Housing

[hibee]

Another article explaining the rush to switch to student flats, Gordon Smith and Hibs even get a mention.

https://www.cockburnassociation.org....ordable-homes/

[Ozyhibby]

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Another article explaining the rush to switch to student flats, Gordon Smith and Hibs even get a mention.

https://www.cockburnassociation.org....ordable-homes/

The rent freeze will be over soon so hopefully things will get moving again. A terrible policy that even the Greens don’t seem to be fighting too hard to bring back.


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[superfurryhibby]

Worth noting that it's not some landlord feeding frenzy after 31 March.

"If a tenant is concerned about the level of a proposed rent increase, they can raise it with their landlord or agent and apply to a rent officer at Rent Service Scotland, or to the First-tier Tribunal if applicable, for a rent adjudication.

The regulations would temporarily modify the rent adjudication process for 12 months so that on making a decision on adjudication, the rent officer would use a rent taper formula which can be summarised as below:

If the gap between the market rent and the current rent is 6% or less, then the landlord can increase the rent by the proposed amount, as long as this is not more than the market level.

If the gap between the market rent and the current rent is more than 6%, the landlord can increase the rent by 6% plus an additional 0.33% for each percent that the gap between the current rent and market rent exceeds 6%, as per the formula set out in the Rent Adjudication (Temporary Modifications) (Scotland) Regulations 2024. However, the total rent increase cannot exceed 12% of the current rent.

https://www.scottishhousingnews.com/...-rent-cap-ends

[Ozyhibby]

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Worth noting that it's not some landlord feeding frenzy after 31 March.

"If a tenant is concerned about the level of a proposed rent increase, they can raise it with their landlord or agent and apply to a rent officer at Rent Service Scotland, or to the First-tier Tribunal if applicable, for a rent adjudication.

The regulations would temporarily modify the rent adjudication process for 12 months so that on making a decision on adjudication, the rent officer would use a rent taper formula which can be summarised as below:

If the gap between the market rent and the current rent is 6% or less, then the landlord can increase the rent by the proposed amount, as long as this is not more than the market level.

If the gap between the market rent and the current rent is more than 6%, the landlord can increase the rent by 6% plus an additional 0.33% for each percent that the gap between the current rent and market rent exceeds 6%, as per the formula set out in the Rent Adjudication (Temporary Modifications) (Scotland) Regulations 2024. However, the total rent increase cannot exceed 12% of the current rent.

https://www.scottishhousingnews.com/...-rent-cap-ends

The madness of this policy has pushed market rents up for new tenancies so far that many existing tenants are now sitting well below market rate.
I suspect lots of tenants will be getting emails on 1st April with substantial increases. Although I don’t think they will bring the policy back, until it’s ruled out officially then landlords will not want to be caught out again.
The whole idea has been a disaster for tenants and not great for landlords either.
And it’s not like there wasn’t evidence from around the world showing what a disaster it would be.


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[superfurryhibby]

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The madness of this policy has pushed market rents up for new tenancies so far that many existing tenants are now sitting well below market rate.
I suspect lots of tenants will be getting emails on 1st April with substantial increases. Although I don’t think they will bring the policy back, until it’s ruled out officially then landlords will not want to be caught out again.
The whole idea has been a disaster for tenants and not great for landlords either.
And it’s not like there wasn’t evidence from around the world showing what a disaster it would be.


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No they won't because there are still controls around rent rises.

"If the gap between the market rent and the current rent is more than 6%, the landlord can increase the rent by 6% plus an additional 0.33% for each percent that the gap between the current rent and market rent exceeds 6%, as per the formula set out in the Rent Adjudication (Temporary Modifications) (Scotland) Regulations 2024. However, the total rent increase cannot exceed 12% of the current rent".

https://www.scottishhousingnews.com/...-rent-cap-ends

Evidence from around the world (as in two places, Argentina and Australia is it ?) that fits your agenda and is totally irrelevant to property in Scotland.

It's landlords that have pushed rents up, not a policy. You seem to struggle with distinguishing the impact of greed with the effect of legislation attempting to reduce the impact of that greed.

[Ozyhibby]

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No they won't because there are still controls around rent rises.

"If the gap between the market rent and the current rent is more than 6%, the landlord can increase the rent by 6% plus an additional 0.33% for each percent that the gap between the current rent and market rent exceeds 6%, as per the formula set out in the Rent Adjudication (Temporary Modifications) (Scotland) Regulations 2024. However, the total rent increase cannot exceed 12% of the current rent".

https://www.scottishhousingnews.com/...-rent-cap-ends

Evidence from around the world (as in two places, Argentina and Australia is it ?) that fits your agenda and is totally irrelevant to property in Scotland.

