The generic Hearts thread

[Oscar T Grouch]

While I’m trying to take pleasure from the hertz woes I’m finding it difficult purely down to the fact that this is effecting so many people I know, most of whom are lost and scared and have no idea how their future is going to pan out. I’ve heard from mates who drive buses, working in kitchens, work in retail all who’ve been laid off this week, more have been told their hours are being cut in half. It’s distressing to see so many people in trouble. Hertz may be the first but I genuinely think we’re going to lose quite a few football clubs because of this crisis. Mostly smaller community clubs but a few of the big boys will be run close to the edge and a few may fall over it. I have sympathy for the lower paid staff because like most of us, they have no savings to fall back on. This pandemic could lead to another 1930s type depression. It is very worrying when we have in government a party who couldn’t care less for the poor and vulnerable in society. I know it’s hertz but we should all try and look at the bigger picture. Yes they’ve been badly managed for years and pissed millions up the wall but there are a lot of normal working people at that club who are facing a real crisis, who have no blame at their feet bar working for hertz.
I hope the human race will see themselves through this pandemic with a view to changing things for the better, I fear we will come through this more cynical and detached from each other though. I like seeing hertz in trouble normally but given the bigger picture is rather bleak I find it hard to take pleasure from their current crisis.

[FilipinoHibs]

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And let's remember guys like Naismith and many others were given long and expensive contracts which will still have a number of years left on them.

Rule E17 says if a club enters an insolvency event the club is not breaking SPL rules in not paying players.

[greenginger]

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Rule E17 says if a club enters an insolvency event the club is not breaking SPL rules in not paying players.

Which means an automatic 15 point deduction this season and starting next season on minus 5 points.

[GreenCastle]

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While I’m trying to take pleasure from the hertz woes I’m finding it difficult purely down to the fact that this is effecting so many people I know, most of whom are lost and scared and have no idea how their future is going to pan out. I’ve heard from mates who drive buses, working in kitchens, work in retail all who’ve been laid off this week, more have been told their hours are being cut in half. It’s distressing to see so many people in trouble. Hertz may be the first but I genuinely think we’re going to lose quite a few football clubs because of this crisis. Mostly smaller community clubs but a few of the big boys will be run close to the edge and a few may fall over it. I have sympathy for the lower paid staff because like most of us, they have no savings to fall back on. This pandemic could lead to another 1930s type depression. It is very worrying when we have in government a party who couldn’t care less for the poor and vulnerable in society. I know it’s hertz but we should all try and look at the bigger picture. Yes they’ve been badly managed for years and pissed millions up the wall but there are a lot of normal working people at that club who are facing a real crisis, who have no blame at their feet bar working for hertz.
I hope the human race will see themselves through this pandemic with a view to changing things for the better, I fear we will come through this more cynical and detached from each other though. I like seeing hertz in trouble normally but given the bigger picture is rather bleak I find it hard to take pleasure from their current crisis.

While I agree with some of what you say..

The bit I find hard is that surely after the last mess they should learnt to made changes.

You could argue Budge has spent more than Romanov with the mess of the main stand and all the donations.

They shafted a lot of folk previously - some I know and you would think they would learnt.

Heart and soul of Edinburgh / community led etc but bottom line is they have wasted a lot of money on staff like Boyce, Levein and even paying a fortune for a new manager.

Remember this is the club who forgot to order seats for a new stand - if I was offered work with them I would have serious concerns about payment and the stability of being involved.

[Skol]

The way Hearts have been run since the rose from the ashes has contributed to the situation they find themselves in.

However, if as seems likely there is no quick end to this crisis, then everyone will follow suit. There will be no choice

[FilipinoHibs]

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Which means an automatic 15 point deduction this season and starting next season on minus 5 points.

Yes they would be best to do it now before the season ends or is ended. Take the 15 points hit now and only had start 5 points down in the championship.

[Oscar T Grouch]

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While I agree with some of what you say..

The bit I find hard is that surely after the last mess they should learnt to made changes.

You could argue Budge has spent more than Romanov with the mess of the main stand and all the donations.

They shafted a lot of folk previously - some I know and you would think they would learnt.

Heart and soul of Edinburgh / community led etc but bottom line is they have wasted a lot of money on staff like Boyce, Levein and even paying a fortune for a new manager.

Remember this is the club who forgot to order seats for a new stand - if I was offered work with them I would have serious concerns about payment and the stability of being involved.

We’ve all worked for ***** companies over the years. It’s irrelevant how they mismanaged for years to those low paid workers. I have little sympathy for the bosses at hertz, though they’re probably in the same boat, they may well have savings to see them through. Like I said it’s the bigger picture you see behind all the mismanagement at hertz that takes the pleasure of their strife away from me. If covid19 hadn’t happened, hertz would have been relegated and found themselves in similar trouble I’d have less sympathy and there would be other jobs for the lower earners to get, that isn’t the case right now.

[Alex Trager]

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We should offer Hickey a contract now

I’m not sure the boy with 51 on the back of his top would leave them so easily.

[Bostonhibby]

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Which means an automatic 15 point deduction this season and starting next season on minus 5 points.

