SNP are lying b******s as well !

[James310]

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Absolutely. The catch-all blame Westminster card doesn't cut it here. Even the SG aren't trying to play that one.

The SG are quick to take credit for the priorities it decides to spend money on but it's the default position to blame Westminster when things don't go their way.

Of course if you make long term spending commitments using short term Covid funding then you will come up short at some point.

"The Scottish Government’s funding per person is 30% higher than the English equivalent, a leading think tank says, with the difference almost entirely due to the Barnett formula.

The Institute for Fiscal Studies (IFS) said the Scottish Government had chosen to use some of its temporary coronavirus funding to pay for permanent spending commitments."

Why would you use temporary funding to pay for long term spending commitments? The SG has to shoulder some of the blame for this as these were their decisions and nothing to do with Westminster.

[He's here!]

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Those gender fluidity studies don’t come cheap.

Not to mention a £200 million overspend on unfinished ferries...

[weecounty hibby]

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Not to mention a £200 million overspend on unfinished ferries...

Cheap jibe that is becoming the go to for unionists. So are all the issues in the UK as a result of the ajax tanks, HS2, Crossrail, aircraft carriers, Palace of Westminster refurb etc etc all being massively overspent and late. And by massively let's talk billions. Ajax will never be delivered, aircraft carriers don't work, HS2 is a shambles but aye, ferries. It is a poor project done for the right reasons but at least we will eventually have two ferries, which is two more that there will be Ajax tanks. I'm sure you'll claim whataboutery but actually your taxes and mine have been spent on all of those projects but I don't see you mention them anywhere. Westminster overspend ok, Holyrood overspend bad. Union over everything

[Stairway 2 7]

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Cheap jibe that is becoming the go to for unionists. So are all the issues in the UK as a result of the ajax tanks, HS2, Crossrail, aircraft carriers, Palace of Westminster refurb etc etc all being massively overspent and late. And by massively let's talk billions. Ajax will never be delivered, aircraft carriers don't work, HS2 is a shambles but aye, ferries. It is a poor project done for the right reasons but at least we will eventually have two ferries, which is two more that there will be Ajax tanks. I'm sure you'll claim whataboutery but actually your taxes and mine have been spent on all of those projects but I don't see you mention them anywhere. Westminster overspend ok, Holyrood overspend bad. Union over everything

Tanks and ferries are one off bad decisions and a sidetrack to the real issues. Scot government block grant has been flat in real terms in last 10 years. In that time public service wages have been decimated. Its a choice that has been made by our neoliberal scot gov.

[Ozyhibby]

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Tanks and ferries are one off bad decisions and a sidetrack to the real issues. Scot government block grant has been flat in real terms in last 10 years. In that time public service wages have been decimated. Its a choice that has been made by our neoliberal scot gov.

I heard on the radio that Scottish teachers receive on average £7k a year more than English teachers. If that’s true then it appears the SG have been trying to to improve the lot of our teachers.


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[Bostonhibby]

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Cheap jibe that is becoming the go to for unionists. So are all the issues in the UK as a result of the ajax tanks, HS2, Crossrail, aircraft carriers, Palace of Westminster refurb etc etc all being massively overspent and late. And by massively let's talk billions. Ajax will never be delivered, aircraft carriers don't work, HS2 is a shambles but aye, ferries. It is a poor project done for the right reasons but at least we will eventually have two ferries, which is two more that there will be Ajax tanks. I'm sure you'll claim whataboutery but actually your taxes and mine have been spent on all of those projects but I don't see you mention them anywhere. Westminster overspend ok, Holyrood overspend bad. Union over everything

I'm no SNP supporter but wouldn't the best way to balance out this ferry business that seems to be critical to most debates around their competence just be to offset it against one (just one) of the many dubious contracts awarded to the in crowd masquerading as PPE contracts?

This one would just about balance it and that's without analysing the intent of each situation.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.the...ainst-ppe-firm

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[Since90+2]

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Cheap jibe that is becoming the go to for unionists. So are all the issues in the UK as a result of the ajax tanks, HS2, Crossrail, aircraft carriers, Palace of Westminster refurb etc etc all being massively overspent and late. And by massively let's talk billions. Ajax will never be delivered, aircraft carriers don't work, HS2 is a shambles but aye, ferries. It is a poor project done for the right reasons but at least we will eventually have two ferries, which is two more that there will be Ajax tanks. I'm sure you'll claim whataboutery but actually your taxes and mine have been spent on all of those projects but I don't see you mention them anywhere. Westminster overspend ok, Holyrood overspend bad. Union over everything

Well said.

