The generic Hearts thread

[green day]

Bayern Munich, AC Milan, Man City -

Not like Hearts to big themselves up...................

[HibbiesandtheBaddies]

"Hearts could face 18-game Championship season as Neil Doncaster issues Betfred Cup concern..."

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.c...oncern-2861971


That's not a lot of money coming in through the turnstiles for poor Hearts. It's not fair.

[007]

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Saughton Jambo***


Posted*1 hour ago

Since Leslie Deans interview on Sportsound last Saturday then I have been In*regular contact with Les. Les*contacted me personally this morning *via telephone*and asked me to post his official letter to our chairman outlining his views on court action*on his behalf.

*Can everyone please share this on all social media platforms to spread his word as his request?*
*many thanks*

*SJ

*I have copied and pasted*his views verbatim and have removed his personal email address for obvious reasons.*
*As follows:-

*In my opinion, There are a minimum of 3 grounds which would entitle Hearts, Partick Thistle, Stranraer and perhaps Rangers, to institute civil court proceedings against SPFL and the clubs who voted to expel the first 3 clubs
Firstly, the clubs formed a common purpose. In the case of the premiership , that was to play 38 games against each other with club 12 to be relegated after these games were played. A common purpose creates a duty of care to each other. The actions of certain other members breach that duty. Additionally the SPFL must act in the best interest of all member clubs and I believe they have failed to do so. Their actions and conduct are set out in the dossier prepared by Rangers. The excuse given for abandoning the current campaign is that they want to start a new campaign, excluding Hearts from the Premiership. The chairman of SPFL has stated he hopes this can happen by July. By committing to a new campaign with a different membership , before the existing campaign is complete , a breach of duty occurs.*
Secondly, there was material non disclosure by SPFL in their briefing pack to clubs on April 8. As I understand it, no reference was made to the potential rebate claim by broadcasters if the league was called early. Additionally no other options than early termination were presented to clubs who were told this was the only feasible option. It was not. By their actions and omissions SPFL did not act in the best interest of all clubs. *
Thirdly, the SPFL motion was not passed. Dundee FC were not legally entitled to change their vote after it was cast. The motion failed and no further motion has been put to the clubs. SPFL are acting illegally.*
The pursuers only need to convince the court on any one of these 3 grounds to win the case.*

If so, the following remedies should be sought
1- Interdict against SPFL starting a new campaign until the current one is finished, whenever that might be.*
2- damages for actual and potential financial loss stemming from their expulsion.*
3- the expenses of litigation.*

*Yours Faithfully

*Leslie Deans*

They're arguing that all clubs have a duty of care to each other. It is impossible for SPFL to act in the best interests of all 42 clubs at all times. All decisions will not suit absolutely everyone, otherwise 100% of clubs would vote the same way. Ann Budge's likely proposed reconstruction option is not int the best interests of all 42 clubs. 14-14-14 disadvantages Clyde, Peterhead, Forfar, Cove Rangers who'd be competing alongside the 10 current League 2 clubs and for less money. Also Dundee, Ayr, Arbroath, Dunfermline, Morton, Alloa and QoS will be in a league half made up of Championship clubs and half of League 1 clubs, also competing for less money. That's at least 10 clubs that Hearts won't be showing a duty of care towards.

The non-disclosure of the potential rebate claim from Sky bit is laughable. How any sensible person could argue they wouldn't expect there to be a rebate would be either lying or stupid. If the argument is that they should have been told the £10m figure, why would you hamper your negotiating position by telling people how much you might have to pay back? The fact that the £10m figure has made its way from just being shared with the SPFL board out into the public domain is testimony to that.

They're saying no other options were provided and that there were other feasible options. They've not said what the other feasible options are however it is easy to prove the alternatives weren't feasible.*Null and void would cost the league a fortune in rebates and playing it out instead would mean next season would start late and therefore jeopardise the Sky deal. Any renegotiating will be downwards. The SPFL wouldn't be showing a duty of care to the clubs if they did either of those 2 alternatives. Don't know what other options they might come up with but I'm sure they'd be easy to prove as not feasible.

Through the passage of time since the Good Friday vote it is now undoubtable that ending the league the way it has been was the correct decision. Even Hearts and Rangers accepted this. The SPFL board has clearly shown good foresight and have been proved right.

If they're still arguing about if money or loans could have been advanced to the clubs, even though Neil Doncaster has explained it, none of that matters now anyway. Even if money could have been given to clubs they way Hearts are saying it could, we'd have still ended up where we are now with the leagues called. In fact you could also say that about any of the information that was included or excluded in the briefing pack given to the clubs, it doesn't matter as we'd have still ended up where we are now. Their only alternative to argue against where we could have ended up instead is the null and void they were plotting with Inverness and Rangers. If they're hanging their hat on that being a feasible alternative then they're in trouble.

