Tories are still lying *******s

[hibsbollah]

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Minimum or living wage has been increasing recently, not got a problem with that at all.

Personally I think the NHS is fine. You could double it's annual budget every year and it will never be enough.

Don't know what Sure Start is so can't comment on that.

Closing the mines was controversial at the time but was the right thing to do.

Ok, so the North of England was ignored in the past, let's at least try and fix it now though yeah?

The chat here since I posted that has been civil and fine, go back through some of the thread though and you'll see what I was referring to though.

I don't go reading every political manifesto or considering every policy before I decide who to vote for. Like a lot of people, I look to the leaders and what they are about.

I couldn't stand Corbyn or anything he stood for. I like Boris though, and I do believe him when he talks about levelling up. I like his positive outlook on things..

I'm not in favour of independence so despite admiring Sturgeon I could never vote for her. I voted for Brexit. I still believe it was the right thing to do.

Well I appreciate you answering the questions anyway. It doesn’t often happen and makes the forum more interesting when folk do. I’ll make a similar effort if you have any of me.

[lapsedhibee]

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Is there anyone else on this thread / forum that votes Conservative, is against Independence and was for Brexit?!!

Am i out here on my own??!!!

GBYoung and FalkirkHibee will agree with you on many things. GBYoung's currently in hiding and FalkirkHibee's changed his name.

[hibsbollah]

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GBYoung and FalkirkHibby will agree with you on many things. GBYoung's currently in hiding and FalkirkHibby's changed his name.

There’s another couple of right wingers sometimes post on here, James and Paul. And He’s here! And that Lucifer felly.

[Lendo]

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There’s another couple of right wingers sometimes post on here, James and Paul. And He’s here! And that Lucifer felly.

hahaha! I forgot about the Luciferian conspiracy stuff. Ahh the good old days.

[Smartie]

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Is there anyone else on this thread / forum that votes Conservative, is against Independence and was for Brexit?!!

Am i out here on my own??!!!

I've never voted Conservative, I'm in favour of independence and I'm vehemently anti-Brexit, however...

I'm open to the idea of right of centre thinking on certain subjects. I actually think Scotland as a whole would be stronger for being a bit more open minded to right of centre thinking but Scotland unfortunately carries some very deep scars from the damage inflicted by Tory governments over the past few decades and can be forgiven for being deeply mistrusting. If you feel you're copping a hard time on here, that's probably why.

My views vary from the wildly left wing to the moderately right wing from subject to subject based on my life's experiences so far. Scotland has a shamefully grotesque inequality of opportunity and until that is properly addressed, I don't think you can back the implementation of too many right wing policies with a clear conscience. It leaves too many behind through no fault of their own.

I'm more interested that the politics suit the population. Right wing countries (like the USA and England are currently) should have the right wing governments they elected, be comfortable with the pros and cons that go with that, and make a success of it. Scandinavian nations, with their different set of values, should have politics that reflect that set of values.

Where does that leave Scotland? Scotland is a weird place that I've grown to loathe more than love as I've got older. It's a wonderful place for a small number of people. It's hellish for a similar number. It's ok for the majority. It should do so, so, much better given the abundance of resource with which it has been blessed. That is a frustration that simply aches more as time goes by. It would be fair to say that voting conservative, against independence and in favour of Brexit only makes that situation worse, not better, in my opinion.

[Keith_M]

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I'd imagine most people voting put their own families interests first? I'd have thought that goes without saying really and doesn't make anyone self-centered for doing so.

If you've got young kids you probably care a lot about education for example.

So what is it specifically that the Tories do for you and your family that earns them your vote?

[Hibernia&Alba]

Tories in Bozo's constituency today....

"They're a bunch of c***s"

[Kato]

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Tories in Bozo's constituency today....

"They're a bunch of c***s"

Surely the worst thing about that is that someone has had the temerity to call the Torys "a bunch of c***s". Never mind the lies, the scuttling of business since Brexit, the latest uncovered bribery euphemised as sleaze, the monetising of a pandemic in favour of themselves and their pals - SOMEONE CALLED THEM A BAD WORD.

This won't worry them. Before the next election some sort of flag wavy, anti Labour, unthinking nonsense which stokes patriotic crap in the electorates breasts, as opposed to their brains, will be concocted and they will all vote Tory again. Maybe not the guy who called them c***ts though.

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[lapsedhibee]

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This won't worry them.

Might worry Nadine Dorries. She's very keen to get rid of all hate speech (except her own, obviously). Might try and close down Byline as they've broadcast a female-oriented slur.

https://twitter.com/i/status/1456656898338525189

[Bostonhibby]

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Best left footed player in Europe….

Bring him home.....