[JeMeSouviens]

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Tanks and ferries are one off bad decisions and a sidetrack to the real issues. Scot government block grant has been flat in real terms in last 10 years. In that time public service wages have been decimated. Its a choice that has been made by our neoliberal scot gov.

According to this - https://www.prospects.ac.uk/jobs-and...chers-get-paid - Scottish teachers are paid more than in rUK apart from in inner London.

Qualified teacher salary
The pay scales for qualified teachers are split into main and upper pay ranges - after entering at the NQT/probationary starting point, teachers are promoted up the scales in line with excellent performance. These ranges, from the main rate to the highest upper rate, differ between countries across the UK:

England (excluding London) and Wales - £28,000 to £38,810
London - £29,344 to £40,083 (fringes), £32,407 to £43,193 (outer), £34,502 to £44,756 (inner)
Scotland - £33,729 to £42,336
Northern Ireland - £24,137 to £41,094.

[Stairway 2 7]

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I heard on the radio that Scottish teachers receive on average £7k a year more than English teachers. If that’s true then it appears the SG have been trying to to improve the lot of our teachers.


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The average is just over 1k, but some of that they pay in higher tax. Fact is its much lower than 10 years ago in real terms whilst the budget isn't.

[degenerated]

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The average is just over 1k, but some of that they pay in higher tax. Fact is its much lower than 10 years ago in real terms whilst the budget isn't.

Don't you want them to pay more income tax though?

[Berwickhibby]

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Not to mention a £200 million overspend on unfinished ferries...

You have not to mention that

[Stairway 2 7]

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Don't you want them to pay more income tax though?

I want them to pay alot more I want them paid in line with what we paid them 10 years ago

[Smartie]

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I want them to pay alot more I want them paid in line with what we paid them 10 years ago

Where do you suggest the money comes from to pay it?

Saying we want them to be paid more is the easy bit. Digging deep, or telling someone else that they're not getting, is the hard bit.

[Stairway 2 7]

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Where do you suggest the money comes from to pay it?

Saying we want the, to be paid for is the easy bit. Digging deep, or telling someone else that they're not getting, is the hard bit.

We have the same budget in real terms in the last ten years. In that time they have slashed public service workers wages. Personally I think wages should be near the top of the agenda. So the question should be to them as to what they have spent the money on. They obviously have the money for it as they did so previously

[Smartie]

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We have the same budget in real terms in the last ten years. In that time they have slashed public service workers wages. Personally I think wages should be near the top of the agenda. So the question should be to them as to what they have spent the money on. They obviously have the money for it as they did so previously

I'm mainly being devil's advocate here tbh and I agree with you re wages.

I'm maybe just a bit more forgiving of those who have to make tough decisions.

Has there been investment in equipment and technology over the past 10 years? With our ageing population are we having to spend more on healthcare in general, not to mention triple locked pensions? What does that leave in the pot for wages? There are countless things that may have happened over the past decade meaning there isn't enough money, or room for manoeuvre.

Corbyn put forward a case for increasing taxes and increasing public spending but it was rejected at the ballot box. Ultimately the Tories are the ones who make the big decisions and I don't think you can continually elect them and wonder why nurses aren't being paid more, although I'm sure a "strong" case can be made for it having been spent on imaginary ferries or wokery or something.

[Ozyhibby]

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We have the same budget in real terms in the last ten years. In that time they have slashed public service workers wages. Personally I think wages should be near the top of the agenda. So the question should be to them as to what they have spent the money on. They obviously have the money for it as they did so previously

The SNP decided that alleviating child poverty might also be worthy of their attention and lots of funds.
We have a budget that is set it London. There are only so many things we can do with it. It looks like we decided to reward our teachers better than those south of the border.


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[Stairway 2 7]

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The SNP decided that alleviating child poverty might also be worthy of their attention and lots of funds.
We have a budget that is set it London. There are only so many things we can do with it. It looks like we decided to reward our teachers better than those south of the border.


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Reward them by dropping their wages by 9% in 12 years, but it's better than England remember that ha

Child poverty is up a few % since snp came to power even though their budget hasn't went down
https://digitalpublications.parliament.scot/ResearchBriefings/Report/2021/12/1/a53b6c2d-0d6a-445e-8bd3-413ee081f41b-1#f211340b-935e-4e08-ba23-9751e299ffe1.dita

[Ozyhibby]

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Reward them by dropping their wages by 9% in 12 years, but it's better than England remember that ha

Child poverty is up a few % since snp came to power even though their budget hasn't went down
https://digitalpublications.parliame...1e299ffe1.dita

All the SNP can do is mitigate Westminster policies. If London cut benefits then of course child poverty will go up. The SNP introducing the Scottish child payment helps but is no solution to Westminster’s decisions.


