Euro 2021 non-Scotland games

[J-C]

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Mute the TV! I do that anyway nowadays or find a foreign commentary so I can't understand the nonsense they're spouting!

Again I have no problems with it compared to so many others on here.

[One Day Soon]

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Ffs another who totally misses the tongue in cheek in my post, if you'd read all the posts you'd see my 2nd post re all the crap about England, commentary etc.

I think the key point here is "if you'd read all my posts". There are 93 pages on this thread so, no, I haven't read all your posts. Anyway tongue in cheek or not I wouldn't get too worked up about it if I were you.

[J-C]

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I think the key point here is "if you'd read all my posts". There are 93 pages on this thread so, no, I haven't read all your posts. Anyway tongue in cheek or not I wouldn't get too worked up about it if I were you.

And I'm not ffs, I'm watching and enjoying the football, the post was a dig at all the 5 pages of bickering after yesterday's game. I thought the post was plainly a sarcastic one, not obvious enough if seems.

[One Day Soon]

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You left your foot in that tackle! Do you consider it possible for folk to get wound up by it for football reasons?

I think some people see it as football, some others see it as both football and a proxy for other things and still others just see it as a proxy for other things. Each to their own. I'd imagine that both Orban and Putin will have regarded the Russian and Hungarian games in an almost completely non-footballing context. I'm loving it, I think its been a great tournament so far.

[One Day Soon]

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And I'm not ffs, I'm watching and enjoying the football, the post was a dig at all the 5 pages of bickering after yesterday's game. I thought the post was plainly a sarcastic one, not obvious enough if seems.

If you didn't like the last five pages you're really not going to enjoy what happens if England beat Ukraine in the next round. Though I just wonder if they will. I'm smelling a possible England out on penalties.

Maybe it's the antidote to pandemic for 15 months that is affecting it but I think it's been a great tournament so far.

[JeMeSouviens]

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If you didn't like the last five pages you're really not going to enjoy what happens if England beat Ukraine in the next round. Though I just wonder if they will. I'm smelling a possible England out on penalties.

Maybe it's the antidote to pandemic for 15 months that is affecting it but I think it's been a great tournament so far.

If Ukraine can get through another 120 mins at the weekend and still win the shootout then I want some of the drugs they're getting!

[RyeSloan]

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If you didn't like the last five pages you're really not going to enjoy what happens if England beat Ukraine in the next round. Though I just wonder if they will. I'm smelling a possible England out on penalties.

Maybe it's the antidote to pandemic for 15 months that is affecting it but I think it's been a great tournament so far.

It’s been a cracking tournament…without checking the stars it has to be one of the best for goals.

But total goals aside it’s had some great games and plenty almost unbelievable moments. That Hungarian goal straight after the Germany equaliser was just insane for example. Denmark’s unlikely qualification and the scenes that followed…the list goes on and hopefully a few more twists and turns to come.

Thoroughly enjoyed it and really don’t give too much of a toss about which commentator is saying what or whatever (Danny Murphy aside!).

If you have not been able to chill and enjoy this tournament then I’m not sure when you will ever be able to!

[He's here!]

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If Scotland were the only U.K. team left, no danger would Gary Lineker or Rio Ferdinand be jumping around celebrating us scoring a goal v Germany. Simply won’t happen.

We’d be luck to even have two Scottish pundits to go with Gary. Likely have Roy Keane, Graham Souness and Juergen Klinsman.

That’s the point. It should be a Scottish lead production serving Scots in that situation.

J

I'm sure Souness, Hansen, McCoist plus any other Scottish pundits involved on whatever channel they were working for would be jumping around though. In fact, there's footage of the Scottish pundits all doing just that when we qualified via the Nations League against Serbia.

What is actually WRONG with Lineker & co celebrating in the studio? I don't really begrudge them that after 55 years of tournament pain v Germany!

And surely if Scotland WERE in such a position we WOULD have Scottish-led option for the game, just as we did for our group games?

