three in last two years? If the current leadership loses support they will be gone just like in any other party.
As it is, Swinney has steadied the ship and got the party back to bread and butter issues abandoned but late years Sturgeon and Yousaf. There is no desire out there to change the leadership?


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[Moulin Yarns]

Only a matter of time before Sarwar proposes it!


https://news.stv.tv/politics/work-to...al-levy-system


.

[Ozyhibby]

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Only a matter of time before Sarwar proposes it!


https://news.stv.tv/politics/work-to...al-levy-system


.

This is a good idea. The SNP needs a big offer for the next election that represents some change. The work will need to almost done and the plans fully fleshed out to win people’s confidence it will happen though after previous failures but it def has potential.
Labour currently are offering to keep SNP policies we already have but with the caveat that Sarwar is known to lie about what his intentions are.


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[Paul1642]

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This is a good idea. The SNP needs a big offer for the next election that represents some change. The work will need to almost done and the plans fully fleshed out to win people’s confidence it will happen though after previous failures but it def has potential.
Labour currently are offering to keep SNP policies we already have but with the caveat that Sarwar is known to lie about what his intentions are.


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I’m fully supportive of overhauling council tax but I’m cynical of the SNP’s timing, effectively running it as an election pledge, when they have already done so in the past only to then go deafly quiet about it for years.

[Ozyhibby]

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I’m fully supportive of overhauling council tax but I’m cynical of the SNP’s timing, effectively running it as an election pledge, when they have already done so in the past only to then go deafly quiet about it for years.

That’s a fair point and this is def being done with an eye on the election. It’s also likely reflects the change from Yousaf to Forbes/Swinney and actually getting real things done instead of a lot of the culture wars nonsense of Yousaf.
One thing for sure is that the vast majority in Scotland think this needs done and will support it until they work out that maybe they are one of the losers from the change.


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[Andy Bee]

I don't know what to make of the voting in Kirky. https://x.com/mgshanks/status/1890307225127641584

Turnout 26.2%, down 18% from last time, SNP supporters still seem to be staying at home. Labour only up 1% but Reform smashing the Tories with 15% of the vote to the Tories 4.1%. If this voting trend continues to 2026 we'll see a shedload of Reform getting in on the list unless SNP change tach on vote 1&2 SNP. Small numbers I know but it should still be a warning.

[Paul1642]

Not a purely SNP issue but the confirmed Edinburgh 25/26 Council Tax raised 8%, Water Charges raised 9.9%

The council have voted to raise council tax by 8% and earlier Scottish Water raised water and waste charges by 9.9% for 25/26

Council Budget headlines 25/26

Investment of £296m in five new schools and five extensions is planned, together with replacement of Fox Covert Campus.

A further £26m will be invested in upgrading our special needs schools.

We are continuing to invest £12.5m this year, and next year, in our pavements, streetscapes, lighting and roads. There’s an additional £5m for Safer Routes to School and other travelling safely initiatives.

There’s £50m investment for purchasing or building suitable temporary accommodation for homeless.

Libraries and Community Centres are hugely valued by our residents and £15m is planned for upgrading and integrating community spaces. We’re committed to keeping our libraries open and we’re investing £15m to replace Blackhall Library

Investment of almost £50m is planned for Health and Social Care facilities, including £5.6m for adaptations to people’s own homes.

there’s additional support of £14m for Adult Health and Social Care in this year’s budget.

They also mentioned in the debate that 3% of the rise will go to pay for the rise in employer National Insurance contributions announced at the UK budget.

Band 25/26 Council Tax 25/26 Council Tax + Water charges 24/25 Council Tax + Water charges
A £1,042.34 £1,442.60 £1,329.39
B £1,216.06 £1,683.03 £1,550.95
C £1,389.79 £1,923.47 £1,772.52
D £1,563.51 £2,163.89 £1,994.08
E £2,054.28 £2,788.09 £2,569.91
F £2,540.70 £3,407.93 £3,141.73
G £3,061.87 £4,062.52 £3,745.71
H £3,830.60 £5,031.39 £4,639.62


A fair increase for some and looks like other councils are in similar ballparks.

I don’t grudge paying the increase because it’s plain to see that the council is in desperate need of cash. Hopefully this raise combined with the imminent tourists tax makes a noticeable difference.

The banding system is of course massively out dated though.

[grunt]

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Not a purely SNP issue but the confirmed Edinburgh 25/26 Council Tax raised 8%, Water Charges raised 9.9%.