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[cabbageandribs1875]

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Might worry Nadine Dorries. She's very keen to get rid of all hate speech (except her own, obviously). Might try and close down Byline as they've broadcast a female-oriented slur.

https://twitter.com/i/status/1456656898338525189

just like her boss, has a wee laugh at herself thinking she's a jokey funny individual, but no one joins in


i expect peerages for her daughters

[Jack]

If the torys weren't a bunch of perpetual lying *******s this thread wouldn't exist.

If people didn't vote for them, knowing what they're like, there would be no issues of perceived victimisation.

[FromLeithtoNZ]

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I think these threads suffer eventually from becoming a mass pile on in which we all post links to apocalyptic stories about how evil they are. It’s the echo chambers’ echo chamber.

There must be dozens of Tories on Hibs net that could try and defend either the Scottish iterations of Davison and dRoss, or Boris and chums? From the point of view of trickle down economics, nation first, something? After all, it’s not like nobody votes for them.

I appreciate the diversity of opinion on here. Lets bear in mind, for some people in this country, their football teams are tied to their politics and entire world view. Thankfully, Hibs fans think for themselves. I like the idea that we can all sit next to each other following the same team, as well as having different political positions and our own views on all and any topics.

[FromLeithtoNZ]

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Is there anyone else on this thread / forum that votes Conservative, is against Independence and was for Brexit?!!

Am i out here on my own??!!!

Brexit: I was torn. In the end I decided to support it. I still don't know if it's the right thing to have done. It is done now however and we have to make it work and do it with confidence.
Independence: I'm against it. I don’t have any confidence in the SNP and many of their policies worry me. They want the state to be all powerful, and that for me is at odds with the Scottish mindset. They have fully embraced 'wokeness' and they seem intent on implementing its tenets everywhere. I have absolute confidence in Scottish people of course, and if we go it alone, we'll make it, I just don't favour the idea at this time. I genuinely think remaining in UK makes more sense. The SNP stirs up nationalist sentiment to encourage people to vote with their hearts not their heads.
Voting: I would prefer a Federal system - Scottish, Northern Irish(depending on what they decide to do), Welsh, Northern England and Southern England parliaments. I've voted for both of the big two over the years. Labour for me has completely abandoned the working class in favour of middle class champagne socialists who live in the main metropolitan centres. They treat working class men in particular with complete disdain. These are the very people who sneer and look down their noses at football fans. The Tories are a weird mix of old Conservative values oddly mixed with more socially liberal ideas. Boris Johnson is not a good PM. He cannot relate to the man in the street. He also looks at the working man with disdain. He’s out of touch. I am politically homeless. None of these parties offers anything that I am interested in. Politics in general has degraded to the level of pantomime. All parties now seem to think they have the right to rule and not serve. Ideally, a new party will emerge which is close to the centre. Common sense politics. Equal opportunities for all but no guarantee of equality of outcome. No more identity politics Each person is seen for what they are, a human being. No more references to race, gender or sexuality. You are just a person and you have the right to be treated with dignity and respect for that reason alone. No more house of lords. It has no place in a modern democracy. If you want be a politician or have political influence, work for it and encourage people to vote for you, as opposed to assuming the right by virtue of birth-right. No monarchy, it has to go, it's ridiculous. On some issues I'm right of centre and on others left of centre. I believe in a reasonable welfare state an support the NHS. On the other hand, I am concerned by the acceptance of the collectivist woke left. It has become cult like. Every area of our lives now comes under the scrutiny of the pc mob. If they say you’re a witch, you're a witch and anyone who defends you is a witch too. The SNP, Labour and to a lesser extend the Conservatives have embraced this. Do we all want to see an end to racism? Of course we do. Are there more than 2 genders? Of course there aren't. At this point, if someone decides they are offended, then someone has to be in the wrong and must be punished. I love the fact that the one thing we all have in common is Hibernian Football Club. We don't all have to agree on one set of ideas. Diversity of opinion should be encouraged. You are welcome to disagree as strongly as you like. I think this poster feels he is at odds with his fellow supporters because he has different from views from majority. We should welcome debate and allow people to say their piece. Dismissing people as ‘right wingers’ is petty name calling and too simplistic. Many people are not sure exactly who to vote for, have mixed views and don’t need to be Pidgeon-holed. Anyway, for crying out loud, another long post. I'll shut up now.

[FromLeithtoNZ]

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I've never voted Conservative, I'm in favour of independence and I'm vehemently anti-Brexit, however...

I'm open to the idea of right of centre thinking on certain subjects. I actually think Scotland as a whole would be stronger for being a bit more open minded to right of centre thinking but Scotland unfortunately carries some very deep scars from the damage inflicted by Tory governments over the past few decades and can be forgiven for being deeply mistrusting. If you feel you're copping a hard time on here, that's probably why.