[JeMeSouviens]

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It’s been a cracking tournament…without checking the stars it has to be one of the best for goals.

But total goals aside it’s had some great games and plenty almost unbelievable moments. That Hungarian goal straight after the Germany equaliser was just insane for example. Denmark’s unlikely qualification and the scenes that followed…the list goes on and hopefully a few more twists and turns to come.

Thoroughly enjoyed it and really don’t give too much of a toss about which commentator is saying what or whatever (Danny Murphy aside!).

If you have not been able to chill and enjoy this tournament then I’m not sure when you will ever be able to!

The fact that you didn't mention either Croatia or Switzerland's late comebacks from 3-1 shows how many good games there have been.

[JeMeSouviens]

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I'm sure Souness, Hansen, McCoist plus any other Scottish pundits involved on whatever channel they were working for would be jumping around though. In fact, there's footage of the Scottish pundits all doing just that when we qualified via the Nations League against Serbia.

What is actually WRONG with the Lineker & co celebrating in the studio? I don't really begrudge them that after 55 years of tournament pain v Germany!

And surely if Scotland WERE in such a position we WOULD have Scottish-led option for the game, just as we did for our group games?

In Scotland, yes, but not UK wide. There's nothing wrong with English commentary/punditry for England. It's a bit odd that we have it in Scotland but (at the risk of veering non-football ) that's what we voted for.

[DH1875]

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I'm sure Souness, Hansen, McCoist plus any other Scottish pundits involved on whatever channel they were working for would be jumping around though. In fact, there's footage of the Scottish pundits all doing just that when we qualified via the Nations League against Serbia.

What is actually WRONG with the Lineker & co celebrating in the studio? I don't really begrudge them that after 55 years of tournament pain v Germany!

And surely if Scotland WERE in such a position we WOULD have Scottish-led option for the game, just as we did for our group games?

There Is absolutely nothing wrong with Lineker and Co doing it when England are playing. When Sweden and Ukraine are playing, I don't need to hear it though. That's is the difference.

[He's here!]

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Last points from me, as I've done this to death now!

1. In footballing terms, England are absolutely a different country to Scotland. Given the history, and the fact that we share a border, I'd suggest that it's even more marked than the Denmark/Germany analogy as there is already an established 'rivalry' there. Making the fact that we get 'English' (British) coverage even more bizarre.
2. I'm not quite following your Andy Murray logic. His is an individual sport first and foremost, he only plays for 'his country' in the Davis Cup and the Olympics, and that country is GB, not Scotland. Of course it's been embraced by the English commentary teams, as there is no distinction between England and Scotland in tennis.

...and I'm done!

Fair enough, I'll bow out of this debate too.

Re Andy Murray, I just meant that after 70 plus years without a British Wimbledon winner (including the years of Henmania), when the real deal emerged in the shape of Murray we witnessed one of the greatest and most emotional days in British sport in 2013. There was no sense from the commentators that the achievement was in some way compromised by the fact he was Scottish rather than English. Sure, there's less distinction between Scotland and England in tennis, but my point is that I'd be surprised if English football pundits didn't wholeheartedly get behind Scotland if we were the only Home Nations side still in contention at a tournament.

[Renfrew_Hibby]

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In Scotland, yes, but not UK wide. There's nothing wrong with English commentary/punditry for England. It's a bit odd that we have it in Scotland but (at the risk of veering non-football ) that's what we voted for.

Exactly, an English audience would never tolerate a Scottish (or any other nation) led coverage on their TV.

[He's here!]

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There Is absolutely nothing wrong with Lineker and Co doing it when England are playing. When Sweden and Ukraine are playing, I don't need to hear it though. That's is the difference.

Again, I'm not sure there would be much difference if Scotland had beaten Germany yesterday and were the only Home Nations team left. In those (admittedly unlikely) circumstances would we take such exception to an English commentator saying things like a Ukrainian injury could be good news for Scotland, or indeed referencing Scotland's great win over Germany earlier that day? I suspect a Scottish commentary team would be making just the same sort of observations.