Not even remotely an SNP issue?

[Ozyhibby]

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Not a purely SNP issue but the confirmed Edinburgh 25/26 Council Tax raised 8%, Water Charges raised 9.9%

The council have voted to raise council tax by 8% and earlier Scottish Water raised water and waste charges by 9.9% for 25/26

Council Budget headlines 25/26

Investment of £296m in five new schools and five extensions is planned, together with replacement of Fox Covert Campus.

A further £26m will be invested in upgrading our special needs schools.

We are continuing to invest £12.5m this year, and next year, in our pavements, streetscapes, lighting and roads. There’s an additional £5m for Safer Routes to School and other travelling safely initiatives.

There’s £50m investment for purchasing or building suitable temporary accommodation for homeless.

Libraries and Community Centres are hugely valued by our residents and £15m is planned for upgrading and integrating community spaces. We’re committed to keeping our libraries open and we’re investing £15m to replace Blackhall Library

Investment of almost £50m is planned for Health and Social Care facilities, including £5.6m for adaptations to people’s own homes.

there’s additional support of £14m for Adult Health and Social Care in this year’s budget.

They also mentioned in the debate that 3% of the rise will go to pay for the rise in employer National Insurance contributions announced at the UK budget.

Band25/26 Council Tax25/26 Council Tax + Water charges24/25 Council Tax + Water charges
A£1,042.34£1,442.60£1,329.39
B£1,216.06£1,683.03£1,550.95
C£1,389.79£1,923.47£1,772.52
D£1,563.51£2,163.89£1,994.08
E£2,054.28£2,788.09£2,569.91
F£2,540.70£3,407.93£3,141.73
G£3,061.87£4,062.52£3,745.71
H£3,830.60£5,031.39£4,639.62


A fair increase for some and looks like other councils are in similar ballparks.

I don’t grudge paying the increase because it’s plain to see that the council is in desperate need of cash. Hopefully this raise combined with the imminent tourists tax makes a noticeable difference.

The banding system is of course massively out dated though.

Isn’t Edinburgh a Labour/Tory coalition?


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[Paul1642]

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Not even remotely an SNP issue?

To be honest it didn’t seem worthy of a new thread and this seemed the most relevant to shoehorn it into.

It was however very much an SNP issue last year when the Scottish government froze council tax and they could have set a % cap or provided more central money to councils reducing the need for large raises so I don’t think it’s fair to say it’s not a partial SNP issue.

[Stairway 2 7]

It's completely an SNP issue due to the farcical council tax freeze that wasn't nearly funded. The rises are needed to end the years and of austerity. Hopefully gives councils some breathing space and all councils whatever the party will announce similar rises.

Yes it needs reformed but no party seems to have an idea on how

[Andy Bee]

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Not a purely SNP issue but the confirmed Edinburgh 25/26 Council Tax raised 8%, Water Charges raised 9.9%

The council have voted to raise council tax by 8% and earlier Scottish Water raised water and waste charges by 9.9% for 25/26

Council Budget headlines 25/26

Investment of £296m in five new schools and five extensions is planned, together with replacement of Fox Covert Campus.

A further £26m will be invested in upgrading our special needs schools.

We are continuing to invest £12.5m this year, and next year, in our pavements, streetscapes, lighting and roads. There’s an additional £5m for Safer Routes to School and other travelling safely initiatives.

There’s £50m investment for purchasing or building suitable temporary accommodation for homeless.

Libraries and Community Centres are hugely valued by our residents and £15m is planned for upgrading and integrating community spaces. We’re committed to keeping our libraries open and we’re investing £15m to replace Blackhall Library

Investment of almost £50m is planned for Health and Social Care facilities, including £5.6m for adaptations to people’s own homes.

there’s additional support of £14m for Adult Health and Social Care in this year’s budget.

They also mentioned in the debate that 3% of the rise will go to pay for the rise in employer National Insurance contributions announced at the UK budget.

Band 25/26 Council Tax 25/26 Council Tax + Water charges 24/25 Council Tax + Water charges
A £1,042.34 £1,442.60 £1,329.39
B £1,216.06 £1,683.03 £1,550.95
C £1,389.79 £1,923.47 £1,772.52
D £1,563.51 £2,163.89 £1,994.08
E £2,054.28 £2,788.09 £2,569.91
F £2,540.70 £3,407.93 £3,141.73
G £3,061.87 £4,062.52 £3,745.71
H £3,830.60 £5,031.39 £4,639.62


A fair increase for some and looks like other councils are in similar ballparks.