There was previously discussion about company law saying that a no vote can be changed to yes vote (but not the other way) as long as it hasn't been announced the resolution has failed, which it hadn't. If that is correct then it would be easy to argue the voting was legal. Even if the court determines the voting was illegal, what happens next? Sack the SPFL board, let Hearts, Rangers and Inverness propose their null and void resolution which would be heavily defeated? Then redo the vote on the original resolution and we still end up exactly where we are now.

All seems very flimsy to me.

[Andy74]

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They're arguing that all clubs have a duty of care to each other. It is impossible for SPFL to act in the best interests of all 42 clubs at all times. All decisions will not suit absolutely everyone, otherwise 100% of clubs would vote the same way. Ann Budge's likely proposed reconstruction option is not int the best interests of all 42 clubs. 14-14-14*disadvantages Clyde, Peterhead, Forfar, Cove Rangers who'd be competing alongside the 10 current League 2 clubs and for less money. Also Dundee, Ayr, Arbroath, Dunfermline, Morton, Alloa and QoS will be in a league half made up of Championship clubs and half of League 1 clubs, also competing for less money. That's at least 10 clubs that Hearts won't be showing a duty of care towards.

The non-disclosure of the potential rebate claim from Sky bit is laughable. How any sensible person could argue they wouldn't expect there to be a rebate would be either lying or stupid. If the argument is that they should have been told the £10m figure, why would you hamper your negotiating position by telling people how much you might have to pay back? The fact that the £10m figure has made its way from just being shared with the SPFL board out into the public domain is testimony to that.

They're saying no other options were provided and that there were other feasible options. They've not said what the other feasible options are however it is easy to prove the alternatives weren't feasible.*Null and void would cost the league a fortune in rebates and playing it out instead would mean next season would start late and therefore jeopardise the Sky deal. Any renegotiating will be downwards. The SPFL wouldn't be showing a duty of care to the clubs if they did either of those 2 alternatives. Don't know what other options they might come up with but I'm sure they'd be easy to prove as not feasible.

Through the passage of time since the Good Friday vote it is now undoubtable that ending the league the way it has been was the correct decision. Even Hearts and Rangers accepted this. The SPFL board has clearly shown good foresight and have been proved right.

If they're still arguing about if money or loans could have been advanced to the clubs, even though Neil Doncaster has explained it, none of that matters now anyway. Even if money could have been given to clubs they way Hearts are saying it could, we'd have still ended up where we are now with the leagues called. In fact you could also say that about any of the information that was included or excluded in the briefing pack given to the clubs, it doesn't matter as we'd have still ended up where we are now. Their only alternative to argue against where we could have ended up instead is the null and void they were plotting with Inverness and Rangers. If they're hanging their hat on that being a feasible alternative then they're in trouble.

There was previously discussion about company law saying that a no vote can be changed to yes vote (but not the other way) as long as it hasn't been announced the resolution has failed, which it hadn't. If that is correct then it would be easy to argue the voting was legal. Even if the court determines the voting was illegal, what happens next? Sack the SPFL board, let Hearts, Rangers and Inverness propose their null and void resolution which would be heavily defeated? Then redo the vote on the original resolution and we still end up exactly where we are now.

All seems very flimsy to me.

It isn't just flimsy, it is absolute drivel.

[Peevemor]

ps. I've got a great deal on a 2 bedroom flat in the Southside - cash only!

[oldbutdim]

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I think you’ll find they’ve been expelled.

Expelegated.

[Bostonhibby]

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"Hearts could face 18-game Championship season as Neil Doncaster issues Betfred Cup concern..."

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.c...oncern-2861971


That's not a lot of money coming in through the turnstiles for poor Hearts. It's not fair.

Their only hope is Mrs doctor Budge spending big again to avoid relegation.

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[Peevemor]

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It isn't just flimsy, it is absolute drivel.

Exactly - he can't possibly have read the SPFL's rules.

[04Sauzee]

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"Hearts could face 18-game Championship season as Neil Doncaster issues Betfred Cup concern..."

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.c...oncern-2861971


That's not a lot of money coming in through the turnstiles for poor Hearts. It's not fair.

Would save money on Leveins medical centre

[Joe6-2]

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Bayern Munich, AC Milan, Man City -

Not like Hearts to big themselves up...................

Somebody is telling porkies!

[Waxy]

Every SPFL club not in the premier division wont be making the same money as teams in there.
What makes hearts think they’re more entitled than a Dundee, ICT or any team to be in there?
They’ve been relegated through sporing merit.
Pretty much they think they’re a special case.

[Hibs1969]

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https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52758938

They took part in a video conference with other championships clubs yesterday

I’m surprised they interrupted the celebrations on the anniversary of the greatest day in their history for something as mundane as a zoom call with their new colleagues. I do hope their sausage rolls didn’t go cold.

[hibeerealist]

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Their only hope is Mrs doctor Budge spending big again to avoid relegation.

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The Duncans are very angry and if Budge does not succeed with reconstruction (no chance anyway) and then fails to take legal action they will turn on her.

IF she has any sense she should then transfer their worthless shares to FOH and get out or this will cost her more than it is worth.

