General election 2019

[Ozyhibby]

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Really? Show some evidence of that then.

The evidence is there in the documents. It is being discussed by the negotiating teams. If something is off the table then you refuse to discuss it. They haven’t.


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[One Day Soon]

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The evidence is there in the documents. It is being discussed by the negotiating teams. If something is off the table then you refuse to discuss it. They haven’t.


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I really don't think it is there in the documents. If it was then presumably it would be available far and wide on social media and elsewhere?

[lapsedhibee]

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In what way was it biased to ask whether the documents actually provide any evidence that the governement has offered the NHS for sale as part of a trade deal?

"Jeremy Corbyn doesn't provide evidence ministers have agreed the health service should be part of a trade deal with US."

Did he claim that they had? Perhaps they were all simply discussing Uganda at the six meetings.

[Ozyhibby]

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Quoted post removed.

How do you know that Jewish people are not among those who are protesting Isreal? Do you maybe want them to wear a badge so you can identify them?
Anti-semitism seems to be tolerated here as much as in the Labour Party these days.


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[marinello59]

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It's on the front page but it isn't the top story was what I was implying.

No, the SNP Manifesto launch was. Given that the story had only just broken that seems fair enough.

[HNA12]

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How do you know that Jewish people are not among those who are protesting Isreal? Do you maybe want them to wear a badge so you can identify them?
Anti-semitism seems to be tolerated here as much as in the Labour Party these days.


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When somebody makes clearly anti-semitic remarks they will not be tolerated.

[HiBremian]

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Because they do nothing to protest at the most brutal, racist and cowardly nation in the world. I am not South African and have never been there but it did not stop me protesting about what was going on there.

**** me, mate. Been out on the streets, been producing documentary photography, been standing shoulder to shoulder with Palestinians. I just don't broadcast my Jewish background. Like thousands of others. You really need to sort out your criticism of folks that happen to be Jewish. The chief rabbi is doing what he's doing because he's a tory. Never forget.

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[Ozyhibby]

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When somebody makes clearly anti-semitic remarks they will not be tolerated.

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[G B Young]

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The evidence is there in the documents. It is being discussed by the negotiating teams. If something is off the table then you refuse to discuss it. They haven’t.


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As somebody else has pointed out these documents are effectively minutes of what the Americans have thrown into the mix. That doesn't mean what they might want is actually 'on the table'. Johnson (who can also, as far as I can see, also point to the fact these meetings took place before he was PM) can (and already has) said the NHS won't be on the table.

Labour will, understandably, do their damnedest to spin this as the NHS being up for sale but unless some concrete evidence of that comes to light it's primarily a scare tactic rather than a bombshell revelation. It's not as though these meetings were held in secret.

[Ozyhibby]

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As somebody else has pointed out these documents are effectively minutes of what the Americans have thrown into the mix. That doesn't mean what they might want is actually 'on the table'. Johnson (who can also, as far as I can see, also point to the fact these meetings took place before he was PM) can (and already has) said the NHS won't be on the table.

Labour will, understandably, do their damnedest to spin this as the NHS being up for sale but unless some concrete evidence of that comes to light it's primarily a scare tactic rather than a bombshell revelation. It's not as though these meetings were held in secret.

6 meetings and not once did anyone from the UK negotiating team take the NHS off the table. It’s still there. It’s up for negotiation.


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[G B Young]

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"Jeremy Corbyn doesn't provide evidence ministers have agreed the health service should be part of a trade deal with US."

Did he claim that they had? Perhaps they were all simply discussing Uganda at the six meetings.

Labour explicitly state on their Facebook page that 'Boris Johnson has put the NHS up for sale'. It's quite a stretch to come to that conclusion based on today's 'evidence'.

[G B Young]

'The nice guy narrative is now officially dead':

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/jeremy-corbyn-interview-andrew-neil-general-election-labour-antisemitism-a9219226.html

[Hibernia&Alba]

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'The nice guy narrative is now officially dead':

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/jeremy-corbyn-interview-andrew-neil-general-election-labour-antisemitism-a9219226.html

He's being crucified for his performance. It was bad, no question, but Neil simply refused to allow Corbyn to say anything beyond a soundbite answer. Neil ruined the interview with his constant interruptions. He didn't listen to any of the replies but merely jumped in immediately.

[Mibbes Aye]

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During the war Attlee was deputy PM, and Ernest Bevin, Morrison and Cripps were all in the cabinet. The Conservative Party did not support universal health care for all, free at the point of delivery. They wanted competition and 'choice', as their voting record during the Attlee government of 1945-51 proves. Had the won the 1945 election, the NHS would not exist and there would have been a variant of private insurance.