It's landlords that have pushed rents up, not a policy. You seem to struggle with distinguishing the impact of greed with the effect of legislation attempting to reduce the impact of that greed.

The controls limit rises to 12%. That will be small consolation for a tenant whose rent goes up by 10%.
Everywhere rent controls have been attempted has ended in failure. Look it up if you like. Better still, show me an example of them working.
Govt setting prices in anything doesn’t work. Otherwise, wouldn’t all govts do it? Surely it would be an election winner to say steaks will now only cost £1 maximum. Who could possibly be against that?


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[RyeSloan]

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No they won't because there are still controls around rent rises.

"If the gap between the market rent and the current rent is more than 6%, the landlord can increase the rent by 6% plus an additional 0.33% for each percent that the gap between the current rent and market rent exceeds 6%, as per the formula set out in the Rent Adjudication (Temporary Modifications) (Scotland) Regulations 2024. However, the total rent increase cannot exceed 12% of the current rent".

https://www.scottishhousingnews.com/...-rent-cap-ends

Evidence from around the world (as in two places, Argentina and Australia is it ?) that fits your agenda and is totally irrelevant to property in Scotland.

It's landlords that have pushed rents up, not a policy. You seem to struggle with distinguishing the impact of greed with the effect of legislation attempting to reduce the impact of that greed.

You equate every Landlord to being greedy..doesn’t help the argument to come across as balanced.

What would be balanced is providing evidence of where rental control have worked.

You are right that though that specific read across from where they have been tried is not always easy as planning and housing varies so much in countries. That would hold for where (if?) they have been proven to be successful as well.

Berlin is also a great example of what havoc controls can have.

But it’s hard to see what this policy has done in terms of long term benefit and the article above re student accommodation shows just the danger of such things and their unintended consequences.

[superfurryhibby]

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You equate every Landlord to being greedy..doesn’t help the argument to come across as balanced.

What would be balanced is providing evidence of where rental control have worked.

You are right that though that specific read across from where they have been tried is not always easy as planning and housing varies so much in countries. That would hold for where (if?) they have been proven to be successful as well.

Berlin is also a great example of what havoc controls can have.

But it’s hard to see what this policy has done in terms of long term benefit and the article above re student accommodation shows just the danger of such things and their unintended consequences.

I think what I said is correct and I definitely didn't suggest that all landlords are greedy, did I?

"It's landlords that have pushed rents up, not a policy. You seem to struggle with distinguishing the impact of greed with the effect of legislation attempting to reduce the impact of that greed".



I think rent controls were well intended in Scotland and the on-going efforts to minimise the impact of exploitative rent rises is well considered.

The issue of rent controls is complex. Berlin, Buenos Aires, Melbourne (not sure if that was the Australian example), vastly different cities, with very different housing cultures from Scotland.

[Ozyhibby]

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I think what I said is correct and I definitely didn't suggest that all landlords are greedy, did I?

"It's landlords that have pushed rents up, not a policy. You seem to struggle with distinguishing the impact of greed with the effect of legislation attempting to reduce the impact of that greed".



I think rent controls were well intended in Scotland and the on-going efforts to minimise the impact of exploitative rent rises is well considered.

The issue of rent controls is complex. Berlin, Buenos Aires, Melbourne (not sure if that was the Australian example), vastly different cities, with very different housing cultures from Scotland.

If a landlords costs go up then he is going to have to pass that on or he will go bust. Same as any business. That’s not greed.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://news.stv.tv/west-central/sco...st-time-buyers

Scottish Labour get on on the market distorting nonsense of discounts for first time buyers. It won’t work.
There is a train away line about planning on there so maybe there is some hope?
Just come out and say you are going to build more houses and show us how you plan to do it. All the rest is just noise or worse, something the makes the problem worse.


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[RyeSloan]

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https://news.stv.tv/west-central/sco...st-time-buyers

Scottish Labour get on on the market distorting nonsense of discounts for first time buyers. It won’t work.
There is a train away line about planning on there so maybe there is some hope?
Just come out and say you are going to build more houses and show us how you plan to do it. All the rest is just noise or worse, something the makes the problem worse.


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And maybe look to cut the punitive taxation charged at higher levels via LBTT as well…the impact of that in the likes of Edinburgh must be substantial in terms of discouraging people to move (upsize or downsize or even sideways).