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[Hibrandenburg]

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All the SNP can do is mitigate Westminster policies. If London cut benefits then of course child poverty will go up. The SNP introducing the Scottish child payment helps but is no solution to Westminster’s decisions.


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It's like baking a cake with some ingredients missing, sure we get to choose which ingredients are missing but the cake is still going to be ****.

[He's here!]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news

First national teachers strike in Scotland since the 1980s now under way.

[James310]

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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news

First national teachers strike in Scotland since the 1980s now under way.

So are people waking up this morning thinking how democracy is being denied or thinking I wish the government would sort this strike out as I am having to take a day off work or arrange emergency childcare.

I reckon it's the latter.

[Smartie]

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So are people waking up this morning thinking how democracy is being denied or thinking I wish the government would sort this strike out as I am having to take a day off work or arrange emergency childcare.

I reckon it's the latter.

I reckon most folk will have space in their heads for more than one thought, and some might even actually link the two.

[Ozyhibby]

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So are people waking up this morning thinking how democracy is being denied or thinking I wish the government would sort this strike out as I am having to take a day off work or arrange emergency childcare.

I reckon it's the latter.

I’m thinking we need to get out of this union so that we can move to the type of economy that values teachers a bit more instead of the wealthy as we do now.


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[CropleyWasGod]

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So are people waking up this morning thinking how democracy is being denied or thinking I wish the government would sort this strike out as I am having to take a day off work or arrange emergency childcare.

I reckon it's the latter.

I'm thinking it's a lovely day for a walk.

[Stairway 2 7]

I'm thinking I wish there was a left wing major party I could vote for. After Corbyn got the full force of the press spin, I guess my best chance is independence

[He's here!]

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So are people waking up this morning thinking how democracy is being denied or thinking I wish the government would sort this strike out as I am having to take a day off work or arrange emergency childcare.

I reckon it's the latter.

I work in support for learning in schools so the schools I work in are closed today which means we didn't need to find childcare for my younger two (who are needless to say delighted with a day off!), but it's a major pain in the a**e for many working parents. I feel especially sorry for non-academic staff at the Edinburgh Council Schools managed by ESP/Amey (the ones which all had to close after the wall at Oxgangs collapsed) as they have to attend 'work' today despite the schools being empty. The catering staff at the school I've been working at this week were told they can clean the kitchen (which they do every day after school lunches anyway!). Either that or take a day's unpaid leave to meet their childcare needs, which some are having to do.

The obvious answer to your question for those not obsessed with independence is that the SG should get on with the day job. Sturgeon asked to be judged on her record in education but this mess is down to her government as teaching unions have made very clear.

[grunt]

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The obvious answer to your question for those not obsessed with independence is that the SG should get on with the day job.

How do you measure obsession? Do you think that someone with 165 posts in a thread on Scottish Independence is "obsessed with independence"?

[JeMeSouviens]

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How do you measure obsession? Do you think that someone with 165 posts in a thread on Scottish Independence is "obsessed with independence"?

You hardly ever hear Tories talking about putative indyrefs, eh?

[He's here!]

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How do you measure obsession? Do you think that someone with 165 posts in a thread on Scottish Independence is "obsessed with independence"?

I'm referring to those obsessed with winning independence, seemingly above all else.

Personally I think the 2014 referendum and, in particular, its aftermath was one of the worst things ever to have happened to Scotland both politically and socially. Had I been able to foresee the divisive mess it would leave the country in I probably wouldn't have voted for devolution. I'm therefore passionate about remaining part of the UK but I wouldn't call it an obsession. Had the vote gone the other way in 2014 I would have sadly accepted it, not spent the next eight years whinging about having another go.

Put it this way, the news that Martin Boyle is out for the season depressed me more than seeing Nicola Sturgeon grandstanding in front of a bunch of saltire-appropriating devotees (after wasting time and money on Supreme Court crusade she knew was futile) when as FM she should have been focusing on how to prevent Scotland's first national teachers strike in 40 years. That I simply found tiresome.

[Santa Cruz]

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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news

First national teachers strike in Scotland since the 1980s now under way.

One day strikes here and there are not going to have as much impact as bringing the teachers out for an undefined period. They have a day today and 2 days in January organised. That's a loss of 3 days earnings for teachers and potentially parents/carers. Better to announce a full week to begin with. They wouldn't take much more of a hit in terms of loss of income and imo that'll get them a quicker resolution from the SG. Economically no Gov wants unplanned school closures for a week, but could handle a day here and there.

I've been in a trade union all my working days, but am now off the opinion the country would be better served with one public sector union with branches representing each sector. No public sector worker should be viewed as more important than any other, yet we now look like approaching a situation where there are differing pay settlements being awarded depending on what sector people work in. We need them all, they all link in and would fail without each other.