Have you read the 1944 White Paper?

[JeMeSouviens]

The BBC's Adam Fleming has the following highlight from the doc:




SPS is basically agricultural standards (sanitary and phytosanitary measures). Labour should be bigging up this stuff as well as the NHS imo.

[Hibernia&Alba]

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Have you read the 1944 White Paper?

That wasn't a Conservative government but a national coalition during war. The Conservative Party voted against the creation of the NHS between 1945 and 1947 and supported the BMA in their initial opposition. The Tories have opposed almost every piece of post war progressive legislation, from the NHS and the welfare state to a minimum wage and Working Families Tax Credits. They have never been ideologically supportive of the system. When Thatcher was talked out of privatising the NHS, she starved it of funds and created the internal market, in an attempt to destroy it from within. They've never changed. Let's not re-write history that the Tories supported the great reforms of the Attlee government; they did not. This notion of a post war consensus isn't true; the two main parties were miles apart in their vision of society.

[heretoday]

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Do you mean most of the voting public don't see it as a key electoral issue or that most of the voting public don't care about racism?

I don't see it as being a key electoral issue except in the sense that it reflects badly on Corbyn for not having sorted it out years ago.

As to the great British public and their attitudes in general. your guess is as good as mine but the Brexit referendum result would suggest a certain antipathy towards foreigners among large sections of the community - mostly in England I would hazard.

Whether that indicates a tolerance of racism I really don't know.

[Hibernia&Alba]

Is Johnson refusing to appear with Neil?

[JeMeSouviens]

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Is Johnson refusing to appear with Neil?

Not refusing (yet), the BBC are in discussions with his team.

Pol ed of LBC, Theo Usherwood tweets:

Labour source tells me BBC informed them Boris Johnson would do an Andrew Neil interview next week.

Turns out no such agreement had been reached.

If Tory leader isn't subjected to same scrutiny as Mr Corbyn, but his team was told he would be, that's a problem for the BBC.

[lapsedhibee]

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Not refusing (yet), the BBC are in discussions with his team.

That's going to be the most predictable interview in TV history.

"Well Andrew we've just got to get Brexit done"
"But Mr Johnson I'm not asking you about Brexit"
"Yes but Andrew we've got to get Brexit done"
"But I'm not asking you about Brexit"
"But the most important thing is that we get Brexit done"
"Yes you've said that a number of times, we get that, but what I'm asking you is … "

repeat for 30 mins.

[G B Young]

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I really don't think it is there in the documents. If it was then presumably it would be available far and wide on social media and elsewhere?

As has been pointed out these documents have been available to anyone online for more than two months so if there had been more to 'expose' than Channel 4 did about these meetings it seems pretty obvious somebody would have done so by now. For Labour to claim they've 'unearthed' some sort of shattering new evidence smacks of desperation.

[Jack Hackett]

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As has been pointed out these documents have been available to anyone online for more than two months so if there had been more to 'expose' than Channel 4 did about these meetings it seems pretty obvious somebody would have done so by now. For Labour to claim they've 'unearthed' some sort of shattering new evidence smacks of desperation.

Other than the knowledge of the power of social media to twist public opinion to their own agenda, I think most politicians are totally ignorant of what materials are available on the internet

[Hibernia&Alba]

What's happened to tonight's scheduled interview?

[Bristolhibby]

Rumour Dominic Cummings has resigned.

J

[Jack Hackett]

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What's happened to tonight's scheduled interview?

https://twitter.com/hashtag/AndrewNe...rview?src=tren

[Callum_62]

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https://twitter.com/hashtag/AndrewNe...rview?src=tren

That's a scandal if he doenst front up

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[Ozyhibby]

Big poll out tonight which should show if tactical voting is likely to be a big factor. Huge data sample (200k I think). Should show individual constituencies. Out at 10pm.


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[Glory Lurker]

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Big poll out tonight which should show if tactical voting is likely to be a big factor. Huge data sample (200k I think). Should show individual constituencies. Out at 10pm.


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and

Where are you getting that from?

[JeMeSouviens]

Our latest #GE2019* Westminster voting intention on behalf of the @Telegraph

CON 41% (-1)
LAB 34% (+2)
LD 13% (+1)
BRX 5% (-)
Other 7% (-)

25th - 26th Nov

(changes from Savanta ComRes/Sunday Express poll, Nov 23rd)

bit.ly/2Djw3VT

[JeMeSouviens]

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and

Where are you getting that from?

It’s the yougov mrp, best performing poll model in 2017.