This relentless (and as you say often counter productive) focus on ‘helping’ just the ‘first time buyer’ totally ignores the fact that supply of existing stock is just as important as new stock.

Enabling more existing owners to move more freely (I.e. not have to find a large tax lump to pay for the privilege of moving) would surely help to increase availability and suitability. Which in turn can help moderate prices as there is more supply on the secondary market.

But my meander aside I agree in general…more hot air and more false promises while also pretending it’s all in the politicians hands to solve it all quickly.

[Stairway 2 7]

Edinburgh is ridiculous, boy at work pays 500 for a room but this takes the biscuit

https://twitter.com/AlternativeEdin/...94748655780063

[Ozyhibby]

https://youtu.be/DPh4PN8e0ds?si=iUWSOm2J0QOh_Pj2

Great video about how Finland set about eradicating homelessness.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://news.stv.tv/scotland/homebui...fluence-prices


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[Ozyhibby]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/pr...d-rent-crisis/

Won’t happen but it would definitely help.


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[superfurryhibby]

https://www.ft.com/content/a1ec4f19-...a-e42f6b0f3846

https://www.ft.com/content/a1ec4f19-...a-e42f6b0f3846

From Simon Kuper-Financial Times

How to reduce homelessness? The frustrating thing is that we know what works. Statutory homelessness fell 69 per cent from 2003 to 2010, largely because the Labour government prioritised an unpopular issue. The solution: build social housing, while providing treatment and counselling to help people recover.

Prevention is better. We could plug the holes in the safety net, such as the point of exit from care or prison, when many become homeless. That would reduce the fortunes we’re spending on temporary housing, emergency healthcare, addiction treatment and prison, which all serve to keep people “just not homeless”. Tucker marvels at how much she cost society during nearly 20 years of addiction. Bird asks: “Why do we put an ambulance at the bottom of the cliff, not a fence at the top?”

[Ozyhibby]

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https://www.ft.com/content/a1ec4f19-...a-e42f6b0f3846

https://www.ft.com/content/a1ec4f19-...a-e42f6b0f3846

From Simon Kuper-Financial Times

How to reduce homelessness? The frustrating thing is that we know what works. Statutory homelessness fell 69 per cent from 2003 to 2010, largely because the Labour government prioritised an unpopular issue. The solution: build social housing, while providing treatment and counselling to help people recover.

Prevention is better. We could plug the holes in the safety net, such as the point of exit from care or prison, when many become homeless. That would reduce the fortunes we’re spending on temporary housing, emergency healthcare, addiction treatment and prison, which all serve to keep people “just not homeless”. Tucker marvels at how much she cost society during nearly 20 years of addiction. Bird asks: “Why do we put an ambulance at the bottom of the cliff, not a fence at the top?”

All the solutions are known and available to us.


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[superfurryhibby]

https://www.ft.com/content/5c49931e-...7-3fc2bc18f0d2


From 2005, but still relevant?

Why the housing ladder doesn't exist anymore


The calculations above are overly generous to the case for buying a flat, because they leave out the often very large maintenance costs incurred by owning property, the need to buy home insurance, transaction costs (and their risks) and so on. In the same way repayments are smaller earlier on, to counteract higher interest on a larger principal amount, the maintenance costs for older flats are often front-loaded on buyers. For many new-build flats which do not have front-loaded maintenance costs, the buyer is subject to high service fees built into the contract.

Buying a flat might seem an attractive strategy because it combines the consumption of housing services with investment. But this is also one reason it is a dangerous strategy. Whereas a highly-levered investment in equities with the £30,000 could result in, say, £100,000 or nothing, the highly-levered investment in the flat is worse in the bad scenario than it is good in the good scenario. In the scenarios in which the price falls, it is not only true that capital has been lost, as with the stocks. The owner of the capital is likely to be trapped in the flat, forced to consume a type of housing service they no longer want, indefinitely, precisely because they combined their living arrangement with their investment. This is a kind of unanticipated purgatorial externality.

[AgentDaleCooper]

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All the solutions are known and available to us.


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Is a massive wealth tax on the super-rich one of them? Cause that's the only thing that's going to stop them buying up assets if the cost of living keeps on rising. Any solution simply has to see massive property portfolios being broken up.

[Ozyhibby]

https://x.com/jburnmurdoch/status/17...dxJXScFNwz8V4A

Good thread.