[JeMeSouviens]

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Fair enough, I'll bow out of this debate too.

Re Andy Murray, I just meant that after 70 plus years without a British Wimbledon winner (including the years of Henmania), when the real deal emerged in the shape of Murray we witnessed one of the greatest and most emotional days in British sport in 2013. There was no sense from the commentators that the achievement was in some way compromised by the fact he was Scottish rather than English. Sure, there's less distinction between Scotland and England in tennis, but my point is that I'd be surprised if English football pundits didn't wholeheartedly get behind Scotland if we were the only Home Nations side still in contention at a tournament.

To continue the tennis analogy, the English crowd loved Murray because he was British and a winner but not as much as they loved Henman who was properly British.

Scotland or Wales in international footy after England are out (I just about remember 78 and we have 2016 evidence for Wales) are treated a bit like poor old Greg Rusedski, not *really* British but needs must and all that.

[J-C]

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If you didn't like the last five pages you're really not going to enjoy what happens if England beat Ukraine in the next round. Though I just wonder if they will. I'm smelling a possible England out on penalties.

Maybe it's the antidote to pandemic for 15 months that is affecting it but I think it's been a great tournament so far.

I've thoroughly enjoyed it apart for Scotland's 2 defeats, I just dont understand needless arguments over commentators or supporting anyone against England, just sit back and watch the best in Europe play.

[PatHead]

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If you didn't like the last five pages you're really not going to enjoy what happens if England beat Ukraine in the next round. Though I just wonder if they will. I'm smelling a possible England out on penalties.

Maybe it's the antidote to pandemic for 15 months that is affecting it but I think it's been a great tournament so far.

Agree. The only thing missing has been a couple of cracking free kicks. (And a Scotland win😁)

[Argylehibby]

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To continue the tennis analogy, the English crowd loved Murray because he was British and a winner but not as much as they loved Henman who was properly British.

Scotland or Wales in international footy after England are out (I just about remember 78 and we have 2016 evidence for Wales) are treated a bit like poor old Greg Rusedski, not *really* British but needs must and all that.

Andy Murray was British until he lost then he was Scottish. A point I made to an English client some years ago who refused to believe it. He called me after Murray was knocked out that year to say he’d just heard that change in nationality.

[The Baldmans Comb]

English people on English TV channels cheering on their nations team is exactly what happens in every other country in the world and is absolutely normal and absolutely to be expected.

Ferdinand and Lineker are deep football fans and proud Englishman who deserve totally to relish in their teams success.

A few "house jocks" and some token Welshman hardly alter the fact that English people control 100% the broadcasting output in tone and content be it in news, entertainment,current affairs and in this case sport and they turn the screw and use this monopoly to ultimate affect anytime they see fit or the interests of their country are under threat.

That is what absolute power allows and I have no problem with this whatsoever though I certainly don't pay anything to participate.

[One Day Soon]

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To continue the tennis analogy, the English crowd loved Murray because he was British and a winner but not as much as they loved Henman who was properly British.

Scotland or Wales in international footy after England are out (I just about remember 78 and we have 2016 evidence for Wales) are treated a bit like poor old Greg Rusedski, not *really* British but needs must and all that.

What's the evidence basis for this? British tennis was absolutely gagging for a Wimbledon winner after such a long drought and I don't recollect anything other utter joy when Andy won. Maybe there's some kind of support index you can measure the love for Henman versus Andy Murray against but if there is I'd like to see it.

[One Day Soon]

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I've thoroughly enjoyed it apart for Scotland's 2 defeats, I just dont understand needless arguments over commentators or supporting anyone against England, just sit back and watch the best in Europe play.

Indeed.

[One Day Soon]

Just reflecting that quite often English pundits have been at least balanced by others guesting on the programmes. I thought Klinsmann was particularly dignified last night - certainly a lot more so than in his notorious diving days.