My views vary from the wildly left wing to the moderately right wing from subject to subject based on my life's experiences so far. Scotland has a shamefully grotesque inequality of opportunity and until that is properly addressed, I don't think you can back the implementation of too many right wing policies with a clear conscience. It leaves too many behind through no fault of their own.

I'm more interested that the politics suit the population. Right wing countries (like the USA and England are currently) should have the right wing governments they elected, be comfortable with the pros and cons that go with that, and make a success of it. Scandinavian nations, with their different set of values, should have politics that reflect that set of values.

Where does that leave Scotland? Scotland is a weird place that I've grown to loathe more than love as I've got older. It's a wonderful place for a small number of people. It's hellish for a similar number. It's ok for the majority. It should do so, so, much better given the abundance of resource with which it has been blessed. That is a frustration that simply aches more as time goes by. It would be fair to say that voting conservative, against independence and in favour of Brexit only makes that situation worse, not better, in my opinion.

A really thoughtful post. I appreciate that you're open enough to say your views vary depending on the subject. I have said something similar to this poster. We may not agree on everything, but we can agree to disagree. I think it's important to hear alternative views. I am absolutely open to changing my mind on a subject if a better argument is put forward. I feel the same about Scotland now. There are things I love about it, but it other ways I feel we can be small minded and parochial. You are right to point our the difference in quality of life between those with the most and those with the least. Independence concerns me because I fear that the problems we have have will worsen. Of course you believe the opposite and I respect your right to have that point of view. It is not good enough that life expectancy in some areas of Glasgow is on par with African nations. Alcoholism, drug abuse and that old scourge of sectarianism still exist and have only improved marginally. I have lost faith in the main parties. I enjoy robust discussion. All too often though, discussions descend in to name calling, etc. Keep that open mind of yours and feel free to disagree with any time.

[Crunchie]

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Is there anyone else on this thread / forum that votes Conservative, is against Independence and was for Brexit?!!

Am i out here on my own??!!!

Sorry mate, I like you was at work but unable to get online. Just getting ready to go back in, some of us have to try and help with the levelling up . I'm not against Independence per say only as long as we want to be chained to the EU.

[One Day Soon]

John Major absolutely roasted Boris Johnson and the coterie of crank hard Brexiteers surrounding him this morning in Radio 4. A moderate Tory shoving it to the parasite extremists currently running the country after hijacking that party. Really uplifting to hear.

[WhileTheChief..]

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Anyway, for crying out loud, another long post. I'll shut up now.

Decent reply, you should post more often!

The point you make about 'wokeness' is a good one.

The whole issue around identity politics is just wrong. The SNP have fully embraced it though and want to run with it.

They'd get rid of the terms Mr & Mrs if they thought they could and have us all being Ms. Watch this space!

It's probably my biggest gripe against the SNP., along with Indy obv.

As for labour, totally agree about them being for posh socialists these days.

In the 90s I'd have been classed as Mondeo man and would probably have been a typical Blair voter. Not a chance in Hell i could vote Labour these days.

[Ozyhibby]

Written by Tory Mathew Parris.


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[Hibernia&Alba]

We get the politicians and governments we deserve. Millions voted for them.

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/lbc/status/1456601290096660482?s=21

This is good from James O’Brien


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[WhileTheChief..]

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I've never voted Conservative, I'm in favour of independence and I'm vehemently anti-Brexit, however...

I'm open to the idea of right of centre thinking on certain subjects. I actually think Scotland as a whole would be stronger for being a bit more open minded to right of centre thinking but Scotland unfortunately carries some very deep scars from the damage inflicted by Tory governments over the past few decades and can be forgiven for being deeply mistrusting. If you feel you're copping a hard time on here, that's probably why.

My views vary from the wildly left wing to the moderately right wing from subject to subject based on my life's experiences so far. Scotland has a shamefully grotesque inequality of opportunity and until that is properly addressed, I don't think you can back the implementation of too many right wing policies with a clear conscience. It leaves too many behind through no fault of their own.

I'm more interested that the politics suit the population. Right wing countries (like the USA and England are currently) should have the right wing governments they elected, be comfortable with the pros and cons that go with that, and make a success of it. Scandinavian nations, with their different set of values, should have politics that reflect that set of values.

Where does that leave Scotland? Scotland is a weird place that I've grown to loathe more than love as I've got older. It's a wonderful place for a small number of people. It's hellish for a similar number. It's ok for the majority. It should do so, so, much better given the abundance of resource with which it has been blessed. That is a frustration that simply aches more as time goes by. It would be fair to say that voting conservative, against independence and in favour of Brexit only makes that situation worse, not better, in my opinion.