If I thought Labour were serious about proper reform of this I would vote for them.

https://www.ft.com/content/bef934b4-...5-447d5346dc1f

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[Stairway 2 7]

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https://x.com/jburnmurdoch/status/17...dxJXScFNwz8V4A

Good thread.

If I thought Labour were serious about proper reform of this I would vote for them.

https://www.ft.com/content/bef934b4-...5-447d5346dc1f

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Uk has one of the lowest rates of second home ownership and also the one of the lowest rates of homes lying empty. I just wonder if it really is about supply like everyone with a slight clue has been screaming.

Yes no party is interested as far as i can see, even though its the biggest issue facing the under 30s

[MKHIBEE]

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https://x.com/jburnmurdoch/status/17...dxJXScFNwz8V4A

Good thread.

If I thought Labour were serious about proper reform of this I would vote for them.

https://www.ft.com/content/bef934b4-...5-447d5346dc1f

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If I thought they were serious about not being a Tory Lite party I wou…………nah, I just couldn’t trust them to do anything radical enough to force real change

[Ozyhibby]

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If I thought they were serious about not being a Tory Lite party I wou…………nah, I just couldn’t trust them to do anything radical enough to force real change

Thing is, this is pro business, pro growth stuff. It’s just needs somebody to get it done.


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[Andy Bee]

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Uk has one of the lowest rates of second home ownership and also the one of the lowest rates of homes lying empty. I just wonder if it really is about supply like everyone with a slight clue has been screaming.

Yes no party is interested as far as i can see, even though its the biggest issue facing the under 30s

Not sure where you're getting your figures from and I'm not disputing them but TBF most if not all Scandinavian countries have a very high second home ownership figure due to them having Summer houses, houses/huts (hytte) they own and holiday in which probably skews the figures.

Lesley Riddoch does a very interesting series on various Nations, the Norway one includes an interview with a couple who explain the "hytte"


https://lesleyriddoch.com/films

[Stairway 2 7]

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Not sure where you're getting your figures from and I'm not disputing them but TBF most if not all Scandinavian countries have a very high second home ownership figure due to them having Summer houses, houses/huts (hytte) they own and holiday in which probably skews the figures.

Lesley Riddoch does a very interesting series on various Nations, the Norway one includes an interview with a couple who explain the "hytte"


https://lesleyriddoch.com/films

The article I replied to? We've one of the lowest second home ownership in the whole of Europe

"It cited a study showing 4 per cent of British households owned second homes for their own use, compared with 9 per cent in France, 17 per cent in Finland and 22 per cent in Spain"

"Share of adults who are landlords:
• UK 4.6%
• US 7%
• Austria 10%
• Germany 12%
• France 13%"

[Ozyhibby]

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The article I replied to? We've one of the lowest second home ownership in the whole of Europe

"It cited a study showing 4 per cent of British households owned second homes for their own use, compared with 9 per cent in France, 17 per cent in Finland and 22 per cent in Spain"

"Share of adults who are landlords:
• UK 4.6%
• US 7%
• Austria 10%
• Germany 12%
• France 13%"

It’s a lot of fun to attack landlords and blame them for the housing shortage rather than our own nimbyism. Even if there are not enough of them and they actually provide housing.


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[MKHIBEE]

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Thing is, this is pro business, pro growth stuff. It’s just needs somebody to get it done.


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Couldn’t agree more. The problem is who is going to get it done? I cannot see where the political will is to force the changes needed. It’s more of the same nonsense that created the present climate in the first place

[marinello59]

Another take.

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeands...=share_btn_url

[MKHIBEE]

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Thing is, this is pro business, pro growth stuff. It’s just needs somebody to get it done.


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Couldn’t agree more. The problem is who is going to get it done? I cannot see where the political will is to force the changes needed. It’s more of the same nonsense that created the present climate in the first place

[superfurryhibby]

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Another take.

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeands...=share_btn_url

"Here, as in the US, we have been lured into a fruitless debate about supply. There is a confected dispute between anti-housebuilding “nimbys” and pro-housebuilding “yimbys”, led by energetic planning-law abolitionists, which seeks to distract us from talking about the ultimate sources of the housing crisis. The supply issue continues to dominate the discourse despite the US having more homes per capita than at any point in its history, and the UK’s homes-per-capita ratio actually exceeds the US’s.

The yimby argument has always seemed flimsy. Its strange logic is that speculative developers would build homes in order to devalue them: that they would somehow act against their own interests by producing enough surplus homes to bring down the average price of land and housing. That would be surprisingly philanthropic behaviour"