Gabby Yorath presenting, Roy Keane, Graeme Souness, Mark Hughes, Robbie Savage etc, someone from at least one of the two competing nations usually on the panel (I thought the Dutch guy was ok when they were playing), Ally McCoist co-commentating etc. Did we ever have anyone non Scottish commentating or on the panel for our games? Don't recall any Croats or Czechs but I could be wrong.

To be honest the only time I've noticed or been bothered about any of this is when someone like Ferdinand was just being a bit rubbish about whatever game was on. I think a few of the 'names' are there for just that reason rather than offering much insight or great wit.

[Lago]

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I've thoroughly enjoyed it apart for Scotland's 2 defeats, I just dont understand needless arguments over commentators or supporting anyone against England, just sit back and watch the best in Europe play.

[CloudSquall]

The Wimbledon Hoorah Henry types will never get over Andy Murray's "Anyone but England" joke with Henman, they still hold it against him.

[marinello59]

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I've thoroughly enjoyed it apart for Scotland's 2 defeats, I just dont understand needless arguments over commentators or supporting anyone against England, just sit back and watch the best in Europe play.

This has been a cracking tournament so far, I’m going to relax and enjoy the rest of it. Watching fans of every nation out celebrating again has been really uplifting for me.

[JeMeSouviens]

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What's the evidence basis for this? British tennis was absolutely gagging for a Wimbledon winner after such a long drought and I don't recollect anything other utter joy when Andy won. Maybe there's some kind of support index you can measure the love for Henman versus Andy Murray against but if there is I'd like to see it.

There was always support for Murray but not much affection until he had a good greet on Sue Barker's shoulder. Anyway, don't take my word for it, here's Tiger Tim:

Henman said: “I find it a bit sad that it takes Andy crying after his Wimbledon final for people to look at him and say, ‘Wow, he does care.’

“He has always had good support but I think that was the turning point for him. That and then winning the Olympic title.

“The crowd in the Wimbledon final last year was about 50-50 because Roger is pretty much the most popular player ever. But when you moved it forward four weeks for the Olympic final it was 90-10 in favour of Andy.

“Does that make a difference? Maybe a very small percentage but it can all add up.

“It’s good to see Andy probably has more backing among the Wimbledon crowd than Federer now after that awkward spell at the start."

[heretoday]

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The Wimbledon Hoorah Henry types will never get over Andy Murray's "Anyone but England" joke with Henman, they still hold it against him.

I don't think that's true. The hoorah Henries have got other things on their minds, like property prices and that.

it's the Defence League types in the pubs who get upset about that sort of stuff. it's a class thing.

[He's here!]

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Just reflecting that quite often English pundits have been at least balanced by others guesting on the programmes. I thought Klinsmann was particularly dignified last night - certainly a lot more so than in his notorious diving days.

Gabby Yorath presenting, Roy Keane, Graeme Souness, Mark Hughes, Robbie Savage etc, someone from at least one of the two competing nations usually on the panel (I thought the Dutch guy was ok when they were playing), Ally McCoist co-commentating etc. Did we ever have anyone non Scottish commentating or on the panel for our games? Don't recall any Croats or Czechs but I could be wrong.

To be honest the only time I've noticed or been bothered about any of this is when someone like Ferdinand was just being a bit rubbish about whatever game was on. I think a few of the 'names' are there for just that reason rather than offering much insight or great wit.

Good point.

[ian cruise]

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There was always support for Murray but not much affection until he had a good greet on Sue Barker's shoulder. Anyway, don't take my word for it, here's Tiger Tim:

I always thought people initially struggled to take to Murray due to the fact he was quiet, reserved and had quite a dry sense of humour/personality. Chris Froome in cycling is the same, people found it much harder to take to him compared to a big personality like Wiggins.

[marinello59]

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I always thought people initially struggled to take to Murray due to the fact he was quiet, reserved and had quite a dry sense of humour/personality. Chris Froome in cycling is the same, people found it much harder to take to him compared to a big personality like Wiggins.

Crowd tonight seem to be behind him alright.