I don’t grudge paying the increase because it’s plain to see that the council is in desperate need of cash. Hopefully this raise combined with the imminent tourists tax makes a noticeable difference.

The banding system is of course massively out dated though.

Trying to work out those bands in todays prices is crazy. I'm thinking a band F must be around the £350 - £500k mark, G around £500 - £650k and H around £600k upwards. We need more bands. There must be people sitting in £2 - £3m houses paying the same as someone in a £600 - £700k house.

[Ozyhibby]

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Trying to work out those bands in todays prices is crazy. I'm thinking a band F must be around the £350 - £500k mark, G around £500 - £650k and H around £600k upwards. We need more bands. There must be people sitting in £2 - £3m houses paying the same as someone in a £600 - £700k house.

Even without full reform that should have been done ages ago.
I’m sure I read somewhere that Buckingham Palace pays the same council house tax as a 3 bed in Blackpool.
They should really do it on valuations on property done every 5 years. 1% or so per year.


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[Moulin Yarns]

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Trying to work out those bands in todays prices is crazy. I'm thinking a band F must be around the £350 - £500k mark, G around £500 - £650k and H around £600k upwards. We need more bands. There must be people sitting in £2 - £3m houses paying the same as someone in a £600 - £700k house.

https://www.saa.gov.uk/council-tax/council-tax-bands/

There you go.



Range of ValuesBandUp to £27,000AOver £27,000 and up to £35,000BOver £35,000 and up to £45,000COver £45,000 and up to £58,000DOver £58,000 and up to £80,000EOver £80,000 and up to £106,000FOver £106,000 and up to £212,000GOver £212,000


34 years ago, I reckon my house, bought in 1989 is worth around 10x it's value then.

[Andy Bee]

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Even without full reform that should have been done ages ago.
I’m sure I read somewhere that Buckingham Palace pays the same council house tax as a 3 bed in Blackpool.
They should really do it on valuations on property done every 5 years. 1% or so per year.


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Seen something on that the other day. Buckingham Palace pays less than the average Scottish home.

[Andy Bee]

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https://www.saa.gov.uk/council-tax/council-tax-bands/

There you go.



Range of ValuesBandUp to £27,000AOver £27,000 and up to £35,000BOver £35,000 and up to £45,000COver £45,000 and up to £58,000DOver £58,000 and up to £80,000EOver £80,000 and up to £106,000FOver £106,000 and up to £212,000GOver £212,000

I used the old values as a reference MY then just used the value and Band of my own home, back of a fag packet stuff but it can't be far out.

[Moulin Yarns]

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Seen something on that the other day. Buckingham Palace pays less than the average Scottish home.

A claim circulating in news outlets and on social media that Buckingham Palace pays less council tax than most English households is missing important context. In addition to council tax the palace is also subject to over £800,000 in business rates.

https://fullfact.org/news/buckingham-palace-pay-council-tax/

[Andy Bee]

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A claim circulating in news outlets and on social media that Buckingham Palace pays less council tax than most English households is missing important context. In addition to council tax the palace is also subject to over £800,000 in business rates.

https://fullfact.org/news/buckingham...y-council-tax/

Jeezo they must really be feeling the pinch

[Andy Bee]

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Even without full reform that should have been done ages ago.
I’m sure I read somewhere that Buckingham Palace pays the same council house tax as a 3 bed in Blackpool.
They should really do it on valuations on property done every 5 years. 1% or so per year.


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I suppose there's now plenty average working people in £300k+ houses now, It's certainly the new level for a new home around my way. £3k a year on council tax is going to hurt. Maybe a stepped % like they do with LBTT.

[Ozyhibby]

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I suppose there's now plenty average working people in £300k+ houses now, It's certainly the new level for a new home around my way. £3k a year on council tax is going to hurt. Maybe a stepped % like they do with LBTT.

I just picked 1% out the air. It could be a bit less so long as it raises enough money. Important thing is wealthy people in huge houses start paying their fair share.


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[grunt]

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It's completely an SNP issue due to the farcical council tax freeze that wasn't nearly funded. The rises are needed to end the years and of austerity. Hopefully gives councils some breathing space and all councils whatever the party will announce similar rises.

So what you're saying is everyone should be happy with the Council Tax increases because it remedies the years of Scot Gov CT freeze? In that case well done to the Edinburgh Labour Council for increasing our taxes!