Missed this post earlier, thanks for the reply.

Agree with most of what you say apart from the last sentence obviously.

[Kato]

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The point you make about 'wokeness' is a good one.

The whole issue around identity politics is just wrong.

I get confused sometimes about this term as it means something different every day.

What do you see as "wokeness" and why do you think it is wrong?

[Pretty Boy]

The fundamental issue the Tories have is they are creating a whole generation who having nothing to conserve. What use are the Conservatives then?

The middle class are being obliterated, wages aren't keeping pace with the cost of living, home ownership is stagnating whilst property prices continue to rise, the cost of renting is running out of control, education saddles young people in England with tens of thousands of pounds of debt.....

The current popularity that seems largely based on jingoism, yearning for a golden age that never existed and rampant exceptionalism screams last hurrah to me.

[Glory Lurker]

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https://twitter.com/lbc/status/1456601290096660482?s=21

This is good from James O’Brien


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Good, and so depressing.

[WhileTheChief..]

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I get confused sometimes about this term as it means something different every day.

What do you see as "wokeness" and why do you think it is wrong?

Ok, I'll bite...

Sensitive subject but here goes.

After the killing of George Floyd, this forum, and social media everywhere across the world, was full of people posting about how bad it was and how much they hate racism.

On Instagram, everyone posted black squares to show their solidarity for example, stuff like that.

It was the main subject on the news and everybody was talking about it.

They were talking about it so much, it was like everyone was trying to outdo each other in the 'i think racism is bad' stakes.

That's the Woke part right there.

Fast forward to now.

When's the last time anyone on here even mentioned George Floyd? Totally forgotten about.

And yet, when it happened it was like we'd lost a family member going by some of the stuff you read on social media. My view, is that a lot of that outpouring of 'grief' was simply folk trying to show they hate racism to feel accepted. To show they're a better person than the next.

Where are the threads now with people talking about what they're doing differently in their lives since it happened? Why's no one keeping it front and centre anymore?

It's because it's not on the news. It's not fashionable this year.

Instead, everyone is posting about Green they are.

Woke.

Next year it will be something else.

[Hibrandenburg]

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The whole issue around identity politics is just wrong. The SNP have fully embraced it though and want to run with it.

They'd get rid of the terms Mr & Mrs if they thought they could and have us all being Ms. Watch this space!

What an utterly ridiculous thing to even say, never mind actually believe.

[bigwheel]

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Ok, I'll bite...

Sensitive subject but here goes.

After the killing of George Floyd, this forum, and social media everywhere across the world, was full of people posting about how bad it was and how much they hate racism.

On Instagram, everyone posted black squares to show their solidarity for example, stuff like that.

It was the main subject on the news and everybody was talking about it.

They were talking about it so much, it was like everyone was trying to outdo each other in the 'i think racism is bad' stakes.

That's the Woke part right there.

Fast forward to now.

When's the last time anyone on here even mentioned George Floyd? Totally forgotten about.

And yet, when it happened it was like we'd lost a family member going by some of the stuff you read on social media. My view, is that a lot of that outpouring of 'grief' was simply folk trying to show they hate racism to feel accepted. To show they're a better person than the next.

Where are the threads now with people talking about what they're doing differently in their lives since it happened? Why's no one keeping it front and centre anymore?

It's because it's not on the news. It's not fashionable this year.

Instead, everyone is posting about Green they are.

Woke.

Next year it will be something else.

I think that’s your version of the situation. To me, Equality, diversity and inclusion remains a major topic . In everyday life and in the workplace people are much more aware of prejudice and inequalities. Delighted that’s the case…

Black Live matter fight goes on, and yes people are repurposing the term woke as a negative thing, but for me it remains a positive term. It was derived to note those who were becoming alert to the prejudices faced by many minorities. If you want to use it that way, then so be it…but it is a right if centre view of the term, which does nothing to recognise where is grew from.

We talk about current topics across all domains a lot on this forum. It’s driven by the news cycle. Just because we do so, doesn’t mean we care less about topics of last year, whether it’s about football, politics or prejudice….that’s just the nature of social forums…..


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[Pretty Boy]

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What an utterly ridiculous thing to even say, never mind actually believe.

It's something that seems to be on the increase. People getting really upset about hypothetical scenarios they have quite literally made up.

[CropleyWasGod]

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I get confused sometimes about this term as it means something different every day.

What do you see as "wokeness" and why do you think it is wrong?

"Woke" is this era's "PC". A pejorative to criticise people with whom your social and cultural values don't align.