[Since90+2]

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They will be due money from the sale of Hickey. Nof sure what the % agreed is.

They are due Celtic 33% of any transfer fee.

[The 90+2]

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The Duncans are very angry and if Budge does not succeed with reconstruction (no chance anyway) and then fails to take legal action they will turn on her.

IF she has any sense she should then transfer their worthless shares to FOH and get out or this will cost her more than it is worth.

She won’t leave until she’s paid Craig Leveins contract up using hearts’ money.

[hibeerealist]

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They are due Celtic 33% of any transfer fee.

That certain?

Big whack off the fee if true!!!

GGTTH

[Since90+2]

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That certain?

Big whack off the fee if true!!!

GGTTH

Was widely reported in the media by various places when he was linked with a move last year.

Edit - just checked stories from around that time and it's 30% not 33%.

[Aldo]

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Was widely reported in the media by various places when he was linked with a move last year.

Edit - just checked stories from around that time and it's 30% not 33%.

Still a fair whack though.


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[Greenworld]

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That certain?

Big whack off the fee if true!!!

GGTTH

Read that a few months back he is in the last year of his contract as of 31st this month so not in a very strong bargaining position. If Celtic want him back then your not talking a big fee

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[O'Rourke3]

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Very odd how quiet it’s been on the reconstruction front. Very odd indeed.

Done and dusted. Like their vote, they've assumed someone emailed it to the SFPL. The hint something has gone wrong is Allisbarry is not over the twatter zone bumming it up.

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[Irish_Steve]

If they do manage to come back up, will they have been regugitated??

[Greenworld]

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The Duncans are very angry and if Budge does not succeed with reconstruction (no chance anyway) and then fails to take legal action they will turn on her.

IF she has any sense she should then transfer their worthless shares to FOH and get out or this will cost her more than it is worth.

They have definitely appointed a QC i don't know what firm he is from maybe our legal boys might know . So she is not letting up

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[Wakeyhibee]

I smell a rat....

The Email purported to be from Leslie Deans doesn't ring true.

if the legal case is strong, why urge all to share all over social media?

Timing is also suspicious the day before the proposal is submitted, whilst those factors have been known all along.

Is this a Hibby legal on the windup?
Or is this just a last ditch attempt to bully other clubs into reconstruction.

I think the latter and their bluff should be called. Legal action (no matter how strong/weak) would be disastrous for Hearts in more ways than one.

[jacomo]

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The Duncans are very angry and if Budge does not succeed with reconstruction (no chance anyway) and then fails to take legal action they will turn on her.

IF she has any sense she should then transfer their worthless shares to FOH and get out or this will cost her more than it is worth.

The insane thing is that this situation has not been forced on Budge.

She is the one who has pushed for reconstruction and she is the one threatening legal action.

She’s revved up the Jambos and given them hope they can avoid relegation. It’s all on her.

[Aldo]

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I smell a rat....

The Email purported to be from Leslie Deans doesn't ring true.

if the legal case is strong, why urge all to share all over social media?

Timing is also suspicious the day before the proposal is submitted, whilst those factors have been known all along.

Is this a Hibby legal on the windup?
Or is this just a last ditch attempt to bully other clubs into reconstruction.

I think the latter and their bluff should be called. Legal action (no matter how strong/weak) would be disastrous for Hearts in more ways than one.

The silence from Doncaster and co has been superb. Veil threats of legal action because they cannot get their own way will not be forgotten.

The SPFL legal team will hopefully have all their bricks lined up and I await this next chapter once the proposal is booted out.

I maybe wrong but do Budge and go think that putting together a possible legal case will prevent things from moving forward?? I don’t. We will see things move in courts soon enough but there will be far more pressing cases (both civil and criminal) than the rattle out the pram tantrum one


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[RyeSloan]

Did one of Ann’s infamous statements not suggest that she had a reconstruction proposal that she was going to email the premiership teams after the meeting where reconstruction was first torpedoed.

I’m sure she said that and was hinting that it was so unfair they had discussed it just before she had hit send on the email..

Yet here we are weeks after that meeting and still we await Ann’s grand plan.

[Greenworld]

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I smell a rat....

The Email purported to be from Leslie Deans doesn't ring true.

if the legal case is strong, why urge all to share all over social media?

Timing is also suspicious the day before the proposal is submitted, whilst those factors have been known all along.

Is this a Hibby legal on the windup?
Or is this just a last ditch attempt to bully other clubs into reconstruction.

I think the latter and their bluff should be called. Legal action (no matter how strong/weak) would be disastrous for Hearts in more ways than one.

Its a wind up Saughton Jambo is not a Jambo i did not need a QC lol

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[Greenworld]

https://www.rosscountyfootballclub.c...roy-macgregor/

Update from Ross County today

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[Billy Whizz]

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https://www.rosscountyfootballclub.c...roy-macgregor/

Update from Ross County today

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What’s the key points

[Wakeyhibee]

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Its a wind up Saughton Jambo is not a Jambo i did not need a QC lol

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I'll hang up my deerstalker lol