[Stairway 2 7]

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So what you're saying is everyone should be happy with the Council Tax increases because it remedies the years of Scot Gov CT freeze? In that case well done to the Edinburgh Labour Council for increasing our taxes!

No one is happy with council tax rises but if you don't want recession they need raised in a major way, pick your poison. SNP councils will raise in the same way so it's silly to blame each party that's putting it up. It should never have been frozen all they years it makes no sense cutting the council tax budget each year.

Scottish people also pay more income tax than UK and actually I do say well done SNP on raising our tax as it's necessary

[Ozyhibby]

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No one is happy with council tax rises but if you don't want recession they need raised in a major way, pick your poison. SNP councils will raise in the same way so it's silly to blame each party that's putting it up. It should never have been frozen all they years it makes no sense cutting the council tax budget each year.

Scottish people also pay more income tax than UK and actually I do say well done SNP on raising our tax as it's necessary

Scottish council tax is much lower than England?
And I doubt more tax helps stave off recession?


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[grunt]

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No one is happy with council tax rises but if you don't want recession they need raised in a major way, pick your poison.

You're going to have to help me out here. What's the link between Council Tax and recession?

[GlesgaeHibby]

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Trying to work out those bands in todays prices is crazy. I'm thinking a band F must be around the £350 - £500k mark, G around £500 - £650k and H around £600k upwards. We need more bands. There must be people sitting in £2 - £3m houses paying the same as someone in a £600 - £700k house.

Totally agree. If Council Tax is to stay we need more bands and updated based on today's pricing. It shouldn't be that hard to do given tools exist like Zoopla etc for estimating market value. I'm currently in a band G house, yet there are houses in the same town that recently sold for 3x what we paid for ours that are also band G. I'm in a new build estate where there are two identical house types, both moved in on same day and both paid £343k. One of the houses is band F and the other is band G...go figure. System is a total mess.

The reality is that if there was a political will to reform council tax it could be done fairly quickly.

[Stairway 2 7]

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Scottish council tax is much lower than England?
And I doubt more tax helps stave off recession?


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Sorry I meant austerity it was too early. Freezing the tax and not funding it means cuts in real terms. Council tax gets spent usually on the bottom up unlike other taxes, so it really hurts the most disadvantaged.

It needs reformed but if it isn't then Council tax freezing is horrendous.

[hibee]

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Totally agree. If Council Tax is to stay we need more bands and updated based on today's pricing. It shouldn't be that hard to do given tools exist like Zoopla etc for estimating market value. I'm currently in a band G house, yet there are houses in the same town that recently sold for 3x what we paid for ours that are also band G. I'm in a new build estate where there are two identical house types, both moved in on same day and both paid £343k. One of the houses is band F and the other is band G...go figure. System is a total mess.

The reality is that if there was a political will to reform council tax it could be done fairly quickly.

Two identical houses in different bands is surely just a mistake which can be rectified rather than it being anything to do with the system, one of them will be incorrect.

I’ve not read up on the SNP proposals for reform or if they even have any but I totally disagree with it being based on the value of a home.

Two people living in a large house will have access to the same council services as two people living in a small house.

[lapsedhibee]

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Two identical houses in different bands is surely just a mistake which can be rectified rather than it being anything to do with the system, one of them will be incorrect.

I’ve not read up on the SNP proposals for reform or if they even have any but I totally disagree with it being based on the value of a home.

Two people living in a large house will have access to the same council services as two people living in a small house.

Didn't we already try a flat rate council tax, and people didn't like it? IIRC there was actual rioting in Scotland when Thatcher introduced it.

[Andy Bee]

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Two identical houses in different bands is surely just a mistake which can be rectified rather than it being anything to do with the system, one of them will be incorrect.

I’ve not read up on the SNP proposals for reform or if they even have any but I totally disagree with it being based on the value of a home.

Two people living in a large house will have access to the same council services as two people living in a small house.

Using that argument all people working 40 hours should be paid the same or all people should be taxed the same amount. Tax needs to be progressive and council tax isn't progressive enough at the moment. Personally I'd just have a land tax.

[Ozyhibby]

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Two identical houses in different bands is surely just a mistake which can be rectified rather than it being anything to do with the system, one of them will be incorrect.

I’ve not read up on the SNP proposals for reform or if they even have any but I totally disagree with it being based on the value of a home.

Two people living in a large house will have access to the same council services as two people living in a small house.

Big fan of the Poll Tax were you?


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