"Act of God" MAY offer an exception to that, however the rules on admission to / membership of the league at E31 is where they might come unstuck depending on the nature of their earlier implosion?

I'm no lawyer, and if I was I wouldn't be a football one

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[edinburghhibee]

Personally, I’m not gonna be laughing my cock off at our pink chums across the road. We have no idea what’s going on behind our own doors just now. So I think it’s best we sit tight.

Yes they’ve overspent on player, staff and the stand but that’s not the support, and yes I’m aware they could have moaned and questioned a bit more.

I have good friends and family members who are of the yam persuasion and although right now their own home life is more of a concern I’d hate for them not to have their club at the end of it all. Families not getting to what their team at the weekends the banter between the fans.

I’ve More respect for the folk who go to Tynecastle every week than the hordes that visit Glasgow and travel up and down the country supporting a team they live nowhere near or have no connection to.

Relegation, By all means, they’ve been brutal this last year and deserve to go down. But admin and going pop! Na not for me. I love the derbies.


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[Kato]

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Compared to every other club in the league outwith the uglies they have had vast amounts of money pumped into them over the last few years, with a large wedge of it unearned income like FOH contributions and 'mystery' donations, but what have they done with that money?

I wonder how much cash has been through their books this century. £83-£120Million (depending on which source you believe) during Vlad's tenure. £28Million from "donations" since then as well as their normal income. A portion of the £19Million when the were owned the Pie-Man. During that time they won 2 SC's and have built a money pit of rust bucket to replace their old rust-bucket.

Mismanagement on a huge scale.

[GreenCastle]

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We’ve all worked for ***** companies over the years. It’s irrelevant how they mismanaged for years to those low paid workers. I have little sympathy for the bosses at hertz, though they’re probably in the same boat, they may well have savings to see them through. Like I said it’s the bigger picture you see behind all the mismanagement at hertz that takes the pleasure of their strife away from me. If covid19 hadn’t happened, hertz would have been relegated and found themselves in similar trouble I’d have less sympathy and there would be other jobs for the lower earners to get, that isn’t the case right now.

I do agree with you in a way like I said but like I said above it’s a club who you would think after the last mess wouldn’t have ended up here.

Boyce is a prime example - huge risk on massive wages. Surely they would have thought...oh if we go down we will be paying large wages in a lower league...what about the knock on effects to rest of club / staff.

The only reason they aren’t handing over to FOH as it would be a disaster without enough ££.

This is a danger of being fan led - something like this could easily happen again.

[James70]

I am getting a bit fed up with Budge's daily bleating as if Hearts are the only club affected, what is it with that woman that she constantly has to be the centre of attention. There has barely been a word uttered from our side of the city but the self pity gushing out from Tynecastle just now is pathetic.

[rodhibs55]

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It’s the gentle soothing sound of the pigeons wings, fluttering in on their journey home getting ready to roost.

Is it actually the sound of pigeons wing fluttering or is it a similar sound coming out of the Yams supporters toilets when they are thinking about the future of their club.

[Col2]

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Yes they would be best to do it now before the season ends or is ended. Take the 15 points hit now and only had start 5 points down in the championship.

We have been here before. They strung it out in 2013 which relegated Dundee when they should have had -15 point hit then.

[stoneyburn hibs]

Is this a pre=empt into administration, knowing that they're getting relegated?

[GreenCastle]

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I wonder how much cash has been through their books this century. £83-£120Million (depending on which source you believe) during Vlad's tenure. £28Million from "donations" since then as well as their normal income. A portion of the £19Million when the were owned the Pie-Man. During that time they won 2 SC's and have built a money pit of rust bucket to replace their old rust-bucket.

Mismanagement on a huge scale.

Would love someone to work it all out:

Would be staggering the amount of money they have spent / wasted / not paid back to local folk in last 20 years.

[Billy Whizz]

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Is this a pre=empt into administration, knowing that they're getting relegated?

If they did, what is the points deduction, and when would it be deducted, this season or next

[Caversham Green]

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The bottom club get £1.12m - this is the minimum amount that any club will get and my understanding is that this is paid in instalments during the season. So even if we would be due £1.56m for finishng 6th, we might already have had about half of that.

The way it used to work before the original Rangers died was that each club got a total of 4% of the prize money distributed throughout the season and the remaining 52% is divided up according to league positions - I don't know if that still stands, but it would mean that Hibs have already received a fair chunk of the total fund but there's still quite a lot to come.

Some of the money is definitely distributed monthly - one of the statements from the SFA/SFPL confirmed that.

[The 90+2]

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If they did, what is the points deduction, and when would it be deducted, this season or next

15 then 5 (I think). They want the season to be kept open as long as possible Budge said, maybe it the alternative to going down in the next few days, the league is played out at a later date, go into admin now, 15 points and down regardless.


How the **** has she managed to spend £10m or so of the Foundation of hearts money as well as normal income and mystery benefactors money over the past 4 years? That’s almost ludicrous.

[Ozyhibby]

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If they did, what is the points deduction, and when would it be deducted, this season or next

They would be better to do it before this season is declared otherwise they would be 15 points down for their promotion campaign next season. If they do it quick it would be 15 of now which won’t matter and only 5 of next season.


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[Ozyhibby]

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The way it used to work before the original Rangers died was that each club got a total of 4% of the prize money distributed throughout the season and the remaining 52% is divided up according to league positions - I don't know if that still stands, but it would mean that Hibs have already received a fair chunk of the total fund but there's still quite a lot to come.

Some of the money is definitely distributed monthly - one of the statements from the SFA/SFPL confirmed that.

The prize money is all still due to the clubs. There is a separate equal payment to all clubs that goes out monthly.


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[mvteng]

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I’m not sure the boy with 51 on the back of his top would leave them so easily.

Hickey was actively trying to get out of hearts at the winter transfer window.

He has no loyalty to hearts, the 51 shirt is pure merchandising on hearts part

[Green Blood]

Any suppliers of goods and services to HMFC you have been warned. Put them on credit stop and chase outstanding payments immediately. Once shafted quite shy is the motto here. They have history in this dept. You have been warned!

[Caversham Green]

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So, according to this, Hearts operating costs are near half a million a month more than Hibs? Can any of the financial guys confirm this?

Those monthly figures are the operating expenses for the year as taken from the last accounts divided by 12. The cash figure is the cash at bank figure at the end of the year and the 'days before running out figure' is those two figures inserted into a formula that I cba working out. The first two figures are a reasonable rule of thumb but by no means accurate. The third figure is pretty meaningless IMO.

So to answer your question - yes, Hearts operating costs are much higher than Hibs. Part of that is explained by the fact that Hearts have more of their commercial operations in-house which is why their turnover is about £5m more than Hibs but their costs are about £6m more.

[MrSmith]

Y'know, their glass wall front of main stand looks awful like a Tesco building, maybe they could rent it out to them for the next few months for some extra income? Its only 1/3 complete so and wouldn't take much to convert. Also, their pitch reflects the old Ingliston Market car park so, they'd be ok for parking too.

[Craig_in_Prague]

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Personally, I’m not gonna be laughing my cock off at our pink chums across the road. We have no idea what’s going on behind our own doors just now. So I think it’s best we sit tight.

Yes they’ve overspent on player, staff and the stand but that’s not the support, and yes I’m aware they could have moaned and questioned a bit more.

I have good friends and family members who are of the yam persuasion and although right now their own home life is more of a concern I’d hate for them not to have their club at the end of it all. Families not getting to what their team at the weekends the banter between the fans.

I’ve More respect for the folk who go to Tynecastle every week than the hordes that visit Glasgow and travel up and down the country supporting a team they live nowhere near or have no connection to.

Relegation, By all means, they’ve been brutal this last year and deserve to go down. But admin and going pop! Na not for me. I love the derbies.


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Get where you're coming from.
But, overspend for 35-40 years and you eventually pay the price.

NONE of there fans even realize what impact their crummy club had from Mad Vlad times and what credit damage was done.. nor any acknowledgement how lucky they were to come through admin.
So, I have no sympathy.

[Green Blood]

“Hearts are probably in a healthier position to survive because they’re commercially debt free, their financial liabilities are close to zero and have one of the best businesswomen in the country, leading from the front.





Send this pic to all their suppliers, cheating bstrds. No shame at that club. This man is allegedly a politician!

[edinburghhibee]

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Get where you're coming from.
But, overspend for 35-40 years and you eventually pay the price.

NONE of there fans even realize what impact their crummy club had from Mad Vlad times and what credit damage was done.. nor any acknowledgement how lucky they were to come through admin.
So, I have no sympathy.

But my point is that it’s football fans in a nutshell. It wasn’t too long ago we were sitting 2nd bottom and we were shouting for the purse strings to be opened so we could get out of the mess we were in. Thankfully it doesn’t look like we over did it but that’s due to our board.

I’m sure if we went out and signed a whole whack of players beyond our means there wouldn’t be many on here saying “so and so’s a great signing, but where did we get the money???” You just get on with it.

My point is for decent normal folk, and there are some over that side of the fence, this isn’t looking great and through no fault of their own.


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[tamig]

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But my point is that it’s football fans in a nutshell. It wasn’t too long ago we were sitting 2nd bottom and we were shouting for the purse strings to be opened so we could get out of the mess we were in. Thankfully it doesn’t look like we over did it but that’s due to our board.

I’m sure if we went out and signed a whole whack of players beyond our means there wouldn’t be many on here saying “so and so’s a great signing, but where did we get the money???” You just get on with it.

My point is for decent normal folk, and there are some over that side of the fence, this isn’t looking great and through no fault of their own.


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The difference with them is that they nearly went to the wall fairly recently. The fans rallied and along with Budge saved them. They have been very fortunate to raise the vast sums they have but that money has been wasted. Mismanagement of the highest order. I didn’t hear a scrap of humility from any of them when they were saved. It wasn’t long before their big team pish was on the go again. Well the chickens are coming home now. I have zero sympathy for them.